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GBMelBlount
08-15-2008, 06:18 AM
First-team 'D' borderline vs. Bills

TORONTO -- They can open and close the roof at Rogers Centre, slap a little paint and a few logos on the turf and call it a National Football League game.

But detractors aren't easily fooled.

In a city where the Canadian maple leaf is proudly displayed and the only thing more plentiful than the traffic is the number of hockey fans, the Steelers' defense looked as though it were slipping and sliding on ice against the Buffalo Bills last night.

And it wasn't the backups and players who won't be around in September who were looking awkward and clumsy. It was the first-unit defense, the one that had trouble protecting leads last season.

OK, so it's still summer and the real games don't begin for a couple of more weeks. And, not to worry, Lawrence Timmons will play more than he did in the first quarter -- one play -- once Sept. 7 rolls around.

Nonetheless, in two preseason outings, the first-team defense has allowed a field goal and two touchdowns on four possessions, the latest act of forgiveness coming in the 24-21 loss to the Bills.

"We weren't at our peak," said nose tackle Casey Hampton, appearing in his first game since coming off the physically unable to perform list. "They ran the plays we knew were coming. They just were dropping the ball on us."

If it were hockey, they would have pulled the goalie.

After the Philadelphia Eagles marched right down the field and kicked a field goal in their only appearance last week, the first-team defense hardly stiffened against the Bills, who scored the third-fewest points (252) in the league last season.

Buffalo scored on its first two possessions -- quarterback Trent Edwards threw touchdown passes of 7 and 13 yards to tight end Robert Royal -- before the Steelers finally forced a three-and-out, the only one of the preseason for the first-teamers.

Granted, the defense showed almost none of its sub packages against the Bills, using cornerback William Gay as a replacement for nose tackle Casey Hampton on just five occasions, and rarely blitzing. On the Bills' 10-play scoring drive that gave them a 7-0 lead, the base defense was on the field for nine plays -- a rarity in these days of ever-rotating personnel packages.

Still, there are too many holes in the defense, and it has been this way since the second half of last season, even though the defense ranked No. 1 overall in the NFL. And the lapses have been noticeable because too many came in the fourth quarter.

On five occasions in 2007, the defense failed to protect a lead in the final minutes after the offense rallied from deficits, some double-digit shortages. The only time it didn't result in defeat was when Cleveland's Phil Dawson missed a 52-yard field goal as time expired in Week 9.

The most severe collapse came in the playoff loss to the Jacksonville Jaguars, when the offense rallied from a 28-10 deficit with three touchdowns in the fourth quarter and the defense let the Jaguars go 44 yards in eight plays and kick the winning field goal with 37 seconds remaining.

Does anyone forget the sight of quarterback David Garrard scrambling 32 yards on fourth-and-2, a play on which safety Tyrone Carter badly missed an open-field tackle?

The tackling wasn't much better against the Bills.

On three consecutive plays on the Bills' second touchdown drive, Gay missed a tackle on wide receiver Roscoe Parrish, resulting in a first down; cornerback Ike Taylor missed a tackle on wide receiver Lee Evans, resulting in a 17-yard gain, and safety Ryan Clark missed a tackle on a swing pass to running back Fred Jackson, turning a loss into a 5-yard gain.

For good measure, there was even a long run by the quarterback on third-and-13 -- Edwards stepping up in the pocket from his own 7 and gaining 22 yards to keep a scoring drive alive.

The good news: Once he got on the field with the second-team defense, Timmons was a one-man terror, sacking J.P. Losman on third down in the second quarter and hammering third-string quarterback Matt Baker as he released the ball in the fourth.

Friday, August 15, 2008
By Gerry Dulac, Pittsburgh Post-Gazette

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/08228/904538-66.stm

GBMelBlount
08-15-2008, 06:26 AM
On a positive note, Timmons looks like he's coming along very well.

Alva Lord
08-15-2008, 07:21 AM
That was a pathetic display of football from the Steelers, especially from the first string offense and defense. The special teams are still horrible.

By the middle of the third quarter the Bills had 110 yards rushing to the Steelers 27.

The first team defense didn't generate a pass rush against a vanilla offense. They allowed Edwards all the time he needed to pick them apart. On top of that Buffalo was without their best OL, LT, Jason Peters. They couldn't stop the run either and that's their forte'. They were allowing no-name running backs to shine.

The Steelers DB's couldn't tackle my grandmother with a walker and in a four by six room. They were that bad.



http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v458/MBlaster1/Silverbacksig540.jpg

Alva Lord
08-15-2008, 07:25 AM
Where's the pass rush? Edwards had all day to pick them apart. What makes matters worse is they were playing against a vanilla offense without their best offensive lineman LT, Jason Peters.

The Steelers defense was getting run on all game and by no name backs trying to make the Bill's roster. By contrast the Steelers couldn't run effectively.

