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Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 02:32 PM
Jack Del Rio has obviously allowed the frustration of coaching one of the most unpredictable teams of 2006 to boil over into making one of the least classy comments of the year.

“They should’ve speared him then,” Del Rio said of a Brady head-first dive early in Sunday’s game, when Jaguars defenders backed off Brady because they thought he was going to slide feet-first. “You go face-first and you’re a runner,” Del Rio added.

Brady went head-first in capping a seven-yard run around left end midway through the fourth quarter. Ingram delivered a massive shot to the back of Brady’s head and shoulders, leaving the star quarterback writhing in pain on the ground and having to be helped off the field.

Or maybe the HC of the 'tough guy' Jags needs the rules explaining to him?

As for spearing, it is covered in the NFL rule book under Rule 12, Section 2, Article 8(g). The rule reads as follows: "Using any part of a player’s helmet (including the top/crown and forehead/“hairline” parts) or facemask to butt, spear, or ram an opponent violently or unnecessarily; although such violent or unnecessary use of the helmet and facemask is impermissible against any opponent, game officials will give special attention in administering this rule to protecting those players who are in virtually defenseless postures

Poor show, Del Rio - hopefully the Football Gods will punish you accordingly.

NM

Big D
12-28-2006, 02:33 PM
Jack Del Rio has obviously allowed the frustration of coaching one of the most unpredictable teams of 2006 to boil over into making one of the least classy comments of the year.



Or maybe the HC of the 'tough guy' Jags needs the rules explaining to him?



Poor show, Del Rio - hopefully the Football Gods will punish you accordingly.

NM

I think if the jags lose this week he could and should be out of a job.

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 02:36 PM
Im just hoping he gets hit with a big fine.

How are the players expected to toe the line if their HC's are advocating illegal hits to unprotected players?

NM

Big D
12-28-2006, 02:37 PM
Im just hoping he gets hit with a big fine.

How are the players expected to toe the line if their HC's are advocating illegal hits to unprotected players?

NM

You have to remeber this is a former linebacker. Do you think he would make similar comments if he was a qb

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 02:45 PM
You have to remeber this is a former linebacker. Do you think he would make similar comments if he was a qb

I think as a HC you have to put that to one side - the spearing is potentially alot more dangerous to the guy doing the hitting - broken necks, paralysis etc are all possibilities when you hit with the top of the helmet like Ingram did.

The guy who made the hit is a rookie who probably doesnt know much better, I hope Del Rio doesnt regret making comments like that for more serious reasons.

NM

tony hipchest
12-28-2006, 03:04 PM
Im just hoping he gets hit with a big fine.

How are the players expected to toe the line if their HC's are advocating illegal hits to unprotected players?

NM

:yawn: oh please. i suggest watching inside the nfl for some nice m. jones drew clips and comments of the cheap shots he suffered from last week. that t. bruschi sure is a classy guy :rolleyes:. #25 on the pats is another with "class".

im sure after del rio reviewed the tape he was pretty ticked off and just figured turnabout shouldve been fair play. personally i wouldnt mind at all it the pats tasted some of their own medicine. im thinking denver may be watching the same tape to prepare for their trip to foxboro. i wonder if chop blocks will utilized?

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 04:16 PM
:yawn: oh please. i suggest watching inside the nfl for some nice m. jones drew clips and comments of the cheap shots he suffered from last week. that t. bruschi sure is a classy guy :rolleyes:. #25 on the pats is another with "class".

im sure after del rio reviewed the tape he was pretty ticked off and just figured turnabout shouldve been fair play. personally i wouldnt mind at all it the pats tasted some of their own medicine. im thinking denver may be watching the same tape to prepare for their trip to foxboro. i wonder if chop blocks will utilized?

Cheap shots on Drew-Jones?

Can't say i've heard anything about this before now - care to elaborate?

Maybe you need to take another look at the rules - I presume you've seen the actual clip of Brady being hit in the back helmet first?

Who would have expected an anti-Patriots rant from Tony Hipchest...not me! :sofunny: :sofunny:

NM

Big D
12-28-2006, 04:17 PM
Cheap shots on Drew-Jones?

