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Steeldude
11-11-2007, 04:24 PM
who is the special teams' coach? that is the kind of kickoff/punt return coverage you see in pee wee football. the entire steelers' team bottlenecks each time. have they ever heard of containment?

the steelers were very lucky today.

The Duke
11-11-2007, 04:31 PM
bob ligasheky?

something has to be done soon or we'll lose games cause our ST sucks

SteelCurtain
11-11-2007, 04:33 PM
the special teams coverage was horrendous today...they definitely need to get this problem fixed immediately. Not to pick on Reed too much because i know he is just a kicker, but c'mon man you can do a better job of trying tackle the returner than that....

xXTheSteelKingsXx
11-11-2007, 04:36 PM
Also wondering why cant Reed boot the ball any further than he does. I know I've seen him kick it into the endzone before.

RunWillieRun
11-11-2007, 04:37 PM
Also wondering why cant Reed boot the ball any further than he does. I know I've seen him kick it into the endzone before.



He must have stopped taking his HGH....:sofunny:

But seriously he was booting it much better earlier this year

Borski
11-11-2007, 04:41 PM
well you couldn't ask for much better from him when he got it at the one, ST shoulda stopped them at the 5-10 yard line but instead they ran it back through our craptastic ST coverage for a TD

fansince'76
11-11-2007, 04:42 PM
What is really disconcerting is all the emphasis they have supposedly been placing on STs this year. :dang:

Steeldude
11-11-2007, 04:46 PM
Also wondering why cant Reed boot the ball any further than he does. I know I've seen him kick it into the endzone before.

i believe he was told after the first long return to kick them short.

the two returns were 90 and 100 yards.

jjpro11
11-11-2007, 04:48 PM
im still dumbfounded that they got that 100 yard return when he should have been knocked out at the 5. unbelievable. cribbs just has our number.

Steelers
11-11-2007, 04:49 PM
There were definitely times in that game where I would've directed them to kick it out of bounds. Cribbs was crazy.

FastWillieParker39
11-11-2007, 04:54 PM
As Tomlin put it best today and with emphasis "our kickoff coverage stinks!"

RoethlisBURGHer
11-11-2007, 04:55 PM
Cribbs had returns of 90 and 100 yards, that isn't the fault of Reed, that's just poor coverage.

jjpro11
11-11-2007, 05:09 PM
Cribbs had returns of 90 and 100 yards, that isn't the fault of Reed, that's just poor coverage.

exactly. reed kicked very effectively after the first long cribbs return. he placed the ball perfectly so that there wouldnt be a return. the 100 yard cribbs return was a great kick with pitiful coverage.

klick81
11-11-2007, 05:36 PM
i believe he was told after the first long return to kick them short.

the two returns were 90 and 100 yards.

I agree...he must have been instructed to keep the ball away from that a-hole.

BlastFurnace
11-11-2007, 05:37 PM
Is there anyone...playing soccer...Australian Rules football...CFL....Arena League...that we can sign that can kick the ball through the end zone every single time???????

Anyone? I'm desparate and I'm not afraid to admit it.

BozMan
11-11-2007, 05:43 PM
Another special teams play that almost cost the Steelers the game: Sepulveda's last punt. Steelers had the ball deep in their own territory and needed to get a few first downs to kill the clock and end the game. Instead, the Browns hold the Steelers to 3 and out (which is another subject). Sepulveda then punts it right down the middle of the field directly to the return man. WTF???

Browns got decent field position after that return, but a killer holding penalty bailed the Steelers out. Even then, the Steelers were left hoping that Dawson would miss a 52-yard FG.

Bottom line is that awful special teams play almost the Steelers the game.

If this continues, should Tomlin fire both special teams coaches? Should starters see more time on ST?

SteelCurtain
11-11-2007, 05:46 PM
Sepulveda then punts it right down the middle of the field directly to the return man. WTF???

Browns got decent field position after that return, but a killer holding penalty bailed the Steelers out.

That was ridiculous...they should have punted the ball out of bounds.

HometownGal
11-11-2007, 05:47 PM
I agree...he must have been instructed to keep the ball away from that a-hole.

I think the Steelers mindset was that they would rather have the Browns start their series from the 30-35 yard line than risk Cribbs breaking loose, which he ultimately did anyway. It pissed me off to no end on that kickoff where Reed squibbed it perfectly, the ball bounced back towards the EZ, Cribbs picked it up and took off with it and at least 5 Steelers blew tackles on him. :dang::dang: ST's is our achilles heel - more so than the OL this season.

