PDA

View Full Version : Ah, Steeler fan stupidity after a loss. Right on schedule.


Edman
11-18-2007, 08:06 PM
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=68#s=68&f=1897&t=1454975

Nothing else needs to be said. Today was an all-around poor performance by the Steelers. The first bad performance in weeks, but this is no excuse.

revefsreleets
11-18-2007, 08:09 PM
There is nothing stupid about recognizing fatal flaws. Our OL is horrible. We've won in spite of it, not because of it. We were out-coached today. If the Jets had more quality players they would have pounded us soundly. And we have lost to three awful teams on the road. That's just a fact.

To say 9-7 is just knee-jerk, but frustration runs rampant when you lose to inferior competition, and why shouldn't it?

Sharkissle29
11-18-2007, 10:31 PM
i dont agree whats on that board, but that just fans speaking there opinion. you're allowed to be critical of your own team, steeler fans just tend to over-react because we are such diehards. oh well, lets get them next week

HometownGal
11-18-2007, 10:37 PM
i dont agree whats on that board, but that just fans speaking there opinion. you're allowed to be critical of your own team, steeler fans just tend to over-react because we are such diehards. oh well, lets get them next week

That isn't being a diehard, St33lers. More like being fair-weathered like some of the people around here. More spoiled brats who didn't suffer through the 80's because they weren't yet a twinkle in their Daddy's eye.

Steel_Bus_24
11-18-2007, 10:44 PM
sure you would like to move on, and not think much of it( as I did for the Arizona, and Denver losses).......but when you lose 3 games now to lower competition on the road you have to assume we have some major problems.

I'm really at a loss for words when I look at this team, because I'm so confused by them. Why in the hell is it so hard for them to beat the teams they're supposed too on the road??I just don't get it, especially for a team that became road warriors to win a SB.

Steelfan4ever
11-18-2007, 10:51 PM
I'm really at a loss for words when I look at this team, because I'm so confused by them. Why in the hell is it so hard for them to beat the teams they're supposed too on the road??I just don't get it, especially for a team that became road warriors to win a SB.


AMEN brother!!!!

HometownGal
11-18-2007, 10:52 PM
I'm really at a loss for words when I look at this team, because I'm so confused by them. Why in the hell is it so hard for them to beat the teams they're supposed too on the road??I just don't get it, especially for a team that became road warriors to win a SB.

Not the same cast of characters.

fansince'76
11-18-2007, 10:54 PM
Not the same cast of characters.

Yep, and I VIVIDLY recall people bitching that year when we were 7-5 - "we're never gonna make the postseason." There is still a LOT of football to be played, folks.

SteelCityMan786
11-18-2007, 10:57 PM
That isn't being a diehard, St33lers. More like being fair-weathered like some of the people around here. More spoiled brats who didn't suffer through the 80's because they weren't yet a twinkle in their Daddy's eye.

Yeah I am amazed how they could consider themselves as Die Hard.

No, I didn't put up with the 80's (Especially since I wasn't alive) but I have put up with my share of losing years. In fact the first year of the 16 now 17 seasons that I was alive for yet, don't remember as well when Coach Noll was still around was a LOSING SEASON.

I wish more of those who grew up with the winning age that started back up in the 90's DESPITE there only being one super bowl would learn to appreciate living through good years while they last and standing by the team in the bad years.

Steel_Bus_24
11-18-2007, 10:59 PM
Not the same cast of characters.


No we are still largely intact from the players side of things. Our coaching staff has seen some shakeup

X-Terminator
11-18-2007, 11:04 PM
I wish more of those who grew up with the winning age that started back up in the 90's DESPITE there only being one super bowl would learn to appreciate living through good years while they last and standing by the team in the bad years.

Not going to happen, because a great deal of fans today, much like society itself, are all about instant gratification and "what have you done for me lately."

fansince'76
11-18-2007, 11:05 PM
No we are still largely intact from the players side of things. Our coaching staff has seen some shakeup

It's still not the same team.

HometownGal
11-18-2007, 11:07 PM
It's still not the same team.

You're scaring me - - - quit being right, will ya?. :wink02:

SteelCityMan786
11-18-2007, 11:22 PM
Not going to happen, because a great deal of fans today, much like society itself, are all about instant gratification and "what have you done for me lately."

Unfortunately XT, that is correct.

Steel_Bus_24
11-18-2007, 11:24 PM
It's still not the same team.

so you don't think we have any of the qualities left from that team to gut out games on the road-they just left with Bettis and Cowher???

silver2000svt
11-18-2007, 11:41 PM
http://mbd.scout.com/mb.aspx?s=68#s=68&f=1897&t=1454975

Nothing else needs to be said. Today was an all-around poor performance by the Steelers. The first bad performance in weeks, but this is no excuse.

Umm, the Clowns game was an awful performance too

fansince'76
11-18-2007, 11:47 PM
Umm, the Clowns game was an awful performance too

Umm, why'd they win, then?

HometownGal
11-18-2007, 11:47 PM
Umm, the Clowns game was an awful performance too

Wow - who pi$$ed in your Cheerios today? Don't you have anything positive to say about anything? :dang:

silver2000svt
11-18-2007, 11:49 PM
You guys honestly think we played well against the Clowns... Wow, I guess maybe I should lower my standards... Did we win, hell yes... Did we do somethings well, hell yes... Did we play that well, hell no...

fansince'76
11-18-2007, 11:52 PM
You guys honestly think we played well against the Clowns... Wow, I guess maybe I should lower my standards... Did we win, hell yes... Did we do somethings well, hell yes... Did we play that well, hell no...

