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View Full Version : What Obama’s Proposed Tax Cuts Mean for Small Businesses


tony hipchest
01-06-2009, 04:48 PM
shouldnt obama be more focused on his masterplan to tax these people into oblivion and put them all out of business? :coffee:

http://www.businessweek.com/smallbiz/running_small_business/archives/2009/01/why_obamas_prop.html?campaign_id=rss_smlbz

Here’s a welcome report for entrepreneurs this new year: President-elect Barack Obama’s massive stimulus plan is expected to include three key tax breaks for small-business owners.

Details are still emerging, but the plan could include a longer window for businesses to “carry back” losses; an incentive to invest in machinery, equipment and other capital improvements; and a tax credit for job creation.

How soon can that get money into your hands? Faster than you might imagine. I spoke with Barbara Weltman, a tax attorney in Millwood, N.Y., who says an extension of a carry back period for losses could significantly help businesses that had been profitable in years past, but struggled in 2008.

Here’s how it might work: If you experienced a downtick last year, you can claim a net operating loss or NOL, which is essentially when expenses exceed revenues. Current tax law allows you to use that NOL to offset the past two years’ income, which could win you an immediate cash refund. Under the Obama stimulus plan, that carry back period would be extended, allowing you to use that NOL to reduce the past five years’ tax bills. That’s “a big deal,” she says. “It allows you to get an immediate cash infusion that you can use to help you survive now.”

If you do get a cash refund, another proposed tax break might spur you to plow that money back into your business. The Section 179 (first-year expensing) deduction for purchases of new equipment or machinery is expected to increase to $250,000. Currently, the limit for 2009 is $133,000.

Another piece of the Obama stimulus package could be a one-year tax credit for job creation. The president-elect has pledged to create 3 million new jobs to offset 2008’s steep losses. Republican Congressional leaders have indicated they would support tax relief, although size and scope would need to be worked out. The emergency package could be passed within weeks of Obama’s inauguration.

revefsreleets
01-06-2009, 04:57 PM
That's all fine and good, BUT this is the exact opposite of what his track record would suggest.

Hopefully this is a sign that the guy has solid staff and aides who are steering him down the right path.

tony hipchest
01-06-2009, 05:23 PM
Hopefully this is a sign that the guy has solid staff and aides who are steering him down the right path.doubtful if theyre all liberals left over from the clinton administration (ie same ol, same ol). :rolleyes:

being the smart man that he is, im sure he recognizes the economic situation is far worse now than it was last year or even in the summer. a successful president must be flexible and able to adapt.

revefsreleets
01-06-2009, 07:24 PM
Clinton wasn't THAT bad to small business. But he was also a centrist. So far, that's what Obama is doing best, shifting towards the middle where he needs to govern from. I have very few complaints with anything he has proposed so far post-election.

Preacher
01-06-2009, 07:34 PM
Clinton wasn't THAT bad to small business. But he was also a centrist. So far, that's what Obama is doing best, shifting towards the middle where he needs to govern from. I have very few complaints with anything he has proposed so far post-election.

I gotta disagree... (Or should I say, qualify the statement).

He was quite far left when he came into office. However, he was faced with a reality... be a 1 term president like Carter, or move to the center. He moved to the center declaring the era of "big government" over.

Some of the Clinton aides that have come in probably remember that. Therefore, regardless of where Obama's personal feelings are (the small amount that his record does show), puts him quite far left. However, he seems wise enough to move center-left to govern. Good for him.

If this does go through. I would support it and be happy for my president.


Now the games Pelosi is playing is a whole different story.

revefsreleets
01-06-2009, 07:37 PM
Clinton was a new democrat, from the Democratic Leadership Council school. His own party turned on him at points because they considered DLC "Republican Lite".

But I agree that he was pretty liberal for most of his 12 years as Governor of Arkansas.

revefsreleets
01-06-2009, 07:38 PM
Clinton was a new democrat, from the Democratic Leadership Council school. His own party turned on him at points because they considered DLC "Republican Lite".

But I agree that he was pretty liberal for most of his 12 years as Governor of Arkansas.

Preacher
01-06-2009, 07:59 PM
Clinton was a new democrat, from the Democratic Leadership Council school. His own party turned on him at points because they considered DLC "Republican Lite".

