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beSteelmyheart
03-15-2009, 11:31 PM
My fiancee recently bought a computer that's loaded with Windows Vista & I must say that I hate it. I miss the XP. Has anyone else had to deal with this & what are your thoughts?

MasterOfPuppets
03-15-2009, 11:49 PM
yup....bought a pc that came with vista on it. found it to be quite a pain in the ass, and i didn't see any advantages that it had over xp. after about 2 months i whiped it out and put xp on it.

SteelCurtain7
03-16-2009, 03:55 AM
What 3000 said. XP (on my PC) slower than a tortoise compared to Vista (on my laptop).

xfl2001fan
03-16-2009, 06:11 AM
Keep in mind, there are rumors floating around that Microsoft is talking about going to a new program (Windows 7...or something like that).

When they do, Windows XP will no longer be supported by their tech support.

stillers4me
03-16-2009, 06:36 AM
I got a new computer about a month ago with Vista and have no problems.

Indo
03-16-2009, 01:37 PM
I have an XP, a Vista, and a MacIntosh

Once you go Mac, you NEVER go back

DoubleSh0t
03-16-2009, 01:38 PM
Keep in mind, there are rumors floating around that Microsoft is talking about going to a new program (Windows 7...or something like that).

When they do, Windows XP will no longer be supported by their tech support.

Those aren't rumors. Windows 7 has been in play for quite some time. Microsoft even released a beta copy for the public which I have been using on my laptop.

Windows 7, in my experience is better than Vista. When it's set to launch, it should be much better than Vista with all the performance of XP.

Interestingly enough, people HATED XP when it came out. Now no one wants to get rid of it.

MasterOfPuppets
03-16-2009, 01:46 PM
it was all the stupid ass security prompts that drove me nuts with vista. everytime you tried to do something a damn window popped up....that and the time it took to boot up.

steelreserve
03-16-2009, 02:21 PM
Once you go Mac, you NEVER go back

Yeah, I had a Mac at work once. It sucked so bad I never used another Mac again. I think that's what you meant.

steelreserve
03-16-2009, 02:29 PM
I've got one older computer with XP, and two newer ones with Vista. I honestly don't see what everyone' problem is with Vista. It's hardly any different from XP other than the security warnings, and you can feel free to turn off most of them if you have any idea what you're doing around computers.

People always complain "Oh, but Vista is so slow! It crashes my system!" But usually the problem is that they're trying to run it on a computer that's a piece of shit. Or else on a computer that came straight out of the box and only has the most basic bare-bones amount of RAM. Because computer manufacturers love to sell machines with big hard drives and fast processors, but skimp out on memory to save themselves a few bucks. The end result being that people end up with powerful, brand-new computers whose performance hits a fat bottleneck because there's not enough RAM. That's the problem with probably 90% of the people I've seen complaining about Vista.

revefsreleets
03-16-2009, 02:36 PM
Use XP on the desktop and Vista on the laptop.

No problems with either.

XP, I'm pretty sure, will be supported through 2012.

Indo
03-16-2009, 02:42 PM
Yeah, I had a Mac at work once. It sucked so bad I never used another Mac again. I think that's what you meant.


I'm not sure how long ago "once" was, but I'm guessing you haven't used a Mac in quite a while. The Mac is soooooo much easier to use, it's not even a contest. I am forced to use a Vista at work and there is just no comparison IMO. I don't want to get into a Windows/MacIntosh debate because both platforms have their proponents, but my preference is definitely Mac

Hammer67
03-16-2009, 03:06 PM
it was all the stupid ass security prompts that drove me nuts with vista. everytime you tried to do something a damn window popped up....that and the time it took to boot up.


Turn off UAC.

Anyway...I have a system that triple boots to Vista Ultimate x64, XP Home (SP3) and Ubuntu Linux 8.10.

I have to say, that I like Vista the most. It is pretty darn stable and the performance is the same as XP if you disable the Aero graphical interface...then, it sort of looks like XP.

People have to understand that you need a bit more ram to really make it fly. I run with 4gb and Vista runs rock solid.

Hammer67
03-16-2009, 03:08 PM
I'm not sure how long ago "once" was, but I'm guessing you haven't used a Mac in quite a while. The Mac is soooooo much easier to use, it's not even a contest. I am forced to use a Vista at work and there is just no comparison IMO. I don't want to get into a Windows/MacIntosh debate because both platforms have their proponents, but my preference is definitely Mac

Now that's just perception. Mac OS has it's issues as well, it's just it has a much smaller user base and less people to find problems and less press about them. My cousin's Mac Book running the latest Mac OS X, couldn't find my Linksys wireless router...we had to fidget with it for a few hours before it would even see the wireless network I was broadcasting. In the end, he ended up plugging in to an ethernet port. Vista found it at startup without issue. Just an example.