The 1st half was horrible, but considering that the Browns didn't get a first down in the second half until very late in the 4th, we made up a two-score deficit with big plays, I thought we played fairly well in the 2nd half.

Preacher
11-18-2007, 11:52 PM
The issue is not who is or is not on our team this year compared to two years ago.

The issue is...

1. We don't have the center we had to anchor the offense. Mahan has done well, but he isn't what we are used to.

2. Simmons, Faneca, and Smith are all two years older... and it is showing.

3. We are no longer run first, run always, we need a more well-rounded line... not one that can just run block.

Expect our first 2 picks and a FA to come in and challenge the O line positions this coming spring.

However... We made it to 7-3 with this line... Lets ride it out and see how far it WILL take us.

fansince'76
11-19-2007, 08:31 AM
SHUT UP already. If everyone suffers thru the 80s with HTG, maybe she can stop telling all of us that we are bad fans. I grew up in Black and Gold footsie PJs in the 70s, and I love MY Steelers to death, but I know when they are not playing well and am not affraid to say so. Nobody really gives crap if you feel like seeing them lose many times in the 80s is a good reason to accept mediocrity, but my standards are and will always be extremely high.

That post wasn't addressed to you, was it? Who said she's accepting mediocrity? Interestingly enough, HTG also isn't one of the ones saying "Super Bowl or bust" after a win, either. Some folks need to gain a proper perspective of things and not throw the team under the bus and declare the season an unmitigated disaster after one loss. Last year - THAT was a disaster. You'd be the one better advised to shut it.

fansince'76
11-19-2007, 08:33 AM
DO you honestly think the Browns game was a good preformance? Yes, we won, maybe that's why we lost today. We played BAD in the browns game.

In the second half, YES. Sorry I'm not quite ready to throw the team, the FO, the coaching staff and the family dog under the bus after one loss. A lot of people around here need to heed the words of John Wooden: "Keep your head at the peaks, and the valleys will be more tolerable." In other words, don't get too up after a win, and don't get too down after a loss. Chill out.

HometownGal
11-19-2007, 08:40 AM
SHUT UP already. If everyone suffers thru the 80s with HTG, maybe she can stop telling all of us that we are bad fans. I grew up in Black and Gold footsie PJs in the 70s, and I love MY Steelers to death, but I know when they are not playing well and am not affraid to say so. Nobody really gives crap if you feel like seeing them lose many times in the 80s is a good reason to accept mediocrity, but my standards are and will always be extremely high.

Who the HELL do you think you are to tell me to shut up, Mr. Negativity? 99% of your posts on this board are filled with condescending negativity and putting people down when they don't agree with your almighty opinion. I am entitled to my opinion just as much as you are and what I saw on this board last night after the team's 3rd loss in 10 games sickened me.

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 08:55 AM
SHUT UP already. If everyone suffers thru the 80s with HTG, maybe she can stop telling all of us that we are bad fans. I grew up in Black and Gold footsie PJs in the 70s, and I love MY Steelers to death, but I know when they are not playing well and am not affraid to say so. Nobody really gives crap if you feel like seeing them lose many times in the 80s is a good reason to accept mediocrity, but my standards are and will always be extremely high.

What the HELL is your freaking problem? First of all, she is entitled to her opinion, just like you are. Second of all, her post wasn't even talking about you! Is your reading comprehension THAT nonexistant? If you can't get the point from reading her post, perhaps you want to go up a few posts and read MINE for proper context, and then come back and tell her to shut up.

I swear to God, if you get this fscking worked up over a FREAKING FOOTBALL GAME, then you need to get your priorities in order. This was TOTALLY uncalled for!

Providence Steel
11-19-2007, 09:25 AM
I think we are having a good season but we've played some bad games too. We are first in our division and will probably make the playoffs. We have problems, every team but the Patriots does. If the Pats weren't in the league, I think a lot of us would be a little more relaxed. The Steelers are a good team this year but we aren't the best at this point and I think that is what bugs us the most. I think in our hearts, we all know that we aren't going to the SB even though there is a small chance we will. The reality that we have a lot of problems so late in the season and no ability to fix them is a harsh pill to swallow.

There are lots of good things though...
Ben is playing extremely well under a LOT of pressure.

Willie Parker might not have his footing right now but he hasn't fumbled in a LONG time. That is definitely something that the coaches fixed this year (and I cant believe the did!).

Holmes was obviously a great pick. He is going to get better too.

Tight Ends are playing brilliantly.

Pass coverage is much better.

James Harrison.

I'm just as pissed as anyone about yesterday but it's definitely better than last year. If we can take care of the Bengals, Ravens and Dolphins then we should take a deep breath and enjoy the playoffs. Those sound like realistic goals.

Maybe a loss like this galvanizes the Steelers to commit to excellence...just like the Super Bowl season.

