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LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:15 AM
then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head......I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
01-13-2009, 02:17 AM
Was too young to have heard about that, do you have a link to an article or anything?

Also, that doesn't make it O.K. for Lewis. Kind of like Pats fan's argument that they didn't cheat because "everybody does it".

Preacher
01-13-2009, 02:18 AM
ON second thought. . .

My only question is... couldn't this have been done in the other Stabbit Ray thread?

We only really need one on the forum don't you think?

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:28 AM
ON second thought. . .

My only question is... couldn't this have been done in the other Stabbit Ray thread?

We only really need one on the forum don't you think?

Yeah, but with the sanctimonious threads I've been reading I wanted to ensure people had the opportunity to read it.





WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO ... GREG LLOYD

Ex-NFL player fights to restore ties with his kids


By JOHN HOLLIS
The Atlanta Journal-Constitution

Published on: 03/31/08

You don't just waltz right into the Oh Do Kwan Martial Arts Center.

Not unless you want to meet intimidating former NFL linebacker Greg Lloyd up close and personal.


Mikki K. Harris/AJC
(ENLARGE)
Greg Lloyd, former linebacker for the Pittsburgh Steelers, works with kids in his tae kwon do class in Fayetteville.

RELATED LINKS:
• Lloyd photos

Previous stories
in this series:

Somewhat mellowed strategist keeps eye on 2010
First 'altruistic' liver donor lives without regrets
After big debate, few Georgia high schools offer Bible classes
Man serving life needed bone marrow transplant
More metro stories



Students are required to bow as a gesture of respect when first entering the building and then again to the American flag before taking to the floor.

"It's a requirement, but it's about respect," said Lloyd, a fourth-degree black belt in tae kwon do who has been teaching at the Fayetteville school since 1998.

"Respect for others and respect for themselves."

That intensity and rigid adherence to the minutest detail is what helped make Lloyd a five-time Pro Bowler during a standout 12-year NFL career spent mostly with the Pittsburgh Steelers.

They're also among the personal characteristics that his ex-wife Rhonda cited when she had Lloyd arrested after accusing him of shoving a gun into his son's mouth in 2001 and of pointing a gun at her head a year later.

Lloyd, a Fort Valley native who first took up tae kwon do in the late 1980s, has insisted the charges were trumped up because of the acrimonious divorce the couple was going through at the time.

He maintains his innocence of all charges.

"I can't stop one woman from being bitter and trying to ruin my life," he said during a recent interview.

Greg Lloyd Jr. was 15 at the time authorities alleged that his father shoved the gun in his mouth as punishment for his poor grades.

His father was tried twice on a charge of aggravated assault, but never convicted.

The elder Lloyd did plead no contest in 2004 to a simple battery charge resulting from the alleged December 2002 incident involving his ex-wife, however. He says he regrets that decision, which he now attributes to poor advice from his attorney at the time.

By then, Rhonda Lloyd already had taken out a restraining order against her ex-husband, so he hasn't seen any of the couple's three children — James, Tiana or Greg Jr. — since 2003.

A ferocious defensive playmaker who helped carry the Steelers to Super Bowl XXX in 1996, Greg Lloyd objects to the assumption by some that he and the person they saw play on the field every Sunday were one and the same.

Football "is a violent game," he said. "It still is a violent game. I made a living from playing football, but that's not who I really am."

Joaquin Bonilla, a fifth-degree black belt who runs the Oh Do Kwan school, knew the entire Lloyd family.

He stuck by the former football player when his legal troubles began.

"It wasn't fair," Bonilla said. "What happened to him was not right, but I was never going to give up on him. I was looking at a guy I knew was innocent."

Even years later, Lloyd, 42, now remarried with two stepchildren, is still going rounds with his ex-wife.

He's still trying to retrieve some of the $80,000 he accuses her of taking from their joint account, not to mention the $12,000 Rolex watch and wedding ring he alleges she also possesses.

Efforts to reach Rhonda Lloyd for this story were unsuccessful.

Steve Harris, her Fayetteville-based attorney, did not return two phone calls seeking comment.

Greg Lloyd hopes to someday cement the fragmented pieces of his own family by first resuming a relationship with his oldest son, who will be a sophomore weakside linebacker this fall at the University of Connecticut.

In the meantime, the once-feared linebacker who was named to the Pittsburgh Steelers' 75th anniversary team last fall continues to make a name for himself.

Only now as "Master Lloyd."

Still physically fit at a sculpted 6 feet 2 inches tall and weighing 242 pounds, Lloyd teaches two classes per week to youngsters who weren't even alive when he first began terrorizing NFL quarterbacks and ball carriers.

He is more father figure than coach, often dispensing life lessons he hopes they will take with them.

Several of his charges were among the school's 18 students who competed at the recent regional tae kwon do championships in Atlanta, winning 12 gold medals while qualifying 17 for this summer's national championships in Madison, Wis.

Lloyd, however, said he wants nothing more than just to eventually put things right with his own family.

"All I want is what's mine," he said. "I want to be left alone, and I want my relationship with my kids."

Preacher
01-13-2009, 02:34 AM
Well,

this is old news... it has even been brought back up and debated here after the Harrison incident.

The problem here, is that he wasn't convicted, nor did he plea out. SO it is very hard to make any determination.

You are better off asking about Harrison, who returned to the scene and admitted his actions.

Personally, only his actions of returning and accepting full responsibility tilted the scales to even wanting him on the team this year.

If he does it again, with ANYONE. I want him gone. Period.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:42 AM
Well,

this is old news... it has even been brought back up and debated here after the Harrison incident.

The problem here, is that he wasn't convicted, nor did he plea out. SO it is very hard to make any determination.

You are better off asking about Harrison, who returned to the scene and admitted his actions.

Personally, only his actions of returning and accepting full responsibility tilted the scales to even wanting him on the team this year.

If he does it again, with ANYONE. I want him gone. Period.


Lloyd pled no contest to simple battery, which stemmed from the incident with his wife.

Preacher
01-13-2009, 02:46 AM
Lloyd pled no contest to simple battery, which stemmed from the incident with his wife.

Didn't see that, I was thinking about the incident with the kid.

Then I say the same about him if he was playing today. Just because someone plays a sport doesn't mean they are above the law or the common sense of the average person.

The things athletes get away with nowadays is sick. They should be held to the exact same standards every other human is held to.

And I can guarentee you, there are a number of jobs were if you abuse your wife or are involved in a felony, you are fired.

Mine is definitely one of them!

lambertlunaticfan
01-13-2009, 03:11 AM
i had no idea about this.wow....not being in pittsburgh i dont hear alot of steeler news and never heard this........and as far as lewis goes,wasnt convicted,isnt a murderer then....i still believe in innocent until proven gulty as its the american way........and i cant believe the nastiness on that other post about him,but its a steelers board so what do i expect.....but it made me afraid to even post on thier in fear that the steelers lifers on here would rip on me......i think ray is a great player,and if he was a steeler,he would be one the favorites to most of the people that are posting hate on here about him.....its funny,how people doing stubid dances are always on other teams,but when they are on your team you love the dances he does.......like ward,they hate him for smiling,but if he played for thier team they would love him smiling all the time then......anyway lambert god thanks for the thread here,good for you:tt:then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head......I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

steelreserve
01-13-2009, 03:24 AM
then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head....

