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browner3
12-09-2008, 02:00 AM
2008 Season

Steelers finish 12-4 and #2 in the AFC
Beat the Colts in the divisional game
Beat the Ravens in the AFC Championship
Beat the Panthers in the SB

The Steelers win the SB on the shoulders of the D. The Offense plays just well enough to get us that 6th ring. However, I still believe Arians should be fired. I know itís awfully rare for a SB team to fire its OC, but lets not fool ourselves, he must go. As well as the OL coach.

Extend Heath Miller and James Harrison

2009 NFL Free Agency Steelers:

The Steelers are unable to sign, or let walk:

Charlie Batch
Fernando Bryant
Paul Ernster
Trai Essex
Byron Leftwich
Bryant McFadden
Orpheus Roye
Marvel Smith
Nate Washington

The Steelers resign:

Willie Colon
Keyaron Fox
Chris Kemoeatu
Anthony Madison
Max Starks

2009 NFL Free Agency:

Sign Marc Colombo OT Dallas
Sign Domonique Foxworth CB Atlanta
Sign Roscoe Parrish WR Buffalo
Take a look at either Igor Olshansky or Chris Canty

2009 NFL Draft:

Rd. 1: Duke Robinson OG Oklahoma
Rd. 2: Vince Oghobaase DT/DE Duke
Rd. 3a: Kevin Barnes CB Maryland
Rd. 3b: Max Unger OT Oregon
Rd. 4: Pannel Egboh DE Stanford
Rd. 5: Mohamed Massaquoi WR Georgia
Rd. 6: Graham Harrell QB Texas Tech
Rd. 7a: Chris Pressley FB Wisconsin
Rd. 7b: Joey Husdon ILB Miami (OH)

2009 Depth Chart

LT: Max Starks, Tony Hills
LG: Duke Robinson, Kendall Simmons
C: Darnell Stapleton, Justin Hartwig
RG: Chris Kemoeatu, Wille Colon
RT: Marc Colombo, Max Unger
TE: Heath Miller, Matt Spaeth, Sean McHugh
WR: Hines Ward, Santonio Holmes, Roscoe Parrish, Limas Sweed, Mohamed Massaquoi
FB: Chris Pressley
RB: Willie Parker, Rashard Mendenhall, Mewelde Moore, Gary Russell
QB: Ben Roethlisberger, Dennis Dixon

LDE: Aaron Smith, Nick Eason, Pannel Egboh
NT: Casey Hampton, Chris Hoke
RDE: Brett Keisel, Vince Oghobaase
LOLB: Lamarr Woodley, Bruce Davis
LILB: Lawrence Timmons, Keyaron Fox
RILB: James Farrior, Larry Foote
ROLB: James Harrison, Andre Frazier, Donovan Woods
CB: Ike Taylor, Kevin Barnes
SS: Troy Polomalu, Anthony Smith
FS: Ryan Clark, Ryan Mundy
CB: William Gay, Domonique Foxworth, Roy Lewis

K: Jeff Reed
P: Daniel Sepulveda
PR: Roscoe Parrish
KR: Roscoe Parrish, Rashard Mendenhall

Tell me what you think

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 02:21 AM
Arian's must go unless the offense mirculously comes together in the next 3 games or in the playoffs, which I highly doubt. And I agree, Superbowl or not, unless the offense takes 10 steps forward, he should go.

Cut Paul Ernster? Why? LOL..they should shoot him, not cut him

Colombo signed a 4 year extension today.

I'm not familiar with college at all and won't make pretend I am.

I want Offensive linemen in the first 2 rounds unless there is a "good" running back over 6'0 and 235 pounds.

steelreserve
12-09-2008, 02:29 AM
I agree with most of this, except:

1) 12-4? Are you kidding? Who the hell are we going to lose to?

2) We won't fire Arians. Hopefully some piece of crap team like the Raiders will offer him the head coaching job and we'll let him go. Hell, maybe we'll even pick up the phone and give ol' Al Davs an unsolicited glowing recommendation.