ExtonSteelFan
11-11-2007, 06:05 PM
Ligashesky (I think) came from St. Louis. They didn't have very good special teams play either so I naturally questioned this move. Alot of other fans here did too I think.

With that said, I don't know how this is going to be fixed overnight. On the other hand, Cribbs is a VERY good return man so that had to be a part of it too.

Michael Keller
11-11-2007, 06:59 PM
This real seroius guys. Tomlin is doing a great job. BUT he now needs to MICRO MANAGE. player by player , This Steelers is very special (bad choice of words) but we dodge a bullet today and this game should not have been this close.

I look for consistency, or lack of and Kick Off Coverage special team play has been consistently bad to terribible. We can not begiving our opponet the ball after a kick off even on their 40 , thus 60 yards to score a TD. Certainly can"t be allowing them to pentrate into our side of the 50.

If this were the paly offs I would suggest putting some of defensive starters on the kick off coverage, Mcfadden looked anywhere from terrible to stupid on the touch down kick off return. He ran backwards about 40 yards never attempting to make a tackle. Clearly he does not know what he is doing. I personally think Tomlin needs to take over the special teams coaching. There is too much at stake. Brian Billick fired his offensive coordinator last year . Why not ? This is acompetive business and it does not preclude firing coaches in the middle of the season.

The Steelers are a Super Bowl contender when you cast all the Bull Shit aside. Some body better get on the News.

steelpride12
11-11-2007, 07:06 PM
I can't say our special teams sucks, but Cribbs is a probowl returner and is the only guy this year who returned a kickoff for a touchdown, but after today mabey it is something that may need some work!

Rhee Rhee
11-11-2007, 07:30 PM
i think special teams reflects desire and depth... we obviously had no desire by the starters who looked as if they wanted nothing to do with special teams and this game showed how bad our backups are at wrapping up ball carriers if we lose more than one or two guys on Defense we're F***ed!!!

X-Terminator
11-11-2007, 07:51 PM
And things do not get any easier for the ST next week - they will face Leon Washington, who already has 2 90+ yard kickoff return TDs this season.

Keep kicking it high and short, Jeff!

HometownGal
11-11-2007, 07:54 PM
I can't say our special teams sucks

I can. Our STs suck.

That is all.

The Duke
11-11-2007, 07:56 PM
And things do not get any easier for the ST next week - they will face Leon Washington, who already has 2 90+ yard kickoff return TDs this season.

Keep kicking it high and short, Jeff!

So Darrelle Revis is not returning kicks for the jets? That would be sick, that team has 2 very explosive returners. too bad their O and D sucks :flap:

steel striker
11-11-2007, 08:16 PM
You know through the years our special teams have sucked and, I will still never forget the 2001 afc championship against the pats. two kick returns for touchdowns today almost reminded me of that. I hope we can get this fixed and, I know Tomlin will address this so we will see what happens. Again thank god for Ben and, his playing making. Also big props for the defense in the second half they really turned the game around. I agree with Keller it looked like Mcfadden put a poor effort in that kick coverage. Well I'm just gald we got the win today and, it was a big one because now we are 4-0 in the division and on our way now.

BozMan
11-11-2007, 08:30 PM
You know through the years our special teams have sucked and, I will still never forget the 2001 afc championship against the pats. two kick returns for touchdowns today almost reminded me of that.

I had the same flashbacks too. We won't go very far in the playoffs with ST play like this.

SCrowe
11-11-2007, 08:33 PM
bob ligasheky?

something has to be done soon or we'll lose games cause our ST sucks

it would be nice to have an explosive returner like Cribbs...he's a threat to break it everytime he touches the ball. Rossum's age is showing.

fansince'76
11-11-2007, 08:35 PM
it would be nice to have an explosive returner like Cribbs...he's a threat to break it everytime he touches the ball. Rossum's age is showing.

At least Rossum hangs on to it.

SCrowe
11-11-2007, 08:39 PM
At least Rossum hangs on to it.

Shows how poor the special teams are when you're satisfied with only with that.

fansince'76
11-11-2007, 08:41 PM
Shows how poor the special teams are when you're satisfied with only with that.

The STs suck out loud, no argument here. But they were even worse last year.

Atlanta Dan
11-11-2007, 08:43 PM
At least Rossum hangs on to it.

And little else

If we are not going to use Reid, cut him and bring back Chidi! - that will solve all ST problems:smile:

klick81
11-11-2007, 08:45 PM
I do think Rossum fumbled on a punt return today-didn't he?

SCrowe
11-11-2007, 08:48 PM
when's the last year that Steeler special teams were halfway decent? when Bobby April was around back in '95?

