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SteelersMongol
11-21-2008, 01:11 AM
Can anyone explain 2 me why that Nate's run-in into that Bengal was not acceptable, please? I didn't understand that part.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
11-21-2008, 01:16 AM
I am not really sure, it looked incidental to me...like they accidentally ran into each other. It didn't effect the play, so I don't see why it mattered. At least we had missed call that went our way, but unlike most other teams fans I can admit it :applaudit:

Steeldude
11-21-2008, 01:27 AM
Can anyone explain 2 me why that Nate's run-in into that Bengal was not acceptable, please? I didn't understand that part.

incidental or not, it is illegal(offensive pass interference) to cut off a defender's route to covering a receiver, especially when the ball is in the air. if they allowed incidental contact then every player would start running into defenders and saying it was an accident. you would also have refs constantly making judgement calls on every pass play. they would have to decide if a offensive player is intentionally or unintentionally trying to pick the defender.

Steeldude
11-21-2008, 01:29 AM
It didn't effect the play, so I don't see why it mattered.

:doh: are you serious? that totally affected the play.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
11-21-2008, 01:30 AM
:doh: are you serious? that totally affected the play.

Yes, I am serious. If you could explain to me how it mattered I would appreciate it. I played nose tackle, I don't know a lot about coverage rules :)

Isn't it true that a defender also cannot impede a receivers route?

jjpro11
11-21-2008, 01:55 AM
it was stupid.. the least he could do was look back at ben while running into the defender. he played like crap tonight.

SunshineMan21
11-21-2008, 02:01 AM
Yes, I am serious. If you could explain to me how it mattered I would appreciate it. I played nose tackle, I don't know a lot about coverage rules :)

Isn't it true that a defender also cannot impede a receivers route?

It might have been an accident, but Nate ran a pick for Hines' defender, which led to Hines beign absolutely wide open for a 42-yard gain. Since the offensive players are dictating the routes, only they can set picks.

The refs made some mistakes tonight, but the call on Nate was the right one.

steelreserve
11-21-2008, 02:55 AM
it was stupid.. the least he could do was look back at ben while running into the defender. he played like crap tonight.

Are you kidding me? He played like two craps. I was optimistic about him when he was catching those bombs earlier in the season, but now he's striknig me more as the dime-a-dozen type of receiver again.

Galax Steeler
11-21-2008, 04:57 AM
He did drop a couple of passes that he should have had easily but it ended our drive hopefully he just had an off game and will get back to playing some good ball next week.

jjpro11
11-21-2008, 09:15 AM
Are you kidding me? He played like two craps. I was optimistic about him when he was catching those bombs earlier in the season, but now he's striknig me more as the dime-a-dozen type of receiver again.

he has been bad the past 2 games and pretty much sums up his career so far.. inconsistent.

rbryan
11-21-2008, 09:30 AM
He was flagged because he squared up on the DB like he was trying to block him.

He has to do a better job of making it look like incidental contact. All he needs to do is brush the guy to give Hines a little seperation. It was a good call.

Dino 6 Rings
11-21-2008, 09:37 AM
NFL Rulebook. (Nate was guilty of A)

Actions that constitute offensive pass interference include but are not limited to:

(a) Blocking downfield by an offensive player prior to the ball being touched.

(b) Initiating contact with a defender by shoving or pushing off thus creating a separation in an attempt to catch a pass.

(c) Driving through a defender who has established a position on the field.

Dino 6 Rings
11-21-2008, 09:38 AM
Oh, and note to Arians.

Please stop calling pass plays to Nate on 3rd down. He can only catch on 1st and 2nd down. Thanks.

drizze99
11-21-2008, 09:51 AM
If I recall, Holmes, Ward and Miller all dropped balls too last night, it wasn't just Nate.

The call was the right call though. Nate has to do a better job of acting if he is going to run a pick play...

Dino 6 Rings
11-21-2008, 09:57 AM
If I recall, Holmes, Ward and Miller all dropped balls too last night, it wasn't just Nate.

The call was the right call though. Nate has to do a better job of acting if he is going to run a pick play...

You know what, Hines is allowed to drop a ball once in a while. He's good enough to make up for it later on. He always does. Miller dropped one that he got drilled on and was short of the 1st down marker for. Holmes made one of the best catches of the night, if not two of them, the one on the slant when he was lined up on the left and reached out in stride and caught it with his hands, and then the one he got killed on, he held onto the ball.