I don't believe Troy would have made that much of a difference. Bad is bad and the Steelers were just plain bad.

Where's the tackling? The Steelers DB's were embarrassing themselves. They couldn't tackle to save their lives.

xfl2001fan
08-15-2008, 07:37 AM
Wow...the sky is falling in Pittsburgh.

There's a reason you guys are known as Blitzburgh in many fan circles in the NFL. Your team has neither proven nor disproven anything in the preseason because you're not playing a zone-blitz scheme in games that don't count.

My hopes have not risen on iota concerning your play in the preseason. I'm pretty confident that, when W2 roles around, we'll be facing a much different defense than what has been displayed in the first two preseason games.

redst3
08-15-2008, 07:37 AM
That was a pathetic display of football from the Steelers, especially from the first string offense and defense. The special teams are still horrible.

What he said

Wow...the sky is falling in Pittsburgh.

There's a reason you guys are known as Blitzburgh in many fan circles in the NFL. Your team has neither proven nor disproven anything in the preseason because you're not playing a zone-blitz scheme in games that don't count.
.

X you are actually being too nice. It sucked and we know it. We also know its only pre-season, the defense was "vanilla" and there's time to get better. After all, part of the purpose of the board is to gripe.

xfl2001fan
08-15-2008, 07:46 AM
When I see more of the Zone Blitzing scheme that you guys use next week...and see it fail...then I'll get my hopes up. However, I almost wonder if this isn't some ploy to lull opposing teams into complacency.

Lord Stiller
08-15-2008, 08:08 AM
defensive line is getting pushed around

Tyrone Carter is really bad, i can't believe Tomlin starts him over Anthony Smith. Guess he didn't learn from the playoff loss.

Clark doesn't seem like the same player he was prior to his illness. I hope he improves, he was really good prior to that freak sickness

Alva Lord
08-15-2008, 08:19 AM
I'm willing to give Clark a pass considering what he went through. He's still trying to get his feet under him.

Now, Tyrone Carter has no excuse to look as bad as he does. I wonder if Anthony Smith has a learning disability along with being immature. It would explain his lack of development. It looks like the coaching staff's giving up on him as a free safety.

Lord Stiller
08-15-2008, 08:22 AM
I'm willing to give Clark a pass considering what he went through. He's still trying to get his feet under him.

Me too. I'm a big fan of Clark. Considering how much weigth and strength he lost, i find it pretty amazing he is out there now. This might be one of those things where he isn't back to normal untill next year though.


Now, Tyrone Carter has no excuse to look as bad as he does. I wonder if Anthony Smith has a learning disability along with being immature. It would explain his lack of development. It looks like the coaching staff's giving up on him as a free safety.

I have no idea but it really ticks me off seeing Carter out there continuing his crappy play

Edman
08-15-2008, 08:30 AM
People are telling me not to worry, but it's true.

The Steelers lost by three, but they still played a pathetic game. Ben got no time to throw because Colon and Marvel were getting abused, while Trent Edwards was able to sit in that comfortable pocket and have all day to throw. I'm glad that Marvel is in his contract year, he is obviously WAY past his prime.

Both Lines and the Running Backs sucked. The once-awesome Steeler Run D got pushed around and the Bills RB's were able to bust long ones. Holes opened up, while the Run blocking for Willie was pathetic. This is the second week in a row that they got torched on the first drive.

Like I said before, the Steelers will have get into shootouts with people to win this year. This Soft Defense sucks and is on borderline Cincy horrible and I have no confidence in them. Poor Tackling, again, poor special teams, again, poor Offensive Line play, again.

Dino 6 Rings
08-15-2008, 08:58 AM
and yet...we were one dropped ball in the endzone away from winning the game in dramatic fashion. Wonder what the comments would have been had that happened. Funny how Football is truly a game of inches.

I worry not. I will base my opinions on what happens against Houston Week 1.

Oh, and the Special Teams did alright, the one big return, I watched the highlight and there was a Clear block in the back right at the moment the receiver started up field. It was so obvious it was ridiculous. But its pre-season. My blood pressure didn't rise.

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-15-2008, 09:21 AM
Tyrone Carter is really bad, i can't believe Tomlin starts him over Anthony Smith. Guess he didn't learn from the playoff loss.

Clark doesn't seem like the same player he was prior to his illness. I hope he improves, he was really good prior to that freak sickness

I was thinking that I saw too much of Ty Carter doing nothing last night. So, no pass rush from the front 3, bad tackling, soft DB play and Ty Carter instead of Polamalu......I'm not too worried about a preseason loss by 3 pts.

millwalldavey
08-15-2008, 09:24 AM
From what I saw on the live feed (not much.....) the defense looked rather mediocre. Again, Timmons was a bright spot.

I keep telling myself this is only preseason, and I hope its right....

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-15-2008, 09:26 AM
People are telling me not to worry, but it's true.

