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R2sojr
10-22-2006, 04:49 PM
even though i know ricardo wasnt that good but how come when he muffed that punt everyone wanted him gone...but santonio muffed what 3 punts in the last 2 games and no one says a word about it....ppl say say all the excuses that they want but the steelers seem that they have lost that fire that they had last season...i know its a long season and it isnt over but as they keep trying to get it together every other team is pulling ahead...i think next week will determine whether the season is over or not for them....

Atleast well get a good draft pick next year but i doubt the rooneys will pay enough for him...

Stilliz
10-22-2006, 05:53 PM
Holmes is a rookie with an extreme upside and will only get better. Im sure you know all this, but are just being facetious? Right ?

If we win the next 2 we will be 4 - 4 going into the big divisional games. And I like the chances after that.

Dont you ?

stillers4me
10-22-2006, 05:56 PM
I believe!! I think a year from now, Holmes will make us forget all about these mistakes. We are not done collecting Lomabrdi's by a long shot.....this year, next year........I'll take them any day!

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 06:19 PM
[QUOTE=R2sojr;164650]even though i know ricardo wasnt that good but how come when he muffed that punt everyone wanted him gone...but santonio muffed what 3 punts in the last 2 games and no one says a word about it....ppl say say all the excuses that they want but the steelers seem that they have lost that fire that they had last season...i know its a long season and it isnt over but as they keep trying to get it together every other team is pulling ahead...i think next week will determine whether the season is over or not for them....

Atleast well get a good draft pick next year but i doubt the rooneys will pay enough for him...[/QUOTE


Because Santonio is a ROOKIE that was productive as a starter in college for an elite division one school,..... against other quality teams. C#cklocker was a major REACH when he was drafted and has never played as though he belongs in the League since he's been here. More often than not,.....you get what you pay for. "Nuff Said"



"Hail Caesar,.......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

R2sojr
10-22-2006, 06:37 PM
those are all good points but we are in a must win situation right now...and cant afford to make those silly mistakes....saying that he a rookie and its a rookie mistake isnt gonna cut it when it comes down to games like this...like they say....BIG PLAYERS MAKE BIG PLAYS IN BIG GAMES....IM A DIE HARD STEELER FAN..when they lose my day is shot to hell...i dunno maybe im just sayin this because im angry...you look at how we been playing...were playin great great football but give these games awy on turnovers and it just makes my stomach hurt to think about it...maybe i am just takin this to serious??

Stlrs4Life
10-22-2006, 06:49 PM
If we win the next 2 we will be 4 - 4 going into the big divisional games. And I like the chances after that.

Dont you ?

Sounds like what we were saying 2 weeks ago. Only then, Cincy and Baltimore lost. You can't keep going to the well. We win this game it was a different story. Turns out now, they can only lose maybe 2 more, and that's it. And there is 10 games left. Let's just admit, we are not a very good football team.

Atlanta Dan
10-22-2006, 06:59 PM
I agree this team has problems - Falcons have been struggling on offense but Vick looked like Steve Young in his prime today - where was the pressure on the pass rush?

Wait till next year.

klick81
10-22-2006, 07:04 PM
Vick looked like Steve Young in his prime today - where was the pressure on the pass rush?

We've been making mediocre/rookie qb's look like hall of famers in the past weeks. :banging:

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 07:40 PM
I agree this team has problems - Falcons have been struggling on offense but Vick looked like Steve Young in his prime today - where was the pressure on the pass rush?

Wait till next year.


Peezy was out and we were playing "contain" with Vick. Henceforth we were'nt blitzing very often. And as most of us are painfully aware,....if we don't get pressure from the blitz,...ANY decent QB will have their way with our secondary. "Like a Middle ages Bar Wench"
Dangelo "big mouth" Hall called our secondary (corners in particular) "Bums" earlier this year in response to Chad Johnson bragging. This pissed me off and made me sick. But it's even more sickening the way they've been proving him and (many others) correct this season.
It's really not any of their faults that they just don't have the skills and or physical ability,....but DAMN.


