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View Full Version : To all the trolls/bandwagoners/fair weather fans!


RoethlisBURGHer
09-30-2008, 08:51 AM
Mods, if you feel this should be moved to the blast furnace, go ahead. I am posting it here so it's seen by the people it's intended for.

You people know who you are. You are the entire "the sky is falling" group every time the Steelers don't score a TD, every time the other team gets a first down, every time there is a penalty against the Steelers.

You are the fire the coaching staff people, the bench Ben Roethlisberger people, the "we should have drafted an offensive lineman in the first round" people.

Most of you joined right after the Eagles loss. You are a wolf in sheep's clothing. I don't think you guys are Steelers fans, but fans of other teams coming over here to cause trouble.

And to the longer tenured members, please stop with the entire sky is falling garbage. We aren't going to go 16-0, we aren't going to play every game perfect. The offensive line is not that good, deal with it instead of regurgitating the same stuff on a daily basis.

Bruce Arians is probally not getting fired during the season. A major coaching change like that can really throw a team off. We have won a division title and are currently 3-1 and in the division lead with him at OC. While there may be a change in the offseason, it probally won't happen in season so just deal with it.

Ben Roethlisberger holds onto the ball to long. Yes, at times that'll end up in sacks. That is also why he threw a TD pass to Santonio Holmes last night. It's high risk, high reward...but I'll take the risk as long as we get plenty of the reward. Just get used to it, that's the way it's going to be.

/rant

The_WARDen
09-30-2008, 08:53 AM
You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?

:coffee:

X-Terminator
09-30-2008, 08:56 AM
You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?

:coffee:

Pointing out problems is one thing. Outright giving up before HALFTIME, like you did last night, is entirely another.

How's that crow tasting?

I also find it absolutely amazing the number of "fans" who show up during the gameday thread when the team is losing, and then you never hear from them again when they're winning. It happens as sure as the sun comes up in the morning. I can think of at least 5 newbies last night who came in, dropped their little pearls of wisdom, and then went silent once the game turned around.

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 09:08 AM
You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?

:coffee:

Constructive criticism of the team when it's not playing well is one thing, bitching like a spoiled teenage girl is another. Guess which group you fall into, bud? :coffee:

RoethlisBURGHer
09-30-2008, 09:09 AM
You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?

:coffee:

I'm not drinking any koolaid....it's iced tea.

And I realize that this team has some problems. However, I don't want to sift through pages upon pages of fire Arians, bench Ben, fire Tomlin posts after every game...and I am pretty sure that most of the people here don't want to do the same thing either.

I realize this team has some holes. However, those holes aren't going to get changed overnight. Hell, we're stuck with a rather crappy offensive line probally the rest of the season unless some people (aka backups) step up and make the line better. There is nobody we can sign who is a free agent that's going to imrove this line. There isn't a guy I believe we can get in a trade to improve this line. It needs rebuilt, and that'll take some time.

Yes, Ben holds on to the ball too long, like I said in my original post. However, if you want him to throw it away every single time, then we're gonna lose out on a good number of big plays and punt the ball away. Like I said before, it's high rist/high reward but much of the time it's worth it because of the reward.

revefsreleets
09-30-2008, 09:30 AM
Fire Arians! Fire Tomlin! Fire...

Oh, wait...wrong thread...sorry:wink02:

Seriously, there is the troll contigency, and only like 6-8 real posters here who are guilty of this nonsense...they just make it seem worse because they post the same 5 stupid things over and over and over. It's like spamming up our board...

Edman
09-30-2008, 09:37 AM
Don't jump in the fans for booing and being critical. The team WAS NOT playing well. In Pittsburgh, if you suck, you're gonna hear it. The first half last night was probably the worst I've ever seen the Steelers play at home in a long time. The fans let them have it.

Ben stepped up as a leader and got pissed at the team in the locker room. Sure enough, it worked.

Giving up is a different story.

Penn St Steelers
09-30-2008, 09:45 AM
I seriously don't understand why everybodies so worried anyways, I mean the last 2 weeks we have played 2 of the best D's in the NFL (and the Eagles in their home) and I mean we hate the Ravens but c-mon now, their D' is awesome and they send everything but the kitchen sink on every down......coming away after being down 13-3 late in the 3rd quarter with a win last night to me was something to be said about this team (even more so when we were down to our 4th RB).......

atlsteelers
09-30-2008, 09:59 AM
i still dislike arians. but i am glad we won. i also feel the fans can boo all they want. the offense deserved it.

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 10:07 AM
Don't jump in the fans for booing and being critical. The team WAS NOT playing well. In Pittsburgh, if you suck, you're gonna hear it. The first half last night was probably the worst I've ever seen the Steelers play at home in a long time. The fans let them have it.

Ben stepped up as a leader and got pissed at the team in the locker room. Sure enough, it worked.

Giving up is a different story.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the hometown fans booing, Ed. I remember very well the games at TRS back in the 70's and 80's and it was rare you ever heard a boo from anyone, even when the team didn't play well. It's these new-aged spoiled Steelers "fans" that I have a problem with. Probably three quarters of them didn't live through the lean years in the 80's and early 90's before Cowher came on board and turned things around, or are bandwagon jumpers who hopped on when we got our 5th ring in 2005.

I have no problem at all with constructive criticism, which is what Ben issued in the locker room at the half. It is the destructive criticism and unrelentless bashing and "fed up" bullshit that I do have a problem with. If you're going to call yourself a Steelers fan, damn it, BELIEVE IN THEM!!

revefsreleets
09-30-2008, 10:08 AM
Hey, where'd my post go!?!?

steelpride12
09-30-2008, 10:10 AM
Pointing out problems is one thing. Outright giving up before HALFTIME, like you did last night, is entirely another.

How's that crow tasting?

I also find it absolutely amazing the number of "fans" who show up during the gameday thread when the team is losing, and then you never hear from them again when they're winning. It happens as sure as the sun comes up in the morning. I can think of at least 5 newbies last night who came in, dropped their little pearls of wisdom, and then went silent once the game turned around.

Halftime? They gave in the second quarter and were saying time for a drink, time to turn this off.

Thats why they play the game and us real fans understand that and watched our team to victory. Yes all the people that show up on gamedays i never see post then all of all sudden we have a few bad plays and there gone. Pathetic, but for all the true fans HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 10:12 AM
I also find it absolutely amazing the number of "fans" who show up during the gameday thread when the team is losing, and then you never hear from them again when they're winning. It happens as sure as the sun comes up in the morning. I can think of at least 5 newbies last night who came in, dropped their little pearls of wisdom, and then went silent once the game turned around.

I can think of a number of others who have actually been members for a while who pretty much NEVER post otherwise doing the exact same thing.

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 10:14 AM
Hey, where'd my post go!?!?

It wasn't deleted by either of us as far as I can see, revs. It may be the problems with the database rearing its ugly head again. :mad: Try to re-post. I've had that happen to me quite a few times in recent days.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 10:34 AM
Constructive criticism of the team when it's not playing well is one thing, bitching like a spoiled teenage girl is another. Guess which group you fall into, bud? :coffee:

Can we all just please try to get along? This post seems somewhat condescending to fellow Steeler fans.


The OP is right. All the "Ben holds onto the ball too long", "Fire Arians", "This is the worst O-line ever", "Mewelde Moore is useless" posters are now back on the bandwagon........and the sky isnt falling for at least another 6 days. :chuckle:

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 10:56 AM
Can we all just please try to get along? This post seems somewhat condescending to fellow Steeler fans.



And the post fansince was replying to (which was directed at him) wasn't condescending, not to mention blatantly ignorant? :doh:

You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?


If you fire the tainted dart around here, there is a 99.99999% chance you are going to get it back.

revefsreleets
09-30-2008, 11:02 AM
Yup...the database errors ate it up...a couple others in the political threads (although that's probably all for the best...I wish the database errors would eat ALL the political threads up!).

It was just me being a sarcastic smart ass again anyway...

memphissteelergirl
09-30-2008, 11:08 AM
Constructive criticism of the team when it's not playing well is one thing, bitching like a spoiled teenage girl is another. :coffee:

Nicely played! :thumbsup::chuckle: :applaudit:

I have no problem at all with constructive criticism, which is what Ben issued in the locker room at the half. It is the destructive criticism and unrelentless bashing and "fed up" bullshit that I do have a problem with. If you're going to call yourself a Steelers fan, damn it, BELIEVE IN THEM!!

I said in another post I would NEVER boo my own team, and I stand by that. Do I get p*ssed off when they're playing like crap? Of course I do! But the bashing can get a little out of hand.

X-Terminator
09-30-2008, 11:15 AM
i still dislike arians. but i am glad we won. i also feel the fans can boo all they want. the offense deserved it.

They can boo all they want, sure. But I reserve the right to call them a bunch of ungrateful, spoiled brats whenever they do it. In all my years and all of the sporting events I have ever attended, the only time I've ever booed was for the opposing team. Booing your own team does nothing to help the team - it is counterproductive. It's also hypocritical for some of our fans to say it's perfectly fine to boo your own team, but then turn around and bash Pats* fans for doing the same. Where's the difference?

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 11:17 AM
And the post fansince was replying to (which was directed at him) wasn't condescending, not to mention blatantly ignorant? :doh:

.

I wouldnt say "blatantly ignorant", but rather informed and frustrated at the very kind of posters that complain like fansince refers to.

I realize that the whiney haters that come in and cry the sky is falling with no visual evidence to support the argeument, have irritated me in the past and have vowed to no longer let them get to me.

As for the dart you refer to......you mean if somebody fires one at me, THEN its OK for me to lash out and reply in a somewhat condescending tone of name calling? Cool, thanks!! :thumbsup:

blkngld68
09-30-2008, 11:23 AM
Tomlin will get the ship righted. There is plenty of vetern leadership on this team that will keep everyone focused. Yes, the offense is struggling, but that is where the defense will keep this team in it game after game.

Maybe the second half comeback back will get the offense on track.Time will only tell. Hopefully going into the bye week 5-1,will let the guys get healed up enough for the final stretches and keep rolling into the playoffs.

Buckle up your helmets, it will be fun and interesting rest of the season.

HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!!!!!!!!!!:tt02:

LVSteelersfan
09-30-2008, 11:24 AM
I have no problem at all with constructive criticism, which is what Ben issued in the locker room at the half. It is the destructive criticism and unrelentless bashing and "fed up" bullshit that I do have a problem with. If you're going to call yourself a Steelers fan, damn it, BELIEVE IN THEM!!

