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Livinginthe past
05-23-2007, 11:43 AM
As is typical with these offseason rankings (player or team) they are mainly just for stimluating a little friendly debate.

http://nflblogs.profootballweekly.com/AroundtheNFL/2007/05/pfws_top_50_list_a_breakdown.html

A few players who seem like a bit of a reach at first glance...

42. Kellen Winslow
47 Mike Strahan

But , in general, it seems like a fairly decent list - can't think of many who should be on here who aren't.

fansince'76
05-23-2007, 12:23 PM
For such a "thoroughly compiled" list, it seems pretty subjective to me. #1 through #3 I completely agree with, then after that it seems pretty arbitrary. Carson Palmer at #4? 'Tis to laugh. Winslow making it onto the list at all while Alge Crumpler, Heath Miller AND Ben Watson were left off it entirely? Again, 'tis to laugh. I gotta give them props for at least not putting Vick on it.

lamberts-lost-tooth
05-23-2007, 12:42 PM
As is typical with these offseason rankings (player or team) they are mainly just for stimluating a little friendly debate.

http://nflblogs.profootballweekly.com/AroundtheNFL/2007/05/pfws_top_50_list_a_breakdown.html

A few players who seem like a bit of a reach at first glance...

42. Kellen Winslow
47 Mike Strahan

But , in general, it seems like a fairly decent list - can't think of many who should be on here who aren't.

I would argue that Parker should be there before Rudi Johnson.... Ogden is a Hall of Famer, but has not been a top 50 player for the last 2 years.... Lee Evans has only had one year of more than 850 yards, and that isnt even close to beating out Hines Ward.

They seem to not be consistant towards "body of work" vs "flash in the pan"

Livinginthe past
05-23-2007, 01:02 PM
For such a "thoroughly compiled" list, it seems pretty subjective to me. #1 through #3 I completely agree with, then after that it seems pretty arbitrary. Carson Palmer at #4? 'Tis to laugh. Winslow making it onto the list at all while Alge Crumpler, Heath Miller AND Ben Watson were left off it entirely? Again, 'tis to laugh. I gotta give them props for at least not putting Vick on it.



Yeah, i'd go along with most of your assessment.

Palmer is an excelllent pasing technician but appears to have a problem with turnovers when it really matters.

Yeah, I'd definitely have Crumpler ahead of Winslow too.

Livinginthe past
05-23-2007, 01:04 PM
I would argue that Parker should be there before Rudi Johnson.... Ogden is a Hall of Famer, but has not been a top 50 player for the last 2 years.... Lee Evans has only had one year of more than 850 yards, and that isnt even close to beating out Hines Ward.

They seem to not be consistant towards "body of work" vs "flash in the pan"

Yeah, i'd probably give Willie the edge at this time, bearing in mind Cincy has plenty of weapons in the pasing game to take the heat off him.

I have a feeling that these ratings are heavily biased toward last years achievements with one eye on what might happen this year, rather than taking the last 3-4 years into acount.

Black@Gold Forever32
05-23-2007, 01:25 PM
All I had to see Soldier Boy on the list and I went no further with it. The left off Willie Parker, Hines Ward but have Soldier Boy. What piece of cow dung this list is.lol

lamberts-lost-tooth
05-23-2007, 01:28 PM
Yeah, i'd probably give Willie the edge at this time, bearing in mind Cincy has plenty of weapons in the pasing game to take the heat off him.

I have a feeling that these ratings are heavily biased toward last years achievements with one eye on what might happen this year, rather than taking the last 3-4 years into acount.

I think your right..but that doesnt explaing Ogden....Speed Rushers have beat him so bad over the last two years...you would have thought he stole something.

Crushzilla
05-23-2007, 01:53 PM
This is really bad...

You are always going to have people disagree when you compile a list like this, but this is terrible...

Livinginthe past
05-23-2007, 03:43 PM
This is really bad...

You are always going to have people disagree when you compile a list like this, but this is terrible...

I thought the team-by-team breakdown was reasonable enough - I kinda ignored the 1-50 rankings.

Counselor
05-23-2007, 04:58 PM
For such a "thoroughly compiled" list, it seems pretty subjective to me. #1 through #3 I completely agree with, then after that it seems pretty arbitrary. Carson Palmer at #4? 'Tis to laugh. Winslow making it onto the list at all while Alge Crumpler, Heath Miller AND Ben Watson were left off it entirely? Again, 'tis to laugh. I gotta give them props for at least not putting Vick on it.

Palmer at 4---he's not even the 4th best quarterback---certainly shouldn't be ahead of Drew Brees.

This can't make Alan Faneca happy---obviously he's not one of the top two guards in the league:dang:

Have I mentioned I have a love/hate relationship with these lists? I love to look at them, but I always hate the results.

RoethlisBURGHer
05-23-2007, 05:15 PM
The fact that KW2 is even on the list makes it laughable at best.

faneca05
05-23-2007, 05:32 PM
no Faneca and no Parker!? there is something very wrong with the guy who wrote this

MasterOfPuppets
05-23-2007, 07:09 PM
javon walker #26 ???? :jerkit:

Crushzilla
05-23-2007, 08:27 PM
javon walker #26 ???? :jerkit:

Maybe three years ago...

Are we sure this isn't an old article?

Crushzilla
05-23-2007, 08:31 PM
Just saw this...

Coming to the defense of Wilky re: PFW's Top 50 NFL players
Anytime you make a list of this nature, rating the top 50 players in the NFL, you’re going to have debate.

No love for my guy.

How could you leave this dude off the list?

Not enough of a certain position. Too much of another.

There is no list that will please everyone, and there are bound to be controversies, but let me tell you I thought that Mike Wilkening — and this was the first time he did the Top 50 for PFW — did a heck of a job. I spent the weekend with him out in L.A. at the NFL's Rookie Premiere, and we talked about some of the feedback this blog got, and let me tell you that Mike put a ton of thought and time into researching this.

He called scouts, GMs, position coaches and other talent evaluators around the league for their input, and he collectively came up with a comprehensive list that has made some fans happy and others … well, like we said, a lot of tough critics out there.


I decided to boil down the comments a little bit and see what common themes there were. Here’s what I came up with:

Jeremy Shockey and Kellen Winslow have no love from the fans. Maybe too many tight ends in general.
Ray Lewis is someone a number of fans liked and thought should still be on the list.
Marcus Stroud was an omission in some people’s minds, and there was a lack of defensive players as well overall. Shaun Rogers was mentioned a bit, too.
Roy Williams and T.O. were the receivers that fans thought should be included.

Now, without speaking to or for Wilky, I should say that I thought he hit it mostly on the button. I, too, would like to see more out of Winslow and Shockey to firm up their places on this list, but in terms of ability, there’s no question that they are both rare athletes who are in the top five at their position. Whether you think tight ends belong on the list in numbers is another debate, but I will say that the position is more valuable than it was a decade ago.

And consider this:

There just aren’t as many great defensive players. Teams are built more on schemes. Name five premier linebackers in the game today. I’ll spot you Brian Urlacher, Shawne Merriman and Julian Peterson. Is Lance Briggs that good? Adalius Thomas — jack-of-all-trades, but master of how many? Al Wilson likely will retire. DeMarcus Ware could be that guy but is not there yet. And you can’t say that Lewis or Zach Thomas is in peak physical condition anymore. They are productive players who have passed their peak.

Three ends are outstanding: Julius Peppers, Jason Taylor and Dwight Freeney, and Freeney had an off year. So did Richard Seymour, who for now is a notch below those guys in terms of playmaking. Ty Warren was outstanding last season, but we need to see more to be sure. Michael Strahan and Osi Umenyiora are coming off injuries. And there aren’t a ton of dominant tackles these days. Kevin Williams, Tommie Harris (he was a Pro Bowler if he didn’t get hurt), Jamal Williams and Casey Hampton top the list, but it drops off from there.

Champ Bailey is the only shutdown corner in the league, period. I love Terence Newman, Nate Clements, Rashean Mathis … but I watched each of those guys get burned last season. On Mike’s original list, I saw that Adrian Wilson (50) was omitted. That was my mistake. Add Ed Reed and Troy Polamalu, and you’ve got your elite DBs. Brian Dawkins turns 34 this year, and though he had a nice season and should be good again, I agree with Mike that he falls just outside the top 50.

Think about it: We’re talking about the 50 best of the best. That’s an average of less than 1.6 players per team. And if we break positions down to QB, running back, wide receiver, tight end, offensive tackle, offensive guard, center, defensive tackle, defensive end, outside linebacker, inside linebacker, cornerback and safety, that’s fewer than four players (3.8) per position that can make the list. QBs and running backs will take up a good portion of the list by nature of the positions, so it’s tough to get the proper love for the guys in the trenches, who not only get overlooked by you and me, but also by league sources.

It’s tough, guys. I wish there was a perfect way to do this, but there just isn’t. The feedback is great; keep it coming. I thought Mike did a terrific job, but as we know, not everyone will be satisfied with such an undertaking.

http://nflblogs.profootballweekly.com/AroundtheNFL/

I'm not entirely sure why I care... :coffee:

He called scouts, GMs, position coaches and other talent evaluators around the league for their input, and he collectively came up with a comprehensive list that has made some fans happy and others … well, like we said, a lot of tough critics out there.

Riiiiiiight...

rich4eagle
05-24-2007, 03:22 PM
All I had to see Soldier Boy on the list and I went no further with it. The left off Willie Parker, Hines Ward but have Soldier Boy. What piece of cow dung this list is.lol

Agree this list is a joke.........high quaility skill players left of the list like the two Steelers mentioned and the a mercy pick like Winslow who has all of three td's in his NFL career.....that is funny.........in addition to way too players at non impact positions

Personally, too many OL guys and non impact position guys were on the list. Also, sorry Hampton is great but if a DL guy is not making lots of tackles and sacks how can he be one of the best fifty in the league. Heck 50 players is about 1 1/2 per team........the list provided says a lot of teams are incapable of winning ............

revefsreleets
05-24-2007, 04:30 PM
I'm not going to win any popularity contests for saying this and I want to make sure people know I don't like this guy and I wouldn't trade him for Heath because of the way they play and class and character issues, but Kellen Winslow Jr caught 89 passes on a horrible Browns team that was last or close to last in passing. I think if he played on a better team he'd have Tony Gonzales type stats.

NV STEELERS 723
05-24-2007, 10:33 PM
Vick was not on the list ! I guess the reporter is a Dog Lover.

ben2hines=6
05-27-2007, 02:41 PM
vick shouldnt be on the list but what about sharper, suggs, faneca, santana moss, roy williams (wr), derrick brooks......they got characters like winslow, lee evans!!??, adrian wilson???....damn this is a little foggy