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SteelCityKing
07-15-2009, 04:38 PM
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d8114beb2/Top-5-Coaches

not a bad list. but i am REALLY tired of people slobberin' all over the Patriots again. they don't have Matt Cassell. so, they aren't going to do what they did last year. yeah, they got Tom Brady, but obviously he didn't play last year. so, they are focusing on what the Patriots did 2 years ago...go undefeated and lose the Super Bowl. it's just a little frustrating.

steelreserve
07-15-2009, 04:55 PM
Ahh well. At least it's a little different this year now that Dungy retired. Pretty much every list like this for the past several years would go:

1. Belichick
2. Dungy
3. Bill Parcells when he's not retired, Mike Shanahan when he is
4. Whichever flavor-of-the-month NFC team made the Super Bowl last year, only to fall flat this season
5. Whichever flavor-of-the-month team came back from 5-11 to make the playoffs last year, only to fall flat this season

SteelCityKing
07-15-2009, 05:02 PM
i would put Dungy over Belichick anyday. for sure.

i'm honestly stoked that Tomlin made the list. but he's aready snagged some accolades in his young career and he's going to do very well in the future. i bet he'll out tenure Cowher.

T.Richardson
07-15-2009, 06:00 PM
I know im probably going to get dirty looks, like SteelCityKings avatar, but...

I like Tomlin as a coach much better than Cowher. Tomlin got his first superbowl win in what? 2 years? IT took Cowher almost 15 years? SO yea, I say Tomlin>Cowher right now.

BlastFurnace
07-15-2009, 07:04 PM
I know im probably going to get dirty looks, like SteelCityKings avatar, but...

I like Tomlin as a coach much better than Cowher. Tomlin got his first superbowl win in what? 2 years? IT took Cowher almost 15 years? SO yea, I say Tomlin>Cowher right now.

Give Cowher a QB like Ben for the first 10 years of his coaching tenure, and we have 3 or 4 more rings.

Preacher
07-15-2009, 07:27 PM
I know im probably going to get dirty looks, like SteelCityKings avatar, but...

I like Tomlin as a coach much better than Cowher. Tomlin got his first superbowl win in what? 2 years? IT took Cowher almost 15 years? SO yea, I say Tomlin>Cowher right now.

Give Cowher a QB like Ben for the first 10 years of his coaching tenure, and we have 3 or 4 more rings.

But that is the point. Cowher did not put the emphasis on QB that was needed. His emphasis was on the run game. As long as you had the dominant RB and Running game line, he thought you only needed an average QB to hand the ball off and throw it once in a while.

He himself admits that it was Tommy Maddox that finally changed his mind, that he saw what the pass game could do... though he got "enamored" with it. That is why they went back to the run in 04.

It wasn't until 05, 13 years after he started, that he finally figured out a balanced game win's SB's, and for that, you need at LEAST a pretty good QB.

Furthermore, he was a coach that would stick with players, and motivate them beyond their ability seemingly. Tomlin on the other hand, cares more about the ability and will put the best players out there regardless.

They both were tough disciplinarians . . . I think Holmes sits against the Giants no matter who coached last year.

All in all, I think as it sits now, i have to give the edge to Tomlin. And I LOVED Cowher, so that kinda surprises me.

Matter of facyt, i saw the water-boy again last night on TV, and loved Cowher sitting in the stands in the black and gold.

St33lersguy
07-15-2009, 10:04 PM
So Tomlin is the highest ranked coach among no-cheating coaches on that list. I will call Belichick the best cheating coach

SteelersMongol
07-15-2009, 10:45 PM
So Tomlin is the highest ranked coach among no-cheating coaches on that list. I will call Belichick the best cheating coach

:toofunny:

Hammer Of The GODS
07-15-2009, 11:35 PM
I WOULD LIKE TO SET BELICHEATS NARDS ON FIRE! :mad:


GD I HATE THE PATRIOTS!



.

revefsreleets
07-16-2009, 11:16 AM
BB as HC of the Cleveland Browns: 36-44
BB as the coach of the Patriots PRIOR to taping: 5-11

Total UNTAINTED record of Bill Belichick in the NFL: 41-55

Bill AFTER taping began: Who cares? It doesn't count. But 41-55 does NOT qualify him as the best coach in the NFL. It may make him one of the worst, though...

Steel Head
07-16-2009, 11:24 AM
Dungy is retired

steelreserve
07-16-2009, 11:39 AM
Give Cowher a QB like Ben for the first 10 years of his coaching tenure, and we have 3 or 4 more rings.

Either that, or he would've won one Super Bowl and then gone on siesta until we let him go. There's precedent to my theory.

Ishkabibble
07-19-2009, 07:55 PM
How much more sleep are you gonna lose over this guy? Didn't the Steelers just win a ring, or something?

The Patriot
07-19-2009, 08:33 PM
Old Willy won 11 games with Matt Cassel. I doubt the Chiefs will.

KeiselPower99
07-19-2009, 09:11 PM
Cassell will win 4 games this year then be benched for Thiegpen.

Galax Steeler
07-20-2009, 04:55 AM
Bellicheat and the patriots.:jerkit:

revefsreleets
07-20-2009, 10:15 AM
The Pats 2008 SOS was .387, LAST in the league.

Steelers was .598, STRONGEST in the league.