Here here. I was getting PO'ed last night reading threads on all 4 Steelers boards that I participate in. (yes, I can't get enough of it so I do other boards as well) I am called a kool-aid drinker and much worse but I don't care. Give me a break all you naysayers. We are 3-1 and leading the division despite all of the crap. We have problems, YES. Arians playcalling is despicable. YES. The Oline has serious blocking problems. YES. We all know that. I don't care what you people say. I stick with them through thick and thin and believe we will win every game. Root for your team and show that you are a true fan or STFU. We don't want to hear it.

blkngld68
09-30-2008, 11:28 AM
By righting the ship,for clarification before i get torched. Tomlin will get the backup guys, that will be moving into the starting roll, going.

Penn St Steelers
09-30-2008, 11:30 AM
By righting the ship,for clarification before i get torched. Tomlin will get the backup guys, that will be moving into the starting roll, going.

your right, his post game presser basically stated this, how yes injuries happened (thus is football was his remark) and the back-ups will fill these spots and be counted on.....

Hapa
09-30-2008, 11:43 AM
I think it's plain dumb to boo your own team at home. If you want them to play well, you should cheer them on. Booing is a sign of disrespect

ChronoCross
09-30-2008, 12:15 PM
wow.. Its funny, instead of paying attention to the game, people were on here crying before half. Do not touch the forums until after the game that way you do not look like a fair weather fan are looser, speaking before the game is over.

I have a ritual I follow ever game and one of them rituals is do not post on forums during games, and the online voice chat community I belong to, I am not even on for that. I turn off my monitor and pay attention to the game and only the game. The crybabies from last night know who you are, try turning off your monitor and not posting crap until the game is over that way you do not look like a moron, bandwagon, are fair weather fan.

GutterflowerSteel
09-30-2008, 12:48 PM
Constructive criticism is one thing - but to hear the same pissing and moaning over and over again is just counterproductive and a waste of time. I watch every game until the team walks off the field, win or lose. Sure, I may get disheartened at some of the things that I see during the game, but whining about it won't change the outcome. Besides, I would NEVER give up on the Steelers!! I first became a football fan during the Kordell era, for God's sake *lol* When the team overcomes adversity the way that they did last night - it makes the victory that much sweeter. :tt02:

Sharkissle29
09-30-2008, 12:50 PM
So is it a new rule on this board that once you criticize the pittsburgh steelers you're a bandwagoner? That doesn't sound logical to me. I was definitely one of those people who were questioning ben, thinking he should get a week or two off because i think maybe he is more hurt than we all think (ball sailing on him/gunshy etc.) How dare you call someone a bandwagoner for saying something like that. i've been a diehard steelers fan since the day i was born, and i dont find it wrong to be a little critical when things DO LOOK LIKE THE SKY IS FALLING. You have to admit that first half was probably the worst you've ever seen the offense play (maybe next to the eagles game performance). Why not vent a little?? We were all obviously pissed off

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 12:53 PM
So is it a new rule on this board that once you criticize the pittsburgh steelers you're a bandwagoner? That doesn't sound logical to me.

Giving up on a game before halftime when trailing by only 10 is logical? There are 60 minutes in a game, not 30. And there's a big difference between criticism and out-and-out whining.

MACH1
09-30-2008, 12:54 PM
but, but, but if sweed started we'd be undefeated.:chuckle:

X-Terminator
09-30-2008, 12:56 PM
So is it a new rule on this board that once you criticize the pittsburgh steelers you're a bandwagoner? That doesn't sound logical to me. I was definitely one of those people who were questioning ben, thinking he should get a week or two off because i think maybe he is more hurt than we all think (ball sailing on him/gunshy etc.) How dare you call someone a bandwagoner for saying something like that. i've been a diehard steelers fan since the day i was born, and i dont find it wrong to be a little critical when things DO LOOK LIKE THE SKY IS FALLING. You have to admit that first half was probably the worst you've ever seen the offense play (maybe next to the eagles game performance). Why not vent a little?? We were all obviously pissed off

Talk about a leap of faith.

Questioning/criticizing the team is not the problem. Doing nothing but bash the team and QUITTING ON THEM when the game isn't even half over IS. You completely missed the point, just as everyone else does when their behavior as "fans" gets questioned.

BTW, I brought up several times in the Gameday thread about Ben looking gunshy and having happy feet. I don't recall getting bashed for it. Why? Because I did it constructively and didn't go on and on with "this team sucks" and "this game is over." Simple, really.

PalmerSteel
09-30-2008, 01:05 PM
yeah, people that are highly emotional should stay away from the forum during and right after game to not post on emotion :)
i know during the game watching i didnt blame the crowd a bit for booing. wasnt the fact they were just playing like crap. it was how inept they looked and the horrid play callign at times. it was really making me cringe because we truly looked like the worst offense in the nfl most of the night. we pulled it out and thats a good thing but if you hear the pittsburgh home crowd booing, there is usually a damn good reason for it and there was last night and i am sure the whole steelers roster and coaches would have agreed. thank you

Sharkissle29
09-30-2008, 01:12 PM
Talk about a leap of faith.

Questioning/criticizing the team is not the problem. Doing nothing but bash the team and QUITTING ON THEM when the game isn't even half over IS. You completely missed the point, just as everyone else does when their behavior as "fans" gets questioned.

BTW, I brought up several times in the Gameday thread about Ben looking gunshy and having happy feet. I don't recall getting bashed for it. Why? Because I did it constructively and didn't go on and on with "this team sucks" and "this game is over." Simple, really.

then i guess i have missed the point haha, i wasnt saying stuff like that i dont think im the one at fault here. i just get defensive when people get all up in my fanhood.

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 03:12 PM
I wouldnt say "blatantly ignorant", but rather informed and frustrated at the very kind of posters that complain like fansince refers to.

I realize that the whiney haters that come in and cry the sky is falling with no visual evidence to support the argeument, have irritated me in the past and have vowed to no longer let them get to me.

As for the dart you refer to......you mean if somebody fires one at me, THEN its OK for me to lash out and reply in a somewhat condescending tone of name calling? Cool, thanks!! :thumbsup:

Sorry there El-Gonzo, but I found it to be quite ignorant. Informed? It was a cheap shot at my fellow Mod which is indirectly a cheap shot at me, as well, as Gary and I pretty much agree on our actions around here.

The name calling was initiated by the poster who fansince replied to, i.e. "Mr. Fan Policeman". We are asked to do a job around here and trust me - we let a LOT go as we try not to overmoderate. However, as I've said until I'm purple, most times when we post, we post as REGULAR members, which we are before being Mods.

Hey - if someone flame throws you unjustifiably, have at it. Just be sure your response is in line with the board COC which can be found in the Announcements forum under "Laws of the Land". Most members, and particularly newbs who come here to B & M during and after a game (particularly when the team is losing or does lose) don't take the time to bother to read the rules - they just start flappin' the yaps and throw their daggers.

Crow-Magnon
09-30-2008, 05:46 PM
That troll won't have the stones to show back up here.

The Fed Up thread was closed, so I couldn't post a reply there.

I can take my lumps. The Steelers won, the Ravens lost. That's it in a nutshell. They are 3-1 and the Ravens are 2-1, so Pittsburgh now leads the AFCN.

I had a fun week or so posting on steelersfever.com and I'll back in December when the Steelers come to Baltimore. One of us is going to be playing for the division title, as it looks like Cleveland and Cicinnati are not going to compete.

This was a good test for Flacco. He made a few rookie mistakes, but he looked a damned sight better than Boller ever did. At least I'll take that from this game. Any loss in OT isn't that bad.

iloveben7
09-30-2008, 05:55 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree on the hometown fans booing, Ed. I remember very well the games at TRS back in the 70's and 80's and it was rare you ever heard a boo from anyone, even when the team didn't play well. It's these new-aged spoiled Steelers "fans" that I have a problem with. Probably three quarters of them didn't live through the lean years in the 80's and early 90's before Cowher came on board and turned things around, or are bandwagon jumpers who hopped on when we got our 5th ring in 2005.

I have no problem at all with constructive criticism, which is what Ben issued in the locker room at the half. It is the destructive criticism and unrelentless bashing and "fed up" bullshit that I do have a problem with. If you're going to call yourself a Steelers fan, damn it, BELIEVE IN THEM!!

Every single one of your posts I agree with. I think it's completely wrong to boo your own darn team. I'm a new fan (only since 04), but I didn't jump on the bandwagon, I just wasn't into football. Making the story short, I saw some highlights of Ben playing in college and was interested to see how he did and I've been hooked ever since.

steelpride12
09-30-2008, 05:55 PM
The Fed Up thread was closed, so I couldn't post a reply there.

I can take my lumps. The Steelers won, the Ravens lost. That's it in a nutshell. They are 3-1 and the Ravens are 2-1, so Pittsburgh now leads the AFCN.

I had a fun week or so posting on steelersfever.com and I'll back in December when the Steelers come to Baltimore. One of us is going to be playing for the division title, as it looks like Cleveland and Cicinnati are not going to compete.

This was a good test for Flacco. He made a few rookie mistakes, but he looked a damned sight better than Boller ever did. At least I'll take that from this game. Any loss in OT isn't that bad.

Nice trash talking with you, and will look forward to hearing from you in December, but surely we will be resting out starters for the playoffs the division is ours :flap:!

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 05:57 PM
The Fed Up thread was closed, so I couldn't post a reply there.

I can take my lumps. The Steelers won, the Ravens lost. That's it in a nutshell. They are 3-1 and the Ravens are 2-1, so Pittsburgh now leads the AFCN.

I had a fun week or so posting on steelersfever.com and I'll back in December when the Steelers come to Baltimore. One of us is going to be playing for the division title, as it looks like Cleveland and Cicinnati are not going to compete.

This was a good test for Flacco. He made a few rookie mistakes, but he looked a damned sight better than Boller ever did. At least I'll take that from this game. Any loss in OT isn't that bad.

Thanks for the extremely classy post, Crow. :drink: It was a hard fought game and thankfully, the Steelers pulled it out. Jeff Reed is Mr. Automatic and I had no doubt he would nail that FG in OT. :tt03:

Flacco is a rising star - I have no doubt about that. He was so poised last night and took his lumps like a pro without whining to the refs. He also has a very strong and fairly accurate throw and I really think the Rats ought to think about signing him LT.