But I agree that he was pretty liberal for most of his 12 years as Governor of Arkansas.

Clinton was a new democrat, from the Democratic Leadership Council school. His own party turned on him at points because they considered DLC "Republican Lite".

But I agree that he was pretty liberal for most of his 12 years as Governor of Arkansas.

:doh:

Looks like we have problems with the board double-posting again.

GBMelBlount
01-06-2009, 09:13 PM
being the smart man that he is, im sure he recognizes the economic situation is far worse now than it was last year or even in the summer. .

Or just a flat out liar....:chuckle:

tony hipchest
01-06-2009, 10:27 PM
We'll see. So far it's just talk and this small business is still struggling..the entire global economy is struggling. cant blame obama for that. the man aint even in office yet and shit was on a downward spiral, long before he was elected. :noidea:

but honestly, the only solution to the problem is to push our ever increasing debt even further into the future (regardless of who is in charge) and hope that a global war wipes us or our future generations out before its time to pay up.

Preacher
01-07-2009, 01:41 AM
the entire global economy is struggling. cant blame obama for that. the man aint even in office yet and shit was on a downward spiral, long before he was elected. :noidea:

but honestly, the only solution to the problem is to push our ever increasing debt even further into the future (regardless of who is in charge) and hope that a global war wipes us or our future generations out before its time to pay up.

Nope. Supposedly, the economy was all Bush's fault. Now, since Obama has been elected, every time he speaks, it seems the Dow goes down further. So it is all his fault if the same logic is applied.

Either the American economy is a result of the global economy, or it is a result of how our president and president elect are leading (and giving indicators of how they will lead in Obama's case).

__________________________________________________ _________

Sadly, to the solution. . . that is how it has been thought of for quite some time. It is quite amazing how they expect companies to balance their checkbooks, but then the govt. won't balance theirs.

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 07:03 AM
Preacher;517388]Nope. Supposedly, the economy was all Bush's fault. Now, since Obama has been elected, every time he speaks, it seems the Dow goes down further. So it is all his fault if the same logic is applied.

Either the American economy is a result of the global economy, or it is a result of how our president and president elect are leading (and giving indicators of how they will lead in Obama's case).

Well said Preach. Now that Obama will be in office, everything will be blamed on everything BUT the president.
__________________________________________________ _________

Sadly, to the solution. . . that is how it has been thought of for quite some time. It is quite amazing how they expect companies to balance their checkbooks, but then the govt. won't balance theirs.

Yep, complete double standard.

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
01-07-2009, 07:56 AM
I like that we are giving him a chance and showing confidence in his staff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (this is the mature thing to do)

He has the opportunity to be a great president because of how bad things are right now and the fact that so much is going on right now in the world.

revefsreleets
01-07-2009, 09:11 AM
Krugman just ran a piece about how the government needs to spend like mad to get us out of this mess.
http://www.ohio.com/editorial/commentary/37131029.html

All the campaign promises and rhetoric are out the window, and would have been regardless of who was elected. The government is going to spend trillions and sock us (anyone under 40) with the bill. We're screwed.

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 12:24 PM
BIGBENFASTWILLIE

I like that we are giving him a chance and showing confidence in his staff!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! (this is the mature thing to do)

Really? You're lecturing us on maturity? LOL! You and a few others irrationally blamed everything on Bush and now that it's your turn to be accountable you want to hold hands and sing Kumbaya? You voted for a liar who successfully peddled his trickle up economic scheme to the 90% of the lemmings on the receiving end and did a complete about face the minute he was elected? And then people like Tony say that's because things were only "really bad" then, and now that they are "really, really bad" it makes sense and he is a smart man. LMAO! :chuckle:

You live by the sword, you die by the sword, my friend.

He has the opportunity to be a great president because of how bad things are right now and the fact that so much is going on right now in the world.

Yes, and the lions had an opportunity to go 16-0 this year......:chuckle:

tony hipchest
01-07-2009, 12:54 PM
Really? You're lecturing us on maturity? LOL! You and a few others irrationally blamed everything on Bush and now that it's your turn to be accountable you want to hold hands and sing Kumbaya? You voted for a liar who successfully peddled his trickle up economic scheme to the 90% of the lemmings on the receiving end and did a complete about face the minute he was elected? And then people like Tony say that's because things were only "really bad" then, and now that they are "really, really bad" it makes sense and he is a smart man. LMAO! :chuckle:

You live by the sword, you die by the sword, my friend.



i see the sky is still falling in your world. has the government sent you your socialism uniform yet?

