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steelerchad
02-12-2009, 01:14 PM
I argue with a friend weekly about Big Ben. He basically says he sucks. We only win because of our defense and Big Ben does nothing but manage a game.
While he is correct about our defense being great year in and year out and that we usually have a balanced offensive attack ( although no running game for most of this year). Big Ben is more than a manager of a game. He makes plays when plays need to be made. In addtion, I decided to look at some stats since he joined the league.

This is based on passer rating, which takes all aspects of a QB and puts it into one number. While not perfect it does measure the efficiency of a QB pretty well. Using net yards, comp %, TD's, or INT's doesn't make sense. QB rating takes all of these factors into account.
In the last 5 years since his rookie season this is the top 5 each year:
04
1. P. Manning 121.1
2. Culpeper 110.9
3. Brees 104.8
4. McNabb 104.7
5. Ben 98.1

05
1. P. Manning 104.1
2. Palmer 101.1
3. Ben 98.6
4. Hasselback 98.2
5. Bulger 94.4

06
1. P. Manning 101.0
2. Huard 98.0
3. Brees 96.2
4. McNabb 95.5
5. Romo 95.1
21. Ben 75.4

07
1. Brady 117.2
2. Ben 104.1
3. Garrard 102.2
4. P. Manning 98.0
5. Romo 97.4

08
1. Rivers 105.5
2. Pennington 97.4
3. Warner 96.9
4. Brees 96.2
5. P. Manning 95.0
24. Ben 80.1

I knew Payton was great, but not this great. Top 5 all 5 years and #1 three times.
Big Ben and Brees were next, in the top 5 three times.
McNabb and Romo in the top 5 twice.
Nobody else made the list more than once and that includes Tom Brady. (yeah I know Pats fans he was hurt last year, but what happened in the other 3 years. )

iloveben7
02-12-2009, 01:47 PM
you'll probably be arguing with people on here too

and tell your friend to watch Ben's Superbowl winning drive

fansince'76
02-12-2009, 01:49 PM
Big Ben's detractors no longer have a leg to stand on. Period. End of discussion. All the cries of "22.6," and that "the Steelers' running game and great defense win all of Ben's games for him" went out the window 11 days ago when his defense coughed up a 13-point 4th quarter lead, his running game did nothing (again) and he bailed them all out with an 88-yard SB-winning TD drive. Next.

Edman
02-12-2009, 02:20 PM
Ben Roethlisberger won Super Bowl XLIII. Not the running game (which was non-existant all year), or the Defense, or for the idiot conspiracy theorists, the referees.

Ben. All Ben. 100%.

Anyone who has the gall and the nerve to tell me he's not very good. I'm just give them a dirty look, the finger, and walk away. Such stupidity does not deserve a response. And anyone who complains about him (They'll be here next year when the Steelers lose a game). I'll be on them like flies on dog shit. No excuses.

Indo
02-12-2009, 02:45 PM
Ben is an Elite quarterback.

Not a good Quarterback.

An ELITE Quarterback.



He didn't "manage" the Superbowl.
He Won it.

SuzyPeppercorn
02-12-2009, 03:18 PM
Do people still seriously think all this crap? I could understand people's point of view before this years superbowl. But after Ben leads a legendary 88 yard drive to win the superbowl how can anyone think that he is a game manager?

Also, how many QBs in his position are going to go for the win? How many are going to play for overtime? I wouldn't trade Ben for any player in the whole league. He wins games and he wins championships.

HometownGal
02-12-2009, 03:21 PM
No offense to the OP, but really - how many more "Ben Sucks", "My Friend Sez Ben Suuuuuucks" threads are we going to have around here? It's beyond the point of ridiculous anymore. :doh::banging:

The guy has 2 Super Bowl rings in 5 seasons. He threw the game-winning TD pass to return the Lombari Trophy to the franchise whose team rightfully earned it. END OF STORY.

AllD
02-12-2009, 03:27 PM
BB's breakout season was 2008 and his best game was SB XLIII. Will be interesting to see what happens next year. A collapsing pocket is a double edged sword as long as BB remains relatively healthy. It will be interesting to see who goes deeper in the playoffs next season.

Common sense says we repeat if we remain healthy while the Colts work with a new coach and Brady knocks the rust off. Eagles and Giants look to be the toughtest competition.

fansince'76
02-12-2009, 03:47 PM
No offense to the OP, but really - how many more "Ben Sucks", "My Friend Sez Ben Suuuuuucks" threads are we going to have around here?

