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View Full Version : This is how you OWN a Big Ben Hater....


StainlessStill
05-07-2009, 10:21 AM
I'm a blog and message board guy, I love talkin' Steelers and Sports all over the web. On this one site, I came across an ignorant big Ben hater, who completely spewed diarrhea out the mouth.He said the most overated QB in the NFL is Roethlisberger, and he can't hold Marino, or Favre's jock. I then owned him on his subject, and had to share it with you guys. This just shows that noone can eff with a Steelers fan.

HE SAID: The most overrated QB in the NFL right now is Ben Roethlisberger. Makes monumental eff-ups and is bailed out by his defense over and over. He's got 2 rings * Rolling Eyes* One of them his team won in SPITE of him. He can't carry Favre's or Marino's jock strap.



My Response: OBVIOUSLY you don't watch too many Steelers games to know how important Ben Roethlisberger is to his team. HE was the reason we made a run at the Superbowl in '05 (let alone MAKING THE GAME SAVING TACKLE AFTER BETTIS FUMBLED ON THE ONE.) If you paid attention, the running game was basically non existent, and it was Ben who took the team on his shoulders and delivered with big pass after big pass, in crucial situations. Yeah, he didn't have a good game against Seattle, big deal, he played well enough to win the game, and DID make some key plays that iced the football game.

Monumental eff-ups.. are you talking about yourself again? Jesus Christ, without the plays he makes single handily the last 5 seasons, Pittsburgh's nowhere near the caliber team they are today. He gets out of trouble better than what David Blaine ever can do. He's a wayyyy better FOOTBALL player than Manning or Brady, and when it's time to grind it out, Bens the quarerback you take in ANY SITUATION.

How does the defense bail him out? This statement can't be more false. As GOOD as the Steelers defense was this season, THEY were the burden late in most football games this season, and it was BEN that led his unit down field, 80 yards consistently each game in those situations against TOUGH as nails defense. These games included:

Baltimore: Monday Night game at home against the Ravens, he brought the Steelers down from 10 to lead his team into overtime, eventually making a nice march to put his kicker in the situation to win the game.


"The victory, which came after the Steelers scored 17 unanswered points and squandered a late lead, wasn't sealed until Jeff Reed snuck a 46-yard field goal attempt just inside the left goal post at 8:55 of overtime.

It gave the Steelers a 3-1 record as well as first place in the AFC North. It may also have represented another stage in the maturation of quarterback Ben Roethlisberger.

Roethlisberger threw for 191 yards and the touchdown that jump-started the Steelers' offense in the third quarter. In truth, he may have provided the jolt his team needed earlier.

So frustrated by the Steelers play through the first two quarters Roethlisberger said he "screamed" at his teammates at halftime.

"Very unusual," wide receiver Santonio Holmes said of Roethlisberger's outburst, "but being a captain, that's what we expect from him." He came in and stated his claim."

"I was tired of being booed," Roethlisberger said, "I was tired of being embarrassed on offense. I told the guys that. I said, 'There's no need for it.' "



The Very next week in Jacksonville:

" Roethlisberger engineered an 11-play, 80-yard scoring drive in the fourth quarter, and that proved to be the difference in another classic Jaguars-Steelers game. Roethlisberger may have turned in the play of the game when he completed a third-down pass to Hines Ward right before he was slammed to the turf."



The 11-10 win against San Diego:


"I would say it was frustrating," quarterback Ben Roethlisberger said of the Steelers' inability to score a touchdown, "but we felt good out there on offense."

Roethlisberger redeemed himself for his three-interception performance last week against the Indianapolis Colts. He completed 31 of 41 passes for 308 yards and did not throw an interception. He was a perfect 6 for 6 on the Steelers' final drive, which resulted in Jeff Reed's game-winning 32-yard field goal with 11 seconds remaining.



Dallas:


A 47-yard completion from Roethlisberger to Holmes jump-started the offense, and the Steelers overcame the Cowboys' goal-line stand to score 10 points and tie the game with 2:10 left in the fourth quarter.

That set the stage for the biggest play of Townsend's season.


Very next week @ Baltimore for the division title, and a first round bye:


Quarterback Ben Roethlisberger marched the Steelers 92 yards and capped a 12-play drive with a 4-yard touchdown pass to Santonio Holmes with less than a minute left in the fourth quarter. After producing the only touchdown of the game and then weathering a late push by the Ravens' offense, the Steelers wrapped up the AFC North and assured themselves of no worse than the No. 2 seed in the playoffs



And we all know what he did against Arizona in the Superbowl:


Quarterback Ben Roethlisberger rallied the Steelers after they squandered a 13-point lead, and his late-game heroics produced a 27-23 win and one of the most memorable finishes in Super Bowl history.

Roethlisberger led the Steelers on one of his patented fourth-quarter comebacks, and he capped a 78-yard drive with a 6-yard touchdown pass to Santonio Holmes with 35 seconds left in the game.



Count them, that's 6 nail biting games... games in which the #1 defense FALTERED to put teams away, and it was actually BEN and his offense picking the defense up, and securing a win. Ben Roethlisberger is captain comeback, and he did it on the biggest stage of all.

