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View Full Version : Bruce Arians and a bankrupt game plan


Haiku_Dirtt
09-30-2007, 09:09 PM
How sweet is Santonio Holmes?

When Tomlin said we're running Parker until the wheels come off did Arians have a plan for what happens when the wheels did come off?

Cedrick Wilson should just go away. WTF. Youthful mistakes is not an acceptable reason. And Nate? < Sigh. >

It takes 10 "atta boy"'s to make up for one "oooops!" Ben's decision to throw into double coverage at that juncture of the game is NOT what leaders do. OOOOPs. I'll be watching for the 10 atta boys.

Tomlin is not the offensive coordinator.

Lord Stiller
09-30-2007, 09:46 PM
Nate Washington plays with his head up his a$$

Glace
09-30-2007, 09:47 PM
Lets not forget all the talk that Ben could change plays any time he wants and has as much "freedom" as he wants to run the offense.

I saw him pointing out blocking schemes and such a couple times....not much audible-ing.

Michael Keller
09-30-2007, 09:49 PM
My opinion is as follows:

A-Ben must understand that he does not always have to get the six pointer each and every time he is within 10 yards. When he forced the pass this time, he did not even look at other choices. He has got to train him self to NOT to lock on to a receiver and zip the ball into the narrow creases. While we get only three points and yes we are all disapointed in getting "only three" the last part of this game is played differntly, when you down by eleven maybe you go for two after the last touch down we got etc.

Ben however is a superior athletic QB and we should be grateful for having him as our guy. He will learn but even the guy that broke Marino's record today still has never fully learned NOT to force the ball on occasion.

B-I am a little concerned about the offensive line more than anything else. Ben was under alot of pressure and Parker did not have much room to run.

C-I give the Whis credit the Cardinal played "Steeler Tuff".

We beat Seattle next week and we are in great shape going into the bye week.

This team was never going undefeated but it must learn from each game and stay hungry.

Michael

Bigsteve332310
09-30-2007, 10:14 PM
Carey Davis sucks and hasnt done anything...running games struggling and sitting on the bench is one of the best run blocking fullbacks in the game that could be in blowin open some holes.

ben2hines=6
09-30-2007, 10:18 PM
not sure id say our running game is struggling, this was the first bad game weve had, and dont forget, russ grimm knows every weekness that our oline has and he exploited it, he may not be the d coordinator, but i feel he had an awful lot to do with our struggles today.....buy the way, when were getting non stop blitzed all damn day, wouldnt it make a little sense to throw a screen pass or two, i was screaming for it all day and it never happened..why?

HometownGal
09-30-2007, 10:57 PM
Carey Davis sucks and hasnt done anything...running games struggling and sitting on the bench is one of the best run blocking fullbacks in the game that could be in blowin open some holes.

I wouldn't go so far as to say Davis sucks - he's basically a newbie - but I do agree with you wholeheartedly that I disagree totally with him playing over Dan Kreider who is one of the top two FBs in the game today. I pretty much have agreed with everything Tomlin has done thus far, but that move still makes no sense to me.

tony hipchest
09-30-2007, 11:00 PM
the offensive gameplan reeked.

the inflexibility and stubborness was a blast from the past.

it seemed like there was too much focus on not letting ben "show up" his prior coaches. the cardinals were fine stopping willie and letting ben beat them. the steelers shoulda accepted the challenge on the openning drive.

the uber conservative approach after a 7-0 lead made me think brian st pierre was the qb after a 30 pt lead.

Edman
09-30-2007, 11:02 PM
The Cardinals sold out to stop the run. Barely any playaction passes called. That raised a red flag with me. The playcalling was pedestrian, predictable, vanilla, and conservative at best. No wonder the offense was so horrible. The play calling was Marty Ball/Cowher re-incarnated after that first TD. Only until we went down 21-7 That the playcalling decided to go no-huddle/quick strike. Guess what? We finally scored.