See you in December! :drink:

Ozman58
09-30-2008, 05:57 PM
Might be new to the site, but I remember watching Mark Malone bouncing balls to Louis Lipps from the stands growing up, and I still went to every game in my grandpa's season ticket files.

I know the post was not intended for me as I posted like 2 seconds after signing up, I can't stand fair weather fans either.

Regarding the hometown fans booing, I took some flak at work (in oklahoma) for that this morning form the biggest Ubunch of fair weather (Ou Sooners) fans there are. I told em that if we boo, we mean it.

The first half was pitiful last night and they deserved to know the fans weren't just unhappy, but disgusted with the offense seriously since week 1.

I guess the moral is we don't boo, unless we really really mean it.

VTsteel
09-30-2008, 05:58 PM
Mods, if you feel this should be moved to the blast furnace, go ahead. I am posting it here so it's seen by the people it's intended for.

You people know who you are. You are the entire "the sky is falling" group every time the Steelers don't score a TD, every time the other team gets a first down, every time there is a penalty against the Steelers.

You are the fire the coaching staff people, the bench Ben Roethlisberger people, the "we should have drafted an offensive lineman in the first round" people.

Most of you joined right after the Eagles loss. You are a wolf in sheep's clothing. I don't think you guys are Steelers fans, but fans of other teams coming over here to cause trouble.

And to the longer tenured members, please stop with the entire sky is falling garbage. We aren't going to go 16-0, we aren't going to play every game perfect. The offensive line is not that good, deal with it instead of regurgitating the same stuff on a daily basis.

Bruce Arians is probally not getting fired during the season. A major coaching change like that can really throw a team off. We have won a division title and are currently 3-1 and in the division lead with him at OC. While there may be a change in the offseason, it probally won't happen in season so just deal with it.

Ben Roethlisberger holds onto the ball to long. Yes, at times that'll end up in sacks. That is also why he threw a TD pass to Santonio Holmes last night. It's high risk, high reward...but I'll take the risk as long as we get plenty of the reward. Just get used to it, that's the way it's going to be.

/rant

Well said!

:tt02:

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 05:59 PM
The Fed Up thread was closed, so I couldn't post a reply there.

I can take my lumps. The Steelers won, the Ravens lost. That's it in a nutshell. They are 3-1 and the Ravens are 2-1, so Pittsburgh now leads the AFCN.

I had a fun week or so posting on steelersfever.com and I'll back in December when the Steelers come to Baltimore. One of us is going to be playing for the division title, as it looks like Cleveland and Cicinnati are not going to compete.

This was a good test for Flacco. He made a few rookie mistakes, but he looked a damned sight better than Boller ever did. At least I'll take that from this game. Any loss in OT isn't that bad.

Props to you on coming back. See you in December. :drink:

iloveben7
09-30-2008, 06:01 PM
Constructive criticism is one thing - but to hear the same pissing and moaning over and over again is just counterproductive and a waste of time. I watch every game until the team walks off the field, win or lose. Sure, I may get disheartened at some of the things that I see during the game, but whining about it won't change the outcome. Besides, I would NEVER give up on the Steelers!! I first became a football fan during the Kordell era, for God's sake *lol* When the team overcomes adversity the way that they did last night - it makes the victory that much sweeter. :tt02:

I do the exact same thing. The Steelers or whoever (Pitt, Pirates) i'm watching or at the game cheering on, I do not leave that stadium or turn off the tv until the clock says zero or the bottom of the 9th with 3 outs. That's what a true fan should do, instead of leaving the game or turning the tv off in the middle of it and basically giving up on your team. When you leave that game or turn off your TV early, you are basically saying "I can't watch this game anymore because I don't have faith that my team can win it."

VTsteel
09-30-2008, 06:04 PM
The Fed Up thread was closed, so I couldn't post a reply there.

I can take my lumps. The Steelers won, the Ravens lost. That's it in a nutshell. They are 3-1 and the Ravens are 2-1, so Pittsburgh now leads the AFCN.

I had a fun week or so posting on steelersfever.com and I'll back in December when the Steelers come to Baltimore. One of us is going to be playing for the division title, as it looks like Cleveland and Cicinnati are not going to compete.

This was a good test for Flacco. He made a few rookie mistakes, but he looked a damned sight better than Boller ever did. At least I'll take that from this game. Any loss in OT isn't that bad.


A little class out of Baltimore? Cool! I hope you find the discussions before our next game with you all just as spirited.

stillers4me
09-30-2008, 06:10 PM
In the past, I've always been against the booing of your own team.

But last night the boo birds did what nothing else has accomplished.........Ben called out his guys! He said he was tired of being booed and tired of being embarrassed by them! Look what happened! Finally, Ben had just a few more seconds to throw and in usual Ben fashion, he took matters into his own hands and held on to the momentum the defense created! That oline is not in any way near an elite group........but we saw what happened when Ben (God love ya!) had finally said enough is enough! And it took the boobirds to make it happen. I'm proud of ya, big guy!

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80b3f173

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 06:17 PM
In the past, I've always been against the booing of your own team.

But last night the boo birds did what nothing else has accomplished.........Ben called out his guys! He said he was tired of being booed and tired of being embarrassed by them! Look what happened! Finally, Ben had just a few more seconds to throw and in usual Ben fashion, he took matters into his own hands and held on to the momentum the defense created! That oline is not in any way near an elite group........but we saw what happened when Ben (God love ya!) had finally said enough is enough! And it took the boobirds to make it happen. I'm proud of ya, big guy!

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80b3f173

Another step in the maturation of Ben. About time he jumped their asses instead of saying they did a great job after he'd been sacked again another 5-7 times.

Texasteel
09-30-2008, 07:14 PM
We'll have to agree to disagree on the hometown fans booing, Ed. I remember very well the games at TRS back in the 70's and 80's and it was rare you ever heard a boo from anyone, even when the team didn't play well. It's these new-aged spoiled Steelers "fans" that I have a problem with. Probably three quarters of them didn't live through the lean years in the 80's and early 90's before Cowher came on board and turned things around, or are bandwagon jumpers who hopped on when we got our 5th ring in 2005.

I have no problem at all with constructive criticism, which is what Ben issued in the locker room at the half. It is the destructive criticism and unrelentless bashing and "fed up" bullshit that I do have a problem with. If you're going to call yourself a Steelers fan, damn it, BELIEVE IN THEM!!

I may be the head homer here, but like the lady said, I've seen years that were a hell of lot worse that most of you, and the idea of booing the Steelers just never occurred to me.

steel striker
09-30-2008, 07:34 PM
Giving up on a game before halftime when trailing by only 10 is logical? There are 60 minutes in a game, not 30. And there's a big difference between criticism and out-and-out whining.

I agree 76 just because we played bad for one half our defense kept us close then the no huddle save the day. It's not so much how you start but, it is all about how you finish. Not to change threads here but, after the Lamar's td from the fumble recovery the jerks calling the game did not know what to say. All they could muster is wow the game has turned.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 08:20 PM
I cant remember the exact circumstances when the crowd started booing. What was it exactly again?? Was it the 3rd and 1 pass play from shotgun?

For some reason I thought....."they gotta be booing the playcall and the result". My other feelings were "4th game of the season and its already come to this??"

Anyways, as Belicheat says "movin on to next week......we're movin on".

Michael Keller
09-30-2008, 08:27 PM
Placing labels on people or specfically football fans is unintelligent way to communicate. We all have opinions and they vary. Mine is now becoming very clear. # 1- Mike Tomlin has coached for 1 full season and 25 percent of this season and he is not a good coach. Pure and simple. Hiring Tomlin was a mistake. Bruce Arians is not a good coach. The Steelers have drafted very poorly the past several years and this failure to bring in new talent is catching up with them.

My sincere hope is that one of the Rooneys , be it Dan or Art Jr. recognizes the problems and changes are made sooner or later. They made a mistake when they hired Tomlin and as each game is played this will become more and more the popular opinion. This is not an emotional evaluation on my part but an evaluation that has been building up over the last year and half. I am not kidding myself .

For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "

hizmi
09-30-2008, 08:27 PM
I propose creating a permanent vent thread where people can whine about arians/o-line/ben etc. w/o repercussion, so long as all venting and only venting is done in there.

hizmi
09-30-2008, 08:29 PM
Placing labels on people or specfically football fans is unintelligent way to communicate. We all have opinions and they vary. Mine is now becoming very clear. # 1- Mike Tomlin has coached for 1 full season and 25 percent of this season and he is not a good coach. Pure and simple. Hiring Tomlin was a mistake. Bruce Arians is not a good coach. The Steelers have drafted very poorly the past several years and this failure to bring in new talent is catching up with them.

My sincere hope is that one of the Rooneys , be it Dan or Art Jr. recognizes the problems and changes are made sooner or later. They made a mistake when they hired Tomlin and as each game is played this will become more and more the popular opinion. This is not an emotional evaluation on my part but an evaluation that has been building up over the last year and half. I am not kidding myself .

For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "

i think the better question is what makes tomlin a poor coach?

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 08:33 PM
For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "

He took an 8-8 underachieving team that was snakebit by injuries to a 10-6 record and into the playoffs as a rookie HC. I honestly think the jury is still out on Tomlin personally, as 20 games isn't nearly a big enough body of work to judge by. However, I still like the hire mainly because I trust the Rooneys' (particularly Dan's) judgment and track record with HCs. Who do you feel the Rooneys should have hired since Tomlin in your mind was a poor choice? For the record, I wanted them to hire Grimm before they got Tomlin.

X-Terminator
09-30-2008, 08:37 PM
Placing labels on people or specfically football fans is unintelligent way to communicate. We all have opinions and they vary. Mine is now becoming very clear. # 1- Mike Tomlin has coached for 1 full season and 25 percent of this season and he is not a good coach. Pure and simple. Hiring Tomlin was a mistake. Bruce Arians is not a good coach. The Steelers have drafted very poorly the past several years and this failure to bring in new talent is catching up with them.

My sincere hope is that one of the Rooneys , be it Dan or Art Jr. recognizes the problems and changes are made sooner or later. They made a mistake when they hired Tomlin and as each game is played this will become more and more the popular opinion. This is not an emotional evaluation on my part but an evaluation that has been building up over the last year and half. I am not kidding myself .

