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View Full Version : Batch looks a lot better than BEN


jsteelers51191
08-26-2007, 10:24 PM
I am not just saying this based on the eagles game, i am basing this on the last 2.5 seasons. He gets into his drops a lot faster than Ben and is much more decisive in his decisions. when he hits his plant foot after his final step, he thorws without hesitation where Ben double clutches and looks unsure. I really don't like ben lack of quickness in regard to him getting into his 3 and 5 step drops. from what i have seen, he is one of the slowest quarterbacks when it comes to backpeadling into a quarterback's dropback. Just an opinion. what do others think.

FastWillieParker39
08-26-2007, 10:34 PM
Batch looks good but I'd rather have Ben IMO. Ben is our franchise QB. Plus the reason Batch looks better is because he's going against a 2nd team defense and has been in the league A LOT longer than Ben. I really do like Batch though.

The Duke
08-26-2007, 10:38 PM
Batch is an awesome backup, but even he said it after the dolphins game, Ben is our guy.

24seven
08-26-2007, 10:50 PM
I'm tired of hearing Bens a franchise qb.. what the hell does that even mean anyways.. When you purchase a qb i think in everyones mind is that you would hope he would become a "franchise" qb.. I doubt anyone spends all that money for nothing.. Granted some are destined to be backups but Ben still hasn't in my mind solidified his starting position from what i've seen so far.. I'm actually glad someone else started this topic as I was just coming here to start a similar topic.. I can't believe Al Michaels was saying "wow" to his perfomance like he just did spectacular things.. He was very sloppy and his passes were behind the receiver at least half the times.. Granted he had alot of yards but he passed for almost 25 times.. that's on the way to 50 passes for the game.. Ben should not be given special treatment for the past.. If he can't perform I just hope Mike Tomlin doesn't wait till the seasons over before he yanks him.. Don't get me wrong... I HOPE TO GOD BEN DOES GOOD! I would like nothing more for him to come back from last year and be our savior once again.. But we've all had 3 years to watch Ben play and his inconsistency seems to be the one thing thats consistent.. yah yah.. it's preseason i know.. but as a former athlete you don't go out onto that field thinkin.. oh it's just preaseason.. i'll take it easy.. You KNOW he's goin for the win and throwin for touchdowns everytime he passes.. So preseason is no excuse.. I will give him 3 games before i say i todl you so but I just do not see him being a "franchise" qb such as a favre or montana.. manning... etc.. Please prove me wrong Ben.. I truly hope you do.. But grats to Batch for his performance tonight as well.. He did look sharp and smooth.. and the wife fully agrees as many do i'm sure..

verks36
08-26-2007, 10:56 PM
The pass to Nate was perfect couldnt have been better. Was so close to a touchdown.

We should get out of this that if Ben does get hurt then we know we have a good back up quarter back to keep the Offense going

fansince'76
08-26-2007, 10:59 PM
I thought this crap would at least wait until we lost a regular season game. :banging: Did it ever dawn on anybody saying bench Ben for Batch that Batch was playing against the Eagles' 2nd stringers? Christ.

FastWillieParker39
08-26-2007, 11:02 PM
I thought this crap would at least wait until we lost a regular season game. :banging: Did it ever dawn on anybody saying bench Ben for Batch that Batch was playing against the Eagles' 2nd stringers? Christ.

Agreed.

Jeez Ben had one bad year and Batch is better than him? When Ben is healthy, he leads this team. The team is totally different when he's out there, healthy and playing. We're not expecting him to be a Peyton Manning or a Brett Favre, we're expecting him to just be solid. If he's solid which he was tonight besides the INT, we'll win games.

fansince'76
08-26-2007, 11:03 PM
Agreed.

Jeez Ben had one bad year and Batch is better than him? When Ben is healthy, he leads this team. The team is totally different when he's out there, healthy and playing. We're not expecting him to be a Peyton Manning or a Brett Favre, we're expecting him to just be solid. If he's solid which he was tonight besides the INT, we'll win games.