It's no coincidence that when the Steelers moved into the "mix-it-up", "quick strike", "Killer Instinct attack" approach on Offense that things started getting better all around. Even the O-Line. What a piss poor gameplan.

jjpro11
09-30-2007, 11:05 PM
i really didnt think we were going to miss ward THAT much. but those 9 man fronts were killing us. holmes and miller were the only other reliable receivers out there. miller was forced to stay in and block a lot though. get well soon hines!

Tankus_Maximus
09-30-2007, 11:45 PM
I wouldn't go so far as to say Davis sucks - he's basically a newbie - but I do agree with you wholeheartedly that I disagree totally with him playing over Dan Kreider who is one of the top two FBs in the game today. I pretty much have agreed with everything Tomlin has done thus far, but that move still makes no sense to me.

:iagree:

I was hoping to see big Danny in there today, perhaps to bust a wedge for Willie. I haven't been that impressed with Davis so far.

MACH1
10-01-2007, 12:48 AM
Whats so predictable about run, run, pass. :hunch: I almost thought cowher was back with that short leash ben had on. And the o-line play sucked.

ShutDown24
10-01-2007, 12:50 AM
:iagree:

I was hoping to see big Danny in there today, perhaps to bust a wedge for Willie. I haven't been that impressed with Davis so far.

Davis hasn't done anything to deserve the job yet. I was at camp a ton and I thought Kreider performed well (Been around football a lot so that isn't just a naive fan assesment either). The whole thing with Davis was that he was supposed to be more versatile at the fullback position.

1. How can that help if he is never on the field in favor of an extra tight?

2. When they DO actually put him in it always a run situation.

3. Kreider got in for a few plays today... The one run I saw him block in, he light his guy up.

Preacher
10-01-2007, 12:55 AM
Whats so predictable about run, run, pass. :hunch: I almost thought cowher was back with that short leash ben had on. And the o-line play sucked.


Yep. I was really wondering about that myself!

moedap
10-01-2007, 08:42 AM
I have to agree with comments on Cedrick and Nate. On that 1 series in the 4th when we were down 14-7. The threw a fade to Nate that he barely misses for a TD. The reason he barely misses is that he slowed down for some unexplicable reason on the route. Cedrick has a chance to convert on 2 and long but fails to look for the ball thrown to his outside shoulder.

Atlanta Dan
10-01-2007, 08:52 AM
They better win next week or the wailing for the following 2 weeks with a bye week is going to be intense.:smile: - if Casey and Troy are both out tat will be tough.

Failure to adjust to Whiz loading up against the run was disheartening but they still would have won but for an INT on the end zone throw to Miller and a special teams breakdown - certainly not saying the consequences will be anywhere near the same but yesterday's loss was very similar to the September 2006 home loss to the Benglas which in IMO was when the 2006 season went into a death spiral.

Counselor
10-01-2007, 09:51 AM
i really didnt think we were going to miss ward THAT much. but those 9 man fronts were killing us. holmes and miller were the only other reliable receivers out there. miller was forced to stay in and block a lot though. get well soon hines!

And here is the crux of the problem. With Ward out, Ben didn't have his best "possession reciever" with him. Holmes did a fantastic job, but it can't be a one man show or they key on that one man. If Washington had made a couple of catches, maybe the defense would have backed off a bit, but as it was, the only two catching the ball were Miller and Holmes.

Lord Stiller
10-01-2007, 10:08 AM
I have to agree with comments on Cedrick and Nate. On that 1 series in the 4th when we were down 14-7. The threw a fade to Nate that he barely misses for a TD. The reason he barely misses is that he slowed down for some unexplicable reason on the route.