For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "

You're entitled to your opinion, but I'm sorry, you still sound like the stereotypical Steelers fan that I go on about in this forum. If he isn't perfect, he isn't any good, and patience be damned. That's MY opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

Having said that, the only problem I have with Tomlin is that he needs to take a little more hands-on approach whenever things go wrong, but that just isn't his nature. He trusts his coordinators, he treats his players like men and trusts them to go out and get the job done. That's why he doesn't whine about injuries and instead expects the backups to carry the slack. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that approach. Tony Dungy and Lovie Smith are the same types of coaches, and both have had a LOT of success, and are two men I have a great deal of respect for. Those are a few of the things that I like about Tomlin and why I feel he's the right man for the job. You are obviously beholden to a "fire and brimstone" kind of coach like Cowher was, and that's fine. It still doesn't change how I view your opinion. You are probably one who wanted either Whiz or Grimm to take over as head coach, and if so, I have to ask you - what exactly has Whiz done in Arizona other than underachieve with a team that has a lot of talent in its own right? And if Grimm is so great, why hasn't he gotten one of the numerous HC jobs that he's interviewed for over the years, including the Steelers job? There is a reason for everything.

VTsteel
09-30-2008, 08:41 PM
For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "


Jeez . . . Just off the top of my head . . . Got rid of Porter and gave the job to Harrison, suggested bringing in Moore and Fox, got rid of Faneca admitted a mistake in Mahan and got us Hartwig, Brought us two very good Linebackers (Timmons and Woodley), Keeps his players loose and his drive to win is infectious.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 08:46 PM
I propose creating a permanent vent thread where people can whine about arians/o-line/ben etc. w/o repercussion, so long as all venting and only venting is done in there.


I second the motion!!! :tt03:

Preacher
09-30-2008, 08:50 PM
Come on People.

From the dictionary

Criticism: the art of evaluating or analyzing works of art or literature ; also : writings expressing such evaluation or analysis <an anthology of literary criticism>

I have no problem with someone evaluating and analyzing our Steelers. hey, our line has serious issues. There are times when our scheming is at issue, and that is the offensive coaches. There are some other issues.

The problem however, is the VAST SWEEPING REMARKS and pigeonholing one or two people for the problems on the entire team.

Now, I am not a mod. My words mean nothing around here... the same as everyone else. But for me... that is the issue.

X-Terminator
09-30-2008, 08:52 PM
Jeez . . . Just off the top of my head . . . Got rid of Porter and gave the job to Harrison, suggested bringing in Moore and Fox, got rid of Faneca admitted a mistake in Mahan and got us Hartwig, Brought us two very good Linebackers (Timmons and Woodley), Keeps his players loose and his drive to win is infectious.

You said it better than I did.

I might also add that Tomlin is NOT the final authority when it comes to drafting. We do have a GM, and his name is Kevin Colbert. He takes input from Tomlin, and Cowher before him, but he ultimately has the final say in who they draft. Also Michael, why do you throw your poison darts at Tomlin for his drafts (which has already produced 3 very good players in Timmons, Woodley and Sepulveda, with 2 more on the way in Sweed and Mendenhall), why no darts at your precious Bill Cowher? I didn't see any stud OL drafted during his final couple of years as HC, and the line struggled big time in his last 2 years (how we all forget how mediocre the OL was before the Steelers went on their run to the SB in 2005). But Cowher gets a pass, while Tomlin should be fired in your estimation. Doesn't seem fair to me.

millwalldavey
09-30-2008, 08:54 PM
UNITED BY BLACK AND GOLD WE ARE ALL BROTHERS!

MIKE TOMLIN IS MY COACH!

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 09:06 PM
.

For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion. Instead please tell me what Mike Tomlin does that really impresses you that is unique and outstanding about him that makes him a good NFL coach. Please do not state "when he walks in the room, you can"t helped be impressed. "

First of all, I am not a fan of Arians system....but do think he is a good coach and has a creative offense. I just think his creativity has been on holidays lately. Where was this "pony backfield", or some screen passes or play action??

Secondly, I believe the Steelers have not drafted for need, but for the most taken the BAA, which is not necessarily "drafting poorly". Timmons, Woodley, Spaeth, Sepulveda, Gay, McFadden, Taylor, Holmes, are all products of Steeler drafts. I believe that the Steelers do a good job of developing talent rather than looking for talent on the Free Agent market. They just havent addressed O line or D line and in some cases the talent wasnt there to be had.

As for your question about Tomlin. All I know is from what I have read about him and seen in interviews, but here's why I like him.

1. He has coached, apprenticed under Dungy, Gruden, Kiffin, Childress and others for over a decade.

2. He is a leader of men, not by dictatorship or mental gamesmanship, but by brutal honesty of where they stand and what they need to do to accomplish their goals. If a player is or isnt doing something.....he tells them. He doesnt try to "send a message"....he flat out tells them.

3. He has the respect of his players and relates to his players. Age brings experience, but also brings a generation gap. Tomlin is one of the guys, but they know he is "the man".

4. He is a tireless student of the game. He apparantly has tons of notes, plays, coaching points that he has sponged from his decade plus of coaching and appears to learn from all those experiences.

5. He is humble enough to recognize not to fix what aint broken. The vain thing would be to install a 4-3 because he knows it, but instead chooses to go with what works. Just ask Michigan fans if they like Rich Rod and his spread offense.Tomlin brings experience, youth, leadership and upside to the job. What he will continue to improve in is managing the coaches under him(and in turn the team), rather than coaching the players he used to as a position coach/ co-ordinator.

The Rooneys got it right with Mike Tomlin.

HometownGal
09-30-2008, 09:22 PM
I propose creating a permanent vent thread where people can whine about arians/o-line/ben etc. w/o repercussion, so long as all venting and only venting is done in there.

That would never fly here, hizmi. We've had some problems over the years with people venting on each other in the Blast Furnace, only to have the flame wars carry over into the other forums. A forum as large as SF brings with it a lot of totally different personalities and opposite viewpoints. No matter how much we may disagree with each other from time to time, most of us are united in our love and support of the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL! :drink::tt02:

Originally Posted by Michael Keller
Placing labels on people or specfically football fans is unintelligent way to communicate. For those of you who disagree Please do not put a label on my opinion.

No disrespect intended here (honestly), but as XT said above, you are coming across strongly as the typical impatient and destructively critical Steelers "fan".

As I've said many times, constructive criticism is always welcome - it can be a learning experience for even the most knowledgeable fan (I've learned in life's journeys that the learning experience is an ongoing privilege!). However, destructive criticism will always be challenged by me, as I am an optimist and always try to see the positive in the majority of situations that I have encountered already in life or may encounter in the future.

You don't want to be labled as the typical stereotypical Steelers fan that is being called out in this thread?

Try the shoe on before you actually wear it.

lilyoder6
09-30-2008, 09:25 PM
come on now.. if tony kornheisar can like him y can't u.. lol

Michael Keller
09-30-2008, 10:04 PM
That would never fly here, hizmi. We've had some problems over the years with people venting on each other in the Blast Furnace, only to have the flame wars carry over into the other forums. A forum as large as SF brings with it a lot of totally different personalities and opposite viewpoints. No matter how much we may disagree with each other from time to time, most of us are united in our love and support of the greatest franchise in the history of the NFL! :drink::tt02:

No disrespect intended here (honestly), but as XT said above, you are coming across strongly as the typical impatient and destructively critical Steelers "fan".

As I've said many times, constructive criticism is always welcome - it can be a learning experience for even the most knowledgeable fan (I've learned in life's journeys that the learning experience is an ongoing privilege!). However, destructive criticism will always be challenged by me, as I am an optimist and always try to see the positive in the majority of situations that I have encountered already in life or may encounter in the future.

You don't want to be labled as the typical stereotypical Steelers fan that is being called out in this thread?

Try the shoe on before you actually wear it.

I do not mind being labled by any fans on this forum. Labeling people is not how I think and quite frankly I find it amusing . I honestly believe Mike Tomlin is not a good coach and I am sure that upsets people. It upsets me because i love the Steelers and I feel we are stuck for a period of time.

I am sorry but I played the game, coached the game and watched the game for many years. I am not impatient at all. I see a nasty trend here, from Colbert to Tomlin to Arians. I could wait this out and when the season ends and the Steeler fans start to dump on Tomlin I will not say I told you so. I just think he is not the man for the job. I defended him last year because he deserved a chance but I have crossed over and I taken a position I sincerely believe in . It is

This is one of the easiest evaluations I have to make. Only way Tomlin survives after 4 years is he hires a Dick Lebeau like offensive coordinator .

HTG I really do not pay attention to many posts but I have paid attentionj to yours. You should always remain an optimist and I am sure you will. I am basically an optimist also but I sincerely want to see some radical changes in the Steelers organization. Again I do not like the trend. It is as simple as that. No big neurotic dynamics going on here.

fansince'76
09-30-2008, 10:09 PM
I just think he is not the man for the job. I defended him last year because he deserved a chance but I have crossed over and I taken a position I sincerely believe in .

What has changed so dramatically over basically 4 games then? 75% of which we have won?

cubanstogie
09-30-2008, 10:09 PM
i think the better question is what makes tomlin a poor coach?

I agree with that question 100%. You can't possibly judge a coach and productivity after 20 or so games. We are 3-1, 2-0 against division rivals and we made the playoffs last year. And you call for his firing. You think its Tomlins fault our O-line is kept together with bondo. To strong of a statement made by Keller at this juncture IMO. It seems the players respect him and want to perform for him. A motivator , thats not all there is to coaching but it is a necessity. Clock management, challenging officials, time outs, etc... are a learning experience. Give the guy a chance before you crucify him. And lastly have faith in the Rooneys, we Steelers fans are a spoiled bunch. I should know I live in the bay area and we have the Raiders and 49ers. The Rooneys hired Knoll and Cowher, I think they know what to look for in a head coach. The Raiders have gone through more coaches in a season than we have in 35 years.

GBMelBlount
09-30-2008, 10:09 PM
I personally have no problem with fans booing or expressing anger or negativity sometimes. But that's just me. It’s their right. What I don’t like is people who ONLY whine, complain or boo, and NEVER offer anything positive or constructive. There is a difference in my opinion. I feel there are a few good SF posters who are being mischaracterized. There are others I've been observing, however, who simply deserve what they are getting. That's all.

Angina
09-30-2008, 10:41 PM
Personally, I never, ever boo our Steelers.

However, if things do seem to be going wrong late in a game, I will occasionally climb up on my husband's shoulders, grab onto his hair, jump up and down and yell, "YOU SAID THEY WERE GOING TO WIN!!!!! YOU SAID THEY WERE GOING TO WIN!!!!!!"