The things we are hearing about Vista are the things we heard about XP in 2001 and 2002, and are the things we heard about Windows 98 in 1998, etc, etc.

People fear change, and ignore the fact that a computer from 2000 may be able to run XP, but that same computer is not going to be able to run a 2007 OS (Vista).

Technology changes, folks. And you have to take emotions out of it...it's just an OS for pete's sake.

The Duke
03-16-2009, 03:30 PM
the opinions vary. But yeah a lot of people have several issues with vista. lots of them have been fixed through the years though

what exactly are you having trouble with?

Keep in mind, there are rumors floating around that Microsoft is talking about going to a new program (Windows 7...or something like that).

When they do, Windows XP will no longer be supported by their tech support.

yep, and it's supposed to be a better transition from vista to 7 this time

I'm not believing the hype yet though. I do know that if it's actually good it may keep me fro buying a mac next year

MACH1
03-16-2009, 03:33 PM
There is a Beta version of 7 that can be downloaded from ms to try out.

steelreserve
03-16-2009, 03:59 PM
I'm not sure how long ago "once" was, but I'm guessing you haven't used a Mac in quite a while. The Mac is soooooo much easier to use, it's not even a contest. I am forced to use a Vista at work and there is just no comparison IMO. I don't want to get into a Windows/MacIntosh debate because both platforms have their proponents, but my preference is definitely Mac

I don't really understand how one can be any easier to use than the other. Since Windows first came out, every version of it and Mac OS have been basically the same, except the Mac isn't compatible with anything. Maybe that's changed in the past year or two, but I don't see the advantage of being "easy to use" when there's really not much you can do with it in the first place.

Pretty much every Mac owner that I know just uses it for the Internet and iTunes. As far as I can tell, they're giving up compatibility with 90% of the programs out there in an attempt to make a statement that their lifestyle is oh-so-edgy and counterculture.

X-Terminator
03-16-2009, 04:25 PM
Vista has it's pluses and minuses just like any other OS. It's great for making movies (even better if you have Home Premium or Ultimate), working with pictures and setting up a home network. It's also much faster than any XP machine I've ever used. The Ultimate edition has extra features such as full-motion backgrounds that are pretty cool, but it can be a load on your CPU. It sucks when installing programs or doing anything that requires direct access to memory or sensitive areas of the OS (User Account Control - blah), uses quite a bit of memory (which is why you have to have at least 2GB of the fastest RAM your motherboard can handle along with a good and fast dual-core processor for it to run nice and smooth) and I'm not a huge fan of the Windows Sidebar. Windows 7, though, is going to be pretty nice when it comes out. I've used it on my laptop and it's great. It should satisfy the people who have complained about Vista.

Hammer67
03-16-2009, 05:22 PM
The thing that kind of makes me chuckle is all the negative vibe over Vista...I mean, it wasn't THAT bad. Bad was Windows ME. If anyone remembers that piece of garbage, they pulled if from the shelves and released XP but a year later.

Vista has been stable from the beginning...I think the problem at first was that people tried to upgrade to it without paying attention to the requirements or reviews. If you had 1gb of RAM and XP was just flying, Vista was not going to be a good upgrade. And, of course drivers took a bit to catch up much like when XP was released.

As for the Mac, it has it's uses, for sure, but much of the hype is just that "edgy and different" feel that Steelreserve alluded to. In fact, there is a reason that Apple moved to the PC hardware architecture (read Intel)...

Windows 7 will be the same...people will groan and Apple will continue to make those cute, if inaccurate, commercials bashing it.

Hammer67
03-16-2009, 08:14 PM
Even though I own and love my iPhone, I have to agree with you...Apple is anal about their pricing and proprietary parts. And, the iPhone had, and still has, major bugs and design decisions/issues.

X-Terminator
03-16-2009, 09:12 PM
The thing that kind of makes me chuckle is all the negative vibe over Vista...I mean, it wasn't THAT bad. Bad was Windows ME. If anyone remembers that piece of garbage, they pulled if from the shelves and released XP but a year later.

Vista has been stable from the beginning...I think the problem at first was that people tried to upgrade to it without paying attention to the requirements or reviews. If you had 1gb of RAM and XP was just flying, Vista was not going to be a good upgrade. And, of course drivers took a bit to catch up much like when XP was released.

As for the Mac, it has it's uses, for sure, but much of the hype is just that "edgy and different" feel that Steelreserve alluded to. In fact, there is a reason that Apple moved to the PC hardware architecture (read Intel)...

