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View Full Version : Fix the Run offense. How do you think...


xbroughneck
12-21-2008, 04:38 PM
...the Steelers can be more productive running the ball?

Sure, some are going to say start Moore, but really. Is Willie Parker starting REALLY the problem? Even if Moore is better, IMHO the run offense has a much deeper problem and it's one that's making Ben have to do more than he should.

Edman
12-21-2008, 04:41 PM
Stop running Willie Parker.

Mewelde Moore and Gary Russell are our running game. Moore is versitile and makes nothing but plays in his hands and Russell can get the tough yards.

I wish Mendenhall didn't get hurt.

XxKnightxX
12-21-2008, 04:42 PM
Makeshift O line, Weak Linemen, and Coach I send a lot of Porn instead of gameplan Zierlein. The reason I like Moore right now rather than Parker is that as crappy is the Rushing game is , Moore makes the best out of nothing, and thats what we need. Its clearly shown that Parker cannot run effectively without a solid blocking line and thats something that we do not have right now. Obviously our blocking schemes are horrible and have been exposed from last year so they need to start drawing up some new plays on the board.

chatman
12-21-2008, 04:42 PM
i absolutely agree--we have an oc that is completely retarded and he doesnt have a clue how to design a proper running play

augustashark
12-21-2008, 04:43 PM
Groundhog day!

brick
12-21-2008, 04:46 PM
our o-line and run blocking is the problem, although i dont think parker has really been up to his usual since getting hurt. i don't know if there's much to do to fix it at this point in the season, but i would start moore.

Edman
12-21-2008, 04:49 PM
And I forgot that Bruce Arians is an imbecile. We've won games IN SPITE of him.

The sooner he gets fired, the less control he has, the better the offense gets. Like I said before, it seems when BEN has control he gets the ball rolling. Under Arians' brilliant playcalling, Ben gets skittish and messes up. As he did plenty today. Sure enough, we lost.

Arians is an bonafide idiot who is out of his league in the NFL.

steelreserve
12-21-2008, 05:05 PM
You fix the run offense by getting a better running back, that's how. Not by trying the same tired shit over and over and acting like it's surprising when you have a miserable performance like today.

What's too bad is, even though Moore is playing better than Parker, you can see he's not the long-term answer to all our problems. Unfortunately, I don't see this getting truly fixed until next season, because we're stuck with the guys we've got. I only hope it'll be good enough to carry us through the playoffs this way.

X-Terminator
12-21-2008, 05:13 PM
You fix the run offense by getting a better running back, that's how. Not by trying the same tired shit over and over and acting like it's surprising when you have a miserable performance like today.

What's too bad is, even though Moore is playing better than Parker, you can see he's not the long-term answer to all our problems. Unfortunately, I don't see this getting truly fixed until next season, because we're stuck with the guys we've got. I only hope it'll be good enough to carry us through the playoffs this way.

They drafted Mendenhall with the hope that he would eventually take over the starting role. But unfortunately his season got cut short thanks to a Killah Ray hit and we'll have to wait until next year to see if he is the real deal. If he's not...we're in trouble.

shevdog
12-21-2008, 05:15 PM
...the Steelers can be more productive running the ball?

Sure, some are going to say start Moore, but really. Is Willie Parker starting REALLY the problem? Even if Moore is better, IMHO the run offense has a much deeper problem and it's one that's making Ben have to do more than he should.

At this point we can only patch things up. In the off-season, after SB #6, Steelers will need to start the fix by firing Bruce, the focusing on building that O-line. (Yes, I'm an Arans hater, even when we pull of #6). So for now we'll have to patch up that line and get our backs to pound the ball more.

Onward to our scrimmage game against the Stains!

steelreserve
12-21-2008, 05:15 PM
They drafted Mendenhall with the hope that he would eventually take over the starting role. But unfortunately his season got cut short thanks to a Killah Ray hit and we'll have to wait until next year to see if he is the real deal. If he's not...we're in trouble.