But I don't think that counts since the team can't hear it. :thumbsup:

Angina

RoethlisBURGHer
09-30-2008, 11:38 PM
The Mike Tomlin Situation:

First, I would like to hear why people think Mike Tomlin is a bad head coach. Why do you not like him? You've asked us to give you the reasons why we like him, so don't be a hypocrite...tell is why you don't like him. Also, who did you want to be hired after Cowher resigned, and who would you hire that is currently available to replace Tomlin if he were fired/resigned tomorrow? By the way, Cowher does not count as a choice.

Many people do not know enough about how the most legendary Steelers head coach, Chuck "Emperor Chaz" Noll, coached. Many of the people here I believe aren't quite old enough to remember him. I know that I have no memories of watching him myself, being born in 1985.So for most of the people here I would assume, have only seen Bill Cowher live or saw very little of Chuck Noll.

Now like I said, I don't remember seeing him coach live. However I have watched a lot of shows and videos of the Steelers from the early days to when Cowher first became coach, and beyond. I have read tons of books. I have gathered as much information as I could. I have read books multiple times because I enjoyed them. I am a Steelers junkie.

Chuck Noll was not a fire and brimstone type of head coach. He wasn't very fiery. No spittle flying. No stuffing a photo of a play in a referee's pocket. Not very much yelling and screaming at players. He was a rather stoic head coach. He won four Super Bowl championships.

Mike Tomlin reminds me a lot of Chuck Noll. His demeanor is calm. He does show more emotion at times than Chuck Noll did. Tomlin doesn't rely on making his team fear him to get them to play for him, and neither did Noll. Also, Mike Tomlin is brutally honest with his players and the media. He doesn't cut corners, he tells it as it is, no sugarcoating.

Bill Cowher was a complete 180 of Chuck Noll. He was fiery, he was brash. Spittle flying when he talked/yelled. He bashed heads with a good amount of players. But that was his style. It was blue collar and rugged, and for him it worked.

That is what we got used to over 13 years. Then he abrubtly resigned. When we all thought there was going to be a contract extension, he resigned.

Now we go back the other 180 degrees, to Mike Tomlin.

Both Cowher and Tomlin are players coaches, but I feel Cowher pulled some punches with certain players, and went out of his way to attempt a knockout blow to others.

With Tomlin, we won't have the contreversies we had between Ben Roethlisberger and Bill Cowher. If Ben is hurt, he won't try to hold the information back.

I like the fact that Mike Tomlin has given Ben Roethlisberger more control over the offense. He makes protection changes, he can audible to something else than a run up the gut. He took the handcuffs off of Ben.

Mike Tomlin allowed Arians and Ben to revise the playbook that just had plays added to it over 13 years. He allowed Ben to be a part of changing verbage and vetoing plays that he didn't like or were not comfortable with.

Mike Tomlin was a breath of fresh air to the Steelers. I loved Cowher, but the air was getting rather stagnant. it would have stayed the same if Whizenhut or Grimm were hired to replace Cowher. Tomlin shook things up in his first training camp. The vets were to relaxed, he changed that.

Another thing is people are blaming Mike Tomlin for not drafting or signing offensive and defensive linemen. Mike Tomlin is not the GM or the owner of the Pittsburgh Steelers. His responsibility lies within preparing the roster given to him. His thoughts and wants are taken into account, but it's not his final desicion.

If you look throughout the league, this is what you have:

Bill Bellicheck: Very successful, but how much of it was cheating? We will never know, his legacy is forever tarnished.

Tony Dungy: Very successful, very classy man. One of my favorite all-time non-Steelers coaches.

Jon Gruden: Once thought of as an offensive genuis, many have soured on him. He seems to be living off of winning a Super Bowl with Dungy's Buccs more than what he has done latley as a head coach.

Norv Turner: Didn't decent in DC...didn't do anything in Oakland (who can?)...is doing well as Chargers HC.

Romeo Crenell: Horrible clock managment. Doesn't dicipline players. He just can't seem to be a head coach.

Marvin Lewis: The team he coaches is full of ego-driven malcontents. He has lost his team IMHO.

That's the jist of the spectrum right there, excluding Tomlin.

All Tomlin has done is take an 8-8 team and take them to 10-6 and a division championship. We lost that playoff game because a ref missed a call in Garrard's huge run that would have taken the play back 5 yards and we would have probally won the game.

In just his second season, he has his team a 3-1 and in the division lead...undefeated in the division.

We're not the Raiders who go through coaches like most people go through underwear.

Also, of those available, excluding Cowher...this is basicly your list:

Scott Linnehan
Lane Kiffin
Brian Billick
Marty Shottenheimer

Slim pickings.

augustashark
09-30-2008, 11:40 PM
Never boo, but sure have dropped some WTF'S during the last couple of weeks. These threads always make me laugh, I could care less what other Steeler fans do or say. I have my way and no ONE will ever change how I feel or act about the team I love. If people want to come here and B&W then so be it.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-30-2008, 11:42 PM
I do not mind being labled by any fans on this forum. Labeling people is not how I think and quite frankly I find it amusing . I honestly believe Mike Tomlin is not a good coach and I am sure that upsets people. It upsets me because i love the Steelers and I feel we are stuck for a period of time.

I am sorry but I played the game, coached the game and watched the game for many years. I am not impatient at all. I see a nasty trend here, from Colbert to Tomlin to Arians. I could wait this out and when the season ends and the Steeler fans start to dump on Tomlin I will not say I told you so. I just think he is not the man for the job. I defended him last year because he deserved a chance but I have crossed over and I taken a position I sincerely believe in . .

M. Keller, what is the "nasty trend" that you see here??

The only issue I have is talking about getting younger on the O and D lines, but not doing it. There were few options in the draft, as most of the good O line talent went fast, but yeah......we could have addressed the D-line. Only real option that made sense that I could see was drafting Anthony Collins OT from Kansas in the 3rd instead of Bruce Davis.

I also was a fan of letting Max Starks go and getting a compensatory pick for him next season. That way we would have had $6.9 mil to either extend some players, or bring in some decent free agent on either line or maybe at CB.

As a former coach and player, what issues would you have playing for a guy like Mike Tomlin??

What dont you like about Bruce Arians?? Personally, I think he is a creative guy in the passing game, but his lack of emphasis on the running game concerns me as defense and a strong run game is the foundation of playoff football.

augustashark
09-30-2008, 11:50 PM
All Tomlin has done is take an 8-8 team and take them to 10-6 and a division championship. We lost that playoff game because a ref missed a call in Garrard's huge run that would have taken the play back 5 yards and we would have probally won the game.
In just his second season, he has his team a 3-1 and in the division lead...undefeated in the division.

We're not the Raiders who go through coaches like most people go through underwear.

Also, of those available, excluding Cowher...this is basicly your list:

Scott Linnehan
Lane Kiffin
Brian Billick
Marty Shottenheimer

Slim pickings.


First off I'm not a "I want Tomlin gone" fan, but with all due respect the quote above regarding the taking a 8-8 team to the playoffs does not hold that much water with me. That team was jet lagged from top to bottom from the SB run. I would have been alittle upset if we did not make it back to the playoffs that year no matter who was coaching them. We still had a very good vet team playing a softer sch. Also to disagree with the other part of the bolded quote, I think we lost that game due to us getting very conservative when we got the ball back after we took the lead.

steeler dude
09-30-2008, 11:54 PM
Let Ben run his No Huddle O

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-01-2008, 12:03 AM
First off I'm not a "I want Tomlin gone" fan, but with all due respect the quote above regarding the taking a 8-8 team to the playoffs does not hold that much water with me. That team was jet lagged from top to bottom from the SB run. I would have been alittle upset if we did not make it back to the playoffs that year no matter who was coaching them. We still had a very good vet team playing a softer sch. Also to disagree with the other part of the bolded quote, I think we lost that game due to us getting very conservative when we got the ball back after we took the lead.

But, even if the team was a 12-4 team and the rookie head coach that nobody ever heard of comes in and wins the AFC North crown........the Haters say."it had nothing to do with coaching", but if he went 8-8, they would be crying"he's a bad coach".

I'm still curious to hear what Tomlin's faults are that has some worried about his 3-1 record at the quarter pole??

fansince'76
10-01-2008, 12:06 AM
I'm still curious to hear what Tomlin's faults are that has some worried about his 3-1 record at the quarter pole??

From what I can gather, it appears to be mostly because he's not Cowher. :noidea:

augustashark
10-01-2008, 12:12 AM
But, even if the team was a 12-4 team and the rookie head coach that nobody ever heard of comes in and wins the AFC North crown........the Haters say."it had nothing to do with coaching", but if he went 8-8, they would be crying"he's a bad coach".
I'm still curious to hear what Tomlin's faults are that has some worried about his 3-1 record at the quarter pole??

Yep, comes with the job. To be on that stage you have to take the good with the bad. Every coach has faults and Tomlin has showed some of his, but to me if you keep a competitive team on the field and they fight for sixty minutes then you have a good coach and should show him the respect he deserves.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-01-2008, 12:17 AM
From what I can gather, it appears to be mostly because he's not Cowher. :noidea:

I dont think that is a true and fair assumption, but I could be wrong. Maybe the feeling is that Grimm or Whiz were more experienced and in the previous regime?

I find it strange to specifically ask that nobody uses "Tomlin's presence in a room" as a reason for why he is a good coach, but then generalize that....Arians is not a good coach, Tomlin was the wrong choice, the Steelers have drafted poorly.

Crow-Magnon
10-01-2008, 07:21 AM
Nice trash talking with you, and will look forward to hearing from you in December, but surely we will be resting out starters for the playoffs the division is ours :flap:!

Thanks, it was fun. Now I have to go and hang out on some Titans forums.

It is a wonder either or our teams had a RB or FB left to carry the ball. Our defenses can bring it, no doubt.

X-Terminator
10-01-2008, 07:23 AM
I dont think that is a true and fair assumption, but I could be wrong. Maybe the feeling is that Grimm or Whiz were more experienced and in the previous regime?

I find it strange to specifically ask that nobody uses "Tomlin's presence in a room" as a reason for why he is a good coach, but then generalize that....Arians is not a good coach, Tomlin was the wrong choice, the Steelers have drafted poorly.