Well, I think the guy likes guns, duh. Any other questions, rocket scientist?

redst3
01-13-2009, 03:51 AM
LLyod was off the team when it happened though, right? Lewis was kept on.

Still, your point is well taken. I've seen people defend the Steelers players for things they shouldnt have done in the past. Its disturbing.

Having said all that, for the most part, the Rooneys have had very little tolerance for that over the years.

KeiselPower99
01-13-2009, 10:45 AM
Pointing a gun is not as bad as shooting someone. I dont condone it but it is 2 differant situations.

DWC52
01-13-2009, 10:50 AM
Pointing a gun is not as bad as shooting someone. I dont condone it but it is 2 differant situations.

WHEN DID RAY EVER SHOOT ANYONE? LOL

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 10:51 AM
Said it before. Lloyd was one of the toughest players ever to wear B&G and I was a huge fan.

Pointing a loaded gun at anybody, especially your own children is just disturbing and wrong!!

tony hipchest
01-13-2009, 10:53 AM
OJ is guilty and this thread belongs in the NFL forum.

greg lloyd didnt flee the scene with 2 people bleeding out in the street. :coffee:

oh, and greg lloyd was a great steeler and a true professional while he was here.

T&B fan
01-13-2009, 11:03 AM
Said it before. Lloyd was one of the toughest players ever to wear B&G and I was a huge fan.

Pointing a loaded gun at anybody, especially your own children is just disturbing and wrong!!

did I read that story wronge ...he NEVER WAS CONVICTED of the gun and kid ....

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 11:03 AM
OJ is guilty and this thread belongs in the NFL forum.

greg lloyd didnt flee the scene with 2 people bleeding out in the street. :coffee:

oh, and greg lloyd was a great steeler and a true professional while he was here.

You forgot that he didnt jump on the pile after Kirkland and Brown had already made the tackle, but get credited for 2 tackles by stats inc.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 11:07 AM
Said it before. Lloyd was one of the toughest players ever to wear B&G and I was a huge fan.

Pointing a loaded gun at anybody, especially your own children is just disturbing and wrong!!

did I read that story wronge ...he NEVER WAS CONVICTED of the gun and kid ....

And Ray Lewis was never convicted of murder. We have to take the B&G colored glasses off and compare apples to apples. Lloyd was reported to have done that and Lewis was reported to have been involved in a fight that left 2 men dead.

Plus if you read about how Lloyd's own son doesn't want anything to do with his own father, you can make a reasonable assumption that physical or mental abuse occured. I believe it happened.

Give It To Abercrombie
01-13-2009, 11:10 AM
i think ray is a great player,and if he was a steeler,he would be one the favorites to most of the people that are posting hate on here about him.....its funny,how people doing stubid dances are always on other teams,but when they are on your team you love the dances he does.......like ward,they hate him for smiling,but if he played for thier team they would love him smiling all the time then......

Crap. I hate the 'look at me' crap that any player does. I irritates the shit out of me when Ike Taylor waves his open hand in front of his face after breaking up a pass. WTF does that MEAN?! I didn't like Joey Porter's little kick and I don't like Foote's stomp. Just smash the asshole with the ball, get up, turn around like you can do it anytime you want. And I assure you that if any player on the Steelers were to be such a complete self-centered ass as Ray Lewis with his "I am bigger than my team" dance or Donovan McNabb costing his team a potential game ending first down in a PLAYOFF GAME by picking up the phone on the Giants sideline to taunt them after a scramble sent him out of bounds, I would FOREVER have that player on my shit-list. My memory is very long, to the point where my wife makes fun of me for it when we watch games. My loyalty lies with the team, not any player. If any player thinks he is bigger than the team or even portrays himself as being bigger than the team, then he can kiss my ass. That stupid dance Ray Lewis does is no different than if he just stood there and put both hands over his head and pointed at his name on the back of his jersey. Don't tell me it's to get his team psyched up either, because that's crap too.

WindyCitySteelerFan
01-13-2009, 11:10 AM
You know... Laura Bush also killed a guy, and got away with it.....


That;s right.. Laura Bush killed a guy.

LOL.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 11:13 AM
You know... Laura Bush also killed a guy, and got away with it.....


That;s right.. Laura Bush killed a guy.

LOL.

Don King too.

Give It To Abercrombie
01-13-2009, 11:15 AM
....its funny,how people doing stubid dances are always on other teams,but when they are on your team you love the dances he does.......like ward,they hate him for smiling,but if he played for thier team they would love him smiling all the time then....

And you are seriously going to compare Ray's "look at me" dance to Hines Ward smiling after a play is over?

Wow.

Hopefully you are just trying to illustrate a point, but that's a bad comparison.

Ravengirl
01-13-2009, 11:19 AM
For those of you who call Ray a murderer simply is ignorant and doesn't know the facts. Ray's DNA was no where to be found on the weapon used against the thugs who attacked them. They were thugs originally from Cleveland, OH. (Ironic). The State of GA gave Ray Lewis the deal because even the prosecutor is also noted as saying that Ray Lewis is innocent. If Ray became a Steeler next season, then all of you guys would be screaming how great of a player Ray Lewis is.

Ray Lewis is one of the best linebackers of our time so deal with it.

T&B fan
01-13-2009, 11:23 AM
[QUOTE=T&B fan;526858]

And Ray Lewis was never convicted of murder. We have to take the B&G colored glasses off and compare apples to apples. Lloyd was reported to have done that and Lewis was reported to have been involved in a fight that left 2 men dead.

Plus if you read about how Lloyd's own son doesn't want anything to do with his own father, you can make a reasonable assumption that physical or mental abuse occured. I believe it happened.

I don't give a crap about what Lewis did or did not do . and I have said nothing about him ... but to keep saying that Lloyd did do it is just stupid .. and you must never have had a X wife make up storys .in order to get the kids and the $$$ that Lloyd would have to pay for suport.. ( as any one should you makem you pay forem ). and as for the kid .you tell him the sky is brown enof and he will tell you it is too . how old was the kid when this was to have happened ? maybe dad is the law in the house and mom lets me get a way with anything so there for mom must know what is best ...

The_WARDen
01-13-2009, 11:27 AM
For those of you who call Ray a murderer simply is ignorant and doesn't know the facts. Ray's DNA was no where to be found on the weapon used against the thugs who attacked them. They were thugs originally from Cleveland, OH. (Ironic). The State of GA gave Ray Lewis the deal because even the prosecutor is also noted as saying that Ray Lewis is innocent. If Ray became a Steeler next season, then all of you guys would be screaming how great of a player Ray Lewis is.

Ray Lewis is one of the best linebackers of our time so deal with it.

How bout you just stop talking and keep posting pics of yourself?!