Brady threw 2 picks in a loss to the Titans. Bench him!

Preacher
08-26-2007, 11:06 PM
Brady threw 2 picks in a loss to the Titans. Bench him!

:sofunny::sofunny:

HometownGal
08-26-2007, 11:18 PM
I really wasn't overly impressed with Charlie until last season, to be quite honest. While I now wholeheartedly agree that he has clearly proven himself as one of the best backups in the league, there is obviously a reason why he wasn't pursued by any other NFL team as a starter after he was released by the Lions. I'd be comfy with him for a few games should Ben go down (God forbid), but beyond that, I'd be a bit nervous.

That being said - when called upon to deliver tonight, he played admirably. :cheers::tt02:

Geez Louise - it's still the preseason and we're already hearing the Bench Ben boo birds? :dang::dang::banging:

fansince'76
08-26-2007, 11:19 PM
Geez Louise - it's still the preseason and we're already hearing the Bench Ben boo birds? :dang::dang::banging:

Have no fear - the "fire Tomlin" crowd is next up. :rolleyes:

Edman
08-26-2007, 11:36 PM
This is just about as bad as the "Charlie Frye/Brady Quinn is/will be better than Ben" crowd in Cleveland. Well, not really. But it's pretty close.

Jeremy
08-26-2007, 11:37 PM
25-42 and 421 yards

Black@Gold Forever32
08-26-2007, 11:39 PM
Ok I think Ben has the potential to be great and want him to start no doubt...But there is some good points being made here...If Ben would work on the small things like his footwork and just getting rid of the ball more quickly it would improve his game so much and then he could become the great QB we all know he can be.....Tonight Ben was alright...But he needs to take a shorter drop back at times and needs to hit Hines Ward for that TD that he missed tonight in the endzone...That should have been six if he hadn't threw it behind Hines...

fansince'76
08-26-2007, 11:43 PM
If Ben would work on the small things like his footwork and just getting rid of the ball more quickly it would improve his game so much and then he could become the great QB we all know he can be.....Tonight Ben was alright...But he needs to take a shorter drop back at times and needs to hit Hines Ward for that TD that he missed tonight in the endzone...That should have been six if he hadn't threw it behind Hines...

Maybe so, but by the same token, I saw Ben buy himself more time on a number of plays by moving around in the pocket where Batch would have gotten creamed for a sack. Ben blew a couple of throws, but he kept a LOT more plays alive that wouldn't have been kept alive by Batch.

Indy_Steelers
08-26-2007, 11:47 PM
Ben double clutches and looks unsure.

It is called a pump fake.:dang:

OneForTheToe
08-26-2007, 11:52 PM
Maybe so, but by the same token, I saw Ben buy himself more time on a number of plays by moving around in the pocket where Batch would have gotten creamed for a sack. Ben blew a couple of throws, but he kept a LOT more plays alive that wouldn't have been kept alive by Batch.


Exactly, that is the part people tend to miss. Ben may always make more mistakes than Charlie Batch because Ben's capabilities allow him to try and do more. Therefore, Ben doesn't always play within himself. Still, as much as I like Charlie I don't see him taking over for an entire season.

Black@Gold Forever32
08-26-2007, 11:54 PM
Maybe so, but by the same token, I saw Ben buy himself more time on a number of plays by moving around in the pocket where Batch would have gotten creamed for a sack. Ben blew a couple of throws, but he kept a LOT more plays alive that wouldn't have been kept alive by Batch.

I'm not saying start Batch....All I'm saying it still seems Ben hasn't improved in some of the basic fundamentals.......I want him to reach his full potential and he just seems to get by on his talent...I'm not saying thats the case for sure...But when I see the same mistakes time and time again....It makes you wonder....lol

If the Oline is going to continue to suck like they did tonight which your right Ben did buy himself some extra time at times then he needs to work on taking shorter drop backs and to get rid of the ball quicker.....