Steel_Bus_24
11-11-2007, 08:56 PM
Our STs suck something awful, we arn't going anywhere with that type of play

Hopefully though Tomlin will chew some ass and get it to at least a mediocre level.....though Tomlin needs to fix his own tard decisions on challenges

fansince'76
11-11-2007, 08:58 PM
Our STs suck something awful, we arn't going anywhere with that type of play

Hopefully though Tomlin will chew some ass and get it to at least a mediocre level.....though Tomlin needs to fix his own tard decisions on challenges

At least he didn't piss away 2 TOs like Crennel did.

Atlanta Dan
11-11-2007, 09:04 PM
At least he didn't piss away 2 TOs like Crennel did.


Yeah - Romeo tried to lay the TO to decide whether to challenge Miller's catch (which wasted another TO) on the players, who were having none of it

In the Pittsburgh locker room, the Steelers were dumbfounded by a fourth-quarter sequence that cost the Browns two timeouts. It happened with 3:13 to play and the Steelers having taken a 30-28 lead, pending the extra point, on Heath Miller's 2-yard touchdown catch. Although the catch seemed clear both live and on the initial replay, the Browns called a timeout to consider challenging the call.

In other words, the Browns willingly burned one timeout to contemplate risking a second timeout on a challenge. Which is exactly what happened. Crennel challenged the call, and when replays confirmed the call -- touchdown -- the Browns were out a second timeout.

"I thought it was weird to use two timeouts," Miller said. "I don't know why they would do that."

Nobody knows. In the Cleveland locker room, several seething Browns refused to discuss Crennel's clock mismanagement. They'll be angrier in the coming hours when they realize Crennel basically blamed the whole screw-up on them, saying, "I'm not exactly sure what happened -- (the first) timeout was called on the field. ... Some guys on the field felt we needed to challenge."

Crennel paradoxically tried to take the blame after that, saying, "Put it on me." But by then it was too late. He had already put it on his players. I talked to three different Browns defenders who were on the field for Miller's touchdown, and none of them knew which player, if any player, called the timeout. Defensive tackle Shaun Smith pinned the responsibility to his coach.

"That's not my decision," he said of the timeout and the challenge. "You'll have to ask the coach. I don't call any timeouts."



http://www.sportsline.com/nfl/story/10467396

At least Tomlin only burns one TO on worthless challenges to calls that will not be overturned.

MasterOfPuppets
11-11-2007, 09:24 PM
romeo took the first timeout to look at restaurant menu's

Steel_Bus_24
11-11-2007, 09:30 PM
romeo took the first timeout to look at restaurant menu's

Yeah he probably ordered a Roethlisburger:sofunny:

Lord Stiller
11-11-2007, 09:37 PM
Clint Kriedwalt strikes again

Every big return you see Clint screwing up

I wouldnt be surprised if he gets cut tomorrow

How the hell is he a captain???

Am I the only one that sees this?

He already cost us the Arizona game

Lord Stiller
11-11-2007, 09:42 PM
Clint Kriedwalt strikes again

Every big return you see Clint screwing up

I wouldnt be surprised if he gets cut tomorrow

How the hell is he a captain???

Am I the only one that sees this?

He already cost us the Arizona game

By the way, for those of you that dont really pay attention that much, Kriedwalt was the one that was too much of a ***** to push Cribbs out of bounds. And he is the one that missed an easy tackle in the Zona game that Beaston returned to beat us

CUT KRIEDWALT, SEND A MESSAGE TOMLIN!!!!!

jjpro11
11-11-2007, 09:42 PM
you cant blame tomlin for challenging that cribbs run. it was a huge play and usually the kind that wins teams games with the momentum shift... it was an inch away from it being wiped clean. it looked like his foot could have possibly planted on the grass and slid ever so slightly over the sideline... but it was clear after the numerous replays that he never stepped out of bounds and the call was right.

SCrowe
11-11-2007, 10:01 PM
you cant blame tomlin for challenging that cribbs run. it was a huge play and usually the kind that wins teams games with the momentum shift... it was an inch away from it being wiped clean. it looked like his foot could have possibly planted on the grass and slid ever so slightly over the sideline... but it was clear after the numerous replays that he never stepped out of bounds and the call was right.

where were the "eyes in the sky" who watch the replays and advise Tomlin to challenge it or not? obviously they were asleep at the wheel this time around and deserve the blame for a failed challenge that cost the Steelers a timeout.

verks36
11-11-2007, 10:11 PM
well you couldn't ask for much better from him when he got it at the one, ST shoulda stopped them at the 5-10 yard line but instead they ran it back through our craptastic ST coverage for a TD

ya you cant get better than the kick that stopped on the 1 yard line. That is as good as it gets i dont think we can blame reed for that one.