Windows 7 will be the same...people will groan and Apple will continue to make those cute, if inaccurate, commercials bashing it.

Windows ME was the biggest piece of trash Microsoft ever put out. I had it on my PC for a week before going back to 98SE. The only thing that ME gave us that was any good was the hibernation mode.

I admit I was sour on Vista until I got to learn more about it, and after I upgraded my laptop hardware (it came with just 1GB of RAM; I upgraded to 2GB and am about to go to 4GB). Now I don't mind it at all. I should have known better to believe the negative vibes that come with every Microsoft release - I've only been in the IT field for 10 years.

I'm also not a big fan of Macs. They are overrated, overhyped and definitely overpriced. And the old Motorola-based architecture was substandard to say the least, which of course is why they switched to Intel processors.

beSteelmyheart
03-16-2009, 09:42 PM
Maybe I'm one of those who hate change. I got used to XP & could zip thru it when doing my photoediting & have it done quickly. Now I'm wondering if I have to fork out the $ $ to buy all new photoediting software for Vista or can I just reload the old one?

Hammer67
03-16-2009, 10:23 PM
Maybe I'm one of those who hate change. I got used to XP & could zip thru it when doing my photoediting & have it done quickly. Now I'm wondering if I have to fork out the $ $ to buy all new photoediting software for Vista or can I just reload the old one?

Chances are it will work, but why upgrade if what you have is working fine? Personally, i try not to move to a new OS unless I have to.

beSteelmyheart
03-17-2009, 08:35 PM
Turn off UAC.

Anyway...I have a system that triple boots to Vista Ultimate x64, XP Home (SP3) and Ubuntu Linux 8.10.

I have to say, that I like Vista the most. It is pretty darn stable and the performance is the same as XP if you disable the Aero graphical interface...then, it sort of looks like XP.

People have to understand that you need a bit more ram to really make it fly. I run with 4gb and Vista runs rock solid.
What is UAC? How do I get to that? I see exactly what the other guy was talking about when dealing with this stupid security crap.
My example...I'm trying to deal with the Windows Photo Gallery editing gimmick(yep, I've gotten that desperate), using pics from a CD..I can bring up the image but it won't allow me to edit it until i change the attributes & uncheck the read only box, etc, etc. Simple enough, I thought even though it's a PITA I never had to deal with before, & when you are dealing with alot of pictures, this processing time really adds up. So I went to change the attributes & the stupid security window popped up!!WTF? Over a picture???? Ok, whatever, I typed in the damned password & it came back with an error. Now wait, I followed the directions. Is it because it's coming from a CD?
Anyway there was another option given which was to save the photo under another name & then open that & edit it. I tried that & it wouldn't let me, coming up with a box that said something like this file doesn't exist, blah blah. Well of course it doesn't exist! I'm in the process of trying to create it, for crying out loud!!!!
I never, never, NEVER had to deal with this crap before.
The wonderful finale to this story of frustration is that I can't find the serial code for my photo software, even if it did work with Vista...I can't even email them without the code. It tells me I can get the code from the properties menu on the program...my fiancee, God bless him, reloaded that drive in an attempt to fix it because it was freezing up which caused us to buy this new computer, so that serial code is lost.
I'm screwed. I have almost 200 huge photo files from a Warbird show last Saturday that I downloaded onto yet another computer & burned onto a CD so I wouldn't clog this one up. I've tried downloading pics onto this Vista computer before & there was no selective menu on what you can check off to download & what you don't want.
Photography is one of my hobbies & i'm an artist but am a computer idiot. The only thing I care about on a computer is to process my stuff & cruise a few regular sites like this one & hate the aggravation of going around in circles. My fiancee likes to think he knows about computers & in the process knows how to screw them up, but alas, even he didn't know what the UAC was. (At least I'll admit when I'm clueless.)
Hammer, can you simplify any of this for me, I would appreciate it!

Edit-the only way to work it for now is to send it to my documents & open it from there, when XP would have let me pick & choose out of those photos & send them to my pictures where they belong in the first place. It's another inefficient step to tack on to the processing time.

MasterOfPuppets
03-17-2009, 10:08 PM
hey besteel, here's an excellent photo editing program.......
http://www.gimp.org/

its totally free, and is very similiar to photoshop.....BUT FREE !!! :thumbsup: ...I actually have photoshop cs3, and still use gimp. it's pretty user friendly, and you can find hundreds of tutorial video's just with a google search.