I'm a huge Ben fan...Been following him since he played at Miami of Ohio.....But I just want to see him become the great QB I know he can be.....

nicesteel4life
08-26-2007, 11:55 PM
TOTALLY! Listen all, Batch is a great BACK-UP QB, He wouldn't be able to handle the weekly pounding of being the starting QB. He for one doesn't have the size or speed to get out of situations that Ben excels in. I truly believe Batch is the BEST DARN BACK-UP in the league, yes there is a few teams out there that would start him. But he aint no spring chicken. We all just need to be happy that in the case either Ben goes down by injury or isn't performing the way he should in a game that #16 can come in and handle it! Get off the throw Ben to the Bench comments and be glad that we have this situation instead of what other teams are going through. Ben is, and will be the Starter, Batch loves being the Back-up or he wouldn't of re-signed. COMON!

fansince'76
08-27-2007, 12:00 AM
If the Oline is going to continue to suck like they did tonight which your right Ben did buy himself some extra time at times then he needs to work on taking shorter drop backs and to get rid of the ball quicker.....

Big if - IMO, the pass blocking still sucks. It's hard to complete throws at a 70% clip when there is a defender constantly coming in unblocked and getting in your grill, regardless of how short the QB's drop back is. We need to go OL in rounds 1-3 next draft. This group ain't getting it.

Black@Gold Forever32
08-27-2007, 12:04 AM
I guess some of us Steelers fans can't question Ben's game and just want him to become great instead of just good?.....Ben wasn't even good tonight he was average....13/25 is nothing to scream about and Ben really should have had 2-3 picks instead of just the one....Plus missed Hines for a TD....

I don't want Ben to be benched....I just think he should have looked more crisp tonight since this was the final tune up before the regular season.....

For the record I don't think Batch is a fulltime starter in the NFL...There is a reason why he is a backup...lol I just want Ben to take his game to the next level....Thats all people....lol

SteelShooter
08-27-2007, 12:07 AM
Batch looks good but I'd rather have Ben IMO. Ben is our franchise QB. Plus the reason Batch looks better is because he's going against a 2nd team defense and has been in the league A LOT longer than Ben. I really do like Batch though.

:iagree:

tony hipchest
08-27-2007, 12:07 AM
Ok I think Ben has the potential to be great and want him to start no doubt...But there is some good points being made here...If Ben would work on the small things like his footwork and just getting rid of the ball more quickly it would improve his game so much and then he could become the great QB we all know he can be.....Tonight Ben was alright...But he needs to take a shorter drop back at times and needs to hit Hines Ward for that TD that he missed tonight in the endzone...That should have been six if he hadn't threw it behind Hines...

we have 2 quality qb's. its a good problem to have. the back up is always the favorite and steelerfans have boo'ed a qb who has won as many sb's as any other qb in history.


ben has always been taught to look for the deep ball 1st and then check it down. if the steelers would call more 3 step drop plays, im sure ben would throw them.
there were plenty of designed screen plays, and they were executed pretty good. i'll take that as a positive.

ben needs to quit saying what a great line he has. quit protecting the guys whe are paid to protect him. take the sack (even if that means being sacked 60 times). quit throwing interceptions.

the offensive coaches need to work on a more conventional pass offense that isnt all about play action, the deep ball, and screen plays to the rb.

a designed 3 step drop to the #2 or #3 wr for 7 yds isnt gonna kill anybody.

fansince'76
08-27-2007, 12:08 AM
I guess some of us Steelers fans can't question Ben's game and just want him to become great instead of just good?.....Ben wasn't even good tonight he was average....13/25 is nothing to scream about and Ben really should have had 2-3 picks instead of just the one....Plus missed Hines for a TD....

Yes, and he was running for his life the entire time he was out there. That is my point. I watched the Pats game the other night and Brady had all day to throw. I want to see Ben get that kind of time. He's not getting it.

Atlanta Dan
08-27-2007, 12:14 AM
I'm not saying start Batch....All I'm saying it still seems Ben hasn't improved in some of the basic fundamentals.......I want him to reach his full potential and he just seems to get by on his talent...I'm not saying thats the case for sure...But when I see the same mistakes time and time again....It makes you wonder....lol

If the Oline is going to continue to suck like they did tonight which your right Ben did buy himself some extra time at times then he needs to work on taking shorter drop backs and to get rid of the ball quicker.....