:drink:

tony hipchest
01-13-2009, 11:29 AM
If Ray became a Steeler next season, then all of you guys would be screaming how great of a player Ray Lewis is.

.nope. we dont want ray, or houshmandzadeh, or pac-man, or TO.

iff hell froze over and they wound up on our team, we'd still look at them as pieces of crap. plus, porter, harrison, woodley are all better than ray. lloyd and green were better along with andy lb on the 70's team.

plus guys like urlacher, sam mills, london fltecher, cornelius bennett were just as good.

ray is just a loudmouth and a headhunter which gets him lots of exposure.

memphissteelergirl
01-13-2009, 11:37 AM
All right, fine...if you wanna go there

Here is my problem with Ray Lewis:

Just like with OJ Simpson back in the day, I wasn't there, so I don't know if he "did the deed" or not, but I'm 99% percent sure he had a hand in it. And IMHO he should have paid for it, but he plead out. OJ's deeds finally caught up to him; will they catch up to Ray? Who knows?

Now Ray as a football player: In his prime, I'll give you that he was among the best defensive players in the league, but now he's more sizzle than steak. While he gets his share of tackles, he seems to jump onto a pile more to pad his stats. And don't get me started on that ridiculous dance of his. Not only is it just dumb-looking, he is just too old for that mess.

And being "God's linebacker?" Well, let me tread lightly here, because I'm not going to get into his questioning his salvation, but here again (and this is JMO mind you) there is more "talk" than "walk." As Christians we are all "works in progress," but his behavior on the field and some of his comments in pressers...well, just makes me wonder. It seems to me athletes and entertainers are quick to put God in everything they say. Again, JMHO.

Bottom line: Good player....questionable person.

Hey, LambertIsGod...you asked. :noidea:

Rick5895
01-13-2009, 11:57 AM
then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head......I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

Lloyd was not convicted and having read an interview with him I tend to beleive what he says, that he didn't put the gun in his kids mouth. Women make all kinds of outlandish accusations and will also have kids say anything to prove love to the mother.
As a man with custody of his 15 year old son (since my son was 11 months) I have had to deal with a few false accusations against me, all of which are unfounded.
As a person who works in Law Enforcement I have also seen where charges are layed just on the womens accusation with absolutely no evidence or proof.

I have read a number of your posts, you say you rather have a different QB and now you call into question one of our greater LB's. WHY?

Dino 6 Rings
01-13-2009, 12:03 PM
then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head......I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

I think the kid should do better in school now.

Fire Haley
01-13-2009, 12:07 PM
I notice a resemblance...

http://deadspin.com/assets/resources/2007/09/RayLewisorangejumpsuit.jpghttp://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2007/09/20/amd_simpson_courtroom3.jpg

DACEB
01-13-2009, 12:14 PM
I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

Gotta say that this shows incredibly poor taste by you, LIG58.

Does your man crush on Ray overshadow your love for the Steelers?

It's no secret what took place with Lloyd, and he's not the only Steeler to have a brush with the law. Does any of that change the FACT that this is and will remain, under the control of the Rooney's, one of the most classy and tradition rich organizations in all sports.

Again, extremely poor taste.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 12:16 PM
For those of you who call Ray a murderer simply is ignorant and doesn't know the facts. .

And if you think Ray Lewis doesnt know what happened that night and didn't protect the murderers of 2 men.....then you are an idiot who thinks football is more important than a man's life.

Ray Lewis is one of the best LB's of the past decade, but if he was to become a Steeler, I would probably stop watching the Steelers for the first time in 30 years until Lewis was gone.

OX1947
01-13-2009, 12:21 PM
Those who call Ray Lewis a murder are not calling him a murderer because he murdered someone, its just to throw a dig to him. I think any intelligent person who knows about the incident knows that Ray Lewis was with a crew where one of them killed someone. If Ray Lewis is guilty of anything, he is guilty of not ratting on his friends. I have no doubt he saw everything as he was there when it happened.

The reason why no one got in trouble for it at the end of the day, Im assuming, is because I believe the crew that started stuff with Lewis's crew may not have been the best of citizens. If that is the case, and there was indication that they were the instigators, well, then what are you suppose to do. You don't know what kind of people these are. look at Darrett Williams and Collier and Joey Porter. Only difference in this case is Ray Lewis boy killed this guy before maybe they tried to kill them.

Hammer67
01-13-2009, 12:23 PM
For those of you who call Ray a murderer simply is ignorant and doesn't know the facts. Ray's DNA was no where to be found on the weapon used against the thugs who attacked them. They were thugs originally from Cleveland, OH. (Ironic). The State of GA gave Ray Lewis the deal because even the prosecutor is also noted as saying that Ray Lewis is innocent. If Ray became a Steeler next season, then all of you guys would be screaming how great of a player Ray Lewis is.

Ray Lewis is one of the best linebackers of our time so deal with it.

He may be one of the best, but I wouldn't want him on my team. No offense...we have had plenty of decent and moral LB's to cheer for. Don't need to throw a thug into the bunch.

PalmerSteel
01-13-2009, 12:24 PM
gettin a kick out of some of the responses. do you all really think he pulled the trigger, aka the murderer? i mean come on, if so do you really thinkthe prosecutor would have accepted such a minor plea agreement? no way do i think so. was he a piece of trash for hanging with who he was with and garbage for trying to cover up the actual murderes? of course. i in no way respect ray but do respect his football play but to compare him to oj and say they did the same thing? thats a little out of wack.

OX1947
01-13-2009, 12:26 PM
And if you think Ray Lewis doesnt know what happened that night and didn't protect the murderers of 2 men.....then you are an idiot who thinks football is more important than a man's life.

Ray Lewis is one of the best LB's of the past decade, but if he was to become a Steeler, I would probably stop watching the Steelers for the first time in 30 years until Lewis was gone.

Lets wake up to a little common sense here. You are telling me you wouldn't protect a childhood friend who may have been attacked by 2 guys who he happen to kill in self defense? With the little facts we knew about the case, police didn't seem to care that 2 guys died because word was they were the ones who tried to start crap. If that is the case, then too bad. If someone is trying to hurt me, I make sure they dont. Better safe then sorry. Just look at all these guys who are getting shot.....

tyler289
01-13-2009, 12:26 PM
Ray Lewis didn't kill anyone. He just didn't tell the police who did it.

Hammer67
01-13-2009, 12:26 PM
Those who call Ray Lewis a murder are not calling him a murderer because he murdered someone, its just to throw a dig to him. I think any intelligent person who knows about the incident knows that Ray Lewis was with a crew where one of them killed someone. If Ray Lewis is guilty of anything, he is guilty of not ratting on his friends. I have no doubt he saw everything as he was there when it happened.

The reason why no one got in trouble for it at the end of the day, Im assuming, is because I believe the crew that started stuff with Lewis's crew may not have been the best of citizens. If that is the case, and there was indication that they were the instigators, well, then what are you suppose to do. You don't know what kind of people these are. look at Darrett Williams and Collier and Joey Porter. Only difference in this case is Ray Lewis boy killed this guy before maybe they tried to kill them.