3) I seriously worry about our ability to re-sign Harrison. He could've just priced himself out of our range.

4) I bet we keep Essex for cheap.

5) I'd put DL as an immediate need over OL, just because of how old everyone is and how thin we are. If there's a dominant DE or DT left by the time we pick, I bet we draft him. You can do fine at OL in the second and third rounds, and I'd be surprised if we don't take someone there. At every other position, we're basically set.

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 02:47 AM
I agree with most of this, except:

1) 12-4? Are you kidding? Who the hell are we going to lose to?

2) We won't fire Arians. Hopefully some piece of crap team like the Raiders will offer him the head coaching job and we'll let him go. Hell, maybe we'll even pick up the phone and give ol' Al Davs an unsolicited glowing recommendation.

3) I seriously worry about our ability to re-sign Harrison. He could've just priced himself out of our range.

4) I bet we keep Essex for cheap.

5) I'd put DL as an immediate need over OL, just because of how old everyone is and how thin we are. If there's a dominant DE or DT left by the time we pick, I bet we draft him. You can do fine at OL in the second and third rounds, and I'd be surprised if we don't take someone there. At every other position, we're basically set.

I've lived through the stingyness of the Steelers for over 15 years, I hope you are wrong about Harrison though, I'm hopinh his age keeps him from getting to greedy.

steelreserve
12-09-2008, 02:59 AM
I've lived through the stingyness of the Steelers for over 15 years, I hope you are wrong about Harrison though, I'm hopinh his age keeps him from getting to greedy.

With Harrison, it's not an issue of being cheap, it's an issue of the salary cap. If he wants a 5-year, $42 million deal, we just can't afford to pay him that much unless we want to give up Woodley or Clark or McFadden, or someone of that caliber. And given Harrison's age, I don't see us signing him to a long-term deal for that kind of money. Next year may really be it for him unless he does what Farrior did and takes a highish-but-still-reasonable offer. If the Redskins want to pay him something totally unrealistic, there's nothing we can do about it.

I really don't think the Steelers are cheap. They're right up against the salary cap limit every year, but probably two seasons out of three, they have to let go of a popular veteran who costs too much.

Just think of it in terms like this: Would you rather have Faneca on the team, or Polamalu? Would you rather keep Plaxico Burress, or Taylor, Townsend and Clark? Would you rather have kept Joey Porter, or Roethlisberger? Randle El, or Woodley and Holmes? Yeah, we've had to let some guys go, but 90% of the time, we end up being right on the ball about who's going to help us win in the long term.

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 03:10 AM
With Harrison, it's not an issue of being cheap, it's an issue of the salary cap. If he wants a 5-year, $42 million deal, we just can't afford to pay him that much unless we want to give up Woodley or Clark or McFadden, or someone of that caliber. And given Harrison's age, I don't see us signing him to a long-term deal for that kind of money. Next year may really be it for him unless he does what Farrior did and takes a highish-but-still-reasonable offer. If the Redskins want to pay him something totally unrealistic, there's nothing we can do about it.

I really don't think the Steelers are cheap. They're right up against the salary cap limit every year, but probably two seasons out of three, they have to let go of a popular veteran who costs too much.

Just think of it in terms like this: Would you rather have Faneca on the team, or Polamalu? Would you rather keep Plaxico Burress, or Taylor, Townsend and Clark? Would you rather have kept Joey Porter, or Roethlisberger? Randle El, or Woodley and Holmes? Yeah, we've had to let some guys go, but 90% of the time, we end up being right on the ball about who's going to help us win in the long term.

If he wasn't going to be a problem, honestly I would've kept Burress over Taylor, Townsend and Clark. I think they let Burress go because they knew he would end up shooting himself in the foot with his attitude. Who would've thought he would do it literally.

We always compete every year, I won't ever complain about front office moves. But I think they have been stingy in the past.

steelreserve
12-09-2008, 03:17 AM
Dude, Holmes is basically the same receiver Burress is, minus the height and plus a little elusiveness. As I said in another thread, we're only allowed to have one talented-but-ghetto receiver on the team at a time.

