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mesaSteeler
12-27-2008, 09:15 AM
Column: Don't blame Arians for Steelers' poor offense
http://www.timesonline.com/articles/2008/12/26/sports/steelers/doc4955b8e9eedfa227422106.txt

By Mike Bires, Times Sports Staff
Published: Saturday, December 27, 2008 12:11 AM EST

You know itís a meaningless football week in Pittsburgh when the media has to debate Bruce Ariansí future.

Since thereís nothing compelling about the hapless Browns coming to town to close out the regular season, the fate of the Steelersí offensive coordinator has been a hot topic.

It started Tuesday at the Mike Tomlin press conference when Tomlin was asked if he stands by his O.C.

ďI wonít even dignify that with an answer,Ē Tomlin snapped.

Good for you, Mike.

Barring a miracle, the Steelers will win their 12th game Sunday. They have already wrapped up the AFCís No. 2 seed in the upcoming playoffs. And someone asks if the coach stands by his offensive coordinator?

The Steelers may rank 23rd in the NFL in total offense, but that has little to do with Arians managing the Steelersí offense.

The subject didnít go away. On Friday during a radio interview on ESPN 1250, Matt Williamson of Scouts Inc. said that Tomlin should fire Arians once this season ends.

I find it hard to believe that a guy who supposedly knows talent and watches tons of videotape actually believes Arians is the cause of the Steelersí offensive problems.

Granted, Iím not keen on the Tomlin/Arians approach thatís phasing out the fullback. But look around the league. Many teams are doing that, including Indianapolis and New England.

I can list several reasons why the Steelers are sputtering on offense. But hereís the top three:

l The offensive line: This is not breaking news, folks. We knew before the season started that the O-line wasnít very good, and nothing has changed. In fact, when you consider that guard Kendall Simmons and tackle Marvel Smith have missed most of the season with injuries, the situation up front is worse than expected.

Not all of the 46 sacks of Ben Roethlisberger can be attributed to the O-line. But most are.

2 Sloppy performances: How many passes has Santonio Holmes dropped this year? How many passes has Nate Washington dropped? How many times have wide receivers failed to get open? And how about Roethlisbergerís red-zone fumble last week in the first quarter in Tennessee? Was that Ariansí fault?

3 The other teamís defense: If the Steelersí top-ranked defense deserves praise for the way it shuts down opposing offense, other teams playing stingy defense deserve credit, too. Of the defenses that rank 2 through 12, the Steelers have played nine of them.

The bottom line is that Arians is calling plays just the way he did last year. But how quickly people forget.

Last year in Ariansí first season as offensive coordinator, running back Willie Parker led the league in rushing before breaking his leg in late December. Roethlisberger set franchise records with 32 TD passes and a 104.1 passer rating. The Steelers ranked third in rushing and tied for ninth in scoring.

No one complained about Arians then. Nor should they now.

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 09:21 AM
HALLE-FREAKIN-LU-JAH!!!!! Someone FINALLY gets it!!!! :applaudit::applaudit::hatsoff:

ohiosteelerfan20
12-27-2008, 09:42 AM
.







Last year in Ariansí first season as offensive coordinator, running back Willie Parker led the league in rushing before breaking his leg in late December. Roethlisberger set franchise records with 32 TD passes and a 104.1 passer rating. The Steelers ranked third in rushing and tied for ninth in scoring.

No one complained about Arians then. Nor should they now.[/QUOTE]

:popcorn: Here they come. The arm chair OCs. The Arians runs too much, too little, we need more screen passes BS.

Hammer67
12-27-2008, 09:51 AM
That's why all the kneejerk people on this board obviously don't know much about football. While I liked Danny Kreider, we forget that there is more then one way to skin a cat...sometimes things change.

Some of the anti Arians stuff on here has made me laugh out loud. If some of those gadget plays in 2005 didn't work then Weisenhunt would have been the devil to you people.

It's funny how some people are simple and need a single scapegoat...

mesaSteeler
12-27-2008, 09:56 AM
Apologies to all for screwing up the tread title. - mesa

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 10:00 AM
Apologies to all for screwing up the tread title. - mesa

Fixed. :thumbsup:

tyler289
12-27-2008, 10:01 AM
The point he has about playing to top defense is absolutely correct. We haven't had the luxury of playing crappy teams all season long.

mesaSteeler
12-27-2008, 10:23 AM
The question I would have is should we be phasing out the fullback?

To quote the article: "Granted, I’m not keen on the Tomlin/Arians approach that’s phasing out the fullback. But look around the league. Many teams are doing that, including Indianapolis and New England."

The no fullback approach does not seem to be working all that well. I am not enough of an X-O's guru to analyze the issue. Another related question is do we have the personnel to run a no fullback offense?

lilyoder6
12-27-2008, 10:48 AM
the whole def thing the steelers have played as been my arguement to keep bruce... but i guess it takes a article for ppl to realize it

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 11:12 AM
Oh THANK the LORD for Mike Bires, WHO?? Mike Bires, WHO???? You know, the guy that set everyone straight on the fire Bruce Arians debate. :rofl:

l The offensive line: This is not breaking news, folks. We knew before the season started that the O-line wasn’t very good, and nothing has changed. In fact, when you consider that guard Kendall Simmons and tackle Marvel Smith have missed most of the season with injuries, the situation up front is worse than expected.

Not all of the 46 sacks of Ben Roethlisberger can be attributed to the O-line. But most are.

2 Sloppy performances: How many passes has Santonio Holmes dropped this year? How many passes has Nate Washington dropped? How many times have wide receivers failed to get open? And how about Roethlisberger’s red-zone fumble last week in the first quarter in Tennessee? Was that Arians’ fault?

3 The other team’s defense: If the Steelers’ top-ranked defense deserves praise for the way it shuts down opposing offense, other teams playing stingy defense deserve credit, too. Of the defenses that rank 2 through 12, the Steelers have played nine of them

And look at the MANY fine points that he has made. Hell my dog could have come up with that assessment of the Steelers this season, where has this genius been all along? He could have solved this debate months ago. :thumbsup:

It's six of one and a half dozen of the other. This article carries no more weight than any of the others. So NO, we haven't yet read something from "someone who gets it".
The only person THAT GETS IT is Mike Tomlin. I'll wait to see what he has to say at seasons end. In the meantime, the Mike Bires article goes to the garbage with the junk mail.

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 11:20 AM
It's six of one and a half dozen of the other. This article carries no more weight than any of the others. So NO, we haven't yet read something from "someone who gets it".
The only person THAT GETS IT is Mike Tomlin. I'll wait to see what he has to say at seasons end. In the meantime, the Mike Bires article goes to the garbage with the junk mail.

And if Tomlin retains him as OC, then what?

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 11:23 AM
And if Tomlin retains him as OC, then what?

Then he retains him. What, what?? What are you looking for in a response?

SteelCityMan786
12-27-2008, 11:28 AM
HALLE-FREAKIN-LU-JAH!!!!! Someone FINALLY gets it!!!! :applaudit::applaudit::hatsoff:

A-FREAKIN-MEN! I'm tired of everyone busting on Arians. If people would realize what the heck the Offensive Coordinators have to do these days with deciding their play calling, then I'm sure they'd have 2nd thoughts about the difficulty of the job.

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 11:31 AM
Then he retains him. What, what?? What are you looking for in a response?

Never mind - your response answers it. Somehow if Tomlin doesn't fire him, I don't think that will settle the "debate" one iota with many fans.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 11:36 AM
Never mind - your response answers it. Somehow if Tomlin doesn't fire him, I don't think that will settle the "debate" one iota with many fans.


And one could say the same thing if Tomlin does fire him.

If he keeps him I'll be disappointed but I won't be jumping off of a bridge or anything along those lines. I'll never question Tomlin's decision on ANY football related matter. All that we as fans can do is sit back and watch what happens, just as we do during every game.

