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View Full Version : Arians Throws Ben Under The Bus


Atlanta Dan
10-27-2007, 09:10 AM
Offensive coordinator Bruce Arians said he called more running plays in the first half in Denver, but quarterback Ben Roethlisberger had to audible pass plays because the Broncos were overloading their defensive front to stop the run. Arians said some of the audibles called by Roethlisberger -- quick lateral throws to the wide receiver -- are actually like running plays.

"To me, the flanker screen is a run, that's a long handoff," Arians said.

The Steelers' play-calling has come into question because they attempted 24 pass plays and ran just 12 times in the first half against the NFL's worst rush defense (187 yards per game). The Steelers lost 31-28.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/07300/829053-66.stm

I thought all week the party line was that Arians called the plays he did because that was what was available? Certainly have not heard this explanation from Tomlin or Ben.

So did Ben audible that first drive down the field to start the game? For some reason IMO if that was the case Ben would have shared that information:smile: Now Ben can learn what it is like to have someone dump play calling issues on him.

Even if true, Arians coming out with this information after his play calling has been criticized for the past 5 days looks like blame shifting (even though he also tells us a flanker screen should be counted as a running play anyhow:dang:) - not what i expect from a coach.

stlrtruck
10-27-2007, 09:34 AM
I'll take the one game blunder from whoever is responsible without being too upset but if the trend continues, someone really has to step up and answer the questions as to why our offense isn't performing.

The bungals may have an awful defense but they've been known to put up lots of points on offense. It is definitely a game that our defense has to make a statement from the first snap to the last whistle!!!

And Ben needs to remind Carson who is the SB winning QB, not a mvp of a meaningless game.

Atlanta Dan
10-27-2007, 09:39 AM
I'll take the one game blunder from whoever is responsible without being too upset but if the trend continues, someone really has to step up and answer the questions as to why our offense isn't performing.
.

The offense performed in the second half (3 TDs on 3 possessions) and 28 points should be enough to win.

IMO it was the first half play selection mix that Tomlin criticized to NBC at halftime (I guess Tomlin does not regard a flanker screen as a running play) and about which questions have been asked this week.

stlrtruck
10-27-2007, 10:46 AM
The offense performed in the second half (3 TDs on 3 possessions) and 28 points should be enough to win.

IMO it was the first half play selection mix that Tomlin criticized to NBC at halftime (I guess Tomlin does not regard a flanker screen as a running play) and about which questions have been asked this week.

Yeah, I know they performed in the second half but to your point, they didn't play for 60 minutes and that, as a fan, is what I'm used to seeing from my beloved Steelers.

Still, if the offense, and the defense for that matter, doesn't continue to perform at the high level that we're use to seeing, then someone should definitely be held accountable - and as much as I'd like to say it's the coaches, IMHO the players need to be quesitoned and give answers.

PalmerSteel
10-27-2007, 11:44 AM
offense did fine. rough first half but turned it around nicely. its our defense that hopefully we can look back at and say they had a brain fart.

BlastFurnace
10-27-2007, 11:45 AM
The offense or the offensive play calling did not cost us the game. The offense put up 28 points. The defense cost us that game.

stillers4me
10-27-2007, 01:04 PM
The infamous Steeler defense had better report for duty tomorrow! Carson Palmer needs to be shut down......he simply cannot be allowed to have a good day.

And if anybody can get into his head, it should be some big guys dressed in black and gold. :chuckle:

And the offense has had a week to get their heards out of their arses......................wake up boys!! Give Ben alittle help.

Edman
10-27-2007, 01:07 PM
Offense not performing?

This has been the most dynamic, most balanced Offense the Steelers have had in years. They put up 28 on the Donkeys. 21 in the second half. 28 points should be enough for anyone.

You may say the O performed for 30 minutes, but the D did not play at all. Don't forget, the Broncos scored on their opening drive. And when they needed a stop, they couldn't get one. Say what you want about the O, but unlike the D, they got their crap together and got the Steelers back in it. The D and Coach Dad get the blame. They effed up big time on national TV. If they have even the remote sense of accountability and pride, they make Crybaby Carson pay tomorrow.