Just wait until we lose another game. :rolleyes:

7SteelGal43
02-12-2009, 04:04 PM
do ya think if Ben wins a third Super Bowl, like say, repeat, that will shut up the detractors ?

Preacher
02-12-2009, 04:05 PM
Just wait until we lose another game. :rolleyes:

:chuckle:

stlrtruck
02-12-2009, 04:26 PM
do ya think if Ben wins a third Super Bowl, like say, repeat, that will shut up the detractors ?

Probably not!

TackleMeBen
02-12-2009, 05:53 PM
do ya think if Ben wins a third Super Bowl, like say, repeat, that will shut up the detractors ?
no, they will say he has a great defense to keep him in the game.

wootawnee
02-12-2009, 09:53 PM
He still has alot of work to do to his game......He has to get the deep ball better(over 40 yrd)with his receivers....He tends to underthrow the real deep wide open ones....He also has to work on his audible game(with the whole offense)......He needs to study other D's more to recognize where to go on the field with the audibles and his reads............It takes alot of working the ass off stuff but that is what he has to do........Lots of stuff between the games that few see.......

ohiosteelerfan20
02-12-2009, 09:54 PM
After the first loss next season, you can bet there will be a post on here, calling for Leftwich, Batch,or Dixon, or whoever is the backup, to start the following week.

7SteelGal43
02-12-2009, 11:19 PM
no, they will say he has a great defense to keep him in the game.

Yeah, but on the other hand, our defense didn't orchestrate that game winning drive in the Super Bowl. Sure, Ben may not have numbers like Favre, Elway, Marino, but he freakin wins, baby !

steelerchad
02-12-2009, 11:28 PM
This isn't a bash Ben thread at all. I've been saying all along that Ben knows how to win, has alot of intangibles, and all that stuff. I didn't expect to see the stats he's had thus far. For those that don't believe he's an elite QB, the stats prove it as well. Only manning has had better stats over the last 5 years.

Texasteel
02-12-2009, 11:28 PM
Just wait until we lose another game. :rolleyes:


Just wait until we win another game by less than a TD. :banging:

iloveben7
02-13-2009, 12:43 AM
do ya think if Ben wins a third Super Bowl, like say, repeat, that will shut up the detractors ?

nope I don't think so. there are always going to be people bashing Ben no matter how many Superbowls he wins. and that's sad

but i could care less what anyone else thinks because Ben's won 2 Superbowls and has broken many records.

iloveben7
02-13-2009, 12:44 AM
actually just wait for another game because he gets bashed when we win or lose and that even includes the Superbowl

StainlessStill
02-13-2009, 01:12 AM
I argue with a friend weekly about Big Ben. He basically says he sucks. We only win because of our defense and Big Ben does nothing but manage a game.
While he is correct about our defense being great year in and year out and that we usually have a balanced offensive attack ( although no running game for most of this year). Big Ben is more than a manager of a game. He makes plays when plays need to be made. In addtion, I decided to look at some stats since he joined the league.

This is based on passer rating, which takes all aspects of a QB and puts it into one number. While not perfect it does measure the efficiency of a QB pretty well. Using net yards, comp %, TD's, or INT's doesn't make sense. QB rating takes all of these factors into account.
In the last 5 years since his rookie season this is the top 5 each year:
04
1. P. Manning 121.1
2. Culpeper 110.9
3. Brees 104.8
4. McNabb 104.7
5. Ben 98.1

05
1. P. Manning 104.1
2. Palmer 101.1
3. Ben 98.6
4. Hasselback 98.2
5. Bulger 94.4

06
1. P. Manning 101.0
2. Huard 98.0
3. Brees 96.2
4. McNabb 95.5
5. Romo 95.1
21. Ben 75.4

07
1. Brady 117.2
2. Ben 104.1
3. Garrard 102.2
4. P. Manning 98.0
5. Romo 97.4

08
1. Rivers 105.5
2. Pennington 97.4
3. Warner 96.9
4. Brees 96.2
5. P. Manning 95.0
24. Ben 80.1

I knew Payton was great, but not this great. Top 5 all 5 years and #1 three times.
Big Ben and Brees were next, in the top 5 three times.
McNabb and Romo in the top 5 twice.
Nobody else made the list more than once and that includes Tom Brady. (yeah I know Pats fans he was hurt last year, but what happened in the other 3 years. )

Funny how the argument of the haters mark Ben as a game manager.. fine. Whatever they say cannot withhold the fact of Bens W-L record, period.