If you associate with thugs, then you are a thug. Look at Pacman Jones.

In Porter's case, he was, by all accounts, leaving a club in a crowd when a stray bullet from a drive by hit him. And, he said he will never put himself in that environment again. Some of these athletes need to re-evaluate their choice of "friends"

OX1947
01-13-2009, 12:27 PM
I notice a resemblance...

http://deadspin.com/assets/resources/2007/09/RayLewisorangejumpsuit.jpghttp://assets.nydailynews.com/img/2007/09/20/amd_simpson_courtroom3.jpg

Ones a piece of crap who ruined 3 families and ended two lives. The other is a guy who just happened to be caught up in a bad situation. Big difference.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 12:45 PM
Lets wake up to a little common sense here. You are telling me you wouldn't protect a childhood friend who may have been attacked by 2 guys who he happen to kill in self defense? .....

Sorry my blind Raven home friend....I am using common sense.

The men killed were a 5'2", 135 lb aspiring rapper that called himself "Shorty P" and a 6',170 lb Barber named Richard Lollar.

Common sense dictates that they would not attack Lewis and his posse of 12. In fact, Lewis blamed his co-defendant Reginald Oakley for starting the fight. Here is the fact, you should read some yourself before you claim self defense.

Baltimore Ravens linebacker Ray Lewis took the witness stand today against his former co-defendants, Joseph Sweeting and Reginald Oakley. Lewis blamed Oakley for starting the fight that ended with two men stabbed to death outside an Atlanta nightclub back in January, but he said even Oakley was provoked into violencehttp://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0006/06/se.03.html

Common sense dicates that if you walk up to a guy to start a fight and he hits you with a champagne bottle, the appropriate response is that 6 men don't attack them with knives and brutally stab him and his friend. Common sense to me would dictate that you should do the right thing and cooperate with police in a murder investigation.

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 12:56 PM
'There is no justice'
Outraged and in searing pain, relatives of Jacinth Baker and Richard Lollar say Lewis got away with murder. And no one cares.
By MARC TOPKIN

St. Petersburg Times, published January 23, 2001

TAMPA -- There is a baby girl in Georgia without a father. There are families with still-raw wounds a year later. And there are two bodies buried in the cold Ohio ground.

What is known is this: A brutal fight occurred outside an Atlanta nightclub. Ray Lewis was there. And Richard Lollar and Jacinth Baker are dead.

Lollar, 24, and Baker, 21, were childhood friends from Akron, Ohio, who had been in some legal trouble of their own and had moved to the Atlanta area seeking a better life. Lollar was a talented barber with three arrests, Baker an aspiring artist who was wanted by police for violating probation on gun and drug charges. Like thousands of others -- like Lewis and his friends -- they were out celebrating on Super Bowl Sunday.

Details are fuzzy, facts scarce. For whatever reason, their group and Lewis' clashed outside the Cobalt Lounge sometime after the 3:30 a.m. Monday closing. The violence escalated quickly. Baker -- a 5-foot-2, 135-pounder known as Shorty P -- and Lollar (6-0, 170) were brutally beaten by a half-dozen men and savagely stabbed, the knives twisted into their organs. "A thrill kill," Lollar-Owens said. Lewis and friends piled into his 40-foot chauffeured Lincoln Navigator limousine and sped off, one of the victim's friends shooting at their tires.

The 24-year-old Lewis, uncooperative in his initial interview with police, was charged with two counts of murder later Monday and arrested. After a three-state manhunt, so were two of his acquaintances, Reginald Oakley and Joseph Sweeting.

"He ain't nothing but a liar," said Gladys Robinson, Baker's grandmother. "I wonder how he would feel if someone killed his brother or killed his son. Then he wouldn't have so much to say. But you know, one day he is going to get his, too. Because Ray Lewis was right there, and he knows what exactly went down.

"It's sad, but you try not to worry about it. God says he is the one who will bring justice to it, and I'm leaving it to God's hands. (Lewis) can say he didn't do it, that he's innocent, all he wants. As long as you know who did it, you're as guilty as they are if you don't say. He had something to do with it. I believe that in my heart."

"Ray Lewis can look forward to raising his child," Threatt said. "Can Richard look forward to rearing his first child? No. Can he ever see what she accomplishes in her life? No. And the only thing she can look forward to are words and pictures. She will not be able to receive the love he was waiting to give her.

"The fans want to forget about it," Lollar-Owens said. "They don't care about Richard and Jacinth. They don't know these people. The only thing they care about is they want to see these guys play. Tagliabue and them people, they don't care. As long as it's not their sons or daughters, they don't care. The NFL mothers association -- the NFL mothers! -- they don't even care."

But more than anything, Lollar-Owens would like to talk to Ray Lewis.

"I want to show him the tree," she said. "I have a picture of the tree where they pinned my nephew up. I'd want to ask him if he remembered it. That would be the main thing."

Lewis wrote that he pours his heart out to the families, but they're still waiting to see it. They say they have never heard from Lewis, never gotten an apology or condolences. Baker's grandmother suggested Lewis make an anonymous donation to provide a proper memorial for the slain men, but with the possibility of pending legal action, that seems unlikely.

"I think it's a shame that (Ravens owner) Art Modell and the NFL stand behind this man," Threatt said. "It's a disgrace, not only to us, but to anybody who has to sit and watch him play.

http://www.sptimes.com/News/012301/SuperBowl2001/_There_is_no_justice_.shtml

atlsteelers
01-13-2009, 12:57 PM
my buddy was involved in the case and he believes that ray killed those guys. infact at a preseason game at the dome my buddy said a few things (from the trial) to ray that had him ready to jump into stands after him. if the city of atlanta did not have such as lousy DA work the case and if the limo driver did not change his story on the stand ray would be in jail.

revefsreleets
01-13-2009, 01:29 PM
Comparing Lloyd and Lewis is like comparing Jack Ruby with Jeffrey Dahmer.

Dino 6 Rings
01-13-2009, 01:33 PM
It makes Ray Lewis just another guy standing between the Steelers and the ultimate goal of winning another Super Bowl. Nothing more, nothing less. He's one guy, on the other team, that we must defeat and crush on our way to the Super Bowl.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 01:47 PM
[QUOTE=El-Gonzo Jackson;526863]

I don't give a crap about what Lewis did or did not do . and I have said nothing about him ... but to keep saying that Lloyd did do it is just stupid .. and you must never have had a X wife make up storys .in order to get the kids and the $$$ that Lloyd would have to pay for suport.. ( as any one should you makem you pay forem ). and as for the kid .you tell him the sky is brown enof and he will tell you it is too . how old was the kid when this was to have happened ? maybe dad is the law in the house and mom lets me get a way with anything so there for mom must know what is best ...

The whole point of this thread was just to point out to some Steeler fans that we've had some of our own issues. But for some unknown reason, it's easy to point fingers and talk shit about a player from another team. Especially when they are from a rival team and considered one of the best to ever play their respective position.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 01:49 PM
nope. we dont want ray, or houshmandzadeh, or pac-man, or TO.

iff hell froze over and they wound up on our team, we'd still look at them as pieces of crap. plus, porter, harrison, woodley are all better than ray. lloyd and green were better along with andy lb on the 70's team.

plus guys like urlacher, sam mills, london fltecher, cornelius bennett were just as good.

ray is just a loudmouth and a headhunter which gets him lots of exposure.