Steelman16
12-09-2008, 03:23 AM
*raises hand*

I have a question. Why is your name "browner"? :huh:

Dude, Holmes is basically the same receiver Burress is, minus the height and plus a little elusiveness. As I said in another thread, we're only allowed to have one talented-but-ghetto receiver on the team at a time.

:chuckle:

markymarc
12-09-2008, 08:06 AM
I would be very happy if we got Duke Robinson in the first round. He is going to be a very good OL player in the NFL.

The Duke
12-09-2008, 11:38 AM
With Harrison, it's not an issue of being cheap, it's an issue of the salary cap. If he wants a 5-year, $42 million deal, we just can't afford to pay him that much unless we want to give up Woodley or Clark or McFadden, or someone of that caliber.


I'd give up McFadden for silverback to stay

Nothing against him, but we have great corners and I know he's going to ask for a lot of money

If james takes a farrior type deal that would be the best thing in the world. Don't see it happening though. he DESERVES a good contract. just hope it's with the steelers....

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 12:34 PM
Dude, Holmes is basically the same receiver Burress is, minus the height and plus a little elusiveness. As I said in another thread, we're only allowed to have one talented-but-ghetto receiver on the team at a time.

I'm sorry steelreserve, this is a ridiculous statement, Holmes is not half the receiver Burress is/was let alone basically the same. Minus the height? You mean minus half a foot?? And elusiveness? You mean being able to beat most CB's down field.
Burress is the second best receiver in the league. I've officially put him ahead of Terrel Owens cause Burress cannot be shutdown as easily unless you double him up, Owens can be shutdown with single coverage. But even if you argue that Owens is better, then Burress is still the 3rd best receiver in the league. How is that basically the same as Holmes?

unless you were being sarcastic and I didn't catch it.

Sharkissle29
12-09-2008, 05:43 PM
I think Ben would make parrish an extremely good receiver (kind of like the way randle el was great for us but nothing for the redskins). roscoe just needs a good QB to give him the ball

Steelman16
12-09-2008, 06:06 PM
I'm sorry steelreserve, this is a ridiculous statement, Holmes is not half the receiver Burress is/was let alone basically the same. Minus the height? You mean minus half a foot?? And elusiveness? You mean being able to beat most CB's down field.
Burress is the second best receiver in the league. I've officially put him ahead of Terrel Owens cause Burress cannot be shutdown as easily unless you double him up, Owens can be shutdown with single coverage. But even if you argue that Owens is better, then Burress is still the 3rd best receiver in the league. How is that basically the same as Holmes?

unless you were being sarcastic and I didn't catch it.

And Burress is officially out of the league for awhile. :coffee:

I'd take Holmes over "shoot-me-in-the-foot" anyday.

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 06:09 PM
And Burress is officially out of the league for awhile. :coffee:

I'd take Holmes over "shoot-me-in-the-foot" anyday.

Oh I would take Holmes over Burres before he shot himself in the foot, I don't like that kind of attitude on a team. He didn't have Steelers class. But he far superior to Holmes as a player.

hindes204
12-09-2008, 06:15 PM
The only reason i would take Holmes over Buress is the "gimme the ball" attitude plax had when he played here....the steeler organization as a whole has always harped on character and class....and plax had no class, i m glad he left

Steelman16
12-09-2008, 06:16 PM
Oh I would take Holmes over Burres before he shot himself in the foot, I don't like that kind of attitude on a team. He didn't have Steelers class. But he far superior to Holmes as a player.

Then again...Holmes ain't exactly a role model either. :chuckle:

NYC SteelersFan
12-09-2008, 06:25 PM
Then again...Holmes ain't exactly a role model either. :chuckle:

lol better drugs than guns? Makes a fine t-shirt

lilyoder6
12-09-2008, 09:18 PM
eat plants or eat bullets?

GridironWarrior
12-09-2008, 09:27 PM
eat plants or eat bullets?