OneForTheToe
10-27-2007, 02:36 PM
The offense did enought to win. This one was on the D.

GeneralRobinson
10-27-2007, 02:57 PM
I did not interpret his comments as throwing Ben under the bus. Coach Arians did not criticize the audibles. I believe he was simply reporting "the news" as Coach Tomlin likes to say.

Bottom line in the NFL, it's all about results. If your team goes against conventional wisdom and is not successful, the second guessers will be out in droves. All Pittsburgh can do now is keep chopping wood and prepare for Cincinnati.

X-Terminator
10-27-2007, 03:49 PM
Yeah, I don't see what the big deal is in what Arians said either. To me, this is a non-story.

SteelDogFan
10-27-2007, 03:56 PM
The Steelers better sure up their passing D or it will be a long second half of a season. The Offense scored 28 points but they came at the end of the game. The offense did not play well at all in the first half. When you score also counts. Its not like we were up 28 to nothing and the D let them score 28 unanswered points.

I do agree that the D lost the game by giving up 21 points. But remember the offense also contributed to the score with a Ben fumble taken back for a TD. Turnovers also count in momentum. Even though the D must go out there and stop them it can be a let down non the less.

Both offrense and defense contributed in the loss. But the bottom line is when you turn the ball over in the NFL you are going to lose and thats it.

Lord Stiller
10-27-2007, 03:58 PM
It didnt sound like he threw Ben under the bus to me

stupid thread title

Preacher
10-27-2007, 04:16 PM
Yeah, I don't see what the big deal is in what Arians said either. To me, this is a non-story.

Exactly.

It was actually more of him saying that the reason the TEAM didn't run was the Bronco's came in to stop the run, Ben called it out and changed it.

Funny thing is, that is what he was SUPPOSED to do.

ytsan2q
10-27-2007, 04:57 PM
Yeah, if they put 8 in the box, of course he had to audible to wide reciever screens and quick slants. You could see him audibling out of the run during the game. There's no story here. We just have to force teams out of those 8 man front. Arizona was the 1st team to try it (and was successful). Seattle did it but our D played well enough for us to win that game. I expect the Bengals to try the same thing this weekend. We have to work on exploiting 8 man fronts.

Atlanta Dan
10-27-2007, 05:53 PM
It didnt sound like he threw Ben under the bus to me

stupid thread title


Thanks for the feedback - I will try to do better in the future:smile:

The fact remains after 5 days of criticism, Arians decided it was time to lay the preponderance of the pass play calling on his QB - I certainly did not hear it from Ben or Tomlin

I stand by my position it was blame shifting - contrast Arians comments on the play calling with how Troy handled criticism of his play last Sunday

Polamalu took responsibility for being "misaligned on a big play," and said the others were "probably my fault as well, the big ones, yeah.


http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_534606.html

Shabby conduct by Arians

TackleMeBen
10-27-2007, 05:58 PM
i dont care who's fault it was.. that was last week. now we need to focus on the bengals and shut down tj and cj.... and as i stated before (many times) it doesnt matter what ben says or dont say something will find fault with it... so move on and get over it... its in the past.

GBMelBlount
10-27-2007, 08:40 PM
Yeah, I don't see what the big deal is in what Arians said either. To me, this is a non-story.

I know everyone loves the guys who rush to take the blame, but maybe what Arians said is just the truth. Plain & simple.

Atlanta Dan
10-27-2007, 08:50 PM
i dont care who's fault it was.. that was last week. now we need to focus on the bengals and shut down tj and cj.... and as i stated before (many times) it doesnt matter what ben says or dont say something will find fault with it... so move on and get over it... its in the past.