The Duke
03-17-2009, 10:48 PM
What is UAC? How do I get to that? I see exactly what the other guy was talking about when dealing with this stupid security crap.


the user account control. it creates those security alerts

I do not have XP, but I believe you can turn it off by launching RUN and typing MSCONFIG. the option to disable UAC should be there. Think there's a way to turn it off from control panel too....

BUT, if you are really not good with computers I wouldn't recommend messing with stuff in Run

maybe hammer or XT can back me up on this....

X-Terminator
03-17-2009, 10:55 PM
What is UAC? How do I get to that? I see exactly what the other guy was talking about when dealing with this stupid security crap.
My example...I'm trying to deal with the Windows Photo Gallery editing gimmick(yep, I've gotten that desperate), using pics from a CD..I can bring up the image but it won't allow me to edit it until i change the attributes & uncheck the read only box, etc, etc. Simple enough, I thought even though it's a PITA I never had to deal with before, & when you are dealing with alot of pictures, this processing time really adds up. So I went to change the attributes & the stupid security window popped up!!WTF? Over a picture???? Ok, whatever, I typed in the damned password & it came back with an error. Now wait, I followed the directions. Is it because it's coming from a CD?
Anyway there was another option given which was to save the photo under another name & then open that & edit it. I tried that & it wouldn't let me, coming up with a box that said something like this file doesn't exist, blah blah. Well of course it doesn't exist! I'm in the process of trying to create it, for crying out loud!!!!
I never, never, NEVER had to deal with this crap before.
The wonderful finale to this story of frustration is that I can't find the serial code for my photo software, even if it did work with Vista...I can't even email them without the code. It tells me I can get the code from the properties menu on the program...my fiancee, God bless him, reloaded that drive in an attempt to fix it because it was freezing up which caused us to buy this new computer, so that serial code is lost.
I'm screwed. I have almost 200 huge photo files from a Warbird show last Saturday that I downloaded onto yet another computer & burned onto a CD so I wouldn't clog this one up. I've tried downloading pics onto this Vista computer before & there was no selective menu on what you can check off to download & what you don't want.
Photography is one of my hobbies & i'm an artist but am a computer idiot. The only thing I care about on a computer is to process my stuff & cruise a few regular sites like this one & hate the aggravation of going around in circles. My fiancee likes to think he knows about computers & in the process knows how to screw them up, but alas, even he didn't know what the UAC was. (At least I'll admit when I'm clueless.)
Hammer, can you simplify any of this for me, I would appreciate it!

Edit-the only way to work it for now is to send it to my documents & open it from there, when XP would have let me pick & choose out of those photos & send them to my pictures where they belong in the first place. It's another inefficient step to tack on to the processing time.

To turn off UAC (User Account Control): Start - Control Panel - User Accounts and Family Safety - User Accounts. There should be an option to turn UAC on or off under User Accounts. You won't get any more of those security alerts if you turn it off.

Hope this helps!

beSteelmyheart
03-18-2009, 08:07 PM
Thanks for the help, guys! And sorry for the long vent, I was pretty frustrated when I wrote that.

AllD
03-18-2009, 08:33 PM
Turn off UAC.

Anyway...I have a system that triple boots to Vista Ultimate x64, XP Home (SP3) and Ubuntu Linux 8.10.

I have to say, that I like Vista the most. It is pretty darn stable and the performance is the same as XP if you disable the Aero graphical interface...then, it sort of looks like XP.

People have to understand that you need a bit more ram to really make it fly. I run with 4gb and Vista runs rock solid.


That sounds like a Dell XPS which I was thinking about purchasing. The Ubuntu looks interesting too for video. However, I am wondering if there wold be a loss by not having OS7 when it arrives. Is the start up time for the 3 OSs longer? I run XP now and can surf blindfolded quickly.

Hammer67
03-19-2009, 12:15 PM
That sounds like a Dell XPS which I was thinking about purchasing. The Ubuntu looks interesting too for video. However, I am wondering if there wold be a loss by not having OS7 when it arrives. Is the start up time for the 3 OSs longer? I run XP now and can surf blindfolded quickly.

Startup time depends on lots of variables, like partition fragmentation, drive speed, registry bloat, number of apps and services loading during boot, etc. But I have found that Vista boots a bit faster then XP when everything is optimized the same...but I am running Vista x64 and XP x86.

Ubuntu boots quickly as well, but I don't have much in terms of apps installed on that partition...it's mostly a default install. Linux is still fidgity to me in terms of updates, drivers and wireless support so I use it mostly as a Test & QA platform. My XP partition is getting removed shortly to free up more space for Vista.

I would not recommend Vista if you are happy with XP...unless you are a gamer and want DX10 capabilities. It is aesthetically nicer and has more robust security features built in, but no real killer app that requires upgrade.