HometownGal
11-19-2007, 09:40 AM
I think we are having a good season but we've played some bad games too. We are first in our division and will probably make the playoffs. We have problems, every team but the Patriots does. If the Pats weren't in the league, I think a lot of us would be a little more relaxed. The Steelers are a good team this year but we aren't the best at this point and I think that is what bugs us the most. I think in our hearts, we all know that we aren't going to the SB even though there is a small chance we will. The reality that we have a lot of problems so late in the season and no ability to fix them is a harsh pill to swallow.

There are lots of good things though...
Ben is playing extremely well under a LOT of pressure.

Willie Parker might not have his footing right now but he hasn't fumbled in a LONG time. That is definitely something that the coaches fixed this year (and I cant believe the did!).

Holmes was obviously a great pick. He is going to get better too.

Tight Ends are playing brilliantly.

Pass coverage is much better.

James Harrison.

I'm just as pissed as anyone about yesterday but it's definitely better than last year. If we can take care of the Bengals, Ravens and Dolphins then we should take a deep breath and enjoy the playoffs. Those sound like realistic goals.

Maybe a loss like this galvanizes the Steelers to commit to excellence...just like the Super Bowl season.

Excellent post Prov! :cheers: It is great to see someone else with a positive 'tude around here. Yes - I was disappointed in the team's overall performance yesterday, but I've already put it behind me and am looking ahead to our matchup against the Fins. I'm not going to dwell on the loss and I'm sure Tomlin isn't going to allow the team to do that either. Our ST's looked a little better yesterday but did give up the big return which contributed to sealing our fate, so obviously the few changes Tomlin made were somewhat effective. I have no doubt he will be busting the OL's chops this week in practice and studying film like mad to at the very least band-aid the problems on the OL until they can be addressed in FA and the draft.

Michael Keller
11-19-2007, 09:52 AM
I must admit I am baffled. The Great Steeler teams lost games but you could analyze their loss , understand it and accept it and know your team would be back next game and would perform as you expected. Maybe once a year the old team would lose a game it should not have lost.

This inconsistency bothers me. I am concerned now that when the Steelers play well they are playing better than they truly are. I say this not as a pessemist but I am really bothered by how TERRIBLE the special teams' perform and the ineptude of the offensive line. I am not deluding myself, the special teams are very bad and I was hoping the offensive line would get better as the season progressed. That has not happened.

I hate to say it but "repairing ' these two areas may be an off season endeavor.

This Pittsburgh Steeler team from game to game is Exhilerating to-Flat, Dominant to Porous. Explosive to Desperate but always, always TERRIBLE on special teams.

jjpro11
11-19-2007, 10:20 AM
I must admit I am baffled. The Great Steeler teams lost games but you could analyze their loss , understand it and accept it and know your team would be back next game and would perform as you expected. Maybe once a year the old team would lose a game it should not have lost.

This inconsistency bothers me. I am concerned now that when the Steelers play well they are playing better than they truly are. I say this not as a pessemist but I am really bothered by how TERRIBLE the special teams' perform and the ineptude of the offensive line. I am not deluding myself, the special teams are very bad and I was hoping the offensive line would get better as the season progressed. That has not happened.

I hate to say it but "repairing ' these two areas may be an off season endeavor.

This Pittsburgh Steeler team from game to game is Exhilerating to-Flat, Dominant to Porous. Explosive to Desperate but always, always TERRIBLE on special teams.

we would have 2 more shutouts if it wasnt for special teams. the bills only score was from a big return, although it should have been reviewed and overturned, but whatever.. and the ravens return led to the mcgahee td.

revefsreleets
11-19-2007, 10:41 AM
I've been a little too negative, too. Let me say this: Our defense is still pretty damned good. The tackling sucked yesterday, but that can be remedied.

I still think this team is capable of putting together a little run and finishing 12-4 or 11-5, but they have GOT to solve the OL problem.

moedap
11-19-2007, 11:17 AM
That isn't being a diehard, St33lers. More like being fair-weathered like some of the people around here. More spoiled brats who didn't suffer through the 80's because they weren't yet a twinkle in their Daddy's eye.

Hometown Gal were u around in the 70's. I am an older fan who was spoiled by the performance of the team in the 70's. And I dont know about u but I suffered in the 80's, 90's and the 00's until 2005-06. I dont want to be satisfied with regular season success. I dont want to be that fan who remembers the futility of the 80's and because so is happy just b/c we make the playoffs. I want to see a Pittsburgh Steelers team perform up to their abilities game in and game out and when I dont see it I am going to BOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

So yesterdays performance gets a BOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

But its GO STEELERS!!!!! for life.

Atlanta Dan
11-19-2007, 11:26 AM
It is hard not to be negative after such a bad loss, but I agree with prior posters that it is not as if all hope for the playoffs has been lost.

11-5 should get the division title (surely the Browns are not going to run the table:jawdrop:) in which case that gets a home game + Indy rather than New Engand after that. Even a wild card game win at Cleveland or San Diego is not improbable.

But I agree that is assuming the OL does not continue in free fall - Cleveland & the Jets have 2 of the worst pass rushes in the league but have looked like the 85 Bears against the Steelers.