The Steelers lost by three, but they still played a pathetic game. Ben got no time to throw because Colon and Marvel were getting abused, while Trent Edwards was able to sit in that comfortable pocket and have all day to throw. I'm glad that Marvel is in his contract year, he is obviously WAY past his prime.
.

So who is gonna replace Marvel Smith?? Way past his prime......he just turned 30 last week???

Smith got beat once, but stayed with Kelsay long enough to avoid the sack. Other than that Smith has been solid this preseason. Colon on the other hand still has problems with speed guys like Kelsay and Schobel.

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-15-2008, 09:28 AM
Oh, and the Special Teams did alright, the one big return, I watched the highlight and there was a Clear block in the back right at the moment the receiver started up field. It was so obvious it was ridiculous. But its pre-season. My blood pressure didn't rise.

Yeah, and most of the scrubs were on the ST during that return. The one thing the did worry me on that return was Bruce Davis total lack of interest in getting in on the play. Like Tomlin said....."there's a difference between active and productive"

Davis isnt looking productive at all.

Alva Lord
08-15-2008, 09:31 AM
and yet...we were one dropped ball in the endzone away from winning the game in dramatic fashion. Wonder what the comments would have been had that happened. Funny how Football is truly a game of inches.

I worry not. I will base my opinions on what happens against Houston Week 1.

Oh, and the Special Teams did alright, the one big return, I watched the highlight and there was a Clear block in the back right at the moment the receiver started up field. It was so obvious it was ridiculous. But its pre-season. My blood pressure didn't rise.
Forget the score.

The Bill's first string offense and defense out played the Steelers first stringers. On top of that the Bills were without their starting LT, Jason Peters. Even the Bill's second string defense was giving the Steelers first string offense all they could handle. Also, the Bill's second string offense was running, at will, against the Steelers first string defense.

Pre season or not, there's no excuse for the Steelers DB's to completely whiff on tackling. They were especially horrible.

redst3
08-15-2008, 09:42 AM
Me too. I'm a big fan of Clark. Considering how much weigth and strength he lost, i find it pretty amazing he is out there now. This might be one of those things where he isn't back to normal untill next year though.


Clark's impact was lost on me until this Summer when i wacthed a bunch of games I had dvded from last year. When he went down it killed us.....

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 09:47 AM
People are telling me not to worry, but it's true.

The Steelers lost by three, but they still played a pathetic game. Ben got no time to throw because Colon and Marvel were getting abused, while Trent Edwards was able to sit in that comfortable pocket and have all day to throw. I'm glad that Marvel is in his contract year, he is obviously WAY past his prime.

Both Lines and the Running Backs sucked. The once-awesome Steeler Run D got pushed around and the Bills RB's were able to bust long ones. Holes opened up, while the Run blocking for Willie was pathetic. This is the second week in a row that they got torched on the first drive.

Like I said before, the Steelers will have get into shootouts with people to win this year. This Soft Defense sucks and is on borderline Cincy horrible and I have no confidence in them. Poor Tackling, again, poor special teams, again, poor Offensive Line play, again.

:applaudit:

Nice Post Edman. That is exactly what happened last night. At this point, the team doesn't look good at all. Hopefully, things will change. The sky isn't falling yet, but it's atleast very very cloudy.

tony hipchest
08-15-2008, 09:49 AM
people need to remember that in a real game the 1st team defense doesnt come off the field and adjustments will be made. a game isnt won in the 1st quarter. give lebeau a chance to create some sacks and turnovers. let the defense find a chance to get some rhythym and flow.

:applaudit:

Nice Post Edman. That is exactly what happened last night. At this point, the team doesn't look good at all. Hopefully, things will change. The sky isn't falling yet, but it's atleast very very cloudy.the sky has already fallen when people compare the steelers d to the bungles.

the sky has fallen and been buried.

Dino 6 Rings
08-15-2008, 09:53 AM
Doom and Gloom

I'll have none of it unless I'm sitting in my Black Tower in Mordor thinking about how to destroy those stinking elves and hobbits once and for all.

The Steelers will be fine. Ben had some nice throws he and Holmes are connecting nicely. The defense got to the other team's qb pretty nicely and the defense was vanilla, Reed missing a kick concerns me a little but other than that, we were 1 catch away from winning and then we'd all be hearing about how "awesome" the O looked and good the blocking was on the Dixon run or the Mendenhall Touchdown Run.

btw..can we please cut Reid. I'm tired of seeing incompletions thrown his way already.

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 09:57 AM
people need to remember that in a real game the 1st team defense doesnt come off the field and adjustments will be made. a game isnt won in the 1st quarter. give lebeau a chance to create some sacks and turnovers. let the defense find a chance to get some rhythym and flow.

the sky has already fallen when people compare the steelers d to the bungles.

the sky has fallen and been buried.