I'm a huge Ben fan...Been following him since he played at Miami of Ohio.....But I just want to see him become the great QB I know he can be.....

Agreed on the fundamentals - Preacher was observing how Ben kept delivering the ball to the wrong shoulder behind the receiver tonight. - that seems to be a mechanical flaw. In addition, the INT on the first possession tonight was a rookie mistake. For all the happy talk about the "new Ben" it looked like November-December 2006 (not January 2006) Ben to me - flashes of talent mixed with mediocrity.

But if the goal is to improve and win it all, the only way that happens is for an improved Ben to carry the load. Batch is the best backup in the league, but his performance as a Lions starter indicates he is not Steve Young forced to sit on the bench behind Montana.

Batch is a journeyman QB - the 1976 Steelers could win consistently with a backup caretaker at QB but the 2007 Steelers do not have that luxury. The Steelers go as far as Ben takes them this year.

Black@Gold Forever32
08-27-2007, 12:26 AM
Its funny the INT Ben threw really doesn't bug me as much as the missed TD tonight to Hines...QBs are going to throw INTs......But when you get close to the endzone you must make that throw...Yes the Steelers still got 3 out of it....But you must score TDs when you get in the red zone....

I know I'm probably being to hard on Ben.....But I'm usually hard on the players I expect the most from....

As for the Steelers calling more 3-5 drop backs for Ben...With Ben facing this much pressure you would think Ariens would call those shorter drop backs for Ben....Plus with the shorter drop back run a quick slants to Holmes/Ward to beat the blitz....Or even Heath.....

tony hipchest
08-27-2007, 12:42 AM
steelers beat the eagles and ben proved he could beat them while throwing the ball.

the steelers can win by 10, 20, or 3. (i dont care)

i'll leave the style points for carson palmer in the pro bowl.

oh, and willie parker sucks :rolleyes:

ChronoCross
08-27-2007, 12:58 AM
Batch is no full time starter... He is a great backup... He can cover a few games but he is no led the team to the promise land...

Ben is and has done so... So the offense looks a little shaky.. Name one starting offense out there in pre season that has taken it home every pre season game and just looked awsome every down...

So we have a new fan it seems that started this thread that must be a new fan... Welcome to the board...

steel#1
08-27-2007, 01:01 AM
People chill, it's the preseason and now is the time to work out the kinks. We're not even seeing
the offense, it's just vanilla. They have other plays that will be called at goal-line situations than
what we have seen. Personally I'm more concerned with Parker than I am with anyone else.
Sorry people but he is inconsistant, 200 yards against bad teams vs. 25-50 against good ones.
Or else he has 1 run for 30 yds. and 10 runs for 2 yds. I'd rather have a runner that could
consistantly get 3 or 4 yds. Hope they find a solution and hold on to the dang ball. Go Steelers!

tony hipchest
08-27-2007, 01:05 AM
bubby brister an charlie batch both have a super bowl ring. they both did their jobs when their numbers were called.

im not saying they are doug williams or jeff hostettler, but they did their jobs and got their rings nevertheless.

Preacher
08-27-2007, 01:34 AM
My assessment of Ben:

AD was right... I noticed he was throwing the ball to the back shoulder... almost as if he wasn't quite in time with the WR's. I was wondering why that would be, as they were in camp for a month. Ben scrambled, and hit a couple passes beautifully... as I was thinking about it, I may have come up with an answer.

The game speed dramatically increased this game from last game. You just cannot replicate game speed in practice. It took Ben a quarter to adjust to the speed. When you look at his second quarter, it was much better.

When Ben had to move from the pocket, he had to move at game speed, or get tackled, which speed up his throwing and decision making process. Basically, he starting clicking into gamespeed.