:toofunny:

talk about irrational. you were "really wrong" then. now looking back on it you are "really, really wrong" :wink02:

but i digress. im sure theres a chargerfan on the board flapping his fish taco somewhere. :wave:

revefsreleets
01-07-2009, 03:46 PM
Actually, Obama has moved far, far to the right. He was extremely liberal as a Senator, but he quickly realized that's not the way to govern. You run from the right or left, and govern from the middle.

The criticism he received from the right on this board was based on his past positions, which is all we had to go on. There was no way to know what he'd actually do once elected. Now we know...

Dino 6 Rings
01-07-2009, 03:59 PM
Offering a 'tax cut' while pushing a new 750 billion dollar spending bill is the biggest shell game I've ever seen.

Do this, and I'll be impressed. Offer a Tax Cut plan, that Cuts the Federal Income Tax for everyone that pays into it by 10 %. On its own, as its own bill. Push that first.

Then let us look at a Federal Spending Bill up near a Trillion Dollars.

Don't mix the two together. Shell Games and Politics as Usual.

I'm saddened.

Tom Coburn is one of the only people in Washington with any sense at all.

http://coburn.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=LatestNews.PressReleases&ContentRecord_id=adcc37f6-802a-23ad-4950-1d97fa30c9fb

Big Spenders in the Federal Government are never a good thing for the American People.

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 04:41 PM
i see the sky is still falling in your world. has the government sent you your socialism uniform yet?

:toofunny:



I'm just saying that you are in such blind lockstep with Obama that you somehow try to justify him as being smart when he immediately flip-flopped from a position you agreed with before? He lied his ass off to get elected and you act like he's a brilliant open minded genius. How funny.

And trying to make it personal with some type of socialism retort, is the best you can come up with? :chuckle:

Sorry if I hit a nerve.....

Dino 6 Rings
01-07-2009, 04:53 PM
I've personally cleared out my closet of all brown tinted, brown, dark brown, light brown, any brown shirts. Just so I can't be mistaken for a Communist Supporter.

Besides, I look so much better in Chinese Red and Italian Green.

tony hipchest
01-07-2009, 04:53 PM
I'm just saying that you are in such blind lockstep with Obama that you somehow try to justify him as being smart when he immediately flip-flopped from a position you agreed with before? He lied his ass off to get elected and you act like he's a brilliant open minded genius. How funny.

And trying to make it personal with some type of socialism retort, is the best you can come up with? :chuckle:

Sorry if I hit a nerve.....he is smart.

and you did try to suggest we would all become a socialist nation. sorry if you take being reminded of that personally. :wave:

so no uniform yet? i hear i'll be getting mine with my tax cut. :sofunny:

Dino 6 Rings
01-07-2009, 05:00 PM
people need to really look at these numbers.

bailouts already passed in 2008:

Bear Sterns, $30 Billion
Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac $200 Billion
AIG $150 Billion
Auto Industry $25 Billion
TARP $700 billion
CitiGroup $247.5 Billion
GM/Chyrsler $17.4 Billion.

These are already on our books. Now we are looking at another $800 Billion up to $1.2 Trillion in New Spending.

It has to stop. We are talking about loans against taxes my unborn GrandChildren will be paying. That's just insane. It isn't about "the children" anymore. Its about the "grand children"

It has to stop.

http://www.propublica.org/special/government-bailouts

Preacher
01-07-2009, 05:44 PM
people need to really look at these numbers.

bailouts already passed in 2008:

Bear Sterns, $30 Billion
Fannie Mae/Freddie Mac $200 Billion
AIG $150 Billion
Auto Industry $25 Billion
TARP $700 billion
CitiGroup $247.5 Billion
GM/Chyrsler $17.4 Billion.

These are already on our books. Now we are looking at another $800 Billion up to $1.2 Trillion in New Spending.

