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View Full Version : Arians and LeBeau stay!!


The Duke
01-09-2008, 01:06 AM
Bruce Arians will be back for his second year as offensive coordinator after Tomlin promoted him from wide receivers coach under Bill Cowher a year ago

Dick LeBeau will return as defensive coordinator in 2008, which will be his 36th season as an assistant or head coach in the NFL.

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08009/847735-66.stm

Now, can we finally stop with the "Fire Arians" threads. he's staying whether anybody likes it or not

Good to see Dick one more season, he's not getting any younger, but he sure loves the team. here's to many more future hall of famer :cheers:

ShutDown24
01-09-2008, 01:14 AM
Well. I guess we will all just have to get used to a RUN - RUN - PASS offense with a 'FADE' based goaline package...

Great to see LeBeau stay.

Preacher
01-09-2008, 01:14 AM
Excellent.

Now let's fix the problems.. fire the Special teams coach... and get going into the future!

MACH1
01-09-2008, 01:30 AM
Excellent.

Now let's fix the problems.. fire the Special teams coach... and get going into the future!

Might want to get a new 0-line coach too. Bad play all year long across the whole line, can't blame it all on the players it was bad coaching also.

jjpro11
01-09-2008, 01:35 AM
now just get rid of the special teams coach and the oline coach.

Preacher
01-09-2008, 01:37 AM
Might want to get a new 0-line coach too. Bad play all year long across the whole line, can't blame it all on the players it was bad coaching also.

Yeah... throw him in there too!

CASTEEL
01-09-2008, 02:11 AM
http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08009/847735-66.stm

Now, can we finally stop with the "Fire Arians" threads. he's staying whether anybody likes it or not...

That might stop the 'Fire Arians' threads, but it won't stop the complaining.... I think we all know that... :wink02:

I'm happy to see Coach D stay, for sure.....

Haiku_Dirtt
01-09-2008, 02:11 AM
Might want to get a new 0-line coach too. Bad play all year long across the whole line, can't blame it all on the players it was bad coaching also.

Honestly folks. Vince Lombardi couldn't have taken this team to the Super Bowl.

If we can't blame it all on the players then we have to blame who put the players on the roster. And the guy most responsible for about 90% of this roster is Bill Cowher. And BC is as responsible for Colon as he is Holmes.

Blaming the new guy is like being blamed for your newlywed's teenage kid being in rehab. Rather than fingering pointing we should be pissed at Tomlin for not sabotaging the season earlier so we could pick higher in the draft. That would make more sense.

Like I said, we were never going to the Super Bowl this year.

MACH1
01-09-2008, 02:22 AM
Honestly folks. Vince Lombardi couldn't have taken this team to the Super Bowl.

If we can't blame it all on the players then we have to blame who put the players on the roster. And the guy most responsible for about 90% of this roster is Bill Cowher. And BC is as responsible for Colon as he is Holmes.

Blaming the new guy is like being blamed for your newlywed's teenage kid being in rehab. Rather than fingering pointing we should be pissed at Tomlin for not sabotaging the season earlier so we could pick higher in the draft. That would make more sense.

Like I said, we were never going to the Super Bowl this year.

Lombardi wouldn't of put up with the piss poor coaching or play either. As far as Cowher goes the players were all good enough in 2005. Blaming him for our problems now is a bit of a stretch don't ya think.

CASTEEL
01-09-2008, 02:30 AM
Blaming him for our problems now is a bit of a stretch don't ya think.
Nahh... not too much of a stretch....

This team was down after the SB - that was Cowher's fault. This team is two years older... and not NEAR the running team that they were in '05 -in fact, while many names are the same - I wouldn't dare say this team was the same team that won the SB.

I'm not going to say it's all Cowher - but Coach T did inherit some crap....

...just my tuppence...

Haiku_Dirtt
01-09-2008, 03:02 AM
Lombardi wouldn't of put up with the piss poor coaching or play either. As far as Cowher goes the players were all good enough in 2005. Blaming him for our problems now is a bit of a stretch don't ya think.

For the record...My expectations have been exceeded this year.

Lombardi might contemplate suicide before having to pander to this generation. I'm fairly young compared to Vince and I feel that way.

But actually my point is that there should be no blame. Cowher gave us a Super Bowl and the subsequent fallout. Thanks Bill. I'll take that.

The reciprocal is equally if not a greater stretch because Tomlin was only dealt a hand. Blaming the current coaches for Cowher's fallout is ridiculous considering Tomlin won the AFC North with basically the same team.