PalmerSteel
11-19-2007, 11:35 AM
yesterday they were no better than the dolphins or rams. absolutely pathetic. people have a right to complain about them. maybe over the top on some, but whatever. who cares? if it bothers you that much then dont read it and dont reply to it. same problems as in 05: underperforms at times as a team, poor offensive line play, and special teams. that year turned out alright, but it will almost be impossible to catch that lightning in a bottle twice, especially the way the pats are dominating. but with most of the same cast of characters from that year still on the team, ya just never know. we have problems that can be fixed THIS season.

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 11:39 AM
Hometown Gal were u around in the 70's. I am an older fan who was spoiled by the performance of the team in the 70's. And I dont know about u but I suffered in the 80's, 90's and the 00's until 2005-06. I dont want to be satisfied with regular season success. I dont want to be that fan who remembers the futility of the 80's and because so is happy just b/c we make the playoffs. I want to see a Pittsburgh Steelers team perform up to their abilities game in and game out and when I dont see it I am going to BOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!

So yesterdays performance gets a BOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!

But its GO STEELERS!!!!! for life.

To answer your first question - HTG was around in the 60s when the Steelers were still playing in Pitt Stadium and stinking out the joint week in and week out. She sat through the 1-win season in Chuck Noll's first year as HC in 1969. So when she says she's sat through the bad times, she isn't bullshitting.

Hey, if you want to be a fan who settles for nothing less than winning the SB, that is your right. There's nothing wrong with criticism when they don't perform either, so long as it's constructive and not destructive. And I think you already know my stance, as well as HTG's stance, on booing your own team. But it's also MY right to tell you that you can't win the SB every year. It simply does not happen, and any fan who feels that way is simply spoiled and out of touch with reality.

steelermuzik
11-19-2007, 11:52 AM
"YES. Sorry I'm not quite ready to throw the team, the FO, the coaching staff and the family dog under the bus after one loss. A lot of people around here need to heed the words of John Wooden: "Keep your head at the peaks, and the valleys will be more tolerable." In other words, don't get too up after a win, and don't get too down after a loss. Chill out."

I completely agree. I also seem to recall that most fans believed the Steelers would do not much better than 9-7 or 10-6 this year. The fact that we are in position to go 12-4 or even 11-5 and make the playoffs still looks pretty good to me.

As for the reason this post was started: the fact some fans are wanting to throw Tomlin under the bus for being 'underwhelming' just baffles me. The team has 'underwhelmed' since the SB win, and I hardly think that's because of Tomlin considering he wasn't the coach last year.

We need to remember that going into the season, we all beleived this would be a transition year with all the new coaching staff. I think Tomlin's done a great job with the situation he's been brought into and will fix the problems in the years to come, since this is not the last chance the Steelers have of going back to the Superbowl. And I personally have enjoyed the 7 wins we've already gotten and look forward to seeing how 'the men' react to Tomlin's whooping this week and return the favor to the 'Fins! :cheers:

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 11:59 AM
As for the reason this post was started: the fact some fans are wanting to throw Tomlin under the bus for being 'underwhelming' just baffles me. The team has 'underwhelmed' since the SB win, and I hardly think that's because of Tomlin considering he wasn't the coach last year.

Why does this baffle you? It doesn't surprise me in the least, because Steelers fans have no patience. The only thing that surprises me is that it took this long before some of the "faithful" wanted to throw him under the bus.

BlastFurnace
11-19-2007, 12:26 PM
SHUT UP already. If everyone suffers thru the 80s with HTG, maybe she can stop telling all of us that we are bad fans. I grew up in Black and Gold footsie PJs in the 70s, and I love MY Steelers to death, but I know when they are not playing well and am not affraid to say so. Nobody really gives crap if you feel like seeing them lose many times in the 80s is a good reason to accept mediocrity, but my standards are and will always be extremely high.

That is exactly right. I've been a fan since 1975 and suffered through the 80's like many others.

I don't see how anyone is a bad fan because they recognize that this team is soft emotionally and doesn't come to play every week.

Too many fans want so desparately to say that we are on equal footing with the Patriots when quite simply....we can't carry their jock. They come hungry every week and destroy teams they should destroy. We...on the other hand...keep them in the game.

I want a team like the Patriots that crushes everyone. I'm sick and tired of seeing my favorite team get bullied and crushed by a 1-8 team in the trenches.

No one will ever tell me that I'm not a "good" fan because I rip this team when it deserves it. I've followed this team as closely as anyone on this board for over 30 years and when something stinks...atleast I can admit it.

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 12:35 PM
That is exactly right. I've been a fan since 1975 and suffered through the 80's like many others.

I don't see how anyone is a bad fan because they recognize that this team is soft emotionally and doesn't come to play every week.

Too many fans want so desparately to say that we are on equal footing with the Patriots when quite simply....we can't carry their jock. They come hungry every week and destroy teams they should destroy. We...on the other hand...keep them in the game.

I want a team like the Patriots that crushes everyone. I'm sick and tired of seeing my favorite team get bullied and crushed by a 1-8 team in the trenches.

No one will ever tell me that I'm not a "good" fan because I rip this team when it deserves it. I've followed this team as closely as anyone on this board for over 30 years and when something stinks...atleast I can admit it.

So do you agree with him being so ignorant to her about it when it wasn't warranted? Especially when the post in question wasn't even addressed to him or anyone else in particular?

moedap
11-19-2007, 12:36 PM
To answer your first question - HTG was around in the 60s when the Steelers were still playing in Pitt Stadium and stinking out the joint week in and week out. She sat through the 1-win season in Chuck Noll's first year as HC in 1969. So when she says she's sat through the bad times, she isn't bullshitting.

