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View Full Version : Another Game...another Willie Parker Fumble


Providence Steel
08-27-2007, 11:54 PM
And at the goal line! :dang: This guy has fumbled away games in the past and he's doing it again albeit in preseason. I'm stating now that the Steelers will loose games this season...important games, as a result of badly timed Willie Parker fumbles. I don't like the guy as the starting back. Too small and fumbles WAY too much. I have a BAD feeling again about the RB situation this season.

Yeah I know...:blah:

ShutDown24
08-27-2007, 11:58 PM
That was possibly the greatest statment I have ever read on these boards... Especially it being your first post... I am also guessing you wanted him to go instead of Kevan Barlow tonight right? Being elected to the pro bowl in a superior division doesn't mean anything does it?

TommyG
08-28-2007, 12:07 AM
I don't like the guy as the starting back. Too small and fumbles WAY too much. I have a BAD feeling again about the RB situation this season.

Yeah I know...:blah:

You don't find a back with his speed very often. He will be fine when the season starts. I think we should worry about our kick return game more then the RB situation. Parker will be our franchise back for years to come.

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 12:07 AM
Pro bowl doesnt mean a thing if your sitting on the couch at home during the playoffs.

Parker consistently fumbles and the number of yards he picks up doesnt mean much if he fumbles the game away at the 1 yard line.

I had a lot of discussion last year about this matter and I believe there were 3 or 4 games where Parker fumbles LITERALLY cost us a scoring chance and a chance at winning. If only ONE of those games were won, Parker could have played in both the Pro Bowl, along with the rest of the team, and the Playoffs.

This love of Parker has to be tempered by common sense. If you cant hold onto the ball...why should you be handed the responsibility of carrying it in the first place?

nicesteel4life
08-28-2007, 12:08 AM
INSANITY!!!! He came in High, It was a mistake and guess what, it's pre-season! Get them all out of the system now!

Steelersfan4life0655
08-28-2007, 12:12 AM
then who should we pick up in order to fill the so called "void" at running back? come on, the guy has been in the league for three years he is getting better. we finally have that explosion on offense that will put our offense with the tops in the league. arnt you being a little hard on the guy for makeing a pro bowl in his second season even with a bland offensive line from last year.

tony hipchest
08-28-2007, 12:16 AM
Yeah I know...:blah:

+1 :thumbsup:



Pro bowl doesnt mean a thing if your sitting on the couch at home during the playoffs. did willie win a ring and set a SB record for longest run in sb history from his couch? maybe the coaches shouldve called a play fake to willie and utilized 2 of the picks they have used on a tight end instead of running willie into a 3 man pile as faneca stood by and watched.

:jammin:

ShutDown24
08-28-2007, 12:17 AM
This is the type of guy who comes and finds a board to make a rediculous post like this so he doesn't have to take any responsibility or heat for his opinion because he knows he is wrong in the first place.

Guess what, if Ben would'nt have thrown 20+ interceptions the same thing could be said about making the playoffs. If the secondary had less missed interceptions the same could b said. Nice arguement, to bad it's completley over.

SteelCityMan786
08-28-2007, 12:17 AM
When would you rather he be messing up this much

Now or when it counts?

Steelman16
08-28-2007, 12:20 AM
Well, at least it didn't happen in a game that mattered, so maybe he's just getting his 'willies' out so he won't let us down next time.

That said, I think he's an excellent back with exceptional speed. That 18 yard TD run was seriously smooth. If Barlow can pull that off, I'll become a Cowgirls fan. :jawdrop: (JK)

SteelCityMan786
08-28-2007, 12:21 AM
Well, at least it didn't happen in a game that mattered, so maybe he's just getting his 'willies' out so he won't let us down next time.

Seems like some people are cutting him slack.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 12:24 AM
"Providence Steel" - been a while, but aren't you the same "Providence Steel" that used to post on Steelers.com? Seems to me the knock on Willie over there was that "he isn't that good of a RB if you take away all his long runs." :dang: I guess "he fumbles too much" is the new tack?

Preacher
08-28-2007, 12:47 AM
Willie Parker fumbled 5 times last year.

However, he put the ball in the endzone 13 times...

Granted, 5 is high. but 13 touchdowns is very good as well. I doubt every fumble was a blown touchdown.

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 01:10 AM
Sorry...I dont know how to quote on this forum yet but I'd like to respond to a few things....

First Mr. ShutDown24, if I came here to post and leave I wouldn't have responded once and now twice...shows how much your intuition fails you. Furthermore...someones failures, as in Mr. Roethlisberger's, are no justification for poor performance on the part of anyone else. I didn't start the thread talking about Ben's poor performance last year (and it was bad). There are lots of poor performers. This is about Willie...not Ben.

Second. I am one in the same, Fansince76, as the poster on other forums. Last year I talked all about the # of fumbles and long yardage carries Parker provided for the team. I went back to look at the games in which Willie Parker fumbled inside the 15 and I believe the Steelers lost 3 close games when that happened...maybe 4. I cant remember. My mantra this year, unfortunately, is the same, as is Willie Parkers performance based on his game against the Eagles.

The Super Bowl run was great. But enough already...that was THREE seasons ago. (Did we all as Steeler fans get complacent with the laurels of former glory because of the 25 year dry spell?!?) It's a good thing he had that long run because he picked up only 11 more the entire game. That doesn't sound too good to me...you? Maybe with better running we could have won by 2 touchdowns. I'm glad he made the run and even happier no one was at the goal line to hit him...because he might have fumbled a touchdown away.

If you want fast, flashy and fumble-itis...we've got that in Willie Parker. I'd prefer, slow, big, pounding and a guy who isn't so prone to having the ball stripped from his arms and hands. The Steelers didn't control the ball well last year and as we all know, Steelers football centers around running.

Unfortunately, I'll be beating this dead horse all year long because I don't think Willie has changed. If he has, the goal line strip against the Eagles was no indication of great things to come.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 01:18 AM
It's a good thing he had that long run because he picked up only 11 more the entire game. That doesn't sound too good to me...you? Maybe with better running we could have won by 2 touchdowns.

Yep, same old broken record. At least you're consistent.

Preacher
08-28-2007, 01:18 AM
Last year I talked all about the # of fumbles and long yardage carries Parker provided for the team. I went back to look at the games in which Willie Parker fumbled inside the 15 and I believe the Steelers lost 3 close games when that happened...maybe 4.


Willie had 5 fumbles last year. Are you telling me that 60 to 70 percent of those fumbles were inside the 15? that ALL but 1 or two were when we were trying to score? Really?

Preacher
08-28-2007, 01:33 AM
He had 7 fumbles , just got luck enough to only lose 5. I don't think Willie should get cut or anything like that, but I can understand the worries about fumbles. Willie definitely fumbled in piles last year. After 3 years he ought to know not to go into a goal line pile standing straight up. I still believe he has something to prove because in his only full starting seson, he did not preform well with the fumbles. In 2005 we had Jerome to stick his head into the tough holes, without any fumbles during the regular season.

Remember however, last year was teh first time Willie was played in goal line offenses. He will learn. Plus, it seems that Najeh is learning how to run through a tackle or two before he comes down.

tony hipchest
08-28-2007, 01:50 AM
Sorry...I dont know how to quote on this forum yet but I'd like to respond to a few things....

dont worry about it. it took me a while and i still dont even worry about the "multi-quote" function.

First Mr. ShutDown24, if I came here to post and leave I wouldn't have responded once and now twice...shows how much your intuition fails you. Furthermore...someones failures, as in Mr. Roethlisberger's, are no justification for poor performance on the part of anyone else. I didn't start the thread talking about Ben's poor performance last year (and it was bad). There are lots of poor performers. This is about Willie...not Ben.

more viewpoints are welcome her are welcome, even if they arent the concensus.

Second. I am one in the same, Fansince76, as the poster on other forums. Last year I talked all about the # of fumbles and long yardage carries Parker provided for the team. I went back to look at the games in which Willie Parker fumbled inside the 15 and I believe the Steelers lost 3 close games when that happened...maybe 4. I cant remember. My mantra this year, unfortunately, is the same, as is Willie Parkers performance based on his game against the Eagles.

and our PR muffed a punt and QB threw an untimely int. atleast c. gardocki or d. sepulveda still hasnt had a punt blocked.

The Super Bowl run was great. But enough already...that was THREE seasons ago. (Did we all as Steeler fans get complacent with the laurels of former glory because of the 25 year dry spell?!?) It's a good thing he had that long run because he picked up only 11 more the entire game. That doesn't sound too good to me...you? Maybe with better running we could have won by 2 touchdowns. I'm glad he made the run and even happier no one was at the goal line to hit him...because he might have fumbled a touchdown away.

that was 19 months ago. do they award 2 rings for winning by 2 td's? personally i think the giants win by 1 point over the bills is a hell of alot more impressive than the blow outs the 49ers delivered to the chargers or broncos. thats just me though.

If you want fast, flashy and fumble-itis...we've got that in Willie Parker. I'd prefer, slow, big, pounding and a guy who isn't so prone to having the ball stripped from his arms and hands. The Steelers didn't control the ball well last year and as we all know, Steelers football centers around running.slow, big, and not prone to fumbling is what coughed up the ball to the colts on our last sb run. niel odonnel had one of the lowest interception % in history and it didnt help him in the superbowl.

Unfortunately, I'll be beating this dead horse all year long because I don't think Willie has changed. If he has, the goal line strip against the Eagles was no indication of great things to come. that is unfortunate for you. most people simply get over it and move on


the good news is when ladainian tomlinson is a free agent theres a great chance that the steelers will go out and sign him. or perhps they can trade up in the draft for a back like c. benson, r. williams, or c. williams.

monday morning qb'ing is definitely fun though :thumbsup: good thing willies fumble at the goal line didnt cost us the game this time!

im sure next time he fumbles, instead of winning by 2 we coulda won by 3.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 01:53 AM
monday morning qb'ing is definitely fun though :thumbsup: good thing willies fumble at the goal line didnt cost us the game this time!

And of course we must discount his beautiful 18-yard TD run up-the-gut in the same game. And remember kids, again, if it weren't for his long runs, Willie sucks! :chuckle:

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 01:58 AM
Willie had 5 fumbles last year. Are you telling me that 60 to 70 percent of those fumbles were inside the 15? that ALL but 1 or two were when we were trying to score? Really?

Well...that does sound ridiculous but it's been a while. I'm going on memory but here is what I found:

Parker fumbled inside the 5 yard line against the Ravens during the first half of the second meeting. The Steelers could have gone into halftime with the score tied at 14 all. They ended up not scoring again and lost 31-7. That Parker fumble took the wind right out of their sails. Offensive line was terrible too...I know.

While I cant find the recap of the game to back it up, I BELIEVE Willie Parker fumbled last year against the Atlanta Falcons to give them a short field (my mistake here, its been a while) and led to an Atlanta score. This game that was lost in overtime. Fumbling as your going into score or when you are close to your own goal line = similar results. Maybe even worse when you are close to your own goal.

While this has nothing to do with fumbling, his inability to get into the endzone from the 3 yard line against Oakland was critical as well. ANY back in the NFL HAS to be able to punch the ball into the end zone from the 3. I think it's part of the job description.

The Steelers posted 26 yards on 14 carries against the Jags...26 big ol'e yards with Parker as the RB. Again, no fumbles but 26 yards is not even helping the team. They should have just lined up 4 receivers and thrown every down.

IF Parker does his job in any of the above games, the Steelers end the season 9-7 and make the playoffs as a wild card. ..and while you could say the same of Ben, this post is about Willie...not Ben. Ben gets a pass last year for the accident. I'm not the only one stating that he should have been held out until the 4th or 5th week.

I believe Willie Parker fumbled 7 times last year...I could be wrong. He lost 5. Two were very costly and his inability to actually gain yards certainly didnt help in losses. I cant find a lot of detailed info online about last years games. Perhaps there is another example or two I'm not including in the above.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 02:04 AM
The Steelers posted 26 yards on 14 carries against the Jags...26 big ol'e yards with Parker as the RB. Again, no fumbles but 26 yards is not even helping the team. They should have just lined up 4 receivers and thrown every down.

And LT, by far and unquestionably the best RB in the NFL right now, posted 36 yards on 13 carries against us last season and didn't sniff the end zone. My point? It's difficult to run against good run defenses. Hence why they're known as good run defenses.

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 02:12 AM
Quoting Tony Hipchest:

"slow, big, and not prone to fumbling is what coughed up the ball to the colts on our last sb run. niel odonnel had one of the lowest interception % in history and it didnt help him in the superbowl."

That fumble did not lead to a loss. It was untimely and VERY unfortunate considering that Bettis RARELY fumbled the football in ANY situation. Comparing Willie Parkers inability to protect the ball to Bettis' fumble against the Colts is so completely ridiculous and totally unfair to the arguement and to Bettis. Parker is no Bettis.

-end discussion about the quote-

Not only can I not get over Willie Parker's failures as a ball carrier but neither can the Steelers as they sat at home last year during the playoffs. I REALLY hope the coaching staff makes Willie earn his place on the roster this year and has a REAL zero tolerance approach to Fumbles from the RB position.

18 yard runs are great highlight reel material but I'd like to see him hold onto the football too. I'd also trade that single 18 yard run for 4 runs of 4.5 yards...something that Parker cannot do.

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 02:17 AM
And LT, by far and unquestionably the best RB in the NFL right now, posted 36 yards on 13 carries against us last season and didn't sniff the end zone. My point? It's difficult to run against good run defenses. Hence why they're known as good run defenses.

Fair enough but you'll have to come up with other excuses for the three other poor performances that I mentioned to make my point invalid.

I dont think even a moderator (who has probably forgotten more Steeler stats than I'll ever know) can find a way to excuse fumbles from a starting, pro bowl, running back who is in his FOURTH year. Especially fumbles from a guy that is known (across the NFL, the internet and fantasy football players) to have ball control issues.

Preacher
08-28-2007, 02:19 AM
"slow, big, and not prone to fumbling is what coughed up the ball to the colts on our last sb run. niel odonnel had one of the lowest interception % in history and it didnt help him in the superbowl."

That fumble did not lead to a loss. It was untimely and VERY unfortunate considering that Bettis RARELY fumbled the football in ANY situation. Comparing Willie Parkers inability to protect the ball to Bettis' fumble against the Colts is so completely ridiculous and totally unfair to the arguement and to Bettis. Parker is no Bettis.

-end discussion about the quote-

Actually, his fumble almost ended our season. If it wasn't for a lucky save by Ben, we would have been sitting at home for the rest of the post-season.

Last year, Willie was one of the BRIGHT spots on the team. O line, CB's, Etc. etc. yeah.. they were ALL serious problems. Willie is the least of our worries.


OOPS... The rest of his post was supposed to be deleted!!

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 02:34 AM
Agreed, Preacher - I felt Willie was about the only bright spot the team had last year. Another LT comparison: Parker is going into his 4th year. LT had 6 fumbles his 4th year (and was lucky to only have lost 2). And as much as I like Willie, he and LT are light years apart in ability. Admittedly, I'd like to see the ball hit the ground less when he carries it as well, but I think it is also a very correctable problem.