Can't say i've heard anything about this before now - care to elaborate?

Maybe you need to take another look at the rules - I presume you've seen the actual clip of Brady being hit in the back helmet first?

Who would have expected an anti-Patriots rant from Tony Hipchest...not me! :sofunny: :sofunny:

NM

i'm not sticking up for you nigel. I saw that hit and I didnt think it was dirty either. Jones just got a lil jacked up

Black@Gold Forever32
12-28-2006, 04:19 PM
Jack Del Rio is a F$g and I couldn't stand him as a player also. Reading that classless comment by that guy makes me have less respect for that tool.

Big D
12-28-2006, 04:21 PM
Jack Del Rio is a F$g and I couldn't stand him as a player also. Reading that classless comment by that guy makes me have less respect for that tool.

I grew up in a viking house. I used to have to watch this guy play all the time when he played for the vikings. He was a softy and I remeber edgar bennett running over him and barry sanders blowing by him.

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 04:24 PM
i'm not sticking up for you nigel. I saw that hit and I didnt think it was dirty either. Jones just got a lil jacked up

I think your average football fan without an agenda would admit there werent any dirty hits on Jones-Drew.

On a similar note - the guy is an exceptionally tough runner - he hits the hole hard.

Big D
12-28-2006, 04:28 PM
while I will admit qb's are over protected by the refs and sometimes you might as well put a red shirt on them. Comments like Jack Delrios were out of line. I'm sure he can be expecting a fan. If coaches keep making comments like this you can expect brawls similar to the one we saw with the knicks and nuggets a couple weeks ago.

Stlrs4Life
12-28-2006, 04:33 PM
That sure is classless, they should have just tried tackling him like a RB.

steelerbackr4life
12-28-2006, 04:34 PM
Regardless of the play on the field it is classless the way he acted with his comments. Better off not saying anything at all. I guess it doesnt matter what you wear on the sideline if you dont have class you dont have it.

Preacher
12-28-2006, 05:11 PM
Del Rio... Should just shut up.. Maybe he will get his just deserts... and end up as the Raiders coach.

Brady... Should be smart enough to slide FEET FIRST. Slide feet first.. and you just get touched. Slide head first.. and you get HIT. yeah, it is illegal to it with the helmet first. Nobody is accusing him of being dirty.. just a rookie mistake. Brady is no rookie though... He was stupid for going head first and opening himself to be hit IN ANY FASHION.

tony hipchest
12-28-2006, 05:27 PM
I think your average football fan without an agenda would admit there werent any dirty hits on Jones-Drew.
. yeah, cause the "average fan" is on the field and at the bottom of the pile.:rolleyes:

jones drew is just a melodramatic liar :rolleyes:

im sure you get HBO across the pond. if not just check the nfl films highlights.

theres a reason the pats are known as a dirty team. duce staley can tell you as much.

i think del rios message was heard by his players though. dont give up cheap yardage to a qb who refuses to slide properly. im sure if jack lambert, greg lloyd, or joey porter were a coach they wouldve said the same thing (although within the locker room).

like i said, i think del rio was just fustrated with the way the pats play so he slipped up and spewed his thoughts to the media. im not calling him classy or anything but i understand where he is coming from. i thought brady deserved that shot to the back. its football and qb's get hit. ive seen ben get hit countless times putting himself in a vulnerable position.

those who suggest del rio should be fired or fined are utterly rediculous. thats just not how it works. after all tom wasnt wearing a pink dress that says "dont hit the qb" was he?

and if its between believing a patfans viewpoint of a game vs. players and coaches who experienced the game and reviewed the actual tape im gonna have to go with......drumroll please....... the players and coaches!