I moved on ... by his comments yesterday it is Arians who apparently has not

X-Terminator
10-27-2007, 09:00 PM
Thanks for the feedback - I will try to do better in the future:smile:

The fact remains after 5 days of criticism, Arians decided it was time to lay the preponderance of the pass play calling on his QB - I certainly did not hear it from Ben or Tomlin

I stand by my position it was blame shifting - contrast Arians comments on the play calling with how Troy handled criticism of his play last Sunday

Polamalu took responsibility for being "misaligned on a big play," and said the others were "probably my fault as well, the big ones, yeah.


http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt.../s_534606.html

Shabby conduct by Arians

I still just don't see it, Dan, sorry. When a QB is facing 8- and 9-man fronts, it's expected he try to change the play. If the Steelers had continue to run against those fronts without success, the fans would have questioned why they didn't pass enough, as they did after the loss to the Cardinals.

This is a classic case of damned if you do and damned if you don't. Fans want someone to blame, so players and coaches go out of their way more often than not to accept it, even when they are only part of the reason for the loss. And if they don't, well, this is what happens.

I always respect you and your opinion, Dan, but I see nothing wrong with what Arians said.

Atlanta Dan
10-27-2007, 09:13 PM
I still just don't see it, Dan, sorry. When a QB is facing 8- and 9-man fronts, it's expected he try to change the play. If the Steelers had continue to run against those fronts without success, the fans would have questioned why they didn't pass enough, as they did after the loss to the Cardinals.

This is a classic case of damned if you do and damned if you don't. Fans want someone to blame, so players and coaches go out of their way more often than not to accept it, even when they are only part of the reason for the loss. And if they don't, well, this is what happens.

I always respect you and your opinion, Dan, but I see nothing wrong with what Arians said.

We will agree to disagree on this - I agree it is a non-issue as to what happened last week. By Arians feeling it necessary to explain a situation for which he has been taking heat five days after a loss he elected to keep the issue alive, which reflects a certain insecurity on his part and an indication he does not think it is a non-issue (such as his need to explain how flanker screens are just like running plays). In addition, given how Ben reacts to any criticism from coaches, laying anything on Ben before a crucial game is simply not a good idea.

Coach K at Duke has a saying when you suffer a setback - next play. Arians could have just let it pass with an equivalent or no comment on Friday, but since Tomlin called out the play calling to NBC at halftime maybe Arians has been taking heat from sources other than Internet boards and the media or still has scars from his less than brilliant tenure in Cleveland.

Preacher
10-27-2007, 09:43 PM
We will agree to disagree on this - I agree it is a non-issue as to what happened last week. By Arians feeling it necessary to explain a situation for which he has been taking heat five days after a loss he elected to keep the issue alive, .

Personally... I would like to hear the entire interview. I could very easily imagine a question such as, "Why were there so many run pass plays last week?"

Answer, " Ben Roethlisberger had to audible pass plays because the Broncos were overloading their defensive front to stop the run."

Next Question "But shouldn't you or Ben have ran more running plays anyways?"

Answer, "To me, the flanker screen is a run, that's a long handoff,"

The context will mean everything... and given the chance to trust the team, or the press on context.. I NEVER TRUST THE PRESS.

But yeah, I think that it is a non-issue, just a question asked, and answered honestly.

SteelDogFan
10-28-2007, 11:58 AM
No matter who changed the plays the fact the the Steelers passed the ball, what was it, thirteen out of fifteen plays is not good. A tone was set for the D-line to pin their ears back because the team was going to pass first. This snowballed into Ben being rushed and sacked all game long. weather the running game is working or not the Steelers always establish a ground game tone so that the defense has to keep loinebackers at home. This causes the play-action to work better or be more effective.

I know its not that bad but I think someone on the Steelers coaching staff needs to say establish the ground game or ground game identity first and foremost. We do not have the Pats or the Colts offense but are trying to operate like them Pass to set up the run. When the Steelers are built to run to set up the pass.

Each time I watch the pre-game shows or Playbook on the NFL Network this is the quote. "I look for the Steelers to get back and do what they do best and thats run the football." But then they come out and pass 13 out of 15 first plays.