I completely agree. Right after Nate passed his guy he absolutely DID slow down while Ben threw a perfect pass that would have been a TD if Nate didn't slow down

BIG MISTAKE and one of many for bonehead Nate.

noto45
10-01-2007, 10:12 AM
we need more depth at the wide reciever postion thats for sure! I think the play calling was terrible. Our we forgetting how to make adjustments or what??? I hope Bruce learns from this game cause he flat out stunk!!

rog
10-01-2007, 10:21 AM
Why are so many people blaming the loss on the play calling I didn't see the coaches calling the game much different than the first 3 game the difference was the execution. Like I said apperently if a play works it is a good call if it doesn't work it was a bad call.RIGHT?

steel58
10-01-2007, 11:44 AM
Maybe I am a conspiracy theorist, but it sure looked to me like the Steelers were meant to lose that game. I agree that Nate definitely slowed down on that ball. Also, all week Big Ben was saying how glad he was that the Steelers weren't going run on 1st, run and 2nd, passing on 3rd and long (I guess his jab at Whiz), yet that's exactly what they did! And the fact that every time the Steelers had something going a penalty was called. That punt was awesome just before the one that got returned for the TD, yet a penalty wipes it out. Also, the lack of adjustments by the Steelers. That's why their D is so awesome usually, because they are hard to adjust against. I guess all the players out did make a difference.

GeneralRobinson
10-02-2007, 11:01 AM
Someone else raised this point but it was an extremely good one. Why didn't Ben check to more passes if Arizona was overplaying the run? The only reason I could think of was that our WR and TEs could not get a clean release off of press coverage which would have meant that Ben would have to hold the ball and risk getting sacked quite a bit given the play of the OL. If Ben has more freedom to audible, this would have been the best time to do it.

oldschool
10-02-2007, 12:10 PM
How about Krider and Davenport at the goal line, instead of Parker we should be able to power the ball in from the 4 yard line!

Lord Stiller
10-02-2007, 12:13 PM
How about Krider and Davenport at the goal line, instead of Parker we should be able to power the ball in from the 4 yard line!


Not a bad idea. Does anyone remember if Kreider was in on goaline??? He is made for that

rog
10-02-2007, 01:55 PM
Goaline is where Kreider is at his best.

thebus36idf
10-02-2007, 03:08 PM
My opinion is as follows:

A-Ben must understand that he does not always have to get the six pointer each and every time he is within 10 yards. When he forced the pass this time, he did not even look at other choices. He has got to train him self to NOT to lock on to a receiver and zip the ball into the narrow creases. While we get only three points and yes we are all disapointed in getting "only three" the last part of this game is played differntly, when you down by eleven maybe you go for two after the last touch down we got etc.

Ben however is a superior athletic QB and we should be grateful for having him as our guy. He will learn but even the guy that broke Marino's record today still has never fully learned NOT to force the ball on occasion.

B-I am a little concerned about the offensive line more than anything else. Ben was under alot of pressure and Parker did not have much room to run.

C-I give the Whis credit the Cardinal played "Steeler Tuff".

We beat Seattle next week and we are in great shape going into the bye week.

This team was never going undefeated but it must learn from each game and stay hungry.

Michael

Nice Job. Couldn't agree with you more. :thumbsup: Black & Gold, Peace & Grace

Dino 6 Rings
10-02-2007, 05:53 PM
Davenport has a BAD habit of running to high, not good for the goal line.

I agree, Kreider needs to be in at the goal line, but how about, instead of throwing to a TE like you have the 3 previous games on 3rd down...how about...wait for it...wait for it...RUNNING IT a 3rd time in a row? Seriously...I was reading the "Football Coaching for Idiots" book and even in there it doesn't say anything about not being allowed to run it 3 times in row...what's the worst thing that happens? We kick a field goal? Well I guess we could fumble...but a pass can be picked or incomplete as well...and NO ONE was looking for a run on 3rd down. Even the Peanut vender knew we were looking for a TE on that play...

augustashark
10-02-2007, 06:03 PM
Davenport has a BAD habit of running to high, not good for the goal line.

I agree, Kreider needs to be in at the goal line, but how about, instead of throwing to a TE like you have the 3 previous games on 3rd down...how about...wait for it...wait for it...RUNNING IT a 3rd time in a row? Seriously...I was reading the "Football Coaching for Idiots" book and even in there it doesn't say anything about not being allowed to run it 3 times in row...what's the worst thing that happens? We kick a field goal? Well I guess we could fumble...but a pass can be picked or incomplete as well...and NO ONE was looking for a run on 3rd down. Even the Peanut vender knew we were looking for a TE on that play...