What I want is for Colbert and the scouting department to be well financed to fix one of the biggest problems in recent Steeler history. A VACANT offensive line. Not weak. VACANT.

Da Steeler Soprano
01-09-2008, 03:55 AM
Can we start a fire Tomlin thread yet?

CASTEEL
01-09-2008, 04:03 AM
Can we start a fire Tomlin thread yet?
LOL

Galax Steeler
01-09-2008, 04:52 AM
Good to see lebeau staying with the players we have coming in it should be a good deffense next year.

WVSteeler
01-09-2008, 06:23 AM
I like Lebeau staying but I am not sold on Arians, Special Teams and O-line coaches should probably be shown the door.

Bill
01-09-2008, 06:43 AM
Excellent.

Now let's fix the problems.. fire the Special teams coach... and get going into the future!
How can you say sticking with LeBeau is going into the future? One of the biggest problem on this team is the lack of consistent pressure on the QB. The only pressure comes from exotic blitzes. When good teams pick up the blitz, it leaves wide open receivers. The key to the Steelers' success is QB pressure from the defensive line, which is not happening now. This will lead to turnovers, good field position, and more opportunities for the offense.

I hope Tomlin forces LeBeau to start putting in more of the 4-3. LeBeau must go - it's time to stop feeling so sentimental and put the best defensive scheme on the field. The 3-4, with the weak defensive lineman we have right now, is not the best idea for the Steelers.

steelpride12
01-09-2008, 07:01 AM
Well im happy Bruce is staying and i hope his play calling can be greatly improved next season, and with Dick back i can't wait to see our #1 defense back on the field ready to kick some a$$!

Rick5895
01-09-2008, 07:15 AM
I don't think the problem with Arians was his ability to coachb but his play calling, my issue has always been that the Steelers offensively never play to win, just not to lose. He's back and I am sure he will correct his mistakes. I glad LeBeau is back.
Definately special teams must be addressed, we have sucked at that for too long. The O-Line coach may not be the best but what did he have to work with, Mahan was terrible and to be honest should be gone, NOT moved to guard like I have read, and there were injuries. I am sure we will be fine next season if we draft for depth, We need a top O Lineman, dline depth and depth at RB, in my opinion anyway.
Cant wait for the draft, lol

DACEB
01-09-2008, 07:29 AM
How can you say sticking with LeBeau is going into the future? One of the biggest problem on this team is the lack of consistent pressure on the QB. The only pressure comes from exotic blitzes. When good teams pick up the blitz, it leaves wide open receivers. The key to the Steelers' success is QB pressure from the defensive line, which is not happening now. This will lead to turnovers, good field position, and more opportunities for the offense.

I hope Tomlin forces LeBeau to start putting in more of the 4-3. LeBeau must go - it's time to stop feeling so sentimental and put the best defensive scheme on the field. The 3-4, with the weak defensive lineman we have right now, is not the best idea for the Steelers.

Because he is a great defensive coordinator and we still have 3-4 personell. How does it hurt the future at all for Tomlin to collaborate with one of the best defensive minds of the past two decades?!

BTW, I'm extremely happy to see both coordinators back. There's no denying that Ben made a huge jump this season. IMO, his work with Arians and Anderson helped him alot. This was Bens first season calling audibles and protections, the playbook was minimized to an extent early on, things can only get better next year. If you couple that with a better running game (more consistent) and better O-line play, the sky is the limit.

I'm with everyone else on a new O-line and STs coach.

HometownGal
01-09-2008, 07:32 AM
Might want to get a new 0-line coach too. Bad play all year long across the whole line, can't blame it all on the players it was bad coaching also.

I'd give Zierlien one more season with an overhauled line and a healthy Marvel Smith.

Ligashesky needs to go.

As for Arians and Lebeau staying - I couldn't be happier! :banana::thumbsup:

fansince'76
01-09-2008, 08:18 AM
I hope Tomlin forces LeBeau to start putting in more of the 4-3. LeBeau must go - it's time to stop feeling so sentimental and put the best defensive scheme on the field. The 3-4, with the weak defensive lineman we have right now, is not the best idea for the Steelers.

Ah, but a switch to the 4-3, which would place even more emphasis on the play of those "weak defensive linemen" is needed. Whatever.

Atlanta Dan
01-09-2008, 08:48 AM
Announcing the coordinators are returning while remining silent on the status of the other coaches hopefully indicates the ST coach may not be retained.

