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Infamix
01-04-2007, 10:02 AM
I'm not a big fan of Seth Wickersham...but he makes a valid point in this article. I wanted to know if our line cut blocks...I haven't noticed it though.

Cut blocks elicit irrational behavior posted: Wednesday, January 3, 2007 | Feedback | Print Entry
filed under: NFL

The past few months have been some of the most interesting in my five years covering the NFL. They've been spent working on an Albert Haynesworth story and listening in with Albert and his closest family and friends as he's tried to figure out exactly why he committed the most atrocious act in recent sports memory.
I spent hours interviewing Haynesworth -- in his house, in his monster F-650, over breakfast and lunch -? during the past two months. This week in ESPN The Magazine, I write about what I saw, what Haynesworth revealed, and the two surprising paths he's taken to healing.

I know what you want answered: Why did he stomp on the naked head of Cowboys center Andre Gurode? What caused him to commit such an act in such a public arena with so much on the line? Haynesworth's answer is complicated; there is no clear reason, and my story goes into each possible theory. But one of the sparks that lit his fuse occurred in a seemingly forgettable play in the second quarter of the Titans-Cowboys game on Oct. 1.

It was third down, and as Drew Bledsoe took the snap, Haynesworth leapt out of his three-point stance. As guard Kyle Kosier was blocking him, Gurode exploded his 300-plus pounds into Haynesworth's surgically repaired left knee. It was a vicious, legal chop block that had Haynesworth twisting in the air only .64 seconds after the snap. Haynesworth believed the Cowboys wanted to end his career, and that anger he carried into the third quarter when he saw Gurode on the ground, his helmet knocked off.

Now, I'm not making excuses for what Haynesworth did. Neither, it should be emphasized, was he when he described it to me. But that was part of why Haynesworth snapped, and it brings up a larger question for the NFL to consider: Why are cut blocks allowed?

It is a barbaric tactic, and this year Haynesworth wasn't alone in losing his head over it. Richard Seymour stomped on the head of Tarik Glenn after a cut block. Antonio Pierce hit Michael Vick out of bounds as payback for the Falcons' cut blocks. Igor Olshansky punched Tom Nalen after a cut block. It goes on and on.

Now, Haynesworth's explosion was by far the most fantastic. He literally went into a blind rage. (When he got to the locker room after being ejected, he couldn't remember what he'd done.) But when millions are on the line, and dirty but legal tactics are involved, isn't a matter of time before someone else blows?

I brought this up over the phone with Mike Pereira, the NFL's director of officiating. He said that he's been at every competition committee meeting since 1998 and, "I promise you, it'll be discussed. It is every year. But there's a lot that goes into it. Are more players getting injured? Can you run the ball if you eliminate those types of blocks?"

I don't know if you can. Defensive linemen are getting so big that very few interior blockers can move them using pure force. Stars like LaDainian Tomlinson get huge chunks of yards thanks to cut blocks. So does Warrick Dunn. So does every Broncos tailback. That sort of excitement is why fans pack stadiums.

But at what cost? By allowing blockers to dive at defenders' knees, with careers at stake, I think it's just a matter of time before we see another Haynesworth-type incident.

Stillers#1
01-04-2007, 11:08 AM
As a former undersized college lineman, I am all for cut-blocks. We get rid of these and before you know it, no one is going to be allowed to get hit. This game is a watered down version of what it used to be, and we only have the fair weather fans to blame for that.

What I mean by that is the fans who will only watch if Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, LT, etc. are playing. The league is going to drastic measures to protect these guys, and it is getting ridiculous. Although, if the league got rid of cut blocking all together, we would more than likely see a drastic drop in scoring, and a drop in the number of fans who watch games. This is why the league won't mess with this.

HometownGal
01-04-2007, 11:20 AM
As a former undersized college lineman, I am all for cut-blocks. We get rid of these and before you know it, no one is going to be allowed to get hit. This game is a watered down version of what it used to be, and we only have the fair weather fans to blame for that.

What I mean by that is the fans who will only watch if Tom Brady, Peyton Manning, LT, etc. are playing. The league is going to drastic measures to protect these guys, and it is getting ridiculous. Although, if the league got rid of cut blocking all together, we would more than likely see a drastic drop in scoring, and a drop in the number of fans who watch games. This is why the league won't mess with this.

Good post, Stillers, and I can't disagree with what you are saying here. Back in the day, cut blocks were the norm and accepted as part of the game of football. The league has attempted to pussify the game over the last decade or two and the way things are going, we're going to be watching a game similar to flag football. Football is a CONTACT sport and as long as the blocks aren't made to deliberately injure another player (which I do realize would be difficult to ascertain) I see this maneuver as just another part of a game that is meant to be physical.

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 11:51 AM
I know that I'm expanding on the original topic, but I have a question? I have heard numerous times since the game on Sunday that the Steeler's were playing dirty...meaning intentionally trying to injure. I was told that it happened at least 5 different times and that even the national commentators were calling it out. Since I was at the game, and dealing with "issues" there, I wasn't aware that there was controversy about it going on. I would appreciate hearing opinions. (Mods, if this needed it's own thread, please excuse and feel free to move it.)