Livinginthe past
08-28-2007, 02:46 AM
So, even though I don't agree at all with the general premise behind the thread i've enjoyed reading your thoughts, Prov!

Willie is still a work in progress, when you consider his lowly beginnings he has taken large steps forward in his development each year - he's basically still learning the game and I think there is plenty more to come (and you know thats no homer opinion)

What is your 'solution' to the Willie Parker fumbling issue in terms of this season - should your worst case scenario play out and Willies fumbles directly lose 2 or 3 early season games?

If Willie gets benched who comes in?

Russell?

There really doesn't appear to be a viable everydown back alternative on the roster at this point.

Steelman16
08-28-2007, 03:16 AM
I've read the whole thread, and at this point I'm not sure I understand where you're trying to go with this Prov. Willie IS our back right now, and until we get another Bus, he'll be that guy. Little fast guys fumble, I think that can be proven through history, but it is also a correctable problem. (i.e Tiki Barber)

I for one am fully behind the guy. So he fumbles in the preseason. Let's see what he does when it all really counts and starters play most of the game.


NC, just read your reply, agreed with you there. And Living, you made a good point on his football experience. If I remember right, he hardly played in college. (or at least part of college)

Galax Steeler
08-28-2007, 04:56 AM
I have to agree with living in the past there is no better option right now.
Willie hasn't played much due to injury let him knock the rust off.

The Duke
08-28-2007, 07:58 AM
I've read the whole thread, and at this point I'm not sure I understand where you're trying to go with this Prov. Willie IS our back right now, and until we get another Bus, he'll be that guy. Little fast guys fumble, I think that can be proven through history, but it is also a correctable problem. (i.e Tiki Barber)

I for one am fully behind the guy. So he fumbles in the preseason. Let's see what he does when it all really counts and starters play most of the game.


NC, just read your reply, agreed with you there. And Living, you made a good point on his football experience. If I remember right, he hardly played in college. (or at least part of college)

There won't be another Bus, now Willie is the steelers future at runningback

HometownGal
08-28-2007, 08:09 AM
I've read the whole thread, and at this point I'm not sure I understand where you're trying to go with this Prov. Willie IS our back right now, and until we get another Bus, he'll be that guy. Little fast guys fumble, I think that can be proven through history, but it is also a correctable problem. (i.e Tiki Barber)

I for one am fully behind the guy. So he fumbles in the preseason. Let's see what he does when it all really counts and starters play most of the game.




Couldn't have said it better myself, Steelman. :thumbsup:

It's the preseason - RELAX.

Buzz05
08-28-2007, 08:21 AM
It's the preseason - RELAX.

Man some people really need to just chill and have a beer...or 12...the games dont count yet...thats what the preseason is for...correcting mistakes. Im not worried about it. Didnt someone by the name of Tiki Barber have a fumbling problem a few years ago too? And if my memory recalls...he got it sqaured away and turned out to be a pretty good back.

X-Terminator
08-28-2007, 10:10 AM
Couldn't have said it better myself, Steelman. :thumbsup:

It's the preseason - RELAX.

You're talking about a Steeler fan..."relax" isn't in their vocabulary :sofunny:

Some people just can't wait until the games actually mean something before they start circling their prey like a pack of wolves.

Steelman16
08-28-2007, 10:41 AM
There won't be another Bus, now Willie is the steelers future at runningback

I was referring to a ways down the road when Willie gets old, (That's kinda scary to think about...)like maybe 4-5 years from now and the Steelers will be looking for his eventual replacement.

I had a quick question, is Willie faster than Reggie Bush?

RoethlisBURGHer
08-28-2007, 11:03 AM
I'll take the good with the bad. And Parker isn't the sole reason that we didn't make the playoffs last year.

If Coclough doesn't muff the punt in the first game against the Bengals, we more than likley win that game and end up in the playoffs with a 9-7 record.

If Ben doesn't throw the picks in Oakland we win that game, go 9-7 and make the playoffs.

If our defense could have stopped Atlanta, we end up 9-7 and go to the playoffs.

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 11:04 AM
So, even though I don't agree at all with the general premise behind the thread i've enjoyed reading your thoughts, Prov!

Willie is still a work in progress, when you consider his lowly beginnings he has taken large steps forward in his development each year - he's basically still learning the game and I think there is plenty more to come (and you know thats no homer opinion)

What is your 'solution' to the Willie Parker fumbling issue in terms of this season - should your worst case scenario play out and Willies fumbles directly lose 2 or 3 early season games?

If Willie gets benched who comes in?

Russell?

There really doesn't appear to be a viable everydown back alternative on the roster at this point.


I'd really like to see a different back be brought in to trade off with Parker. I don't know how that could be done and as far as drafts over the past two years have gone...I think they done very well by taking the best player available to them. I don't recall a great back having been on the board when we were picking. Bolstering the Wide Receivers last year and getting what I believe will be a couple of good LBs this year have been great and will help.

I guess the best I can hope for is that Najeh proves to be a good investment and becomes good enough to take the heavy load off Parker. Would be nice to have that Goal Line guy that could be counted on to hold onto the ball and punch it in in those situations.

All one can do is sit back and watch the season unfold. I hope Parker turns the corner this year. I wish him and the Steelers the best but I'm not overly optimistic.

DACEB
08-28-2007, 12:14 PM
I've read the whole thread, and at this point I'm not sure I understand where you're trying to go with this Prov. Willie IS our back right now, and until we get another Bus, he'll be that guy. Little fast guys fumble, I think that can be proven through history, but it is also a correctable problem. (i.e Tiki Barber)

Prov. is absolutely correct in stating the FACT that the fumbles are a problem, I don't understand how anyone can deny that. To those that don't think it's a problem I would ask, how many fumbles a season is acceptable?? Let's ask coach Tomlin,

"You don't like fumbles," Tomlin said. "You don't like fumbles in the red zone, but he is a competitor. I understand that it happens, but we are not going to accept it. We are going to try to be perfect in this area. We have to be."

There you have it, fumbling is in fact unacceptable. Now don't get me wrong, I too believe FWP has tremendous upside and as some have stated is still a little green with limited experience. FWP is indeed an important part of our bright future but the fumbles are a problem and need to be addressed.

As Steelman stated this is a problem that can be corrected (i.e. Barber). FWP only needs to watch tape of Bettis, because the Bus always carried the rock correctly, up tight in your armpit. Yet even Bettis fumbled as we know!!

83-Steelers-43
08-28-2007, 01:40 PM
Timmons is a bust.

Holmes was the main reason why we had a horrible season last year.

Batch should start over Ben.

Parker is going to cost us games because he fumbled twice in preseason after sitting out a good chunk of TC.

Good stuff......good stuff. I believe I've seen it all and it's not even November. It's the Pittsburgh sports media's fault!!!

augustashark
08-28-2007, 02:27 PM
I'll take the good with the bad. And Parker isn't the sole reason that we didn't make the playoffs last year.

If Coclough doesn't muff the punt in the first game against the Bengals, we more than likley win that game and end up in the playoffs with a 9-7 record.

If Ben doesn't throw the picks in Oakland we win that game, go 9-7 and make the playoffs.

If our defense could have stopped Atlanta, we end up 9-7 and go to the playoffs.

Very good post!

You have 22 guys that start every game and to point to a running back (one guy)and say he was the reason we did not make the playoffs is just plain wrong.

A normal game has so many factors on who wins and who looses that you can never point to just on guy or one play. Now I know it's easy to point one play out and say that's why we lost, but anyone who knows the game knows that football is a game of inches and that it will always be that way.

HometownGal
08-28-2007, 02:36 PM
Prov. is absolutely correct in stating the FACT that the fumbles are a problem, I don't understand how anyone can deny that. To those that don't think it's a problem I would ask, how many fumbles a season is acceptable?? Let's ask coach Tomlin,

"You don't like fumbles," Tomlin said. "You don't like fumbles in the red zone, but he is a competitor. I understand that it happens, but we are not going to accept it. We are going to try to be perfect in this area. We have to be."

There you have it, fumbling is in fact unacceptable. Now don't get me wrong, I too believe FWP has tremendous upside and as some have stated is still a little green with limited experience. FWP is indeed an important part of our bright future but the fumbles are a problem and need to be addressed.

As Steelman stated this is a problem that can be corrected (i.e. Barber). FWP only needs to watch tape of Bettis, because the Bus always carried the rock correctly, up tight in your armpit. Yet even Bettis fumbled as we know!!

Yes- fumbles are unacceptable, but unfortunately, are part of the game. It's not like FWP is the only Steeler who had butter fingers last season and this preseason. Ben lost a fumble in the Packers game several weeks ago - shall we call for his head on a platter too? I have no doubt whatsoever that this is an area Tomlin and the coaches are working diligently on this week in practice. If FWP becomes infected with fumbilitis during the course of the season, then its time to look at other options, but c'mon - after ONE preseason game????

Atlanta Dan
08-28-2007, 02:53 PM
Fumbles are more immoral than dogfighting - unleash Kuhn and cut Willie now!

DACEB
08-28-2007, 03:04 PM
It's all fun and games 'til someone drops the rock when it really counts.

DACEB
08-28-2007, 03:18 PM
Yes- fumbles are unacceptable, but unfortunately, are part of the game. It's not like FWP is the only Steeler who had butter fingers last season and this preseason. Ben lost a fumble in the Packers game several weeks ago - shall we call for his head on a platter too? I have no doubt whatsoever that this is an area Tomlin and the coaches are working diligently on this week in practice. If FWP becomes infected with fumbilitis during the course of the season, then its time to look at other options, but c'mon - after ONE preseason game????

I myself never called for anyones head on a platter, just simply stated that the fumbles are indeed a problem. It doesn't matter if it is pre-season, reg-season, last year, this year. When does fumbling really matter, only in the superbowl?

Seeing as you brought up Bens name. He needs to take better care of the ball as well.

The 1st quarter of the Eagles game looked alot like last season all over again. I'm not bashing anyone but a championship team does not make those types of mistakes.

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that what we all want, A Championship Caliber Team.

TackleMeBen
08-28-2007, 03:31 PM
Yes- fumbles are unacceptable, but unfortunately, are part of the game. It's not like FWP is the only Steeler who had butter fingers last season and this preseason. Ben lost a fumble in the Packers game several weeks ago - shall we call for his head on a platter too? I have no doubt whatsoever that this is an area Tomlin and the coaches are working diligently on this week in practice. If FWP becomes infected with fumbilitis during the course of the season, then its time to look at other options, but c'mon - after ONE preseason game????

i told you that we should have benched ben and played batch..lol.. just kidding... every team fumbles the ball, what matters if you can stop the opponent from capitalizing on your mistake.

Preacher
08-28-2007, 03:35 PM
Timmons is a bust.

Holmes was the main reason why we had a horrible season last year.

Batch should start over Ben.

Parker is going to cost us games because he fumbled twice in preseason after sitting out a good chunk of TC.

Good stuff......good stuff. I believe I've seen it all and it's not even November. It's the Pittsburgh sports media's fault!!!


you forgot two...

1. Tomlin is not screaming on the sidlines... he is a horrible coach... just picked because of the Rooney rule.

2. What? We plan on throwing a ball on any down other then the third? WE WILL FAIL!

The Duke
08-28-2007, 03:45 PM
I was referring to a ways down the road when Willie gets old, (That's kinda scary to think about...)like maybe 4-5 years from now and the Steelers will be looking for his eventual replacement.



It's been said many times, but remember, Willie didn't play college so he isn't as burned out as other backs at his age. That's one reason he wants more and more carries, he knows he can do it and is just hungry after not carrying it in college

HometownGal
08-28-2007, 03:49 PM
I myself never called for anyones head on a platter, just simply stated that the fumbles are indeed a problem. It doesn't matter if it is pre-season, reg-season, last year, this year. When does fumbling really matter, only in the superbowl?

Seeing as you brought up Bens name. He needs to take better care of the ball as well.

The 1st quarter of the Eagles game looked alot like last season all over again. I'm not bashing anyone but a championship team does not make those types of mistakes.

Correct me if I'm wrong but isn't that what we all want, A Championship Caliber Team.

My apologies, DACEB - you didn't actually call for FWP's head on a platter, but you did agree with Prov's position. Guilty by association. :wink02::wink02:

No one likes turnovers, unless you are on the team that benefits from the turnover, but as I said - unfortunately, they are part of the game. I do agree, however, that trying to eliminate or drastically reduce costly turnovers is vital to the overall success of the team in the long run. I refuse to compare any game this season to last year's contests - this is a new season and a new era. The purpose of TC and preseason matchups are for the coaching staff to see what they have to work with, work on eliminating mistakes/problem areas and to ultimately put the best 53 players on the roster. I have faith in our coaching staff and thus, I have faith in those players that make the final cut, FWP being one of them. I'm not going to damn the guy to hell because he fumbled during a meaningless game. If he continues to turn over the ball during the regular season, then I'll want to hunt him down and skin him, but not a moment before. :chuckle:

Preacher
08-28-2007, 03:54 PM
My apologies, DACEB - you didn't actually call for FWP's head on a platter, but you did agree with his position. Guilty by association. :wink02::wink02:

No one likes turnovers, unless you are on the team that benefits from the turnover, but as I said - unfortunately, they are part of the game. I do agree, however, that trying to eliminate or drastically reduce costly turnovers is vital to the overall success of the team in the long run. I refuse to compare any game this season to last year's contests - this is a new season and a new era. The purpose of TC and preseason matchups are for the coaching staff to see what they have to work with, work on eliminating mistakes/problem areas and to ultimately put the best 53 players on the roster. I have faith in our coaching staff and thus, I have faith in those players that make the final cut, FWP being one of them. I'm not going to damn the guy to hell because he fumbled during a meaningless game. If he continues to turn over the ball during the regular season, then I'll want to hunt him down and skin him, but not a moment before. :chuckle:


I gotta disagree with you a little. If a pattern emerges in training camp and the preseason, I will be worried. However, you are right in that we have to be patient, because that is the time that is used to correct those issues, or to remove the player... such as Starks!

And you are wrong on not hunting down the player during preseason. It is best to hunt 'em down early, that way you're ready to go as soon as the mistakes are made! You don't have to waste time trying to find them!

:sofunny::sofunny:

HometownGal
08-28-2007, 04:02 PM
I gotta disagree with you a little. If a pattern emerges in training camp and the preseason, I will be worried.

A pattern is ONE fumble in FOUR preseason games thus far? :dang::dang: This is what I just am not getting here - why crucify the guy after ONE fumble in FOUR meaningless games?

Steel_Bus_24
08-28-2007, 06:31 PM
Yeah lets just be thankful this happened in a game that didn't matter, and hope that this has become a point if not the point of emphasis of developing his game from now on

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
08-28-2007, 06:47 PM
And at the goal line! :dang: This guy has fumbled away games in the past and he's doing it again albeit in preseason. I'm stating now that the Steelers will loose games this season...important games, as a result of badly timed Willie Parker fumbles. I don't like the guy as the starting back. Too small and fumbles WAY too much. I have a BAD feeling again about the RB situation this season.