It has to stop. We are talking about loans against taxes my unborn GrandChildren will be paying. That's just insane. It isn't about "the children" anymore. Its about the "grand children"

It has to stop.

http://www.propublica.org/special/government-bailouts

Absolutely.

And in all honesty, it cuts across political lines.

Now, there is an argument to be made that not supporting these companies would push us into a depression. History may look back on the acts of George Bush and Barack Obama and decide that they both saved us from a depression with bailouts.

However, I am SO underjoyed about the entire situation I don't know where to begin. I can guarantee you that fault for where we are at now spreads across all political wings and back over at LEAST 16 years of presidencies. . .

The spending HAS to stop.

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 06:13 PM
he is smart.

and you did try to suggest we would all become a socialist nation. sorry if you take being reminded of that personally. :wave:

so no uniform yet? i hear i'll be getting mine with my tax cut. :sofunny:

Gottya, you were referring to my comments a while back about the fact that Obama referred to things like penalizing oil companies for EXCESS PROFITS when the government STEALS more money per gallon from us than oil companies who actually do something. Yes, you're right, he did run his campaign using alot of the techniques and terms that socialists use to take control which I think I pointed out. It worked. Thank God he was simply being a lying sack of sh it in order to get elected! :thumbsup:

And yes, he is smart, smart enough to know that people like you would blindly support his ridiculous trickle up economic scheme and vote for him regardless of the fact as I've said all along that his scheme made no sense to anyone that understands economics. Yet you tried to justify it and now are trying to justify his immediate reversal of what he ran on. LOL!

SteelCurtain7
01-07-2009, 07:11 PM
I gotta disagree... (Or should I say, qualify the statement).

He was quite far left when he came into office. However, he was faced with a reality... be a 1 term president like Carter, or move to the center. He moved to the center declaring the era of "big government" over.

Some of the Clinton aides that have come in probably remember that. Therefore, regardless of where Obama's personal feelings are (the small amount that his record does show), puts him quite far left. However, he seems wise enough to move center-left to govern. Good for him.

If this does go through. I would support it and be happy for my president.


Now the games Pelosi is playing is a whole different story.

Word. BHO needs to tell her to shut her flaming pie-hole. It's about time somebody did. :rofl:

tony hipchest
01-07-2009, 07:25 PM
Thank God he was simply being a lying sack of sh it in order to get elected! :thumbsup:

!

still hung up on that WMD sham, huh?

no, actually i was just referring to you pretty much calling obama either a socialist or marxist. :hatsoff:

oh, how right you were. :rolleyes:

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 08:01 PM
still hung up on that WMD sham, huh?

no, actually i was just referring to you pretty much calling obama either a socialist or marxist. :hatsoff:

oh, how right you were. :rolleyes:

Yes, he was such a convincing liar with regard to his utopiaspeak it was hard not to believe the lying POS. Hell, if I was a lockstep lemming I might have voted for him too. :chuckle:

tony hipchest
01-07-2009, 08:30 PM
if I was a lockstep lemming...

im gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you voted for sarah palin, right?

rush limbaugh and ann coulter must be so proud! :thumbsup:

anyways, the point is, its nice to have the fear mongering myth that obama has it out for small businesses so quickly squashed.

:drink: heres to the improvement of the fuked up situation this country is in, in 09.

(BTW- politicians dont lie. did you not know this?)

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 09:14 PM
tony hipchest;518299]im gonna go out on a limb here and guess that you voted for sarah palin, right?


Yes. Why would I vote for Obama? I work for a living and don't have a government job and am not in a union and he demonized capitalism as exploiting the middle class.

:drink: heres to the improvement of the fuked up situation this country is in, in 09.

Yes, hopefully the deceitful, lying Obama can turn things around by continuing to do the opposite of what he ran his campaign on! :drink:

tony hipchest
01-07-2009, 10:49 PM
Yes. Why would I vote for Obama? I work for a living and don't have a government job and am not in a union and he demonized capitalism as exploiting the middle class.



Yes, hopefully the deceitful, lying Obama can turn things around by continuing to do the opposite of what he ran his campaign on! :drink:so tell me, do i need to learn the "goose step" now that were gonna be socialists? :noidea:

i wouldnt know. as an american ive never lived with the fear of becoming one so i dont know much of the rituals we will have to go through. is this what they call the "new world order"? :salute:

:chuckle:

GBMelBlount
01-07-2009, 11:16 PM
so tell me, do i need to learn the "goose step" now that were gonna be socialists? :noidea:

i wouldnt know. as an american ive never lived with the fear of becoming one so i dont know much of the rituals we will have to go through. is this what they call the "new world order"? :salute:

:chuckle:

No, you only need to know how to embrace a complete liar and his positions, and then do a complete 180 and support his new view, as you have clearly done. :chuckle:

Hammer Of The GODS
01-08-2009, 12:41 PM
GB........ It is IMPOSSIBLE to have an intelligent conversation with hipchest because he chooses to live in his own world where he doesn't need to back up statements with facts and NEVER answers questions where the answer makes his point of view look like a monkey humping a football.

Hammer67
01-08-2009, 12:49 PM
How can we stop this bailout madness. Frankly, I think we should enter a major recession and allow the system to iron itself out the way it is supposed to. People say "well, that can be disastorous" ....what? Like how my parents can't retire now as their 401k tanked? Like my wife was laid off? What's disastorous then? At this point, I say to hell with it. Time to hit rock bottom and start fresh.

tony hipchest
01-08-2009, 12:57 PM
GB........ It is IMPOSSIBLE to have an intelligent conversation with hipchest because he chooses to live in his own world where he doesn't need to back up statements with facts and NEVER answers questions where the answer makes his point of view look like a monkey humping a football.looks like your spending time in imaginary land with gbmelblount. what statements do i need to back up? what questions were asked of me?

enjoy playing "make believe" with eachother. :drink:

tony hipchest
01-08-2009, 01:02 PM
No, you only need to know how to embrace a complete liar and his positions, and then do a complete 180 and support his new view, as you have clearly done. :chuckle:hey mel, why dont you go find where i did a complete 180. what is this imaginary "new view" that you have pulled out of your ass, that i was so opposed to, but now i fully support. :hunch:

where is this "stance" you speak of. enlighten us all, cause i have no idea what the **** your talking about.

i think youre just a bit disappointed that obama is showing signs of NOT being the socialist/marxist you were so worried about.

fansince'76
01-08-2009, 01:05 PM
Here we go again. :chuckle:

tony hipchest
01-08-2009, 01:16 PM
I agree, we can run up the bill with everyone, then when they want their money back we can be like ''come and get it'' :coffee: :wink02:
yep. thats what it may come down too, especially if we keep raising uneducated idiots who are unable to get competitive jobs in a global market to pay off all the debt.

scary stuff here-

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/08/business/worldbusiness/08yuan.html

China Losing Taste for Debt From U.S.


HONG KONG — China has bought more than $1 trillion of American debt, but as the global downturn has intensified, Beijing is starting to keep more of its money at home, a move that could have painful effects for American borrowers.


The declining Chinese appetite for United States debt, apparent in a series of hints from Chinese policy makers over the last two weeks, with official statistics due for release in the next few days, comes at an inconvenient time.

On Tuesday, President-elect Barack Obama predicted the possibility of trillion-dollar deficits “for years to come,” even after an $800 billion stimulus package. Normally, China would be the most avid taker of the debt required to pay for those deficits, mainly short-term Treasuries, which are government i.o.u.’s.

In the last five years, China has spent as much as one-seventh of its entire economic output buying foreign debt, mostly American. In September, it surpassed Japan as the largest overseas holder of Treasuries.

Polamalu Princess
01-08-2009, 09:21 PM
:popcorn:

revefsreleets
01-09-2009, 09:51 AM
I don' think Obama lied. I think he lived in a fairy tale land where we all get along in a politically correct wonderland.

But now he's the President, and reality is a bitch. He has to grow up and actually govern from a position of prgmatic reality, and not childish liberal fantasies. So it's not as much of a flip-flop as it is maturing and learning how the real world works.

GBMelBlount
01-10-2009, 07:57 AM
hey mel, why dont you go find where i did a complete 180. what is this imaginary "new view" that you have pulled out of your ass, that i was so opposed to, but now i fully support. :hunch:

where is this "stance" you speak of. enlighten us all, cause i have no idea what the **** your talking about.

i think youre just a bit disappointed that obama is showing signs of NOT being the socialist/marxist you were so worried about.


Well Tony, here is an example of an exchange BEFORE THE ELECTION where I clearly pointed out that Obama was smart enough to know that there were enough lockstep lefties who would be on the receiving end of his PROPOSED class envy trickle-up tax scheme and wouldn’t question how ridiculous it was based on our economic situation at that time, or ANY time for that matter.

xbroughneck
At least she and her husband (Barak & Michelle Obama) are intelligent enough to write a senior thesis. Can't say that about every political candidate in this years election.
Huh?

GBMelBlount
You see xbrough, this is what puzzles me. You seem to think Obama is so smart but he apparently does not even understand introductory Economics. He has stated that the way to get the economy and jobs back on track is to take a trillion dollars from those that would invest it in more business and jobs and give it to the lower and middle income. That goes against basic economics.

So why do I not say Obama is stupid? Simple, because he is smart enough to know, as any good salesman, that if he promises the average Joe that by taking the $500 or $1,000 they deserve they will help raise the middle class and the economy, they will vote for him! Wow!

So do you see why I questioned you when you said that his massive income redistribution plan works and it can't be proven otherwise?

Now, Instead of weighing in on an important issue like this, A person who has 20,000 posts remains largely silent on this EXTREMELY important issue and yet weighs in politically by calling Palin a MILF and several other sleazy posts about her that was meaningless drivel.

Then, when the Harvard Educated asshat who apparently just finished reading his first book on economics (for dummies), does a complete 180 before he is even in office you have the balls to start a thread with this inflammatory and pathetic remark?

Hipchest
shouldnt obama be more focused on his masterplan to tax these people into oblivion and put them all out of business?”

Are you serious? I have a family to provide for and yet I work almost the entire first half of the year for the government? And you wonder why it concerns me when an asshat says he’s going to tax the hell out of our country to the tune of an ADDITIONAL trillion dollars?

Why were we wrong to be concerned about this liar who purposely deceived the ignorant masses into voting for him by saying he would go Robin Hood on steroids, steal from the job creators and give them the money that they rightly deserved and at the same time magically propel us into some utopian society. Complete stupidity that you apparently embraced.

So you’re making fun of us for not knowing he was a lying sack of sh*t. LOL!

And then the real kicker is you’re defending this asshat (who I said back in October was a lying sack of shit) by saying that it made sense back then because the economy was just really, really bad, but now that it is reallly, really, really bad, Obama completely changing his position on taxes shows that he is a smart and open minded man.

Again, LMAO!

tony hipchest
01-10-2009, 02:41 PM
wow gb, this post is so full of fallacies and twist and turns i dont even know where to begin, but as suspected you were unable to show where i did a 180. that was just a figment of your imagination (much like the rest of your post) and a bunch of hot air.

for a person who has 2700 posts how many of those were spent trying to convince people obama was a socialist and gonna "tax people into oblivion and put them out of business"?

i wont count, but i will say quite a few. so the remark you call inflamatory and pathetic was really just sarcasm and satire meant to show how melodramatic people like you were being several months ago.

how can i make this claim? read the article...

i was smart enough to realize obama has the capabilities to surround himself with good people and steer this ship in the right direction, as opposed to buying into all the doom and gloom you were spewing.

i like your example of an exchange before the election where you admit obama is smart, yet claim the exact opposite in this thread. speaking of 180 degrees....contradict much?

you have alot of gall to trash obama for finishing his first book on economics when you voted for mccain (who admitedly still hasnt gotten through a book on the subject himself.)

as for the "important issue" you say i didnt address with 1 of my 20K posts, why would i? it was complete make believe rubbish. obama taking $500-$1000 from the average joe? (:laughing- he offered them tax CUTS) i simply laugh at that and give it no merit whatsoever because it is completely false. i feel a little dirty even dignifying it with a response, now.

as for the MILF comment dont go pointing fingers at me (while i agree). i wasnt the 1st one to bring it up. it was in a thread you started so you should remember as opposed to trying to deflect you being wrong by painting me as such a bad, horrible guy.

http://forums.steelersfever.com/showthread.php?t=26812&highlight=milf&page=4

I have only one thing to say, and be prepared, because it's quite profound:


MILF!