"Hail Caesar,........HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
10-22-2006, 08:30 PM
even though i know ricardo wasnt that good but how come when he muffed that punt everyone wanted him gone...but santonio muffed what 3 punts in the last 2 games and no one says a word about it....ppl say say all the excuses that they want but the steelers seem that they have lost that fire that they had last season...i know its a long season and it isnt over but as they keep trying to get it together every other team is pulling ahead...i think next week will determine whether the season is over or not for them....

Atleast well get a good draft pick next year but i doubt the rooneys will pay enough for him...

they play the raiders next week........its not going to say anything............you reaal cant take anything away from todays game...........it was a great game......it was exciting....
I love games like that..........I could have done with out all the turn overs

Stilliz
10-22-2006, 08:38 PM
Sounds like what we were saying 2 weeks ago. Only then, Cincy and Baltimore lost. You can't keep going to the well. We win this game it was a different story. Turns out now, they can only lose maybe 2 more, and that's it. And there is 10 games left. Let's just admit, we are not a very good football team.

We are not a bad team either.

Lets talk after the next two games. My money says we're 4-4. You disagree ?

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 10:02 PM
We are not a bad team either.

Lets talk after the next two games. My money says we're 4-4. You disagree ?


Not tryin to p#ss in your cornflakes,....but 4-4 is still mediocre and by any competitor's standards,....."bad". However it's the begining of what would be a run of Glorious historic proportions. So i think the better question is for everyone in the locker room,........WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO ?



"Hail Caesar,........HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

Stilliz
10-22-2006, 10:08 PM
4-4 AND we head into some serious DIVISION games. Or do you think the rats and cats are that much better then us that we can beat them straight up ??? Piss in your own godamn cornflakes.

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 10:24 PM
4-4 AND we head into some serious DIVISION games. Or do you think the rats and cats are that much better then us that we can beat them straight up ??? Piss in your own godamn cornflakes.



Take it easy "Tough Guy",......you don't want to wake your parents do you ?. (LMAO) Who said anything about defeat at the hands of the Rat's or anyone else ? WE beat us,.....this is the only opponent of any importance. Or did you not understand the context of my post ?



"Hail Caesar,.......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

tony hipchest
10-22-2006, 10:25 PM
why blame anyone? its much easier and appropriate to credit vick and crumpler.

i blame anyone who forgot the vick IS an nfl qb who can throw, and that alge is a top 3-4 tight end in the league.

tony hipchest
10-22-2006, 10:27 PM
So i think the better question is for everyone in the locker room,........WHAT ARE YOU PREPARED TO DO ?



"Hail Caesar,........HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

i hope the answer (atleast for ben verron, santoino and parker) isnt "try to win the game all by myself.

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 10:37 PM
i hope the answer (atleast for ben verron, santoino and parker) isnt "try to win the game all by myself.



LOL,...I hope not either Tone. I was thinkin more along the lines of playing complete and fundamentaly sound football on everyone's part that touches the field for the rest of this season. Is that alot to ask of professional warriors with any measure of dignity and Honor ? I don't believe it is for THIS locker room.


"Hail Caesar,.......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

Preacher
10-22-2006, 10:42 PM
Didn't get a chance to see the game today... (had Tivo set... but the stupid game was on normal tv... )

However, Our DB's have been horrible since the end of 2001. Go back and look at the games.. About 2 or 3 games from the end of the season... the pass yard ROCKETED against us. It continued the entire next year, and really bit us in the butt three years ago. Now, we have been able to cover it the last couple of years... by running up the score and then keeping the ball on offense. However, if we really want a good Defense, we MUST go out and get a top notch CB.

SteelCzar76
10-22-2006, 10:49 PM
Didn't get a chance to see the game today... (had Tivo set... but the stupid game was on normal tv... )

However, Our DB's have been horrible since the end of 2001. Go back and look at the games.. About 2 or 3 games from the end of the season... the pass yard ROCKETED against us. It continued the entire next year, and really bit us in the butt three years ago. Now, we have been able to cover it the last couple of years... by running up the score and then keeping the ball on offense. However, if we really want a good Defense, we MUST go out and get a top notch CB.