Yeah I know...:blah:

Ya great post we all agree with you :wink02:

revefsreleets
08-28-2007, 07:50 PM
83 and Preach started this, but I want to chime in. After reading the Steelers threads over the last few days, I've learned that we need to:

Fire Tomlin (He's black and folds his arms on the sideline)
Trade Willie Parker (He sucks!)
Trade Max Starks (Is Barrett Brooks still available?)
Sign Jeremiah Trotter (One man's trash is another mans treasure)
Start Batch over Ben (A Kordell comeback?)
Get new owners who aren't so cheap (Can Mark Cuban buy the Steelers?)

We'll be 3-13 for the next 8 seasons, but it'll be worth it!

HometownGal
08-28-2007, 08:09 PM
83 and Preach started this, but I want to chime in. After reading the Steelers threads over the last few days, I've learned that we need to:

Fire Tomlin (He's black and folds his arms on the sideline)
Trade Willie Parker (He sucks!)
Trade Max Starks (Is Barrett Brooks still available?)
Sign Jeremiah Trotter (One man's trash is another mans treasure)
Start Batch over Ben (A Kordell comeback?)
Get new owners who aren't so cheap (Can Mark Cuban buy the Steelers?)

We'll be 3-13 for the next 8 seasons, but it'll be worth it!

:toofunny::toofunny::toofunny::thumbsup:

83-Steelers-43
08-28-2007, 08:31 PM
83 and Preach started this, but I want to chime in. After reading the Steelers threads over the last few days, I've learned that we need to:

Fire Tomlin (He's black and folds his arms on the sideline)
Trade Willie Parker (He sucks!)
Trade Max Starks (Is Barrett Brooks still available?)
Sign Jeremiah Trotter (One man's trash is another mans treasure)
Start Batch over Ben (A Kordell comeback?)
Get new owners who aren't so cheap (Can Mark Cuban buy the Steelers?)

We'll be 3-13 for the next 8 seasons, but it'll be worth it!

And you worded it and punched the point home much better than I did. I tip my hat to you sir. :wink02:

Dylan
08-28-2007, 09:17 PM
You got to be kidding willie kept us from not having a losing season

Providence Steel
08-28-2007, 10:27 PM
A pattern is ONE fumble in FOUR preseason games thus far? :dang::dang: This is what I just am not getting here - why crucify the guy after ONE fumble in FOUR meaningless games?


We need to remember that Willie fumbled once in TWO preseason games. 50% of the time. He was inactive for the first two...wasnt he? If you go into a season thinking that your starting RB is going to fumble in 40% of your games...that doesnt make one feel too good and that is basically what he did last year.

You can CERTAINLY spread the blame around for last year. Ben gets a pass...he nearly died for Pete's sake. Cowher and the coaching staff should have held him out for a few weeks. Holmes was a rookie and even Ward fumbled against the Chargers near the end zone trying to make a play. The O- Line was terrible...I know.

The focus is on Parker in this thread and I'm not the kind of person to validate or excuse a performance based on what others do. I feel that Parker has got to protect the rock and be more consistent or you end up with an up and down season...just like last year.

If Ben performs badly this year (again)...I'll be the first in line questioning his play. Although he QB'ed for the Super Bowl win he really stunk in that game. I'll call a rat a rat.

I guess Parkers inexperience should be taken into account but then the coaches should look at that as well.

By the way...I have never called for anyones head or suggested the Steelers trade Parker. Please dont blow the post out of proportion to validate your point.

Preacher
08-28-2007, 10:35 PM
HTG...

I was talking in generalities about patterns, not Willie specifically. that is why I mentioned starks... because SPECIFICALLY showed a pattern.

Now let's talk about another pattern.

Tomlin doesn't yell, doesn't spit, doesn't show enough emotion.

FIRE HIM!

Edman
08-28-2007, 11:05 PM
Fumbling is unacceptable, especially on the goal line. But like someone else said, fumbles are correctable.

What is the point of this thread again? Willie fumbled in a preseason game. That sucked. The end.

fansince'76
08-28-2007, 11:13 PM
We need to remember that Willie fumbled once in TWO preseason games. 50% of the time. He was inactive for the first two...wasnt he?

So he had one fumble in the first real semblance of live game action he's seen in over seven months. He also had an 18-yard TD run. It's a wash. If the fumbling continues, then yes, it's definitely a problem.

EDIT: misread boxscore of Wash game - I honestly don't remember Willie playing at all, which shows how inconsequential his extremely limited time in that game was.

tony hipchest
08-28-2007, 11:22 PM
willie had like 4 carries against washington. barely a warm up.

once there is focus on the "3 points of pressure" while carrying the ball, willies fumblitis will be cured. when he carries he tends to just maintain 2 points of pressure by gripping the nose of the ball and having the other end tucked into his forearm and bicep. pull it all into the body and the problem is solved. easilly correctable.

The Duke
08-28-2007, 11:34 PM
I remember Tiki Barber was a fumble machine years ago and some new coach I think helped him get over that. So yes, Willie's "problem' with fumbles may be fixed, he just needs the right teacher. Is Jerome available? :smile:

SteelShooter
08-28-2007, 11:41 PM
@%$*(&^!^$@^%#>+~<*%##!^@%$#*&^ !!!!!!!!!!!

tony hipchest
08-28-2007, 11:53 PM
I remember Tiki Barber was a fumble machine years ago and some new coach I think helped him get over that. So yes, Willie's "problem' with fumbles may be fixed, he just needs the right teacher. Is Jerome available? :smile:well i dont know if teaching willie to be a burritto shy of 3 bills is the answer, but coughlin and his staff emphasised the "3 points of pressure" on the ball to tiki. it is basic fundamentals, and wont take no specialist to teach.

its a matter of emphasis and practice to ingraine it into willies head. he is a speedster, so naturally he uses his arms to help gain momentum. he needs to shake this basic fundamental of sprinting and adopt the basic fundamental of carrying. i noticed this in a few clips of him i saw running in camp.

however this wasnt the problem that caused him to fumble against the eagles. that was simply a case of him thinking his huevos were bigger than the ball he was carrying. while willie 1 on 3 vs 750 lbs of defensive muscle is a valiant effort in a goal line situation, i would prefer him to fall down and take the run for no gain. just like ben sometimes just needs to take the sack.

regardless, i would rather see mistakes caused by going 100%, trying to hard, and giving too much effort as opposed to a lacadasical, half assed, unprepared mistake (faneca?)

Preacher
08-29-2007, 01:58 AM
And giving too much effort as opposed to a lacadasical, half assed, unprepared mistake (faneca?)

Um,

Wouldn't that be mistake (s) ???

DACEB
08-29-2007, 07:35 AM
Fumbling is unacceptable, especially on the goal line. But like someone else said, fumbles are correctable.

That's all I was saying, acknowledge there is a problem and work to correct it.

Now could I please have my head from that platter!!

HometownGal
08-29-2007, 08:14 AM
By the way...I have never called for anyones head or suggested the Steelers trade Parker. Please dont blow the post out of proportion to validate your point.

No, but you got out your crystal ball and have already pointed the finger of blame at FWP for Steelers losses this season, when the regular season hasn't even begun!!!! :jawdrop: See YOUR statement below.

I'm stating now that the Steelers will loose games this season...important games, as a result of badly timed Willie Parker fumbles.

83-Steelers-43
08-29-2007, 08:26 AM
While I doubt there were many Steeler fans cheering when Parker fumbled, it does happen. Am I concerned? Not at all. If it occurs during the regular season, then I will start to worry. But I'm not going to worry when it comes to a back who has had limited playing time and is coming off a training camp in which he was injured for a good amount of time.

The guy is still getting loose and working out the kinks just like everybody else on that roster. He knows he messed up last game and he's determined to work on it in practice. If some want to make the assumption that Willie is going to "cost us games" this year because of his fumbling, that's your opinion. I think it's a little early to make those assumptions after four preseason games.

Mistakes happen. That's why we have preseason and practices. If he's fumbling on a regular basis after 9/9, then get back to me. Speaking of 9/9, it can't come soon enough after reading some of the threads this week.

Steelers Fever should start selling paper bags for inhaling and exhaling purposes with those t-shirts.

Steelerstrength
08-29-2007, 03:31 PM
FWP is our RB! He is absolutely our best option at that position, and one of the best in the league.

I too, was pissed when he fumbled. He came in like no one was going to touch him and got smacked. A professional RB should know better, but he had a lapse in judgement. Our coaching staff is probably all over that situation now. No worries!

It is also very obvious that we have no great options for a short yardage back. When watching other preseason games, it is a specialized position that every team requires. Our staff did not get it done during the off season, and there will be situations where we desparately need it. We now have to find other ways of gaining those last two yards, rather than my personal preference of smashmouth football. And that sucks!

That said, I am very optimistic about this season! I have faith that the staff will find other means to an end, zone that is. I'm still trying to decide which game (s) I will attend! I might go to the Arizona game because it's close to Cali, but will absolutely be going to a home game!

Providence Steel
09-09-2007, 02:13 PM
Ho hum....

Another game...another Parker Fumble....

Transplanted Steeler Fan
09-09-2007, 02:37 PM
and another dropped pass out of the backfield.. willie is killing my fantasy team..

Elvis
09-09-2007, 04:07 PM
I hate to see those fumbles out of anyone... but Willie must fix these problems...
:tt02:

fansince'76
09-09-2007, 04:32 PM
Ho hum....

Another game...another Parker Fumble....

Yep, and another 100+ yard effort. Way to stay positive, there. I guess we should trade for the sure-handed coke dealer Clevelend has? After all, we need another big back. :rolleyes:

revefsreleets
09-09-2007, 04:35 PM
I'm sort of concerned. I'm more concerned about Santonio Holmes, though. He fumbled out in space, and he also dropped a pass that would have been at least a 20 yard gain.

Stlrs4Life
09-09-2007, 05:34 PM
LOL, just coming on here to complain about Willie P. He will be fine. He sure looked good gaining109 yards though.

SteelDogFan
09-09-2007, 05:58 PM
Does anyone remember Tikki Barber who just retired. Thats all I'll say on this. WAIT I hate that he fumbled and caused the Steelers to lose the game. OH!!! Thats right they won. Its they first Sunday we blow team out and the only thing you grab from the game is a fumble. PP man, thats means Post Positive when your team is 1-0. Also, when we lose a game do to Willie fumbling then post it.

fansince'76
09-09-2007, 06:00 PM
LOL, just coming on here to complain about Willie P. He will be fine. He sure looked good gaining109 yards though.

Why not? Prov did the same thing over at Steelers.com 2+ years ago. Only over there, his angle was "Willie isn't such a good back if you take away all his long runs." :dang:

83-Steelers-43
09-09-2007, 06:04 PM
Ho hum....

34-7 Steelers.

We should really think about simply releasing Willie Parker. How about worrying about that o-line? Try it...it might make more sense.

SteelDogFan
09-09-2007, 06:17 PM
A Thought,

Man what a game we blew the Browns out, plus thats one win in the division, man that was a great first win. i do think the Steelers may have a problem with Willie fumbling, I hate when he puts the ball on the ground.

X-Terminator
09-09-2007, 06:18 PM
Now I know I'm going to get lynched for saying this, but Parker's fumbling has to be addressed. Yes, in the grand scheme of things, it didn't hurt us today, but it did cost us at least 3 points. It doesn't mean that I don't think he's a good back and among the elite backs in the league. He is, on both counts, IMO. But if he does want to be the next LT, or even the next Tiki Barber, he cannot put the ball on the ground so much.

fansince'76
09-09-2007, 06:20 PM
A Thought,

Man what a game we blew the Browns out, plus thats one win in the division, man that was a great first win. i do think the Steelers may have a problem with Willie fumbling, I hate when he puts the ball on the ground.

The coke dealer lost one too, the Browns as a team lost four, it rained heavily the night before the game, and it started raining again during the game. Methinks a wet field and wet ball may have played a part, but that's just me.

SteelDogFan
09-09-2007, 06:35 PM
i don't disagree with addressing the fumbling situation. when it bcomes a situation. We have not lost a game due to his fumbling and we won the super bowl due to his running style. This was the first game of the season and a divisional game in which The Steelers won convincingly. The first post I see when I log on is,

ANOTHER GAME, ANOTHER WILLIE FUMBLE.

Granted I did not have to post here, but felt compelled to, Ben tnrew 4 touchdowns and all you can post is that come on its as if we lost the game. Maybe thats a major issue with some, that I understand. But the title of the post just through me off. Its so negative the way it is written.

When I mentioned Tiki Barber I was referring to how fumble prone he was before addressing the issue. You could count on him to fumble at least twice a game. Thats a fumbling issue. Not once every 3 to 4 games.

X-Terminator
09-09-2007, 06:40 PM
i don't disagree with addressing the fumbling situation. when it bcomes a situation. We have not lost a game due to his fumbling and we won the super bowl due to his running style. This was the first game of the season and a divisional game in which The Steelers won convincingly. The first post I see when I log on is,

ANOTHER GAME, ANOTHER WILLIE FUMBLE.

Granted I did not have to post here, but felt compelled to, Ben tnrew 4 touchdowns and all you can post is that come on its as if we lost the game. Maybe thats a major issue with some, that I understand. But the title of the post just through me off. Its so negative the way it is written.

Understood. And the fumbling isn't a major issue with me, like it is with the OP, but it doesn't mean that I don't feel it shouldn't be addressed. I also saw some other things out of the team (the offense in particular) that need some work, but I'll let myself and everyone else savor the victory.

SteelDogFan
09-09-2007, 06:50 PM
COOL.

83-Steelers-43
09-09-2007, 07:17 PM
The coke dealer lost one too, the Browns as a team lost four, it rained heavily the night before the game, and it started raining again during the game. Methinks a wet field and wet ball may have played a part, but that's just me.

Shhh, Parker is the only back in the NFL that fumbles and stop with the excuses. You sound like Marvin Lewis.....:flap::wink02:

tony hipchest
09-09-2007, 07:36 PM
Oh no! We suck again!

http://i132.photobucket.com/albums/q23/shortyshane_2006/Waterboy_2.jpg

im gonna email mike tomlin and suggest that the steelers address fumbling. and watch.... i bet it will be adressed as soon as my email is read.

GBMelBlount
09-09-2007, 08:08 PM
If you watch most great coaches & players in any sport, no matter how great their team is, or they are individually, they always have flaws & they look at "what went wrong" and work on improving it. Thankfully, Tomlin is supposedly such a meticulous coach so I think things like Willies fumbling WILL be addressed. No matter how great you are as an athlete, you always have something to work on. I'll take Willie....problems & all!!!!!

HometownGal
09-09-2007, 08:18 PM
Now I know I'm going to get lynched for saying this, but Parker's fumbling has to be addressed. Yes, in the grand scheme of things, it didn't hurt us today, but it did cost us at least 3 points. It doesn't mean that I don't think he's a good back and among the elite backs in the league. He is, on both counts, IMO. But if he does want to be the next LT, or even the next Tiki Barber, he cannot put the ball on the ground so much.