Ok....but this isn't a preseason problem. This has been going on since the middle of last season. But just keep throwing out the "sky is falling card" and act like the rest of us are crazy, but you are clearly watching a completely different defense than the rest of us who are concerned about what we are watching.

Our defense is clearly our weak point this season.

fansince'76
08-15-2008, 09:57 AM
Doom and Gloom

Doing my best to ignore it. So far so good. Going to be hard to continue to hold my tongue, though.

Alva Lord
08-15-2008, 09:57 AM
I still remember that the Steelers couldn't generate a pass rush last season when the games counted. Coach LeBeau can be as creative as he wants, but they still have the same players, sans Woodley and they still can't generate a pass rush, even against a vanilla offense.

tony hipchest
08-15-2008, 10:39 AM
Ok....but this isn't a preseason problem. This has been going on since the middle of last season. But just keep throwing out the "sky is falling card" and act like the rest of us are crazy, but you are clearly watching a completely different defense than the rest of us who are concerned about what we are watching.

Our defense is clearly our weak point this season.anyone who compares steelers d to bungles d IS crazy. its a simple as that.

i dont know what game all you doom and gloomers are watching but you need to quit acting like its the superbowl. im watching preseason football.

i have 2 concerns about this defense and theyre more about scheme and focus-

TE's in the redzone can find the softest spot in the zone blitz defense. defense seems to underestimate 2nd year or rookie qb's and think they can beat them with intimidation alone.

paw-n-maul-u
08-15-2008, 10:48 AM
1- the word "Vanilla" is getting way overused ... it's kind of annoying

2- I don't know how anyone can call the reigning #1 defense in the league a "weak" point for the season ... especially w/out big snack and troy p. Your right, missing two perennial probowler's has had NOTHINGGGG to do with it.

a couple preseasons ago after ben's 15-1 season I'm pretty sure the steelers first team offense didn't produce a single touchdown, or atleast not one until week three or four of the season.

Holy hell, do you remember how THAT nightmare ended?

Oh, yeah we won the superbowl ... oops.

Dino 6 Rings
08-15-2008, 10:53 AM
Unless your name is Sir Lancelot, there will always be a "chink" in your armor. The true greats rise above their faults and win in spite of them.

We'll see what happens Week 1. Until then, a bunch of guys are getting their legs under them and trying to stay healthy, while a bunch of other guys are trying to make a pro level team. That is what the pre-season is all about.

steeltheone
08-15-2008, 11:00 AM
Poor tackling is becoming a weekly occurance, as is no pass rush. No excuse for this. Timmons needs to be on the number 1 defense now.

steeltheone
08-15-2008, 11:09 AM
don't know how anyone can call the reigning #1 defense in the league a "weak" point for the season

This team had the number one Defense last year only on paper. It was built on the week one Browns game and a couple other pushovers. That being said, all is not lost. Add Timmons and Woodley, i think the speed alone makes us much more dangerous. Kiesel and Smith, Polumolu stay healthy, we can turn this around.

1207
08-15-2008, 11:12 AM
I'll try to take the middle ground. Yes, it was only a preseason game, and we all know you can't really take too much from a preseason performance, but the complete lack of resistance by the first team D in the Bills first two drives has to be a concern, especially considering the defenses inability to play a 60 minute game during the second half of last season. I think it all starts with the D-line. We have two legitimate NFL pro bowlers on the line in Smith and Hampton, one of which is coming off a season ending injury, and the other came into camp out of shape. We have Keisel, who really should be a back up. I think he loses his ability to do what he does well, which is rush the passer, when he is in there on first and second downs being hammered on by offensive linemen. The ideal situation with him in my opionion, would be to have another big body start, and play on running downs, and then sub Keisel on obvious passing downs. Easier said than done at this point. The Steelers really have no depth on the D-line, and it appears they do not have a player that could start at right DE, and allow Keisel to go back to being a pass rush specialist.

Timmons has to be a starter come week one. He is just too explosive to keep on the sidelines. He reminds me of Kendrell Bell, during Bell's first couple of years in the league. Fast, and hits a ton.

The secondary will be okay, if Troy comes back healthy and plays to his level, and the front seven are able to generate a pass rush. They do need to takle better as a unit. That is a problem from last season, and as a professional defensive football player, there is absolutely no excuse for poor tackling. I thing\k Coach T may have to consider digging into some of these guys wallets if they continue to habitually not wrap up when tackling.

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 11:14 AM
1- the word "Vanilla" is getting way overused ... it's kind of annoying

2- I don't know how anyone can call the reigning #1 defense in the league a "weak" point for the season ... especially w/out big snack and troy p. Your right, missing two perennial probowler's has had NOTHINGGGG to do with it.

a couple preseasons ago after ben's 15-1 season I'm pretty sure the steelers first team offense didn't produce a single touchdown, or atleast not one until week three or four of the season.