Yes it is a true and fair assumption, because this guy complained all last season about Tomlin's perceived lack of emotion since he doesn't yell and scream and spit on his players like Cowher did, and because of that, he doesn't feel he's a good coach. He doesn't seem to understand or accept that not every coach is the same, that they have their own style and method of motivating the team. Mike Tomlin is NOT Bill Cowher, and he never will be. And I hate to tell him, but the Rooneys are NOT going to fire him this soon. If they didn't fire Cowher after missing the playoffs 3 straight years from 1998-2000, then they aren't going to fire Tomlin after what should be back-to-back division titles. It's a good thing the Rooneys are patient, because if this kind of fan was in charge of the team, we'd turn into the Raiders or Redskins, going through HCs and coordinators like they change their underwear.

Oh and BTW...that "bad coach," if by some odd chance he is fired within the next 5 years, wouldn't be out of work for very long. I guarantee you that.

fansince'76
10-01-2008, 08:58 AM
If they didn't fire Cowher after missing the playoffs 3 straight years from 1998-2000, then they aren't going to fire Tomlin after what should be back-to-back division titles. It's a good thing the Rooneys are patient, because if this kind of fan was in charge of the team, we'd turn into the Raiders or Redskins, going through HCs and coordinators like they change their underwear.

Which is exactly why the prospect of a "diehard fan" like Druckenmiller taking over controlling interest in this team makes me nervous.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-01-2008, 09:38 AM
Yes it is a true and fair assumption, because this guy complained all last season about Tomlin's perceived lack of emotion since he doesn't yell and scream and spit on his players like Cowher did, and because of that, he doesn't feel he's a good coach. He doesn't seem to understand or accept that not every coach is the same, that they have their own style and method of motivating the team. Mike Tomlin is NOT Bill Cowher, and he never will be. .

OK, I dont know the history of the poster. I was just trying to respect his request of not "labelling him", so didnt want to label him as a "Cowher guy", but thanks for the update.

I believe that you are correct. I have taken a couple sport psychology courses and my prof is an international consultant. We did go thru a few models of coaching styles like "The authoritarian" and "the players coach". Each has their strengths and weaknesses as you mention and each responds to different types of players differently.

The thing that I remember was it was suggested that as coaches, we find what motivates the players and adapt our style in subtle ways to get the best out of the players, but as a coach you gotta be who you are. I think Tomlin is doing that pretty well.

Hines4ever
10-01-2008, 10:05 AM
Don't jump in the fans for booing and being critical. The team WAS NOT playing well. In Pittsburgh, if you suck, you're gonna hear it. The first half last night was probably the worst I've ever seen the Steelers play at home in a long time. The fans let them have it.

Ben stepped up as a leader and got pissed at the team in the locker room. Sure enough, it worked.

Giving up is a different story.

I was at the game on Monday night.....it absolutely pained me to hear our fans booing....of course we were all upset....Yes, I'm new to the board and have only been to 2 games in my life....however, I have been a diehard fan for over 30 years. I get upset, disguisted too BUT that being said.....You just don't boo your own team......we are not Eagle fans!!!! We have more class than that!!!!!!!!!:tt02:

Penn St Steelers
10-01-2008, 10:10 AM
I was at the game on Monday night.....it absolutely pained me to hear our fans booing....of course we were all upset....Yes, I'm new to the board and have only been to 2 games in my life....however, I have been a diehard fan for over 30 years. I get upset, disguisted too BUT that being said.....You just don't boo your own team......we are not Eagle fans!!!! We have more class than that!!!!!!!!!:tt02:


I think the majority of the boo-ing on MNF was just the fans being digusted with the lack of Offensive output.........no more no less.........on a side note...Glen Rock is about 15mins from me here in Hanover.....nice to see another fan close by.....

steelpride12
10-01-2008, 10:20 AM
The Boo was not toward the team in general, just becuase afer the 8 quarters with no TD most would BOO!

It was hard to listen to the Boo's, but the black and gold nation are true fans and don't do it unless extremly necessary.

Plus hey it worked.

iloveben7
10-01-2008, 10:33 AM
No they don't always do it when extremely necessay, people boo at useless times at the beginning of games when you have 45 minutes left to play. I was at the playoff game last year against the Jags, and people were booing the whole time. I'm sorry, but i just think it's wrong to boo your own team.

The_WARDen
10-01-2008, 10:57 AM
When fans buy tickets, they have the right to cheer, boo, go get a beer, get some food, whatever they want.

If you were cheering during that 2nd quarter after 6 straight quarters of inept (that's being polite) offensive football, then that's you're right.

But fans had a right to be upset and let the team know it. Evidently, it worked because Ben said he was tired of getting booed which led to his tirade and in the second half, they were at least a functional offensive unit.

Hines4ever
10-01-2008, 11:07 AM
No they don't always do it when extremely necessay, people boo at useless times at the beginning of games when you have 45 minutes left to play. I was at the playoff game last year against the Jags, and people were booing the whole time. I'm sorry, but i just think it's wrong to boo your own team.

I agree....Well said!!!!!:applaudit:

atlsteelers
10-01-2008, 12:29 PM
boooooooooooooooo boooooooooo

Dino 6 Rings
10-01-2008, 12:43 PM
For the Record. I scream and yell and curse at our guys more than I do the other guys. Why. Because If they are not living up to my expectations, which is to destroy everyone in their path and win games by 80 points, then I feel let down.

Now if your job is to block, and you don't block, I will Scream at you. If your job is to run for 2 yards on a 3rd and 1 and you only get 1/2 yard, I will scream at you. If your job is to read a defense and see the blitzes and audible out, and you miss it, I will scream at you. If your job is to cover and tackle, and you blow your coverage and then miss a tackle on a key 3rd down play, I will scream at you. Why...because I Want Perfection.

If your job is to adjust the offense to the game situation and you don't, I will scream at you. And Curse too. If your job is to kick the ball, and you blow it, I will let you know my displeasure.

Now, if anyone, other than a Steelers fan, screams at my players, I will punch them in the face.

I don't want anyone fired, anyone traded, anyone kicked off, or benched.

I want the talent we have to perform up to the standards I have established.

Rings...Get Me Rings.

X-Terminator
10-01-2008, 01:01 PM
For the Record. I scream and yell and curse at our guys more than I do the other guys. Why. Because If they are not living up to my expectations, which is to destroy everyone in their path and win games by 80 points, then I feel let down.

Now if your job is to block, and you don't block, I will Scream at you. If your job is to run for 2 yards on a 3rd and 1 and you only get 1/2 yard, I will scream at you. If your job is to read a defense and see the blitzes and audible out, and you miss it, I will scream at you. If your job is to cover and tackle, and you blow your coverage and then miss a tackle on a key 3rd down play, I will scream at you. Why...because I Want Perfection.

If your job is to adjust the offense to the game situation and you don't, I will scream at you. And Curse too. If your job is to kick the ball, and you blow it, I will let you know my displeasure.

Now, if anyone, other than a Steelers fan, screams at my players, I will punch them in the face.

I don't want anyone fired, anyone traded, anyone kicked off, or benched.

I want the talent we have to perform up to the standards I have established.

Rings...Get Me Rings.

Nothing wrong with that, Dino. It's perfectly fine to have high, though unrealistic, expectations, and then yell and scream at them when they don't live up to them. Lord knows I was shaking my head, giving them the Bill Cowher "really, really pissed off stare," and screaming at them to wake the hell up on Sunday...but if I were in the building, I wouldn't boo them. It's counterproductive and does NOT show support for the team, no matter how much some want to justify it because Ben acknowledged it after the game.

stlrtruck
10-01-2008, 01:38 PM
But fans had a right to be upset and let the team know it. Evidently, it worked because Ben said he was tired of getting booed which led to his tirade and in the second half, they were at least a functional offensive unit.

Unlike Kordell, Ben didn't crash under the pressure. He accepted what the fans were saying and he knew they should be performing better. Wasn't there a thread started talking about Ben being overrated - how can a leader like that be overrated!!!???

memphissteelergirl
10-01-2008, 02:00 PM
Now, if anyone, other than a Steelers fan, screams at my players, I will punch them in the face.



LOL...great line!! :applaudit:

Kinda like if you have a bothersome kid brother/sister. You can kick their butt all you want but if anybody else tries to do it, they get their butt kicked!

SCSTILLER
10-01-2008, 02:02 PM
For the Record. I scream and yell and curse at our guys more than I do the other guys. Why. Because If they are not living up to my expectations, which is to destroy everyone in their path and win games by 80 points, then I feel let down.

Now if your job is to block, and you don't block, I will Scream at you. If your job is to run for 2 yards on a 3rd and 1 and you only get 1/2 yard, I will scream at you. If your job is to read a defense and see the blitzes and audible out, and you miss it, I will scream at you. If your job is to cover and tackle, and you blow your coverage and then miss a tackle on a key 3rd down play, I will scream at you. Why...because I Want Perfection.

If your job is to adjust the offense to the game situation and you don't, I will scream at you. And Curse too. If your job is to kick the ball, and you blow it, I will let you know my displeasure.

Now, if anyone, other than a Steelers fan, screams at my players, I will punch them in the face.

I don't want anyone fired, anyone traded, anyone kicked off, or benched.

I want the talent we have to perform up to the standards I have established.

Rings...Get Me Rings.


I am the same way Dino! In the Steelers group that I watch the games with I am nicknamed "Torretts", and it fits. If you don't play up to the level that I know you can play, I will boo, scream, cuss, and anything else to vent my frustration. And yes, after six or so quarters of an inept offensive that couldn't score a touchdown let alone seem like they belonged in the NFL, I would have booed also. And hey, it did work, it lit a fire under Ben's a$$.

steelergirl07
10-01-2008, 02:12 PM
I wouldn't boo the team if I was there. I'll yell and scream, but not boo.

That being said, it seemed to work.

missedgehead
10-01-2008, 02:34 PM
You're right!! HERE WE GO STEELERS HERE WE GO!!!! Man, I feel better and guess what Mr. Fan Policeman, it worked. All the problems just magically went away.

Now where is that koolaid?

:coffee:


Agreed. I mean, we fans ARE allowed to criticize a team's performance, right? We DO spend our HARD EARNED MONEY on this team, right? Those men and coaches on that field and the folks in the front office, etc, earn their salaries from the money that comes out of OUR POCKETS, so I think we have a RIGHT to criticize them if they play like CRAP!!! While I don't like the boobirds at the games who boo their own team and such, I do not have a problem with sensible criticism of the team. I agree with the WARDen. I don't think any fan should tell other fans how to be a fan.