Retaining Arians and LeBeau hopefully will allow for better insights as to how to retool the OL and figure out what went wrong with the D (it was more than injuries to Clark & Aaron Smith) the second half of the season before the draft and FA signings - having a new coordinator (presumably from outside the organization) get up to speed on personnel and Tomlin's preferences would require time better in deciding how (to use the phrase of Haggans agent) to rebuild as the "old Steelers" model drifts away.

revefsreleets
01-09-2008, 09:14 AM
Very good points. There is a ton of value to retaining key staff. We can start working on fixes instead of ground-up work. We'll have consistency in the front office from one year to the next, and that's a rare thing from an organization that has been perennially successful. It seems we used to lose at least one coordinator every year.

There's no need for me to say anything about either Arians or LeBeau, other than I'm positive time will prove me right.

Lord Stiller
01-09-2008, 09:19 AM
I'm very happy Lebeau is coming back and also Arians I guess.

Consistency goes a long way in the NFL. Remember when Cowher kept changing O-coordinators every year, it was always a disaster

Hopefully Tomlin and Arians learned not to play like vaginas at the end of a game and instead to go for the win

TackleMeBen
01-09-2008, 09:33 AM
Remember when Cowher kept changing O-coordinators every year, it was always a disaster

just ask coach nolan how that is going?? they just hired another one..lol

Michael Keller
01-09-2008, 09:39 AM
I don't think the problem with Arians was his ability to coachb but his play calling, my issue has always been that the Steelers offensively never play to win, just not to lose. He's back and I am sure he will correct his mistakes. I glad LeBeau is back.
Definately special teams must be addressed, we have sucked at that for too long. The O-Line coach may not be the best but what did he have to work with, Mahan was terrible and to be honest should be gone, NOT moved to guard like I have read, and there were injuries. I am sure we will be fine next season if we draft for depth, We need a top O Lineman, dline depth and depth at RB, in my opinion anyway.
Cant wait for the draft, lol

Rick: i read your post and responed "now hereis some one who I totally agree with on every point made . Then I see that you are in fact a coach. Makes sense.

I think Bruce has done somethings very well. Especially that he and Ben apparently relate well together.

But;; can Bruce improve his "play calling accumen" on the sidelines? ?

Choices :
1- Bruce goes to the booth and removes himself from the potential distractions of being -on the sidelines? He concentrate more on play calling and Anderson works with Ben on the sidelines.

2-Tomlin , who is obviouslly very intelligent, but on the other hand might not be a quick thinker, gets involved more in the offense and play calling . Personally I think he needs to be involved in the game more. Either in the style of projecting more energy or decision making. His "managing the game " does not impress me. He seems to aloof. He needs to be in the game more. With his intelligence and passion for the game and willingness to work hard I acould see this happen. In short Tomlin makes the decisons on key plays.

3-Assign another position coach or asst. head coach the responsiblity of making play calling decisions. I know this convulates the process but I am not sure play calling is within Bruce's ability. Personally I see so many people that are reasonably intelligent who are not able to think quickly. From afar, Bruce seems to be of this nature.

4-Ben continues to grow and become a student of the position of NFL QB. ala Peyton Maning and he used audibles much more fequently. This to me is the ideal method of improving play calling . With no disrespect is Ben a quick thinker ? I do not know.

My entire point here is the play calling was very poor all year but the creativity in available plays was in the package better than prior years. Not to repeat myself the working relationship between, Bruce and Ben and perhaps Anderson is not to be underestimated in it s value.

TackleMeBen
01-09-2008, 09:53 AM
i think the problem isnt all on the OC.. the oline didnt give ben time to do anything but run for his life all season.

memphissteelergirl
01-09-2008, 09:57 AM
Glad LeBeau is staying....Arians...eh...not so much. That said though, as it is his first year as OC I am willing to see what adjustments he makes in his playcalling next season. If nothing changes, I say show him the door.

Counselor
01-09-2008, 10:03 AM
I'm very pleased to hear that both are staying.

TheManOfSteel
01-09-2008, 10:15 AM
You get what you say and believe in PERIOD. We all get what we say and believe in you heart. WE PROGRAM are heart, what we poor into in and out of it.



"Set a guard, O Lord, over my mouth; keep watch over the door of my lips." (Psalm 141:3)

Jeremy
01-09-2008, 10:18 AM
Excellent.

Now let's fix the problems.. fire the Special teams coach... and get going into the future!