Funniest thing I've read in a long time lol.

lilyoder6
12-09-2008, 11:00 PM
Funniest thing I've read in a long time lol.

i thought some would like that :flap:

markymarc
12-10-2008, 07:24 AM
IBurress is the second best receiver in the league. I've officially put him ahead of Terrel Owens cause Burress cannot be shutdown as easily unless you double him up, Owens can be shutdown with single coverage.

Sorry but I would put Steve Smith ahead of TO and Burress.

NYC SteelersFan
12-10-2008, 02:07 PM
Sorry but I would put Steve Smith ahead of TO and Burress.

I've seen Smith get shut down with single coverage plenty of times. I would be hard-presse to argue that T.O is definitely better, it could go either way honestly between those two, but Burress is better than Smith.

steelreserve
12-10-2008, 02:42 PM
I'm sorry steelreserve, this is a ridiculous statement, Holmes is not half the receiver Burress is/was let alone basically the same. Minus the height? You mean minus half a foot?? And elusiveness? You mean being able to beat most CB's down field.
Burress is the second best receiver in the league. I've officially put him ahead of Terrel Owens cause Burress cannot be shutdown as easily unless you double him up, Owens can be shutdown with single coverage. But even if you argue that Owens is better, then Burress is still the 3rd best receiver in the league. How is that basically the same as Holmes?

unless you were being sarcastic and I didn't catch it.

I guess what I mean is, I don't rate Burress quite so highly. He's good, but I don't think he's quite the dominant, game-altering force you're making him out to be. I don't think there are more than two or three receivers who you can put in that category ... Moss, maybe Owens, maybe Reggie Wayne or someone like that.

Then you've got a number of guys who are very good but not impossible to deal with. Guys like Larry Fitzgerald, Steve Smith, Anquan Boldin, Brandon Marshall, Ocho Stinko or Houshmanzadeh or Braylon Edwards .. that's about where I'd put Burress. Holmes isn't quite in that group but isn't far from it either.

Then you have another whole group of guys who aren't in the same category of explosiveness but who put up numbers that are just as good and make you pay if you don't account for them: Tony Gonzalez, Wes Welker, Antonio Gates, Marques Colston ... Hines Ward is probably moving more toward this category and out of the previous one as he gets older.

Basically, it seems like Burress gives you 1,000 yards a season and Holmes gives you 850-900. Burress catches 10-20 more balls but Holmes gets a few more yards per catch. They can both catch the deep ball, and they can both make people miss. The biggest equalizer: Holmes will probably continue to improve if you give him another few seasons, while Burress has turned into a head case and a diva. Let's face it: Even before he shot himself, he wasn't really having a great season, and I could be wrong, but he looks more likely to be declining than improving from here on out.

KeiselPower99
12-10-2008, 05:19 PM
2008 Season

Steelers finish 12-4 and #2 in the AFC
Beat the Colts in the divisional game
Beat the Ravens in the AFC Championship
Beat the Panthers in the SB

The Steelers win the SB on the shoulders of the D. The Offense plays just well enough to get us that 6th ring. However, I still believe Arians should be fired. I know itís awfully rare for a SB team to fire its OC, but lets not fool ourselves, he must go. As well as the OL coach.

Extend Heath Miller and James Harrison

2009 NFL Free Agency Steelers:

The Steelers are unable to sign, or let walk:

Charlie Batch
Fernando Bryant
Paul Ernster
Trai Essex
Byron Leftwich
Bryant McFadden
Orpheus Roye
Marvel Smith
Nate Washington

The Steelers resign:

Willie Colon
Keyaron Fox
Chris Kemoeatu
Anthony Madison
Max Starks

2009 NFL Free Agency:

Sign Marc Colombo OT Dallas
Sign Domonique Foxworth CB Atlanta
Sign Roscoe Parrish WR Buffalo
Take a look at either Igor Olshansky or Chris Canty