Yeah, basically it's just too bad that happened. I had high hopes for what he could do for the running game. Like I said, I'd be surprised if they found a long-term fix for the problem until next season.

BozMan
12-21-2008, 05:20 PM
Do we fire Larry Zierlein? Somebody has to be held accountable for the piss poor performance of the OL. A case can be made that, however, Zierlein could not have done much better with the players that Kevin Colbert has given him. The Steelers are paying a price for neglecting their OL for so long.

Another thing to consider is that new coach(es) do not guarantee an upgrade and there is something to be said for continuity. (Just ask fans of the Norv Turner-led San Diego Chargers.)

On balance, though, I'm leaning towards giving Zierlein the boot and bringing in some new OL players. It can't get much worse than this, and we need a fresh start.

steelreserve
12-21-2008, 05:39 PM
Do we fire Larry Zierlein? Somebody has to be held accountable for the piss poor performance of the OL. A case can be made that, however, Zierlein could not have done much better with the players that Kevin Colbert has given him. The Steelers are paying a price for neglecting their OL for so long.

Another thing to consider is that new coach(es) do not guarantee an upgrade and there is something to be said for continuity. (Just ask fans of the Norv Turner-led San Diego Chargers.)

On balance, though, I'm leaning towards giving Zierlein the boot and bringing in some new OL players. It can't get much worse than this, and we need a fresh start.

Yeah, the OL definitely needs some help. But you don't get 29 yards on 18 carries unless there's a problem with the OL and the running back. Especially when that's been happening regularly for three years whether it's a good OL or a bad one.

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
12-21-2008, 05:52 PM
wait till offseason and pick up Jordan Gross

Stlrs4Life
12-21-2008, 05:56 PM
Not until we get a FB in the backfield.

BozMan
12-21-2008, 06:02 PM
Not until we get a FB in the backfield.

I miss the blocking FB too.

NoFieldFive
12-21-2008, 06:05 PM
parker's always been either get stopped for a 3 yard loss in the backfield or break one open for a decent run. he's never been a solid back whose going to pound out 4 yards a carry. I'd bring back Davenport and use he and Moore.

fansince'76
12-21-2008, 06:07 PM
I'd bring back Davenport and use he and Moore.

Yep, that's what we need - a 250-lb RB who runs like a scatback.

NoFieldFive
12-21-2008, 06:13 PM
Yep, that's what we need - a 250-lb RB who runs like a scatback.

and what we have today....does not work. with all the stops on 3rd and 4th down with inches to go and no points at the goal line....something needs to change

dolphin
12-21-2008, 06:22 PM
The offensive line STINKS!!!!Keomatu is pathetic---no pocket for Ben and again, cannot get the ball in the end zone from the 4 and CANNOT even run for a first down on third and 2. Tomlin knows this line is awful but the organization does NOTHING about it. We draft a useless receiver like Sweed or a doggone punter instead of a quality lineman.

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
12-21-2008, 06:50 PM
The offensive line STINKS!!!!Keomatu is pathetic---no pocket for Ben and again, cannot get the ball in the end zone from the 4 and CANNOT even run for a first down on third and 2. Tomlin knows this line is awful but the organization does NOTHING about it. We draft a useless receiver like Sweed or a doggone punter instead of a quality lineman.

I agree with all except Sweed.... He will be a good receiver

Dirt53
12-21-2008, 07:56 PM
It's all on the line. Below average all the way across. When was the last time you saw a gaping hole?

Dirt53
12-21-2008, 08:06 PM
I should edit my post to say "When was the last time you saw a gaping hole that a back could run through." We've seen plenty for pass rushers to get through.

Michael Keller
12-21-2008, 08:17 PM
I think Bruce Arians is soooo bad that my fear is that if the Steelers win the Super Bowl in spite of him they would retain his grossly incompent services. This is my greatest Steeler nightmare, another year of Arians as OC.