I say bench him, gosh darn it. :flap:

This is only Week #1, so I'm going to give him a free pass this game. It didn't come back to bite us in the hiney, so I'm not going to dwell on it. If this becomes a habit, then I'll be a little more vocal, but I really believe Tomlin and Kirby Wilson will be addressing this problem in practice this week and every week in the future until the problem is under control. Tiki Barber had a problem in his early years with butterfingers and he worked hard in practice to overcome the fumbilitis. I have no doubt FWP will do the same.

I don't want FWP to be LT or Tiki - I want him to continue to develop his own style and swagger on that field and keep up with the pace he's been on since last season - playing HIS game, minus the fumbles of course. :tt02:

Preacher
09-09-2007, 08:27 PM
Hey...

FWP played a good game. He fumbled. I don't like it. He fumbled in bad weather. Still don't like it, but I will take the 109 yards.

revefsreleets
09-09-2007, 08:32 PM
Jamal Lewis fumbled, too, and he NEVER fumbles.

X-Terminator
09-09-2007, 08:52 PM
I say bench him, gosh darn it. :flap:

This is only Week #1, so I'm going to give him a free pass this game. It didn't come back to bite us in the hiney, so I'm not going to dwell on it. If this becomes a habit, then I'll be a little more vocal, but I really believe Tomlin and Kirby Wilson will be addressing this problem in practice this week and every week in the future until the problem is under control. Tiki Barber had a problem in his early years with butterfingers and he worked hard in practice to overcome the fumbilitis. I have no doubt FWP will do the same.

I don't want FWP to be LT or Tiki - I want him to continue to develop his own style and swagger on that field and keep up with the pace he's been on since last season - playing HIS game, minus the fumbles of course. :tt02:

Don't get me wrong - I'm not saying I want him to be Mr. Perfect or anything. I just would like to see it addressed for his sake more than anything else. I wouldn't want to see his legacy tarnished by being labeled a fumbler. As someone mentioned earlier, I too can live with the occasional fumble so long as he keeps putting up the numbers. I also have all of the confidence in the world that Tomlin and Co. will fix it, because it is a very correctable problem.

Preacher
09-09-2007, 09:04 PM
Don't get me wrong - I'm not saying I want him to be Mr. Perfect or anything. I just would like to see it addressed for his sake more than anything else. I wouldn't want to see his legacy tarnished by being labeled a fumbler. As someone mentioned earlier, I too can live with the occasional fumble so long as he keeps putting up the numbers. I also have all of the confidence in the world that Tomlin and Co. will fix it, because it is a very correctable problem.


Yep. That is the one thing I want to see, a tailing off of these fumbles....

But my goodness... That really isn't a problem if this team keeps playing this way!!

fansince'76
09-09-2007, 09:07 PM
Yep. That is the one thing I want to see, a tailing off of these fumbles....

But my goodness... That really isn't a problem if this team keeps playing this way!!

1 fumble in 27 carries on a wet field with a wet ball I can live with. If he coughs it up multiple times in one game (like the Bears RBs did today in optimal conditions), then I'll worry a bit more.

Infamix
09-09-2007, 10:22 PM
His fumble in this game was very weird and unlikely to happen if the ball was dry...it wasn't like the preseason game where it was completely his fault.

Providence Steel
09-09-2007, 11:43 PM
For the sake of argument, I'll be re-charging this post with every Parker fumble...regardless of score. Remember...this post is about Parker, not Jamal Lewis, Big Ben or the offensive line. He didn't cost us the game but once again, he did put it on the ground and lost it to the opposition...If it isn't fixed, will will loose games this year because of it. One fumble every once-in-a-while is acceptable. parkers fumble rate is not, in my opinion.

Rah rah Steelers! We beat up on the hapless Browns. Lets hope we continue our winning ways.

fansince'76
09-09-2007, 11:51 PM
....He didn't cost us the game but once again, he did put it on the ground and lost it to the opposition...If it isn't fixed, will will loose games this year because of it....Rah rah Steelers! We beat up on the hapless Browns. Lets hope we continue our winning ways.

Try to contain your enthusiasm there, oh prescient one. :rolleyes:

HometownGal
09-10-2007, 12:05 AM
Rah rah Steelers! We beat up on the hapless Browns. Lets hope we continue our winning ways.

C'mon - can't you concentrate on all of the positives in the Steelers' win today instead of focusing on one of the few negatives? :dang:

Preacher
09-10-2007, 12:09 AM
C'mon - can't you concentrate on all of the positives in the Steelers' win today instead of focusing on one of the few negatives? :dang:

Like another person said...

Welcome Mike Tomlin. You win against our longest running rival... 34-7. But it wasn't good enough!

DACEB
09-10-2007, 09:25 AM
this post is about Parker, not Jamal Lewis, Big Ben or the offensive line. He didn't cost us the game but once again, he did put it on the ground and lost it to the opposition...If it isn't fixed, will will loose games this year because of it.

Whether or not anyone agrees with ProvSteel's opinion of FWP, I can't see how everyone downplays the fumbles.

Just because we won the game does not mean that there is no room for improvement.

It just goes to show how far our expectations have fallen, that we will accept a fumble every now and then.

Well folks that's 1 game and 1 fumble lost. Maybe next time it will cost us the game, and maybe that game would cost us the playoffs.

I don't want to cut Willie, or bench him, or whatever little clever comeback that many of you have come up with to combat the facts. Simply stated, it's a problem now work to fix it.

fansince'76
09-10-2007, 10:21 AM
Whether or not anyone agrees with ProvSteel's opinion of FWP, I can't see how everyone downplays the fumbles.

Just because we won the game does not mean that there is no room for improvement.

It just goes to show how far our expectations have fallen, that we will accept a fumble every now and then.

Well folks that's 1 game and 1 fumble lost. Maybe next time it will cost us the game, and maybe that game would cost us the playoffs.

I don't want to cut Willie, or bench him, or whatever little clever comeback that many of you have come up with to combat the facts. Simply stated, it's a problem now work to fix it.

I hear you Daceb, but there are two kinds of complaints - one kind is out of genuine concern and the other kind is just for the sake of bitching. Guess which camp Prov falls into. I'd lend it a bit more credence if he hadn't been complaining about some aspect or another of Willie's game for the last two+ years on another board. On the other board, his tack was that "Willie isn't really a good RB if you take away all his long runs." :dang:

MACH1
09-10-2007, 10:39 AM
FWP needs to work on how he holds the ball. IMO Tiki had a problem with fumbles then he changed his hold and cut way down on the fumbles.

X-Terminator
09-10-2007, 10:43 AM
C'mon - can't you concentrate on all of the positives in the Steelers' win today instead of focusing on one of the few negatives? :dang:

Obviously he can't, because he's obviously your typical Steelers fan who is never happy about anything. I call it the "perfection or the pine" mentality, where you are not allowed to make a mistake, and if you do, you should be benched.

fansince'76
09-10-2007, 10:48 AM
Said it once, and I'll say it again: wet ball, wet field - even the coke dealer put one on the ground. And he supposedly "never" fumbles. 'Nuff said.

SteelerFanInCA
09-10-2007, 10:48 AM
He fumbled... running backs usually do that in the NFL. He might even have a few more in him before the year is over. It's just the nature of the game.

Hopefully none of the fumbles cost us a game. I'm not going to hold court against Willie just because he fumbled in yesterday's game. WP brings a lot of good to the table.

BozMan
09-10-2007, 10:49 AM
Whether or not anyone agrees with ProvSteel's opinion of FWP, I can't see how everyone downplays the fumbles.

Just because we won the game does not mean that there is no room for improvement.

It just goes to show how far our expectations have fallen, that we will accept a fumble every now and then.

Well folks that's 1 game and 1 fumble lost. Maybe next time it will cost us the game, and maybe that game would cost us the playoffs.

I don't want to cut Willie, or bench him, or whatever little clever comeback that many of you have come up with to combat the facts. Simply stated, it's a problem now work to fix it.

Agreed 100%. WP is the best RB on the team, no doubt. But he's got to hang on to the dang ball, bad weather or not.

Yeah, his fumble didn't matter against the pathetic Browns. But against elite opposition in a close game, a fumble could turn the game. I'm thinking about games like @ Denver and @ NE. WP can't put the ball on the ground there. We simply can't leave points on the field against those kind of teams. Remember Randle El's fumble on an attempted lateral against NE 2 years ago?

That's why WP's fumbles are worrisome. It's becoming something of a trend.

DACEB
09-10-2007, 11:23 AM
FWP needs to work on how he holds the ball. IMO Tiki had a problem with fumbles then he changed his hold and cut way down on the fumbles.

That's what it comes down to, there is a proper way to handle the football. Look at film from Bettis, up tight in his armpit with the point of the ball tucked in his elbow and the other point gripped by his hand. Noone can pop it out from under or over.

I understand that fumbles happen, but perfection takes practice, practice and more practice. Right now Willie isn't the only one, Holmes needs to work on this as well.

BozMan put it best. Those types of mistakes will kill us against the elite teams, and the elite teams don't make those mistakes.

From what we have seen so far this year, and from what we learned last year, if we can eliminate those mistakes we can be a playoff team and even an elite team contending for the superbowl.

GeneralRobinson
09-10-2007, 01:29 PM
I understand everyone's concern about Willie. However, the fumble against Cleveland looked to me like more the case of the defender making a good play as opposed to Willie being careless. The replay showed Willie running low to the ground (possibly stumbling) and his forearm securing the ball. The defender takes his hand and swats the ball loose. I ain't gonna hate on Willie for that fumble. In my opinion, you just gotta tip your hat to the Cleveland defender for making a play.

Providence Steel
09-11-2007, 11:00 AM
I hear you Daceb, but there are two kinds of complaints - one kind is out of genuine concern and the other kind is just for the sake of bitching. Guess which camp Prov falls into. I'd lend it a bit more credence if he hadn't been complaining about some aspect or another of Willie's game for the last two+ years on another board. On the other board, his tack was that "Willie isn't really a good RB if you take away all his long runs." :dang:

Last year was the only year I brought it up. Its been only 1+ football seasons that I have been complaining about Parker and his fumbles.

Saying I'm "bitching" about the OBVIOUS problem would be like me saying that your riding Parkers jock. You're on one side of the camp, I'm on the other...can we leave the names, vulgarities and cheap shots out of this? Besides, isnt the FACT the Parker ONCE AGAIN fumbled in a game enough to give credibility to my point? Why should my continued illustration of this fact lessen the validity of the point being made?....

Another Game ANOTHER Parker fumble.

I feel as if I'm simply pointing out a PROBLEM which is not seen by SO MANY people because of the Parker Love Fest going on. He IS exciting at times but if you cant hold onto the ball, you are going to be exciting for the wrong reasons sooner or later.

fansince'76
09-11-2007, 11:06 AM
Last year was the only year I brought it up. Its been only 1+ football seasons that I have been complaining about Parker and his fumbles.

Saying I'm "bitching" about the OBVIOUS problem would be like me saying that your riding Parkers jock. You're on one side of the camp, I'm on the other...can we leave the names, vulgarities and cheap shots out of this? Besides, isnt the FACT the Parker ONCE AGAIN fumbled in a game enough to give credibility to my point? Why should my continued illustration of this fact lessen the validity of the point being made?....

Another Game ANOTHER Parker fumble.

I feel as if I'm simply pointing out a PROBLEM which is not seen by SO MANY people because of the Parker Love Fest going on. He IS exciting at times but if you cant hold onto the ball, you are going to be exciting for the wrong reasons sooner or later.

You're right, we should trade him immediately for either Jamal Lewis or Rudi Johnson - after all, they NEVER fumble. Besides, Willie just doesn't have the size to grind out those tough 3rd-and-short situations, right? :rolleyes:

The fact of the matter is you were complaining about Willie before last season. As I mentioned before, you used the "Willie isn't such a good RB if you take away all his long runs" angle before that.

onthebus36
09-11-2007, 11:23 AM
I was a member of another forum that I quit because these so-called fans NEVER had anything positive to say about the team. Cowher sucked, Parker sucked, Ben sucks, too old, too slow, run too much, don't run enough, etc...

If you want to have an intelligent discussion and Parker's fumbles, mention that he led all starting RBs in fumbles last year. That is a stat that should concern fans. Of course, to give a balanced picture you have to talk about his other stats:

Fourth in Rush/Receiving TDs with 16
Fifth in Rushing TDs with 13
Tied for fifth in Total Rushes
Sixth in Rushing Yards
Seventh in Yards from Scrimmage
Pro Bowl

So yeah... he sucks. :coffee:

Are his fumbles a concern? Absolutely. Has it been well-documented it's something he's working on? Yes.

Providence Steel
09-11-2007, 12:10 PM
You're right, we should trade him immediately for either Jamal Lewis or Rudi Johnson - after all, they NEVER fumble. Besides, Willie just doesn't have the size to grind out those tough 3rd-and-short situations, right? :rolleyes:

The fact of the matter is you were complaining about Willie before last season. As I mentioned before, you used the "Willie isn't such a good RB if you take away all his long runs" angle before that.

You're wrong...

My first post about Willie Parker came after the Super Bowl season. I argued that outside of the long run, Willie Parker stunk in that game. He had something like 11 yards on 7 carries. I further illustrated that he was horrible in short yardage situations neither helping the game on first and 10 or third and short and I also stated that he was too small. My first bad feelings about Parker came about two - three games into the season LAST year. Chargers game....

Everyone fumbles...I know. Parker fumbles too much for a team that has traditionally relied on the run. He fumbled yet AGAIN against the Browns.

I'll be letting you know when he fumbles again because its gonna happen...soon and often. I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back and his 100+ yards this weekend came against the BROWNS, what looks to be the NFL's most horrible team outside the Arizona Cardinals. (Whiz sure bombed!). There were lots of great things about the game but I'm not jumping on the "6 time world champion Steeler Bandwagon", just one game into the season. We're playing relative cream puffs for the first four games.

As far as perfection....? New England Patriots. Indianapolis Colts.

You wanna beat them? You better be CLOSE to perfect and among many other things...you better not fumble against them.

Why are you suggesting Lewis and R. Johnson?...I never mentioned them.

fansince'76
09-11-2007, 12:38 PM
I'll be letting you know when he fumbles again because its gonna happen...soon and often. I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back and his 100+ yards this weekend came against the BROWNS, what looks to be the NFL's most horrible team outside the Arizona Cardinals. (Whiz sure bombed!). There were lots of great things about the game but I'm not jumping on the "6 time world champion Steeler Bandwagon", just one game into the season. We're playing relative cream puffs for the first four games.

OK, Prov - you don't like Willie. It's cool. You're certainly entitled to your opinion. We'll just agree to disagree about him.

Jman
09-11-2007, 02:04 PM
If you want to have an intelligent discussion and Parker's fumbles, mention that he led all starting RBs in fumbles last year. That is a stat that should concern fans. Of course, to give a balanced picture you have to talk about his other stats:

Fourth in Rush/Receiving TDs with 16
Fifth in Rushing TDs with 13
Tied for fifth in Total Rushes
Sixth in Rushing Yards
Seventh in Yards from Scrimmage
Pro Bowl

So yeah... he sucks. :coffee:

Are his fumbles a concern? Absolutely. Has it been well-documented it's something he's working on? Yes.