Ben was a game manager in his ROOKIE season and maybe a little bit of the Superbowl XL '05 season because he was so young at the time to lead a team. That all has changed now, and looking back at his RECORD BREAKING IN HOUSE RECORDS OF BRADSHAW, he is no longer a game manager.

Another thing, even though it was his second year and how young he was in '05, people seem to FORGET that it was the arm of Ben that clearly led us to the promise land that year, and we went through the # 1,2 and 3 seed on his cannon, and not the managing running game.

You could argue this year as well. Though the run game was alive against SD, it was Ben and his receivers taking over and performing Houdini maneuvers to win our 6th title.

Ben is FAR from a game manager, and people need to realize he's entering his 6th season as a starter, with 2 rings, and he sometimes won game, by himself.

Galax Steeler
02-13-2009, 04:37 AM
I don't see how people can keep slamming Ben.The man puts together drive after drive like hometown gal said he has won 2 superbowls in 5 years what more could you want.

stillers4me
02-13-2009, 06:39 AM
He doesn't date supermodels and "singer/actresses" (and I say that loosely).

Steelcitygal87
02-13-2009, 06:56 AM
He doesn't date supermodels and "singer/actresses" (and I say that loosely).

He dated Hayden Panettiere from the tv show HEROS.

stillers4me
02-13-2009, 07:01 AM
He dated Hayden Panettiere from the tv show HEROS.

No, it was Missy Peregrym.....but she's not a SUPERSTAR like Jessica. :wink02:

GBMelBlount
02-13-2009, 07:01 AM
To me, you can often judge someone's "greatness" by how they perform under pressure when EVERYTHING is on the line. Ben's got it imo.

tucker6
02-13-2009, 07:27 AM
If Pats fans can write threads about trading Brady based on a couple good Cassel games, Steeler fans will write threads about trading Ben when Leftwich has a good game. Oops. Already happened. Brady has won three SB's, and people still think it's greener on the other side.

99% of us believe Ben is one of the main reasons behind our success the last five years. The defense is the other. Without either, I'm not sure we win one SB. Let's just enjoy one of the premier QB's in the NFL. Only 3 or 4 teams would not want Ben as their starter, so we have someone good here.

Need to fix the OL though.

TackleMeBen
02-13-2009, 07:53 AM
i was visiting my cowboy board last night and someone started a thread comparing romo to ben... they were saying how ben is a good qb and they wish that romo could play like he has over the past year.

Steelcitygal87
02-13-2009, 07:58 AM
i was visiting my cowboy board last night and someone started a thread comparing romo to ben... they were saying how ben is a good qb and they wish that romo could play like he has over the past year.

Obviously those are fans who know what they are talking about :thumbsup::tt03: . True fans of football will admire and give credit where it is due...even if it is to a player of an opponent they hate.

I actually do not mind Romo. I wish he could go and play for a different team. Lord knows, if I were him, I wouldn't want to be in the middle of all that drama...putting up with T.O.and Jerry Jones....what a headache.

lilyoder6
02-13-2009, 08:41 AM
Obviously those are fans who know what they are talking about :thumbsup::tt03: . True fans of football will admire and give credit where it is due...even if it is to a player of an opponent they hate.

I actually do not mind Romo. I wish he could go and play for a different team. Lord knows, if I were him, I wouldn't want to be in the middle of all that drama...putting up with T.O.and Jerry Jones....what a headache.

but romo knows that t.o and jones gives him a hell of a shot 2 win and poss win a championship.....

t.o is a bad attitude and pos a bad team-mate.. but on sun he is still 1 of the best wr's in the game

Steelcitygal87
02-13-2009, 09:07 AM
but romo knows that t.o and jones gives him a hell of a shot 2 win and poss win a championship.....

t.o is a bad attitude and pos a bad team-mate.. but on sun he is still 1 of the best wr's in the game

Yeah, he is, but how has that worked out for them so far? I don't see them getting the job done. Almost every year they are the team that is picked from the NFC to make it to the super bowl..and yet they don't. I know they have a lot of talented players on the team..Ware, Romo, T.O., Witten...but if there is no chemistry there...no 'all for one and one for all'(like there is with the Steelers)attitude, chances are it is only going to get you so far.

There is NO leadership on that team. That is just one of the areas where Ben is far above Romo..in his leadership skills.

steelax04
02-13-2009, 12:03 PM
i was visiting my cowboy board last night and someone started a thread comparing romo to ben... they were saying how ben is a good qb and they wish that romo could play like he has over the past year.

Same with Donovan on some Philly boards.