I said it 6 or 8 games ago Bruce Arains is the opponent's 12th man and he will cost us in the play offs

xbroughneck
12-22-2008, 10:52 PM
First thing i would do would be to find where the heck Dan Kreider is. i'd have his but back in a Steeler uniform and Davis on the practice squad faster than you can imagine.

Then I'd MAKE Bruce Arians sit in a room with just him and Kreider and i'd have Dan beat his 10 favorite run plays into Arians head.

Lastly, i'd tell the Steelers right guard that if he lets one more of HIS assignments stop a Steeler running back behind the line of scrimmage he's off the team.

hell...I'd make Bruce Arians suit up and play right guard. He'd do better than he does at offensive play calling.

fansince'76
12-22-2008, 11:07 PM
First thing i would do would be to find where the heck Dan Kreider is. i'd have his but back in a Steeler uniform and Davis on the practice squad faster than you can imagine.

Despite the fact that he could no longer even cut it on the Rams' roster? OK.

steelreserve
12-22-2008, 11:12 PM
Despite the fact that he could no longer even cut it on the Rams' roster? OK.

I think a good plan would be to sign him for the league minimum, then wait for a key situation in the playoffs, and then put him in as the lead blocker. Then right as the ball is snapped, you set him on fire. That would clear out a huge hole. Problem is, you could only run that play once.

xbroughneck
12-22-2008, 11:33 PM
Despite the fact that he could no longer even cut it on the Rams' roster? OK.

Uhm...do the Rams have a worse rushing attack than the Steelers. Heck, Dan could probably make the Steelers roster even though he couldn't make the Rams.

tony hipchest
12-22-2008, 11:41 PM
First thing i would do would be to find where the heck Dan Kreider is. i'd have his but back in a Steeler uniform and Davis on the practice squad faster than you can imagine.

.yeah, make willie run behind dan kreider, that way instead of being just injured with a lost step, he would be slower than any back in history.

if i cant expect my 300 lb grandpa with a walker to clear a hole for willie to run through, why the hell would i want kreider?

fansince'76
12-22-2008, 11:53 PM
Uhm...do the Rams have a worse rushing attack than the Steelers.

Yeah, actually they do - they're currently ranked 27th. The Steelers are ranked 24th.

T.Richardson
12-22-2008, 11:56 PM
Funny thing is no one complained about Arians playcalling last year

stillers4me
12-23-2008, 12:03 AM
Funny thing is no one complained about Arians playcalling last year

Yes they did. :noidea:

T.Richardson
12-23-2008, 12:05 AM
Yes they did. :noidea:

really?

stillers4me
12-23-2008, 12:06 AM
really?

Yep. Really.

T.Richardson
12-23-2008, 12:09 AM
Yep. Really.

:banging:

stillers4me
12-23-2008, 12:12 AM
Arians pink slip was the most anticipated move of the off season.

Didn't happen.

tony hipchest
12-23-2008, 12:42 AM
oh! i got it! we need dan kreider lead blocking for john kuhn.

heath miller will be to expensive to bring back as a blocking te and spaeth was a waste of a 3rd round pick, so we let the both of them walk and bring back breuner and tuman on the cheap.

we would kick ass then....


:rolleyes:

NYC SteelersFan
12-23-2008, 03:59 AM
I think a good plan would be to sign him for the league minimum, then wait for a key situation in the playoffs, and then put him in as the lead blocker. Then right as the ball is snapped, you set him on fire. That would clear out a huge hole. Problem is, you could only run that play once.

LOL

Funny thing is no one complained about Arians playcalling last year

Who ever wasn't, should've been, he sacraficed a great offensive system in exchange for stat padding Roethlisberger. We got exposed in the playoffs and we got exposed bad! The bright side is our QB gets mentioned more on ESPN, so I guess it was an even trade.

oh! i got it! we need dan kreider lead blocking for john kuhn.

heath miller will be to expensive to bring back as a blocking te and spaeth was a waste of a 3rd round pick, so we let the both of them walk and bring back breuner and tuman on the cheap.

we would kick ass then....