Holy hell, do you remember how THAT nightmare ended?

Oh, yeah we won the superbowl ... oops.

We won the SuperBowl 3 years ago. Great accomplishment and thrilled that we did...but that team is in the past....it's clearly not what it is today.

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 11:20 AM
anyone who compares steelers d to bungles d IS crazy. its a simple as that.

i dont know what game all you doom and gloomers are watching but you need to quit acting like its the superbowl. im watching preseason football.

i have 2 concerns about this defense and theyre more about scheme and focus-

TE's in the redzone can find the softest spot in the zone blitz defense. defense seems to underestimate 2nd year or rookie qb's and think they can beat them with intimidation alone.

Ok...how about the slogan "The Sky is Clear" and we can just ignore all the problems this defense has had since midseason last year. Like I said, this is not a preseason problem, but it's all good. The Steelers will turn it on with the lights come on and the front 7 will play like the old Blitzburgh days of 1994. After all, they have all given us enough evidence that what we have seen since midseason last year was nothing but a mirage. The Steelers defense, #1 statistically in the league, is a defense that tackles well, schemes well, and doesn't allow late half/game drives to give up points. I think I got it now.

19ward86
08-15-2008, 11:21 AM
We arent blitzing, end of story.

Lord Stiller
08-15-2008, 11:25 AM
We arent blitzing, end of story.

Yeah we were

PalmerSteel
08-15-2008, 11:39 AM
Yeah we were
exactly. thats what got us in trouble in the past. we shouldnt have to get penetration on every play to stop someone. i just hope this was our D's wake up call.

revefsreleets
08-15-2008, 11:49 AM
I LOVE preseason prognostication! According to about 80% of this board, after each preseason game of the last few years we are awful and will certainly only win a game or two.

Team that suck play their guts out in preseason, blitz, take chances, etc, etc...because the coaches are trying to instill a winning attitude in the team any way they can. Perrenial powerhouse teams use preseason as a practice tool to evaluate plays and assess individuals performances in game conditions.

I assure all of you nay-sayers that had this been a regular season game, there would have been a completely different mind-set from the Steelers, much different play calling and much more intensity.

Much ado about nothing...

xfl2001fan
08-15-2008, 12:54 PM
I LOVE preseason prognostication! According to about 80% of this board, after each preseason game of the last few years we are awful and will certainly only win a game or two.

Team that suck play their guts out in preseason, blitz, take chances, etc, etc...because the coaches are trying to instill a winning attitude in the team any way they can. Perrenial powerhouse teams use preseason as a practice tool to evaluate plays and assess individuals performances in game conditions.

I assure all of you nay-sayers that had this been a regular season game, there would have been a completely different mind-set from the Steelers, much different play calling and much more intensity.

Much ado about nothing...

C'mon, they wouldn't listen to me when I said that there was really nothing to take from this game...why would they take you any more seriously?

Dino 6 Rings
08-15-2008, 12:59 PM
Someone break down the corner or safety blitzes we've used so far in the pre-season. How many have their been? what was the result. Please also break down the linebacker packages per down and when we blitzed or sat back. I'd appreciate those stats.

thanks.

OneForTheToe
08-15-2008, 01:21 PM
I think the D has not looked good. And that is a bit of a concern considering how we ended up last season However, I am not sure I would call the Bills offense exactly vanilla. Maybe more butterscotch twist.:hatsoff:

I know they weren't running reverses and the like, but they did seem like they had prepared a bit for the Steelers' blitzing by using short drops. Of course, when you are getting five yards a carry passing becomes easier.:doh: After all, the D even when it was playing well early last season often gives up large chunks of yardage early in games. I'm not sure if it is because teams script plays against our tendencies, or if coach Lebeau just likes to play a kind of "rope a dope" D as he looks for places to attack an opposing offense. Heck, remember how the "cryhawks" moved the ball early in the Super Bowl. If you would have just watched the first drive you'd a thought they were going to score 30.

I also this "big snack" needs to get himself into playing shape, which he can only do by playing. Remember that was his first action in eight months.

revefsreleets
08-15-2008, 04:59 PM
C'mon, they wouldn't listen to me when I said that there was really nothing to take from this game...why would they take you any more seriously?

Because the Browns are one of those teams that have to play hard in the preseason.

xfl2001fan
08-15-2008, 05:03 PM
Because the Browns are one of those teams that have to play hard in the preseason.
That doesn't answer my question. I already tried to explain to the doom n gloom crowd that there is nothing to take from this game. I used similar arguments. My question was why you think they'll listen to you when I pointed out that as a Browns fan, I am not drawing a single shred of hope from what little I've seen of the Steelers games.

revefsreleets
08-15-2008, 05:09 PM
Because, as a Browns fan, you've had to apologize for a shitty team for so long that you've become the boy who cried wolf.