Hey, if you want to be a fan who settles for nothing less than winning the SB, that is your right. There's nothing wrong with criticism when they don't perform either, so long as it's constructive and not destructive. And I think you already know my stance, as well as HTG's stance, on booing your own team. But it's also MY right to tell you that you can't win the SB every year. It simply does not happen, and any fan who feels that way is simply spoiled and out of touch with reality.

Darn, the 60's that was bad times. I guess it is silly to expect a SB everyyear but it isnt fairweather to express disappoitment and frustration. Fairweather fans will root for other teams. Plus for those of us who dont live in Pittsburgh and talk Steelers smack the backlash is very uncomfortable.

BlastFurnace
11-19-2007, 12:42 PM
So do you agree with him being so ignorant to her about it when it wasn't warranted? Especially when the post in question wasn't even addressed to him or anyone else in particular?

I never agree with personal attacks. It's unwarranted.

What he is trying to say is that too many of us are listed as not true fans because we notice things and are critical of them. I refuse to sweep things under the rug and act like they don't happen....especially when it is a definite pattern.

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 12:45 PM
Darn, the 60's that was bad times. I guess it is silly to expect a SB everyyear but it isnt fairweather to express disappoitment and frustration. Fairweather fans will root for other teams. Plus for those of us who dont live in Pittsburgh and talk Steelers smack the backlash is very uncomfortable.

No, it isn't fairweather to express disappointment and frustration. It's how you go about that disappointment and frustration that is the key. If you simply point out what's wrong with the team and criticize some of the decisions made, that's perfectly fine. If you expected a better performance (I certainly did), and are upset that they didn't perform the way you expected, that's fine too. But when some fans get on here and say "We S-U-C-K," want to throw everyone under the bus and feel like the season's over when we're still 7-3 and atop our division by 2 games (we hold the tiebreaker over Cleveland), that's where we have a problem. I and others have tried to explain this time and time again, but it continually gets misunderstood.

Counselor
11-19-2007, 12:46 PM
How quickly we all forget. At the begining of the year, we would have been thrilled with 10-6 and lauded Tomlin as the "second coming" of Noll. Now we're sitting at 7-3----we only have to go .500 from here to see 10-6---- and you would think the coaching staff (or the o-line) killed our puppy.

Are there problems? or course there are---I think we knew that last year, and we knew it in preseason---they've just been masked by great play in other areas.

Yesterday, the Jets had a great game plan and the Steelers we're ready for it. end of story. I'm as mad about this loss as anyone, but the comments on that other board are ridiculous in the extreme.

The emotional highs and lows of the fan base get a bit dramatic. All I heard before this game was how we're going to creme the jets all the team needs to so is show up. Same things I heard before Denver. I realize fans don't effect the outcome of the game, but you know as well as I do that the attitude of the fan base and media is heard by the players too (they live here---they can't help but hear it)---I believe it can have an effect. Anyone who's played sports knows that if someone (or everyone!) tells you something often enough, you believe it.

this is the NFL and you can't take anyone lightly---but the fact is, it wasn't a killer loss. We'll probably still win the division---so what if we're the 3rd or 4th seed----we're going to have to through Foxborough anyway, and we don't play well off of bye weeks anyway.

Everyone can be mad about this loss, and constructive criticism is appreciated by all of us, but the ignorance expressed on that other board, (and at times here) is counterproductive.

Michael Keller
11-19-2007, 12:51 PM
The issue is not who is or is not on our team this year compared to two years ago.

The issue is...

1. We don't have the center we had to anchor the offense. Mahan has done well, but he isn't what we are used to.

2. Simmons, Faneca, and Smith are all two years older... and it is showing.

3. We are no longer run first, run always, we need a more well-rounded line... not one that can just run block.

Expect our first 2 picks and a FA to come in and challenge the O line positions this coming spring.

However... We made it to 7-3 with this line... Lets ride it out and see how far it WILL take us.


Preacher:

I think you have it right in your brief analysis. Add the lack of experience or perhaps ability (too early to know) of Colon. That the problem with the O line.

Michael Keller
11-19-2007, 01:14 PM
No, it isn't fairweather to express disappointment and frustration. It's how you go about that disappointment and frustration that is the key. If you simply point out what's wrong with the team and criticize some of the decisions made, that's perfectly fine. If you expected a better performance (I certainly did), and are upset that they didn't perform the way you expected, that's fine too. But when some fans get on here and say "We S-U-C-K," want to throw everyone under the bus and feel like the season's over when we're still 7-3 and atop our division by 2 games (we hold the tiebreaker over Cleveland), that's where we have a problem. I and others have tried to explain this time and time again, but it continually gets misunderstood.

X Terminator

Reading your responses I have come to respecxt your clarity and objectivity. Thus I want to ask you. Is this team lacking EMOTIONAL FIRE on the field ? In your mind is it even important?

Let me name a few prototypes.