Remember, this is the first time with his actual line. Let him play a quarter next week and then get ready for the reg. season. There will be a few issues, but I think looking back over the year, he will be a VERY solid QB. Top Tier? probably not. Hey isn't a Manning or a Brady. However, overall, he will be an excellent player, and continue to take us a LONG way... hopefully a few more SB's as well!

Galax Steeler
08-27-2007, 04:52 AM
Ben will be fine he had some good numbers.It seemed like the offensive line is starting to come together giving ben some time to throw.

X-Terminator
08-27-2007, 09:00 AM
Its funny the INT Ben threw really doesn't bug me as much as the missed TD tonight to Hines...QBs are going to throw INTs......But when you get close to the endzone you must make that throw...Yes the Steelers still got 3 out of it....But you must score TDs when you get in the red zone....

I know I'm probably being to hard on Ben.....But I'm usually hard on the players I expect the most from....

As for the Steelers calling more 3-5 drop backs for Ben...With Ben facing this much pressure you would think Ariens would call those shorter drop backs for Ben....Plus with the shorter drop back run a quick slants to Holmes/Ward to beat the blitz....Or even Heath.....

Fairly criticizing his performance isn't being too hard on him. Calling for him to be benched in PRESEASON after an inconsistent performance is being too hard on him. Personally, I didn't think he was sharp at all last night - too many easy throws missed. The pass to Ward was the one that stuck in my craw the most as well - that should have been an easy TD. I still have all the confidence in the world in Ben and think he will have a solid season, but you're just not being honest if you can't see that there are still things he needs to work on.

Jman
08-27-2007, 09:10 AM
Let him play a quarter next week and then get ready for the reg. season. There will be a few issues, but I think looking back over the year, he will be a VERY solid QB. Top Tier? probably not. Hey isn't a Manning or a Brady. However, overall, he will be an excellent player, and continue to take us a LONG way... hopefully a few more SB's as well!

This is a really good assessment. Ben knows how to buy time and can take a hit. He's no Manning with the accuracy (that's Peyton, mind you), and no Brady (that the shotgun works almost every time), but he does do good at QB. I think the best thing is, when he's in the zone, he plays smart.

Ohio Steeler
08-27-2007, 09:12 AM
I am not just saying this based on the eagles game, i am basing this on the last 2.5 seasons. He gets into his drops a lot faster than Ben and is much more decisive in his decisions. when he hits his plant foot after his final step, he thorws without hesitation where Ben double clutches and looks unsure. I really don't like ben lack of quickness in regard to him getting into his 3 and 5 step drops. from what i have seen, he is one of the slowest quarterbacks when it comes to backpeadling into a quarterback's dropback. Just an opinion. what do others think.


it is only preseason and yes Batch looks good but Big Ben is and will always be our QB

steelers78
08-27-2007, 09:52 AM
This is funny

83-Steelers-43
08-27-2007, 10:28 AM
IMO, Charlie has looked better than Roethlisberger over the last four games. At the same time, it's irrelevant. Roethlisberger is our starter. End of story.

Ohio Steeler
08-27-2007, 10:29 AM
I vote this thread for best thread of the year :toofunny:

Mosca
08-27-2007, 10:34 AM
We aren't running the regular season offense, we aren't calling the same plays we will use in the same situations once the season starts. BR is still getting into the flow of calling the blocking assignments. CB most likely isn't doing that.

There is so much more going on that isn't apparent to us, at the other end of a TV camera and a million miles away from the team mentally. For all we know, half the plays might have been, "Lets try this wrinkle and see what happens." Followed by, "OK, now we know to not try that when the season starts."

And that's the point; it is pre-season and doesn't count for anything. That interception? Counts for nothing. Parker's touchdown? 0 points. The win? It means that we start the season 0-0, like every other team.

Call me when the shooting starts.


Tom

Edman
08-27-2007, 10:34 AM
Nobody said Ben was going to be perfect the rest of the way. That's why he has Ken Anderson to coach him. Ben missed some easy throws, he wasn't perfect, but I give him a solid B. I'll wait until the regular season to place judgment.