And, trust me, I get bashed up a lot around here for defending the FO. I'm Arians biggest apologist and I got hammered for it a lot last year. It's all good though. Arians is the idiot that gave Ben free reign of the offense, the offense that he set records in, the awful offense that for like 14 weeks was producing the NFL's top rusher. I'm sure most people on here know more about being an OC than Bruce Arians...(insert sarcastic smiley here).

Preacher
08-15-2008, 05:25 PM
Congratulations....

This is the second thread to earn the COVETED award!


http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/sky-is-falling.jpg

stillers4me
08-15-2008, 05:52 PM
I LOVE preseason prognostication! According to about 80% of this board, after each preseason game of the last few years we are awful and will certainly only win a game or two.

Team that suck play their guts out in preseason, blitz, take chances, etc, etc...because the coaches are trying to instill a winning attitude in the team any way they can. Perrenial powerhouse teams use preseason as a practice tool to evaluate plays and assess individuals performances in game conditions.

I assure all of you nay-sayers that had this been a regular season game, there would have been a completely different mind-set from the Steelers, much different play calling and much more intensity.

Much ado about nothing...

I agree. That 40some yard bomb from Ben to Santonio was his way of saying, "Don't worry. Be happy." :wink02:

HughC
08-15-2008, 06:16 PM
Overlooked in the debate on the defense is the play of special teams. I know it's only one play and it's preseason, but I couldn't help but have a sense of deja vu when I saw an opponent of ours take a kick back for a touchdown. I always felt back when Bill Cowher was head coach that he underestimated the importance of special teams, specifically coverage on punts and kickoffs. We had good punt and kickoff coverage last year; I just hope we don't return to the special team play of five years ago.

stillers4me
08-15-2008, 06:24 PM
Overlooked in the debate on the defense is the play of special teams. I know it's only one play and it's preseason, but I couldn't help but have a sense of deja vu when I saw an opponent of ours take a kick back for a touchdown. I always felt back when Bill Cowher was head coach that he underestimated the importance of special teams, specifically coverage on punts and kickoffs. We had good punt and kickoff coverage last year; I just hope we don't return to the special team play of five years ago.

And I also agree.

I was tell my hubby just this morning, that I'm not worried about the D.......I'm only a little worried about the O line. I have absolutely no worries about Ben and the receivers. But special teams.... that's a concern. Everybody else can bring their A game every week, but one or two episodes like last night with the schedule we have this year, and special teams could be responsible for keeping us out of the playoffs. I couldn't tell from where I was sitting who was playing.......were the starters sitting out? As much as I hate to see players like James Harrison and Woodley risking themselves, our special team unit looks much better with them.

Blitzburgh_Fever
08-15-2008, 06:52 PM
Congratulations....

This is the second thread to earn the COVETED award!


http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/sky-is-falling.jpg

LOLCATZ FTW!

Still, to say there's nothing wrong is being a homer. If we weren't getting in position to stop people, I'd be less worried. As it is, we're there, we just can't tackle anyone. It's like one guy gets on someone and the rest of the D stops trying and looks, then reacts when he busts through. It's probably just preseason, but it doesn't instill confidence.

I still hold strong in my 10-6 prediction!

edit: I will actually change that to 11-5, I believe we can around four shootouts after seeing how effortless the Ben-to-Holmes connections have been. I think if our D can step up against the Colts and Pats enough to keep it close, Ben can seal the deal.

Preacher
08-15-2008, 08:56 PM
Funny... I actually think that 10-6 will be a good year this year. I think that 9-7 will win the division, and we will have a good year at 9-7.

Do we have problems? Absolutely. I am not happy with our O line. However, it seems to be more together then it was last year. I did see some nice pockets forming.

I just don't worry about our D. When you run a 3-4 fire-blitz scheme, and don't really scheme, there are simply going to be a lot of holes. In many ways, the LB's really just focused on the passes.

Don't forget, this is much like baseball preseason games. Remember, the pitchers may be working on 2 pitches and as a result, the batters just sit on those pitches, cranking them out of the park. In the same way, the Steelers may be focusing on who has the best coverage skills. As a result, they play coverage schemes, and want to see who can cover the best... regardless of the actual play. The second part of that, is seeing reaction times.

Am I saying that IS what happened? Not at all. I am saying however, that there is so much that they are looking at and wanting to see that they were more focused on those things, and not as much actually STOPPING the offense and getting off the field.

SO no, I don't worry about the D.

We have issues, we have problems. Every team does. We will see those cracks, and our team try to overcome. That makes the Steelers.... an NFL team.

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 11:53 PM
Overlooked in the debate on the defense is the play of special teams. I know it's only one play and it's preseason, but I couldn't help but have a sense of deja vu when I saw an opponent of ours take a kick back for a touchdown. I always felt back when Bill Cowher was head coach that he underestimated the importance of special teams, specifically coverage on punts and kickoffs. We had good punt and kickoff coverage last year; I just hope we don't return to the special team play of five years ago.