When will be the GOD DAMN DAY that Ben Roethlisberger gets the respect he deserves? He's clearly, far and beyond an elite quarterback in the NFL. I guess he has to just keep winning Superbowls to be lumped in "just an average Quarterback" company. eff that. He's the type of quarterback ANY team envy's, and they let it show by making dumbass comments as madsplash just did. My advice: watch a Steelers football game rather than looking at stats, then come back and tell me if the man's overrated. Oh, and by the way, He has more Superbowl rings than Marino, and Favre COMBINED. Stick that up your blow hole.

Have a nice day.

--------------------------------

I haven't heard from him since. THAT'S how you own a hater.

ALL HAIL STEELERS NATION!!!!:tt02::tt02:

SteelersMongol
05-07-2009, 10:25 AM
Nice. That must've been some Tennessee Tits or Jacksonville Jaggoffs fan.

fansince'76
05-07-2009, 10:55 AM
Fact: We didn't win squat for more than a quarter century, despite having great running games and kick-ass defenses for the better part of Cowher's tenure (1994, 1995 and 2001 especially). All of a sudden since Ben's arrival in 2004, we've picked up 2 more Lombardis.

Coincidence? Think not. If we truly could stick any schmuck behind center and win SBs due to having a dominant defense and running game, we'd be working on Lombardi #10 or #11 instead of #7 right now. :coffee:

steelreserve
05-07-2009, 11:39 AM
Your biggest mistake was spending so much effort responding to the guy. People like that tend to not be receptive to anything other than their own hating.

Dino 6 Rings
05-07-2009, 11:45 AM
Great Retort Stainless Still. Very nicely Done.

I especially like the "more rings than Marino and Favre Combined" line. That's a classic, I'll be using that myself in the office next time someone tries to talk down my QB, which isn't often now that he's got 2 rings.

Vincent
05-07-2009, 12:13 PM
Mamma always said "Don't argue with idiots. They'll drag you down to their level then beat you with their experience".

SteelMember
05-07-2009, 02:08 PM
Fact: We didn't win squat for more than a quarter century, despite having great running games and kick-ass defenses for the better part of Cowher's tenure (1994, 1995 and 2001 especially). All of a sudden since Ben's arrival in 2004, we've picked up 2 more Lombardis.

Coincidence? Think not. If we truly could stick any schmuck behind center and win SBs due to having a dominant defense and running game, we'd be working on Lombardi #10 or #11 instead of #7 right now. :coffee:

NIce post, and as far as the schumck, I think we signed him...at least 3 times. :wink02:

Sharkissle29
05-07-2009, 02:12 PM
Your biggest mistake was spending so much effort responding to the guy. People like that tend to not be receptive to anything other than their own hating.

:iagree:

Rek
05-07-2009, 02:29 PM
Fact: We didn't win squat for more than a quarter century, despite having great running games and kick-ass defenses for the better part of Cowher's tenure (1994, 1995 and 2001 especially). All of a sudden since Ben's arrival in 2004, we've picked up 2 more Lombardis.

Coincidence? Think not. If we truly could stick any schmuck behind center and win SBs due to having a dominant defense and running game, we'd be working on Lombardi #10 or #11 instead of #7 right now. :coffee:

We should bench Ben and see if Kordell or Tomczack are available. :chuckle:

pancake
05-07-2009, 02:51 PM
Mostly Bungal fans in my area and they think Palmer is better than Big Ben. :rofl:

Rek
05-07-2009, 02:53 PM
Mostly Bungal fans in my area and they think Palmer is better than Big Ben. :rofl:

Personally, I think Palmer is a fantastic QB (although I dislike him as a person) who is surrounded by a shitty organization and overrated criminals. Better than Ben? I think not.

Cmdurand21
05-07-2009, 03:30 PM
Here is why people don't like Ben. People have become so crazy about Fantasy Football that it matter more than real football. They see his 15-20 points and they scoff and think, "god he sucks I would never want him as my QB". Then they go look at someone like Palmer, Rivers, or Romo with his 23-30 points a game, and think, " WOW THIS GUY IS AWESOME". They haven't seen either player play, but this is all that matters to most people.

Then people like us look at reality and take the only stats that really matter, and it's clear who is better.

Record / Playoff Record / Win % / Game Winning drives

Ben Roethlisberger: 51-20 / 8-2 / 72.84% / 19

Carson Palmer: 32-33 / 0-1 / 48.48% / 11

Tony Romo: 28-13 / 0-2 / 65,12% / 7

Phillip Rivers: 34-17 3-3 64.91% 6


Most Importantly combined record of the last 3 vs the Steelers 4-8. :helmet:

Psyychoward86
05-07-2009, 05:02 PM
And in case many dont know, BB has more 4th quarter/OT come from behind victories than any QB since he came into the league in 2004

StainlessStill
05-07-2009, 05:51 PM
I said to myself time and time again to not respond to the douchebag, but the more and more I read it, the more and more I wasn't going to let him spew obsurity about the subject, so I caved in and had to stand up for Ben.

