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View Full Version : Interesting tid bit of info


BOXCAR JOEY
03-04-2007, 01:57 PM
Big ben finished 9# place in the heisman trophy race in 2003. also the same year he was #2 in passer rating when he was in college.

just thought i would share

Elvis
03-04-2007, 02:02 PM
:coffee:
Nice Information that I didnt know.
I Love Big Ben and all the intangibles that he brings to our team
and he is gonna rebound I just know it. He is Not the 30-40 pass attempt guy that alot of people want him to be though. We
must keep our running game strong and our
defense Intimidating and we will be
just fine...
:tt02:

tony hipchest
03-04-2007, 02:15 PM
why is he not the 30-40 pass attempt per game guy?

hes a qb right? he knows how to toss the ball? his arm isnt weak or diseased is it?

then he is that guy. otherwise the steelers wouldve gotten rid of him rather than the coaching staff that turned him into a 20 attempt/game passer.

Livinginthe past
03-04-2007, 03:50 PM
A guy who is not capable of throwing the ball 30-40 times, and throwing it well, when required is simply not that good a QB.

The days of the Steelers being able to bend other teams to their will by power running up the gut and playing crushing defense are gone.

Ben will be due a big payday soon enough - it would be wise for the Steelers to find out whether they have a QB or a game manager before they decide whether to pay him 'franchise QB' money.

For the record, I have always maintained that Ben will be an excellent QB - although a single season is a fairly large % of his career to date - there are enough mitigating circumstances to think that last year will be an anomaly.

Florida_Steelers_Fan
03-04-2007, 06:01 PM
The days of the Steelers being able to bend other teams to their will by power running up the gut and playing crushing defense are gone.


i totally disagree with this statement. the steelers are a team built on running the football and always will. even when erhardt was running those 5 receiver sets with o'donnell at qb, they still ran the ball with foster/morris.

i think we're all overreacting to cowher's loss and some comments made by the players (ie. faneca) regarding tomlin. none of these statements are based on facts (as your presumption also shows)...nothing more than innuendo's based upon opinions.

can we at least have one practice before we start making this stuff up? :hunch:

Livinginthe past
03-04-2007, 06:15 PM
i totally disagree with this statement. the steelers are a team built on running the football and always will. even when erhardt was running those 5 receiver sets with o'donnell at qb, they still ran the ball with foster/morris.

i think we're all overreacting to cowher's loss and some comments made by the players (ie. faneca) regarding tomlin. none of these statements are based on facts (as your presumption also shows)...nothing more than innuendo's based upon opinions.

can we at least have one practice before we start making this stuff up? :hunch:

It is my opinion that in the salary cap era building a team as dominant as the 70's Steelers is nigh on impossible - and by dominant, I mean you know what they are going to bring but they are so superior at executing it that you are unable to stop them.

Team in recent times have tasted SB success by being flexible in their approach to offensive philosophy - the Patriots like to feed the ball to the RB plenty but have shown a desire to go 5-wide alot - spreading the field out.

Best example of that was against the Vikes last year - best run D in the country , so the Patriots simply didnt try to run - they spread 'em wide and killed them with a 1000 short passes.

The Colts this past year learnt to stop heaving the ball down the field in the postseason, they realised the benefits of committing to a running game and giving their D a breather.

They also had Manning throwing dump offs, quick outs and slants - to go with what was having the most effectiveness.

The Steelers put the ball in Roethlisbergers hands two years ago in the postseason and bar one game it worked very well.

The one thing I consistently criticised Cowher for was being one dimensional and stubborn - for not realising running Bettis up the gut against a good run D is not always going to pay dividends.

In the SB winning year he was able to shelve that disposition and success was his - no coincidence, I think.

Im pretty sure Belichick would love nothing more than for the Steelers to roll into New England this year determined to run the ball at all costs - teams excel these days at taking away an element of a teams offense.

To prosper you must be able to adapt.

NM

Florida_Steelers_Fan
03-04-2007, 07:30 PM
you still (and in my opinion, always will) win championships by doing two things well: run the football on offense and stop the run on defense. roethlisberger may end up being a very good qb when his career is all said and done, but the steelers will find success when they run teams over and control the clock...running the football is a mindset, and tomlin understands this very well.

adapt, yes...but don't over-adapt. it's still a simple game and building a "passing" team doesn't work as we learned a three/four years ago when the steelers tried to let tommy maddox win via the pass and the steelers got away from their "bread and butter" of power football.