Hugh...it's ok...the Steelers aren't scheming and it's just preseason...atleast that is what I am told. It will all turn to Gold when the season begins.

BlastFurnace
08-15-2008, 11:57 PM
Congratulations....

This is the second thread to earn the COVETED award!


http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2007/06/sky-is-falling.jpg

"It's not just going to snap around and just come soon as September comes," Harrison said. "You got to go out there and play these preseason games like it's a real game, no matter how long you're in there. And I don't feel like we're doing that right now.

"We're going out there and getting our timing, getting our plays in and getting out. We're not playing or coming out with the same attitude we come out with in the regular season.

"You got to show something in the preseason. That's why we play the damn games."

Quote from James Harrison after Steelers preseason loss to Buffalo.

Wow....someone better tell James that the "Sky isn't falling". According to many on the board, he is overreacting and not seeing preseason for what it really is.

tony hipchest
08-16-2008, 12:09 AM
Wow....someone better tell James that the "Sky isn't falling". According to many on the board, he is overreacting and not seeing preseason for what it really is.

wow. ok.

dear james,

thank you for your competitive spirit and not acting like a little whining crybaby because youre team lost a preseason game. all of us grounded in reality know that if you were to play in all four quarters of the game you most certainly would have "shown something". unfortunately, according to many on this board, you are no better than a bungle.

thanks again.

th :helmet:

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-16-2008, 12:17 AM
Good on Harrison for speaking his mind and calling his team out.

The thing about the regular season, is that if he did that at halftime the starters could respond with their play and comeback from that 7 point defecit.

In the preseason, the just get to watch Kirschke, Eason, Hoke start the 2nd half.

BlastFurnace
08-16-2008, 12:18 AM
wow. ok.

....and James...thanks for caring about your performance on the field because you are a professional...and taking pride in that every play counts...whether it be preseason or regular season. You realize that missed tackles do matter and that poor performance doesn't mean the sky is falling, but it does demand improvement.

Tony...I haven't once compared this bunch to the Bengals, but you keep saying that. Harrison is right in his assessment and is actually saying the very things that some on this board are accusing others as whining.

tony hipchest
08-16-2008, 12:42 AM
....and James...thanks for caring about your performance on the field because you are a professional...and taking pride in that every play counts...whether it be preseason or regular season. You realize that missed tackles do matter and that poor performance doesn't mean the sky is falling, but it does demand improvement.

Tony...I haven't once compared this bunch to the Bengals, but you keep saying that. Harrison is right in his assessment and is actually saying the very things that some on this board are accusing others as whining.it was edman who compared them to the bungles so im not accusing you specifically.

the colts are something like 2-13 in their past 15 preseason games. im just trying to add some perspective to the situation. last season, the steelers came out like gangbusters in the 1st 5 preseason games and through the 1st 4 regular season games they had lost only 2 of 9.

some think that expended energy before the bullets started flying cost them in the end. tomlin has hinted at a shift in his preseason philosophy.

if harrison had his way, he woulda been on the field on ST for superbad mclovins td return. just aint gonna happen right now though. if troy had his way, he would probably be playing. just aint gonna happen. if hampton had his way, he would weigh 400 lbs, never practice, and still get the start. it aint gonna happen though. i want 4 shut outs for the 1st 4 preseason games, but you know what.....?


yep. you guessed it.

millwalldavey
08-16-2008, 08:00 AM
the colts are something like 2-13 in their past 15 preseason games. im just trying to add some perspective to the situation. last season, the steelers came out like gangbusters in the 1st 5 preseason games and through the 1st 4 regular season games they had lost only 2 of 9.

Excellent point. The Bucs of the 80's were always undefeated in the preseason!

It sucks to lose, but it is preseason. Just time to get the ducks in a row for when it really counts. We'll be ready!

43Hitman
08-16-2008, 09:02 AM
it was edman who compared them to the bungles so im not accusing you specifically.

the colts are something like 2-13 in their past 15 preseason games. im just trying to add some perspective to the situation. last season, the steelers came out like gangbusters in the 1st 5 preseason games and through the 1st 4 regular season games they had lost only 2 of 9.

some think that expended energy before the bullets started flying cost them in the end. tomlin has hinted at a shift in his preseason philosophy.

if harrison had his way, he woulda been on the field on ST for superbad mclovins td return. just aint gonna happen right now though. if troy had his way, he would probably be playing. just aint gonna happen. if hampton had his way, he would weigh 400 lbs, never practice, and still get the start. it aint gonna happen though. i want 4 shut outs for the 1st 4 preseason games, but you know what.....?


yep. you guessed it.


I'm not asking for mid-season play from our guys just fundamentally sound football. Like tackling. :coffee:

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-16-2008, 09:42 AM
I'm not asking for mid-season play from our guys just fundamentally sound football. Like tackling. :coffee:

This is the modern day NFL, so you gotta take what you can get.