If Arians is coming back, you're still going to see problems. Special teams didn't lose the game to Jacksonville. A series of stupid play calls on offense and a stubborn slow quarterback lost the game against Jacksonville.

TheManOfSteel
01-09-2008, 10:29 AM
Mark 11:23
For verily I say unto you, that whosoever shall say unto this mountain, be thou removed and cast into the sea, and shall not doubt in his heart, but shall believe that those things which he say shall come to pass; shall have whatsoever he saith.

Dino 6 Rings
01-09-2008, 11:07 AM
Glad Dick L is back, he's a Steeler through and through. The defense should be even better next season with some young fresh talent at linebacker ready to rock and roll next season. Arians should get another year to see if he can improve on the success we had passing the ball this year and focus a little more on running the ball. Parker was leading the league in rushing before he went down with a broken leg, I expect the same next season.

New O-line coach, with some of the New O-line faces we will be seeing and a New ST coach for pete's sake.

Edman
01-09-2008, 11:11 AM
Looks like Lebeau isn't ready to hang it up yet.

The problem with D's 2nd Half collapses this year was not the scheme. It was the players and the execution.

Arians? I have no problem with him. He's helped turn our QB into a Superstar, and had the league's leading rusher in Parker before he went down. And about last Saturday's game? He couldn't be any more aggressive. He went for it several times. Including for 2 twice. If those 2 point conversions were made, haters would be touting him as a genius instead of calling him to be fired.

If anybody deserves to go, it's Ligashevsky.

OneForTheToe
01-09-2008, 12:09 PM
II wouldn't mind if Ligashevsky.was fired because I think a special teams coach puts his stamp on his unit the first year he has the job. On the other hand, the offensive line has been declining for years and you can't expect it to be turned around in an instant. Now if things do not improve next season then we will have to consider a change.

The call for Arians to be fired just doesn't resonate with me. We had a weak offensive line but still had the leading rusher and second ranked passer in the NFL. No, I didn't agree with all of his play calls, but every team, in hindsight, makes terrible play calling decisions. Hell, Peyton makes more bad decisions than any coordinator in the NFL. It is just that if your execution is good and you have the talent you can overcome the poor decisions and you suddenly look like a genius.

I suspect that inside the Steelers organization there may be some thoughts about whether to retain Ligashevsky, but that they would be scratching their heads at the thought of getting rid of Arians.

After all, the person who really needs to go is the Mascot coordinator.

TackleMeBen
01-09-2008, 12:21 PM
After all, the person who really needs to go is the Mascot coordinator.

now that i agree with..lol...

lilyoder6
01-09-2008, 12:31 PM
i think that next yr Arians will be a better play caller.. i think the first yr is always diffucult for an OC especially if they didn't have any exp b4.. just b/c that they probably didn't know which calls would be great in a needy situation and so forth... so i hope he can learn from this season and become better

Dino 6 Rings
01-09-2008, 01:13 PM
I agree, Arians did a good job with his first stint as Offensive coordinator, and if Ben wasn't getting blown up with sacks and wasn't so shy about trying to get rid of the ball faster, it would have been even better.

There were a lot of guys open in the Jacksonville game that didn't have the ball thrown their way. With Ben and Bruce working together on the game plans, passing and running attack, blocking schemes and offense as a whole, the entire off season, things will be more productive and better next season.

Tomlin will address the O-line issues and will address the Special Teams issues. I'm kind of surprised he didn't fire the ST coach mid season. One Kick return for a touchdown isn't enough to be productive and horrible starting position after getting the ball back due to a lack of punt returns needs to be fixed as well. We did stop the fumbling problem, this season, now lets get some return yards as well next season.

jjpro11
01-09-2008, 04:03 PM
you cant go through 3 offensive coordinators in 3 seasons.. that is never good for a quarterback and an offense. you've got to give the players time to adapt to a coach and his style. keeping arians is a smart move. the offense really wasnt as big of a problem as people keep making it out to be. in fact, it was pretty damn good having the league's leading rusher for most of the season, ben breaking bradshaw's touchdown record and being the 2nd highest rated qb in the league.. all this with one of the worst olines in the league. who knows what we could do with a decent oline.

SteelDogFan
01-09-2008, 04:34 PM
Thank you, thank you, I am so glad that the top three coaches are still intact. Now I will begin to look at the draft. I dont want anyone to lose their job, but we need help on Special Teams.

Tomlin's and LeBeau's defense will be a monster next year.