Ray Lewis WILL be a first ballot Hall of Famer. With the non-Steeler players you mentioned, I'd stake my life that none of them make it into the hall. Take a break from the Kool Aid once in a while.......

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 01:53 PM
Lloyd was not convicted and having read an interview with him I tend to beleive what he says, that he didn't put the gun in his kids mouth. Women make all kinds of outlandish accusations and will also have kids say anything to prove love to the mother.
As a man with custody of his 15 year old son (since my son was 11 months) I have had to deal with a few false accusations against me, all of which are unfounded.
As a person who works in Law Enforcement I have also seen where charges are layed just on the womens accusation with absolutely no evidence or proof.

I have read a number of your posts, you say you rather have a different QB and now you call into question one of our greater LB's. WHY?

Did you ever plead "no contest" to something? Do innocent people plead out? Seems to me, at least according to the experts on this board, that doesn't happen. Lloyd pled no contest to battery which was a result of pointing the gun at his wife. And yeah, the kid wants nothing to do with him even as recently as last year because he's father of the year. DUH!


And for the record, I'm calling into question his character not his playing ability. I thought you read the post. Steeler or not, try calling it how it is instead of how you want it to be.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 01:54 PM
Gotta say that this shows incredibly poor taste by you, LIG58.

Does your man crush on Ray overshadow your love for the Steelers?

It's no secret what took place with Lloyd, and he's not the only Steeler to have a brush with the law. Does any of that change the FACT that this is and will remain, under the control of the Rooney's, one of the most classy and tradition rich organizations in all sports.

Again, extremely poor taste.

I guess I'll get no sleep tonight.......:coffee:

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:02 PM
I also seem to recall reading that Lloyd was tried TWICE for the incident with his son. But TWO hung juries. I guess the DA's office seemed to think he did it.....

revefsreleets
01-13-2009, 02:07 PM
Sadly, once they let Lawrence Taylor into the Hall (and didn't strip OJ), they established a policy that "Character doesn't count".

Ray Lewis statistically deserves to be in the Hall. But his personal life and off-field issues should keep him out. He will be a unanimous 1st ballot selection though.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:10 PM
Sadly, once they let Lawrence Taylor into the Hall (and didn't strip OJ), they established a policy that "Character doesn't count".

Ray Lewis statistically deserves to be in the Hall. But his personal life and off-field issues should keep him out. He will be a unanimous 1st ballot selection though.

But Cornelius Bennett was better Rev.......:coffee:

Don't get me wrong, Bennett was great. And he was my favorite LB in the late 80's and early 90's. And you can't compare OLB's to MLB's IMO..........

cubanstogie
01-13-2009, 02:17 PM
If character was a prerequisite for Hall of Fame half the guys today wouldn't be eligible. The real LT had the most impact of any defensive player I have ever seen. I couldn't imagine him not being in the Hall. I personally don't have a problem with letting someone in even if they are in prison.I hate OJ with a passion but can't deny he was a great running back and deserves to be in HOF. There aren't too many saints in pro sports, or politics for that matter.

tony hipchest
01-13-2009, 02:24 PM
Ray Lewis WILL be a first ballot Hall of Famer. With the non-Steeler players you mentioned, I'd stake my life that none of them make it into the hall. Take a break from the Kool Aid once in a while.......you know what...

steeler nation is SO large you should start offering classes on how to be a TRUE steelerfan, teaching who they should root for and to what extent.

in other words, get over yourself or atleast explain what it is that makes you so superior to other steelerfans. :coffee:

revefsreleets
01-13-2009, 02:29 PM
I absolutely disagree. You can't seperate the athlete from the person. It starts early and never stops, this double standard, coddling athletes, letting them get away with things others can't. There needs to be a line drawn, and this is one of those lines. You send a message that great athletic ability does NOT entitle you you to awards and accolades, that you need to be a role model and ambassador as well.

I say this sincerely. Ray Lewis really is a piece of garbage. He should be banned from football for life, and no way should he be in the HOF.

But that's not the reality...

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:31 PM
you know what...

steeler nation is SO large you should start offering classes on how to be a TRUE steelerfan, teaching who they should root for and to what extent.

in other words, get over yourself or atleast explain what it is that makes you so superior to other steelerfans. :coffee:

I post my opinion as everyone else does. You simply stated that Biscuit Bennett, Urlacher, Fletcher and I forget the other guy are as good as Ray Lewis. I would hope that you honestly don't believe that. I don't think I'm superior to anyone on this board. But you seem to think being a TRUE fan is one who bleeds B&G on every issue or question. I guess we have two different takes.

OX1947
01-13-2009, 02:34 PM
Sadly, once they let Lawrence Taylor into the Hall (and didn't strip OJ), they established a policy that "Character doesn't count".

Ray Lewis statistically deserves to be in the Hall. But his personal life and off-field issues should keep him out. He will be a unanimous 1st ballot selection though.

I have a strong belief that OJ will be taken out of the Hall of Fame. LT may have had character issues, but they were self-inflicted drug issues. He didn't lop off two peoples heads in a jealous rage. Heck, he isn't the only one who's been there, just ask, Michael Irvin, Chris Carter, etc.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 02:37 PM
I absolutely disagree. You can't seperate the athlete from the person. It starts early and never stops, this double standard, coddling athletes, letting them get away with things others can't. There needs to be a line drawn, and this is one of those lines. You send a message that great athletic ability does NOT entitle you you to awards and accolades, that you need to be a role model and ambassador as well.

I say this sincerely. Ray Lewis really is a piece of garbage. He should be banned from football for life, and no way should he be in the HOF.

But that's not the reality...

I disagree Rev......these players are getting paid to play this game to the best of their ability. Not to be a role model to kids. That should start in the home, not on the football field. As much as I dislike some of the things that these players have done, they are not being inducted b/c of their character. I believe Pete Rose belongs in the Baseball Hall of Fame. As far as I can recall, he was never found guilty betting against this team.

cubanstogie
01-13-2009, 02:41 PM
OJ has a great career, acts his way through life literally as well, and then the anger problem comes out and he kills 2 individuals. It doesn't take away the fact that he was still a great running back. My problem is where do you draw the line if its not just judging what they do on the field. Its not a Miss America pageant, to me it just means they are a great player. I do understand your point of view as well, but I accepted years ago that athletes are not role models. We really don't know them at all. I can appreciate good play even if I don't like or respect them. I do seperate the person from the player or I wouldn't like most of them. Thats just me though.

revefsreleets
01-13-2009, 02:45 PM
They are role models because they are thrust into that role. It comes with the territory. Kids idolize their football heroes, and that's all part of the game.

steelpride12
01-13-2009, 02:51 PM
Did he kill them? No so it's not the same situation.

memphissteelergirl
01-13-2009, 02:57 PM
[QUOTE=T&B fan;526885]

The whole point of this thread was just to point out to some Steeler fans that we've had some of our own issues. But for some unknown reason, it's easy to point fingers and talk shit about a player from another team. Especially when they are from a rival team and considered one of the best to ever play their respective position.