Stillers#1
01-04-2007, 11:54 AM
I know that I'm expanding on the original topic, but I have a question? I have heard numerous times since the game on Sunday that the Steeler's were playing dirty...meaning intentionally trying to injure. I was told that it happened at least 5 different times and that even the national commentators were calling it out. Since I was at the game, and dealing with "issues" there, I wasn't aware that there was controversy about it going on. I would appreciate hearing opinions. (Mods, if this needed it's own thread, please excuse and feel free to move it.)

This wasn't just the Steelers IMO. Although we were playing dirty, which sometimes is part of football. I can't remember the name, but on the opening kickoff a bungles special teamer threw a punch at Santonio. They opened the can, we filled it, end of story.

But yeah, our boys werent playing "lemony fresh".

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 12:06 PM
This wasn't just the Steelers IMO. Although we were playing dirty, which sometimes is part of football. I can't remember the name, but on the opening kickoff a bungles special teamer threw a punch at Santonio. They opened the can, we filled it, end of story.

But yeah, our boys werent playing "lemony fresh".Thanks for responding. Did the Bengals get called on any of it or just the Steelers? Do you recall any specific plays either way besides the opening kick? The info is appreciated.

tony hipchest
01-04-2007, 12:06 PM
i think finesse teams and their fans (bungles) sometimes confuse smashmouth with dirty. im sure alot saw the way smith leveled t.j housh...and had to feel it was a dirty unnecesary blow. it was legal, it prevented a catch, and it was a play the free safety is supposed to make.

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 12:09 PM
i think finesse teams and their fans (bungles) sometimes confuse smashmouth with dirty. im sure alot saw the way smith leveled t.j housh...and had to feel it was a dirty unnecesary blow. it was legal, it prevented a catch, and it was a play the free safety is supposed to make.I know that there were calls made against the Steelers. So do you think they were bad calls then...undeserved?

Stillers#1
01-04-2007, 12:10 PM
Thanks for responding. Did the Bengals get called on any of it or just the Steelers? Do you recall any specific plays either way besides the opening kick? The info is appreciated.

No, the bungles pretty much chilled out after that one. Our boys didn't though. The hit by Smith was cleaner than a car wash. Colon was talkin shit though, and more than likely playing dirty. And although I missed it ( I musta been taking a dump or seomthing) Harrison belly to back suplexed 85. The commentators got it right, but the bungles quite literally threw the opening punch.

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 12:54 PM
No, the bungles pretty much chilled out after that one. Our boys didn't though. The hit by Smith was cleaner than a car wash. Colon was talkin shit though, and more than likely playing dirty. And although I missed it ( I musta been taking a dump or seomthing) Harrison belly to back suplexed 85. The commentators got it right, but the bungles quite literally threw the opening punch.I've seen a clip of that take down on Chad. So you think that was a bad hit and deserved a penalty?

SteelerFanInCA
01-04-2007, 01:15 PM
These guys will be playing flag football one day. NFL -The National Flag League. I love the old school game when you could just go out and crack some one without being penalized.

HometownGal
01-04-2007, 01:19 PM
I know that there were calls made against the Steelers. So do you think they were bad calls then...undeserved?

The one bad call that stands out in my mind is the roughing the passer call against Farrior in the 4Q. Nice acting job, Cartoon. That call was total BS. :poop:

Infamix
01-04-2007, 01:26 PM
These guys will be playing flag football one day. NFL -The National Flag League. I love the old school game when you could just go out and crack some one without being penalized.

Compare the size and speed of the old school players to present day.

sumo
01-04-2007, 01:28 PM
pussify

LMAO!! - I love that word and I haven't seen it for so long :toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny:

SteelerFanInCA
01-04-2007, 01:30 PM
Compare the size and speed of the old school players to present day.

You make a great point. Although the modern day players might be faster, bigger and stronger I am still a fan of the old school ways.

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 01:33 PM
I'm hoping to see a taped version of that game this weekend. I said I would reserve judgement until I saw it for myself. I appreciate the input.

Stillers#1
01-04-2007, 01:33 PM
I've seen a clip of that take down on Chad. So you think that was a bad hit and deserved a penalty?

With the rules being what they are, yes it deserved a penalty. The way I would like football to be played though, it wouldn't be a penalty. I do that to friends while playing backyard football.

sumo
01-04-2007, 01:36 PM
During a game once when I kept allowing myself to be cut blocked and thus giving up contain and huge running plays and more or less getting my a-- handed to me - my position coach yanked me out of the game and gave me a huge WTF look -- the only thing I could say was "man - these guys cut block every play.." - he proceeded to throw his headset on the ground and get within an inch of my face and yell "THAT"S FOOTBALL - IF YOU CAN"T KEEP THEM OFF YOUR LEGS - THEN YOU BETTER SIT YOUR A** DOWN!!!" - in the words of HTGAL - I pussified myself that day...

floodcitygirl
01-04-2007, 01:36 PM
With the rules being what they are, yes it deserved a penalty. The way I would like football to be played though, it wouldn't be a penalty. I do that to friends while playing backyard football.I have to say that after seeing that one, I would have been shocked if it hadn't been called. But personally.....I really enjoyed it. :grin:

Haiku_Dirtt
01-04-2007, 02:47 PM
These guys will be playing flag football one day. NFL -The National Flag League. I love the old school game when you could just go out and crack some one without being penalized.