(The southern coach from "The Waterboy" voice:)

"You sah,.......are preaching to the Pope" LOL



"Hail Caesar,.......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

tony hipchest
10-22-2006, 11:08 PM
please dont blame the db's! watch the highlights. about every one of crumplers catches he was SINGLE covered. this dude is like gates or gonzalez. if troy is gonna be focused on stopping vicks run, there MUST be some help for a 200lb db covering crumpler. he is big, and he is fast and he uses those basketball skills to block out a single tiny guy in coverage. hes gonna win that battle just about every time (as he proved today).

can anyone tell me how many balls were caught on ike today? im thinking 0
mcfadden has been like glue on the man he covers.
polamalu made an exellent int in a baited toss to a wr.

everytime someone has made a td grab over deshea he has been on the man like saran wrap. hes just a little short to be covering 6 foot 5 guys who luck out and make highlight film grabs. credit has to go to the wr's in these cases for making the catch and the qb for making PERFECT throws. (it is disheartenning that it happened against atl, sd, and cin though)

augustashark
10-22-2006, 11:23 PM
please dont blame the db's! watch the highlights. about every one of crumplers catches he was SINGLE covered. this dude is like gates or gonzalez. if troy is gonna be focused on stopping vicks run, there MUST be some help for a 200lb db covering crumpler. he is big, and he is fast and he uses those basketball skills to block out a single tiny guy in coverage. hes gonna win that battle just about every time (as he proved today).

can anyone tell me how many balls were caught on ike today? im thinking 0
mcfadden has been like glue on the man he covers.
polamalu made an exellent int in a baited toss to a wr.

everytime someone has made a td grab over deshea he has been on the man like saran wrap. hes just a little short to be covering 6 foot 5 guys who luck out and make highlight film grabs. credit has to go to the wr's in these cases for making the catch and the qb for making PERFECT throws. (it is disheartenning that it happened against atl, sd, and cin though)

I hate making this kind of reply, but I completely agree here with your post Tony. It was either a saftey or LB on Crumpler. He was the one who ate our lunch. The catch that Jenkins made in the corner of the endzone was just a perfect pass from Vick, you can't blame our DB for that play.

SteelCzar76
10-23-2006, 12:28 AM
please dont blame the db's! watch the highlights. about every one of crumplers catches he was SINGLE covered. this dude is like gates or gonzalez. if troy is gonna be focused on stopping vicks run, there MUST be some help for a 200lb db covering crumpler. he is big, and he is fast and he uses those basketball skills to block out a single tiny guy in coverage. hes gonna win that battle just about every time (as he proved today).

can anyone tell me how many balls were caught on ike today? im thinking 0
mcfadden has been like glue on the man he covers.
polamalu made an exellent int in a baited toss to a wr.

everytime someone has made a td grab over deshea he has been on the man like saran wrap. hes just a little short to be covering 6 foot 5 guys who luck out and make highlight film grabs. credit has to go to the wr's in these cases for making the catch and the qb for making PERFECT throws. (it is disheartenning that it happened against atl, sd, and cin though)


For the record,...I've never metioned (nor will i ever) Troy in the same regard, or should i say lack thereof,.....as the rest of the secondary. Your the homey Tone so i guess we'll just have to agree to disagree,....but they're very suspect.
It's not their faults that they're undersized with poor awareness and lack of playmaking ability. That is a matter of genetics. I don't knock them for that. I knock the fact that they are even on the field to be "Run amuck".
It's always a matter of "bend, but don't break". Until teams start really going after them aggressively,...which then of course they allow plays that almost always result in points for the opposition at the worst possible times.
(But i guess that at least makes them consistent at something ?) LOL Bottom line,.....Troy needs help.



"Hail Caesar,......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"

augustashark
10-23-2006, 12:39 AM
Other then the Cincy game our DB'S have played pretty well. If you go back and look at the stats it will show that two TE'S we've faced are the ones who really beat us up. We are strugling with TE'S, but the two we've played are two of the top four in the league.