I think this is a pretty fair assessment. I didn't bother reading the other pages (sorry folks :coffee:)...

He is working on it I'm sure.

Preacher
09-11-2007, 02:08 PM
I was a member of another forum that I quit because these so-called fans NEVER had anything positive to say about the team. Cowher sucked, Parker sucked, Ben sucks, too old, too slow, run too much, don't run enough, etc...

If you want to have an intelligent discussion and Parker's fumbles, mention that he led all starting RBs in fumbles last year. That is a stat that should concern fans. Of course, to give a balanced picture you have to talk about his other stats:

Fourth in Rush/Receiving TDs with 16
Fifth in Rushing TDs with 13
Tied for fifth in Total Rushes
Sixth in Rushing Yards
Seventh in Yards from Scrimmage
Pro Bowl

So yeah... he sucks. :coffee:

Are his fumbles a concern? Absolutely. Has it been well-documented it's something he's working on? Yes.


Excellent post. Yeah, we all get upset when he fumbles. But for what he gives this team... a homerun possibility EVERY TIME he touches the ball? Wow.

X-Terminator
09-11-2007, 02:23 PM
I'll be letting you know when he fumbles again because its gonna happen...soon and often.

We'll all be waiting with baited breath...

NOT.

I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back

Onthebus36 just posted some numbers that say otherwise. Plenty of people also said Tiki Barber wasn't good enough to be the starting back either - how did his career turn out?

You bash Willie, but I'll bet you you're the first person who stands up and cheers his head off when he scores a TD or breaks off a long run. In other words, you're a typical Pittsburgh Steelers fair weather fan who is never happy unless he's bitching about something.

PalmerSteel
09-11-2007, 03:00 PM
willie needs to watch gametape on how tiki turned around his fumbling problem. it is definately an issue and could possibly be a game breaker when he fumbles. with this said, there is only 5, if that, backs that could be better than willie. hold the ball high and tight willie!

X-Terminator
09-11-2007, 03:27 PM
willie needs to watch gametape on how tiki turned around his fumbling problem. it is definately an issue and could possibly be a game breaker when he fumbles. with this said, there is only 5, if that, backs that could be better than willie. hold the ball high and tight willie!

All the Giants did with Tiki was change the way he held the ball - he was holding it way too low and loose, and thus got stripped easily. I believe the Rams did the same with Steven Jackson, because he fumbled quite a bit earlier in his career. That's all they need to do with Willie, but whether it's changing the way he holds the ball or whatever, I'm sure it is being worked on.

onthebus36
09-11-2007, 04:06 PM
I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back...

Yeah! And you know who else sucks? That slacker Ladanian Tomlinson. He only got 25 yards rushing on Sunday. What a dud! The Chargers should cut him.

Seriously, if you look at one stat, you miss the picture and you clearly can't see the forest for the trees. If you just look at total rushing yards, LT had a terrible game. However, he also rushed for a TD and passed for a TD.

I think the stats posted on this thread present a more complete picture of Willie Parker and speak for themselves.

Oh, one more stat... Willie holds the Steelers' single game rushing record that Frency Fuqua held for 30+ years. A record that stood up against efforts by backs like Franco Harris, Rocky Bleier, Jerome Bettis, etc... Were those guys starters?

PalmerSteel
09-11-2007, 04:28 PM
I believe the Rams did the same with Steven Jackson, because he fumbled quite a bit earlier in his career

errr, ummm, bad time to say it can easily be fixed by using jackson as an example. he fumbled twice sunday. but i know what your getting at. it can be fixed. thats why i said for willie to carry it high and tight. :helmet:

HometownGal
09-11-2007, 04:39 PM
I suppose Canton should strip Franco Harris of his HOF bust, too - gee - the guy had 90 fumbles in his most celebrated career.

Sweetness had 86 fumbles throughout his legendary career, as well.

My point? Even the most elite RBs in the NFL, past and present (and most likely future) turn over the ball.

If this was an issue that couldn't be worked out and improved upon, I would be concerned, but there is no doubt in my mind that Tomlin, Wilson and FWP are addressing this issue and doing what they need to do to resolve this problem.

Providence Steel
09-11-2007, 05:15 PM
Yeah! And you know who else sucks? That slacker Ladanian Tomlinson. He only got 25 yards rushing on Sunday. What a dud! The Chargers should cut him.

Seriously, if you look at one stat, you miss the picture and you clearly can't see the forest for the trees. If you just look at total rushing yards, LT had a terrible game. However, he also rushed for a TD and passed for a TD.

I think the stats posted on this thread present a more complete picture of Willie Parker and speak for themselves.

Oh, one more stat... Willie holds the Steelers' single game rushing record that Frency Fuqua held for 30+ years. A record that stood up against efforts by backs like Franco Harris, Rocky Bleier, Jerome Bettis, etc... Were those guys starters?

Your point illustrates mine more than it does to dispel it in my opinion. Parker is a back that is great at times and god awful terrible at others.

I want someone who can 1) HOLD ONTO THE BALL!
2) Give us consistent performances week in and out.

Once again....this post is about Parker...not LT or anyone else in the league.

Providence Steel
09-11-2007, 05:20 PM
We'll all be waiting with baited breath...

NOT.



Onthebus36 just posted some numbers that say otherwise. Plenty of people also said Tiki Barber wasn't good enough to be the starting back either - how did his career turn out?

You bash Willie, but I'll bet you you're the first person who stands up and cheers his head off when he scores a TD or breaks off a long run. In other words, you're a typical Pittsburgh Steelers fair weather fan who is never happy unless he's bitching about something.

How could I POSSIBLY be a "typical" fan when my opinion is CLEARLY atypical on this thread?

I'll cheer ANY touchdown and am happy with any win but I'm not gonna pretend like Parker doesn't have a problem with dropping the ball...something that nearly everyone who has responded seems to gloss over. The "typical" opinion is to jump on the Parker Bandwagon.

fansince'76
09-11-2007, 05:24 PM
How could I POSSIBLY be a "typical" fan when my opinion is CLEARLY atypical on this thread?

I'll cheer ANY touchdown and am happy with any win but I'm not gonna pretend like Parker doesn't have a problem with dropping the ball...something that nearly everyone who has responded seems to gloss over. The "typical" opinion is to jump on the Parker Bandwagon.

Who do you think should be starting, then?

HometownGal
09-11-2007, 05:25 PM
The "typical" opinion is to jump on the Parker Bandwagon.

No, Prov - the typical opinion is to stop pummeling the kid into the ground and realize that he is capable of error just like every other athlete out there. Holy shit - we just played our first game of the season and won formidably over a division rival (even though the Browns suck). This is a new season and Sunday is a new game. FWP and his coaches are working on the problem. Quit nitpicking already!

Preacher
09-11-2007, 05:41 PM
Your point illustrates mine more than it does to dispel it in my opinion. Parker is a back that is great at times and god awful terrible at others.

I want someone who can 1) HOLD ONTO THE BALL!
2) Give us consistent performances week in and out.

Once again....this post is about Parker...not LT or anyone else in the league.


Here is where I just shake my head at you.

1. He was the HARDEST WORKING PLAYER last year on the offense. His work ethic is as good if not BETTER then Wards.

2. You seem to believe that all you have to do is give a RB the ball and the RB, all by himself, should be able to run through 11 people to pick up 4 or 5 yards. Fact is, there are 10 other people on the field, a load of coaches on the sidelines, etc. that ALL have to be doing there respective positions WELL for a RB to be able to gain yards.

Now lets go back to last year. Right side line? Nope. Failed. Coaches? Nope, everyone KNEW what we would be trying to do.

Yet, STILL, Wille had over 1500 yards last year. That was AMAZING.

3. Unreal expectations. Go back and look at Jerome's runs. -2 3 -1 4 4 2 -2 -1 3 etc. etc. etc.

Hines0wnz
09-11-2007, 06:35 PM
Here is where I just shake my head at you.

1. He was the HARDEST WORKING PLAYER last year on the offense. His work ethic is as good if not BETTER then Wards.

2. You seem to believe that all you have to do is give a RB the ball and the RB, all by himself, should be able to run through 11 people to pick up 4 or 5 yards. Fact is, there are 10 other people on the field, a load of coaches on the sidelines, etc. that ALL have to be doing there respective positions WELL for a RB to be able to gain yards.

Now lets go back to last year. Right side line? Nope. Failed. Coaches? Nope, everyone KNEW what we would be trying to do.

Yet, STILL, Wille had over 1500 yards last year. That was AMAZING.

3. Unreal expectations. Go back and look at Jerome's runs. -2 3 -1 4 4 2 -2 -1 3 etc. etc. etc.

:jammin:

Right on Preach!

In 2005, Shaun Alexander & LJ each had 5 fumbles but they seem to have turned it around since then. In '04, Ahman Green (w/GB) & Edgerrin James had 6 (I bet the Colts are glad they traded him before they won the SB last year!) while Clinton Portis, Tiki, Shaun Alexander, LT & Deuce McAllister had 5 each. My point, one season does not make him Mr Fumblrooski as the OP would have you think. Last season was a crap year all around but this is 2007 and its time to forget about it. :tt02:

onthebus36
09-11-2007, 06:45 PM
Your point illustrates mine more than it does to dispel it in my opinion.

In your opinion, I'm sure it does. To the rest of the world, not so much.

zoneblitz43
09-11-2007, 07:36 PM
Willie wasn't the only one that fumbled. He also had 109 yards. Lewis coughed one up in the same game, not only that he ran for a pitiful 35 yards. Willis McGahee (77 yards) and Rudi Johnson (50 yards) each fumbled one ball in last night's game, which ended up being turned over to the opponent. So you see, Willie isn't the only back that fumbled, and of every back in the AFC North he had the most success in week 1. It is a problem that does need to be addressed, and with our new coaching staff I think it will.

fansince'76
09-11-2007, 08:42 PM
Your point illustrates mine more than it does to dispel it in my opinion.

In your opinion, I'm sure it does. To the rest of the world, not so much.

I can only speak for myself here - nope.

Providence Steel
09-11-2007, 11:36 PM
Well...
I guess the thing is to wait and see what happens next. If it's anything like last year when his "work ethic" clearly blinded the many "atypical" fans who post here, into believing he was a great back, then I'll be here frequently reminding you of how many times he drops the ball... (by the way, he fumbled in his pre-season debut as well).


This should be called the Steelers Homer Forum...point out one OBVIOUS negative about a fan favorite player and you piss everyone off.

You know what...
I'm probably wrong about this....

Coach Tomlin should just ignore the problem all together...like the people here do. Like Coach Cowher did. Say nothing about it. Pretend the problem doesn't exist.

Maybe Willie Parker can fumble our way into the playoffs this year...

I'm just imagining things. And the next time Parker fumbles which I believe will be in one of the next two games, you can all pretend it didn't happen, write it off because of "work ethic" (clearly wasn't working on keeping the ball in his hands), and pretend that I didn't come back here to remind you all about something that didn't happen...AGAIN.

fansince'76
09-11-2007, 11:41 PM
Well...
I guess the thing is to wait and see what happens next. If it's anything like last year when his "work ethic" clearly blinded the many "atypical" fans who post here, into believing he was a great back, then I'll be here frequently reminding you of how many times he drops the ball... (by the way, he fumbled in his pre-season debut as well).


This should be called the Steelers Homer Forum...point out one OBVIOUS negative about a fan favorite player and you piss everyone off.

You know what...
I'm probably wrong about this....

Coach Tomlin should just ignore the problem all together...like the people here do. Like Coach Cowher did. Say nothing about it. Pretend the problem doesn't exist.

Maybe Willie Parker can fumble our way into the playoffs this year...

I'm just imagining things. And the next time Parker fumbles which I believe will be in one of the next two games, you can all pretend it didn't happen, write it off because of "work ethic" (clearly wasn't working on keeping the ball in his hands), and pretend that I didn't come back here to remind you all about something that didn't happen...AGAIN.

Once again, which of the other RBs on the roster would you start? You said Willie shouldn't be the starter, so which one? And there have been plenty of people in this thread besides yourself that have admitted it's a problem and at the same time haven't completely agreed with you. Disagreeing with you = homerism, I guess.

Preacher
09-12-2007, 01:34 AM
This should be called the Steelers Homer Forum...point out one OBVIOUS negative about a fan favorite player and you piss everyone off.

May I suggest you spend a little bit of time here before you post such obvious ignorance.

On this forum, I have posted negatives about the CB's, OL, Cowher, WR's, and yes, even Ward.

I have never got the reaction you received....

Interestingly, Tony, Atlanta Dan, Fan since, HTG, X-term, on and on and on have also posted negatives about this team...

I don't think any of them have got that kind of reaction either...

So, is it Steeler homerism, or Posting style?

I would have to say the latter.

Haiku_Dirtt
09-12-2007, 02:27 AM
[QUOTE=Providence Steel;284894I have a BAD feeling again about the RB situation this season.[/QUOTE]

Where were you when the debate included Duce Staley making another triumphant return to dress but not play. It's not fair that your BAD feeling comes so late in the debate.

We've already digested this debate as if it were your divorce attorney telling you she's getting the house, the car, the kid, and the cash.

We've hit the bottom and now our running game will rise like the Phoenix from the ashes of bankruptcy and find a perfect compliment for Wille via the draft so we don't run him into the ground.

P.S. I think Davenport is tough.
P.S.S. I've made numerous lucid, idotic, sober, intoxicated (maybe one or two flat out comatose), over-loaded, polite, freakin' obnoxious and insightful posts and few would be called "homeristic." Whether one likes it or not they are on record.

Preacher
09-12-2007, 02:32 AM
Where were you when the debate included Duce Staley making another triumphant return to dress but not play. It's not fair that your BAD feeling comes so late in the debate.

We've already digested this debate as if it were your divorce attorney telling you she's getting the house, the car, the kid, and the cash.

We've hit the bottom and now our running game will rise like the Phoenix from the ashes of bankruptcy and find a perfect compliment for Wille via the draft so we don't run him into the ground.

P.S. I think Davenport is tough.

Hmmm... a divorce in your recent history?

Haiku_Dirtt
09-12-2007, 02:42 AM
:sofunny:Hmmm... a divorce in your recent history?

:toofunny: Actually I avoided three divorces by just not getting married in the first place. Isn't it great when FORESIGHT is 20/20!?

Preacher
09-12-2007, 02:43 AM
:sofunny:

:toofunny: Actually I avoided three divorces by just not getting married in the first place. Isn't it great when FORESIGHT is 20/20!?


:sofunny::sofunny::sofunny:

Smart... very smart!!!

Either get married and stay married... or don't get married!!

RJC
09-12-2007, 08:01 AM
For the life of me I can not understand as to why when someone points out a blatantly obvious point it somehoe makes them less of a fan or a troll. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. This can't be disputed. It doesn't have anything t o do with plays he's made in the past, or how fast he's able to run. The bottom line is he lead the NFL last season in fumbles from a starting RB, and he did it again on Sunday. It's a problem that needs to be addressed. That's all people are trying to say...

fansince'76
09-12-2007, 08:16 AM
Willie Parker has a fumbling problem....It's a problem that needs to be addressed. That's all people are trying to say...