PINDEL1
01-09-2008, 05:17 PM
I like Lebeau staying but I am not sold on Arians, Special Teams and O-line coaches should probably be shown the door.

I am not sold either but I will give him 1 yr. to fix the pass protection problems with the OL..

Stats and Pro-Bowl selection prove Ben had an O/S year.
However the Offense was 17th in the NFL.. << That will not cut it for a SB run.

The QB sack stat per pass play was the worst in the NFL. Just think what Ben would have done with more protection.

HometownGal
01-09-2008, 05:43 PM
Special teams didn't lose the game to Jacksonville. A series of stupid play calls on offense and a stubborn slow quarterback lost the game against Jacksonville.

Take away the 96 yarder that ST's gave to Jones-Drew early on in the game which gave them a quick score, and the Steelers win that game 29-24. Then - take away the D allowing Garrard a 32 yard scamper to get the Jags in FG range and we still have a Steelers win - 29-21.

SteelCityMan786
01-09-2008, 06:51 PM
Might want to get a new 0-line coach too. Bad play all year long across the whole line, can't blame it all on the players it was bad coaching also.

I'd go for both being fired.

As for Arians I guess there may be new ideas for O that he'll be putting in this year.

Good to see Dick has his heart in the game.

BlastFurnace
01-09-2008, 07:03 PM
Tomlin is obviously taking his time with announcing who is staying and who is going...and that is a good thing. I would hope that a person in charge of anything would take a step back and look at things.

Lig and Zierlein would not be in the pro's coaching if they were not decent coaches.

On ST, The problem may lie in that some players aren't professional enough to know or follow their assignments on ST. After all, how many times did we see gaping holes in ST, guys like Andre Frazier completely miss tackles, etc. I have a hard time believing that any ST coach that has made it to the pro level coaches leaving your lanes, arm wave at tackles, etc.

On the OL, Zierlein can't make Mahan stronger, block better, or not get bulled over by the most average of DT's. I think Mahan was more of a problem in the middle of the line than we realize.

What we may end up seeing is both coaches stay for atleast one more year. I wouldn' t be surprised to see more players leave than coaches. Some players may be part of the problem.

Steeldude
01-09-2008, 08:41 PM
the talent on the steelers' O-line is pretty much average to poor. i mean, who on the O-line is good or better than average? IMO, i would say smith, but that depends on his recovery. he isn't the most healthy player.

i feel the zone blocking scheme that zierlein employs is porous. it also appeared to be confusing for the players. maybe that's why it was porous :smile:

zierlein's only NFL experience as an O-line coach was in cleveland from 2001 - 2004. couch was sacked 51 times in 2001.

browns' rankings for rushing each year with zierlein:

2001 - 31st
2002 - 23rd
2003 - 20th
2004 - 23rd

in defense of zierlein the browns weren't the most talented team. perhaps it took the players until the second year to understand his zone blocking schemes. what happens next year then the steelers will have some new faces on the O-line? do they spend another year learning the system? kemo is reportedly riding the bench because he can't grasp his assignments. this is dating back to last year also. kemo may be big and strong but if he doesn't know who to block he is useless. if essex starts how long will it take him to grasp the scheme. what about the draft picks or FA additions to the O-line?

if zierlein is fired i hope the steelers go after hudson houck.

revefsreleets
01-09-2008, 09:22 PM
the talent on the steelers' O-line is pretty much average to poor. i mean, who on the O-line is good or better than average? IMO, i would say smith, but that depends on his recovery. he isn't the most healthy player.

i feel the zone blocking scheme that zierlein employs is porous. it also appeared to be confusing for the players. maybe that's why it was porous :smile:

zierlein's only NFL experience as an O-line coach was in cleveland from 2001 - 2004. couch was sacked 51 times in 2001.

browns' rankings for rushing each year with zierlein:

2001 - 31st
2002 - 23rd
2003 - 20th
2004 - 23rd

in defense of zierlein the browns weren't the most talented team. perhaps it took the players until the second year to understand his zone blocking schemes. what happens next year then the steelers will have some new faces on the O-line? do they spend another year learning the system? kemo is reportedly riding the bench because he can't grasp his assignments. this is dating back to last year also. kemo may be big and strong but if he doesn't know who to block he is useless. if essex starts how long will it take him to grasp the scheme. what about the draft picks or FA additions to the O-line?

if zierlein is fired i hope the steelers go after hudson houck.

w00t! We finally agree on something. The scheme was no good, but it wasn't exactly zone blocking. The talent MAY be there just lost in the assignments and positioning. Grimm deployed a power blocking scheme, and the Steelers knew it inside and out, but things changed under Zierlein. That happens when you change scheme's. You are questioning players abilities to grasp the system? Could that have effected Arians ability to do his job? Ben's? Tomlin's?