Ben will never be a Peyton Manning-type in terms of passing ability, which is not a bad thing. Manning is a once-in-a-generation rarety in QB proficiency and accuracy. And unlike some, I don't expect him to be.

It was always said, "The most popular QB in Pittsburgh is the backup." Unless your name is Maddox.

CantStop85
08-27-2007, 10:55 AM
The backup QB is always the most popular guy in town...until he actually has to start.

BlastFurnace
08-27-2007, 11:20 AM
I honestly can't believe that someone is writing this. Other than one throw last night, Ben looks great. Ben is the key to our season, not Batch.

Ohio Steeler
08-27-2007, 11:43 AM
We aren't running the regular season offense, we aren't calling the same plays we will use in the same situations once the season starts. BR is still getting into the flow of calling the blocking assignments. CB most likely isn't doing that.

There is so much more going on that isn't apparent to us, at the other end of a TV camera and a million miles away from the team mentally. For all we know, half the plays might have been, "Lets try this wrinkle and see what happens." Followed by, "OK, now we know to not try that when the season starts."

And that's the point; it is pre-season and doesn't count for anything. That interception? Counts for nothing. Parker's touchdown? 0 points. The win? It means that we start the season 0-0, like every other team.

Call me when the shooting starts.


Tom

wait WTF is that about oh wait my bad I forgot it is only preseason :dang:

Buzz05
08-27-2007, 11:54 AM
The backup QB is always the most popular guy in town...until he actually has to start.

Oddly enough your right.

Stlrs4Life
08-27-2007, 11:55 AM
TOTALLY! Listen all, Batch is a great BACK-UP QB, He wouldn't be able to handle the weekly pounding of being the starting QB. He for one doesn't have the size or speed to get out of situations that Ben excels in. I truly believe Batch is the BEST DARN BACK-UP in the league, yes there is a few teams out there that would start him. But he aint no spring chicken. We all just need to be happy that in the case either Ben goes down by injury or isn't performing the way he should in a game that #16 can come in and handle it! Get off the throw Ben to the Bench comments and be glad that we have this situation instead of what other teams are going through. Ben is, and will be the Starter, Batch loves being the Back-up or he wouldn't of re-signed. COMON!



Exactly.

onthebus36
08-27-2007, 12:04 PM
And as someone else said, the "double clutch" is called a pump fake. Nobody complained about Ben "double clutching" when we made Champ Bailey bite inside and threw a nice TD in the AFC Championship game in '05.

Charlie Batch is an excellent backup and there are probably a few times he could start for. (Atlanta springs instantly to mind) However, he is a backup.

I think all that needs to be said on this point has been said. Not much debate on this one...

FastWillieParker39
08-27-2007, 05:35 PM
What Steeler fans have to realize is that Ben is not going to be a Pro Bowl QB every year. He won't put up numbers that Manning and Brady do. He'll be a solid QB.

Ben will be a QB who just wins games for us. He's pretty good in the clutch and a good QB to have. Sure there will be a few years that Ben will make the Pro Bowl, no doubt about that but he won't be a top 5 or top 3 QB. We don't need him to be that type of QB to win because we always have the defense and Ben just needs to perform solid. We should be happy that we have Ben, some teams have QB controverisies (Chiefs, Raiders, Browns, etc). We could be stuck with a Joey Harrington, or a Matt Schaub instead we have a guy WHO CAN WIN AND HAS PROVED IT BEFORE.

The Duke
08-27-2007, 05:40 PM
What Steeler fans have to realize is that Ben is not going to be a Pro Bowl QB every year. He won't put up numbers that Manning and Brady do. He'll be a solid QB.

Ben will be a QB who just wins games for us. He's pretty good in the clutch and a good QB to have. Sure there will be a few years that Ben will make the Pro Bowl, no doubt about that but he won't be a top 5 or top 3 QB. We don't need him to be that type of QB to win because we always have the defense and Ben just needs to perform solid. We should be happy that we have Ben, some teams have QB controverisies (Chiefs, Raiders, Browns, etc). We could be stuck with a Joey Harrington, or a Matt Schaub instead we have a guy WHO CAN WIN AND HAS PROVED IT BEFORE.