:rolleyes:

Coolest quip of the day and the day has just started!

steelreserve
12-23-2008, 04:03 AM
Yeah, actually they do - they're currently ranked 27th. The Steelers are ranked 24th.

To be fair, they've also had a lot less rushing attempts than us (or most teams) because they fall behind so often. They're actually beating us at yards per carry.

We're at 3.6 yards per carry for the entire season. That's worse than the Lions.

fansince'76
12-23-2008, 08:09 AM
To be fair, they've also had a lot less rushing attempts than us (or most teams) because they fall behind so often. They're actually beating us at yards per carry.

We're at 3.6 yards per carry for the entire season. That's worse than the Lions.

A 2/10 of a yard difference (3.8 vs. 3.6 YPC average) is negligible. Through 15 games, we have rushed it 424 times for 1,512 yards and the Rams have rushed it 380 times for 1,447 yards. If the Rams carried the same number of times up to now that we have, that extrapolates to 1,611 yards (rounded down from 1,611.2), which roughly translates to 99 yards over 15 games, or a 6.6 yards per game difference overall, which would be enough to move us up from being ranked 24th in rushing to 22nd. To me at least, that's not enough of an improvement to warrant dumping someone else to clear a roster spot. At this point, Kreider would not help much, IMO. 5 years ago? Absolutely! But not now.

xbroughneck
12-23-2008, 10:33 PM
A 2/10 of a yard difference (3.8 vs. 3.6 YPC average) is negligible. Through 15 games, we have rushed it 424 times for 1,512 yards and the Rams have rushed it 380 times for 1,447 yards. If the Rams carried the same number of times up to now that we have, that extrapolates to 1,611 yards (rounded down from 1,611.2), which roughly translates to 99 yards over 15 games, or a 6.6 yards per game difference overall, which would be enough to move us up from being ranked 24th in rushing to 22nd. To me at least, that's not enough of an improvement to warrant dumping someone else to clear a roster spot. At this point, Kreider would not help much, IMO. 5 years ago? Absolutely! But not now.

I agree actually. i was just making a point that we need to rush with a fullback, and not one that was kept simply because he's a better receiving back than Dan Kreider.

What do i want my fullback to do? BLOCK.

If he can block i don't care if he can't catch, or run with the ball or hike the ball.

I want the best RUN BLOCKERS out there when we run the ball. PERIOD.

Right now, the Steelers have tight ends out there for run plays and they are poor run blockers (as is our right guard).

fansince'76
12-23-2008, 10:36 PM
I agree actually. i was just making a point that we need to rush with a fullback, and not one that was kept simply because he's a better receiving back than Dan Kreider.

What do i want my fullback to do? BLOCK.

If he can block i don't care if he can't catch, or run with the ball or hike the ball.

I want the best RUN BLOCKERS out there when we run the ball. PERIOD.

Right now, the Steelers have tight ends out there for run plays and they are poor run blockers (as is our right guard).

I agree - I just didn't want Kreider back at this point. I'd like to see a real FB on the roster again as well.

tony hipchest
12-23-2008, 10:48 PM
kreider was cut more for his $1+ mil salary per year than anything else.

steelers are pressed towards the cap and any dime saved helps, especially whit declining talents taken into account.

it was a great move when we dropped veteran long snapper m. schneck for rookie g. warren.

moedap
12-23-2008, 11:15 PM
Use Russell as a fullback and distribute the runs. As it stands our Oline isnt good enough to create the kind of holes necessary with a 1 back offensive set. The second level LB's only have to key on 1 RB. A true "pony offense" utilizes all the weapons.

markymarc
12-24-2008, 07:35 AM
The run offense is what it is the rest of 2008. Dump Arians, fix the OL and get a real FB would be a great start in the off season in fixing all of our offensive woes.