Not quite:

I want someone who can 1) HOLD ONTO THE BALL!
2) Give us consistent performances week in and out.

Once again....this post is about Parker...not LT or anyone else in the league.

I'll be letting you know when he fumbles again because its gonna happen...soon and often. I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back and his 100+ yards this weekend came against the BROWNS, what looks to be the NFL's most horrible team outside the Arizona Cardinals. (Whiz sure bombed!).

And my question was who should be our starting RB if not Willie, which I asked TWICE and has yet to be answered. Pointing out a problem is one thing, bitching for the sake of bitching is another.

HometownGal
09-12-2007, 08:24 AM
For the life of me I can not understand as to why when someone points out a blatantly obvious point it somehoe makes them less of a fan or a troll. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. This can't be disputed. It doesn't have anything t o do with plays he's made in the past, or how fast he's able to run. The bottom line is he lead the NFL last season in fumbles from a starting RB, and he did it again on Sunday. It's a problem that needs to be addressed. That's all people are trying to say...

I don't believe anyone is calling anyone "less of a fan" or a "troll". I think what has pissed people off is that such a big deal is being made about ONE fumble in ONE game - a turnover that didn't hurt us in the long run. I don't give a rat's patoot what happened last season - this is a new season and I'm only concerned with what our guys do this year. Prov stated that he doesn't feel FWP should be the starting back. I'm still waiting to hear who his choice would be.

Buzz05
09-12-2007, 08:28 AM
If he fumbles this week then Ill start worrying. Once is a mistake...twice is an issue, tree times is a trend...4 times is a problem.

X-Terminator
09-12-2007, 08:36 AM
For the life of me I can not understand as to why when someone points out a blatantly obvious point it somehoe makes them less of a fan or a troll. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. This can't be disputed. It doesn't have anything t o do with plays he's made in the past, or how fast he's able to run. The bottom line is he lead the NFL last season in fumbles from a starting RB, and he did it again on Sunday. It's a problem that needs to be addressed. That's all people are trying to say...

OK, for you and for our resident Parker basher (yes, this means YOU, Providence Steel):

There have been VERY FEW, if not NO ONE in this thread who has not admitted that Parker's fumbling is a problem that needs to be addressed. Do I need to point out to you all of the various posts that I personally have made stating that fact? So I guess that means your statement about "making them less than a fan or a troll if you point that out" is complete BS, doesn't it? My main problem with Prov in particular is that he feels the need to endlessly remind us of that, as if we're 10 year old kids who need to be told what to do. Not only that, he has refused to acknowledge or casually dismissed all of the good that he's done, and if you don't agree with him, you are a "homer" who "ignores the problem altogether." Give me a break. Anyone who's read this board for longer than 5 minutes can see PLENTY of posts by me and many others who pointed out flaws in this team. Hell, many people raised some questions after the win over the Browns, for crying out loud! Is that something a "homer" would do? I think not.

The bottom line is we KNOW Parker led the league in fumbles last year. We KNOW he fumbled on Sunday. We DO NOT need to be constantly reminded about it by some guy who clearly doesn't like him and doesn't appreciate anything good that he does. And I'd like to know myself who he thinks should be starting ahead of FWP, since he doesn't think he's good enough to be the starting back, but alas, he keeps avoiding the question. Ah well...

onthebus36
09-12-2007, 09:48 AM
Providence Steel,

fansince'76 has asked you several times who you would start in front of Willie Parker.

What is your answer?

An old teacher of mine once said to me, "Criticism without solutions is meaningless." I think that's applicable here. You clearly believe Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. At this point, we all understand your position.

So, the question is, who do you start in place of Willie Parker?

Dino 6 Rings
09-12-2007, 11:21 AM
Willie Parker does fumble. But how often?
2004 0 fumbles, 0 lost on 32 carries, 186 total yards
2005 4 fumbles, 0 lost on 255 carries, 1202 total yards
2006 7 fumbles, 5 lost, on 337 carries, 1494 total yards
2007 1 fumble, 1 lost on 27 carries, 109 total yards

Compared to who? Tomlinson?
2001 8 fumbles, 5 lost on 339 carries, 1236 total yards
2002 3 fumbles, 1 lost on 372 carries, 1683 total yards
2003 2 fumbles, 0 lost on 313 carries, 1645 total yards
2004 6 fumbles, 2 lost on 339 carries, 1335 total yards
2005 3 fumbles, 1 lost on 339 carries, 1462 total yards
2006 2 fumbles, 1 lost on 348 carries, 1815 total yards
2007 0 fumbles, 0 lost on 17 carries, 25 total yards

what I see more than anything, is that in Tomlinson had a fumble habit in 2004 that was "masked" by his team's ability to pounce on the lose ball. But I also see that Willie had about as many fumbles in his 3rd year as LT in LT's 4th year. I'm sure they will work on being better with the ball. Tiki used to be called known for fumbling, but he got it turned around. I'd be more concerned with interceptions, pass blocking and the over all offensive production and dropped passes by wide open guys than I would about Willie fumbling the ball during a "key" moment.

Just using facts my friends...even the best fumble once in a while.

X-Terminator
09-12-2007, 11:30 AM
But wait - according to Prov, you can't use those stats because this thread is about Parker, and you can't compare him to any other RB who might have or have had a fumbling problem. That might poke a hole in his argument, you see. Using his logic, the Chargers should have given up on Tomlinson in 2001 or 2004 because "he wasn't good enough to be the starting back" since he fumbled too much :sofunny:

Dino 6 Rings
09-12-2007, 11:36 AM
Well if you are going to claim that the starting Running Back for the Steelers has a fumbling problem, that needs to be addressed asap, I'm going to come at you with stats either backing you up or going against your claim. I've looked at the stats, and there is no "trend" or habit as to Willie's fumbling over the top back in the league. I could look at Najeh's stats, but he has never had more than 77 carries in a single season, and that was 2003. So no arguement can be made for him to replace Willie, as he obviously can't carry the load or is prone to break down during a season.

I'm sure if you did a side by side comparision, with 5 or 6 other "big name backs" in the league, you'd find they all have seasons they drop it a little more than others. However his arguement that we need to replace Willie because of the Fumbling problem isn't valid when compared to the rest of the league. Which can mean one of two things, he just really misses the Bus, which "...we all do man"...or he's just very much against Parker.

onthebus36
09-12-2007, 12:19 PM
...or he's just very much against Parker.

DING DING DING!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!

Dino 6 Rings
09-12-2007, 12:24 PM
Well thank you onthebus36. Do I get a prize for having a winning quote ? Maybe season tickets for life or something small like that ? :thumbsup:

Elvis
09-12-2007, 01:17 PM
Anyone who thinks that Willie should be benched in favor of anyone else that the Steelers have on their roster right now is a wolf in sheeps' clothing trying to bring our team down. There is no way you bench Willie or your crazy...:wink02:
Besides... who ya gonna replace him with?.... Davis... like they replaced Kreider with? Kreider should be our starter and before long we will find out.
:tt02:

SteelDogFan
09-12-2007, 01:18 PM
I can't believe this post is still getting replies. I haven't been on in two days and this is still a major topic?????

OK, Willie fumbles sometimes

OK, Ben throws INT's sometimes

OK, Holmes drops passes sometimes

OK, Foote misses tackles sometimes

OK, Dick calls the wrong blitz sometimes

OK, Ike gets burnt sometimes

OK, The offensive line false starts sometimes

OK, Troy is sometimes out of position


OK, SOMETIMES IT RAINS

OK, SOMETIMES IT SNOWS

OK, SOMETIMES ITS SUNNY

LIKE EVERY OTHER GOOD BACK I N THE NFL INCLUDING LT, THE FUMBLES WILL DECREASE EACH YEAR.

My point is there is no point for this conversation to continue!
WILLIE
DOESNOT HAVE A
FUMBLING PROBLEM
PERIOD!!!!!!!

DACEB
09-12-2007, 01:28 PM
Willie Parker does fumble. But how often?
Compared to who? Tomlinson?
Just using facts my friends...even the best fumble once in a while.

Great stats Dino, you've definetly proven the point to me.

I still hope that Willie is concentrating on holding the ball as I type this.
Practice, Focus!!

Preacher
09-12-2007, 04:30 PM
Hey Willie...


Please.. Hold the ball high, hold the ball tight... don't fumble..

SO THIS THREAD CAN DIE

Steelman16
09-12-2007, 04:32 PM
16 pages? :yawn:

RJC
09-12-2007, 06:04 PM
Um, fellas, Willie Parker lead the league in fumbles last year. That's not "sometimes"......

X-Terminator
09-12-2007, 07:04 PM
Um, fellas, Willie Parker lead the league in fumbles last year. That's not "sometimes"......

Actually no, he didn't. That distinction belongs to one Devin Hester. Bet you don't see Bears fans getting their panties in a bunch over it.

X-Terminator
09-12-2007, 07:09 PM
Hey Willie...


Please.. Hold the ball high, hold the ball tight... don't fumble..

SO THIS THREAD CAN DIE

I'd love for that to happen too, Preach...but Providence Steel is already on record as saying he's going to revive this thread every time he fumbles as an "I told you so." You know, like a 12 year old would do.

HometownGal
09-12-2007, 07:48 PM
Steel Dog Fan says it best above. :thumbsup:

Frankly, I'm sick of seeing this thread up at the top. Whether FWP has chronic butterfingers or not remains to be seen. He's our feature back and I'm behind him 100%.

My finger is on the trigger . . . .

fansince'76
09-12-2007, 07:49 PM
Steel Dog Fan says it best above. :thumbsup:

Frankly, I'm sick of seeing this thread up at the top. Whether FWP has chronic butterfingers or not remains to be seen. He's our feature back and I'm behind him 100%.

My finger is on the trigger . . . .

You homer! :toofunny:

RJC
09-12-2007, 08:37 PM
Willie Parker lead all starting RBs in fumbles last season. He opened this season with a fumble. It doesn't matter how fast he is, he still fumbles. It doesn't matter how many plays he makes, he still fumbles. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be fixed. Nothing anyone says will change this. If you think he doesn't, you're lying to yourself.....

Steel_Bus_24
09-12-2007, 08:51 PM
Yeah he has to fix it if he ever wants to be mentioned in the same breath as L.T.

srk173
09-12-2007, 09:19 PM
if he puts up 150 yards and a touch or two he can fumble every game it wont matter cause or d will hold them.

GBMelBlount
09-12-2007, 11:51 PM
Willie Parker lead all starting RBs in fumbles last season. He opened this season with a fumble. It doesn't matter how fast he is, he still fumbles. It doesn't matter how many plays he makes, he still fumbles. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be fixed. Nothing anyone says will change this. If you think he doesn't, you're lying to yourself.....

Agreed. As mach1 said, like Tiki, it is a matter of working on it. Let's hope he does!

suprasad
09-13-2007, 01:01 AM
Willie Parker lead all starting RBs in fumbles last season. He opened this season with a fumble. It doesn't matter how fast he is, he still fumbles. It doesn't matter how many plays he makes, he still fumbles. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be fixed. Nothing anyone says will change this. If you think he doesn't, you're lying to yourself.....

I'd like to think that Tomlin, being the bright guy that he is, will (with help from the D in practice) work on that...

Sudesh

Indy_Steelers
09-13-2007, 05:28 AM
Pro bowl doesnt mean a thing if your sitting on the couch at home during the playoffs.

Parker consistently fumbles and the number of yards he picks up doesnt mean much if he fumbles the game away at the 1 yard line.

I had a lot of discussion last year about this matter and I believe there were 3 or 4 games where Parker fumbles LITERALLY cost us a scoring chance and a chance at winning. If only ONE of those games were won, Parker could have played in both the Pro Bowl, along with the rest of the team, and the Playoffs.

This love of Parker has to be tempered by common sense. If you cant hold onto the ball...why should you be handed the responsibility of carrying it in the first place?

Are you going to dump Hines Ward as well for his fumble against the Droncos? I checked Nfl.com & yahoo sports and they say that he only fubled once last yerar. So that one was in the Bengals game and I think we won that one . So I am not sure of the fumbling away games part you are talking about.

Indy_Steelers
09-13-2007, 05:31 AM
Willie Parker lead all starting RBs in fumbles last season. He opened this season with a fumble. It doesn't matter how fast he is, he still fumbles. It doesn't matter how many plays he makes, he still fumbles. Willie Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be fixed. Nothing anyone says will change this. If you think he doesn't, you're lying to yourself.....

Well if that is your possition then we should bench Ben as well. Did he not throw the most INTs last year?

RJC
09-13-2007, 07:59 AM
Well if that is your possition then we should bench Ben as well. Did he not throw the most INTs last year?

Now, who exactly said Parker should be benched? It wasn't me. I'm wondering if you mad that statement for dramatic effect? Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be rectified. The End.

As for Ben, yeah, I did think there were games last year he should kave been sat down and given time to think about his play. Oakland being one of them. Had we benched him in the 2nd quarter, we win that game, and subsequently go to the playoffs. When a player makes back breaking mistakes, they deserve to sit. No matter who they are...

fansince'76
09-13-2007, 08:06 AM
Now, who exactly said Parker should be benched? It wasn't me. I'm wondering if you mad that statement for dramatic effect? Parker has a fumbling problem. It needs to be rectified. The End.

No, it wasn't made for "dramatic effect," nor was it you who suggested it:

I don't think the guy is good enough to be the starting back and his 100+ yards this weekend came against the BROWNS, what looks to be the NFL's most horrible team outside the Arizona Cardinals.

And I'm still waiting for an answer to my question, Prov.

Buzz05
09-13-2007, 08:31 AM
Can we get past this fumbling thing...dont we have more important things to do then argue with eachother over this...kind of like an improved Bills team coming up this weekend....

thebus36idf
09-13-2007, 05:35 PM
I like willie, But I'm not so sure about him getting the call to pound it up the middle at the goal line. I was baffled as to why we weren't using davenport at that time. I think we should use more of Davenport to tire out the defense then throw some speed in there. It seemed as though willie was a little indicisive in the back feild. It seems as though he is trying to create plays, rather than just hitting the hole as he did when he was the new kid on the block. He should stick to what worked in the past. Also remember what a gamble it was at one time to hand Tiki Barber the ball. He fixed that over time, and became one of the NFL's prolific running backs. I still think we should however use Davenport more.

Providence Steel
09-13-2007, 06:03 PM
Sorry, I have not logged on in a few days. Came back today to see if there was any chatter about Belli-cheater.

To answer Fansince76's question which was, who should be our starter...
I don't know of anyone on the team now that can do that job. The issue to me is that Parker's fumbling problems were evident last year, they were evident in the preseason and into the first game of the season are evident again. There has been plenty of time to address the problem and bring SOMEONE in. Maybe we can see what Davenport can do when you put more pressure on his shoulders. Regardless of who I think can handle the job, I believe someone else needs to be a starter.

I've not ever said Willie should be benched. I believe he works best to help the team when his workload is lighter. The year he shared responsibilities with Staley and Bettis seemed to work out nicely. If the fumbling problem continues, and I believe it will, Tomlin should be looking for another ball control back...soon.:helmet:

Outside of this, the stats posted by others here are interesting but in no way tell the whole story. Willies numbers look great on paper and the long exciting runs are great highlight film material but does he really help the team to consistently sustain drives? Let me give a hypothetical example:

Running Back X plays a full game, has 15 touches for 101 yards and a touchdown. Those are great numbers! 6.7 yards per carry and a score. Problem is that Running Back X had a one run for 90 yards, and another that went for 11. The other nine carries were all for zero yards. Now I know that these numbers are exaggerated but the point is this.

Running Back X was GREAT on two carries but on NINE other carries, did NOTHING to help his team and his poor performance there resulted in PUNTS. He looks GREAT on paper but stats dont tell the real story and his hypothetical team lost, 30-7. :flap:

I would like to see someone post a response to the following:

Since runs over 10 yards are not the average in the NFL by a running back...lets throw the occasional big run out and calculate yardage on the more average run. Can someone easily calculate the average yards per carry of Willie Parker when discounting these longer yardage runs since the long run, even by the great Willie Parker dont even come every game?

The reason I think this is important is because, while Parker has the ability to (using terminology another poster stated) "hit a home run" when he touches the ball, the truth is that home runs are few and far between. Does Willie Parker really help this team when looking at the AVERAGE carry? Maybe he does but it surely doesnt appear to me to be that way, especially when he has a problem holding onto the ball.


Here I am arguiing that stats don't tell the whole story, but I'll try one on you guys...a VERY INTERESTING stat that no one has brought up yet:

Willie Parker fumbled in EACH of the last 4 games he has played. He fumbled against the Ravens last year, fumbled against the Bengals last year, Fumbled in the only game he played in during the preseason (his appearance for 3 downs in the last game without touching the ball doesn't count) and he fumbled against the Browns last week.

In the last 4 games, Willie Parker is batting 1000 in the fumbling category. :banging::dang::dang::dang:

How can this stat be so nonchalantly overlooked?

Elvis
09-13-2007, 06:21 PM
Anyone that knows anything about football should see that Willie Parker is the man to run the ball. How can you or anyone else set there and say that Parker is Not the man to carry the load for the Steelers? Are you really a Steelers fan? I think that you are a wolf in sheeps clothing my friend and you need to show your true hand so we will know who you really pull for. Maybe your a Raven fan or a Bengal fan.... but anyone who knows Steelers football much knows that we are set at RB with fast Willie and Co.
:tt02:

xXTheSteelKingsXx
09-13-2007, 07:38 PM
I love Willie running the ball and Providence Steel, he is way more consistant than what you give him credit for.

Also, this is just an observation, it seems to me that Willie runs better as the game goes on. My opinion is that the opposing defenses just get tired and can't keep up with his speed. Has any one else seen this?

fansince'76
09-13-2007, 08:35 PM
To answer Fansince76's question which was, who should be our starter...
I don't know of anyone on the team now that can do that job. The issue to me is that Parker's fumbling problems were evident last year, they were evident in the preseason and into the first game of the season are evident again. There has been plenty of time to address the problem and bring SOMEONE in. Maybe we can see what Davenport can do when you put more pressure on his shoulders. Regardless of who I think can handle the job, I believe someone else needs to be a starter.

Fair enough. :thumbsup:

Preacher
09-13-2007, 08:40 PM
Prov...

You CAN'T take the long runs away from Willie when discussing him. Just as a homerun will only come to a player 40 or 50 times in a real good year, so big runs don't come that often in the NFL. HOWEVER....

When a player like A-rod, Ramirez, etc. get up to bat, the team plays them different... many times walks them in a given situation. Thus, those numbers affect how a team plays them. The same thing happens with WIllie.

Teams HAVE TO respect his speed. DB's have to keep an eye on him, because if they don't, on a screen or a draw play, he will be gone right passed them. They can no longer just load the box, because willie can beat many of the LB's to the corner and safeties will never chase him down when he does get through. His speed and homerun ability brings a dynamic to game planning for defenses. It is a dynamic they have not had to deal with before when dealing with us.

I really don't know what your infatuation is with Willie. there are many other players on this team that failed miserably last year. This year, we have a number of receivers that have ALREADY dropped balls that they SHOULD have caught. I don't notice you having ANYTHING to say about them.

What is your problem with Willie? Because it is out of balance with how he plays and other players perform.

revefsreleets
09-13-2007, 09:19 PM
Parker has a better average than once in 40. He hits a big run probably 1 in 10. The problem is the vanilla nature of his runs. Almost everything was between the tackles in the first half, and it under-utilizes his speed. The Steelers need to toss in some sweeps and counters from the same formations they run the old "Belly 22" from.

fansince'76
09-13-2007, 09:28 PM
"Providence Steel" - been a while, but aren't you the same "Providence Steel" that used to post on Steelers.com? Seems to me the knock on Willie over there was that "he isn't that good of a RB if you take away all his long runs."

Outside of this, the stats posted by others here are interesting but in no way tell the whole story. Willies numbers look great on paper and the long exciting runs are great highlight film material but does he really help the team to consistently sustain drives?....Since runs over 10 yards are not the average in the NFL by a running back...lets throw the occasional big run out and calculate yardage on the more average run. Can someone easily calculate the average yards per carry of Willie Parker when discounting these longer yardage runs since the long run, even by the great Willie Parker dont even come every game?

Like I said....:coffee:

Providence Steel
09-13-2007, 10:14 PM
So in other words...

Fumbling every game (at least the last four he's played in) is just fine with fans and posters on this board? At best, he fumbles in 40% of the games he plays.

My lack of faith in Willie to carry the load is an entirely separate issue from the fumbles. I can understand how someone can like the type of back that Willie is...I dont. Difference of opinion. Fair enough.

But he fumbles FAR too much! How can anyone deny this? On this fact alone, my faith in this guy is shaken.

Would anyone here take a RB in the draft that was going to guarantee you a fumble in 40% of the games that he plays?

That's Willie Parker. That's your guy.

I'm gonna take a break from this thread until the next fumble, which I hope is a long way off but my instinct tells me it's just around the corner.

Dino 6 Rings
09-14-2007, 09:46 AM
The actual Percentage is 30% not 40%

12 fumbles in 40 Games = 30%

Too many fumbles but still, not as bad as you make it sound.

revefsreleets
09-14-2007, 10:38 AM
A quickie breakdown on Parker: If you take away his 25 yard run (which it's wrong to do, since running up the middle for 2-3 yards sets those big plays up) he still averages about 3.2 yards per carry. After watching the game again, some observations: Parker, although certainly not as big a back as Bettis, can run with power. If you watch the game, he was getting 2-3 yards even when there was nowhere to go. There were few plays where he was stopped for less than a couple yards.He just put his head down and moved the pile for positive yards. EVERY RB breaks off a big play now and then, so trying to toss out the big plays by Parker doesn't wash.

As far as fumbling, it's a problem, and it needs addressed. We'll see if it improves as the season goes.

DACEB
09-14-2007, 10:52 AM
I can only hope that ball security is getting as much attention at practice as this thread is on this board.

HometownGal
09-14-2007, 11:28 AM
Would anyone here take a RB in the draft that was going to guarantee you a fumble in 40% of the games that he plays?

That's Willie Parker. That's your guy.



On that stat alone, probably not, but I'd sure take a chance on him if he was going to guarantee the team 21 all purpose TDs in 2 seasons, two - 1,000 yard rushing seasons in his first two seasons as a starter and a 4.6 ypc.

Fumbles can be worked on. Sheer talent is God given.

That's Willie Parker. That's our guy.

revefsreleets
09-14-2007, 12:44 PM
I took Parker in one of my fantasy leagues, so, yes, I'd take him reality if I was in a position to do so.

Hines0wnz
09-14-2007, 01:52 PM
I took Parker in one of my fantasy leagues, so, yes, I'd take him reality if I was in a position to do so.

I would have taken him if he was available too. Its funny how the talk has digressed from "he's not as big as Jerome, we need a big back for this offense!" to (after consecutive 1,000 yard seasons) picking apart his flaws. Some fans just cant be pleased without finding something to whine about.

Edman
09-15-2007, 03:11 AM
Willie has developed a slight fumbling problem. It's fixable and I hope it's fixed. End of story. I know it. And everyone else knows it.

Don't forget people, this is the same Providence Steel that jumped on Willie for performing poorly in a meaningless Pro Bowl game. It's incresingly obvious that this isn't a matter of addressing Willie's flaws, Prov is simply Anti-Willie. And will go to all lengths to bash him. Even exaggerating his flaws to make him out to be a detriment to the Steelers. Why I do not know.

Willie isn't perfect, nobody said he was. He's got his flaws, but do not discredit him. The Clowns sold out to stop the run last Sunday and FWP still broke 100. FWP posts our first 1,000 yard rusher since the Bus back in 2001. Did it twice even. What a garbage HB Willie is.

steelcity58
09-16-2007, 12:19 PM
Willy...FAST WILLY...is something the Steelers have never had,...a game breaker,
a guy with enough speed to get to the outside, a guy that blows the SB wide open.

As long as FW makes 25 good runs and fumbles 1 time, I can hang.

Better than 2 yards and a cloud of dust.

:tt02:

eastcoastslide43
09-16-2007, 12:37 PM
why are you people so negative? He made the probowl last year, he helped win a superbowl, has had consecutive 1,000 yard seasons and your still dissin him. He is a good franchise running back who will have an outstanding year in 07.

Polly
09-16-2007, 04:14 PM
No fumbles this game huh? I don't think he'll fumble for a long time

X-Terminator
09-16-2007, 04:59 PM
why are you people so negative?

They're Steelers fans. It's in their blood.

badg2k
09-16-2007, 05:53 PM
i wish the game was broadcasted here in nyc

Edman
09-16-2007, 05:55 PM
They're Steelers fans. It's in their blood.

Exactly. The Steelers can win 50-0 and fans will still complain.

Steeler fans complain about the Rooneys and whine about the front office, despite the fact that the Steelers have been the most successful franchises for the better part of 30+ years. The Steelers have now won 500 games. The MOST of all AFC teams and the ONLY AFC team to do so.

fansince'76
09-16-2007, 05:57 PM
So, Prov, what say you this week? Yeah, that's what I figured. Nothing.

Petesburgh66
09-16-2007, 06:00 PM
Another game, another 100 yards.

Why don't people see all the positives Parker brings to table instead? Speed kills and alot of NFL teams would love to have a back like this. .

HometownGal
09-16-2007, 06:03 PM
DIE THREAD DIE!!!! :chicken:

That is all.

revefsreleets
09-16-2007, 06:42 PM
Congrats Willie! Great game, running for power and speed against a good defense.

ShutDown24
09-16-2007, 06:48 PM
Hmmm.... Over 200 yards, a touchdown and only one fumble so far this season for Willie... People still have a problem with him? He is doing this non the less in our new pass happy offense.

Edman
09-16-2007, 06:48 PM
I say keep this thread up. Just further evidence that Providence is Anti-Willie.

23 carries, 126 yards and a TD. And like magic, Providence is no where to be seen. "But...But take away his big runs and he has nothing." Lol.

Preacher
09-16-2007, 06:52 PM
DIE THREAD DIE!!!! :chicken:

That is all.

:sofunny::sofunny:

Yep... especially after today!!

Notice how Willie was carrying the ball higher and tighter? Hmmmm.....

Old 09-12-2007, 01:30 PM #154
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Default Re: Another Game...another Willie Parker Fumble
Hey Willie...


Please.. Hold the ball high, hold the ball tight... don't fumble..

SO THIS THREAD CAN DIE
__________________
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Preacher is online now Add to Preacher's Reputation Report Post Reply With Quote Multi-Quote This Message

Maybe he IS reading this board?!?!:wink02::sofunny:

Providence Steel
09-17-2007, 10:32 AM
Just thought I'm come in and give Willie some credit. Carried the ball well and looked fantastic rushing and hitting the holes. The only complaints I'd have is his inability to get the short yards inside the 5 yard line but with yesterdays performance, others on the team can make up for it.

It was his first game in the last 5 he's played without fumbling and we were playing the 28th ranked (last years ranking) defense who lost three starters last week so I precede with cautious optimism in my faith in this guy.

If he continues to play this way, who could complain? Perhaps our next 3 games against what should be lesser teams will build confidence for everyone but the real test is coming halfway through the season.

I don't mind giving credit where credit is due but most posters here cant seem to criticize when criticism is warranted.

Good job and cheers to Willie.

Providence Steel
09-17-2007, 10:39 AM
i wish the game was broadcasted here in nyc

I live in Providence RI and watch every game on the internet for free. It's not GREAT resolution but you can see most everything and hear the broadcasters clearly. Go here:

(www).myp2p.eu/index.htm (take out the parenthesis and copy into your browser)

Read it and do what they say to do. No spyware or malicious viruses. I've been using it both last season and this and I have never gotten a single piece of spam from it. Mainly for use in third world countries but available to anyone with an internet connection.

I can t believe it really works!

Providence Steel
10-01-2007, 12:22 PM
Uh...Ohh...

Looks what's back.

Parker fumbles against the Cardinals (I actually thought he hadnt but was wrong) and cant get in on two carries from the 4 and 2 yard lines.

(In the last 7 games, Parker has 5 fumbles.)

Do I sound like a broken record or what?!

Parker and the Steelers faced the best defense they have seen this year and came out with a loss. Plenty of blame to go around but Parker certainly didnt help matters any.

Davenport should be given the chance to run when Parker fails...especially inside the 5. He had two carries for something like 16 yards. Davenport looks harder to bring down. Maybe that is just my perception but three straight ahead runs up the middle by Davenport when the Steelers defense came up with that fumble inside the 5 and the Steelers win that game.

fansince'76
10-01-2007, 12:28 PM
Parker and the Steelers faced the best defense they have seen this year and came out with a loss. Plenty of blame to go around but Parker certainly didnt help matters any.

Yep, refusing to go to any play-action or screens against a perpetual 9-man front didn't help any either. :coffee:

Edman
10-01-2007, 12:31 PM
Nope. Parker didn't have a good game at all. In fact, the Steelers were just off their game. Almost everybody was off.

Of course, the blame goes to Willie for piss-poor game planning (running into a 9 man front, no playaction, run-run-pass). FWP is just not a good, consistent RB. Stop making excuses for him. :rolleyes:

The fumbled exchange I place on Ben and Willie. That was their fault. The Steelers just did not have a good day.

X-Terminator
10-01-2007, 12:42 PM
Hey Mr. Broken Record, did you actually watch the game and see what happened on that play? It was a bad handoff from Ben that he did not put all the way into Parker's gut. Yes, he gets credit for it, but that one was not his fault. Not that you'd be objective or anything since you're a blind hater, right?

Providence Steel
10-01-2007, 03:24 PM
Hey Mr. Broken Record, did you actually watch the game and see what happened on that play? It was a bad handoff from Ben that he did not put all the way into Parker's gut. Yes, he gets credit for it, but that one was not his fault. Not that you'd be objective or anything since you're a blind hater, right?

Yes, I did see that play and the ball was placed clearly into the hands of Parker who didn't handle it well. Even the commentators said the ball was placed perfectly in his hands.

He also got stuffed at the goal line again.:coffee:

I dont hate Willie Parker. He just isn't the guy ya'll think he is. Against the 14th ranked Defense and the best that Pittsburgh has seen this year...he STUNK! He also had another drop.:dang: Thats 5 in the last seven games guys...

Rationalize that.

fansince'76
10-01-2007, 03:33 PM
I dont hate Willie Parker. He just isn't the guy ya'll think he is. Against the 14th ranked Defense and the best that Pittsburgh has seen this year...he STUNK! He also had another drop.:dang: Thats 5 in the last seven games guys...

Rationalize that.

How about this: you could take Jim Brown, Earl Campbell, the Bus, Franco, and every other great "big back" in NFL history, roll them all into one, and he STILL wouldn't have success against a NINE-MAN front all day, especially when the D is given next to no reason to respect the pass. Good enough?

HometownGal
10-01-2007, 03:39 PM
Yes, I did see that play and the ball was placed clearly into the hands of Parker who didn't handle it well. Even the commentators said the ball was placed perfectly in his hands.

He also got stuffed at the goal line again.:coffee:

I dont hate Willie Parker. He just isn't the guy ya'll think he is. Against the 14th ranked Defense and the best that Pittsburgh has seen this year...he STUNK! He also had another drop.:dang: Thats 5 in the last seven games guys...

Rationalize that.

Sorry Prov - gotta agree with XT here. I clearly saw the play - I just watched it again on my DVR and Ben absolutely DID NOT put that ball cleanly into FWP's hands. They both shoulder some blame for that fumble with 60% of the blame going to Ben.

I never put any stock into anything the commentators say. At least 4 times during the game yesterday, they made boneheaded statements and then had to backpedal as fast as those pieholes could do so.

I refuse to hate on Parker - he's more than contributed his fair share to the Steelers 3 wins this season. Yesterday's debacle was a team loss - other than Santo and Sep, they all played like their ass cheeks were super-glued.

Edman
10-01-2007, 03:40 PM
Check it out folks. Prov comes back after Willie has a rough game (first time this season) with more smart-ass comments.

Indy_Steelers
10-01-2007, 03:41 PM
Uh...Ohh...

Looks what's back.

Parker fumbles against the Cardinals (I actually thought he hadnt but was wrong) and cant get in on two carries from the 4 and 2 yard lines.

(In the last 7 games, Parker has 5 fumbles.)

Do I sound like a broken record or what?!

Parker and the Steelers faced the best defense they have seen this year and came out with a loss. Plenty of blame to go around but Parker certainly didn't help matters any.

Davenport should be given the chance to run when Parker fails...especially inside the 5. He had two carries for something like 16 yards. Davenport looks harder to bring down. Maybe that is just my perception but three straight ahead runs up the middle by Davenport when the Steelers defense came up with that fumble inside the 5 and the Steelers win that game.

I do not care so much that he fumbles, not that I want him to, I do care if he/we loses/lost the fumble. If we get it back, good. Next I guess you are going to say that it was Parker's fault that Ben threw a pic in the end zone and that a punt was returned for a TD was his fault too. I do however agree that Davenport may have been the best RB in the goal line situation.

I do not think it was the best defense. I do think wiz has a bit of knowledge of his former team even with a new coaching staff.

I will keep in mind for future reference that whenever we suck it is Parker's fault. Funny though that when we were winning nobody cared that Parker fumbled.
2 fumbles in 74 caries and only lost one of them. Not too bad.

onthebus36
10-01-2007, 03:58 PM
Check it out folks. Prov comes back after Willie has a rough game (first time this season) with more smart-ass comments.

He's on the Don't Blame the O-Line thread too:

http://forums.steelersfever.com/showthread.php?t=20217

But seriously, the "Blame Willie" strategy could be really useful outside of just football. I'm going to blame him for all the problems in my life.

Can you guys believe all the problems Willie Parker started in Burma?

HometownGal
10-01-2007, 04:18 PM
But seriously, the "Blame Willie" strategy could be really useful outside of just football. I'm going to blame him for all the problems in my life.

Can you guys believe all the problems Willie Parker started in Burma?

He's responsible for erosion of the ozone layer, illegal immigrants living in this country and Elton John having the ghey, too. :jawdrop:

Stlrs4Life
10-01-2007, 06:16 PM
Willie didn't fumble. Blame Ben on that exchange.

Providence Steel
10-01-2007, 06:26 PM
Its so wonderful how people here put words into your mouth...

I've never stated that it was Parkers fault that Ben threw an interception.

Never stated I hated Parker.

Never said the O-line didnt play terrible...

But...

You cant continue to blame O-Line for bad running. Not every play was the result of a bad O-line. They were in the backfield ALL DAY but they weren't in the back field when we had the ball at the 4 and Tumbleweed Parker cant punch it in.

PARKER dropped the ball. Ben put it right in his hands. Parker HAD it and then let it go. That lies squarely on Parker...no one else...except the O-Line since they are to blame for everything.

Can anyone here riding Parkers jock tell me how 5 fumbles in the last seven games is a good thing?

Can anyone here riding Parkers jock tell me how 1 yard on two carries inside the 5 yard line is a good thing?

By the way...I complained about Parker after the Cleveland game (a good game for Parker) because HE FUMBLED THE ROCK AGAIN! I also came here and gave him props when he DIDN'T fumble after the Buffalo game. But those teams stunk! And guess what?

I'll be back here MANY times revisiting this thread this season because Parker fumbles the ball...a LOT and against average defenses, cant get into the end zone when we are inside the 5.

The guy is great in the open field but I wouldn't trust him to run through paper at the end of a tunnel.

I'll post again when Parker fumbles...
Unfortunately, you'll hear from me soon.

fansince'76
10-01-2007, 06:29 PM
I'll be back here MANY times revisiting this thread this season because Parker fumbles the ball...a LOT and against average defenses, cant get into the end zone when we are inside the 5.

The guy is great in the open field but I wouldn't trust him to run through paper at the end of a tunnel.

I'll post again when Parker fumbles...
Unfortunately, you'll hear from me soon.

Yep, typical 5-year-old mentality. Wants Willie to fumble just so he can come back and say "I told you so." Whatever.

HometownGal
10-01-2007, 06:34 PM
Seriously, Prov - if the only reason you are here is to squeal with glee every time Parker fumbles so you can thump your chest, do us all a favor - don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya. You are entitled to your opinion, but all you appear to want to do is to spew the same old redundant sh it.

I'm proud to have FWP as a member of the team I love. Other than LT, there isn't another back in the NFL that I'd prefer wearing the black and gold.

X-Terminator
10-01-2007, 06:54 PM
Seriously, Prov - if the only reason you are here is to squeal with glee every time Parker fumbles so you can thump your chest, do us all a favor - don't let the door hit ya where the good Lord split ya. You are entitled to your opinion, but all you appear to want to do is to spew the same old redundant sh it.

Seconded. In fact, I'm all for locking up this thread and any subsequent thread on this subject that this guy starts. How this guy can call himself a Steelers fan is beyond me. Pulling up a thread just so he can go "neener neener neener?" What is he, 3 years old for crying out loud?

Prov, it's OK. Willie didn't mean to ignore you when you tried to get his autograph. No need to hate him forever.

Preacher
10-01-2007, 07:34 PM
Prov.

Don't you miss the days when we had the Bus... Who would get 30 yards on every carry through 11 men in the box... all on HGH, and never fumble the ball.. even when the other team had illegally taped the call before hand?

Yeah.. those were the days.

:rolleyes:

revefsreleets
10-01-2007, 07:41 PM
Earl Campbell combined with Walter Payton wouldn't have scored on those attempts inside the 5. The Cards had it sniffed out, But nice try, "ParkerhaterProv".

Preacher
10-01-2007, 07:46 PM
Earl Campbell combined with Walter Payton wouldn't have scored on those attempts inside the 5. The Cards had it sniffed out, But nice try, "ParkerhaterProv".

Ahhh..

PHP!

That is a nice shorthand.

revefsreleets
10-01-2007, 07:49 PM
It should be "ParkerHaterProv" then. Or the hiphop version, "ParkaHatahProv".

Either way, it's amusing to see him stick his head out of his turtle shell when the coast is clear. Unfortunately for him, it's probably not going to happen many times this year.

fansince'76
10-01-2007, 07:52 PM
Prov.

Don't you miss the days when we had the Bus... Who would get 30 yards on every carry through 11 men in the box... all on HGH, and never fumble the ball.. even when the other team had illegally taped the call before hand?

Yeah.. those were the days.

:rolleyes:

:toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny:

HometownGal
10-01-2007, 07:56 PM
It should be "ParkerHaterProv" then. Or the hiphop version, "ParkaHatahProv".

Either way, it's amusing to see him stick his head out of his turtle shell when the coast is clear. Unfortunately for him, it's probably not going to happen many times this year.

:toofunny::toofunny::thumbsup:

Providence Steel
10-07-2007, 05:02 PM
I'm here to pop my "head out of my shell", give props to Willie for holding the ball and props to the coaching staff for giving the ball to Davenport when inside the 5. Having Parker handle the ball in those situations does not work and it's glad to finally "see" the coaches realizing it too.

Must admit I missed seeing the game but the recap and boxscore looks impressive. Wish I could have caught it and unfortunately for those of you who havent been following the thread, I'm GLAD to see Parker hold onto the ball, glad to get the win and TA-DAH! am back again to give credit where credit is due.

But ya'll wont remember that...

tony hipchest
10-07-2007, 05:04 PM
I'm here to pop my "head out of my shell", give props to Willie for holding the ball and props to the coaching staff for giving the ball to Davenport when inside the 5. Having Parker handle the ball in those situations does not work and it's glad to finally "see" the coaches realizing it too.

Must admit I missed seeing the game but the recap and boxscore looks impressive. Wish I could have caught it and unfortunately for those of you who havent been following the thread, I'm GLAD to see Parker hold onto the ball, glad to get the win and TA-DAH! am back again to give credit where credit is due.

But ya'll wont remember that...

did you say something?

...i forget.

Edman
10-07-2007, 05:08 PM
Willie Parker's has a bad game: "Willie Parker sucks."

Willie Parker has a good game: "Willie did fine, but (Insert excuses)."

Hines0wnz
10-07-2007, 05:11 PM
did you say something?

...i forget.

who was that?

TackleMeBen
10-07-2007, 05:12 PM
i think he is saying its willie's fault we WON the game..:flap:

Hines0wnz
10-07-2007, 05:13 PM
Willie Parker's has a bad game: "Willie Parker sucks."

Willie Parker has a good game: "Willie did fine, but (Insert excuses)."


QFT :sofunny:

Hines0wnz
10-07-2007, 05:13 PM
i think he is saying its willie's fault we WON the game..:flap:


hehehe.......you might be on to something.

TackleMeBen
10-07-2007, 05:15 PM
hehehe.......you might be on to something.

however i dont think he would admit that :tt02:

Hines0wnz
10-07-2007, 05:16 PM
Prov.

Don't you miss the days when we had the Bus... Who would get 30 yards on every carry through 11 men in the box... all on HGH, and never fumble the ball.. even when the other team had illegally taped the call before hand?

Yeah.. those were the days.

:rolleyes:

*thread winner* :cheers:

Hines0wnz
10-07-2007, 05:17 PM
however i dont think he would admit that :tt02:

Most people like that never do. He opened the can of worms but probably regrets it now. Only the Mods can save the face loss of making a stupid thread.

TackleMeBen
10-07-2007, 05:18 PM
then again maybe he dont. he probably knew exactly what he was doing when he started this thread.. but the good thing is that now he can eat crow on this game b/c parker didnt fumble..lol

HometownGal
10-07-2007, 06:03 PM
then again maybe he dont. he probably knew exactly what he was doing when he started this thread.. but the good thing is that now he can eat crow on this game b/c parker didnt fumble..lol

Mark my words - Prov will come back with . . . .

but, but, but . . . . Parker didn't score any TDs. :blah::blah::blah:

revefsreleets
10-07-2007, 06:54 PM
I'm here to pop my "head out of my shell", give props to Willie for holding the ball and props to the coaching staff for giving the ball to Davenport when inside the 5. Having Parker handle the ball in those situations does not work and it's glad to finally "see" the coaches realizing it too.

Must admit I missed seeing the game but the recap and boxscore looks impressive. Wish I could have caught it and unfortunately for those of you who havent been following the thread, I'm GLAD to see Parker hold onto the ball, glad to get the win and TA-DAH! am back again to give credit where credit is due.

But ya'll wont remember that...

Davenport got the ball once today in a "Willie Parker Situation" (9 guys in the box). He gained half a yard. Najeh had a nice game, but so did Willie. You REALLY need to stop all this ignorance.

Preacher
10-07-2007, 07:21 PM
Parker got 102 yards... but one was a long carry, so that doesn't count (good job on Najeh on that long carry).

Willie didn't get any touchdowns. He sucks.

:wink02:

Mosca
10-07-2007, 08:05 PM
Sheesh. Everyone knows about Willie Parker, you take away all those long runs and he ain't NOTHIN'.

Tom

Preacher
10-08-2007, 12:56 AM
Davenport got the ball once today in a "Willie Parker Situation" (9 guys in the box). He gained half a yard. Najeh had a nice game, but so did Willie. You REALLY need to stop all this ignorance.

:thumbsup:

onthebus36
10-09-2007, 12:49 PM
Sure, Willie had a great game, but his continued support of international terrorism really gets my goat.

TackleMeBen
10-09-2007, 01:03 PM
its parkers fault that we have a bye this week..lol

Lord Stiller
10-09-2007, 01:28 PM
It's a shame they called back that 37 yard run Parker had on a phantom Heath Miller holding penalty

Steelerstrength
10-09-2007, 01:37 PM
It's a shame they called back that 37 yard run Parker had on a phantom Heath Miller holding penalty

Seriously, that was one horrible call!

Watching Willie now, vs the past, sure gives me a good feeling about his/our future! By comparison, Shauna Alexandria just dropped to the ground every time our defenders got close. Honestly, I do recall when Willie would do the same. Glad that has changed!

revefsreleets
10-09-2007, 06:04 PM
It's a shame they called back that 37 yard run Parker had on a phantom Heath Miller holding penalty

Literally, if that was holding, then every block by every blocker on both sides of the ball was holding. Horrible call.

But is it really unreasonable to think that there was just a little "toss a couple calls the Seahawks way" going on? The game was pretty even at the start of the 3rd on the scoreboard and the field, and a Seahawks stop, assisted by the refs or not, would help Seattle quite a little bit. And holding is always the easiest call to make, because it can be called on any play.

But it didn't work. Unlike the Seahawks in XL who collapsed under adversity and felt sorry for themselves and complained, the Steelers just turned around and made more plays. That's what makes a winner.