It's complicated.

lilyoder6
01-09-2008, 10:30 PM
i think firing the ST coach might be too harsh... i mean u can only teach the players so much on special teams... on punt, u block for 5 secs and go tackle.. punt return block the person in front of u.. kick off.. run ur lanes and make a tackle.. kick off return block the person u are suppose to block... other than that what else do u expect the coach to teach the players on special teams??? i would have to say who ever has the final say in who goes in at that position needs work...

SteelDogFan
01-09-2008, 10:49 PM
We all must realize that the loss of Russ is probably 20-30% of the reason the Oline did not seem to gel this year. I really think that the coaches working together this year they got to know each other and their tendencies. Things were done the same way with the team for over 10 years. Just like players its going to take time for the coaches to gel and this year was a good start. We made the playoffs and won the division.

I'm mostly siked about the D. The problem this year was two minds on two different schemes. Dick with Zone blitz and Tomlin with the 4/3 / cover2. When these two minds get insink with each other its going to be incredible.

This year we had coaches and players trying to be on the same page that had not worked together before. Next year with a year under their belt they will be Awesome..

Phoenixus
01-10-2008, 01:11 PM
Team was fine,
Nothing wrong with it, but losing Grimm at Oline coach made a huge impact and it should be obvious at this point.

2006 Cowher lost his motivation to coach, and it was plain as day. The rest of the team won the superbowl bought into the hype of "Number 1 team". They weren't hungry anymore, nor was Cowher and it showed. But the talent was there and remains. He was a good coach, but his days were over and everyone knew it. He just had no motivation and it reflected on the team in 2006.

It is doubtful there was a talent problem.

Tomlin inherited the team with talent, but a lot of changes in coaching staff as well as injuries kind of put a damper on things, combined with a new coach adjusting to the job. And you see a team with talent underperforming it's capabillity at times, but at least the "we're the greatest team" mentality was gone.

In 2007 they finally decided to play football again... 2008, we'll have to see if they can get hungry for it again.

I don't think the transition to Tomlin sat well with some players... even though with others they seriously fell in with him, and I suspect losing Grimm was pretty big too.

There's a lot of reasons the Steelers were one and done in the playoffs this year, and while disappointing, there's no need to begin with doom and gloom yet. Everything should adjust over next year and the year after, those are the ones that will truly answer the questions.

83-Steelers-43
01-10-2008, 01:22 PM
Tomlin plans to bring entire staff back for next season
By Scott Brown
TRIBUNE-REVIEW
Thursday, January 10, 2008

Mike Tomlin said at his final news conference of the season that he plans to bring his entire coaching staff back for the 2008 season.

The Steelers' struggled along the offensive line and on special teams, leading to speculation that Tomlin might make some changes.

"At this point my intention is to keep the staff intact," Tomlin said today at the Steelers' South Side practice facility. "Generally I'm pleased with our staff."

The Steelers' special teams were a problem all season, and Tomlin said he will "leave no stone unturned" in turning the unit into a "great" one.

Tomlin said special teams had been one of his biggest concerns because the Steelers had lost "core" guys such as Sean Morey, Mike Logan and James Harrison from previous years.

Harrison didn't play as much on special teams this season because he became the starter at right outside linebacker.

http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pittsburghtrib/sports/s_546854.html

Preacher
01-10-2008, 01:26 PM
If Arians is coming back, you're still going to see problems. Special teams didn't lose the game to Jacksonville. A series of stupid play calls on offense and a stubborn slow quarterback lost the game against Jacksonville.

You just won't be happy until we have a big running back, average qb, and run the ball 35 times a game. Oh wait... that is what they tried to do on the first two plays.

If I searched the net, would I find you complaining the last few years when Cowher called the exact same plays in the same situation?

If you can't see that while that series hurt us, ST's killed us, defensive breakdowns killed us, Arians playcalling and Ben's running/passing got us BACK into the game after we were down by 18, then you're simply blinded by your hatred of Arians. Too each his own.

revefsreleets
01-11-2008, 09:51 AM
Alright, I might give the OL coach a pass, assuming Tomlin knows something the rest of us don't, but the special teams coach? We had, hands down, the worst special teams in the NFL. We lost games because of bad special teams. The ST had an important role in a playoff loss this year. This is like a CEO of a Fortune 50 losing two billion dollars and getting a raise.