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 11:40 AM
All that we as fans can do is sit back and watch what happens, just as we do during every game.

Agreed. :drink:

Dr. Steel
12-27-2008, 11:41 AM
I could careless if Arians is fired or not. The main objective heading into the off-season is to improve the offensive line. That alone will improve the entire offense. But it seems that some think Arians doesn't deserve some of the blame for the offensive woes this year. Arians doesn't deserve all of the blame and shouldn't be the scape goat. But he deserves part the blame just like the poor execution by the players at times and the crappy offensive line. The entire offense from coaches to players are guilty for the Steelers sluggish offense this year.

stillers4me
12-27-2008, 01:33 PM
I could careless if Arians is fired or not. The main objective heading into the off-season is to improve the offensive line. That alone will improve the entire offense. But it seems that some think Arians doesn't deserve some of the blame for the offensive woes this year. Arians doesn't deserve all of the blame and shouldn't be the scape goat. But he deserves part the blame just like the poor execution by the players at times and the crappy offensive line. The entire offense from coaches to players are guilty for the Steelers sluggish offense this year.

Bingo..... but which comes first? The chicken or the eggs?

New chicken.....different eggs?

GBMelBlount
12-27-2008, 01:39 PM
But he deserves part the blame just like the poor execution by the players at times and the crappy offensive line.

Ya, but do you think Arians would have picked these players had he been solely making the FA and draft decisions? My point is that he, though not blameless imo, can only do so much with our current offensive line personnel...

stillers4me
12-27-2008, 01:46 PM
Ya, but do you think Arians would have picked these players had he been solely making the FA and draft decisions? My point is that he, though not blameless imo, can only do so much with our current offensive line personnel...

But were these players picked to fit along the lines of Arian's offensive schemes and not necessarily our traditional style of offense?

And as far as people saying things were ok last year, I don't remember it quite that way. People were waiting after the Jags playoff game to see if Arians got the "heave ho", too. There were alot of calls for his head, then too. When it was announced there would be no coaching changes, the consensus said, "ok, we'll give it another year to jell with his changes." Well, guess what? The jello melted. I understand why we didn't get the guys in the draft. But the run game has degenerated badly under his coaching. Does anyone really think that a third year........another year to waste all the talent on this team is going to make a difference?

I hoping as badly as everyone else is that something miraculous is going to happen come the playoff games, that we see new life in the offense, or that our defense can carry us along like it has most of the year. Time will tell.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 02:21 PM
That's why all the kneejerk people on this board obviously don't know much about football. While I liked Danny Kreider, we forget that there is more then one way to skin a cat...sometimes things change.

Some of the anti Arians stuff on here has made me laugh out loud. If some of those gadget plays in 2005 didn't work then Weisenhunt would have been the devil to you people.

It's funny how some people are simple and need a single scapegoat...

And please enlighten us all what makes you such a football genius.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 02:30 PM
I am not sold on Arians at the end of this year as I was last year.

But if the coach and the organization want him back... then he comes back.

I don't have a THING to say about it,.

I prefer it that way.

I also recognize there are a lot of OTHER problems on this offense. . . thar Arians is shouldering the blame for unfairly. To what degree is it him vs. those other problems, I have no idea. . . which again, is why I am happy I am responsible for the decision.

and i am happy no other fan is either.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 02:31 PM
And please enlighten us all what makes you such a football genius.

Its not abut being a football genius, it is about how people react and interact.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
12-27-2008, 02:32 PM
The sloppy play, the bad line, and the play calling still fall back upon the coaching staff. Part of the coaching staffs responsibility is to get the team fired up to play. The defense seems fired up, the offense not so much.

Leftoverhard
12-27-2008, 02:34 PM
good article. I've been really sick of the whining about Arians all season long.

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-27-2008, 02:35 PM
To quote the article: "Granted, Iím not keen on the Tomlin/Arians approach thatís phasing out the fullback. But look around the league. Many teams are doing that, including Indianapolis and New England."

Another related question is do we have the personnel to run a no fullback offense?

The Patriots use 250lb Heath Evans (good blocker and receiver), while the Colts use 255lb TE/Hback Gijon Robinson as lead blockers in short yardage. The Steelers had used 225lb Carey Davis, but he has been largely ineffective so we have seen a lot of empty sets and throwing on 3rd down.

Do we have the personnel to run a no FB offense?? I think yes we do because we have no FB, but the teams the author uses as examples do have viable lead blockers to use in short yardage situions where the Steelers do not.

This is similar to Arians offense in Cleveland where there was no true FB. The year after Arians left there, the Browns signed Terrelle Smith as a true blocking FB.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 02:39 PM
Its not abut being a football genius, it is about how people react and interact.

And that is exactly my point. Listen I get the whole point about everyone having an opinion. I get it that people want to still defend Arians, but people should not be bashed for not supporting Arians either. There are several issues with the offense and that includes the OL, not having a real FB, formations and ARIANS. Arians is part of the problem as well. I love it that we are about to become 12-4 after tomorrow considering our schedule and dealing with our injuries during the year, but I also refuse to be blind to weaknesses on this team.

Hammer67
12-27-2008, 02:39 PM
Oh THANK the LORD for Mike Bires, WHO?? Mike Bires, WHO???? You know, the guy that set everyone straight on the fire Bruce Arians debate. :rofl:

l The offensive line: This is not breaking news, folks. We knew before the season started that the O-line wasnít very good, and nothing has changed. In fact, when you consider that guard Kendall Simmons and tackle Marvel Smith have missed most of the season with injuries, the situation up front is worse than expected.

Not all of the 46 sacks of Ben Roethlisberger can be attributed to the O-line. But most are.

2 Sloppy performances: How many passes has Santonio Holmes dropped this year? How many passes has Nate Washington dropped? How many times have wide receivers failed to get open? And how about Roethlisbergerís red-zone fumble last week in the first quarter in Tennessee? Was that Ariansí fault?

3 The other teamís defense: If the Steelersí top-ranked defense deserves praise for the way it shuts down opposing offense, other teams playing stingy defense deserve credit, too. Of the defenses that rank 2 through 12, the Steelers have played nine of them

And look at the MANY fine points that he has made. Hell my dog could have come up with that assessment of the Steelers this season, where has this genius been all along? He could have solved this debate months ago. :thumbsup:

It's six of one and a half dozen of the other. This article carries no more weight than any of the others. So NO, we haven't yet read something from "someone who gets it".
The only person THAT GETS IT is Mike Tomlin. I'll wait to see what he has to say at seasons end. In the meantime, the Mike Bires article goes to the garbage with the junk mail.

Actually, because the "Fire Arians" crowd has absolutely NO response or information to back up their opinions, this pretty much settles it.

WAAAAA!!! Fire Arians because....I HATE HIM!!! WAAAAA!!!" is not an argument against...

I'm just saying....:coffee:

Hammer67
12-27-2008, 02:41 PM
And please enlighten us all what makes you such a football genius.

I'm not...just haven't heard a valid argument for firing Arians. I am open to good points. Plus, I have been around long enough to hear every "sky is falling" non logical argument there is regarding the Steelers every year. If you stand back and look at it from a fan of another team's perspective, then it looks silly. We are spoiled, face it.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 02:42 PM
And who exactly is Mike Bires? Just because Mike Bires says it, then that must be true :banging:

Hammer67
12-27-2008, 02:48 PM
And that is exactly my point. Listen I get the whole point about everyone having an opinion. I get it that people want to still defend Arians, but people should not be bashed for not supporting Arians either. There are several issues with the offense and that includes the OL, not having a real FB, formations and ARIANS. Arians is part of the problem as well. I love it that we are about to become 12-4 after tomorrow considering our schedule and dealing with our injuries during the year, but I also refuse to be blind to weaknesses on this team.