Nate drops important passes all the time and I'm literally sick of it. Its great that on 1st and 10 he can do a double move and run 30 yards down field and catch a deep ball, but on 3rd and 9, he drops the effing ball time and time again.

I'm done with Nate. He's had his chances to prove his roster spot isn't wasted and he's missed the opportunity to show he belongs #3 on this team.

thebus36idf
11-21-2008, 10:17 AM
Much like basketball you must make every opportunity to avoid the person. otherwise recievers in the NFL would be running that cross route every other play in which a reciever can take out the defender as long as it's inside the five yardline leaving the other crossing reciever wide open. In basketball this is done to give a shooter a lane to the basket both illegal. they'll let you get away with shoulder to shoulder contact, or to get tied up for a moment, but full contact is usually almost always called. It looked like it was deliberate, and even acted out a little on the fall.

jjpro11
11-21-2008, 10:22 AM
You know what, Hines is allowed to drop a ball once in a while. He's good enough to make up for it later on. He always does. Miller dropped one that he got drilled on and was short of the 1st down marker for. Holmes made one of the best catches of the night, if not two of them, the one on the slant when he was lined up on the left and reached out in stride and caught it with his hands, and then the one he got killed on, he held onto the ball.

Nate drops important passes all the time and I'm literally sick of it. Its great that on 1st and 10 he can do a double move and run 30 yards down field and catch a deep ball, but on 3rd and 9, he drops the effing ball time and time again.

I'm done with Nate. He's had his chances to prove his roster spot isn't wasted and he's missed the opportunity to show he belongs #3 on this team.

sweed is waiting in the wings.. he had a chance to pass nate but failed.. maybe he will by season's end. he is getting more and more playing time each week.

TackleMeBen
11-21-2008, 10:23 AM
nate just needs some blocking lessons from hines:chuckle:

and a savings account for fines..lol...

thebus36idf
11-21-2008, 10:28 AM
[QUOTE=Dino 5 Rings;480487]You know what, Hines is allowed to drop a ball once in a while. He's good enough to make up for it later on.

I think Hienz is one of the most underrated recievers in the NFL a great all around player, here goes the BUT! Why does he almost always leave his feet When catching the ball, almost like he's cradeling the ball. I have mentioned this to my freinds during games for years. Chris Collingsworth mentioned it last night. It affects his ability to run after the catch, and last night it cost him the catch. I wonder if his coach ever edresses this? Will he be a Hall of Famer? he makes Stallworth, and Swanns #'s look small. However I think his catching style make it hard for him to catch those amazing highlight catches that Lynn Swann was so good at.

thebus36idf
11-21-2008, 10:29 AM
Much like basketball you must make every opportunity to avoid the person. otherwise recievers in the NFL would be running that cross route every other play in which a reciever can take out the defender as long as it's inside the five yardline leaving the other crossing reciever wide open. In basketball this is done to give a shooter a lane to the basket both illegal. they'll let you get away with shoulder to shoulder contact, or to get tied up for a moment, but full contact is usually almost always called. It looked like it was deliberate, and even acted out a little on the fall.

Blitzburgh_Fever
11-21-2008, 10:56 AM
He did drop a couple of passes that he should have had easily but it ended our drive hopefully he just had an off game and will get back to playing some good ball next week.

I saw maybe two. Ward didn't have a crazy game either, though. Conditions probably played into it a bit.

It's funny how some people think one truly bad game for Washington means he's back to being a bad receiver (not saying you do, Galax Steeler). He still runs good routes and his hands are getting better.

Blitzburgh_Fever
11-21-2008, 11:00 AM
he almost always leave his feet When catching the ball

Last night he jumped to seal off the defender from making a play on the ball. He does it a lot really, a typical unique Hines Ward move...many other shorter receivers would be wise to adapt and make use of it (guys like Heath can just use their 6'5 frame). It's very smart because if the defender so much as bumps him while he's in the air it's a PI call, unfortunately it takes a lot away from your ability to run with it. Last night was one of the few times it kinda backfired on him. Cris Collinsworth is a huge douchebag, but he's a good announcer and really does know quite a bit about football. I was surprised he didn't recognize what Hines was doing since Collinsworth was a receiver himself.

I'd place the reason for all the drops this year on a lack of innate communication between the OL, most likely causing Roethlisberger to get out-of-sync with his receivers.