I also take Ike out of this thread all together, this guy has matched up against the top WR on the other team. Look at the results....Chambers was shut down as was Chad Johnson and Kenan mccardell(sp?). With the teams that are upcoming I think we will match up very well. Oakland has their 2nd strip QB going......Denver's passing game is a joke except for Walker and you know Ike will be on him. Cleveland and Baltimore will not give us that many problems except for the TE play. Carolina scares me a bit, with Smith and Johnson are DB'S are going to have to come out and play a good game.

tony hipchest
10-23-2006, 01:02 AM
For the record,...I've never metioned (nor will i ever) Troy in the same regard, or should i say lack thereof,.....as the rest of the secondary. Your the homey Tone so i guess we'll just have to agree to disagree,....but they're very suspect.
It's not their faults that they're undersized with poor awareness and lack of playmaking ability. That is a matter of genetics. I don't knock them for that. I knock the fact that they are even on the field to be "Run amuck".
It's always a matter of "bend, but don't break". Until teams start really going after them aggressively,...which then of course they allow plays that almost always result in points for the opposition at the worst possible times.
(But i guess that at least makes them consistent at something ?) LOL Bottom line,.....Troy needs help.



"Hail Caesar,......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"deshea has been picked on. i will give you that. plex used to own c. mccalister (known as a pretty good db in the league) all the time in the same way deshea has been against sd, cin, and today.

1) steelerfans have been spoiled with rod woodson much like they have been by jerome bettis or our storied pro bowl centers. no one will replace them.

2) steelers play a zone blitz which is different from "man on man" or a "cover 2". the cornerbacks responsibilities are different than in a conventional defense.

3) do the rooneys really wanna spend the same money as d. snyder for a d. sanders type player?

4) d. hall wasnt too effective against our vagabond group of wr's today. c. bailey wasnt spectacular the last time we played him either. would the 2 of them be invincible in our system?

5) itsbeen almost a year since the last time i. taylor was burned for a td. he is big and tall.
rookie mcfadden prevented manning from leading his team to the afc champ game last year. big players make big plays at big times. i cant knock mcfadden for anything so far this year. he seems to be there to recover muffed punts too.

6) if ike and brian had the skills to pick off 10 passes a year they would be moved to wr in a heartbeat. they are db's for a reason. their coverage is why we seen a lb pick off the ball for the 5th time this season. troy leads the team with 3.

7) cornerbacks are not meant to be singled up on a great atheletic 270 lb te. its a mismatch o coordinators will go to every time. even the best safety in the game will usually lose this matchup. you notice how often heath miller has been doubled this year? almost all the time. thats why he hasnt caught as many passes as we would like. otherwise we would go to him on every play. (teams give h. miller more respect every week than we gave a. crumpler today)

like i said, its a double edged sword. pick your poison. troy couldve spent all day double teaming crumpler and vick may have ran in those 3 td's.

SteelCzar76
10-23-2006, 06:25 PM
deshea has been picked on. i will give you that. plex used to own c. mccalister (known as a pretty good db in the league) all the time in the same way deshea has been against sd, cin, and today.

1) steelerfans have been spoiled with rod woodson much like they have been by jerome bettis or our storied pro bowl centers. no one will replace them.

2) steelers play a zone blitz which is different from "man on man" or a "cover 2". the cornerbacks responsibilities are different than in a conventional defense.

3) do the rooneys really wanna spend the same money as d. snyder for a d. sanders type player?

4) d. hall wasnt too effective against our vagabond group of wr's today. c. bailey wasnt spectacular the last time we played him either. would the 2 of them be invincible in our system?

5) itsbeen almost a year since the last time i. taylor was burned for a td. he is big and tall.
rookie mcfadden prevented manning from leading his team to the afc champ game last year. big players make big plays at big times. i cant knock mcfadden for anything so far this year. he seems to be there to recover muffed punts too.

6) if ike and brian had the skills to pick off 10 passes a year they would be moved to wr in a heartbeat. they are db's for a reason. their coverage is why we seen a lb pick off the ball for the 5th time this season. troy leads the team with 3.