2009 NFL Draft:

Rd. 1: Duke Robinson OG Oklahoma
Rd. 2: Vince Oghobaase DT/DE Duke
Rd. 3a: Kevin Barnes CB Maryland
Rd. 3b: Max Unger OT Oregon
Rd. 4: Pannel Egboh DE Stanford
Rd. 5: Mohamed Massaquoi WR Georgia
Rd. 6: Graham Harrell QB Texas Tech
Rd. 7a: Chris Pressley FB Wisconsin
Rd. 7b: Joey Husdon ILB Miami (OH)

2009 Depth Chart

LT: Max Starks, Tony Hills
LG: Duke Robinson, Kendall Simmons
C: Darnell Stapleton, Justin Hartwig
RG: Chris Kemoeatu, Wille Colon
RT: Marc Colombo, Max Unger
TE: Heath Miller, Matt Spaeth, Sean McHugh
WR: Hines Ward, Santonio Holmes, Roscoe Parrish, Limas Sweed, Mohamed Massaquoi
FB: Chris Pressley
RB: Willie Parker, Rashard Mendenhall, Mewelde Moore, Gary Russell
QB: Ben Roethlisberger, Dennis Dixon

LDE: Aaron Smith, Nick Eason, Pannel Egboh
NT: Casey Hampton, Chris Hoke
RDE: Brett Keisel, Vince Oghobaase
LOLB: Lamarr Woodley, Bruce Davis
LILB: Lawrence Timmons, Keyaron Fox
RILB: James Farrior, Larry Foote
ROLB: James Harrison, Andre Frazier, Donovan Woods
CB: Ike Taylor, Kevin Barnes
SS: Troy Polomalu, Anthony Smith
FS: Ryan Clark, Ryan Mundy
CB: William Gay, Domonique Foxworth, Roy Lewis

K: Jeff Reed
P: Daniel Sepulveda
PR: Roscoe Parrish
KR: Roscoe Parrish, Rashard Mendenhall

Tell me what you think

Steelers and Panthers in the Super Bowl?? Its starting to look like they are the 2 best teams in the conferences. I dont see Simmons being a back up with the kinda pay he makes.

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 02:33 AM
I guess what I mean is, I don't rate Burress quite so highly. He's good, but I don't think he's quite the dominant, game-altering force you're making him out to be. I don't think there are more than two or three receivers who you can put in that category ... Moss, maybe Owens, maybe Reggie Wayne or someone like that.

Then you've got a number of guys who are very good but not impossible to deal with. Guys like Larry Fitzgerald, Steve Smith, Anquan Boldin, Brandon Marshall, Ocho Stinko or Houshmanzadeh or Braylon Edwards .. that's about where I'd put Burress. Holmes isn't quite in that group but isn't far from it either.

Then you have another whole group of guys who aren't in the same category of explosiveness but who put up numbers that are just as good and make you pay if you don't account for them: Tony Gonzalez, Wes Welker, Antonio Gates, Marques Colston ... Hines Ward is probably moving more toward this category and out of the previous one as he gets older.

Basically, it seems like Burress gives you 1,000 yards a season and Holmes gives you 850-900. Burress catches 10-20 more balls but Holmes gets a few more yards per catch. They can both catch the deep ball, and they can both make people miss. The biggest equalizer: Holmes will probably continue to improve if you give him another few seasons, while Burress has turned into a head case and a diva. Let's face it: Even before he shot himself, he wasn't really having a great season, and I could be wrong, but he looks more likely to be declining than improving from here on out.

I'm sorry, I completely disagree, putting Reggie Wayne with T.O and Moss doesn't make sense. and Putting Burress behind Wayne is still crazy to me. Wayne is a product of the colts offense. Wayne is average at best on most other teams. Burress is 6'5 and jumps higher than any other receiver in the league no matter what team he is on. Defenses are FORCED to double cover Burress. No one has or ever will double cover Holmes, Marshall, Houshmanzadeh, Edwards, or Smith. And probably not Boldin either.