Pass the koolaid. :)

Kvnfaber
10-01-2008, 02:36 PM
For the Record. I scream and yell and curse at our guys more than I do the other guys. Why. Because If they are not living up to my expectations, which is to destroy everyone in their path and win games by 80 points, then I feel let down.

Now if your job is to block, and you don't block, I will Scream at you. If your job is to run for 2 yards on a 3rd and 1 and you only get 1/2 yard, I will scream at you. If your job is to read a defense and see the blitzes and audible out, and you miss it, I will scream at you. If your job is to cover and tackle, and you blow your coverage and then miss a tackle on a key 3rd down play, I will scream at you. Why...because I Want Perfection.

If your job is to adjust the offense to the game situation and you don't, I will scream at you. And Curse too. If your job is to kick the ball, and you blow it, I will let you know my displeasure.

Now, if anyone, other than a Steelers fan, screams at my players, I will punch them in the face.

I don't want anyone fired, anyone traded, anyone kicked off, or benched.

I want the talent we have to perform up to the standards I have established.

Rings...Get Me Rings.

Very well put!

SCSTILLER
10-01-2008, 02:47 PM
Agreed. I mean, we fans ARE allowed to criticize a team's performance, right? We DO spend our HARD EARNED MONEY on this team, right? Those men and coaches on that field and the folks in the front office, etc, earn their salaries from the money that comes out of OUR POCKETS, so I think we have a RIGHT to criticize them if they play like CRAP!!! While I don't like the boobirds at the games who boo their own team and such, I do not have a problem with sensible criticism of the team. I agree with the WARDen. I don't think any fan should tell other fans how to be a fan.

Pass the koolaid. :)

Well put! But I will say that sometimes the "BOO's" are well deserved! These guys are getting paid millions to play football, if they cannot take a few boo's here and there, oh well! How are the fans supposed to display their displeasure with the team, sit in silence? I am not for booing at every little screw up, but sometimes they are needed to let the players, coaches, trainers, water boys, owners, etc. know how they feel about the play on the field!

Aside from that, great win, and I have no finger nails left! :thumbsup:

Hines4ever
10-01-2008, 03:01 PM
...but if I were in the building, I wouldn't boo them. It's counterproductive and does NOT show support for the team, no matter how much some want to justify it because Ben acknowledged it after the game.

EXACTLY.....THANK YOU for making that point.....I agree....it (booing) is counterproductive!!!!! I have had my share of anger outbursts as well....I was angry,disappointed and frustrated Monday night and practically lost my voice from screaming but it wasn't in a bagering, disparaging manner.....there is a difference!!!!! For the person who made the connection with it being like a family member (the "I can say something bad but no one else can") is very appropriate; however, it's a very different thing to put a family member down in public.....I got two text messages from other fans not at the game in utter disbelief that the crowd was booing.....even the announcers made a comment that the booing was very "uncharacteristic of steeler fans!!!!

:tt02:

stlrtruck
10-01-2008, 03:07 PM
Isn't cursing or showing any form of frustration during the game similar to booing? It all holds a negative influence in relation to the support of the Steelers.

So it sounds hypocritical in my opinion that one would say don't boo the team because it's counterproductive but it's ok to curse at the players/team/play calling for the same reasons. The only difference is I prefer not to curse (although it does slip out from time to time) but would rather boo.

Just my thought.

Preacher
10-01-2008, 04:09 PM
I just wonder about the mentality that says "I paid the money... I should be able to yell and scream obsencities and act however I want."

So does that mean i can walk into your place of employment, and when you make a mistake, or a few of them... I can act the same way? Yell, scream, shout obscenities, etc.?

Class is class. Paying money to enter a stadium doesn't allow anyone to set aside norms of behavior. It is still a classless act to do that stuff.

Booing however, I find completely ok. I would never boo my team. But at least it is within the realm of acceptable behavior.

PalmerSteel
10-01-2008, 04:20 PM
booing is fine sparingly at times when needed. steelers fans arent idiots and it was needed on monday night when they were booing. they werent booing the middle school football jv team. this is a nfl team that was playing and playcalling well below expectations. they are big boys. they deserved a little verbal kick in the ass. everyone needs that some times at their job.

GBMelBlount
10-01-2008, 04:49 PM
I just wonder about the mentality that says "I paid the money... I should be able to yell and scream obsencities and act however I want."

So does that mean i can walk into your place of employment, and when you make a mistake, or a few of them... I can act the same way? Yell, scream, shout obscenities, etc.?

Class is class. Paying money to enter a stadium doesn't allow anyone to set aside norms of behavior. It is still a classless act to do that stuff.

Booing however, I find completely ok. I would never boo my team. But at least it is within the realm of acceptable behavior.

I agree, in my opinion, implying that people who "boo" exceptionally bad performance are bad fans or have no class is arrogant and judgmental. Booing has been a legitimate form of fan expression, just as cheering, dating back to the days of Greece it is thought. I may not like it, but I am certainly not going to judge, or turn my nose down on those who have every right to do it.

I do think that your place of employment analogy is a bit of a stretch though. :chuckle:

Preacher
10-01-2008, 04:52 PM
I agree, in my opinion, implying that people who "boo" exceptionally bad performance are bad fans or have no class is arrogant and judgmental. Booing has been a legitimate form of fan expression, just as cheering, dating back to the days of Greece it is thought. I may not like it, but I am certainly not going to judge, or turn my nose down on those who have every right to do it.

I do think that your place of employment analogy is a bit of a stretch though. :chuckle:


I don't know... you ever go to a deacon's meeting?

:rofl:

X-Terminator
10-01-2008, 06:14 PM
Agreed. I mean, we fans ARE allowed to criticize a team's performance, right? We DO spend our HARD EARNED MONEY on this team, right? Those men and coaches on that field and the folks in the front office, etc, earn their salaries from the money that comes out of OUR POCKETS, so I think we have a RIGHT to criticize them if they play like CRAP!!! While I don't like the boobirds at the games who boo their own team and such, I do not have a problem with sensible criticism of the team. I agree with the WARDen. I don't think any fan should tell other fans how to be a fan.

Pass the koolaid. :)

And again, for about the 50 millionth time, nobody is saying that you can't sensibly criticize the team. Constructive criticism is fine. DEstructive criticism, like calling for everyone to be fired or saying the team sucks, or in the case of your buddy, giving up before halftime, is not. Why that is so hard for some people to understand is beyond me.

X-Terminator
10-01-2008, 06:17 PM
Isn't cursing or showing any form of frustration during the game similar to booing? It all holds a negative influence in relation to the support of the Steelers.

So it sounds hypocritical in my opinion that one would say don't boo the team because it's counterproductive but it's ok to curse at the players/team/play calling for the same reasons. The only difference is I prefer not to curse (although it does slip out from time to time) but would rather boo.

Just my thought.

I believe cursing at them - meaning the hardcore cursing - is wrong as well. It's especially wrong when you are at the game and there are kids around. I have a general rule that I do not swear when I am at a game. I may yell a lot and get angry at times, but I don't curse, OR boo.

Preacher
10-01-2008, 06:21 PM
I believe cursing at them - meaning the hardcore cursing - is wrong as well. It's especially wrong when you are at the game and there are kids around. I have a general rule that I do not swear when I am at a game. I may yell a lot and get angry at times, but I don't curse, OR boo.


:hatsoff::hatsoff::hatsoff::hatsoff:



There is just a level of decorum that our country has lost.

Texasteel
10-01-2008, 06:46 PM
I think I disagree, I think if you ask a professional athlete their would tell you they would rather be yelled at than booed.
I may have long term memory lose, I do have my name written on my under ware, but I just don't recall a lot of booing in the late 80s when the team was just awful. This is something I just am not use to out of a Steeler fan, not directed at the Steelers anyway.
It doesn't mean you can't do it, it just means I don't appreciate it, and if you are entitled to your opinion aren't I.

Havik
10-01-2008, 06:49 PM
The Steelers offense deserved to get booed for the product they were putting on the field during the first half on Monday night. I saw a talented team look like a bunch of bums, giving very little effort with no desire to win. It was embarrassing. The booing motivated them to play better during the second half and win the game. These people spent their hard earned money on game tickets, and had the right to be pissed off.

Preacher
10-01-2008, 07:28 PM
The Steelers offense deserved to get booed for the product they were putting on the field during the first half on Monday night. I saw a talented team look like a bunch of bums, giving very little effort with no desire to win. It was embarrassing. The booing motivated them to play better during the second half and win the game. These people spent their hard earned money on game tickets, and had the right to be pissed off.

Sure...

But can I come to your place of work and act like an utter buffoon, cussing, swearing, etc. at you if I don't like how you do your job and thus the product I buy?

PalmerSteel
10-01-2008, 09:06 PM
Sure...

But can I come to your place of work and act like an utter buffoon, cussing, swearing, etc. at you if I don't like how you do your job and thus the product I buy?

i know it was directed at someone else, but i would like to answer: if it is because i am not performing any way near the way i know i am capable of, and expected to do, and should be and being paid millions of dollars by you the paying customer fan, and the owner, than of course you can! ;)

HometownGal
10-01-2008, 09:17 PM
Sure...

But can I come to your place of work and act like an utter buffoon, cussing, swearing, etc. at you if I don't like how you do your job and thus the product I buy?

AMEN Father!!! :drink:

If you spoiled brats who boo your own team are so dissatisfied with how the team is playing, why put yourselves through the misery? Why not give up your tickets to fans who are going to support the team through the good times and the bad? I'm sure there are thousands of fans who would love to relieve you of your misery :chuckle:

You are all entitled to your opinions and I am entitled to mine.

Boo-birds SUCK. That is all.

touchdownward
10-01-2008, 09:36 PM
To add a little humor to this thread.

This discussion reminds me of a Sienfeld episode. The one where Jerry gets booed by Kramer's date at one of his shows. He in turn shows up at her work the next day and heckles her so hard she runs out into the street, getting one of her toes run over by a truck. :chuckle:

iloveben7
10-01-2008, 10:15 PM
AMEN Father!!! :drink:

If you spoiled brats who boo your own team are so dissatisfied with how the team is playing, why put yourselves through the misery? Why not give up your tickets to fans who are going to support the team through the good times and the bad? I'm sure there are thousands of fans who would love to relieve you of your misery :chuckle:

You are all entitled to your opinions and I am entitled to mine.

Boo-birds SUCK. That is all.

exactly. Even though this is about the Pirates, but it relates. Every time I go to a Pirate game, people are always booing and complaining about the record of losing seasons, well then why do you waste money to go to the game and complain the whole time? It really annoys me.