Jeremy
01-11-2008, 09:55 AM
You just won't be happy until we have a big running back, average qb, and run the ball 35 times a game. Oh wait... that is what they tried to do on the first two plays.

If I searched the net, would I find you complaining the last few years when Cowher called the exact same plays in the same situation?

If you can't see that while that series hurt us, ST's killed us, defensive breakdowns killed us, Arians playcalling and Ben's running/passing got us BACK into the game after we were down by 18, then you're simply blinded by your hatred of Arians. Too each his own.

Take away those two Mathis picks and where are the Steelers Preacher?

Blame the special teams all you want. Blame the defense all you want. At the end of the day, three huge picks killed the Steelers. You know and I know it. All three of those picks killed socring drives and two of those picks were all on GS.

Don't sit there are praise him for bringing the team back when he was a huge part of the reason they were in the hole they were in.

lilyoder6
01-11-2008, 09:59 AM
what do u expect a ST teams coach to do????? yes i know our st sucked this yr.. but the only thing the st coach can coach a player on st on punt is to block a few seconds and run down the field and tackle.. punt return is to block the person in front of u.. kickoff is to run down the field in ur lanes and tackle the ball carrier.. and then finally on kick off return is to block ur assignment.. plz tell me what esle the coach can tell the players on st teams???? the rest is up to the players on the field to excute.. it would be the players fault, not the coaches fault.. if a coach should be blamed, it should be the coach who decides which person is on st..

revefsreleets
01-11-2008, 10:14 AM
ST, just the other two phases of the game, is nowhere near as simple as that. If there is a talent gap, okay, but then scheming should make up for that. We had the worst ST in the NFL, but we have nowhere near the worst talent in the NFL ergo, this is not just the players fault.

lilyoder6
01-11-2008, 11:34 AM
either way u look at with scheming or not.. u still block for few seconds and tackle the ball carrier...

jjpro11
01-11-2008, 12:22 PM
what do u expect a ST teams coach to do????? yes i know our st sucked this yr.. but the only thing the st coach can coach a player on st on punt is to block a few seconds and run down the field and tackle.. punt return is to block the person in front of u.. kickoff is to run down the field in ur lanes and tackle the ball carrier.. and then finally on kick off return is to block ur assignment.. plz tell me what esle the coach can tell the players on st teams???? the rest is up to the players on the field to excute.. it would be the players fault, not the coaches fault.. if a coach should be blamed, it should be the coach who decides which person is on st..

you get the feeling when you watch our special teams that they are just bad. you can see them running down the field with their heads chopped off, and just know they are going to run right by the returner. you see the middle of the field wide open as they come barreling down the field, and you just know that runner is going to shoot right through the open lane and juke out jeff reed. they probably know how to tackle since they are in the nfl (besides reed), but they are never in position to do so.

Steeldude
01-11-2008, 12:55 PM
ST, just the other two phases of the game, is nowhere near as simple as that. If there is a talent gap, okay, but then scheming should make up for that. We had the worst ST in the NFL, but we have nowhere near the worst talent in the NFL ergo, this is not just the players fault.

agreed.

IMO, the players look lost. they don't contain or take proper routes when defending. on returns they seem to forget that blocking is legal. some of that has got to be the coaching.

it got to the point where reed should just kick it out of bounds and let them take the ball on the 45 :sofunny:

Thomas Mihalich
01-11-2008, 01:02 PM
You get what you say and believe in PERIOD. We all get what we say and believe in you heart. WE PROGRAM are heart, what we poor into in and out of it.



"Set a guard, O Lord, over my mouth; keep watch over the door of my lips." (Psalm 141:3)

Dats a goot one.....:sofunny:

lilyoder6
01-11-2008, 01:50 PM
i said whoever decides who goes on st should be blamed as well. but firing the st coach is harsh

revefsreleets
01-11-2008, 06:41 PM
Here is what scares the Hell out of me: Tomlin put all kinds of emphasis on ST's in camp. He went out of his way to devote extra time to it, and we still had the worst ST's in the NFL. I have a friend who has a theory that we cut all the guys who spent all that extra time on ST's, but I'm not convinced.

Regardless, if the dude is back next year, the dude is back next year. I guess we can all take solace in the fact that the ST's probably can't get any worse.