So you're saying none of us here are aware that we have had players on our team that have had run-ins with the law? Please! We are painfully aware of it. E. Holmes, Gilliam, Lloyd, more recently S. Holmes, Wilson, Harrison....need I continue? But as a whole the Steeler organization keeps the "bad seeds" at bay and squashes anything that would taint the team's reputation.

To say we don't recognize our own fautls as an organization is insulting our intelligence.

tony hipchest
01-13-2009, 03:03 PM
I would hope that you honestly don't believe that. I don't think I'm superior to anyone on this board. But you seem to think being a TRUE fan is one who bleeds B&G on every issue or question. I guess we have two different takes.
fletcher-1102 tackles, 28 sacks, 14 int, 37 pass defended, 1 ring
overRayted- 911 tackles, 33.5 sacks, 28 int, 48 pass defended, 1 ring

(tackle stats only go back to 2000)

fletcher has 2 fewer years than ray and only started 1 game as a rookie. so how come ray is a permanent fixture in the pro bowl and london is constantly snubbed?

overhyped self promotion.

what about that is bleeding black and gold?

As far as I can recall, he was never found guilty betting against this team.

but he admitted he was guilty. he came clean and said he bet on his team.

fansince'76
01-13-2009, 03:05 PM
So you're saying none of us here are aware that we have had players on our team that have had run-ins with the law? Please! We are painfully aware of it. E. Holmes, Gilliam, Lloyd, more recently S. Holmes, Wilson, Harrison....need I continue?

Don't forget good ol' Bam! :smoker:

http://www.mugshots.com/IMAGES/P__bam_morris.jpg

El-Gonzo Jackson
01-13-2009, 03:11 PM
[QUOTE=T&B fan;526885]

The whole point of this thread was just to point out to some Steeler fans that we've had some of our own issues. But for some unknown reason, it's easy to point fingers and talk shit about a player from another team. Especially when they are from a rival team and considered one of the best to ever play their respective position.

Hey Lambertisgod, you somehow got my quote mixed up with T&B fan's post. " I was framed" :jawdrop:

I agree that Ray Lewis will be in the conversation with guys like Singletary, Huff, Butkus, Lambert, Nitsche, Bednarik for his on field play. Even though I think a lot of his stats are padded and he is of poor character. I like Corny Bennett, but dont think he will ever be in those discussions.

To me the best LB's are Butkus, Lambert, Nitsche, Bednarik, Singletary.......Lewis comes after them.

RoethlisBURGHer
01-13-2009, 03:40 PM
What Greg Lloyd is did is wrong. He is paying for his actions with the record he now has and his very damaged relationship with his son and ex-wife.

As for Ray Lewis, he beat a murder wrap because of his money and fame. I believe in innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, but not in a court of public opinion. I also don't like how much of a hypocrite the SOB is. He says he's such a man of God, let SI put him on the cover with the nickname "God's Linebacker" but he act's nothing like a man of God with his language and actions on the football field. He's a hypocrite.

memphissteelergirl
01-13-2009, 03:43 PM
Don't forget good ol' Bam! :smoker:

http://www.mugshots.com/IMAGES/P__bam_morris.jpg


LOL....Geez, how could I forget him?? :chuckle:

MasterOfPuppets
01-13-2009, 04:43 PM
ray lewis is an over rated football player....and a piece of shit human being.....:coffee:

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 05:55 PM
Comparing Lloyd and Lewis is like comparing Jack Ruby with Jeffrey Dahmer.

Didn't they both kill people?:coffee:

Dino 6 Rings
01-13-2009, 06:00 PM
Didn't they both kill people?:coffee:

yeah but like...um...Ruby was hired by the Government to kill someone and Dahlmer was just hungry...oh and totally insane.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 06:02 PM
yeah but like...um...Ruby was hired by the Government to kill someone and Dahlmer was just hungry...oh and totally insane.

I guess I'm failing to see the comparison......

Preacher
01-13-2009, 06:20 PM
OJ has a great career, acts his way through life literally as well, and then the anger problem comes out and he kills 2 individuals. It doesn't take away the fact that he was still a great running back. My problem is where do you draw the line if its not just judging what they do on the field. Its not a Miss America pageant, to me it just means they are a great player. I do understand your point of view as well, but I accepted years ago that athletes are not role models. We really don't know them at all. I can appreciate good play even if I don't like or respect them. I do seperate the person from the player or I wouldn't like most of them. Thats just me though.

They are role models because they are thrust into that role. It comes with the territory. Kids idolize their football heroes, and that's all part of the game.


Let's view it a different way then. They are representatives of the NFL. If they don't represent what the NFL says it is about, then they don't get the accolades of being the top in the NFL.

In the same way, if you are a top salesman and nationally known for your company, and your personal life makes people shy away from you, then you don't get the salesman of the year award in your company, because you have tarnished the companies reputation by association.

The NFL is not 32 competing teams. It is 1 business with 32 divisions working both with and competing against each other to produce what, in the end, is the best product. You reward people for creating an overall product that is wanted. If a player (employee) hurts that. then then don't deserve to be in the HOF.

HometownGal
01-13-2009, 06:27 PM
What Greg Lloyd is did is wrong. He is paying for his actions with the record he now has and his very damaged relationship with his son and ex-wife.

As for Ray Lewis, he beat a murder wrap because of his money and fame. I believe in innocent until proven guilty in a court of law, but not in a court of public opinion. I also don't like how much of a hypocrite the SOB is. He says he's such a man of God, let SI put him on the cover with the nickname "God's Linebacker" but he act's nothing like a man of God with his language and actions on the football field. He's a hypocrite.

http://blogs.smh.com.au/mashup/images/applause.gif


Let me also state that if I were accused of a crime I knew damned well I didn't commit, I wouldn't strike a deal with anyone. I would stand up and fight and do whatever it took to prove my innocence. But - that's just me.

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 06:56 PM
http://blogs.smh.com.au/mashup/images/applause.gif


Let me also state that if I were accused of a crime I knew damned well I didn't commit, I wouldn't strike a deal with anyone. I would stand up and fight and do whatever it took to prove my innocence. But - that's just me.


You wouldn't strike a deal that would give you a guaranteed 12 months probation vs 20 to life? I wouldn't trust a jury of peers with my life in their hands. Don't innocent people go to prison?

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
01-13-2009, 07:15 PM
You wouldn't strike a deal that would give you a guaranteed 12 months probation vs 20 to life? I wouldn't trust a jury of peers with my life in their hands. Don't innocent people go to prison?

I think this pretty much sums it all up. You would rather tarnish your character forever and run with your tail between your legs than to prove your innocence and keep your honor? Oh, and don't guilty people get set free?