Burress is a game changing WR who forces defenses to build the defensive plan around containing Burress and if they don't contain him, as long as your QB can throw a ball up over his head, he'll out jump any defenser in the league and usually come down with it. He's actually better than T.0. You can shut down T.O. with single coverage. It's near impossible to shut down Burress with single coverage.

markymarc
12-11-2008, 08:11 AM
I've seen Smith get shut down with single coverage plenty of times. I would be hard-presse to argue that T.O is definitely better, it could go either way honestly between those two, but Burress is better than Smith.

No question Plax is a great WR. IMO Steve Smith is the best WR in the game. Any great WR is going to get shut down at times, but Smith makes the big plays when needed. I have also seen Plax get shut down at times with single coverage.

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 04:45 PM
No question Plax is a great WR. IMO Steve Smith is the best WR in the game. Any great WR is going to get shut down at times, but Smith makes the big plays when needed. I have also seen Plax get shut down at times with single coverage.

Here is the key difference between the two. Smith is a great receiver if the offensive plays are well designed and the offense is clicking.

No matter what offense, no matter if the offense is clicking or not, almost any QB in the league can throw a sloppy pass up above Burress' head and he'll out jump the defender 9 out of 10 times and come down with the ball.

Another words you still need good plays and a decent QB to utilize Smith's abilities. But any pass play and any QB can utilize Burress' ability. That is why I put Burress second to Moss.

TeeJay
12-11-2008, 04:54 PM
eat plants or eat bullets?

Eats shoots and leaves..........(that punchline gets me everytime :laughing:)

The Duke
12-11-2008, 05:17 PM
Here is the key difference between the two. Smith is a great receiver if the offensive plays are well designed and the offense is clicking.

No matter what offense, no matter if the offense is clicking or not, almost any QB in the league can throw a sloppy pass up above Burress' head and he'll out jump the defender 9 out of 10 times and come down with the ball.

Another words you still need good plays and a decent QB to utilize Smith's abilities. But any pass play and any QB can utilize Burress' ability. That is why I put Burress second to Moss.

Ok. Now tell me which receiver would you prefer having on a critical 3rd down play late in the game?

For all of burress' ability he can become unreliable at times

That's why I'd build a team around smith rather than plax. He doesn't have that height and jumping threat Plax has, but I can count on him when my team needs to win, and at the same time is an excellent receiver every single week

That's the way I see it at least

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 05:21 PM
Ok. Now tell me which receiver would you prefer having on a critical 3rd down play late in the game?

For all of burress' ability he can become unreliable at times

That's why I'd build a team around smith rather than plax. He doesn't have that height and jumping threat Plax has, but I can count on him when my team needs to win, and at the same time is an excellent receiver every single week

That's the way I see it at least

If I can build the team around the receiver I select, I'll take Smith also. If I don't know how good my QB is going to be and I might end up with an average QB, I want Burress.

The Duke
12-11-2008, 05:38 PM
If I can build the team around the receiver I select, I'll take Smith also. If I don't know how good my QB is going to be and I might end up with an average QB, I want Burress.

Fair enough

That's why I truly believe Eli will by alright without Burress

And a young developing QB, say Tyler Thigpen, could use a Plaxico Burress to throw to

and hey, Eli has his own steve smith already :flap:

steelreserve
12-11-2008, 05:51 PM
Burress is a game changing WR who forces defenses to build the defensive plan around containing Burress and if they don't contain him, as long as your QB can throw a ball up over his head, he'll out jump any defenser in the league and usually come down with it. He's actually better than T.0. You can shut down T.O. with single coverage. It's near impossible to shut down Burress with single coverage.

I still don't know about that. If he was really THAT good, we ought to have won a Super Bowl or two while he was here.

What I remember about Burress when he was here is that he made plenty of good plays, but it's not like he caught every single ball you threw his way. He had his share of drops, miscommunication, not being able to get open, and not outjumping defenders, just like everyone else. I didn't see that suddenly change when he went to the Giants, either.

While Burress is definitely a quality player, your evaluation of him makes it sound like all you have to do is chuck the ball 50 yards blindly down the field and he'll run under it and make a circus catch every time. That's just not true, and there aren't many guys in the league you can even make that argument for -- maybe Moss, but that's about it.