Welcome To Smashmouth
01-12-2008, 12:58 AM
Does anyone have a problem with handing Dick a 10 year extention???

lilyoder6
01-12-2008, 01:50 PM
i think on kick off we should put Daniel Sepulveda as the kicker.. at least we know if someone does break a return he has a better chance of tackling the funner than reed

Thomas Mihalich
01-12-2008, 06:43 PM
Does anyone have a problem with handing Dick a 10 year extention???

A young man has more vigor but Dick has lots of experience. Let Dick stay, he's done a great job and is young for his age! He'll know when it's time to go.

I think the Rooneys did the right thing in going with young head coaches. Paterno is still a head coach at 81! (I think he should step down & turn it over to a younger man.)

Preacher
01-12-2008, 06:55 PM
Take away those two Mathis picks and where are the Steelers Preacher?

Blame the special teams all you want. Blame the defense all you want. At the end of the day, three huge picks killed the Steelers. You know and I know it. All three of those picks killed socring drives and two of those picks were all on GS.

Don't sit there are praise him for bringing the team back when he was a huge part of the reason they were in the hole they were in.

Take away the ST's failure and we are up by 7, maybe 14. The gameplans change, everything changes.

Is Ben at fault for actually throwing the interceptions.... 2 out of 3 of them are completely his fault. However, it is THAT EXACT SAME MENTALITY THAT GOT HIM THROWING INTERCEPTIONS... THAT ALSO PUT US IN THE LEAD. By the way, the third INT (screen pass) was simply a GREAT play by the D. The guy was on the ground when Ben was throwing the pass... and he got up and picked it off. Great play, period.

In the end, Ben made up for his mistakes. The ST's did not. Where was the big return to make up for letting a big return? Defense did not. Where was the shutdown on that last drive to make up for the lapses before that?

Does Ben make mistakes, absolutely, but he makes up for them, neither the D nor special teams made up for thiers... ergo, the blame belongs on ST's and D.

Thomas Mihalich
01-12-2008, 07:05 PM
Take away the ST's failure and we are up by 7, maybe 14. The gameplans change, everything changes.

Is Ben at fault for actually throwing the interceptions.... 2 out of 3 of them are completely his fault. However, it is THAT EXACT SAME MENTALITY THAT GOT HIM THROWING INTERCEPTIONS... THAT ALSO PUT US IN THE LEAD. By the way, the third INT (screen pass) was simply a GREAT play by the D. The guy was on the ground when Ben was throwing the pass... and he got up and picked it off. Great play, period.

In the end, Ben made up for his mistakes. The ST's did not. Where was the big return to make up for letting a big return? Defense did not. Where was the shutdown on that last drive to make up for the lapses before that?

Does Ben make mistakes, absolutely, but he makes up for them, neither the D nor special teams made up for thiers... ergo, the blame belongs on ST's and D.

Well said! The interceptions that he threw were probably due to getting his bell rung, he took a lot of punishment ! If the Steelers had a team made up of Bens' They would win the Superbowl every year!

Preacher
01-12-2008, 07:18 PM
Well said! The interceptions that he threw were probably due to getting his bell rung, he took a lot of punishment ! If the Steelers had a team made up of Bens' They would win the Superbowl every year!

That is actually the last thing I want. I also want players that will play safe (Ahem, A Smith), Players that will not take risks (Ahem, ST;s), and players that will go all out.

Thomas Mihalich
01-12-2008, 08:25 PM
That is actually the last thing I want. I also want players that will play safe (Ahem, A Smith), Players that will not take risks (Ahem, ST;s), and players that will go all out.

Last thing that you want?

Preacher
01-12-2008, 09:58 PM
Last thing that you want?

yes.

conservativesteelers
01-12-2008, 11:20 PM
The ints were not due to Ben getting his bell rung.. really not very knowledgable people making that type of comment.

Mathis picked off the timing route b/c they Steelers ran that same play with Tommy Maddox.. bunch one side. throw a curl route to the other side. Mathis read it again.. and took it to the house.. The steelers should have never ran that play b/c Mathis knows it and boasts about knowing it everytime they run it.

The other play by their lineman was just one heck of a play.. falling over forward, looks up, jumps 3 feet in the air and intercepts Ben.

The throw downfield to Davenport was the only one that was really Bad, and totally Ben's fault. He should have ran it for 2-3 yards, thrown it out of bounds b/c he was outside the tackle box or tried to go to Holmes who was open on that same side. But then again.. it's easy being armchair quarterback.