Great subject.

Farrior's tackle was a beauty. But unless we start equiping humans with braking systems the league is starting to hit a wall in their attempts to protect players. Granted Farrior did look like a bottlenose dolphin once he snatched that fish out of water.

How does he decelerate in mid-air? If he doesn't drive Palmer into the turf then he flattens out and probably takes his head off as momentum carries his body as they both fall to the ground. Greater risk of neck injury to Palmer instead of getting the wind knocked out.

"just go out and crack some one without being penalized" Well yes and no. Yes if it is the other guy. No if it is Ben.

steelcity58
01-04-2007, 03:11 PM
The Steelers are one of the cleanest teams in the NFL.

Want cut-blocking?

Go visit the Broncos and the authority on cheap line tactics....one Mr. Shanahan.

SteelerFanInCA
01-04-2007, 03:12 PM
"just go out and crack some one without being penalized" Well yes and no. Yes if it is the other guy. No if it is Ben.

I can agree with that. :smile:

Haiku_Dirtt
01-04-2007, 03:29 PM
The Steelers are one of the cleanest teams in the NFL.

Want cut-blocking?

Go visit the Broncos and the authority on cheap line tactics....one Mr. Shanahan.

Talk about cheap and cut-blocks? The Broncos suffered the ultimate of both. I don't know if bad karma hovered over Denver on Sunday but that was one nasty trifecta.

Lose to the 49'ers at home. Get eliminated from the playoffs. Bury what appears to be one of the good ones in the NFL.:shake01:

lamberts-lost-tooth
01-04-2007, 03:50 PM
During a game once when I kept allowing myself to be cut blocked and thus giving up contain and huge running plays and more or less getting my a-- handed to me - my position coach yanked me out of the game and gave me a huge WTF look -- the only thing I could say was "man - these guys cut block every play.." - he proceeded to throw his headset on the ground and get within an inch of my face and yell "THAT"S FOOTBALL - IF YOU CAN"T KEEP THEM OFF YOUR LEGS - THEN YOU BETTER SIT YOUR A** DOWN!!!" - in the words of HTGAL - I pussified myself that day...

LOL...I had almost the same situation...got my butt chewed for grabbing turf all game...finally used the dudes spine for a spring board and got his hand on the next play. Funny how cleat indentions seem to dissuade that tactic. But your right...Thats football!!

BlacknGold Bleeder
01-04-2007, 11:22 PM
I've seen a clip of that take down on Chad. So you think that was a bad hit and deserved a penalty?

Where did you see that clip?? I missed that hit.

I-Want-Troy's-Hair
01-05-2007, 01:35 AM
The Steelers are one of the cleanest teams in the NFL.

Want cut-blocking?

Go visit the Broncos and the authority on cheap line tactics....one Mr. Shanahan.

If you remember a year or two ago they were interviewing Shanahan (lovingly called rat face by me) about cut blocks and he just happened to have a video ready to play. The video was of the steelers.

He was giving a blow by blow of how the Steelers cut block and how his beloved Bronco's NEVER EVER cut block. sneezing bull-:poop:

floodcitygirl
01-05-2007, 07:02 AM
Where did you see that clip?? I missed that hit.Media section. "Video of Bunguls hits" thread.

floodcitygirl
01-05-2007, 12:15 PM
I know that I'm expanding on the original topic, but I have a question? I have heard numerous times since the game on Sunday that the Steeler's were playing dirty...meaning intentionally trying to injure. I was told that it happened at least 5 different times and that even the national commentators were calling it out. Since I was at the game, and dealing with "issues" there, I wasn't aware that there was controversy about it going on. I would appreciate hearing opinions. (Mods, if this needed it's own thread, please excuse and feel free to move it.)You know what......nevermind! I just saw a clip from the first play of the game which I missed trying to get to my seat. Whatever happened with those other plays, they got what they deserved IMO. It was paybacks, baby! Were there any flags on that???

ARKIESTEEL
01-05-2007, 12:18 PM
Wasnt that long ago that dudes like Buddy Ryan was putting hits and bountys out on players meaning that if you took the guy out of the game you got the cash


this did happen :thumbsup:

sumo
01-05-2007, 03:13 PM
The Steelers are one of the cleanest teams in the NFL.

Want cut-blocking?

Go visit the Broncos and the authority on cheap line tactics....one Mr. Shanahan.

I'm convinced these guys practice their patented dive and roll moves more then they practice drive blocking...