Preacher
10-01-2008, 11:41 PM
Agreed. I mean, we fans ARE allowed to criticize a team's performance, right? We DO spend our HARD EARNED MONEY on this team, right? Those men and coaches on that field and the folks in the front office, etc, earn their salaries from the money that comes out of OUR POCKETS, so I think we have a RIGHT to criticize them if they play like CRAP!!! While I don't like the boobirds at the games who boo their own team and such, I do not have a problem with sensible criticism of the team. I agree with the WARDen. I don't think any fan should tell other fans how to be a fan.

Pass the koolaid. :)

Actually... No.

1. Most of the money they earn comes nowadays from TV contracts.

2. Criticizing has never been the issue. Reckless overstatement, mass mis-characterization, and scapegoating is the the issue. And no, there IS no reason for that, PERIOD. regardless of where you are in life.

3. So you are telling us what fans CAN do, but won't allow us to say what we think fans CANT do? Is that right?

And no, WARDen ISN"T talking about sensible criticism. Go back and look at his gameday posts... there were vast overstatements.. scapegoating.. .etc.

You're telling me that I need to sit there and let him spew that... without saying anthing about it?

Really, what has happend to MY right of speach? Interesting.

The_WARDen
10-02-2008, 07:11 AM
Actually... No.

1. Most of the money they earn comes nowadays from TV contracts.

2. Criticizing has never been the issue. Reckless overstatement, mass mis-characterization, and scapegoating is the the issue. And no, there IS no reason for that, PERIOD. regardless of where you are in life.

3. So you are telling us what fans CAN do, but won't allow us to say what we think fans CANT do? Is that right?

And no, WARDen ISN"T talking about sensible criticism. Go back and look at his gameday posts... there were vast overstatements.. scapegoating.. .etc.

You're telling me that I need to sit there and let him spew that... without saying anthing about it?

Really, what has happend to MY right of speach? Interesting.

I have never denied your right of speech or anyone else. You have the right to be a cheerleader. That is your right. I also have a right to voice my opinion and vent when the team is pissing me off without being called a "hater".

It's kinda like a family member who's doing the wrong thing...you bitch at them, smack'em up side the head but then hug them afterwards.

:banging:

X-Terminator
10-02-2008, 07:19 AM
I have never denied your right of speech or anyone else. You have the right to be a cheerleader. That is your right. I also have a right to voice my opinion and vent when the team is pissing me off without being called a "hater".

It's kinda like a family member who's doing the wrong thing...you bitch at them, smack'em up side the head but then hug them afterwards.

:banging:

That's all well and good, but the fact remains that YOU GAVE UP BEFORE HALFTIME. That's why you are receiving the flak that you have gotten in the past 2 days. It's no different than a guy on the Steelers.com message board several years ago who said "I'm done with this team" during a loss. I made sure to remind him of that every chance I got, especially when he would cheer for them when they did well. Curse, criticize, get pissed...nobody really cares about that. But don't give up on the team before the game is half over, and for the love of God, don't say you're "done with them."

The_WARDen
10-02-2008, 07:26 AM
That's all well and good, but the fact remains that YOU GAVE UP BEFORE HALFTIME. That's why you are receiving the flak that you have gotten in the past 2 days. It's no different than a guy on the Steelers.com message board several years ago who said "I'm done with this team" during a loss. I made sure to remind him of that every chance I got, especially when he would cheer for them when they did well. Curse, criticize, get pissed...nobody really cares about that. But don't give up on the team before the game is half over, and for the love of God, don't say you're "done with them."


This is actually funny to me that this has gone on for 3 days now. Hilarious actually.

Yes you are all better "fans" than me. Give yourselves a prize.

:coffee:

The_WARDen
10-02-2008, 07:29 AM
You can disquallify his statements without making reference to the type of fan he is. To each his own. If he wants to be a negative nelly that's his perogative. As you should know it's not up to you to judge . If you don't like his post pass on them, if you think he is wrong than make statements to the opposite. Wether or not he is good fan is not for you or anyone else to decide.

Pass the Koolaid.

You know what's funny is that I vent for 5 minutes because the team is playing like inept garbage against an inferior opponent, in my mind the Ravens blow, and it causes this huge mess.

By the way, Ben vented at halftime also.

Anyway, I'm done because I've moved onto Jacksonville.

X-Terminator
10-02-2008, 07:43 AM
You know what's funny is that I vent for 5 minutes because the team is playing like inept garbage against an inferior opponent, in my mind the Ravens blow, and it causes this huge mess.

By the way, Ben vented at halftime also.

Anyway, I'm done because I've moved onto Jacksonville.

Uh yeah Ben vented, but I'm pretty sure he didn't say the game was over and threw in the towel. Big difference.

Anyway, I can move on too. And if it happens again, you can bet your sweet bippy that I will be right here to remind you. Again. Just like the guy who said "I'm done with this team."

The_WARDen
10-02-2008, 07:52 AM
Uh yeah Ben vented, but I'm pretty sure he didn't say the game was over and threw in the towel. Big difference.

Anyway, I can move on too. And if it happens again, you can bet your sweet bippy that I will be right here to remind you. Again. Just like the guy who said "I'm done with this team."

Seriously man, you need a life.

fansince'76
10-02-2008, 08:01 AM
Seriously man, you need a life.

Sure, X-T is the one who needs to get a life.

The Steelers look like a friggin high school team once again!!! Ben looks like a dumb*ss and the line is crap once again! They can't run. They can't pass. Thank God they drafted Mendenhall! Whew! What a difference he's making.

It's gonna be a looooong year folks unless they somehow bend over and remove their heads from their collective *sses!

:mad::mad::mad::mad::banging::banging::mad::mad::b anging:

now the defense can't tackle all of a sudden and there's no pressure! Hey guys! The guy's wide open on the FRIGGIN goal line!!!

This team is not prepared to play!

Now we're at the half.

13-3. This game is pretty over being that our offense is incompetant and allergic to TDs.

:mad::banging::mad::banging:

:rolleyes:

fansince'76
10-02-2008, 08:02 AM
You can disquallify his statements without making reference to the type of fan he is. To each his own. If he wants to be a negative nelly that's his perogative. As you should know it's not up to you to judge . If you don't like his post pass on them, if you think he is wrong than make statements to the opposite. Wether or not he is good fan is not for you or anyone else to decide.

Pass the Koolaid.

And by posting this, you become a judge yourself. See a post you don't like? Then pass on it. :coffee:

SteelMember
10-02-2008, 08:26 AM
So does that mean i can walk into your place of employment, and when you make a mistake, or a few of them... I can act the same way? Yell, scream, shout obscenities, etc.?

I see you've met my boss. :laughing:

I may have long term memory lose, I do have my name written on my under ware, but I just don't recall a lot of booing in the late 80s when the team was just awful.

I agree. I can't remember any booing back then. Of course there were still a lot of beloved players in uniform. It would be hard to boo 4 SB's. This, however, dosen't seem to be a problem with massholes, as tainted as they may be.

I don't know if I've ever booed at a team, but I do my fair share of constructive cursing.:chuckle: And if I was in PA in '95, I may have ridden shotgun in the dumptruck that went to Neil's house. :mad:

stlrtruck
10-02-2008, 09:00 AM
So does that mean i can walk into your place of employment, and when you make a mistake, or a few of them... I can act the same way? Yell, scream, shout obscenities, etc.?


When a customer of my work is not happy with the results I generate I hear about it. Sometimes directly from my customer and sometimes in a tone that is borderline disrespectful but because of my inability to produce at a level they require I bare the consequences of my own actions (or inactions).

I am a customer of the Steelers organization. While I don't expect them to win every game I do expect them to be competitive and when they are not, I feel that is my right to let them know of my discontent with their performance. On the same hand I've never booed them when they've played good ball and lost - that much I can deal with, but playing like they did against the eagles and the first half of the ratbirds, imho, deserved some of the boos.

stlrtruck
10-02-2008, 09:02 AM
I think I disagree, I think if you ask a professional athlete their would tell you they would rather be yelled at than booed.
I may have long term memory lose, I do have my name written on my under ware, but I just don't recall a lot of booing in the late 80s when the team was just awful. This is something I just am not use to out of a Steeler fan, not directed at the Steelers anyway.
It doesn't mean you can't do it, it just means I don't appreciate it, and if you are entitled to your opinion aren't I.

Did you go to the games live? I remember going to a few games that were a complete obliteration of what the team was cable of and the fans let the team know it too.

As for your opinion, yes you are entitled to it and I would never let a difference of opinion come between me and my Steelers family!!!

Leftoverhard
10-02-2008, 09:09 AM
Anyway, I'm done because I've moved onto Jacksonville.

What's the outlook on that one? Wait, don't tell me - I'll just watch it myself.
Dude, no one's telling you how to act and this kool-aid nonsense is not even being used in the right context.
We're Steelers fans, real fans, not fair-weather fans, fans of a franchise that has given back. Like Steelmember said, most of us do our fair share of constructive cursing but to give up on the team during the first half? Hell, I don't even give up until the last seconds of the game.
Do what you want but you shouldn't be surprised when you get blasted for being a bad fortune teller/psychic/seer/mentalist. All those guys get told at the bar or at the game too so don't worry, you aren't alone - you have a few other's to drink your Kool-Aid with.

Cordlisberger
10-02-2008, 09:18 AM
I joined here last season and have pretty much stopped posting or visiting because all of the negitive steeler fans, I have been a fan through thick and thin hell I even have Kordell Stewart jersey, anyway to be a Pittsburgh Steeler Fan is something I take pride in win or loss good game or bad game. The Steelers are not a team that puts up 50 points a game we are not a team that allows 50 a game either if your looking for a team that will blow everyone out by 30 everygame you picked the wrong colors, we are all fans and we will become emotional in differant situations but to abandon all hope is crazy and leads me to question if you are truly a fan

X-Terminator
10-02-2008, 10:20 AM
Seriously man, you need a life.

No, actually I don't. You see, unlike you, if I say something like that, I would expect to be called out on it, and I wouldn't whine and cry about it. I'd simply take my lumps, acknowledge that I might have been a bit hasty in my judgment, and then move on.

But anyway, this is my last post on this subject. For now.

fansince'76
10-02-2008, 10:31 AM
This subject has been pretty much beaten to death at this point. Time to look forward to Jacksonville, folks.