I dont think containment was the problem either because he didnt really get outside on us i thinks it was just tackling and letting him just get by us because we were flying down the field to fast.

Lord Stiller
11-11-2007, 10:27 PM
ya you cant get better than the kick that stopped on the 1 yard line. That is as good as it gets i dont think we can blame reed for that one.

I dont think containment was the problem either because he didnt really get outside on us i thinks it was just tackling and letting him just get by us because we were flying down the field to fast.

HELLO???

I just pin-pointed the problem = CLINT KRIEDWALT

BozMan
11-11-2007, 10:29 PM
HELLO???

I just pin-pointed the problem = CLINT KRIEDWALT

Wasn't it Andre Frazier that had the best shot and whiffed?

Atlanta Dan
11-11-2007, 10:35 PM
HELLO???

I just pin-pointed the problem = CLINT KRIEDWALT

Several weeks ago it was Coclough who was the problem - any thought it might be the coaching?

As for cutting the latest perp, Coclough being cut may have been due to issues other than blowing kick coverages according to the Trib-Review:

If you believe the Steelers released Colclough and took a $3 million hit stricly because of his special teams play, there's some beachfront property on the South Side you should consider buying.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_537356.html

jjpro11
11-11-2007, 11:02 PM
Several weeks ago it was Coclough who was the problem - any thought it might be the coaching?

As for cutting the latest perp, Coclough being cut may have been due to issues other than blowing kick coverages according to the Trib-Review:

If you believe the Steelers released Colclough and took a $3 million hit stricly because of his special teams play, there's some beachfront property on the South Side you should consider buying.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_537356.html

son of a bitch.. i didnt realize we lost 3 mil for that. how much of a difference would have made if we cut him after the season.

stlrtruck
11-11-2007, 11:48 PM
Don't we have two ST coaches? Maybe that's the problem, too many coaches for one subject matter!

An assistant ST coach Amos

rbryan
11-11-2007, 11:59 PM
Rossum looked slow today, as somebody mentioned, at least he holds on to the ball so I don't have a problem with his returns, but he has no business on the coverage team. Check the replays, he was one of the main culprits on both kick returns.

jjpro11
11-12-2007, 12:07 AM
Rossum looked slow today, as somebody mentioned, at least he holds on to the ball so I don't have a problem with his returns, but he has no business on the coverage team. Check the replays, he was one of the main culprits on both kick returns.

he definitely does not know how to tackle. keep him on both return teams.. but i wish we could find a replacement for kick coverage. i dont remember him making a tackle all season.

verks36
11-12-2007, 12:30 AM
the good thing is specials teams is one of the areas in football where its not that hard to fix.

It is all about the fundamentals- good tackling, and staying in the lanes

I wouldnt mind that much if the coverage team slowed down a little bit while going down the field which would result in a couple more yards but would prevent them from flying by the guy with the ball

I am sick of saying these guys fly down the field and zooming right past the returner

rbryan
11-12-2007, 01:19 AM
I swear the Browns return a kick against us every game. I still think we need to find a guy that can kick the ball out of the endzone every time even if it means giving up a roster spot for a 3rd kicker. How much would it be worth to never give up a KO return again?? My guess is that its worth a lot more than the production we get from whoever the 53rd man on the roster is right now.

jjpro11
11-12-2007, 01:32 AM
I swear the Browns return a kick against us every game. I still think we need to find a guy that can kick the ball out of the endzone every time even if it means giving up a roster spot for a 3rd kicker. How much would it be worth to never give up a KO return again?? My guess is that its worth a lot more than the production we get from whoever the 53rd man on the roster is right now.

i wonder if they have ever tried sepulveda at kickoffs in practice.

rbryan
11-12-2007, 01:42 AM
I'm guessing that Sepulveda can't kick it out of the endzone either or he'd already have the job. I'm thinking if such a humanoid even exists he isn't going to be good for anything else but kick offs.

jjpro11
11-12-2007, 01:47 AM
I'm guessing that Sepulveda can't kick it out of the endzone either or he'd already have the job. I'm thinking if such a humanoid even exists he isn't going to be good for anything else but kick offs.

i use him for kickoffs in madden, so it was worth a suggestion. :toofunny:

rbryan
11-12-2007, 01:50 AM
In Madden, Kreider is good for 5 yards everytime you give it to him too. lol

I don't know what happened to Reed, he was kicking a lot deeper in the beginning of the season. Maybe Sepulveda is worth a try.

Galax Steeler
11-12-2007, 05:04 AM
I can't understand what is wrong with our special teams we need to work on them real hard this week or we will end up loosing a game because of it.

Michael Keller
11-12-2007, 05:49 AM
Another special teams play that almost cost the Steelers the game: Sepulveda's last punt. Steelers had the ball deep in their own territory and needed to get a few first downs to kill the clock and end the game. Instead, the Browns hold the Steelers to 3 and out (which is another subject). Sepulveda then punts it right down the middle of the field directly to the return man. WTF???

Browns got decent field position after that return, but a killer holding penalty bailed the Steelers out. Even then, the Steelers were left hoping that Dawson would miss a 52-yard FG.

Bottom line is that awful special teams play almost the Steelers the game.

If this continues, should Tomlin fire both special teams coaches? Should starters see more time on ST?

The answer to both of your questions is an emphatic YES.

There is absolutely no excuse for the special teams play being as pitiful as it is. It is not fair to the other players and not to the fans . Farrier has already voluntered to play special teams. I am disgusted with the ST play, especially the kick off coverage. This Steeler team has the potential to go all the way. IF ST play causes us to lose in the play off I am going to be one pissed off loyal fan . I remember when Mark Malone who was a terrible QB for the Steelers was playing so bad that a fan drove a car into the structure of Three Rivers Stadium to let out his frustration and anger. We might see a reenactment of this display of protest over ST play.

THIS NEEDS TO CHANGE , Fire a few players and perhaps one of the coaches if not both. Billick fired his offensive coordinator last year and the Ravens offense improved in the second half of the season. It can be done. Tomlin 's statement "our kick off coverage stinks " is a strong statement of his frustration. Do not be surpriised is something significant happens this week. I hope so. .

Lord Stiller
11-12-2007, 07:43 AM
Wasn't it Andre Frazier that had the best shot and whiffed?

Yeah my bad, along with about 5 others

The first big return, McFadden screwed up and then Clint missed a tackle

Edman
11-12-2007, 08:00 AM
Problem with the special teams?

Poor Tackling and overrunning the play too much. The Steelers missed several easy tackles on both Cribbs returns. Again, the fundamentals. Time for Tomlin to practice what he preaches. Time for improvement on the Special Teams. Their hiccups accounted for 14 easy Clowns Points.

Jman
11-12-2007, 08:06 AM
What is really disconcerting is all the emphasis they have supposedly been placing on STs this year. :dang:

This is probably the most disappointing thing for me...That so much emphasis was placed on improving STs...

Now granted, they did go out and get Allen Rossum for returns, and he has been pretty good...But the coverage has to improve...

Atlanta Dan
11-12-2007, 08:15 AM
the good thing is specials teams is one of the areas in football where its not that hard to fix.

Maybe so, but the Steelers have spent most of the last 15 years (except when Bobby April was ST coach until he could not take Cowher any more and left) attempting to make that fix:dang:

Atlanta Dan
11-12-2007, 08:16 AM
In Madden, Kreider is good for 5 yards everytime you give it to him too. lol

I don't know what happened to Reed, he was kicking a lot deeper in the beginning of the season..

DEA raided his HGH supplier?

Atlanta Dan
11-12-2007, 08:17 AM
i cant believe nobody else here observes what happens on kick returns

It is more than individual players - it is a systems breakdown

Lord Stiller
11-12-2007, 08:31 AM
http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d8041be2f

The first big return, Cribbs turns McFadden inside out and Clint misses a tackle

The second return for a TD makes me sick (wasting a perfect kick by Reed getting a squib kick to stop at the goal line)

GeneralRobinson
11-12-2007, 09:50 AM
"Shooting a hostage" will probably only work once (referring to Colclough). If that doesn't get a team's attention, then the issues are probably a little deeper. I don't recall the circumstances of Cribbs' first long return in the 2nd quarter, but the TD return had nothing to do with bad special teams coaching. New England constantly uses starting defensive players on ST (Bruschi, Vrabel). I like the accountability being shown by Pittsburgh's defensive players regarding coverage, and, while I'm not sure if that's the solution, it would not surprise me if the coaches employed them on ST. Big picture-wise, I think we're still a year or so away from turning around this unit.

Lord Stiller
11-12-2007, 10:01 AM
I just hate the fact that we have this supposed Special Teams Ace or specialist who is our captain and he sucks

Tomlin did a good job weeding out the worthless players that Cowher always kept (Sean Morey, Matt Cushing) but Clint is the last one remaining