MasterOfPuppets
03-19-2009, 12:37 PM
Startup time depends on lots of variables, like partition fragmentation, drive speed, registry bloat, number of apps and services loading during boot, etc. But I have found that Vista boots a bit faster then XP when everything is optimized the same...but I am running Vista x64 and XP x86.

Ubuntu boots quickly as well, but I don't have much in terms of apps installed on that partition...it's mostly a default install. Linux is still fidgity to me in terms of updates, drivers and wireless support so I use it mostly as a Test & QA platform. My XP partition is getting removed shortly to free up more space for Vista.

I would not recommend Vista if you are happy with XP...unless you are a gamer and want DX10 capabilities. It is aesthetically nicer and has more robust security features built in, but no real killer app that requires upgrade. as you said before, you need lots of ram....i had no idea that was such a factor before....when i bought the pc it only had 1 gb of ram, and it took forever to boot up, even after purging all the junk software that came with it. xp pro with the same ram and software boots up in probably 1/4 the time that vista did.

Hammer67
03-19-2009, 12:46 PM
as you said before, you need lots of ram....i had no idea that was such a factor before....when i bought the pc it only had 1 gb of ram, and it took forever to boot up, even after purging all the junk software that came with it. xp pro with the same ram and software boots up in probably 1/4 the time that vista did.

Sounds about right. Of course, first thing I would do if I bought a Dell/HP/Viao etc, would be to totally uninstall windows, format and install a fresh copy. They dump SO much garbage on their systems that I have seen systems crawl out of the box. PC's are sold at cost in most cases which is why they are so cheap. Vendors make up for this by taking "advertising" type space from software vendors by preloading their crap on their systems.

For Vista, speed depends on things like your graphics card, processor and amount of RAM. There are a lot of things going on under the hood in Vista that aren't in XP. If you had 2gb for Vista it would probably boot in roughly the same time, providing your processor and GPU aren't ancient.

Expecting a new operating system (there were six years between the release of XP and VIsta) to run the same as an older one on the the same hardware is just unrealistic.

MasterOfPuppets
03-19-2009, 12:54 PM
Sounds about right. Of course, first thing I would do if I bought a Dell/HP/Viao etc, would be to totally uninstall windows, format and install a fresh copy. They dump SO much garbage on their systems that I have seen .
your dead on with the garbage...they fill it up with "trial" software that spams the hell out of you, everytime you boot up...the reinstallation would be a great idea, except they DON'T give you a copy of the OS or drivers anymore. but they are more than willing to sell them to you upon request. fortunately , i have a "corperate " :nervous: edition of xp pro , that i can install on as many computers as i want.

steelreserve
03-19-2009, 06:53 PM
your dead on with the garbage...they fill it up with "trial" software that spams the hell out of you, everytime you boot up...the reinstallation would be a great idea, except they DON'T give you a copy of the OS or drivers anymore. but they are more than willing to sell them to you upon request. fortunately , i have a "corperate " :nervous: edition of xp pro , that i can install on as many computers as i want.

Ahh, not enough RAM and the spread of pre-installed crapware: Yet another reason to build your machine yourself. I put together a new machine a few months ago, and it takes 17 seconds from the time you hit the power button until the time Vista is ready and finished loading everything. Again, get 4GB of RAM or more if you can help it at all. It's getting a lot cheaper these days.

Hammer67
03-19-2009, 07:19 PM
Ahh, not enough RAM and the spread of pre-installed crapware: Yet another reason to build your machine yourself. I put together a new machine a few months ago, and it takes 17 seconds from the time you hit the power button until the time Vista is ready and finished loading everything. Again, get 4GB of RAM or more if you can help it at all. It's getting a lot cheaper these days.


My PC has been an evolving and changing great great grandchild of the first PC I put together in 1994. Makes life cheaper and easier...instead of upgrading everything at once, I add a component here and another there...

X-Terminator
03-19-2009, 10:09 PM
Ahh, not enough RAM and the spread of pre-installed crapware: Yet another reason to build your machine yourself. I put together a new machine a few months ago, and it takes 17 seconds from the time you hit the power button until the time Vista is ready and finished loading everything. Again, get 4GB of RAM or more if you can help it at all. It's getting a lot cheaper these days.

My PC has been an evolving and changing great great grandchild of the first PC I put together in 1994. Makes life cheaper and easier...instead of upgrading everything at once, I add a component here and another there...

That's the way I've been doing it since 1998. Just upgraded the MB, processor and RAM, in fact. The only name-brand PCs I've ever owned were laptops.