LambertIsGod58
01-13-2009, 07:21 PM
I think this pretty much sums it all up. You would rather tarnish your character forever and run with your tail between your legs than to prove your innocence and keep your honor? Oh, and don't guilty people get set free?


Yeah, if it means having my freedom. Apparently you'd rather spend being someone's lil' tender ass to gamble saving your rep. Agree to disagree.

Sharkissle29
01-13-2009, 07:22 PM
well...greg lloyd isnt a murderer. just a disciplinarian

lambertlunaticfan
01-14-2009, 12:59 AM
you did miss my point,or maybe its my fault and i didnt do a good enough job expressing it....what i said or tried to say was in reponse to the many posts ive read on here besides convicted ray of a crime that a court in this country didnt,they have been making fun of his dances and his antics like that on the field....and all i was saying was i find it funny when people say things like that,cause chances are if they were doing that and on your team you would cheer it,but cause they are on the other team,you hate the antics like that....hey,im with you,act like youve been there before.....but i have to admit i loved joeys leg kick and love larrys stomp,not a big fan of bretts rowing celebration...but dont do it on every play,just when you make just big plays......i dont have a problem with rays dance......i mean i ve heard from fans of other teams say they find it funny we make fun of rays dance,but it was ok when jerome bettis used to bounce around before running out the tunnel before the game.......and i wasnt comparing the look at me dance to the smiles.....but you have to admit,all sports players do "look at me" antics and even though you might not like them,alot of posters that are making fun of ray doing that are cheering when steelers players do it...and that was the point i was trying to make on here........i was just saying like i said,if hines was on the ravens and ray was on the steelers you guys would hate the smiles and love the dance.....as people from other teams always rip on hines for that,i have a friend whos a vikes fan who keeps making fun of him for that,and im like,thats the best you got,that he smiles during the games,its called loving what you do and i love that he does that....as it shows he loves the game...... it:tt:]And you are seriously going to compare Ray's "look at me" dance to Hines Ward smiling after a play is over?

Wow.

Hopefully you are just trying to illustrate a point, but that's a bad comparison.

JackHammer
01-14-2009, 01:02 AM
LOL....Geez, how could I forget him?? :chuckle:

You could start by smoking what was in his trunk. That should be enough to cause amnesia :rofl::rofl:

redst3
01-14-2009, 03:49 AM
Ray Lewis is one of the best linebackers of our time so deal with it.

Yeah, so that excuses other parts of his life?

Preacher
01-14-2009, 04:00 AM
Ray Lewis is one of the best linebackers of our time so deal with it.

Wow... you got a linebacker to brag about.

Yawn.

Jack Ham

Jack Lambert
Andy Russell
Mike Merriweather
Levon Kirkland
Kevin Greene
Greg Lloyd

Joey Porter
and Now, Harrison--and in the near future, Woodley and Timmons.


And imagine that. . . NONE of them stabbed someone... or covered for a stabbing!

HometownGal
01-14-2009, 06:36 AM
Wow... you got a linebacker to brag about.

Yawn.

Jack Ham

Jack Lambert
Andy Russell
Mike Merriweather
Levon Kirkland
Kevin Greene
Greg Lloyd

Joey Porter
and Now, Harrison--and in the near future, Woodley and Timmons.


And imagine that. . . NONE of them stabbed someone... or covered for a stabbing!

:applaudit::hatsoff::applaudit:

Well put, Father.....and so very true! :tt02:

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 03:38 PM
:applaudit::hatsoff::applaudit:

Well put, Father.....and so very true! :tt02:

No, but one of them put a gun to his wife's head. I would have left Lloyd off the list.

RoethlisBURGHer
01-14-2009, 05:09 PM
No, but one of them put a gun to his wife's head. I would have left Lloyd off the list.

But is she dead? No, she's alive, as is his son.

What he did was wrong, all of us had said that. But still, he didn't actually kill anyone, or cover up a murder.

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 05:39 PM
then what do all of you think of Greg Lloyd? Who put a gun in his son's mouth for not doing well in school. And also pointed a gun at his wife's head......I just wonder since I seem to read posts that would make people think we have a clean closet, when we don't.

way to expose us like that.. props :applaudit:

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:03 PM
But is she dead? No, she's alive, as is his son.

What he did was wrong, all of us had said that. But still, he didn't actually kill anyone, or cover up a murder.

Oh, so now the criteria is whether or not someone is dead? So if these two guys lived, you'd have no issues with Ray Lewis? Keep kidding yourself......

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:04 PM
way to expose us like that.. props :applaudit:

No problem....:coffee:

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:07 PM
Oh, so now the criteria is whether or not someone is dead? So if these two guys lived, you'd have no issues with Ray Lewis? Keep kidding yourself......

Man what is it with some fellow so called steeler fans lately? Sometimes i question these people really.. they sound more like raven fans, then steeler fans.. PATHETIC!

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:13 PM
Man what is it with some fellow so called steeler fans lately? Sometimes i question these people really.. they sound more like raven fans, then steeler fans.. PATHETIC!

BTW you make the name lambert look bad fool!

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:19 PM
BTW you make the name lambert look bad fool!

Not as bad as you look quoting yourself.....:rofl:

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:20 PM
Man what is it with some fellow so called steeler fans lately? Sometimes i question these people really.. they sound more like raven fans, then steeler fans.. PATHETIC!

The problem is you lack objectivity....It's great being a homer sometimes. Key word being sometimes. There are 31 other teams that have talent other than Pittsburgh. Being a Steelers doesn't mean you can't recognize it. Except in your world anyway.

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:21 PM
Not as bad as you look quoting yourself.....:rofl:

that's what i meant to do R'tard! :toofunny:

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:23 PM
The problem is you lack objectivity....It's great being a homer sometimes. Key word being sometimes. There are 31 other teams that have talent other than Pittsburgh. Being a Steelers doesn't mean you can't recognize it. Except in your world anyway.

why don't you do us all a favor and , go over to the ravens board and post, and you can slob on there Nobb there as much as you want!

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:26 PM
why don't you do us all a favor and , go over to the ravens board and post, and you can slob on there Nobb there as much as you want!

Just as I said....no objectivity. Does Mommy know your on the computer? You made a comment about me giving Lambert a bad name. You give all Steeler fans a bad name. Being from LA, it doesn't surprise me. I'm sure you were a Raiders fan until you jumped on this bandwagon.

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:27 PM
that's what i meant to do R'tard! :toofunny:

you're the retard who doesn't know how to edit. :laughing:

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:29 PM
Just as I said....no objectivity. Does Mommy know your on the computer? You made a comment about me giving Lambert a bad name. You give all Steeler fans a bad name. Being from LA, it doesn't surprise me. I'm sure you were a Raiders fan until you jumped on this bandwagon.

Im sure you were a giants or jets fan before you jumped on the steelers D****!.

BTW talk about a dump, that's what the city of NY is clown!

Oh and just because everybody on here is not as old as you, it does not mean

everybody is a kid . :toofunny: Ol folks these days! why dont you get off and play bingo???

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:32 PM
Im sure you were a giants or jets fan before you jumped on the steelers D****!.