SteelShooter
03-04-2007, 07:46 PM
But keep in mind, most teams are so committed to stopping our run that, that in itself opens up our passing game.

I believe, IMHO, that we should still stick to the run as the core of our offense, but pick up the pass just a little more, maybe the 22-30 passes per game neighborhood.

But we do need a nice, tall, speedy WR to assist in opening that field up a smidge.

19ward86
03-04-2007, 08:01 PM
big ben is definitaly able to throw 30-40 times a game, in college he threw a hell of a lot. he threw for like 3500 in college, considering only about 12 games a year that is a crap load of yards.

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
03-05-2007, 01:58 AM
i totally disagree with this statement. the steelers are a team built on running the football and always will. even when erhardt was running those 5 receiver sets with o'donnell at qb, they still ran the ball with foster/morris.

i think we're all overreacting to cowher's loss and some comments made by the players (ie. faneca) regarding tomlin. none of these statements are based on facts (as your presumption also shows)...nothing more than innuendo's based upon opinions.

can we at least have one practice before we start making this stuff up? :hunch:

The team that was built around the run just had its play book thrown out the window and redone by a receivers coach..........This doesnt make you wonder

BritishSteel
03-05-2007, 10:17 AM
It is my opinion that in the salary cap era building a team as dominant as the 70's Steelers is nigh on impossible - and by dominant, I mean you know what they are going to bring but they are so superior at executing it that you are unable to stop them.

Team in recent times have tasted SB success by being flexible in their approach to offensive philosophy - the Patriots like to feed the ball to the RB plenty but have shown a desire to go 5-wide alot - spreading the field out.

Best example of that was against the Vikes last year - best run D in the country , so the Patriots simply didnt try to run - they spread 'em wide and killed them with a 1000 short passes.

The Colts this past year learnt to stop heaving the ball down the field in the postseason, they realised the benefits of committing to a running game and giving their D a breather.

They also had Manning throwing dump offs, quick outs and slants - to go with what was having the most effectiveness.

The Steelers put the ball in Roethlisbergers hands two years ago in the postseason and bar one game it worked very well.

The one thing I consistently criticised Cowher for was being one dimensional and stubborn - for not realising running Bettis up the gut against a good run D is not always going to pay dividends.

In the SB winning year he was able to shelve that disposition and success was his - no coincidence, I think.

Im pretty sure Belichick would love nothing more than for the Steelers to roll into New England this year determined to run the ball at all costs - teams excel these days at taking away an element of a teams offense.

To prosper you must be able to adapt.

NM

Can't disagree with that - though I'd caveat it with the proviso that it's no good having a flexible offence if one element of it is vastly superior to the other, because everyone will know what your default setting is. The Steelers will always run the football first and take to the air second, but the SB run did show (as much with 'gadget plays' as with 'traditional' passing plays) that you put the opposition defence on the back foot if you have a capable and effective plan B.

Ben can throw the ball - anyone who thinks otherwise should watch the first half of the play off game in Indy or the Championship game in Denver - a virtually flawless demonstration of how a run/pass double-punch offence should work. That doesn't mean that we won't be a run-first team, but that Arians might give us a more effective plan B.

drew102e
03-05-2007, 10:53 AM
The team that was built around the run just had its play book thrown out the window and redone by a receivers coach..........This doesnt make you wonder

whiz was recievers (TE) coach as was mularkey before him, and we still ran the ball...alot

DACEB
03-05-2007, 12:05 PM
Teams in recent times have tasted SB success by being flexible in their approach to offensive philosophy - the Patriots like to feed the ball to the RB plenty but have shown a desire to go 5-wide alot - spreading the field out.

The Colts this past year learnt to stop heaving the ball down the field in the postseason, they realised the benefits of committing to a running game and giving their D a breather.

The Steelers put the ball in Roethlisbergers hands two years ago in the postseason and bar one game it worked very well.

The one thing I consistently criticised Cowher for was being one dimensional and stubborn - for not realising running Bettis up the gut against a good run D is not always going to pay dividends.

In the SB winning year he was able to shelve that disposition and success was his - no coincidence, I think.

To prosper you must be able to adapt.

I agree with you 100% LITP, you must be flexible and be able to adapt to circumstances and teams strengths and weaknesses. But in the end you MUST be able to run the ball and stop the run, or maybe it should be phrased differently.

You MUST be able to keep your offense on the field and stop the other teams offense. Whether it is by running the ball or dinking and dumping off to the back. Whether it is by taking advantage of what the defense gives you, run or pass. Whether it is by blitzing or controlling the line of scrimmage on defense.

Whether it is through execution or attrition, as coach Tomlin put it, you must keep control of the GAME on offense and defense. On offense, IMO, running the ball is the best way to do that. You must be able to capatilize with the pass if a team gears up to stop the run, and Ben is expected and needs to be able to do just that, but more than that is not necessary. We don't and I hope we won't need to be pass happy.

You MUST be able to run the ball and stop the run. If you can control those aspects of the game you can control the game. You can control the clock and you can make the other offense one dimensionable.

LITP, you used the Patriots as an example and a good example. In the end however, against the Colts with an 18 point lead, if the Pats could have run the ball more effectively the Pats would have beaten the Colts.

However you want to phrase it, you must keep your offense on the field and you must stop the other teams offense. You MUST be able to control the lines of scrimmage, whether through execution or attrition.

In the end Ben, or any other QB, just needs to manage the game and make plays when necessary.

Livinginthe past
03-06-2007, 01:11 AM
I agree with you 100% LITP, you must be flexible and be able to adapt to circumstances and teams strengths and weaknesses. But in the end you MUST be able to run the ball and stop the run, or maybe it should be phrased differently.

You MUST be able to keep your offense on the field and stop the other teams offense. Whether it is by running the ball or dinking and dumping off to the back. Whether it is by taking advantage of what the defense gives you, run or pass. Whether it is by blitzing or controlling the line of scrimmage on defense.

Whether it is through execution or attrition, as coach Tomlin put it, you must keep control of the GAME on offense and defense. On offense, IMO, running the ball is the best way to do that. You must be able to capatilize with the pass if a team gears up to stop the run, and Ben is expected and needs to be able to do just that, but more than that is not necessary. We don't and I hope we won't need to be pass happy.

You MUST be able to run the ball and stop the run. If you can control those aspects of the game you can control the game. You can control the clock and you can make the other offense one dimensionable.

LITP, you used the Patriots as an example and a good example. In the end however, against the Colts with an 18 point lead, if the Pats could have run the ball more effectively the Pats would have beaten the Colts.

However you want to phrase it, you must keep your offense on the field and you must stop the other teams offense. You MUST be able to control the lines of scrimmage, whether through execution or attrition.

In the end Ben, or any other QB, just needs to manage the game and make plays when necessary.

The Colts game is a good example.

If I had to criticise the Patriots playcalling this past year it would be because they seemed to give up on the run way too early in some games.

We were gashing the Colts in the regular season for 5 ypc, but it seemed clear to me that Belichick and his offensive co-ord were convinced that there was little they could do to stop the game turning into a shootout.

That led to an awful deep ball down field straight down the safeties throat.

I agree that the threat of the run and pass must be viable if a team is to be successful, but the team should be able to unbalance it 80/20 in either direction, for a short period, should the situation require.

The Patriots D totally run out of gas in the 2nd half of the AFCCG - and the offense could have done alot more to help out - as you say, by maintaining better control of the T.O.P. battle.

The Patriots have often used the clock against opponents by making them construct long, multiple play drives (bend don't break) - but the Colts offense was just too clutch on key 3rd downs and had way too many weapons for a defense on its last legs.

As you say, all you can ask of your QB is to make the plays when necessary - last year Ben failed to do that but im convinced that last year will be the excpetion to the rule.

Time will tell.

NM

DACEB
03-06-2007, 06:45 AM
As you say, all you can ask of your QB is to make the plays when necessary - last year Ben failed to do that but im convinced that last year will be the excpetion to the rule.

Time will tell.

I'm confident Ben will bounce back this year. Hopefully with some rest and time with the receivers in the offseason he will play to the level we all expect.

I believe Ben can light it up if necessary, and he has the confidence in himself to do that. I don't think we need to protect Ben with the run, I just believe in running the ball period. As long as Ben makes the defense pay for trying to stop the run, he is being effective.

I like the idea of 4-wide, as well as mixing up the offense a little more. You must be effective at taking what the defense gives you, running or passing, but we must be able to run the ball. I wouldn't want to see us go away from running the ball.