Joe Greene-You did what he said or else

Jack lambert-Thank you Cliff Harris for the pat on the head and much more from Dracula

Greg LLoyd-Total assasin

Kevin Green-Off the chart in enthusiasm

Jerome Bettis-pounding of the chest and letting you know he is coming back to hit you again . Great role model in the locker romm

Joey Porter-Crazy motor mouth who drew the line and made every game an alley fight.


and then there where none. 2007. I do not see it. Ben's political rendition thanking every body in the universe IN FRONT OF THE MEDIA is politically correct but IN THE HUDDLE in my mind or even ON THE SIDELINES he better start asserting himself. He is nor running for student body president he is running for his life out there.

Summary point . I do not see on the field fire and brimstone and I think it is a big part of the problem.

Atlanta Dan
11-19-2007, 01:26 PM
The issue is not who is or is not on our team this year compared to two years ago.

The issue is...

1. We don't have the center we had to anchor the offense. Mahan has done well, but he isn't what we are used to.

2. Simmons, Faneca, and Smith are all two years older... and it is showing.

3. We are no longer run first, run always, we need a more well-rounded line... not one that can just run block. .

I agree Faneca is on the downslope of his career but Simmons and Smith should be in their primes.

I think you hit it with center no longer being a rock (although Hartings had been slipping for several years) and that this line does not have the blocking skills for the current backfield's talents.

But one other point (which is not intended to be Ben bashing) is that I understand Ben is making the line calls this year. With this talent i do not think it makes a big diffeence, but the fact the Browns and Jets have run wild teh last 2 weeks may indicate some new looks are being dispalyed to which the Steelers are not adjusting.

Atlanta Dan
11-19-2007, 01:36 PM
How quickly we all forget. At the begining of the year, we would have been thrilled with 10-6 and lauded Tomlin as the "second coming" of Noll. Now we're sitting at 7-3----we only have to go .500 from here to see 10-6---- and you would think the coaching staff (or the o-line) killed our puppy.

We'll probably still win the division---so what if we're the 3rd or 4th seed----we're going to have to through Foxborough anyway, and we don't play well off of bye weeks anyway.
.

Good post:thumbsup:

One minor point is that the Browns win yesterday is a little scary - they have that team of destiny look and very well may finish no worse than 11-5. That leaves little margin for error after the highly probable Pats loss for further losses if the Steelers are to get a home rather than road first round playoff game.

In a way, if this team was even better it would be a more frustrating season since New England is like a machine - most recent SB winers would be 7-10 point underdogs to the Pats. They are the best team I have seen since the early to mid-1990s pre-FA era Cowboys & 49ers and teams that might be SB worthy in other years probably will be road kill in Foxboro in January. That point is not intended to worship the Pats but to emphasize that I need to get some persepctive and look at this season & a probable playoff berth as a starting point and not an ending to the Ssteelers future success under Tomlin & Ben.

Haiku_Dirtt
11-19-2007, 01:45 PM
To say 9-7 is just knee-jerk, but frustration runs rampant when you lose to inferior competition, and why shouldn't it?

I thought we would go 7-9 before the season started. So 9-7 is not a disappointment to me.

What sets the Jets loss in a different category is that our o-line actually regressed at the point in the schedule where we needed to see some improvement or at least neutrality. :hunch:

Neither. And they regressed against a team that had no business dominating. WTF is going to happen against a defense like Jacksonville.

Steeler fan REALITY not stupidity...:coffee:

wadester47
11-19-2007, 02:15 PM
this is terrrible but I don't think , yes we will loose again . I still believe that the pats will stumble and that the steelers will preveail .

13-3
Happy Thanksgiving everybody!!!

X-Terminator
11-19-2007, 02:18 PM
X Terminator

Reading your responses I have come to respecxt your clarity and objectivity. Thus I want to ask you. Is this team lacking EMOTIONAL FIRE on the field ? In your mind is it even important?

Let me name a few prototypes.

Joe Greene-You did what he said or else

Jack lambert-Thank you Cliff Harris for the pat on the head and much more from Dracula

Greg LLoyd-Total assasin

Kevin Green-Off the chart in enthusiasm

Jerome Bettis-pounding of the chest and letting you know he is coming back to hit you again . Great role model in the locker romm

Joey Porter-Crazy motor mouth who drew the line and made every game an alley fight.


and then there where none. 2007. I do not see it. Ben's political rendition thanking every body in the universe IN FRONT OF THE MEDIA is politically correct but IN THE HUDDLE in my mind or even ON THE SIDELINES he better start asserting himself. He is nor running for student body president he is running for his life out there.

Summary point . I do not see on the field fire and brimstone and I think it is a big part of the problem.

Thank you for the props, Michael!

It seems to me that ever since Tomlin took over as HC, he has wanted to take a more business-like approach to games, and as you know, a team most often takes on the persona of its HC. So that may be why you don't see the same type of "fire and brimstone" leadership that we were used to seeing over the years under Noll and Cowher. I don't have a problem with that - it helps to keep players at an even keel, not too up when you win, and not too down when you lose. If you're going to do that, however, then it helps to have guys who aren't afraid to take players to task when they are underperforming, and you have to approach every game as if you have something to prove. The Patriots this season, as much as I hate to give that classless POS franchise any credit, is doing the best job I have ever seen at this. They never take anyone for granted, and they are always hungry, which in turn keeps them focused on the task at hand.