Don't mean to seem negative but even though we are 4-2 after watching the NFL replay of the game almost twice on NFL network and knowing we have the Ravens twice and the Pats I hope the offense gets going or that could be 3 losses. The Steelers have not faced a D like those yet and we lost to the Cards and the Broncos two games we all thought they would win.

Just a concerned Steelers fan, not a griper.

MasterOfPuppets
10-28-2007, 12:31 PM
here's the funny part about this.....if we win that game, this thread and debate doesn't exsist. arians and ben gets a pat on the back for a job well done, and the new topic is , why 11 of parkers 21 carries were for 1 yd or less!!!

revefsreleets
10-28-2007, 05:34 PM
This is all very interesting. The audibles to short screens and passes to outlets or players in the flat is basically what a West Coast Offense is predicated upon. Arians calling those plays "just like runs" is exactly right. I'm guessing maybe he was hoping for Ben to throw the ball downfield? I don't know. I don't care, either. No matter what, there was a glaring lack of execution across the board last week.

Preacher
10-28-2007, 09:05 PM
When the Steelers are built to run to set up the pass.




Ok... So that means we ALWAYS be run first? That is like saying we should ALWAYS be a 3-4 because that is what we have now.

I don't agree with that logic. If it is felt we need to go to a pass first game, then do it now, see what we have, and draft for it later on.

I am not saying we should or should not, it is just that I disagree with the logic.

Haiku_Dirtt
10-28-2007, 09:14 PM
No matter what, there was a glaring lack of execution across the board last week.

And in Ben's case perhaps over-execution.

DACEB
10-29-2007, 08:27 AM
We just have to force teams out of those 8 man front.

We have to work on exploiting 8 man fronts.

This is the fact of the matter!!

We need to get teams to respect our passing game, or at least the threat of it.

I don't understand why we don't spread the formation out when teams do this. I thought that was the purpose of Carey Davis starting over Krieder, his versatility. Even with a 2 WR, 1TE and 2 back set they can spread out to 4 wide leaving a RB in the backfield. Is'nt this what was talked about and what we all invisioned for Arians offense.

I won't speculate as to whether Arians was throwing Ben under the bus. I will say that at this point in the season there is still a lot of room for improvement. Ben still has work to do to get on the same page with Arians offensive scheme. Considering this is the first year under this system, and reworking the offensive line, I think they are performing well.

steelpride12
10-29-2007, 10:19 AM
O-Line and like said before 8 man rush seems to be our problem. We need our o-line to play its best every game and Ben to recognize the Blitz and exploit it with an audible to a quick slant or out pattern!

GeneralRobinson
10-29-2007, 10:23 AM
O-Line and like said before 8 man rush seems to be our problem. We need our o-line to play its best every game and Ben to recognize the Blitz and exploit it with an audible to a quick slant or out pattern!

I was watching Ben's post-game press conference and he even admitted that he needs to improve on quickly throwing to the hot read as opposed to relying on his scrambling.

Edman
10-29-2007, 10:46 AM
Ben tends to hold onto the ball for too long. He has to get the ball out and quickly to beat the blitz. Next Monday is a big test for Ben against Baltimore's D. The Rats will no doubt try the same crap last year when they hammered the Steelers twice. Time to see what Ben has as a QB and how much he's improved.

BurghZ0n3
10-29-2007, 12:10 PM
I still recall how glad Brian Billick humiliating us...even at our own backyard :jawdrop:!!! Now, its' PAYBACK time...:banging::banging::banging:

tony hipchest
10-29-2007, 06:21 PM
So did Ben audible that first drive down the field to start the game? For some reason IMO if that was the case Ben would have shared that information:smile: Now Ben can learn what it is like to have someone dump play calling issues on him.
.no way dan. i think youre crazy. :wink02: what ever are you talking about?

Comments on the running game tonight?

?The running game was unbelievable tonight, and that credit goes to the offensive line. They opened up running lanes. [B]We audibled in good situations, and we made plays. Willie Parker found ways to get yardage. When Willie is running the way he did today, it makes things easy for all of us.?



http://news.steelers.com/article/83608/