SteelMember
12-24-2008, 07:49 AM
:scratchchin:

...put the ball in the endzone.

:hunch:

steelreserve
12-24-2008, 01:04 PM
Use Russell as a fullback and distribute the runs. As it stands our Oline isnt good enough to create the kind of holes necessary with a 1 back offensive set. The second level LB's only have to key on 1 RB. A true "pony offense" utilizes all the weapons.

I have to say, that's not a bad idea at all, provided Russell can block worth a damn, which I have no idea about. That's about the only way you could make defenses guard against the power and outside runs at the same time.

I don't know if tha would count as a "pony offense" with Russell in there. Probably more like a "donkey" backfield or something like that, but I digress.

ricksteelers55
12-25-2008, 05:48 AM
Look here is the deal....we let Kreider go because he wasnt ''as versatile'' as Davis

well the funny thing is Davis only got 64 all purpose yards last year.

Another funny thing is the fact that we've been pounded for a 2nd straight year by a team that runs the 2 head monster.last year Jax with Jones-Drew and Taylor and now Titans with Johnson and White.

When we won the superbowl we had Willie and Bus.That is the secret behind a balanced attack.That is what we have to do.Play the basic of the steelers football by pounding the other team's D with the run that will set up the pass

Now im not saying we wont have any succes playing like we do right now,but it's not going to be on a regular basis.If we want consistency we need to find out a back that could complete Willie.Is moore the answer ? I doubt it...he's playing well right now but im not sure if he's the answer.Is Mendenhall the answer ? maybe I dunno,hope so,but until then we're going to have tough time establishing the run.

Other teams know that our backs love to run east and west instead of north and south they bring the dawg and we get stuff in the backfield.

HometownGal
12-25-2008, 08:40 AM
i was just making a point that we need to rush with a fullback, and not one that was kept simply because he's a better receiving back than Dan Kreider.

What do i want my fullback to do? BLOCK.

If he can block i don't care if he can't catch, or run with the ball or hike the ball.

I want the best RUN BLOCKERS out there when we run the ball. PERIOD.

Right now, the Steelers have tight ends out there for run plays and they are poor run blockers (as is our right guard).

This is where I'm at. The Steelers were a top rushing team with a fullback in the backfield, ala Dan Kreider. I would love nothing more than to see the Steelers O return to that scheme on running plays - it was highly successful.

LambertIsGod58
12-25-2008, 09:03 AM
In my opinion, this set of events of set in motion back in April. We knew we had OL problems and we drafted RB and WR in rounds 1 & 2. We either need FA pickups for the OL or draft accordingly. But I do think that Mendenhall is the future sooner than later. And as HTG mentions, we so desperately need a BLOCKING FB.

markymarc
12-25-2008, 06:18 PM
We either need FA pickups for the OL or draft accordingly. But I do think that Mendenhall is the future sooner than later. And as HTG mentions, we so desperately need a BLOCKING FB.

I think we need to address the OL issue through FA and the draft. Especially considering that we will probably be losing Smith, Starks, Kemo and maybe even Essex. No question Mendenhall will be a star RB in this league. I would love to see us bring back the lunch pail version of FB for this offense. Of course none of these changes really mean anything unless Arians is fired in the off season.

NJSTEELER
12-25-2008, 06:55 PM
Thank you Dolphin, I am so upset with the play of Keomatu. There has got to be somebody else for that left side. Colon is not much better. Can't a head coach override plays sent in by OC. He;s got to be fed up with Arians also. Definately have to look for help on o-line this draft.

markymarc
12-26-2008, 02:40 PM
Thank you Dolphin, I am so upset with the play of Keomatu. There has got to be somebody else for that left side. Colon is not much better.

This is the one thing I don't get. Our entire OL is bad, but yet only Kemo and Colon get called out. Why is that? It's not like Starks, Hartwig and Stapleton are playing lights out on this OL. The entire OL is at fault, not just 1 or 2 players.