To me, I always was the first one to step up to someone if they would be putting down the Steelers in ANYWAY, and only if they were completely saying things that weren't true and make up their own beliefs and then talk it up to other people for a debate. Football illiterates bother me when trying to argue when they are trying to put that team/player down. It's like sticking up for your little brother when he's bullied, you HAVE to step up and defend when it comes to the Steelers, no matter what.

As for Carson Palmer, all I got to say is, HAHAHAHA. The guy ranks at least top 2 or 3 biggest choke artist of all time, the gagging doesn't get better, than Carson Palmer. It's a shame, he has the potential to be a good quarterback, but unfortunately for him, he can't rise to no occasion and that's what separates good and bad quarterbacks from the NFL.

X-Terminator
05-07-2009, 05:54 PM
Here is why people don't like Ben. People have become so crazy about Fantasy Football that it matter more than real football. They see his 15-20 points and they scoff and think, "god he sucks I would never want him as my QB". Then they go look at someone like Palmer, Rivers, or Romo with his 23-30 points a game, and think, " WOW THIS GUY IS AWESOME". They haven't seen either player play, but this is all that matters to most people.

And there you have it. Fantasy football has ruined fans, period. What was supposed to be something fun has turned into the gospel for far too many morons. Who would have thought 20 years ago that a bunch of arbitrary and inflated - and meaningless - stats would come to mean so much, rather than the cold, hard facts? Those guys can have their FF wonders like Rhomo, Rosie and Brees. I'll take Ben, the guy who does nothing but WIN GAMES week in and week out.

OX1947
05-07-2009, 06:04 PM
I don't give a damn who's better. As long as Big Ben fills the trophy cases with Lombardi Trophies in the Steelers facilities while he is playing QB, he can suck and be overrated all he wants.

And also, Big Ben lead his team 88 yards in the biggest sporting even in the world, to a game winning TD for a title. QB's who are overrated don't do that. Those who say he is over rated, are bumbling morons who don't like the Steelers or Big Ben.

Cmdurand21
05-07-2009, 06:57 PM
Here is the most hilarious and most retarded reason I hear for Ben Roe being overrated. " Oh his Defense is awesome, if Xqb had that defense, he would have won 5 Super bowls by now." This is your typical response from a team with a Great to mediocre offensive team with worse defense than the Steelers (Pretty much everyone) Lately these teams have been: Saints, Bengals, Dallas, Packers, Colts.and even New England & Chargers

Shorty after that I normally point out that we probably have more money tied up on defense then they do, and that's why we are better defensively than most other teams.

Though, I really don't know if this is true or not. I just kind of assumed since we are always good on defense.

kingkulsteel
05-07-2009, 09:39 PM
Its simple if your a Ben hater you aren't much of a steeler fan and certainly don't enjoy the super bowls if you are a ben hater you have no reason to celebrate because with every win you look dumber

devilsdancefloor
05-07-2009, 11:21 PM
Mostly Bungal fans in my area and they think Palmer is better than Big Ben. :rofl:

he is at eating hotdogs

http://img28.picoodle.com/img/img28/2/5/7/gumby12001/f_carsondogm_8707930.jpg

MDSteel15
05-07-2009, 11:49 PM
We should bench Ben and see if Kordell or Tomczack are available. :chuckle:

I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

steelwall
05-07-2009, 11:58 PM
he is at eating hotdogs

http://img28.picoodle.com/img/img28/2/5/7/gumby12001/f_carsondogm_8707930.jpg

:toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny: :toofunny:

chucoblack&gold
05-08-2009, 12:07 AM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

:pity:

Steelers & I
05-08-2009, 12:11 AM
Fact: We didn't win squat for more than a quarter century, despite having great running games and kick-ass defenses for the better part of Cowher's tenure (1994, 1995 and 2001 especially). All of a sudden since Ben's arrival in 2004, we've picked up 2 more Lombardis.

Coincidence? Think not. If we truly could stick any schmuck behind center and win SBs due to having a dominant defense and running game, we'd be working on Lombardi #10 or #11 instead of #7 right now. :coffee:

I've said the exact same thing to a buddy of mine. I've even wished that Roethlisberger would have been drafted by the Steelers way back in 1992. Although he would be long retired by now, just think how many Super Bowls that he and Cowher would have won. 5, maybe even 6, who knows???

Steelers & I
05-08-2009, 12:18 AM
I HATED Roger Staubach, I HATED John Elway, I HATED Steve Young, and I HATE Tom Brady but I'm not foolish enough to say that they're over rated.

Ben Roethlisberger haters hate because he's the man, that's all.

Galax Steeler
05-08-2009, 03:35 AM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

No way :toofunny:

StainlessStill
05-08-2009, 05:43 AM
He responsed, and this was his ludicrous response.

That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard. If Manning had that defense, he'd have 5 or 6 rings by now. Roethlisberger is an average QB. Takes a brilliant person to ride a crotch rocket without a helmet. What a dumbass.