Exactly, that's why Ben just needs to play smart and not throw the kind of interceptions he threw last night. The o line won't be perfect all the time so he has to find his rhythm

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
08-27-2007, 07:20 PM
Remember that Batch it playing agains the second and thrid string defense

Big7BenHOF
08-27-2007, 11:31 PM
Brady threw 2 picks in a loss to the Titans. Bench him!

Doesn't matter, Cassel is better.

Livinginthe past
08-28-2007, 02:16 AM
What Steeler fans have to realize is that Ben is not going to be a Pro Bowl QB every year. He won't put up numbers that Manning and Brady do. He'll be a solid QB.

Ben will be a QB who just wins games for us. He's pretty good in the clutch and a good QB to have. Sure there will be a few years that Ben will make the Pro Bowl, no doubt about that but he won't be a top 5 or top 3 QB. We don't need him to be that type of QB to win because we always have the defense and Ben just needs to perform solid. We should be happy that we have Ben, some teams have QB controverisies (Chiefs, Raiders, Browns, etc). We could be stuck with a Joey Harrington, or a Matt Schaub instead we have a guy WHO CAN WIN AND HAS PROVED IT BEFORE.

What happens when you meet a team with a D that is the equal of the Steelers and with an offense that also very capable - lets say San Diego or maybe New England?

Unless Ben can elevate his play to top 5 QB level then the Steelers are going home early from the playoffs more often than not.

I wouldn't think you can always guarantee having a dominant D in the future either, to be honest.

I also expect Ben will expect to get paid like a top 5 QB when the time comes to re-do his contract.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 02:51 AM
Unless Ben can elevate his play to top 5 QB level then the Steelers are going home early from the playoffs more often than not.

So far, Ben is 5-1 in playoff games. I realize that is no guarantee of future success, but you gotta admit, it's not a bad start. His "career game" so far, IMO, was in the '05 AFCCG against Denver. He's shown he can get it done when it counts. Not to the extent Brady has, of course, but I'd put Ben's poise in pressure situations up against a guy like Manning's or Palmer's any day of the week.

Livinginthe past
08-28-2007, 02:59 AM
So far, Ben is 5-1 in playoff games. I realize that is no guarantee of future success, but you gotta admit, it's not a bad start. His "career game" so far, IMO, was in the '05 AFCCG against Denver. He's shown he can get it done when it counts. Not to the extent Brady has, of course, but I'd put Ben's poise in pressure situations up against a guy like Manning's or Palmer's any day of the week.

Im totally with you on Bens credentials.

In fact, I seem to be a little higher on the guy that alot of Steeler fans - after the SB season I stated that I would much rather have Ben leading my team on a crucial end of game drive in the postseason than Manning.

Again, after that SB winning season I would already have had Ben down as a top 5 guy as you generally you need one of those if you are going succeed in the postseason on a regular basis.

I was basically disagreeing with the premise that the Steelers D is going to be dominant enough, consistently enough, to carry an 'above average' QB. (ie one that isn't even top5)

We'll probably only know at the end of this season (whenever that comes for the Steelers) whether Bens upward trajectory has been totally disrupted by last years injury plagued, demoralising effort

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 03:06 AM
I was basically disagreeing with the premise that the Steelers D is going to be dominant enough, consistently enough, to carry an 'above average' QB. (ie one that isn't even top5)

I completely agree with that. Our defense has gone up and down (especially in the secondary) over the last decade or so, and we haven't been anywhere near what I would term as being "dominant" in pass coverage since Woodson and Lake left. Besides, I think we'd have 2 or 3 more Lombardi Trophies in our case if that were so. The '94 and '95 defenses we fielded were, IMO at least, MUCH stronger than the D we fielded in '05, yet we still came up short both those years. The shortcomings in those two years can be directly attributed to the lack of a championship-caliber QB who could step it up when needed.