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 06:53 PM
I still don't know about that. If he was really THAT good, we ought to have won a Super Bowl or two while he was here.

What I remember about Burress when he was here is that he made plenty of good plays, but it's not like he caught every single ball you threw his way. He had his share of drops, miscommunication, not being able to get open, and not outjumping defenders, just like everyone else. I didn't see that suddenly change when he went to the Giants, either.

While Burress is definitely a quality player, your evaluation of him makes it sound like all you have to do is chuck the ball 50 yards blindly down the field and he'll run under it and make a circus catch every time. That's just not true, and there aren't many guys in the league you can even make that argument for -- maybe Moss, but that's about it.

Burress never belonged on the Steelers, we were a run first/run often team. Even then in 5 years with us he had:

4,164 yards in 71 games and 261 receptions-

58.6 yards per game
3.6 receptions per game
15.9 yards per reception

The yards per reception are staggering (and keep in mind he was drafted by us and only had 22 receptions his first year). To put it into prespective, Randy Moss with Minnesota:

9,142 yards in 109 games and 574 receptions-

83.8 yards per game
5.2 receptions per game
That's 15.9 yards per reception.

It wasn't Burress' fault we didn't use him. Regardless of ability, he had a nasty attitude and belongs in a place like NY where they let scumbag attitude and behavior slide. But he was and is a great receiver, we just didn't use him. He is the reason that Maddox had a phenomenal year, got us to the playoffs and beat Cleveland in that shootout in the first round and he really helped Kordell get to the playoffs in 01'

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 06:56 PM
Fair enough

That's why I truly believe Eli will by alright without Burress

And a young developing QB, say Tyler Thigpen, could use a Plaxico Burress to throw to

and hey, Eli has his own steve smith already :flap:

This I disagree with Duke, I don't think Eli ever developed and I personally think he is a dead man without Burress. Burress seriously spread defenses, busted the running game wide open and that is why Eli showed "some" improvement. Now with the defense's back to concentrating on the rush, Eli and not having to double up Burress, it's bad news for Eli and the Giants.

steelreserve
12-11-2008, 07:08 PM
OK, I guess we just disagree about whether Burress is dominant or just very good. No big deal. But going back to the original point, with the salary cap, it's all about choices. If we didn't give up Burress, we would've had to give up someone else -- I used Taylor, Clark and Townsend in that example, but it just as easily could've been Hampton or Ward or someone else.

I think Holmes has been an adequate replacement and kept our passing game a much greater force to be reckoned with than it would be if it was just Ward and whatever three dingbats we could find off the waiver wire, so we've been lucky in that respect.

Would I rather have Burress still on the team -- of course strictly ability-wise, and minus the distractions? Definitely. But for the $8-9 million a year we'd have to pay him, we would have to give up way too much elsewhere. So far, I think we've mostly made the right moves concerning which guys we should break our necks to re-sign and which ones we're better off letting go in the long run.

NYC SteelersFan
12-11-2008, 07:56 PM
OK, I guess we just disagree about whether Burress is dominant or just very good. No big deal. But going back to the original point, with the salary cap, it's all about choices. If we didn't give up Burress, we would've had to give up someone else -- I used Taylor, Clark and Townsend in that example, but it just as easily could've been Hampton or Ward or someone else.

I think Holmes has been an adequate replacement and kept our passing game a much greater force to be reckoned with than it would be if it was just Ward and whatever three dingbats we could find off the waiver wire, so we've been lucky in that respect.

Would I rather have Burress still on the team -- of course strictly ability-wise, and minus the distractions? Definitely. But for the $8-9 million a year we'd have to pay him, we would have to give up way too much elsewhere. So far, I think we've mostly made the right moves concerning which guys we should break our necks to re-sign and which ones we're better off letting go in the long run.

Subtract the attitude and I take him over Ward and Hampton in all honesty (Ward's money value wouldn't have got so high had Burress still been on the team). Roethlisberger, Burress and a slightly opened up pass scheme would've made for a great offense. Would we have still won the Superbowl?? Can't say. So do I miss him or did the team miss him? Not at all.

thebus36idf
12-12-2008, 12:27 AM
Man lets enjoy the rest of the season guys. We'll have plenty of time for this hopefully in Feb.