7) cornerbacks are not meant to be singled up on a great atheletic 270 lb te. its a mismatch o coordinators will go to every time. even the best safety in the game will usually lose this matchup. you notice how often heath miller has been doubled this year? almost all the time. thats why he hasnt caught as many passes as we would like. otherwise we would go to him on every play. (teams give h. miller more respect every week than we gave a. crumpler today)

like i said, its a double edged sword. pick your poison. troy couldve spent all day double teaming crumpler and vick may have ran in those 3 td's.


My point "so to speak",.....is thus Tone. With the present rules regarding contact,...gone are the days of the "Shutdown" Cornerback. Because of this fact,... it is all the more important that you have size, speed and actual PLAMAKING talent THROUGHOUT your secondary.
Case in point,.....our aforementioned recent Bane of elite TE's. We are being abused by these cat's because of mismatches due to lack of size, speed and playmaking abiltiy on our part.
Even in Rod's day,....he wasn't alone,......there were two other STUDS on the field with him,.....Carnell Lake and Darren Perry. And while only Troy is of their Caliber,.......Dshea, Clark, Ty, and C#cklocker are not even in the same Galaxy as players.
They're merely solid "Backup's" with average ability being put into battles they cannot win because they just simply aren't gifted enough to do so,......no matter how much "Heart" and or "Character" they supposedly have.
Once again,.... Troy and our pass defense would benefit greatly from another ELITE "Presence" at F/S,.... and at least one clutch "Physical" Corner with speed, size, awareness, good hand eye cooridination and intelligence.
Troy is a once in a generation talent,........i'm not saying such player's would be on his level. I'm saying at least let them be worthy to be in the secondary with him. Worthy,... to be on the field with the other core members of this Defense as a whole.
Note that i still give B-mac the benefit of doubt,....he's very young and has shown some flashes. But we'll see.
Bottom line,...you can't keep Drafting (or bringing in as free agents) project, undersized, small school and or average on the collegiate level DB'S,.... and expect to run a 3-4 at it's full effectiveness. More often than not,......you get what you pay for. (And i don't mean in the sense of high priced free agents)



"Hail Caesar,.......Hail the Black and Gold"

Black@Gold Forever32
10-23-2006, 06:51 PM
Ok TE's have gave fits in the past but this year they really havn't guys.

Gates had 3 catches for 55 yards and a TD.

Tony Gonzalez had 3 catches for 15 yard with no TD's.

Randy McMichael had a big 1 catch for 10 yards.

Those are three of the better TE's in the NFL. Plus Gates and Gonzalez are better then Crumpler.

Now lets look at Alge Crumplers stat line. He had 6 catches for 117 yards and 3 TD's. Thats almost 20 yards a catch average. That just reflect the poor gameplan that Dick LeBeau had and the piss poor play of our DB's/LB's on Crumpler. Alge Crumpler is a very good NFL TE but we made him look like Shannon Sharpe in his ****ing prime. I'm still amazed that the Steelers allowed Crumpler to do that to them yesterday.

SteelCzar76
10-23-2006, 07:33 PM
Ok TE's have gave fits in the past but this year they really havn't guys.

Gates had 3 catches for 55 yards and a TD.

Tony Gonzalez had 3 catches for 15 yard with no TD's.

Randy McMichael had a big 1 catch for 10 yards.

Those are three of the better TE's in the NFL. Plus Gates and Gonzalez are better then Crumpler.

Now lets look at Alge Crumplers stat line. He had 6 catches for 117 yards and 3 TD's. Thats almost 20 yards a catch average. That just reflect the poor gameplan that Dick LeBeau had and the piss poor play of our DB's/LB's on Crumpler. Alge Crumpler is a very good NFL TE but we made him look like Shannon Sharpe in his ****ing prime. I'm still amazed that the Steelers allowed Crumpler to do that to them yesterday.



I agree wholeheartedly BlackandGold. (In regards to Crumpler) I brought up TE's in response to what was mentioned before as an excuse for our secondary's meltdowns. But please believe that i include any and all talented passing offenses in this league. (In regards to this secondary giving up points)



"Hail Caesar,.......HAIL THE BLACK AND GOLD"