Troy Polamalu has rarely wrapped up when making a tackle in his NFL career. Its always bugged me when he hits the occasional guy like a missile, but the ballcarrier bounces off for more yardage.

Troy and a lot of other defenders rarely play "fundamentally sound football". Farrior on the other hand is textbook most of the time, but he wasnt in the game long.

rbryan
08-16-2008, 10:18 AM
It is August right.......... I'd wait until at least the 2nd week of September before I give up on the D turning it around.....lol

I realize patience is something that a lot of you are incapable of, but try not ruin it for the rest of us.

Edman
08-16-2008, 11:37 AM
Yes tony, I compared the Steelers Defense to the Bengals. That's how the first team have played in these two preseason games, and how these guys have played for periods of a time last season. No instensity, poor tackling, and even has a hard time stopping the run.

Can you provide me with evidence that shows otherwise?

We'll see what "it's only preseason" excuses the apologists come up with should the Steelers D get shredded by the Jaguars and Pats again this season playing this same "no-problem, "nothing to fix" defense.

fansince'76
08-16-2008, 11:48 AM
We absolutely suck and have no chance. We should see about forfeiting the entire season and going 0-16 so we can have a nice high draft pick. Maybe by next April Druckenmiller will have bought the team out from under the cheap-ass Rooneys and we'll actually be able to afford a top-5 pick. :coffee:

BlastFurnace
08-16-2008, 05:32 PM
This is the modern day NFL, so you gotta take what you can get.

Troy Polamalu has rarely wrapped up when making a tackle in his NFL career. Its always bugged me when he hits the occasional guy like a missile, but the ballcarrier bounces off for more yardage.

Troy and a lot of other defenders rarely play "fundamentally sound football". Farrior on the other hand is textbook most of the time, but he wasnt in the game long.

I love to watch Farrior play. IMO, our best FA aquisition since FA began. I hope he has some Junior Seau in him and can last until he's 38.

MilehighSteelerFan
08-16-2008, 09:27 PM
The first team D was horrible my son's little league team can tackle better than that, not to mention that the DB's and Safetys were getting tore up. Oh and by the way what happen to putting pressure on the other teams QB and not allowing RB to run all over you and through you. The offense was okay but it seems like with no protection Ben would get the ball off a little quicker and stop trying to force the issue. Its only pre-season though but you play how you practice and pre-season is practice.....

fansince'76
08-16-2008, 09:39 PM
The offense was okay but it seems like with no protection Ben would get the ball off a little quicker and stop trying to force the issue.

You do realize he was 9-11 for 142 and a TD in just over a quarter of play, right? Of course, around here, only 11-11 for 200+ and 3 TDs would be acceptable. :coffee:

tony hipchest
08-16-2008, 10:25 PM
You do realize he was 9-11 for 142 and a TD in just over a quarter of play, right? Of course, around here, only 11-11 for 200+ and 3 TDs would be acceptable. :coffee:after further review it looks like ben played a whopping quarter and 2/3rds. i think he was pulled (or should i say "benched"?) with 4+ minutes left in the half.

he sucks. we might as well face it. he was only on pace for a sub-par 300 yds and 3tds. thats pedestrian at best. :rolleyes:

:coffee:

steel striker
08-17-2008, 01:58 PM
This almost sounds like the take from those losers on espn. Relax people it's pre - season our guys will play better have some faith. What good does it do when you dominate in the pre season then go 8-8 in the regular season? For me the jury is still out and, I'll wait to talk after the texans game. Peace out.

El-Gonzo Jackson
08-17-2008, 07:08 PM
I love to watch Farrior play. IMO, our best FA aquisition since FA began. I hope he has some Junior Seau in him and can last until he's 38.

Me too, but i think he will become a victim of Caponomics. Timmons and Foote will be fine and we need to do contracts for Kemo, Colon, a new LT, McFadden and I think Heath Miller.

SteelMember
08-18-2008, 08:21 AM
You do realize he was 9-11 for 142 and a TD in just over a quarter of play, right? Of course, around here, only 11-11 for 200+ and 3 TDs would be acceptable. :coffee:

Now those would be some pretty good fantasy numbers.:sofunny: He'd have to keep it going for his entire career though.

HometownGal
08-18-2008, 11:01 AM
You do realize he was 9-11 for 142 and a TD in just over a quarter of play, right? Of course, around here, only 11-11 for 200+ and 3 TDs would be acceptable. :coffee:

Ben suuuuuuuucks. Bench the bum! :chuckle::wink02:

rbryan
08-18-2008, 11:32 AM
The pattiecakes laid an egg the other night. Thier defense looked worse than ours. No one on ESPN is too worried about it though. Most of those clowns over there barely stopped to wipe thier chin b4 they continued slurping.