As for Ben asserting himself more, I completely agree that he needs to do that more often. His OL is going to get him seriously hurt with the way they have been playing since training camp, and he needs to start calling them out for it. But he seems to be worried about his media image and doesn't want to be perceived as not being a team player, so he just goes about his business, takes blame for losses, gives the OL credit for wins, and so forth. Moreover, I think he's still a little intimidated by Alan Faneca and doesn't want to piss him off, even though he's got one foot out the door already. I say screw that - Faneca has said he's leaving, so why should Ben care how he feels? The OL has stunk and Faneca has been a part of the problem. Plus let's face it - the second Ben gets pissed and starts yelling at the OL, the local media and the fans will be all over him for it. That's just the nature of the beast when you don the black and gold.

I do, however, think there is one guy on the team who can be that fiery leader that they lack, and that's Anthony Smith. Once he gets his feet wet and takes over for Ryan Clark, you will see a lot of that come into focus even more than it has already.

Dodt
11-19-2007, 02:22 PM
i'll start to panic if this continues into next season , the next couple of weeks were up against teams that have to prove there worth (well except new england they just want to run it up.) yeah we should of won this game (but each of the loses could have been won by one play.) a lose is only terrible if you learn nothing from it.

Steel_Bus_24
11-19-2007, 03:18 PM
Well we are definitely going to see what this team is made of here in the next few weeks, we are either going to crumble or dominate...I think this in between crap is done with now and we will see the real Steelers from here on out, albeit good or bad

Dino 6 Rings
11-19-2007, 03:37 PM
Let me just say, that I am disgusted with our playing down to the competition. Of coarse we are better than the Jets, the Broncos and the Cardinals, we just weren't "up" for the games. That's something that must be addressed, hopefully, the Coach put himself in "The News" this week and will address the problem with playing down. Our wins, we dominate, our losses, are just misses, its a coaching thing and an attitude thing that needs to be fixed.

Losing to the Jets...that's just sad. Sad Sad Sad. As for my predictions about the future of this team, any fan who does not believe we are fully capable of winning it all should stop posting and go be a browns fan. I believe, the talent we have is good enough to win it all and the coaching is good enough to win it all, when it all clicks and it all works and it all comes together, this team is truly awesome. When we snooze through a week's preparation and think that the other team isn't getting paid to play too, that's when we lose.

So buck up, get out there and REFUSE to be the team the dolphins get their first win against. Nothing else matters except beating the Dolphins. That's The Bottom Line.

fansince'76
11-19-2007, 03:48 PM
I am entitled to my opinion and I stated it.

More spoiled brats who didn't suffer through the 80's because they weren't yet a twinkle in their Daddy's eye.

Sounds to me to be addresses to anyone who reads it. This is posted in a public forum right?

I'm not worked up at all, but all of sudden you are. It seems I have offended the great SF power structure by not blowing flower up HTGs butt.

Telling someone else to "shut up," kinda indicates they're not entitled to theirs. Wrong answer. And no, that's not how I would take it if I read it, especially since she was responding directly to the following statement of another poster:

steeler fans just tend to over-react because we are such diehards. oh well, lets get them next week

HTG is not jumping anybody for criticizing the team for a bad game. She is criticizing those who take the "sky is falling" chicken little stance after one loss. Did what she write hit a little too close to home maybe?

Atlanta Dan
11-19-2007, 03:51 PM
Thank you for the props, Michael!

It seems to me that ever since Tomlin took over as HC, he has wanted to take a more business-like approach to games, and as you know, a team most often takes on the persona of its HC. So that may be why you don't see the same type of "fire and brimstone" leadership that we were used to seeing over the years under Noll and Cowher.

I actually see Tomlin as a return to Noll's demeanor of winning through preparation
rather than emotion ("making Wednesday as important as Sunday"). Noll was notorious for not being rah-rah (except before the 1974 AFC Championship when he busted on Madden for saying the 2 best teams were the Dolphins and Raiders) and once telling a holdover from the losing years to STFU when the player gave an emotional halftime speech. One aspect of that is Tomlin repeatedly referring to players as "men."

Part of what may have ticked off Tomlin yesterday was that he is treating the players like men and they mail in a performance like that.

IMO Faneca, Ward and Farrior are the emotional leaders (as other posters have said I think Ben will step up only after Faneca leaves and Anthony Smith is too young ) but they were groomed under Cowher and could always count on Cowher to help light the fire.

It is a team in transition and a first year coach is still learning on the job - no shame in that.

Dino 6 Rings
11-19-2007, 03:55 PM
I have a feeling, that Tomlin is the kind of "snap" coach. Calm Calm Calm, until this game..."SNAP" and he is going to do a little yelling this week. Sux to be the Dolphins...I smell a beat down coming for the Fish.

Penalties and Special Team lapses reflect on coaching, and Tomlin will Not want to have his fellow coaches seeing faults with him. He realizes that many people are watching to see how he does in his first year, I'm sure he is absolutely embarressed about Yesterday's game. As are all of us in Steelers Nation.

HometownGal
11-19-2007, 03:56 PM
Just a poster who is tired of you coming to all these threads telling the rest of us we are not good fans because of this that or the other.


Find um prove it with facts.I rarely post anything negative about the team. I am eternally level , not up and down. When I see a bad performance or a bad team I call it what it is and the same for good/great and excellent.