And I watch Pittsburgh play almost every week, unfortunately, because I'm too cheap to buy a dish. If Pittsburgh hadn't been so stupid and not drafted Marino, they would have won rings in the 80's instead of being a joke in that decade.

P.S Are you gonna go to Santonio Holmes' arraignment? I'm sure there'll be lots of Steeler fans there, watching their Super Bowl MVP, getting his ass slapped for being a drug thug. Classy stuff. What a loser.

Put that in YOUR blowhole.

I was happy enough to reply back to him:

My Reply: Weak.

Manning is nowhere near a better FOOTBALL player when being compared to Big Ben. You want to play that kind of game? Fine.. if Ben had the offensive line that Peyton Manning or Tom Brady has, then he would be far above, better than the rest. Put Tom Brady or Manning behind a line like the Steelers (who give up 45+ a year), and I bet they fail as much as you failed to make a worthy statement. Manning or Brady RARELY get sacked, and at times, has AT LEAST 5-6 seconds to release the football down field. If one of them gets their jersey dirty, they are off to the races bitching to the first receiver/ref they see.

What Holmes/Roethlisberger do OFF the field is not the focus of this debate. Try again.

Watch this short clip. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Z5dqelV_8s&feature=related

After this, tell me how 'average' this looks to you. (These plays aren't even CLOSE to the unbelievable plays he makes week in and out.)

I say stick to mowing grass, because obviously your sports smack is moronic.

He Responded AGAIN saying:

I say you're a typical Steeler fan. Ben sucks. It's OK to admit it.

Then I ended it with : My work here is done. lmao.

I love it, damn pansy. HERE WE GO STEELERS, HERE WE GO!!!!:helmet:

stlrtruck
05-08-2009, 06:35 AM
:pity:

It's the water he's drinking :toofunny:

fansince'76
05-08-2009, 07:59 AM
I say you're a typical Steeler fan. Ben sucks. It's OK to admit it.

My only question is why waste so much time responding to someone who's about 12 years old? :hunch:

X-Terminator
05-08-2009, 10:06 AM
Gotta go with the consensus here. Why waste your time arguing with that idiot? Let him continue to believe that Ben sucks, meanwhile he'll just keep on putting rings on his fingers.

It's jealousy, that's all there is to it. Because if that moron had Ben on his team and they were winning championships, you wouldn't hear one word about how much he "sucks."

vasteeler
05-08-2009, 10:17 AM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

put the glass pipe down and step away from the computer:doh:

StainlessStill
05-08-2009, 03:36 PM
My only question is why waste so much time responding to someone who's about 12 years old? :hunch:

I don't care if he was 9 years old, point is.. I'm not letting anyone get away with saying that shit and corrupting other people who DON'T KNOW, and making them think that's all truth to his game. That's my job to stand up for my team, period. It didn't take me long anyway, maybe 5-8 minutes tops.

Ricco Suavez
05-08-2009, 10:44 PM
It can be easy to be a "hater". I see Tom Brady and see the QB of a team I loathe, but I try not to lose sight of what is a very gifted player. I hear the line why argue and I tend to agree, you will never change a true hater's opinion. But let's not forget that last year, in the middle of a 12- 4 season there was a lot of talk on this board of replacing Big Ben with Lefty. Talk by some longtime members not trolling crap stirrers. I made the argument that fantasy football had ruined fans perception of what quality QB play was. then. I guess what i am trying to say is this, Those who hate Ben will never be swayed by words, stats, or intelligent banter, Those who love Ben will just have to smile and enjoy the ride, and quite possibly 2-3 or even more championships.

SteelersTilIDie
05-08-2009, 10:48 PM
Great response LOL but do u really think he's a wayyyyyyyyyy better football player than Brady and manning cause IMO Brady is the best in the business

StainlessStill
05-08-2009, 11:23 PM
Great response LOL but do u really think he's a wayyyyyyyyyy better football player than Brady and manning cause IMO Brady is the best in the business

Your damn right I think he's a better football player than Manning and Brady, and you got to realize the words being used in this cause.

FOOTBALL PLAYER. Of course, Manning and Brady will win the Mechanical Quarterback battle against Ben any day of the week, but when things break down, and when things start to look rough during a breakdown, Ben has what you call "Football Instinct" and his instinct is to lower his shoulder/stiff arm to an opposing player, get free, either find an open man down field, or take off to get extra yardage. Manning or Brady in this situation will take an easy sack and fall to the ground, or chuck the ball out of bounds and live another day. Ben goes for the cheese on every play, and that is just the FOOTBALL player in him, period. To this day, I will take Ben over Peyton or Brady in a heartbeat.

steelerguy26
05-09-2009, 01:45 AM
I will take Big Ben over Manning and Brady everyday. Why you ask well...

Manning is a great technical QB he can pick most defense's apart on any given Sunday. BUT he has one huge flaw. Its the 3-4 defense and the pass rush. The Chargers exposed it a few years back and the Steelers have feed off it ever since.

You send the heat after Manning and he falls flat on his face. He gets out of rythem and starts to act human. You have to get to him though, just pressuring him can hurt more then help a defense. Hit him a few times, he will crack.

Brady is the product of a system. A great system yes. But I put him in the same catagory as Warner. He needs timing to be perfect, for plays to work. Bump his WR's and knock his ass down a few times and you will throw him out of whack. The Giants proved that by gutting that 19-0 season.

He also no longer has the same advantage that won him three rings. Say what you want but while Belicheat was stealing defensive signals via video tapping Brady did great. The league stops his cheating ways and the Giants expose his beloved QB.

Both Manning and Brady are great passers but both have the same flaws and neither can win when their timing is out of whack due to a great pass rush. You blitz them, drop them a few times and knock their WR's out of their routes and they get exposed.

Ben on the other hand thrives when plays break down. He reminds me of John Elway who was at his best when playing back yard football. Plus he has the IT factor and is quickly becoming one of the best 4th quarter come from behind QB's of all time.

Yup I take Big Ben any day over every other QB in the league.

Steelers & I
05-09-2009, 05:49 AM
I agree with both Stainless Steel and Steelerguy. Great points made by both of you. :drink:

In my opinion, I would accept Joe Montana, "in his prime", as THE ONLY viable replacement for Ben Roethlisberger.

St33lersguy
05-09-2009, 08:53 AM
That guy talked exactly like the left wing cooks in the media, just saying stuff he wants to say with no knowledge to support his statement, and you told him off, great job

Hammer67
05-09-2009, 10:11 AM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!


Actually, I don't. You look at those Steelers teams in the late 90's. The Defense was always dominant, we had kick ass receiving corps, and Bettis was in his prime. How did we not win any SB's???? The quarterback play, especially in the clutch, was bad.

Ben is a winner and is the main reason this franchise won 2 SB's the last 4 years...we have ALWAYS had a great defense...

fansince'76
05-09-2009, 12:52 PM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

Methinks someone forgets how bad of a QB Kordell really was. Shitty QB play at the most crucial moments is why Cowher left Pittsburgh with only one ring instead of three or four. We'd have fared no better this past season with the "AFCCG pick machine" behind center than we did in '97 or '01 - probably MUCH worse, actually, as I doubt the six come-from-behind victories late in games that Ben engineered for us this past year would have happened if Kordell was still our QB. On top of that, our OL was about ten times better then than it is now (anybody remember the deer in the headlights look Kordell got and how he'd stare at the rush instead of looking downfield for an open receiver when he was under a heavy rush?) and our offense relies much more heavily on the passing game now than when he was here. No, I think it's quite safe to say we'd still be stuck on four Lombardis and counting if we'd have had Kordell behind center the last five years instead of Ben.

St33lersguy
05-09-2009, 02:47 PM
I don't know about anybody else, but I think Kordell would have won a couple titles with this same team!

Kordell sucked. He was the only reason the steelers did not win it all in 97 and 01. Had big ben been on the 94, 95, 97, and 01 teams the steelers would have 10 superbowl wins by now

StainlessStill
05-09-2009, 05:39 PM
Kordell sucked. He was the only reason the steelers did not win it all in 97 and 01. Had big ben been on the 94, 95, 97, and 01 teams the steelers would have 10 superbowl wins by now

I disagree, I don't think he sucked. You don't lead your team to 2 AFC Title games, and suck. He was just unfortunate to be the Steelers Quarterback at a very unfortunate time.

'97 was his best year to take us to the dance, but obviously we fell short, and even though he threw horrid picks, he was far from the problem. Coaching staff cost us that game and they shouldn't have put all the baggage on Kordell to win it esp. how the Bus was tearin' it up. Horrid coaching from all angles cost us that game, hands down.

The years after that, was a rebuilding process, and we were just BAAAAD as a team OVERALL. Kordell went through multiple years of different offensive coordinators, and Quarterback coaches, all lasting for only a season or two. You can't expect a young QB to go through all that on a rebuilding team and have success. He was dealt with wrong, and he paid for it.

He always had to look over his shoulder, and was benched multiple times in the process, so he didn't have a chance after the ;97 season. '00 was a great year and his presence alone got the job done, and in '01, even though he had a shot to win/tie the game against N.E, Special Teams put us in that bind, and single handily, lost that game. Kordell is an easy finger to point to, but with better handling with him as a young QB, I think he could have been better and got over the hump to taking us to a Superbowl.

steel striker
05-09-2009, 05:53 PM
I still think when it was crunch time Stewart folded like a lawn chair. Where Ben really makes big plays when we need it most. Another thing is people forget when we won in 2005 Ben was a big part of that in the playoffs, and I know he had a bad super bowl that year. We would not have got there without his great play against the bengals, colts, and broncos. I'll this past super bowl victory speak for itself.

fansince'76
05-09-2009, 06:13 PM
I disagree, I don't think he sucked. You don't lead your team to 2 AFC Title games, and suck. He was just unfortunate to be the Steelers Quarterback at a very unfortunate time.

'97 was his best year to take us to the dance, but obviously we fell short, and even though he threw horrid picks, he was far from the problem. Coaching staff cost us that game and they shouldn't have put all the baggage on Kordell to win it esp. how the Bus was tearin' it up. Horrid coaching from all angles cost us that game, hands down.

The years after that, was a rebuilding process, and we were just BAAAAD as a team OVERALL. Kordell went through multiple years of different offensive coordinators, and Quarterback coaches, all lasting for only a season or two. You can't expect a young QB to go through all that on a rebuilding team and have success. He was dealt with wrong, and he paid for it.

He always had to look over his shoulder, and was benched multiple times in the process, so he didn't have a chance after the ;97 season. '00 was a great year and his presence alone got the job done, and in '01, even though he had a shot to win/tie the game against N.E, Special Teams put us in that bind, and single handily, lost that game. Kordell is an easy finger to point to, but with better handling with him as a young QB, I think he could have been better and got over the hump to taking us to a Superbowl.

Sorry, gotta disagree. The only mistake Cowher made with him, IMO, was keep him as the starter for as long as he did. Maybe if he could have had only one QB coach from the get-go, he might have eventually stopped telegraphing his passes, started standing up to heavy rushes and finding a receiver downfield instead of staring them down like a deer in the headlights, and he might have even finally got some semblance of a clue as to how to read a defense, but I don't see how anyone could have improved his passing accuracy, of which he had next to none. We got to two AFCCGs in spite of Kordell, not because of him. Bottom line, Kordell was simply not a NFL QB.

StainlessStill
05-09-2009, 10:42 PM
Sorry, gotta disagree. The only mistake Cowher made with him, IMO, was keep him as the starter for as long as he did. Maybe if he could have had only one QB coach from the get-go, he might have eventually stopped telegraphing his passes, started standing up to heavy rushes and finding a receiver downfield instead of staring them down like a deer in the headlights, and he might have even finally got some semblance of a clue as to how to read a defense, but I don't see how anyone could have improved his passing accuracy, of which he had next to none. We got to two AFCCGs in spite of Kordell, not because of him. Bottom line, Kordell was simply not a NFL QB.

Years after the '97 season, the Steelers wanted Kordell to be more of a pocket passer rather that be the player that he is and that took him out of his element. Kordell was more of an athlete rather than a pure passer, and the playbook was more around Bettis's ability rather than Kordell's. It can be debatable, but you can't argue what could of been and when it comes down to it, Kordell failed as a Quarterback, and that's a shame because he had talent that pro's dream of having.

steelwall
05-09-2009, 11:20 PM
Sorry, gotta disagree. The only mistake Cowher made with him, IMO, was keep him as the starter for as long as he did. Maybe if he could have had only one QB coach from the get-go, he might have eventually stopped telegraphing his passes, started standing up to heavy rushes and finding a receiver downfield instead of staring them down like a deer in the headlights, and he might have even finally got some semblance of a clue as to how to read a defense, but I don't see how anyone could have improved his passing accuracy, of which he had next to none. We got to two AFCCGs in spite of Kordell, not because of him. Bottom line, Kordell was simply not a NFL QB.


You said it. :thumbsup: I watched every single game Kordell played. If it was just an unfortunate situation for him then he would not have faded into obscurity on other teams rosters. He was on a dam good team when he was here. I don't see how anyone who watched those games could have not been thinking "if we had a decent QB we'd probably be undefeated"...

Edman
05-09-2009, 11:52 PM
Kordell didn't entirely suck, but when it came to crunch time in big playoff games, he was horrendous.

The 2001 game was lost on our horrible special teams, but we still had several shots to win it. Korkie threw crippling interceptions on the final two Steeler drives of that game and three INT's for the whole game.

Teams keyed on the Steelers run game in the playoffs because the coaches knew that our passing game wasn't going to scare anyone, or we had the QB that couldn't get the job done. If Kordell was our QB in the AFCC against the Rats where our running game was once again shut down, he would've had 2 or more interceptions in his statline. He just wasn't an NFL QB.

fansince'76
05-10-2009, 01:07 AM
Years after the '97 season, the Steelers wanted Kordell to be more of a pocket passer rather that be the player that he is and that took him out of his element. Kordell was more of an athlete rather than a pure passer, and the playbook was more around Bettis's ability rather than Kordell's. It can be debatable, but you can't argue what could of been and when it comes down to it, Kordell failed as a Quarterback, and that's a shame because he had talent that pro's dream of having.

IMO, he had more of a WR skillset as far as the NFL goes, so in that respect, it was tragic his career was pretty much wasted at QB due to his pigheaded and stubborn insistence on trying to play that position. You're right, he was mishandled - someone (namely Cowher) should have sat him down and told him he was staying in his "slash" role and if he wanted to stay on the roster, it would be as a WR, whether he liked it or not, instead of going along with the charade and keeping him at QB. He did have a ton of athletic talent, much like Vick, and if I were a NFL HC, I wouldn't put Vick behind center knowing what I know about him either.

tony hipchest
05-10-2009, 01:51 AM
Sorry, gotta disagree. The only mistake Cowher made with him, IMO, was keep him as the starter for as long as he did. Maybe if he could have had only one QB coach from the get-go, he might have eventually stopped telegraphing his passes, started standing up to heavy rushes and finding a receiver downfield instead of staring them down like a deer in the headlights, and he might have even finally got some semblance of a clue as to how to read a defense, but I don't see how anyone could have improved his passing accuracy, of which he had next to none. We got to two AFCCGs in spite of Kordell, not because of him. Bottom line, Kordell was simply not a NFL QB.cowher didnt even employ a qb coach on his staff until like 2001.

i think it was tom clements, and im pretty sure he turned kordell into a pro-bowler and league mvp runner up.

up until that point every other team had a qb coach except for the steelers. i dont know if it was cowhers or the rooneys call to be the only team to not provide their qb's with a coach, but it was years behind the times and proved to be costly.

kordell coulda been a much beter player had he had a position coach for his first 5 years. by the time he got one, it was too late, thanks to the 01 playoff loss.

bobby april also took the heat for that loss and was fired. bobby april was named the ST Coach of the Year for the bills in 08. :noidea:

fansince'76
05-10-2009, 02:16 AM
cowher didnt even employ a qb coach on his staff until like 2001.

i think it was tom clements, and im pretty sure he turned kordell into a pro-bowler and league mvp runner up.

up until that point every other team had a qb coach except for the steelers. i dont know if it was cowhers or the rooneys call to be the only team to not provide their qb's with a coach, but it was years behind the times and proved to be costly.

kordell coulda been a much beter player had he had a position coach for his first 5 years. by the time he got one, it was too late, thanks to the 01 playoff loss.

bobby april also took the heat for that loss and was fired. bobby april was named the ST Coach of the Year for the bills in 08. :noidea:

Fair enough, but he got to the Pro Bowl in 2001 with a #1 rushing attack, a #1 defense and on the strength of 14 TD passes against 11 INTs for the season, an 81.7 passer rating and a passing offense that ranked 20th in the league. Ben had similar kinds of numbers this past season and people here were crucifying him for most of the season over it, and let's face it, for the most part it was a down season for him despite the SB win, especially after the way he lit it up in '07. Yet Kordell was NFL MVP runner-up for the same kind of season? I don't think there's any mistaking what got us to 13-3 in 2001, but it mostly wasn't Kordell's passing. And I'd have loved to have seen what Ben could have done with not one, but two possessions in the last 4 minutes of the '01 AFCCG trailing by 7. I strongly doubt he throws two picks in that situation like Kordell did.

steelwall
05-10-2009, 02:22 AM
He might have gotten better in 01, but the fact is he stank it up in 02 so bad he was replaced by Maddox around the first part of that season.

Maybe he would have been better had he had a QB coach from jump street but IMO, I don't think so.

St33lersguy
05-10-2009, 10:01 AM
I disagree, I don't think he sucked. You don't lead your team to 2 AFC Title games, and suck. He was just unfortunate to be the Steelers Quarterback at a very unfortunate time.

'97 was his best year to take us to the dance, but obviously we fell short, and even though he threw horrid picks, he was far from the problem. Coaching staff cost us that game and they shouldn't have put all the baggage on Kordell to win it esp. how the Bus was tearin' it up. Horrid coaching from all angles cost us that game, hands down.

The years after that, was a rebuilding process, and we were just BAAAAD as a team OVERALL. Kordell went through multiple years of different offensive coordinators, and Quarterback coaches, all lasting for only a season or two. You can't expect a young QB to go through all that on a rebuilding team and have success. He was dealt with wrong, and he paid for it.

He always had to look over his shoulder, and was benched multiple times in the process, so he didn't have a chance after the ;97 season. '00 was a great year and his presence alone got the job done, and in '01, even though he had a shot to win/tie the game against N.E, Special Teams put us in that bind, and single handily, lost that game. Kordell is an easy finger to point to, but with better handling with him as a young QB, I think he could have been better and got over the hump to taking us to a Superbowl.

He rode the backs of a strong supporting cast to the title game then proceeded to choke. he threw horrendous passes in both games. Kordell had no leadership skills. Imagine how bad he had been if he played behind our current OL.

bigjamesharrison2
05-10-2009, 02:53 PM
He rode the backs of a strong supporting cast to the title game then proceeded to choke. he threw horrendous passes in both games. Kordell had no leadership skills. Imagine how bad he had been if he played behind our current OL.

He would have been horrid...his nickname would have been more like Crash than Slash

Hammer67
05-11-2009, 02:40 PM
Fair enough, but he got to the Pro Bowl in 2001 with a #1 rushing attack, a #1 defense and on the strength of 14 TD passes against 11 INTs for the season, an 81.7 passer rating and a passing offense that ranked 20th in the league. Ben had similar kinds of numbers this past season and people here were crucifying him for most of the season over it, and let's face it, for the most part it was a down season for him despite the SB win, especially after the way he lit it up in '07. Yet Kordell was NFL MVP runner-up for the same kind of season? I don't think there's any mistaking what got us to 13-3 in 2001, but it mostly wasn't Kordell's passing. And I'd have loved to have seen what Ben could have done with not one, but two possessions in the last 4 minutes of the '01 AFCCG trailing by 7. I strongly doubt he throws two picks in that situation like Kordell did.


And, Kordell's undoing was his stubborness in wanting to be a QB. If he would have accepted the WR or Slash role, they would have been better off, and his career would be more fondly remembered.

tony hipchest
05-11-2009, 04:37 PM
He might have gotten better in 01, but the fact is he stank it up in 02 so bad he was replaced by Maddox around the first part of that season.

Maybe he would have been better had he had a QB coach from jump street but IMO, I don't think so.no? the numbers say different.

Fair enough, but he got to the Pro Bowl in 2001 with a #1 rushing attack, a #1 defense and on the strength of 14 TD passes against 11 INTs for the season, an 81.7 passer rating and a passing offense that ranked 20th in the league. Ben had similar kinds of numbers this past season and people here were crucifying him for most of the season over it, and let's face it, for the most part it was a down season for him despite the SB win, especially after the way he lit it up in '07. Yet Kordell was NFL MVP runner-up for the same kind of season? I don't think there's any mistaking what got us to 13-3 in 2001, but it mostly wasn't Kordell's passing. And I'd have loved to have seen what Ben could have done with not one, but two possessions in the last 4 minutes of the '01 AFCCG trailing by 7. I strongly doubt he throws two picks in that situation like Kordell did.i think i got mixed up. favre beat kordell for league mvp so it had to be in '97 when favre won 3 in a row and kordell had 21 passing td's an 11 rushing. not to be a total kordell homer but i wanna keep it fair in regards to having a positional coach.

kordells 2001 season was his 1st pro-bowl i believe. sure they had the #20 passing offense but they had the #3 offense overall. jerome did his part (leading the league in rushing until the minnesota game) but kordell was the second leading rusher i believe, with 537 on a career high 96 attempts and adding 5 td's.

w/o t. clements he was a career 55% or below passer with 1 season at 58%.

1st year with a coach= 60.2 % and a career high 7 ypa.
2nd year = 65.7% and matching 7 ypa

both years were his 2 highest years in passer rating. the next year he went to the bears to learn yet another new system (shoops hike 'n run) and completely sucked his way out of the league.

the evidence says he needed a coach especially since the nfl had advanced to a point where all other teams had one for their starting qb's. cowher did his starters a diservice IMO and in the end his starters ended up doing him a diservice. it came back to bite him as witnessed with odonnell in the sb.

a qb coach helps the wr's and qb get on the same page as opposed to having the OC do it all.

StainlessStill
05-12-2009, 06:11 AM
no? the numbers say different.

i think i got mixed up. favre beat kordell for league mvp so it had to be in '97 when favre won 3 in a row and kordell had 21 passing td's an 11 rushing. not to be a total kordell homer but i wanna keep it fair in regards to having a positional coach.

kordells 2001 season was his 1st pro-bowl i believe. sure they had the #20 passing offense but they had the #3 offense overall. jerome did his part (leading the league in rushing until the minnesota game) but kordell was the second leading rusher i believe, with 537 on a career high 96 attempts and adding 5 td's.

w/o t. clements he was a career 55% or below passer with 1 season at 58%.

1st year with a coach= 60.2 % and a career high 7 ypa.
2nd year = 65.7% and matching 7 ypa

both years were his 2 highest years in passer rating. the next year he went to the bears to learn yet another new system (shoops hike 'n run) and completely sucked his way out of the league.

the evidence says he needed a coach especially since the nfl had advanced to a point where all other teams had one for their starting qb's. cowher did his starters a diservice IMO and in the end his starters ended up doing him a diservice. it came back to bite him as witnessed with odonnell in the sb.

a qb coach helps the wr's and qb get on the same page as opposed to having the OC do it all.

Everything comes full circle. Without Kordell, we don't have Maddox, and without Maddox.. we don't have Ben. All those years of not having the home run at Quarterback, it forced us to go after a QB eventually in round 1, and fortunately for us, Ben fell # 11 right on our lap and just at the right time.

I remembered I wanted CB Dunta Robinson who went to the Texans before us because our 2003 defensive backs were so putrid, I couldn't keep down my food. My dad kept saying before the draft " If they don't take that Roethlisberger kid, I'm done." The rest is history! :tt02:

The_WARDen
05-13-2009, 12:59 PM
Everything comes full circle. Without Kordell, we don't have Maddox, and without Maddox.. we don't have Ben. All those years of not having the home run at Quarterback, it forced us to go after a QB eventually in round 1, and fortunately for us, Ben fell # 11 right on our lap and just at the right time.

I remembered I wanted CB Dunta Robinson who went to the Texans before us because our 2003 defensive backs were so putrid, I couldn't keep down my food. My dad kept saying before the draft " If they don't take that Roethlisberger kid, I'm done." The rest is history! :tt02:

I agree. I thank Kordell...because of his ineptitude we now have a true QB and great leader...not a whiner who cries on the sideline.