Dino 6 Rings
11-21-2008, 11:01 AM
I think Hienz is one of the most underrated recievers in the NFL a great all around player, here goes the BUT! Why does he almost always leave his feet When catching the ball, almost like he's cradeling the ball. I have mentioned this to my freinds during games for years. Chris Collingsworth mentioned it last night. It affects his ability to run after the catch, and last night it cost him the catch. I wonder if his coach ever edresses this? Will he be a Hall of Famer? he makes Stallworth, and Swanns #'s look small. However I think his catching style make it hard for him to catch those amazing highlight catches that Lynn Swann was so good at.

I think he "jumps" to prepare to get hit. He cradles the ball into his ribs feeling a hit coming. Plus Ben throws High often, so guys have to reach up or jump to get a lot of his passes. Its just Hines' style.

TackleMeBen
11-21-2008, 11:03 AM
I think he "jumps" to prepare to get hit. He cradles the ball into his ribs feeling a hit coming. Plus Ben throws High often, so guys have to reach up or jump to get a lot of his passes. Its just Hines' style.
well hines isnt a tall reciever either,so he has to jump up and catch balls thrown by his tall QB

Stlrs4Life
11-21-2008, 11:05 AM
He did drop a couple of passes that he should have had easily but it ended our drive hopefully he just had an off game and will get back to playing some good ball next week.


Wonder if the weather had anything to do about it. No doubt Nate had a bad game last night.

steelpride12
11-21-2008, 11:43 AM
Nate had a rough game last night, and the crowd went ballistic when they made that call.
We were expecting it to be a holding and we would have still gotten the first down.

El-Gonzo Jackson
11-21-2008, 11:49 AM
He was flagged because he squared up on the DB like he was trying to block him.

He has to do a better job of making it look like incidental contact. All he needs to do is brush the guy to give Hines a little seperation. It was a good call.

:applaudit:

Thank you. You could see that Nate even swerved into the DB, rather than trying to run a pattern that would cross up the DB's. You cant mug the DB trying to cover a WR. I think Nate even got the guy's wallet on that mugging.

Steeldude
11-24-2008, 02:58 AM
i see people ragging on washington, but not holmes. holmes is a first rounder, is paid more and has just as many drops as washington.

as of now, ward is listed as dropping 7 passes, holmes is listed as dropping 4 and washington has 2.

the "dropped pass" is very subjective, IMO.

here is a little more info...

washington - targeted 45 times, 53.3% caught, 31.1% for 1st down

holmes - targeted 80 times, 48.8% caught, 35% for 1st down

ward - targeted 85 times, 63.5% caught, 41.2% for 1st down

MasterOfPuppets
11-24-2008, 04:05 AM
I'm done with Nate. He's had his chances to prove his roster spot isn't wasted and he's missed the opportunity to show he belongs #3 on this team.so ummmm....did you put the call in to tomlin ??? :laughing:

Preacher
11-24-2008, 04:06 AM
i see people ragging on washington, but not holmes. holmes is a first rounder, is paid more and has just as many drops as washington.

as of now, ward is listed as dropping 7 passes, holmes is listed as dropping 4 and washington has 2.

the "dropped pass" is very subjective, IMO.

here is a little more info...

washington - targeted 45 times, 53.3% caught, 31.1% for 1st down

holmes - targeted 80 times, 48.8% caught, 35% for 1st down

ward - targeted 85 times, 63.5% caught, 41.2% for 1st down


That is very subjective as well. Holmes is the long ball receiver usually, and has to go up for them, or come back for them, thus, I would think some of the drops accredited to him really aren't his, they are Ben's in that he was thrown short, or overthrown.

I do think stats need to be a tad more like baseball. INT's be given to the reciever OR the QB, or both (high pass, but still off the hands of a receiver when he shoulda knocked it down).

Steeldude
11-24-2008, 04:41 AM
that is very subjective as well. Holmes is the long ball receiver usually, and has to go up for them

so is washington.

according to the NFL(paraphrasing) a dropped pass is any pass a receiver drops that they would have been able to catch with minimal effort.

I would think some of the drops accredited to him really aren't his, they are Ben's in that he was thrown short, or overthrown

holmes is only listed as dropping 4 passes. if anything i think that is generous. the "targeted" stats is the number of times he was thrown to. most of the, 51.2% not caught, were most likely poor passes.

IMO, most WRs today do not know how to catch.

markymarc
11-25-2008, 01:45 PM
Nate did not do a very good acting job on his responsibility for that play. He needs to be more fluid in setting an offensive pick. But I will say this, I would love to see this penalty called a lot more. Every team does this play and unfortunately this is another example for officials in not being consistent in penalties called. The offensive pick play and protecting the QB are so inconsistent. But hey this shit happens when you have part time officials.