And I'll continue to call out those, including YOU, who act like spoiled little children stomping your feet and throwing tantrums because the team you claim to support isn't perfect, has an off game, or God forbid - doesn't get into the playoffs or the Super Bowl every year. :jawdrop: So you keep on keepin' on there NC and I'll do the same. :wink02:

Y'know - I'm real pis sed off at Bill Cowher and the Rooneys right now for the successful precedent they set which has caused some of you to expect greatness and glory every season come hell or high water. :dang::wink02::wink02:

HometownGal
11-19-2007, 03:59 PM
It seems I have offended the great SF power structure by not blowing flower up HTGs butt.

It seems as if you may need a time out there, pal. That statement was ignorant and totally uncalled for.

Dino 6 Rings
11-19-2007, 04:04 PM
Lets get things straight...for any of us that are really fans...

San Diego at Pittsburgh, AFC Title game...Odonell drops back...incomplete in the endzone...SD goes to the Superbowl

Dallas vs Pittsburgh, Odonell drops back, interception, 2nd of the game...steelers lose the big one.

Pittsburgh at Denver, Kordell drops back, interception, fumble...

New E at Pittsburgh, AFC Title game, Bledsoe comes in Special Teams fail, Steelers lose...

New at Pittsbugh, Ben drops back throws to Tuman, NO! Interception, NE defeat the Steelers and go on to their 3rd Superbowl...

For Everytime I've had my heart broken by the Steelers or by other teams defeating the Steelers, I come back every year and believe, in my heart, that we will be good enough to win it all. And until the final whistle of the season, I will put all my faith into the hope they are going to go all the way. Regardless of crappy games or slow starts or injuries or whatever...I believe...I always Have...and I ALWAYS WILL

The Duke
11-19-2007, 04:05 PM
loses seem to bring the worst out of steelers fans

why can't everyone just smile? :smile: I mean, we lost, but hey we're at the top of the AFC North, and the bungles still suck, and the ratbirds are going downhill, and anthony smith hits like an animal. :tt02:

Dino 6 Rings
11-19-2007, 04:08 PM
I have the Steelers Superbowl Video from 2 years ago. It shows all those heart breaks before it gets into the 05 season. I make sure to watch them, to remember, to remember what its like to lose, what its like to have your heart ripped out and hopes dashed. And that fuels my faith, and feeds my passion, and inspires me to believe that My Team...The Pittsburgh Steelers, will always rise from the ashes and will always have a chance to be there in the end, and for good or bad, I will rise with them and I will cheer them on, buy their gear, scream my bloody head off until I see Them hold up another trophy or walk off the field with tears in their eyes.

The Jets Loss Hurts....But I've Felt Worse...BRING IT ON

HERE WE GO STEELERS
HERE WE GO!!!

Dino 6 Rings
11-19-2007, 04:09 PM
HERE WE GO STEELERS
HERE WE GO!!!

Preacher
11-19-2007, 04:10 PM
I agree Faneca is on the downslope of his career but Simmons and Smith should be in their primes.

I think you hit it with center no longer being a rock (although Hartings had been slipping for several years) and that this line does not have the blocking skills for the current backfield's talents.

But one other point (which is not intended to be Ben bashing) is that I understand Ben is making the line calls this year. With this talent i do not think it makes a big diffeence, but the fact the Browns and Jets have run wild teh last 2 weeks may indicate some new looks are being dispalyed to which the Steelers are not adjusting.


Let's call a spade a spade... Ben isn't picking up the new looks yet and calling them out.

That's fine. He is just doing this for the first time. Mistakes will be made. Everyone has a learning curve. However, what confuses me then, is that we played brilliantly against the Ravens, and they are masters of that defense. Why was Ben able to call that out?

There just seems to be a conglomeration of small issues that together, create horrible results when it comes to a head. It seems to need three ingredients.

1. Ben not picking up the schemes and calling the right blocking schemes.

2. The offensive line not being able to out muscle and move the defense

3. The defense being able to hide what their intentions are.

If two of the three are there, we still win the game. However, if all three issues come to a head at the same time, we end up losing, or eeking out a victory.

SO what gets done about it? Probably nothing much this year. Ben is maturing... and playing great. Just let the natural maturation process continue. Address the O line in the offseason... and the last, well... Ben seems to be really spending a lot of time watching tape. Maybe we need to have the oline do a bit more as well!

Providence Steel
11-19-2007, 11:28 PM
If New England wasn't so damn great this year, we'd be looking at this loss as a hiccup toward the playoffs. Even the great teams of the 70s suffered losses, albeit, more explainable losses, in their drive for the SB. I guess that is what is so great about football...

We could run the table and win the rest of the games, we could run the table and loose the rest of the games. There is a lot of football left and a playoff appearance in Tomlin's first year would be quite spectacular. I can't believe my optimism!

Preacher
11-20-2007, 03:33 AM
If New England wasn't so damn great this year, we'd be looking at this loss as a hiccup toward the playoffs. Even the great teams of the 70s suffered losses, albeit, more explainable losses, in their drive for the SB. I guess that is what is so great about football...

We could run the table and win the rest of the games, we could run the table and loose the rest of the games. There is a lot of football left and a playoff appearance in Tomlin's first year would be quite spectacular. I can't believe my optimism!

Funny... I don't think many of us can either! :hunch: