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View Full Version : They say we are taking a CB


Jpeezyiseternal
04-12-2014, 05:00 PM
Just read the 3 mock drafts over on NFL.COM and ALL 3 had us taking a cornerback

Check it out:

http://www.nfl.com/draft/2014

Idioteque
04-12-2014, 05:43 PM
In our system, a ballhawk or a jamming press guy aren't beneficial. It would be like taking a light wide-9 rusher like Bruce Irvin.

Steel_Bus_24
04-12-2014, 05:53 PM
Ehh now more then ever we need another stud cb

Until proven otherwise our olbs are mediocre if not worse....and we need the extra man to man cover skills

If you remember back to 2012 the reason why our D was ranked so high was because our trio of Taylor, Lewis, and Allen....

Remember when we lost just Allen and the cowboys shredded us.....

When we had those three guys playing well we were like one of the few teams to keep the ravens and their two TEs sets in check.

Mannings no huddle is a different story, we will need our olbs to step up there, but don't undersell what 3 capable corners can do for our D

OX1947
04-12-2014, 06:24 PM
TODD! TODD! TODD! TODD! TODD! TODD! TODD!

Idioteque
04-12-2014, 06:29 PM
don't undersell what 3 capable corners can do for our D

Very little when your D scheme requires them to line up 12 yards off the LOS and values tackling over ball skills.

Our pass D is rooted on pressure and tackling, not coverage ability or ball skills. If you'd like to change that, I'm totally on board and ready to take a CB early. Otherwise, it's tits on a bull.

Steel_Bus_24
04-12-2014, 06:59 PM
Very little when your D scheme requires them to line up 12 yards off the LOS and values tackling over ball skills.

Our pass D is rooted on pressure and tackling, not coverage ability or ball skills. If you'd like to change that, I'm totally on board and ready to take a CB early. Otherwise, it's tits on a bull.

We didn't have much of a pass rush in 2012 either, and was top ranked almost solely because of our top 1-3 cbs ability to cover.

pczach
04-12-2014, 07:35 PM
Very little when your D scheme requires them to line up 12 yards off the LOS and values tackling over ball skills.

Our pass D is rooted on pressure and tackling, not coverage ability or ball skills. If you'd like to change that, I'm totally on board and ready to take a CB early. Otherwise, it's tits on a bull.

I get what you're saying, but just because the system has always been that, doesn't mean you can't add a guy that can play press coverage and incorporate it into the defense.

They don't have to line up 12 yards off the line of scrimmage. That part of the scheme can be adjusted to the talent. They showed they could do it in limited duty against the Patriots a few years ago. If you have the personnel, you can do man to man press coverage. LeBeau has made his living playing zone blitz defensive schemes, and running blitz packages off of that. If they have the talent on the roster to do it, they could mix the coverages into the defensive calls from the sideline to keep quarterbacks guessing, and giving them different looks all game to keep them off balance.

Cortez Allen is a big corner that can play physically at the line of scrimmage. Add another corner that can play that style and you have something there.

The other thing about press coverage is that it interrupts the routes the receivers want to run and disrupts the timing of the play. It also gives the defensive front more time to get to the quarterback because of the physical play as the WRs have to fight to get off the line of scrimmage.

Of course, you already know that, and LeBeau is the man that has to adjust his philosophy to maximize the talent given to him. I just think that he is willing and able to do more of it if the team expresses a need to adjust the approach they take to stopping opposing passing offenses.

SteelersCanada
04-12-2014, 07:44 PM
Well, that's because we are.

Gilbert and Dennard are top shelf, elite players. Fuller is the next best thing, and then Verrett. Roby in the first round is a bad pick.

Idioteque
04-12-2014, 10:51 PM
We didn't have much of a pass rush in 2012 either, and was top ranked almost solely because of our top 1-3 cbs ability to cover.

I'm not talking about the quality of the cornerbacks. I'm talking about the way they play and the value in that. I don't think LeBeau's system will make use of a top CB's talents.

Idioteque
04-12-2014, 11:06 PM
I get what you're saying, but just because the system has always been that, doesn't mean you can't add a guy that can play press coverage and incorporate it into the defense.

You surely can, and I'd love to see it. But I'm not sure LeBeau will be doing that in his 80th year of coaching, lol.

They don't have to line up 12 yards off the line of scrimmage. That part of the scheme can be adjusted to the talent. They showed they could do it in limited duty against the Patriots a few years ago.

They did it beautifully that week. Then abandoned it, rarely to use it again.

If you have the personnel, you can do man to man press coverage. LeBeau has made his living playing zone blitz defensive schemes, and running blitz packages off of that. If they have the talent on the roster to do it, they could mix the coverages into the defensive calls from the sideline to keep quarterbacks guessing, and giving them different looks all game to keep them off balance.

Cortez Allen is a big corner that can play physically at the line of scrimmage. Add another corner that can play that style and you have something there.

The other thing about press coverage is that it interrupts the routes the receivers want to run and disrupts the timing of the play. It also gives the defensive front more time to get to the quarterback because of the physical play as the WRs have to fight to get off the line of scrimmage.

Of course, you already know that, and LeBeau is the man that has to adjust his philosophy to maximize the talent given to him. I just think that he is willing and able to do more of it if the team expresses a need to adjust the approach they take to stopping opposing passing offenses.

A lot of my opinion here comes from my bias against first-round CBs. I hate 'em, lol. It's such a fickle position; guys go from elite to garbage to mediocre to garbage on a yearly basis. It's a position so dependent on scheme (and the thick skin of the CB himself) that I've grown to just despise taking them that early.

It's also such a dependent position - dependent upon the rulebook. Beyond five yards (blink of an eye), there's so little a CB is allowed to do to affect the play. in Roger's NFL, his job after the five-yard mark is often to trot and hope the ball gets underthrown. They simply don't have as much opportunity to affect a play as other defensive positions.

So a lot of it's just me. But the seemingly poor success rate of first-round CBs scares me. Unless you're talking an ELITE player - elite athlete, elite skills - I'd pretty much always rather wait. I'm talking a Pat Peterson or a Joe Haden; otherwise, I think you get the same quality later on. I'm sure that if I were a GM I'd wind up passing on some solid CBs. Just my philosophy.

BLACK_AND_YELLOW
04-13-2014, 06:28 AM
Of course we're taking corner first we're taking Dennard :applaudit:

Seeing how the FO likes MSU prospects and the fact we seem to like A.Rob kinda shows how we are going to draft.

Get a corner in the 1st(Dennard) then give Ben a big WR(A.Rob) to help put points on the board while the defense re-tools.

pczach
04-13-2014, 07:50 AM
You surely can, and I'd love to see it. But I'm not sure LeBeau will be doing that in his 80th year of coaching, lol.



They did it beautifully that week. Then abandoned it, rarely to use it again.



A lot of my opinion here comes from my bias against first-round CBs. I hate 'em, lol. It's such a fickle position; guys go from elite to garbage to mediocre to garbage on a yearly basis. It's a position so dependent on scheme (and the thick skin of the CB himself) that I've grown to just despise taking them that early.

It's also such a dependent position - dependent upon the rulebook. Beyond five yards (blink of an eye), there's so little a CB is allowed to do to affect the play. in Roger's NFL, his job after the five-yard mark is often to trot and hope the ball gets underthrown. They simply don't have as much opportunity to affect a play as other defensive positions.

So a lot of it's just me. But the seemingly poor success rate of first-round CBs scares me. Unless you're talking an ELITE player - elite athlete, elite skills - I'd pretty much always rather wait. I'm talking a Pat Peterson or a Joe Haden; otherwise, I think you get the same quality later on. I'm sure that if I were a GM I'd wind up passing on some solid CBs. Just my philosophy.

I think CBs are the hardest position to evaluate exactly because of some of the things you talk about. Many need to be in a particular scheme because they can't play any other way.

Even if you find one with exceptional talent, they sometimes lose their mental edge and confidence and they're never the same player.

That said, I have to believe in what I see in a player. I don't get excited about first round cornerbacks often. Every once in a while I see a player that I think I can trust to be special.

Sometimes you gotta have a little faith.