Big D
12-28-2006, 05:39 PM
yeah, cause the "average fan" is on the field and at the bottom of the pile.:rolleyes:

jones drew is just a melodramatic liar :rolleyes:

im sure you get HBO across the pond. if not just check the nfl films highlights.

theres a reason the pats are known as a dirty team. duce staley can tell you as much.

i think del rios message was heard by his players though. dont give up cheap yardage to a qb who refuses to slide properly. im sure if jack lambert, greg lloyd, or joey porter were a coach they wouldve said the same thing (although within the locker room).

like i said, i think del rio was just fustrated with the way the pats play so he slipped up and spewed his thoughts to the media. im not calling him classy or anything but i understand where he is coming from. i thought brady deserved that shot to the back. its football and qb's get hit. ive seen ben get hit countless times putting himself in a vulnerable position.

those who suggest del rio should be fired or fined are utterly rediculous. thats just not how it works. after all tom wasnt wearing a pink dress that says "dont hit the qb" was he?

and if its between believing a patfans viewpoint of a game vs. players and coaches who experienced the game and reviewed the actual tape im gonna have to go with......drumroll please....... the players and coaches!

I wasnt suggesting that del rio should get fired for his comments I was refering to the jaguars performance. And comments like that are detremental to the nfl. We dont need the nfl turning into the nba

tony hipchest
12-28-2006, 05:53 PM
I wasnt suggesting that del rio should get fired for his comments I was refering to the jaguars performance. And comments like that are detremental to the nfl. We dont need the nfl turning into the nbaoh ok. but if the jags average record this season is an indicator of a coach that needs fired then there are about 20 teams that need a new coach. i cant recall a year where there were so many average teams with a 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 fighting for a final spot in the playoffs. the jags definitely have problems. i dont think coaching is one of them. they have overachieved since del rio got there. their 1st round qb and wr's have been disappointments. they should feel lucky they havent been bitten like the lions with the same picks.

oh and we dont need the nfl turning into womens softball either.

Preacher
12-28-2006, 06:02 PM
oh ok. but if the jags average record this season is an indicator of a coach that needs fired then there are about 20 teams that need a new coach. i cant recall a year where there were so many average teams with a 7-9, 8-8, 9-7 fighting for a final spot in the playoffs. the jags definitely have problems. i dont think coaching is one of them. they have overachieved since del rio got there. their 1st round qb and wr's have been disappointments. they should feel lucky they havent been bitten like the lions with the same picks.

oh and we dont need the nfl turning into womens softball either.


Too late for that!

The NFL screwed up YEARS ago when they took away the intentional grounding. That was how Qb's protected themselves. Then, they had to start adding all these other rules for the QB to be protected... It has turned into the Cute Skirt league.

I say.. take away ALL RULES regarding hitting the QB on blitzes... AND give back the intentional grounding.

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 06:10 PM
yeah, cause the "average fan" is on the field and at the bottom of the pile.:rolleyes:

jones drew is just a melodramatic liar :rolleyes:

im sure you get HBO across the pond. if not just check the nfl films highlights.

theres a reason the pats are known as a dirty team. duce staley can tell you as much.

i think del rios message was heard by his players though. dont give up cheap yardage to a qb who refuses to slide properly. im sure if jack lambert, greg lloyd, or joey porter were a coach they wouldve said the same thing (although within the locker room).

like i said, i think del rio was just fustrated with the way the pats play so he slipped up and spewed his thoughts to the media. im not calling him classy or anything but i understand where he is coming from. i thought brady deserved that shot to the back. its football and qb's get hit. ive seen ben get hit countless times putting himself in a vulnerable position.

those who suggest del rio should be fired or fined are utterly rediculous. thats just not how it works. after all tom wasnt wearing a pink dress that says "dont hit the qb" was he?

and if its between believing a patfans viewpoint of a game vs. players and coaches who experienced the game and reviewed the actual tape im gonna have to go with......drumroll please....... the players and coaches!


I can't see any evidence of these comments by Jones-Drew - help me out here - a link or something...anything.

I have the whole game on dvd so maybe you can tell me when this dirty hit by Bruschi happened - im not saying it didnt happen, im just saying you are the only person who has even mentioned this.

When you say 'The Patriots are known as a dirty team' it sounds like 'Tony doesn't like the Patriots' - its just hearsay, and biased speculation.

I enjoyed the 'lets believe the coaches' motto - I got a whole load of Bill Belichick truth for you to swallow - hey..I didn't make the rules :thumbsup:

So you thought Brady deserved a shot to the back...so what?

That doesnt mean it wasn't illegal and very dangerous.

The facts are out there, maybe you can actually bring a little factual evidence - you know, like the time of the game the Bruschi hit happened.