Your entitled to your opinion as I am mine. If that offends you then you have options. We are discussing...and "Fire Arians" is kind of extreme. I will call out any extreme reactions and ask for explanations...haven't heard a great one yet, btw.

I don't care one iota for Arians...could care less if he stays or goes. All I care about is that the Steelers play competitive football and make the playoffs, which they have in two years with Arians as OC.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 02:48 PM
I'm not...just haven't heard a valid argument against firing Arians. I am open to good points.

Okay that is fair. Let's start off with these 2 arguments then. At what point during this season have you seen Arians attack a defenses weakness. Also, I have yet to see Arians make any in game adjustments. Sorry, but when you are an OC those are 2 of your biggest responsibilities. Also, when you know one of the bigger problems offensively is your OL, wouldn't you game plan more to protect Ben. For instance more 2 and 3 step drop backs, more bootlegs, heck even more of the no huddle during games. Finally, as an OC you should be defining your identity. Sorry, but I have yet to see an identity for this offense.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 03:15 PM
Okay that is fair. Let's start off with these 2 arguments then. At what point during this season have you seen Arians attack a defenses weakness. Also, I have yet to see Arians make any in game adjustments. Sorry, but when you are an OC those are 2 of your biggest responsibilities. Also, when you know one of the bigger problems offensively is your OL, wouldn't you game plan more to protect Ben. For instance more 2 and 3 step drop backs, more bootlegs, heck even more of the no huddle during games. Finally, as an OC you should be defining your identity. Sorry, but I have yet to see an identity for this offense.

The identity was defined last year. This year, there is just too many problems. Who knows why? Personally, I think it really is teh o line and injuries. There is no doubt the offense is out of sync, and has been that way all year. BUt if you go back and look at the box scores, you will find a number of times the offense started rolling in the second half. So adjustments have been made.

And in order to attack a defenses weakness, you need to be able to have time. Our line was not able to give it.

Over the last few weeks, they have played better. So we will see.

I just think, IMO, it is foolish to blame Arians for all the problems.

lilyoder6
12-27-2008, 03:22 PM
evryone needs to stop bitching about the FB pos... we rarely used a fb last yr and willie was the league rusher...

all i see about is how we are not using the FB pos... if we had a good fb.. this offense would still be NOTHING

devilsdancefloor
12-27-2008, 03:33 PM
And who exactly is Mike Bires? Just because Mike Bires says it, then that must be true :banging:

and no offense who the hell is marky marc ??? :banging::banging::banging:
just because you say it doesnt make it so either! :noidea:

lets sit back and enjoy our team instead of constantly bashing them:drink::drink:

Big D
12-27-2008, 03:46 PM
I bust arians balls more then anyone. But I think he should get another year for two reasons. If you shit can him who are you going to replace him with? and two this offense has had to run with its third string rb this year. I say give him a year with mendenhall and a healthy offensive line. And we will see at the end of next year

markymarc
12-27-2008, 04:39 PM
Your entitled to your opinion as I am mine. If that offends you then you have options. We are discussing...and "Fire Arians" is kind of extreme. I will call out any extreme reactions and ask for explanations...haven't heard a great one yet, btw.

I don't care one iota for Arians...could care less if he stays or goes. All I care about is that the Steelers play competitive football and make the playoffs, which they have in two years with Arians as OC.

Well right back at you then. If my opinion offends you then you have options as well. I am not asking to fire Arians right now. I love the Steelers as much as the next guy and of course want competitive football, but I also will not cover my eyes and just sit back if I do see issues with with team I support. The offense is what it is the rest of this year. I can live with that and will root them on through the playoff run. All I am saying is in the off season you always must look to improve the team. And at this point IMO that includes the OL and OC.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 04:47 PM
The identity was defined last year. This year, there is just too many problems. Who knows why? Personally, I think it really is teh o line and injuries. There is no doubt the offense is out of sync, and has been that way all year. BUt if you go back and look at the box scores, you will find a number of times the offense started rolling in the second half. So adjustments have been made.

And in order to attack a defenses weakness, you need to be able to have time. Our line was not able to give it.

Over the last few weeks, they have played better. So we will see.

I just think, IMO, it is foolish to blame Arians for all the problems.

Okay you say the identity was defined last year. What exactly is that identity? Let me know because I am still trying to figure it out. No question we have had injuries and I know the OL is a major problem with the offense. I saw the offense roll at times when we went to the no huddle. I also saw inconsistency in the 2nd half with the offense just like the first half. There have been plenty of times where the OL did give us time, but not so sure we really attacked the weakness of different defenses we faced each week. Listen the playoffs are a whole new season and IMO I think we can go all the way. Whatever happens this season I guarantee that I will be supporting the Steelers every single day in the off season until the 2009 season begins. I never once said Arians is the only problem with the offense, but I also am not ignorant enough to realize he is not part of the offensive struggles.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 04:53 PM
and no offense who the hell is marky marc ??? :banging::banging::banging:
just because you say it doesnt make it so either! :noidea:

lets sit back and enjoy our team instead of constantly bashing them:drink::drink:

And no offense, but who the hell is devilsdancefloor. Never said my word is the final word. I am not that ridiculous. I have enjoyed this season to the fullest. We could go 0-16 in a year, but I can guarantee you that I will watch every single game and support the Steelers every single day every single year that I am on this earth. I will enjoy the game tomorrow and will definitely enjoy our playoff push to the super bowl this year. No doubt about that. I also will not play dumb to think Arians is not part of our problem though either. I've said it before and will say it again Ben playing great, mistake free football and our defense gives us a great shot at making the super bowl this year. By the way, I am not constantly bashing this team. But I also know the OL and Arians is part of our offensive struggles this year.

markymarc
12-27-2008, 05:05 PM
I bust arians balls more then anyone. But I think he should get another year for two reasons. If you shit can him who are you going to replace him with? and two this offense has had to run with its third string rb this year. I say give him a year with mendenhall and a healthy offensive line. And we will see at the end of next year

Not saying it will happen, but here are 3 options:

Chan Gailey (KC) - Peterson is out after tomorrow's Chiefs game. Who knows what will happen, but with him out that could be a major shake up in KC's FO and coaching staff. Also, Dan Rooney is real familiar with Gailey and he was even brought in for an interview when they were searching for the next HC after Cowher left.

Darell Bevell (Minnesota) - If the Vikings don't make the playoffs Childress may be out. If anybody knows Vikings it would be Tomlin and this guy has been doing pretty good with Peterson and having QBs like Jackson and Ferrotte.

Dirk Koetter (Jacksonville) - The Jaguars have been awful and most likely Del Rio will probably be fired. Dirk did a great job with Taylor and Jones Drew and has done a pretty good job with an average QB in Garrard.

I get it that FWP has not been 100% for awhile and Mendenhall going down has not helped, but Moore is running pretty good behind that shitty OL. Don't forget Moore was the backup RB in Minnesota at one time. No doubt the OL has to be addressed in the off season, but sorry I am just not sold on Arians. I just see him as part of the offensive issues.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 05:37 PM
Actually, because the "Fire Arians" crowd has absolutely NO response or information to back up their opinions, this pretty much settles it.

WAAAAA!!! Fire Arians because....I HATE HIM!!! WAAAAA!!!" is not an argument against...

I'm just saying....:coffee:

A childish utterance of a response, man that was impressive. :thumbsup:

Like I said, it's six of one and half dozen of another. It just so happens that YOU chose this thread in an attempt to back your belief. Scroll down a thread or two, you'll find another article that is quite contrary to this one.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 05:46 PM
Well right back at you then. If my opinion offends you then you have options as well. I am not asking to fire Arians right now. I love the Steelers as much as the next guy and of course want competitive football, but I also will not cover my eyes and just sit back if I do see issues with with team I support. The offense is what it is the rest of this year. I can live with that and will root them on through the playoff run. All I am saying is in the off season you always must look to improve the team. And at this point IMO that includes the OL and OC.


Good point. You know, I think that the Arians supporters could start a "I love Bruce Arians" thread and NOT ONE Arians basher would visit that particular thread. But post an Arians bashing thread and look out, here they come, the Arians supporting know it alls. :busted:

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 05:51 PM
A childish utterance of a response, man that was impressive. :thumbsup:

you mean as opposed to this?-


I'm serious when I say this, I'll accept anyone to replace Arians, even if it's Karl Childers.



:busted: :thumbsup: :coffee:

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 05:58 PM
you mean as opposed to this?-




:busted: :thumbsup: :coffee:

:chuckle::applaudit::chuckle:

lilyoder6
12-27-2008, 06:01 PM
oooo

tony to call him out... u must feel akward now

GodofGridiron
12-27-2008, 06:37 PM
I just want two solid reasons why some folks here think Bruce is a decent Off Coordinator.

Just two..........s'all im askin............

missedgehead
12-27-2008, 07:08 PM
Not saying Arians is the entire blame (bad o line, mistakes made by the offensive players, etc like the article said), however he is not totally blameless like some here are trying to say. I know a certain member of the team LOVES Arians, but I am sorry, Arians is predictable as all hell. I could call the next play. Run the RB to the left Run to the right, (maybe on occasion throw on first down) and then on 3rd and forever PASS. Stevie Wonder, and Ray Charles could see we were gonna pass on 3rd down EVERY TIME. So what if Ben had the fancy stats last year. And? Wasn't his boy Arians the genius who called that 3rd and 6 QB sweep in that playoff game last year against the Jags when Ben was throwing the ball well in the second half and all we needed was a FIRST DOWN to seal the game away?

Yeah, some OC!

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 07:10 PM
:blah: :blah: :blah:

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 07:17 PM
I just want two solid reasons why some folks here think Bruce is a decent Off Coordinator.

Just two..........s'all im askin............

(1) The Steelers won the AFCN last season with BA as the OC.

(2) The Steelers won the AFCN this season with BA as the OC.

There ya go.

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 07:20 PM
Not saying Arians is the entire blame (bad o line, mistakes made by the offensive players, etc like the article said), however he is not totally blameless like some here are trying to say. I know a certain member of the team LOVES Arians, but I am sorry, Arians is predictable as all hell. I could call the next play. Run the RB to the left Run to the right, (maybe on occasion throw on first down) and then on 3rd and forever PASS. Stevie Wonder, and Ray Charles could see we were gonna pass on 3rd down EVERY TIME. So what if Ben had the fancy stats last year. And? Wasn't his boy Arians the genius who called that 3rd and 6 QB sweep in that playoff game last year against the Jags when Ben was throwing the ball well in the second half and all we needed was a FIRST DOWN to seal the game away?

Yeah, some OC!

Get that resume in to the Steelers front office there Missedge. Gosh golly gee - you'd be famous as the first female OC in the NFL. :cheer::cheer:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 07:32 PM
oooo

tony to call him out... u must feel akward now


Yeah boy, didn't you see me running west bound with my tail between my legs? Gosh darn that was a scolding. :rofl:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 07:34 PM
:chuckle::applaudit::chuckle:

I'll have to applaud that one myself. That may rate as THE BEST EVER comeback in forum history, don't you think? I kind of feel like Ed McMahon, hoo hooo hooo hooo hooo.

missedgehead
12-27-2008, 07:38 PM
Get that resume in to the Steelers front office there Missedge. Gosh golly gee - you'd be famous as the first female OC in the NFL. :cheer::cheer:

So no one is allowed to criticize this guy? I guess this is the OC who shall not be criticized along with the Player who shall never be criticized who btw has input in the offense which is part of the problem. When Whisenhunt was the OC, the Player who shall never be criticized remained the game manager and did what he was told and had NO say in the offense. Whisenhunt ran the show like an OC is supposed to. That is just my opinion.

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 07:42 PM
I'll have to applaud that one myself. That may rate as THE BEST EVER comeback in forum history, don't you think? I kind of feel like Ed McMahon, hoo hooo hooo hooo hooo.


"A childish utterance of a response, man that was impressive. :thumbsup:



.

"

lol..... :thumbsup:

and missegghead, you might wanna produce a post where anyone states that the OC is completely blameless before you go flapping your gums...

missedgehead
12-27-2008, 07:46 PM
"

"

lol..... :thumbsup:

and missegghead, you might wanna produce a post where anyone states that the OC is completely blameless before you go flapping your gums...

Hey, if you are gonna insult me, spell my nickname or whatever correctly. I guess you are one of those male chauvinist pigs to talk to me like that. Whatever. :coffee:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 07:51 PM
"

"

lol..... :thumbsup:

and missegghead, you might wanna produce a post where anyone states that the OC is completely blameless before you go flapping your gums...


The absolute KING of the one liners. Yes indeed. I guess the couple of people who talked you up were right. We're definitely seeing evidence of it TONIGHT.

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 07:54 PM
So no one is allowed to criticize this guy? I guess this is the OC who shall not be criticized along with the Player who shall never be criticized who btw has input in the offense which is part of the problem. When Whisenhunt was the OC, the Player who shall never be criticized remained the game manager and did what he was told and had NO say in the offense. Whisenhunt ran the show like an OC is supposed to. That is just my opinion.

Your opinion is duly noted.

Criticism, when done constructively, is A-OK by me. Scapegoating, however, is something I will call out every time, as it is meritless, destructive and redundant. Last season, Mahan was the anti-Christ. This season, it's Arians with a heaping tablespoon of Ben and FWP thrown in. :coffee:

How many more "Arians suuuuuuucks", "No he doesn't", "Ben suuuuuucks", "No he doesn't" threads are going to permeate this board??? :doh:

We can love or hate Arians, FWP, Ben - whoever - all we wish. It's Tomlin's team and he has the final say, not us.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 07:55 PM
Hey, if you are gonna insult me, spell my nickname or whatever correctly. I guess you are one of those male chauvinist pigs to talk to me like that. Whatever. :coffee:


:rofl:


Tony is too much an obama supporter for that!

:stirthepot: :chuckle:


Seriously, to bring sexism into this discussion? come on.

Fact is, there is virtually NO ONE on this board that thinks Arians is the be all end all.

There is, however, people on this board that don't care for the constant berating of our team. Those people have a right to say their peace too.

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 08:02 PM
Awaiting the obligatory "Anyone who doesn't see the flaws in this team (and fails to repeatedly call them out in each and every thread) is a blind, Kool-Aid drinking, cheerleading homer" post in 5,4,3,2,1.... :coffee:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:03 PM
:rofl:


Tony is too much an obama supporter for that!

:stirthepot: :chuckle:


Seriously, to bring sexism into this discussion? come on.

Fact is, there is virtually NO ONE on this board that thinks Arians is the be all end all.

There is, however, people on this board that don't care for the constant berating of our team. Those people have a right to say their peace too.


I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 08:05 PM
I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?

So calling someone else's post childish isn't belittling someone else's post? Using a couple of emoticons is worse than referring to someone else's post as "childish?"

missedgehead
12-27-2008, 08:10 PM
:rofl:


Tony is too much an obama supporter for that!

:stirthepot: :chuckle:


Seriously, to bring sexism into this discussion? come on.

Fact is, there is virtually NO ONE on this board that thinks Arians is the be all end all.

There is, however, people on this board that don't care for the constant berating of our team. Those people have a right to say their peace too.

Preacher,

One, I worship Jesus Christ. I do not worship a football team. Do you understand? IMO, it is only a team, and not life and death so I do not see honest constructive criticism as "berating." I enjoy the team(s) on Sundays and then go on with my life. Btw, In my parents' day, no man would talk to a female the way he spoke to me. I didn't appreciate it. I don't think he would have spoken to a male member of the board like that. JMO. Hope we understand each other.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:12 PM
So calling someone else's post childish isn't belittling someone else's post? Using a couple of emoticons is worse than referring to someone else's post as "childish?"

Hold up Gary, that dude started on me. I didn't say anything to him until he quoted my post with well, "baby talk". It was childish, he drew it up that way so I wasn't insulting him.

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 08:13 PM
Hey, if you are gonna insult me, spell my nickname or whatever correctly. I guess you are one of those male chauvinist pigs to talk to me like that. Whatever. :coffee:sorry....


call it a freudian slip or something.

i see "missedgehead" but sometimes i think and type "missegghead". :noidea:

the same would most likely be true if your screen name were misteredgehead (if that helps).

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 08:13 PM
Fact is, there is virtually NO ONE on this board that thinks Arians is the be all end all.



I support BA, though I don't religiously agree with all of his maneuvers out there, but I'm human enough to realize that the guy has faults - hey - don't we all? I also realize that I am a fan on the outside looking in, am not in BA's shoes having to game plan with all of the injuries the O has suffered this season and a sieve of an OL, and last but not least - am certainly not an NFL-calibre "expert". I can almost guarantee that if BA were released by the Steelers, he would have an OC or HC position within a week. 21-11 (thus far) in 2 seasons and two AFCN's as OC on his resume ain't boobkies.

stillers4me
12-27-2008, 08:15 PM
sorry....


call it a freudian slip or something.

i see "missedgehead" but sometimes i think and type "missegghead". :noidea:

the same would most likely be true if your screen name were misteredgehead (if that helps).

This place is full of "egg-spurts". :toofunny:

Sometimes I just "crack" myself up........ :sofunny:

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 08:19 PM
Hold up Gary, that dude started on me. I didn't say anything to him until he quoted my post with well, "baby talk". It was childish, he drew it up that way so I wasn't insulting him.

Post #2 of this thread: HALLE-FREAKIN-LU-JAH!!!!! Someone FINALLY gets it!!!! :applaudit::applaudit::hatsoff:

And then you go off on this tangent:

Oh THANK the LORD for Mike Bires, WHO?? Mike Bires, WHO???? You know, the guy that set everyone straight on the fire Bruce Arians debate. :rofl:

It's six of one and a half dozen of the other. This article carries no more weight than any of the others. So NO, we haven't yet read something from "someone who gets it".
The only person THAT GETS IT is Mike Tomlin. I'll wait to see what he has to say at seasons end. In the meantime, the Mike Bires article goes to the garbage with the junk mail.

If you're going to mock the posts of others, don't start squawking when you get it back.

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 08:19 PM
[/B]


I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?

For the last time . . . :banging::doh::banging:

THERE IS NO "CERTAIN CORE GROUP OF MEMBERS"

THERE ARE NO "CLIQUES" HERE

GARY AND I DO NOT PLAY FAVORITES

AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST . . . . . . . . .

IF YOU DISH IT OUT, YOU'D BEST BE ABLE TO TAKE IT.

End of story.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:20 PM
In my opinion, Arians will be coaching Wr's next season in either Detroit or San Francisco. I don't believe that anyone will view the Steelers division winning success as being accredited to Arians.

Just my opinion of course. :hatsoff:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:22 PM
For the last time . . . :banging::doh::banging:

THERE IS NO "CERTAIN CORE GROUP OF MEMBERS"

THERE ARE NO "CLIQUES" HERE

GARY AND I DO NOT PLAY FAVORITES

AND LAST BUT NOT LEAST . . . . . . . . .

IF YOU DISH IT OUT, YOU'D BEST BE ABLE TO TAKE IT.

End of story.


I'm not speaking of myself, I CAN HANDLE MY OWN! I was just wondering why a female member was bashed but nevermind, she HANDLED HERSELF QUITE WELL AGAINST THE MALES!

Speaking of dishing it out, I'm not permitted to dish out some of the names that I've seen around here.

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 08:26 PM
[/B]


I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?
oh please.

you do know a broken record doesnt play well, right?

ive ripped arians my fair share, but ive also been realistic about it.

it seems like a bunch of new members are not coping well with the fact that their are a bunch of long time members who are still posting.

if thats a problem i have only one suggestion... come correct or dont come at all. simply bitching about a problem with the steelers isnt gonna get you nowhere.

old hat isnt gonna simply step aside for the newbs.

i still dont recall you posting any better alternatives to arians running the offense....

:tap:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:27 PM
Post #2 of this thread:

And then you go off on this tangent:



If you're going to mock the posts of others, don't start squawking when you get it back.

Everyone mocks the post of others. As I've already stated, I can handle my own. I was speaking up for the female who was called an egghead or whatever the name was but nevermind, she handled herself well.

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 08:27 PM
In my opinion, Arians will be coaching Wr's next season in either Detroit or San Francisco. I don't believe that anyone will view the Steelers division winning success as being accredited to Arians.

Just my opinion of course. :hatsoff:

I believe Arians will be our OC next season and I respectfully disagree with your assumption above. Any HC with a fraction of a brain cell can clearly see where the problems lie with our OL being unable to pass block or open up running lanes, not to mention the injuries to key players, which have been huge factors in our O sputtering this season.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:29 PM
oh please.

you do know a broken record doesnt play well, right?

ive ripped arians my fair share, but ive also been realistic about it.

it seems like a bunch of new members are not coping well with the fact that their are a bunch of long time members who are still posting.

if thats a problem i have only one suggestion... come correct or dont come at all. simply bitching about a problem with the steelers isnt gonna get you nowhere.

old hat isnt gonna simply step aside for the newbs.

i still dont recall you posting any better alternatives to arians running the offense....

:tap:


And I won't, it's not my job to provide a list of viable candidates.

fansince'76
12-27-2008, 08:29 PM
[/B]

Everyone mocks the post of others. As I've already stated, I can handle my own. I was speaking up for the female who was called an egghead or whatever the name was but nevermind, she handled herself well.

Fair enough. :drink:

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 08:33 PM
And I won't, it's not my job to provide a list of viable candidates.

Then how, in good conscience, can all of you redundant B & M'ers continue to B & M? :noidea:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:35 PM
I believe Arians will be our OC next season and I respectfully disagree with your assumption above. Any HC with a fraction of a brain cell can clearly see where the problems lie with our OL being unable to pass block or open up running lanes, not to mention the injuries to key players, which have been huge factors in our O sputtering this season.

Alright, I can respect that opinion. Hey, I'll send you a private message later tonight or tommorow in regards to a contest idea that I have.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:36 PM
Then how, in good conscience, can all of you redundant B & M'ers continue to B & M? :noidea:

Because we simply hate the mans offensive system.

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 08:40 PM
And I won't, it's not my job to provide a list of viable candidates.

well if you dont have any opinions on the solution, dont whine when nobody gives any merit to your opinions on the "problem".

:drink:

like i said, come correct...

Because we simply hate the mans offensive system.

and you love whos? sean paytons? whoever is the coordinator for this years leading rusher? is mike mularkey now a genius because he's running m. turner?

seriously... who's offense should we emmulate and how do we pay for it?

Preacher
12-27-2008, 08:41 PM
[/b]


I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?

There are no "rules enforced"

well--- except that I should probably have spelled out the proper "peace" there :chuckle:

A number of people have posted their dislike of Arians. Heck, I have posted at times as well. I am definitely on the fence with him.

For me personally... When I come across a thread like "arians sucks" "fire arians" and then the first post is "fire Arians" or "Arians sucks," such blanket statements are asinine because they don't take into consideration all the nuances. Last year, he led one of the most potent offenses in the league. This year, the offense is sputtering.

If a person were to post a thread asking why the offense is sputtering this year as opposed to last, and what level Arians invovlement has to do with it... I don't think, at least in the beginning, there would have been any problems.

Go back and look at the posts of FS, HTG, Tony, El-gonzo, MOP X-term, etc. etc. and read when they are critiquing a player, a call, etc. It isn't, HE sucks.. or, "its a fact" or I know what I am talking about so you are wrong.

THAT is what most of these threads devolve into, and why some around here who have been here a while get sick of seeing the same thing over and over and then end up in suspensions and or bans.

Heck, you should have been here my first season, 2006. It got REAL ugly. Last year after the playoff loss was kind bad, but not like 2006.

Personally, I do NOT want to see this board return to that and am happy that the mods are doing the job they do. They aren't perfect. Heck, HTG still likes Lemiex has a hockey player (now HE was a whiner! Boy I am going to get in trouble for that one!).

Point is, relax, enjoy the boards. But remember, there are real people behind every keyboard. Discuss and debate here like you would in a restaurant or a public place. Because in reality, that is what it is.

Of course... I am NOT A MOD... So this is ALL MY OPINION. Post count don't matter, my opinion carries no more weight than anyone elses...

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:41 PM
This is a stupid post, probably not the first one that I've done but anyway. Although we argue a lot, I actually like you ladies and gentlemen. It's quite the entertainment for a Saturday night. I could be doing a lot worse, like boozing it up at the local club and brawling with some scumbag.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 08:49 PM
And I won't, it's not my job to provide a list of viable candidates.


No, but that is what makes it seem that you only want to complain... and whether it is in person, or on a board... that gets real tiring real fast.

So take a shot at it. Who would you go after?

Here is my shot....

Mike Martz. He was just let go in SF. SF. did not have the talent to run his schemes. The Rams did, and I think our offense has just as much talent as the Rams of the late 90's did. However, we HAVE to fix the line first.

Like I said however, I am still on the fence with Arians.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 08:50 PM
This is a stupid post, probably not the first one that I've done but anyway. Although we argue a lot, I actually like you ladies and gentlemen. It's quite the entertainment for a Saturday night. I could be doing a lot worse, like boozing it up at the local club and brawling with some scumbag.

Hey...

I thought we were getting together to do that tomorrow after church?? :hunch:

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 08:52 PM
This is a stupid post, probably not the first one that I've done but anyway. Although we argue a lot, I actually like you ladies and gentlemen. It's quite the entertainment for a Saturday night. I could be doing a lot worse, like boozing it up at the local club and brawling with some scumbag.

:drink: ive definitely encountered worse conversation at the club while boozing it up.

the only thing this place lacks is the hot skanks to look at.... :laughing:

the "arguing" is fun and generally healthy if carried about in the right manner.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 08:54 PM
well if you dont have any opinions on the solution, dont whine when nobody gives any merit to your opinions on the "problem".

:drink:

like i said, come correct...



and you love whos? sean paytons? whoever is the coordinator for this years leading rusher? is mike mularkey now a genius because he's running m. turner?

seriously... who's offense should we emmulate and how do we pay for it?

I can definitely name a system, the OC isn't available but I love the offensive system. The New York Giants. I don't know if I understand your question of "how do we pay for it"? Do you mean the OC's salary, or the player personnel?

The Steelers could probably emulate the Giants offensive system pretty well with their current group of players. Of course they would have to sign a FB and any off-season upgrades at the O-line positions would benefit. Now granted, the Steelers don't have a beast at RB like Jacobs so there will definitely be a downgrade at the power back position.

I don't know, I just like how the Giants run the ball effectively while still spreading the ball around on passing downs. Most of their routes seem to be short to moderate with the QB throwing to the TE, the RB(including the FB), and each WR. I hate the damn Giants but I like their offensive system.

Dr. Steel
12-27-2008, 08:56 PM
The Steelers already had the Giants OC once as their OC. Keven Gilbride is the Giants OC.

tony hipchest
12-27-2008, 08:59 PM
Here is my shot....

Mike Martz. He was just let go in SF. SF. did not have the talent to run his schemes. The Rams did, and I think our offense has just as much talent as the Rams of the late 90's did. However, we HAVE to fix the line first.

Like I said however, I am still on the fence with Arians.i thought about that for a second based on his pedigree and past success (i didnt see that he has already been shitcanned).

but heres the problem...

his offense is predicated on the qb holding onto the ball and taking a beating.

warner, bulger, kitna, and all the frisco qb's have always been sack dummies. i dont think we need that for ben even if martz were a part of 5 championship teams.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 09:00 PM
Sorry Preaher, I'm hitting the strip club after church tommorow.

And Tony, you're right on with that, some young hot skanks with their G-strings pulled up out of the back of their pants would be nice to look at when posting. :drink:

HometownGal
12-27-2008, 09:00 PM
Heck, HTG still likes Lemieux as a hockey player (now HE was a whiner! Boy I am going to get in trouble for that one!).



:kick::rocket::ak47::m16::wink02:

At least he wasn't a cherry pickin' whiner like Gretzky. :flap:

I actually like you ladies and gentlemen.

:hug::hug:

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 09:02 PM
The Steelers already had the Giants OC once as their OC. Keven Gilbride is the Giants OC.


I know, he sucked a little bit with us but hell, you can't say that he had much of a QB when he was in Pittsburgh.

Steelers & I
12-27-2008, 09:07 PM
:kick::rocket::ak47::m16::wink02:

At least he wasn't a cherry pickin' whiner like Gretzky. :flap:



:hug::hug:

On an old NHL video game that I used to own, Wayne Gretzky was a one punch knockout when he was involved in a fight :toofunny:. Mario Lemeiux could take 2 or 3 punches, depending on the opponent, before he hit the ice. :banging:

ADVANTAGE-SUPER MARIO LEMEIUX :thumbsup:

Preacher
12-27-2008, 09:36 PM
:kick::rocket::ak47::m16::wink02:

At least he wasn't a cherry pickin' whiner like Gretzky. :flap:



:hug::hug:


"A Cherry' Pickin' Whiner"

I Love it!!

I have no love for either player, though I have much respect for both.

Hey, I was a defenseman. My guys were the likes of Tiger Williams, the Sutter brothers, Gordy Howe, Esa Tikkanen, etc etc.
(Yeah, I know, I listed forwards... but you get the point!).

Get some lumber in their teeth... LET EM KNOW YOUR THERE!!

OneForTheToe
12-27-2008, 10:04 PM
The only way Arians would be going, IMO, is if he didn't have such a good relationship Ben. I'm not saying Ben can pick the O'coordinator, but given the FO's general preference for stability, I see Ben's apparent good relationship with Arians being the deciding factor. Does Ben want to risk a new coordinator cutting back on his flexability to call his own plays.

Besides, if any coach is toast it will Zierling.

Preacher
12-27-2008, 10:15 PM
The only way Arians would be going, IMO, is if he didn't have such a good relationship Ben. I'm not saying Ben can pick the O'coordinator, but given the FO's general preference for stability, I see Ben's apparent good relationship with Arians being the deciding factor. Does Ben want to risk a new coordinator cutting back on his flexability to call his own plays.

Besides, if any coach is toast it will Zierling.

Inherent in that post is the deeper question...

What amount of the problems we have seen this year have come from personel, what amount from coaching, and what amount from transition. How long do you give before you pull out the rug and say it isn't working? After last year, I say Arians has bought some time.

After this year, I think he has used some of that time up. If he really thinks the line is ok, and we get killed on the line again next year, then I think he needs to probably go because of the devaluing of the line. However, if he is focusing on one area at a time, and this offseason is about the O line, then I am interested in seeing how true Arians offense will play out.

OneForTheToe
12-27-2008, 10:23 PM
Inherent in that post is the deeper question...

What amount of the problems we have seen this year have come from personel, what amount from coaching, and what amount from transition. How long do you give before you pull out the rug and say it isn't working? After last year, I say Arians has bought some time.

After this year, I think he has used some of that time up. If he really thinks the line is ok, and we get killed on the line again next year, then I think he needs to probably go because of the devaluing of the line. However, if he is focusing on one area at a time, and this offseason is about the O line, then I am interested in seeing how true Arians offense will play out.

I wouldn't have a problem with Zierling getting one more season. I would like to see how the guys who were never in Russ Grimm's system (Tony Hills) respond after a season or two to Zierling. On the other hand, I won't miss him much if he is fired.

BozMan
12-27-2008, 11:50 PM
The only way Arians would be going, IMO, is if he didn't have such a good relationship Ben. I'm not saying Ben can pick the O'coordinator, but given the FO's general preference for stability, I see Ben's apparent good relationship with Arians being the deciding factor. Does Ben want to risk a new coordinator cutting back on his flexability to call his own plays.

Besides, if any coach is toast it will Zierling.

Ben's having a good relationship with Arians is the best argument to keeping him around, IMO. I still think Ben and the entire Steeler organization can do a lot better than Arians, though.

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-28-2008, 12:08 AM
Not saying it will happen, but here are 3 options:

Chan Gailey (KC) - Peterson is out after tomorrow's Chiefs game. Who knows what will happen, but with him out that could be a major shake up in KC's FO and coaching staff. Also, Dan Rooney is real familiar with Gailey and he was even brought in for an interview when they were searching for the next HC after Cowher left.

Darell Bevell (Minnesota) - If the Vikings don't make the playoffs Childress may be out. If anybody knows Vikings it would be Tomlin and this guy has been doing pretty good with Peterson and having QBs like Jackson and Ferrotte.

Dirk Koetter (Jacksonville) - The Jaguars have been awful and most likely Del Rio will probably be fired. Dirk did a great job with Taylor and Jones Drew and has done a pretty good job with an average QB in Garrard.

.
Hey, great options. Actually nice to see somebody suggest an answer rather than just complain about problems.

I honestly dont think its likely that the OC from the AFC #2 seed gets canned, but then again, I never expected the Chargers to run Schottenheimer out the door a couple seasons ago after he went 14-2, but lost in the playoffs.

devilsdancefloor
12-28-2008, 12:32 AM
:couch: what about billick:couch:


:couch: He did well when he was at minnesota.:couch:


But i think BA has to close a relationship with ben to get canned, but who knows it is the NFL after all.

devilsdancefloor
12-28-2008, 12:46 AM
And no offense, but who the hell is devilsdancefloor. Never said my word is the final word. I am not that ridiculous. I have enjoyed this season to the fullest. We could go 0-16 in a year, but I can guarantee you that I will watch every single game and support the Steelers every single day every single year that I am on this earth. I will enjoy the game tomorrow and will definitely enjoy our playoff push to the super bowl this year. No doubt about that. I also will not play dumb to think Arians is not part of our problem though either. I've said it before and will say it again Ben playing great, mistake free football and our defense gives us a great shot at making the super bowl this year. By the way, I am not constantly bashing this team. But I also know the OL and Arians is part of our offensive struggles this year.

I have only been here a few months, but the trend is we lose everyone must be fired threads. we win everyone sucks if they didnt make the FF scores light up. I think everyone here doenst have blinders on. We all see how our offense struggles at times. Honestly it just gets old and it seems as though it is the same people over and over and over fighting over the same ol' shiat. This is the first steelers board where it hasnt been asshat galore or troll infeasted. So instead of calling out the mods maybe we should thank them :noidea:. :drink::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03: GOP STEELERS!!

JackHammer
12-28-2008, 04:28 AM
Fire Arians? I'd like to see his offense with a respectable O-line before I blame him. So no, don't fire Arians. DRAFT ALEX MACK FOR GOD'S SAKE :tt03::tt03::tt03:

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:22 AM
A childish utterance of a response, man that was impressive. :thumbsup:

Like I said, it's six of one and half dozen of another. It just so happens that YOU chose this thread in an attempt to back your belief. Scroll down a thread or two, you'll find another article that is quite contrary to this one.

Well if you consider satire of childish remarks childish, I guess.:noidea:

It's not so much my belief as it is seeking reasoning behind others beliefs who want Arians fired. I am trying to figure it out.

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:23 AM
(1) The Steelers won the AFCN last season with BA as the OC.

(2) The Steelers won the AFCN this season with BA as the OC.

There ya go.

Seconded, and add to that they were Top 10 in Offense last year with a healthy line and Parker. As well as presiding over the best season for a QB in Steeler history.

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:26 AM
So no one is allowed to criticize this guy? I guess this is the OC who shall not be criticized along with the Player who shall never be criticized who btw has input in the offense which is part of the problem. When Whisenhunt was the OC, the Player who shall never be criticized remained the game manager and did what he was told and had NO say in the offense. Whisenhunt ran the show like an OC is supposed to. That is just my opinion.

I don't think Arians is any more or less open to criticism then anyone else. It's just that the stats do not back up the "against" crowd. It's baseless opinion. And, Whisenhunt would have been run out of town if some of his gadget plays failed back in 2005.

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:32 AM
[/b]


I'm curious to know, why is it that some can "say their PIECE" without resorting to belittling other members? But later, if a certain core group of members disagree with the post, they are permitted to back their stance by name calling and such. Why do we see so much of this??? Who's enforcing the rules?

No one belittled anybody from what I saw. Actually, my first foray into the "fire arians" realm resulted in this little retort (http://forums.steelersfever.com/showpost.php?p=507162&postcount=8)

All I did was ask why some people thought Arians should be fired. Simple enough question...:noidea:

It appears the belittling is coming from the other side of the fence, good sir.

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:35 AM
Preacher,

One, I worship Jesus Christ. I do not worship a football team. Do you understand? IMO, it is only a team, and not life and death so I do not see honest constructive criticism as "berating." I enjoy the team(s) on Sundays and then go on with my life. Btw, In my parents' day, no man would talk to a female the way he spoke to me. I didn't appreciate it. I don't think he would have spoken to a male member of the board like that. JMO. Hope we understand each other.

Sorry honey...your in a forum, and if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. We aren't sexist/racist/prejudice (well maybe with Pats fans) here so you get treated like everyone else.

:wink02:

Hammer67
12-28-2008, 07:42 AM
:kick::rocket::ak47::m16::wink02:

At least he wasn't a cherry pickin' whiner like Gretzky. :flap:



:hug::hug:


But he was a cherry picker...and god bless him for it. I miss 66.

Big D
12-28-2008, 08:03 AM
If this team would have finished the season at 8-8 instead of 12-4 or 11-5 half of these posters wouldn't even be in here. Whats funny is the more success this team has the more fans come out of the woodwork

HometownGal
12-28-2008, 08:11 AM
Whats funny is the more success this team has the more fans come out of the woodwork

I don't know if I'd call any of the incessant B & M'ers "fans", D. More like fair weathered nitpickers. Nothing really to B & M about as the team is 11-4 so they throw a load of shit up in the air to see what will stick. Sad.

Hammer - not to hijack this thread, but Lemieux was far from a cherry picker. He would go into the corners to dig out a puck and made some of the most phenomenal passes ever seen in the game. Gretzky, on the other hand, rarely ever went into the corners for fear of being hit. Mario roughed and tumbled with the best of 'em and did whatever he had to do to make a play.

I miss him too, but get to see him sitting in his luxury suite at the Pens games! :thumbsup:

LambertIsGod58
12-28-2008, 09:06 AM
I don't know if I'd call any of the incessant B & M'ers "fans", D. More like fair weathered nitpickers. Nothing really to B & M about as the team is 11-4 so they throw a load of shit up in the air to see what will stick. Sad.

Hammer - not to hijack this thread, but Lemieux was far from a cherry picker. He would go into the corners to dig out a puck and made some of the most phenomenal passes ever seen in the game. Gretzky, on the other hand, rarely ever went into the corners for fear of being hit. Mario roughed and tumbled with the best of 'em and did whatever he had to do to make a play.

I miss him too, but get to see him sitting in his luxury suite at the Pens games! :thumbsup:

Gretzky was a puss.....Does anyone know if the movie "Youngblood" was about him?

stillers4me
12-28-2008, 09:26 AM
Sorry honey...your in a forum, and if you can't stand the heat, get out of the kitchen. We aren't sexist/racist/prejudice (well maybe with Pats fans) here so you get treated like everyone else.

:wink02:

Do the guys get called "honey"?

Didn't think so.

:popcorn:

Michael Keller
12-28-2008, 09:35 AM
MIke Bires is not the final answer and neither is he better informed than some of us on this forum. One thing I resent is when someone says no one complained last year about Arians .

FOR THE FINAL TIME I DID . After about the 4th game on in 2007 I am sure many other fans did also.

My last statments on this subject of Arians are three.

#1-There is a reasonabel probability that Bruce Arian's incompetence is going to break our hearts in the play offs.

#-2-I sincerely hope I am wrong. The potential in the Steeler offense exist such that this team's offense could come alive even with the relatively weak OL and lack of power running backs. Week after week I keep waiting for Arian's apparent thick headiness or stupidity to change or Tomlin to assert himself and it does not happen.

#3 I am done posting my complaints about Arians and I am going to hope for the best .

Finally for those of you that like to respond & communicate in the form of name calling & simplistic labeling of people who disagree with you Give It Up .

You are respectfully entitled to your opinion and I am entitled to mine.

You think Arians is a good offensive coordinator--- I think he is a very bad offensive coordinator.

Lets win the Super Bowl

HometownGal
12-28-2008, 11:10 AM
#1-There is a reasonabel probability that Bruce Arian's incompetence is going to break our hearts in the play offs.

#-2-I sincerely hope I am wrong. The potential in the Steeler offense exist such that this team's offense could come alive even with the relatively weak OL and lack of power running backs. Week after week I keep waiting for Arian's apparent thick headiness or stupidity to change or Tomlin to assert himself and it does not happen.



I'm sorry Michael and God forgive me, but :rofl::laughing::rofl: I suppose our "heartbreak in the playoffs" would have nothing at all to do with players' lack of execution?


Lets win the Super Bowl

Let's win against our playoff opponents first. :tt02:

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-28-2008, 11:19 AM
Hey, I was a defenseman. My guys were the likes of Tiger Williams, the Sutter brothers, Gordy Howe, Esa Tikkanen, etc etc.
(Yeah, I know, I listed forwards... but you get the point!).

Get some lumber in their teeth... LET EM KNOW YOUR THERE!!

OK padre, Larry Robinson, Al McInnis type or Brad Park, Paul Coffey type defenseman?? I saw Tiger Williams a couple years ago in an airport, he was on his way to play a charity game in Northern British Columbia.....that guy was crazy.

"Dave's a killer...........Dave's a mess!"

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-28-2008, 11:22 AM
I suppose our "heartbreak in the playoffs" would have nothing at all to do with players' lack of execution?
:

HTG, the flip side of that is that it is possible that the players are executing........but the plays they are executing are no match for the opposing defensive schemes/players.

No matter how thin you slice it, there are always 2 sides. :smile:

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-28-2008, 11:23 AM
Do the guys get called "honey"?

Didn't think so.

:popcorn:

Old ladies and cougars have called me honey. :noidea:

Preacher
12-28-2008, 11:28 AM
OK padre, Larry Robinson, Al McInnis type or Brad Park, Paul Coffey type defenseman?? I saw Tiger Williams a couple years ago in an airport, he was on his way to play a charity game in Northern British Columbia.....that guy was crazy.

"Dave's a killer...........Dave's a mess!"
Paul Coffee was too offensive minded. Al had a nice shot from the point.

Dave "Killer" Carlson!

Let me just say, my years on the ice when I was younger and my current status in life are far apart.

Yeah, I was quite the dirty hockey player. It is amazing what you can do with a stick.

tony hipchest
12-28-2008, 11:45 AM
:old: Let me just say, my years on the ice when I was younger and my current status in life are far apart. :old:

Yeah, I was quite the dirty hockey player. It is amazing what you can do with a stick.

:poke: youre right! it is amazing what you can do with a stick! :poke:

:chuckle:

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
12-28-2008, 11:51 AM
I suppose our "heartbreak in the playoffs" would have nothing at all to do with players' lack of execution?



Doesn't that fall back on the coaching staff as well? Isn't it up to the coaches to get their team fired up to play?

The Lions definitely are not executing and they are in dire need of new coaching staff to light a fire under their asses.

devilsdancefloor
12-28-2008, 11:53 AM
OK padre, Larry Robinson, Al McInnis type or Brad Park, Paul Coffey type defenseman?? I saw Tiger Williams a couple years ago in an airport, he was on his way to play a charity game in Northern British Columbia.....that guy was crazy.

"Dave's a killer...........Dave's a mess!"

But Dave's out. Who's gonna take his place?
Is the answer Jesus?

that movie rocks!:thumbsup:

markymarc
12-28-2008, 06:12 PM
I think he is a very bad offensive coordinator.

Lets win the Super Bowl

I second that. Hopefully Arians doesn't kill us in the playoffs, but like you said it's time to make our playoff push.

lilyoder6
12-28-2008, 06:15 PM
it was a good game called by arians today... hopefully he gets better thru the playoffs

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-28-2008, 07:54 PM
Paul Coffee was too offensive minded. Al had a nice shot from the point.

Dave "Killer" Carlson!

Let me just say, my years on the ice when I was younger and my current status in life are far apart.

Yeah, I was quite the dirty hockey player. It is amazing what you can do with a stick.

So, what you are telling me is you dont run around any longer telling Hanrahan that his wife is a dyke??

I call my buddy at work all the time and tell his receptionist that its either a Mr. Dunlop, Mr. Oglethorp or Mr. Hanrahan to speak to him. "Who howns de team?" ........and what did he say? ......."Ownes", !!! "Ownes!!!"

Some argue that that was Paul Newman's best character he played. :smile:

HometownGal
12-28-2008, 09:19 PM
Doesn't that fall back on the coaching staff as well? Isn't it up to the coaches to get their team fired up to play?



Maybe to a very small degree. As I always say - you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

Isn't it up to the players who are paid a king's ransom to pay attention in the "classroom" and in practice, learn the plays and execute them on game day?

markymarc
12-29-2008, 06:04 AM
hopefully he gets better thru the playoffs

That is all we can ask for.

revefsreleets
12-29-2008, 10:13 AM
Tomlin didn't justify the question with a response.

I like that. I recuse myself from this thread as well. What's the point? Arians isn't going anywhere, and the fans can bitch and piss and moan about it all they like, because their opinion means NOTHING.

BehindSteelCurtain
12-29-2008, 11:13 AM
I think Arians makes an effort to run the ball but we don't have the RB or O-Line to run effectively.

Hammer67
01-07-2009, 12:13 PM
I don't know if I'd call any of the incessant B & M'ers "fans", D. More like fair weathered nitpickers. Nothing really to B & M about as the team is 11-4 so they throw a load of shit up in the air to see what will stick. Sad.

Hammer - not to hijack this thread, but Lemieux was far from a cherry picker. He would go into the corners to dig out a puck and made some of the most phenomenal passes ever seen in the game. Gretzky, on the other hand, rarely ever went into the corners for fear of being hit. Mario roughed and tumbled with the best of 'em and did whatever he had to do to make a play.

I miss him too, but get to see him sitting in his luxury suite at the Pens games! :thumbsup:

Yes he did, and he is my favorite sports hero of all time in any sport....he was still a cherry picker, and the best one ever, as well. How about the last goal he scored before he retired the first time (at home against flyers in playoffs, 97)??? :thumbsup:

It's not a negative, trust me!

Hammer67
01-07-2009, 12:15 PM
Do the guys get called "honey"?

Didn't think so.

:popcorn:

Feel free to call me honey all you want.