Madhunter
12-12-2008, 01:22 AM
I agree with NYC Steelers Fan, ARIANS must go. He Sucks!

Steeldude
12-12-2008, 07:09 AM
Burress cannot be shutdown as easily unless you double him up




huh? burress was often handled by single coverage when he was in pittsburgh. burress played like he was 4' tall and weighed a hundred pounds when in pitt. let's not forget how he would alligator-arm passes either. i can't remember how many times he was pushed out of the way or out-jumped by 5' 9" DBs. i won't even go into how he would jog his routes when he was pouting.

i will never forget his feeble attempt to catch maddox's pass in the titans' playoff game. he just flatout gave up because he thought he might get hit. i was jumping for joy when the steelers let that useless pustule go.

lilyoder6
12-12-2008, 12:20 PM
if i was goin to build a team around a wr, i would def make a clone of jerry rice

NYC SteelersFan
12-12-2008, 01:25 PM
huh? burress was often handled by single coverage when he was in pittsburgh.

i will never forget his feeble attempt to catch maddox's pass in the titans' playoff game. he just flatout gave up because he thought he might get hit. i was jumping for joy when the steelers let that useless pustule go.

He was handled cause we didn't pass to him 10-15 times a game like we should've been, he was nearly below a secondary option in our offensive pass scheme, defense's knew that and covered him accordingly to his importance to our offense. When he went to the Giants and became the #1 option, he consistently got doubled up, opening things up for the run, other receivers and Eli. And even double covered, he would still make plenty of catches that only he could make cause Eli still could'nt even properly throw the ball (still kind of can't).

He was a bum at many times, I admit. It goes to his attitude, which is why I didn't care when he left.

lilyoder6
12-12-2008, 04:05 PM
how did this thread come from the steelers possible off-season outcomes... to being plex being "supossingly" one of the best wr's in the game?

steelreserve
12-12-2008, 04:25 PM
Subtract the attitude and I take him over Ward and Hampton in all honesty (Ward's money value wouldn't have got so high had Burress still been on the team). Roethlisberger, Burress and a slightly opened up pass scheme would've made for a great offense. Would we have still won the Superbowl?? Can't say. So do I miss him or did the team miss him? Not at all.

Yeah!

F*** him!

And f*** the team!!

Wait. Maybe I'm a little too fired up.

markymarc
12-13-2008, 12:46 PM
Here is the key difference between the two. Smith is a great receiver if the offensive plays are well designed and the offense is clicking.

No matter what offense, no matter if the offense is clicking or not, almost any QB in the league can throw a sloppy pass up above Burress' head and he'll out jump the defender 9 out of 10 times and come down with the ball.

Another words you still need good plays and a decent QB to utilize Smith's abilities. But any pass play and any QB can utilize Burress' ability. That is why I put Burress second to Moss.

You bring up a good point, but let's not forget Plax does not always come down with those jump balls. And I tell you what I will take Smith's effort over Plax any day of the week. Plax has been playing for 8 years now and still can go half ass on plays during games. I don't see that with Smith.

NYC SteelersFan
12-13-2008, 02:53 PM
You bring up a good point, but let's not forget Plax does not always come down with those jump balls. And I tell you what I will take Smith's effort over Plax any day of the week. Plax has been playing for 8 years now and still can go half ass on plays during games. I don't see that with Smith.

Definitely, I agree. Like I said, subtract the attitude and I would take him over plenty of players, but he can rot on another team with him being the way that he is.

rbryan
12-13-2008, 03:12 PM
eat plants or eat bullets?

Do you want someone with a smoking bowl or a smoking gun......lol

BTW,I'm guessing plax just hasn't been caught yet with the bowl

Rick5895
12-14-2008, 08:36 AM
Why all the Burress talk, if we resigned Burress we would have lost Ward.