If you can't i'll just discount anything you've said in this thread, and assume its just Patriots-hating nonsense.

NM

tony hipchest
12-28-2006, 06:53 PM
I can't see any evidence of these comments by Jones-Drew - help me out here - a link or something...anything.


NMagain reading comprehension fails you. 2 seperate times in this thread i have directed you where to look.

for the THIRD time: try the nfl films version of the highlights broadcast on "inside the nfl", on hbo. much more insightful than what you have on dvd. unless you are saying you are privy to the nfl films vault, and all the coaching tapes???

so anyways, whats it sound like when i say r. harrison has been repeatedly voted as the dirtiest player in the nfl by his peers?

i know you would like this to ultimately be a fact forum but it is a forum where people voice their opinions. when a patfan of all people voice their opinion that other teams coaches are not "classy" i feel i can disagree. you do remember the game where harrison broke his shoulderblade against the colts where he was practically given orders to take out anything that moved, dont you?

i didnt think so.

i dont agree that del rio's comments were appropriate to be made to the media (although i agree with him). for a patfan to bitch and whine about it, is what i find funny. a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

seriously... nfl films provides some great footage and audio of the games one doesnt catch from tv. you should check it out sometime.

and since you have discounted everything i have ever said, its par for the course right? i dont have to convince you to see things my way cause i know you never will. dont mean i cant offer my opinion on a public steelers board right?

oh, and id like you to show me where del rio hit anybody. appearantly if you call somebody "classless" you are accusing them of hitting somebody.

re read the thread and you will see i just called bruschi the same thing you called del rio. since you have access to all this great footage ill just let YOU review the audio.

Livinginthe past
12-28-2006, 07:00 PM
again reading comprehension fails you. 2 seperate times in this thread i have directed you where to look.

for the THIRD time: try the nfl films version of the highlights broadcast on "inside the nfl", on hbo. much more insightful than what you have on dvd. unless you are saying you are privy to the nfl films vault, and all the coaching tapes???

so anyways, whats it sound like when i say r. harrison has been repeatedly voted as the dirtiest player in the nfl by his peers?

i know you would like this to ultimately be a fact forum but it is a forum where people voice their opinions. when a patfan of all people voice their opinion that other teams coaches are not "classy" i feel i can disagree. you do remember the game where harrison broke his shoulderblade against the colts where he was practically given orders to take out anything that moved, dont you?

i didnt think so.

i dont agree that del rio's comments were appropriate to be made to the media (although i agree with him). for a patfan to bitch and whine about it, is what i find funny. a case of the pot calling the kettle black.

seriously... nfl films provides some great footage and audio of the games one doesnt catch from tv. you should check it out sometime.

and since you have discounted everything i have ever said, its par for the course right? i dont have to convince you to see things my way cause i know you never will. dont mean i cant offer my opinion on a public steelers board right?

oh, and id like you to show me where del rio hit anybody. appearantly if you call somebody "classless" you are accusing them of hitting somebody.

re read the thread and you will see i just called bruschi the same thing you called del rio. since you have access to all this great footage ill just let YOU review the audio.

You are kidding me right?

Another reading comphension jibe?

I dont have HBO - you know so much about this dirty hit by Bruschi yet you cant even tell me what quarter it happened in?

I got the game film - thats it - if it happened, i'll be able to see it.

Call Bruschi what you want, but unless you can do better than tell me to subscribe to HBO or whatever then its just so much white noise.

You're on your own on this one, im afraid.

Del Rio was classless in saying spearing player is ok, and most probably reckless regarding player safety - you're on his side on that one - thats fine.

Thanks

NM

tony hipchest
12-28-2006, 07:35 PM
You are kidding me right?

Another reading comphension jibe?

I dont have HBO - you know so much about this dirty hit by Bruschi yet you cant even tell me what quarter it happened in?

I got the game film - thats it - if it happened, i'll be able to see it.

Call Bruschi what you want, but unless you can do better than tell me to subscribe to HBO or whatever then its just so much white noise.

You're on your own on this one, im afraid.

Del Rio was classless in saying spearing player is ok, and most probably reckless regarding player safety - you're on his side on that one - thats fine.