BTW talk about a dump, that's what the city of NY is clown!

Oh and just because everybody on here is not as old as you, it does not mean

everybody is a kid . :toofunny: Ol folks these days! why dont you get off and play bingo???

Newsflash, NYC is a part of New York State. But I truly didn't expect you to know that. But that's your mindset.....LA is California. Duh!

Polamalu43
01-14-2009, 06:33 PM
Newsflash, NYC is a part of New York State. But I truly didn't expect you to know that. But that's your mindset.....LA is California. Duh!

HAHAHAHAH.. well it was nice clownin you for a bit, hope to do it again soon..

about to get off work, unlike some people.. !!:wave::hatsoff:

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 06:35 PM
HAHAHAHAH.. well it was nice clownin you for a bit, hope to do it again soon..

about to get off work, unlike some people.. !!:wave::hatsoff:

hard day handing out flyers at Wal Mart? I'm surprised you have a job. Someone with your demonstrated skills I would expect to be the repsonsibility of the State of California. Good for you.....:wave:

tony hipchest
01-14-2009, 06:43 PM
No, but one of them put a gun to his wife's head. I would have left Lloyd off the list.
...and then your list would be "better", right? :rolleyes:

zsheik22
01-14-2009, 06:45 PM
hard day handing out flyers at Wal Mart? I'm surprised you have a job. Someone with your demonstrated skills I would expect to be the repsonsibility of the State of California. Good for you.....:wave:





LOL. I dealt with him the other day. I dont know how he manages to breathe without instructions.

lilyoder6
01-14-2009, 06:49 PM
wow lg58... and what do u do for a living?

pittsburghp8baller
01-14-2009, 07:37 PM
If you associate with thugs, then you are a thug. Look at Pacman Jones.

i gotta say this, thats pretty narrow minded. i grew up in an area where a lot of what you would say 'thugs' lived, and i happened to hang out with them a lot. does that make me a 'thug', i highly doubt that i would call myself that.

if that was the case that Ray was just protecting a friend i can understand that to a certain extent, but for double murder i dont care if you my best friend since birth i dont think i would cover for you unless it was self defense which all of the reports do not point toward, which of course if it was self defense there wouldnt be a reason to cover it up would it?

LambertIsGod58
01-14-2009, 08:08 PM
...and then your list would be "better", right? :rolleyes:

Every time I state an opinion, you give me this crap that I think I'm better than everyone else.

Preacher
01-14-2009, 08:15 PM
i gotta say this, thats pretty narrow minded. i grew up in an area where a lot of what you would say 'thugs' lived, and i happened to hang out with them a lot. does that make me a 'thug', i highly doubt that i would call myself that.

if that was the case that Ray was just protecting a friend i can understand that to a certain extent, but for double murder i dont care if you my best friend since birth i dont think i would cover for you unless it was self defense which all of the reports do not point toward, which of course if it was self defense there wouldnt be a reason to cover it up would it?


No, but if you are walking down the street with a bunch of thugs, then you break off and enter into a store that I work in, I will associate you with the company you keep and with the image you choose to project.

So I will be more cautious with you than I would be with someone who came in alone not dressed like a thug, or came in with his wife.

Fact is, when a person chooses to project an image, they are demanding that they be treated according to that image. If you want me to treat you like a thug, then project the thug image.

Of course, any normal person will also not make that their LAST impression. As such, if you come into the store and come up to me behind the counter and said, "excuse me sir, I am looking for the _____" then my impression starts to change.

But the first impression is yours to give... and you can't blame anyone else for taking you as a thug if you hang with them, dress like them, etc.

If yo hang with them but don't dress like them, then it gives me mixed signals. I am going to ask more questions. But I am still going to be weary. That is just called survival in the city. Not only is right... it is FOOLISH NOT to teach those things to your kids, ESPECIALLY your young girls.

pittsburghp8baller
01-14-2009, 08:22 PM
No, but if you are walking down the street with a bunch of thugs, then you break off and enter into a store that I work in, I will associate you with the company you keep and with the image you choose to project.

So I will be more cautious with you than I would be with someone who came in alone not dressed like a thug, or came in with his wife.

Fact is, when a person chooses to project an image, they are demanding that they be treated according to that image. If you want me to treat you like a thug, then project the thug image.

Of course, any normal person will also not make that their LAST impression. As such, if you come into the store and come up to me behind the counter and said, "excuse me sir, I am looking for the _____" then my impression starts to change.

But the first impression is yours to give... and you can't blame anyone else for taking you as a thug if you hang with them, dress like them, etc.

If yo hang with them but don't dress like them, then it gives me mixed signals. I am going to ask more questions. But I am still going to be weary. That is just called survival in the city. Not only is right... it is FOOLISH NOT to teach those things to your kids, ESPECIALLY your young girls.

i never dressed like i was one but i do understand what your coming from, i have gotten mixed impressions from the people i have come in contact with and have even been acused of things just based on the people i hang around with.

i just didnt like the way it was originally worded, that may be the case with some but not all

MasterOfPuppets
01-14-2009, 08:34 PM
You wouldn't strike a deal that would give you a guaranteed 12 months probation vs 20 to life? I wouldn't trust a jury of peers with my life in their hands. Don't innocent people go to prison? he didn't even wanna take a chance on the civil suit !!! why??? because he knew he'd be found GUILTY !!!

HometownGal
01-14-2009, 08:44 PM
he didn't even wanna take a chance on the civil suit !!! why??? because he knew he'd be found GUILTY !!!

Ding, ding, ding - we have a winner! :applaudit:

Big D
01-14-2009, 08:49 PM
The greg lloyd situation is the reason why i'm a fan of the team not the players. Look how many times you start to idolize a player and you find out they are a wife beater,child beater or even a murderer.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
01-14-2009, 10:25 PM
LambertIsGod58 do you throw rocks at hornets nests or stir up ant mounts just to watch the carnage unfold? Seems you get a kick out of getting under peoples skin and agitating them.

LambertIsGod58
01-15-2009, 08:17 AM
LambertIsGod58 do you throw rocks at hornets nests or stir up ant mounts just to watch the carnage unfold? Seems you get a kick out of getting under peoples skin and agitating them.

No, I have what's called an opinion. Regardless of who likes it or dislikes it. There are two issues where I "threw rocks". One is Ben, which we all know. And I simply started it out with my opinion. Because of the Ben slobbering on here, I started getting attacked. I'm not gonna sit and take it. The second issue here is Ray Lewis. I sat back long enough watching one person in particular constantly bash other members for having respect and/or admiration for a player who doesn't wear the black and gold. So if that bothers you.......it's duly noted. But it won't change anything.

I_Bleed_Black_And_Gold
01-15-2009, 01:43 PM
It doesn't bother me, it just seems you are always the catalyst for stirring up trouble here.

I have seen at least two threads now where you and another member spiraled from discussion, to argument, to childish insults and name calling.

I am not blaming you or anything, it is just an observation.

BIGBENFASTWILLIE
01-15-2009, 02:36 PM
aww.... but his son did much better in school didnt he?