One thing that comes to mind about your post is that last night I watched Vrable catch another TD. Everytime that guy is thrown to he catches a TD. I would think that any team that plays NE and sees that Vrable has entered the game on the GL that they would double him up no matter what. The big difference is execution. Brady executes the play everytime. Ben just needs to execute better on the goal line, check off TE if he has to, throw it away, hell take a sack there and kick the FG.

MasterOfPuppets
10-02-2007, 08:28 PM
Why are so many people blaming the loss on the play calling I didn't see the coaches calling the game much different than the first 3 game the difference was the execution. Like I said apperently if a play works it is a good call if it doesn't work it was a bad call.RIGHT?
the difference was ,IT WORKED THE FIRST 3 GAMES !!! you don't wait till half way through the fourth quarter ,and your down by 14 , to decide the running game ISN'T working .all freakin offseason and training camp, we were bombarded with articles and quotes from various steelers about the NEW unpredictable offense , with 4 and 5 wideouts, and the hurry up offense.....well what the hell are they saving it for??? i'd have thought by freakin halftime they would have scrapped the game plan, and threw some different looks at the D.....

steel striker
10-02-2007, 08:50 PM
I know there is not crying over spilled milk but, why did we not try to run Davenport in that series? I like Willie but, we needed a change of pace and, maybe it would not have worked but I sure think Davenport would have scored.

moedap
10-03-2007, 11:38 AM
I wonder if there is someone in the background calling the plays for the offense. It seems to me no matter the O.C. the play calling remains constantly conservative despite the evidence that the Steelers are more successful when they open it up and include everyone. I dont know maybe they thought they could beat Arizona with a vanilla gameplan. Maybe they dont want to reveal too much until later in the season.

SteelDogFan
10-03-2007, 02:51 PM
OK, how many times was someone in the backfield as soon as the ball was snapped. How many runs did Willie have for minus yards? If you think thats just do to bad play calling or sorry game plan your wrong. Russ Grim has worked with these guys for years. He knows all their tendencies, tricks to hold, peel off or what have you. All he has to do is say, "WHEN FANECA'S LEFT HAND IS FLAT ITS A RUN OR, SO AND SO ALWAYS DOES THIS WHEN THE RUN IS TO HIS SIDE". Heck he could even say if Ben looks up before he looks down he is going to pass or run. We had the main two coaches than ran our offense create a defensive plan to stop it.

I don't think Tomlin or Arians was out coached. I due believe he could of put in Davenport for a change of pace. Answer me this how close are the Jets and Patriots game since Mnagini went to NY. New England won the first game last year by 7 and the Jets beat the in their second match-up 17-14. What team holds the Pats to 14 points, none, and this is the Jets.

Take away the special teams TD and that stupid throw that Ben made in the Red Zone and the Steelers win the game. Just thoughts on the topic.

BozMan
10-03-2007, 03:57 PM
I don't think Tomlin or Arians was out coached.

I do. The Steelers dominated the 1st quarter. But after that, it was pretty much all Arizona, except for a last desperate gasp at the end. This looks like the Arizona staff made some effective adjustments after the 1st quarter. The Steelers failed to make effective counter adjustments.

Arizona repeatedly stacked 8 or 9 defenders in the box. They obviously were not respecting our passing game. Where were the play-action passes? If we burn them for some big gains with such plays, they back off the line of scrimmage and we can try to reestablish the run. Instead, we played right into their hands with predictable and unimaginative run, run, pass play calling.

Idaho Steel
10-04-2007, 01:55 AM
The part that disappointed me was that the Cardinals came out to stop the run and were stacking the box so heavily, opening the deep ball and the crossing routes all day. We failed to adjust and run and gun. I believe that if we had done this and kept them honest it would have then opened up the run game. Live and learn and move on to the next game. All of our division rivals suck so we should have an open shot at the playoffs. Go Steelers!!!

Galax Steeler
10-04-2007, 04:45 AM
I don't like making excuses when we loose you can say we were outcoached or we beat ourselves but I think when troy went out in the second half it took the heart of our deffense we played them nose to nose to that point also hampton going out did not help our cause much.