Thanks

NMat ease pardner. just seeing if your feathers still get ruffled. i cant help it if you dont get hbo. hbo is in with nfl films if you didnt know. good stuff. (good job on finally catching the referrence on the 3rd try). while i never said bruschi was taking cheap shots he did grab at a facemask that went unnoticed and was talking his fair share of smack. it is still my opinion that he is dirtier than anyone on the jags including their head coach.

it was really #25 who was punching drew. hmmm.... a rb getting sucker punched by a patriot player. sounds familiar. (if a pat coach allows this im sure he encourages it)

anyways i know im flying solo on this one. but i still stand by my opinion that if it comes down to a picking the more classy coach competition between del rio and belichick, im taking del rio (and i cant stand him going back to his days as a cowboy- i thought he was dirty then). if we had a jagsfan for a mod im sure more would agree.

Livinginthe past
12-29-2006, 09:37 AM
Well the NFL has ruled that the hit was legal, but are investigating Del Rio's comments further.


Jacksonville Jaguars rookie linebacker Clint Ingram will not be fined by the NFL for his jarring hit on Patriots quarterback Tom Brady in the fourth quarter of last Sunday's game.

"It was reviewed, and it was a legal hit," NFL vice president of public relations Greg Aiello said yesterday.

Although Ingram won't be fined, Jaguars coach Jack Del Rio might not be as fortunate.

Aiello said the NFL was aware of remarks by Del Rio on the Jaguars' website, in which he appeared to advocate the illegal tactic of spearing against Brady.

"We're always concerned about comments of that nature, and we're looking into it," Aiello said.

Here is a clip of the legal hit, where the player definitely didnt use the top of his helmet to hit another player!!

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h218/n_mckeown/brady.gif

NM

Steel12
12-29-2006, 09:37 AM
I wasnt suggesting that del rio should get fired for his comments I was refering to the jaguars performance. And comments like that are detremental to the nfl. We dont need the nfl turning into the nba

There are fights in every sport...how is the NBA different?

lamberts-lost-tooth
12-29-2006, 09:49 AM
Too late for that!

The NFL screwed up YEARS ago when they took away the intentional grounding. That was how Qb's protected themselves. Then, they had to start adding all these other rules for the QB to be protected... It has turned into the Cute Skirt league.

I say.. take away ALL RULES regarding hitting the QB on blitzes... AND give back the intentional grounding.

I believe the game is designed to reward the ones who hit the hardest. If you can't take it, you shouldn't play
- Jack Lambert

Yes, I get satisfaction out of hitting a guy and seeing him lie there a while."
- Jack Lambert

"If I could start my life all over again, I would be a professional football player, and you damn well better believe I would be a Pittsburgh Steeler."
- Jack Lambert

Hines0wnz
12-29-2006, 09:51 AM
Is it possible that the only reason this thread exists is because it involves a certain golden boy QB who hasnt had a great season and whose team most likely will be one and done in the playoffs?


Things that make you go hmmmm......

steelerbackr4life
12-29-2006, 10:08 AM
The name of this thread is Del Rio shows lack of class.

Perhaps we are making 2 issues out of one. The play on the field was and has been ruled legal.
The second issue with which this thread was named was that of a knucklehead shooting off his mouth and not letting the staff in place do their job. Which in the end turned out to be the right decision. By running his yap he accomplished absolutely nothing that benefits himself nor his team. Now any time there is a judgement call who do you think is going to get the nod the whiney coach who publicly criticised people before they even reviewed anything? Or as the Pats and their fans would have you believe the innocent victims ?
His only accomplishment here has been to take the focus off an over reacting QB and place it on his ignorance and that is where his lack of class shows through.

Livinginthe past
12-29-2006, 10:13 AM
The name of this thread is Del Rio shows lack of class.

Perhaps we are making 2 issues out of one. The play on the field was and has been ruled legal.
The second issue with which this thread was named was that of a knucklehead shooting off his mouth and not letting the staff in place do their job. Which in the end turned out to be the right decision. By running his yap he accomplished absolutely nothing that benefits himself nor his team. Now any time there is a judgement who do you think is going to get the nod the whiney coach who publicly criticised people before they even reviewed anything? Or as the Pats and their fans would have you believe the innocent victims ?
His only accomplishment here has been to take the focus off an over reacting QB and place it on his ignorance and that is where his lack of class shows through.

How did Brady 'over-react'?

He hasnt said a word to the media about this, as far as I am aware.

For the life of me I cannot see how the NFL hasn;t called this spearing - it doesnt even have to be intentional - a violent contact between the helmet and the body is all you require.

This rule is intended to protect the tackler (in this case Ingram) from a broken neck just as much as the guy getting hit.

Totally agree about Del Rio, though - dumb comment by someone who is paid alot of money to know better.

NM

steelerbackr4life
12-29-2006, 10:46 AM
The name of this thread is Del Rio shows lack of class.


The whole point of my post was to show how Del Rios actions were classless and detrimental to his team. Not to get into a debate over the legality of the play and or Brady over reacting on the field.

tony hipchest
12-29-2006, 11:28 AM
i didnt even know there was even any debate if this was a legal hit on brady. it was totally legal! several issues here:

#1- just about every tackle in football includes helmet contact to the body. its inevitable. the only way to rid of it is to play flag football. some tackles where you dont see helmet contact is horsecollar (banned), being on the ground and grabbing a qb by the legs (banned) or diving after a players legs or feet while being chased to the endzone. ANYTIME you tackle a player who is in front of you, your helmet makes contact with the body. but like they say, just try to "see what you are hitting".

#2- the term "spearing" implies that the body is shaped like a spear, an arrow, a rocket, a point, etc. during a "spear" the intent is not to tackle. the rookie was clearly leading with his right hand and forarm in an attempt to prevent extra yardage and jar the ball loose.

#3- "Using any part of a player’s helmet (including the top/crown and forehead/“hairline” parts) or facemask to butt, spear, or ram an opponent violently or unnecessarily;

i cant say that was violent or unnnecesary. football by definition is a violent sport and brady got hit. is just hitting somebody an act of violence? in the outside world... yes. in football...no. stopping brady from picking up extra yardage was a very necessary play. brady was not in a vulnerable or unprotected position. he was running with the ball trying to pick up extra yardage. he chose not to use the rule designed to protect him (slide rule), kinda like how ben chose not to use the equipment to protect him (motorcycle helmet). careless on bradys part. the spearing rule doesnt protect players from carelessness.

#4- the refs are human. after the jags lobbied the refs to watch for cheap shots, and after brady took it upon himself to turn into a running back and run for a career high in attempts, failing to use the slide rule designed to protect him on a numver of occasions, im thinking the refs might have swallowed the whistle and let the men play.

#5- if nothing was wrong with the hit that gave ben a concussion (in the pocket, in the grasp) or trent green a concussion (using the slide rule) i dont see why brady should get any special treatment. the fact that patfans think he should is whats disturbing.

j. del rio screwed up on 2 counts. speaking out while pissed, and loosely using the term "spear" when he shouldve said his players shouldve "stuck brady in the back earlier".

BTW great clip! great angle. it almost looks like brady is spineless. the way he bounced like a jellyfish and the fact that nothing was broken suggests he is!

in all seriousness hes quite lucky his shoulderpads did their job.

Livinginthe past
12-29-2006, 11:45 AM
The mistake some people are making is looking at the slide rule and the fact that it was a QB who got hit - this is utterly irrelevant.

The only thing that needs to be considered is - does the following rule apply to the hit, or not?

"Using any part of a player’s helmet (including the top/crown and forehead/“hairline” parts) or facemask to butt, spear, or ram an opponent violently or unnecessarily; although such violent or unnecessary use of the helmet and facemask is impermissible against any opponent, game officials will give special attention in administering this rule to protecting those players who are in virtually defenseless postures

When you 'lead with a helmet' that tends to be the first thing that makes contact with the opposing player - thats common sense.

When players dive forward they rarely do it 'like a rocket' - what does this mean anyway?

That players run around with their heads down with their arms beside their bodies? LOL

Thats an amusing image.

Anyway, forget Ben Roethlisberger, forget 'the slide rule', forget about QB's being overprotected (which I happen to agree btw)

Read the rule - look at the clip - make your mind up.

NM

Big D
12-29-2006, 11:55 AM
There are fights in every sport...how is the NBA different?

very good. There are fights in every sport. But in all other sports do you see massive brawls? are how about players going into the stands?

X-Terminator
12-29-2006, 12:04 PM
Well the NFL has ruled that the hit was legal, but are investigating Del Rio's comments further.




Here is a clip of the legal hit, where the player definitely didnt use the top of his helmet to hit another player!!

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h218/n_mckeown/brady.gif

NM

You know, you sometimes have to wonder what the hell the suits in the front office are looking at. How is that NOT a dirty hit?

HometownGal
12-29-2006, 12:14 PM
Personally, from watching the clip that LITP provided, I do not view that hit as a cheap shot. Look at the defender's left foot which slides right before the tackle - he looked somewhat off-balance. In addition, if he wanted to be cheap about it, he very well had the opportunity to spear Brady in the head, which he didn't do. I've seen worse hits than this on QB's not get called.

Are DelRio's comments classless? Yes, most definitely. I think Jack is an excellent coach but I think his comments were made in the heat of the moment. Nonetheless, however, he should have exercised better judgment.

tony hipchest
12-29-2006, 12:17 PM
When players dive forward they rarely do it 'like a rocket' - what does this mean anyway?

That players run around with their heads down with their arms beside their bodies? LOL

Thats an amusing image.



NMthats why spearing is rarely called, because by definition it is rarely done.

as i previously stated so clearly: the term "spearing" implies that the body is shaped like a spear, an arrow, a rocket, a point, etc. during a "spear" the intent is not to tackle.

transitive verb
1 : to pierce, strike, or take with or as if with a spear please tell me you can identify the similarities between a spear, an arrow, a rocket, etc. or how bout we play a game?

which item does not belong:

a) a spear
b) a rocket
c) a bullet
d) an arrow
e) a salad bowl

the answer is clearly "e"

youre only using a few words of the rule you conviniently provided to support your stance:

"Using any part of a player?s helmet (including the top/crown and forehead/?hairline? parts) or facemask to butt, spear, or ram an opponent violently or unnecessarily;


the hit on brady wasnt violent or unnecessary, therefore it was a legal hit regardless of what part of his helmet made contact with bradys body.

being that you cant see the similarities between the shape of a spear and a rocket im not sure i can buy into your interpretation of what spearing in the nfl is. by your interpretation (of just half the rule) a flag for "spearing" would be thrown on atleast 50% of the tackles made.

sorry, i gotta side with the nfl, all the officials, 100's of games played, and thousands of tackles made without a flag on this one. i can see why patfans would want players who hit brady to be penalized though. God forbid he get hurt while playing the game of football. that would put an end to the season.

Livinginthe past
12-29-2006, 12:36 PM
Personally, from watching the clip that LITP provided, I do not view that hit as a cheap shot. Look at the defender's left foot which slides right before the tackle - he looked somewhat off-balance. In addition, if he wanted to be cheap about it, he very well had the opportunity to spear Brady in the head, which he didn't do. I've seen worse hits than this on QB's not get called.

Are DelRio's comments classless? Yes, most definitely. I think Jack is an excellent coach but I think his comments were made in the heat of the moment. Nonetheless, however, he should have exercised better judgment.

Hey thats cool.

I would submit that his left foot is actually off the ground because the player is launching himself with as much force as possible.

I guess the point in trying to make is that it doesnt have to be a 'cheap shot' or have any intent to be ruled as 'spearing' - all you gotta have is violent contact with the top of the helmet to a prone body.

I was serious when I say the rule should be enforced, not just for the guy being tackled but the guy doing the tackling - thats the type of shot that players get paralysed from.

NM

tony hipchest
12-29-2006, 12:54 PM
I would submit that his left foot is actually off the ground because the player is launching himself with as much force as possible.



NM2 feet are off the ground at the same time but his toes are touching the ground when contact was finally made so he definitely wasnt "launching" (more like landing- more rocket references here). you can tell he was aiming for the ball with his helmet. which is exactly what he has been taught to do since pop warner. brady made a heads up play by shielding the ball with his back. see how he twists as hes going down when he sees the defender coming? why else whould he do this?

as far as "enforcement" of this rule, it is a judgement call, and probably couldve been called either way. i think patfans are just spoiled with all the calls always going their way... tuck rule, gerrards fumble at the end of the game, etc.

you win some, you lose some. looks like it evened out in the end. good non call by the refs. in fact, brady shoulda been penalized for not sliding and putting the defender in a dangerous situation.

X-Terminator
12-29-2006, 01:04 PM
I will submit that it really doesn't take much to launch yourself into someone if you're running at a high rate of speed - one little push off your toes is more than enough to hit a player that hard. That could be what happened here, but he still led with his helmet, which IMO makes it an illegal hit.

tony hipchest
12-29-2006, 01:28 PM
I will submit that it really doesn't take much to launch yourself into someone if you're running at a high rate of speed - one little push off your toes is more than enough to hit a player that hard. That could be what happened here, but he still led with his helmet, which IMO makes it an illegal hit.this is where the rules are a little fuzzy. there is "spearing" (which this clearly wasnt), then there is "leading with the crown of the helmet" (which this couldve been called).

then there is "putting a hat on the ball", which is not only taught, but encouraged and applauded (one of the best ways to cause a fumble). to me thats what it looks like he was trying to do which explains why brady slighly twists near the end, shielding the ball with his shoulder/back.

HometownGal
12-29-2006, 01:43 PM
this is where the rules are a little fuzzy. there is "spearing" (which this clearly wasnt), then there is "leading with the crown of the helmet" (which this couldve been called).

then there is "putting a hat on the ball", which is not only taught, but encouraged and applauded (one of the best ways to cause a fumble). to me thats what it looks like he was trying to do which explains why brady slighly twists near the end, shielding the ball with his shoulder/back.

I agree 100%, Tony. If a D coach/coord doesn't teach trying to jar the ball loose every which way but loose, he's in the wrong career field. Your theory makes total sense. Good post, Mr. Hipchest. :cheers:

Steel12
12-29-2006, 01:50 PM
very good. There are fights in every sport. But in all other sports do you see massive brawls? are how about players going into the stands?

Yes you do see massive brawls and seein how every other sport has more people on the field than the NBA does, it's worse! Basketball is the only sport where the fans can reach out and touch the athlete...try again! :thumbsup:

Stillers#1
12-29-2006, 02:18 PM
Fact of the matter is, if you're a QB and you're running, slide, don't dive headfirst. Had that been a RB as opposed to a QB, we aren't even having this conversation.

If Brady wants to be a "tough guy" then so be it, but he should be prepared to take the tough hits. I feel the same way Del Rio did.

Big D
12-29-2006, 03:05 PM
Yes you do see massive brawls and seein how every other sport has more people on the field than the NBA does, it's worse! Basketball is the only sport where the fans can reach out and touch the athlete...try again! :thumbsup:

you are obviously missing my point here....

Hines0wnz
12-29-2006, 03:57 PM
It wasnt spearing and it wasnt holding by Troy Brown (#80) as Brady was falling down in front of the Jags defender of which he (Brown) had 2 hands full of jersey which exposed his shoulder pad.

fansince'76
12-29-2006, 05:28 PM
I really hope Del Rio made that comment out of frustration, because it is a downright idiotic statement. Spearing is illegal for a reason - it is dangerous not only to the ball carrier but the defender doing the spearing. As a former longtime NFL LB himself, Del Rio should know this better than anybody.

tony hipchest
01-08-2007, 08:36 PM
Jack Del Rio has obviously allowed the frustration of coaching one of the most unpredictable teams of 2006 to boil over into making one of the least classy comments of the year.

Poor show, Del Rio NM

im just wondering... short of driving through a drive thru naked (theres a warm buns joke in here somewhere), where does belichicks recent actions of accosting a camera man, rate him on "least classy ACTIONS of the year" list?

poor show 'chick. :chuckle:

its one thing to be a sore loser. even worse to be a poor winner. good thing its something "handshakes and hugs" can mask :rolleyes: