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pittsburghp8baller
07-10-2007, 10:37 AM
i saw the thread about what if there were no steelers and i thought of this. what if the chargers ended with ben and we got philip rivers do u think we still would of got that ring or would we still be struggling. im happy that we have ben now, but i gotta admit rivers was my favorite quarterback coming out of college that year. i got to go to four of his games, i even got to meet him once. i never really saw ben play until the mac championship either his soph or junior year (pretty sure it was his junior year)

xXTheSteelKingsXx
07-10-2007, 10:50 AM
I definitly think Rivers would have got us our fifth ring if not by now like Ben then we would definitly be contenders. Rivers, in my opinion, is a franchise QB.

fansince'76
07-10-2007, 10:53 AM
I definitly think Rivers would have got us our fifth ring if not by now like Ben then we would definitly be contenders. Rivers, in my opinion, is a franchise QB.

I tend to agree with this. Both Ben and Rivers are far and away better QBs than anybody we've had at the position since Bradshaw. I don't mean to sound like I'm damning either player with faint praise by saying that, because it's really not saying much.

bob means
07-10-2007, 10:56 AM
be glad we got ben.this will be his best year yet.

83-Steelers-43
07-10-2007, 11:01 AM
I'm with TSK on this one, I would be more than happy to have Rivers leading this offense. While it's hard to predict if he would have won us a ring in 05, I do feel he would have eventually brought us our fifth Lombardi Trophy.

Newzfoxjr
07-10-2007, 11:17 AM
Hm...I think the Chargers would've been better off picking Ben, but that's just my opinion. I'm not sure if Rivers would've delivered here, it's always tough to tell with questions like these.

xXTheSteelKingsXx
07-10-2007, 11:19 AM
Lets say the draft plays out the way it did on picks 1-10 except Ben is not in it. So who was the 4th QB taken in that draft and would we have taken him?

Newzfoxjr
07-10-2007, 11:31 AM
Here's the first round...O.o


Sel# Team Player Pos. School
1 San Diego Eli Manning QB Mississippi
2 Oakland Robert Gallery T Iowa
3 Arizona Larry Fitzgerald WR Pittsburgh
4 N.Y. Giants Philip Rivers QB North Carolina State
5 Washington Sean Taylor FS Miami
6 Cleveland Kellen Winslow TE Miami
7 Detroit Roy Williams WR Texas
8 Atlanta DeAngelo Hall CB Virginia Tech
9 Jacksonville Reggie Williams WR Washington
10 Houston Dunta Robinson CB South Carolina
11 Pittsburgh Ben Roethlisberger QB Miami, O.
12 N.Y. Jets Jonathan Vilma MLB Miami
13 Buffalo Lee Evans WR Wisconsin
14 Chicago Tommie Harris DT Oklahoma
15 Tampa Bay Michael Clayton WR Louisiana State
16 Philadelphia Shawn Andrews G Arkansas
17 Denver D.J. Williams OLB Miami
18 New Orleans Will Smith DE Ohio State
19 Miami Vernon Carey T Miami
20 Minnesota Kenechi Udeze DE Southern California
21 New England Vince Wilfork NT Miami
22 Buffalo J.P. Losman QB Tulane
23 Seattle Marcus Tubbs DT Texas
24 St. Louis Steven Jackson RB Oregon State
25 Green Bay Ahmad Carroll CB Arkansas
26 Cincinnati Chris Perry RB Michigan
27 Houston Jason Babin DE Western Michigan
28 Carolina Chris Gamble CB Ohio State
29 Atlanta Michael Jenkins WR Ohio State
30 Detroit Kevin Jones RB Virginia Tech
31 San Francisco Rashaun Woods WR Oklahoma State
32 New England Benjamin Watson TE Georgia

Virginia Steeler
07-10-2007, 11:48 AM
I like Ben -- I am a UVa fan, so being in ACC country I got to see Rivers a lot at NC State - he started all 4 years...

I think the bigger question is - if Tommy Maddox didn't get hurt in week 2 of the 2004 season, when would Ben have become the starter? No way Maddox goes 15-1 in 2004. In that scenario Ben never plays in 2004, can't convince the Bus to stay one more year, maybe the Steelers draft a RB instead of Heath Miller, maybe Ben gets the start in week 8 when the Steelers are 2-5 in 2005 and maybe leads them to 3-5 wins and someone else wins Super Bowl XL. How crazy is that???????????

stillers4ever
07-10-2007, 12:12 PM
i cant see phillip rivers in a steelers jersey. NC State in one of my favorite college teams but im glad we picked Ben. Granted, Rivers would probably have been more consistent, but he hasnt won a superbowl yet, anywhere.

I think Big Ben epitomizes more of a steelers toughness than rivers would anyways.

TackleMeBen
07-10-2007, 12:16 PM
well look at it this way... at least we didnt get stuck with eli...:thumbsup:

xXTheSteelKingsXx
07-10-2007, 01:19 PM
i cant see phillip rivers in a steelers jersey. NC State in one of my favorite college teams but im glad we picked Ben. Granted, Rivers would probably have been more consistent, but he hasnt won a superbowl yet, anywhere.

I think Big Ben epitomizes more of a steelers toughness than rivers would anyways.

Yet being the key word, keep in mind last season was his first full season as a starter and with the talent that he has around him I can see Rivers winning a Super Bowl within the next five years.

19ward86
07-10-2007, 01:40 PM
NO, the steelers in the past have won superbowls with QBs that have strong arms and good mobility, rivers is known to be a pocket QB with a weaker arm strength than most, our offense is completely different than the chargers so i think that rivers might of been a bust on our team.

Indy_Steelers
07-10-2007, 01:41 PM
well look at it this way... at least we didn't get stuck with eli...:thumbsup:

:sofunny::sofunny::sofunny:

Going into the draft I was hoping to get Ben but would have been happy with either.
Looking back, after a hold out by Rivers, I am glad we got Ben.

BTW the Rivers hold out launched Drew Brees into Super Star Status. I feel that if Drew had not of played that season he probably would have wound up a journey man. I was hoping that Drew would have wound up in the Burgh during his draft but I think was better for everybody that he was not.

Preacher
07-10-2007, 01:50 PM
Actually....

I was hoping in that draft that we would have picked DeAngelo Hall... or Dunta Robinson.

Remember that we were coming out of a horrible year, and a horrible few years concerning our DB's.

When they went... I was really saddened... Then we got Ben and I thought... Okay... this will be interesting.

Boy am I glad we picked up Ben...

but could you have imagined DeAngelo on the team right now... with Troy and Smith as Safeties? Stick Ike on the number 2 receiver... Wow. that is a brutal set of DB's.

TackleMeBen
07-10-2007, 01:52 PM
wonder what eli is thinking since he was determined he wasnt going to play for san diego.. maybe he wishes he had gone instead. and i know that the giants maybe had wished they had taken ben instead.

The Duke
07-10-2007, 01:52 PM
I like Ben -- I am a UVa fan, so being in ACC country I got to see Rivers a lot at NC State - he started all 4 years...

I think the bigger question is - if Tommy Maddox didn't get hurt in week 2 of the 2004 season, when would Ben have become the starter? No way Maddox goes 15-1 in 2004. In that scenario Ben never plays in 2004, can't convince the Bus to stay one more year, maybe the Steelers draft a RB instead of Heath Miller, maybe Ben gets the start in week 8 when the Steelers are 2-5 in 2005 and maybe leads them to 3-5 wins and someone else wins Super Bowl XL. How crazy is that???????????

All thanks to Maddox :smile:

OneForTheToe
07-10-2007, 01:54 PM
I like Ben -- I am a UVa fan, so being in ACC country I got to see Rivers a lot at NC State - he started all 4 years...

I think the bigger question is - if Tommy Maddox didn't get hurt in week 2 of the 2004 season, when would Ben have become the starter? No way Maddox goes 15-1 in 2004. In that scenario Ben never plays in 2004, can't convince the Bus to stay one more year, maybe the Steelers draft a RB instead of Heath Miller, maybe Ben gets the start in week 8 when the Steelers are 2-5 in 2005 and maybe leads them to 3-5 wins and someone else wins Super Bowl XL. How crazy is that???????????


That is a good point. Also, wasn't Charlie on IR 2004 seson? If Charlie would have been healthy, he might have gotten the nod instead of Ben. If he plays well, maybe Ben does't star until somewhere in the 2005 or 2006 season. Just proof that you can never really go back and change one event and think that you can predict the overall effect.

onthebus36
07-10-2007, 02:30 PM
wonder what eli is thinking since he was determined he wasnt going to play for san diego.. maybe he wishes he had gone instead. and i know that the giants maybe had wished they had taken ben instead.

Supposedly, Mr. and Mrs. Manning didn't want two sons in the AFC and that was part of the pressure on him going to an NFC team.

TackleMeBen
07-10-2007, 02:33 PM
Supposedly, Mr. and Mrs. Manning didn't want two sons in the AFC and that was part of the pressure on him going to an NFC team.

well i didnt know that they got to pick on what team they wanted their son play on.... i thought you were suppost to go where you were drafted. :flap:. just another reason for me to dislike all mannings that play football :thumbsup:

steelpinstripe72
07-10-2007, 02:41 PM
Man, every time this subject comes up, all I have to say is this: Thank you, Cleveland (and everyone else) for being so stupid.

Galax Steeler
07-11-2007, 05:12 AM
yea i am glad we didn't get crybaby eli.

IamTheSteelGod
07-11-2007, 10:13 AM
Despite how he has played in some playoff games and the Superbowl he marched us up to the Superbowl. I think he was the perfect choice for us, and will be a future Hall of famer. I don't think there is as much pressure on him this season as we have a new coach and praticaly a new team. Plus he wants tabloid payback, I really like Big Ben and I know he will silence alot of critics this year.

moedap
07-11-2007, 11:55 AM
I think the both of them are very similar in attributes and talents. However, if we had gotten Rivers instead of Big Ben I dont think we would have won our 5th as fast as we did. The motivating factor for Big Ben was his being picked 11th instead of in the top 10. Had we gotten Rivers(we would have had to trade up) he may not have been as motivated as Big Ben since he was already being touted as potential #1. He would have had more expectations on his shoulders than Big Ben which may have worked against him especially in Pittsburgh(football is different in the Pittsburgh than in San Diego).

TackleMeBen
07-11-2007, 12:31 PM
I think the both of them are very similar in attributes and talents. However, if we had gotten Rivers instead of Big Ben I dont think we would have won our 5th as fast as we did. The motivating factor for Big Ben was his being picked 11th instead of in the top 10. Had we gotten Rivers(we would have had to trade up) he may not have been as motivated as Big Ben since he was already being touted as potential #1. He would have had more expectations on his shoulders than Big Ben which may have worked against him especially in Pittsburgh(football is different in the Pittsburgh than in San Diego).

very good point there :thumbsup:

The Duke
07-11-2007, 12:42 PM
Imagine if we would've gotten JP Losman :flap:

83-Steelers-43
07-11-2007, 01:41 PM
I don't think there is as much pressure on him this season as we have a new coach and praticaly a new team.

Coming off a horribly played season.

Proving he's worth that big contract the Steelers will probably give him.

Proving he's over the accident/concussions. Side effects.

Having to prove critics wrong.

There better be pressure. Maybe it will do him some good. IMO, I think after winning XL he rested on his laurels while making some idiotic personal decisions. IMO, he will play better this season than last season (not sure how much that's saying) and I feel it will be because Tomlin won't put up with his **** (or feel the need to pamper) and because the kid has to prove he's worth that big payday. I'm sure the money will help push him.

Just my unpopular opinion....lol.

SteelerWatch
07-11-2007, 01:58 PM
Funny that I saw this thread today. I just started posting my top 10 current Steelers over at my site and I did Ben at #9 just this morning. I think he'll probably have a fantastic year, but has a long way to go to prove me wrong about that #9 ranking. I think he's a perfect fit for the team, though, much more so than Rivers. Remember that scouts said en would take several years to develop, but that he had the "biggest upside" of the three QBs who went in Round 1. All he did in season 2was win the Super Bowl. Sure, he didn't have a good game, but he had a phenomenal stretch run through four regular season games and three playoff games just to get there. It doesn't bother me that he had a bad game but still won, because he nearly single-handedly dismantled seven straight teams to get there. Look at how he took control in the second half of the wild-card playoff against Cincy, or how he played a nearly flawless game against the heavily favored Colts in the Divisional Round.

Don't forget, last year wasn't primarily a result of his injuries. It was a combination of a line that couldn't block for crap, and him being a little skittish in the pocket because he knew he couldn't depend on his line for protection. After a near-death experience and then a concussion, *anyone* would be hesitant to take a lot of hard hits, and it didn't help that his front five couldn't stop a middle-aged tortoise coming around the right end.

83-Steelers-43
07-11-2007, 02:00 PM
It was a combination of a line that couldn't block for crap, and him being a little skittish in the pocket because he knew he couldn't depend on his line for protection.

While I agree it was a combination of things, can you also include questionable decision making on his part or does this kid take absolutely no blame? Just wondering.

You also forgot the new and ever popular explanation of Ben's showing last season, Whisenhunt and Cowher were holding him back....lol.

TackleMeBen
07-11-2007, 02:06 PM
While I agree it was a combination of things, can you also include questionable decision making on his part or does this kid take absolutely no blame? Just wondering.

You also forgot the ever popular, Whisenhunt and Cowher were holding him back....lol.

there is enough blame to go around. the coaching staff, o-line, and himself. there were times i was like what the heck are you looking at out there.. there wasnt one of our players there and you throw the ball.... what ???? needless to say that i think i wore out the aspirin companies last season..lol..

steelpride12
07-11-2007, 02:10 PM
be proud of Ben and be happy with him! thats who u have.

HometownGal
07-11-2007, 02:20 PM
there is enough blame to go around. the coaching staff, o-line, and himself. there were times i was like what the heck are you looking at out there.. there wasnt one of our players there and you throw the ball.... what ???? needless to say that i think i wore out the aspirin companies last season..lol..

Ever hear of a timing pattern?

While Ben was notably off of his game last season, I put that season in the dumpster and am focusing on the coming season. New coach, new OC, new QB coach - and hopefully a new attitude and a strong will to be the best.

83-Steelers-43
07-11-2007, 02:29 PM
Imagine if we would've gotten JP Losman :flap:

http://www.afrocubaweb.com/renepena/images/gunmouth.jpg

While I'm waiting to see how Ben responds after last season before I praise him to no end and tag him as a future HOF'er (if that's permitted), Losman would have been a nightmare IMO.

TackleMeBen
07-11-2007, 02:39 PM
http://www.afrocubaweb.com/renepena/images/gunmouth.jpg

While I'm waiting to see how Ben responds after last season before I praise him to no end and tag him as a future HOF'er (if that's permitted), Losman would have been a nightmare IMO.

this might be how the giants fan are this season if eli doesnt play well.