This years the Pats SOS is .590, third in the league. Let's see how they do without cheating, and actually playing a challenging schedule for a change. They also face some real competition in their own division which is also a real change.

The_WARDen
07-20-2009, 10:32 AM
The Pats 2008 SOS was .387, LAST in the league.

Steelers was .598, STRONGEST in the league.

This years the Pats SOS is .590, third in the league. Let's see how they do without cheating, and actually playing a challenging schedule for a change. They also face some real competition in their own division which is also a real change.

Ya mean they don't play the AFC West, NFC West and have 3 donkeys in their own division to boot?

WOW! I'm sure Goodell fired the person that made their schedule...surprised there hasn't been an "update" to the schedule.

revefsreleets
07-20-2009, 11:20 AM
I look at that schedule, and can't see them winning more than 10 games this year, possibly 11 (especially if the informal league mandate prohibiting the officials from calling offensive holding on their line is still in effect), and getting dumped in the divisional round of the playoffs.

What a lovely thing it's be if it was the Steelers that dumped them...

The Patriot
07-20-2009, 03:01 PM
I look at that schedule, and can't see them winning more than 10 games this year, possibly 11 (especially if the informal league mandate prohibiting the officials from calling offensive holding on their line is still in effect), and getting dumped in the divisional round of the playoffs.

What a lovely thing it's be if it was the Steelers that dumped them...

List the 6 teams we will lose to.

1) Bills
2) Jets
3) Falcons
4) Ravens
5) Broncos
6) Titans
7) Buccaneers
8) Bye
9) Dolphins
10) Colts
11) Jets
12) Saints
13) Dolphins
14) Panthers
15) Bills
16) Jaguars
17) Texans

The_WARDen
07-20-2009, 03:06 PM
List the 6 teams we will lose to.

1) Bills
2) Jets
3) Falcons
4) Ravens
5) Broncos
6) Titans
7) Buccaneers
8) Bye
9) Dolphins
10) Colts
11) Jets
12) Saints
13) Dolphins
14) Panthers
15) Bills
16) Jaguars
17) Texans

Ravens, Titans, Dolphins, Colts, Falcons, Panthers and Bye.
:popcorn:

revefsreleets
07-20-2009, 03:11 PM
List the 6 teams we will lose to.

1) Bills
2) Jets
3) Falcons
4) Ravens
5) Broncos
6) Titans
7) Buccaneers
8) Bye
9) Dolphins
10) Colts
11) Jets
12) Saints
13) Dolphins
14) Panthers
15) Bills
16) Jaguars
17) Texans

There's that bandwagon Patriot fan arrogance we've all come to expect and love:blah:

I'd say the games you could possibly lose include:
Bills (either game)
Falcons
Ravens
Titans
Dolphins (either game)
Colts
Saints
Panthers
Jaguars
and maybe even the Buccaneers.

But I say you only lose 6 of these contests. Brady is still a very good system QB even if he doesn't know what play the defense has called, and they did make some upgrades to their defense. They are a playoff caliber team in 2009, but that's all.

The Patriot
07-20-2009, 05:35 PM
There's that bandwagon Patriot fan arrogance we've all come to expect and love:blah:

I'd say the games you could possibly lose include:
Bills (either game)
Falcons
Ravens
Titans
Dolphins (either game)
Colts
Saints
Panthers
Jaguars
and maybe even the Buccaneers.

But I say you only lose 6 of these contests. Brady is still a very good system QB even if he doesn't know what play the defense has called, and they did make some upgrades to their defense. They are a playoff caliber team in 2009, but that's all.

So you have only three teams we are certain to beat.. Doesn't really sound playoff caliber. According to you this is our weakest team since 2002, but I'll take that bet.

RoethlisBURGHer
07-20-2009, 05:47 PM
List the 6 teams we will lose to.

1) Bills
2) Jets
3) Falcons
4) Ravens
5) Broncos
6) Titans
7) Buccaneers
8) Bye
9) Dolphins
10) Colts
11) Jets
12) Saints
13) Dolphins
14) Panthers
15) Bills
16) Jaguars
17) Texans

One to the Phins, one to the Jets, Falcons, Colts, Panthers. I say you lose those five.

Titans, Saints, Ravens, and one against the Bills are all possibilities also.

The Patriot
07-20-2009, 06:28 PM
One to the Phins, one to the Jets, Falcons, Colts, Panthers. I say you lose those five.

Titans, Saints, Ravens, and one against the Bills are all possibilities also.

I see two divisional losses, one to either the Colts or Titans, and one more (allowing an off game).

Falcons... not a chance

RoethlisBURGHer
07-20-2009, 06:31 PM
I see two divisional losses, one to either the Colts or Titans, and one more (allowing an off game).

And then at Pittsburgh in the playoffs. :tt03:

revefsreleets
07-21-2009, 09:37 AM
So you have only three teams we are certain to beat.. Doesn't really sound playoff caliber. According to you this is our weakest team since 2002, but I'll take that bet. Actually, there isn't sure bet on the schedule...but then again, there rarely is in the NFL.

I said you'd win 10-11 games and make the playoffs, lose in the divisional round. Now, if Brady just ain't the same, and a few early losses take their toll, I expect things could go south fast, as there are several players of questionable character on that team who could implode and become locker room poison. A lot of fans in the league would be awfully sad if that were to happen to SUCH a classy team (insert sarcasm smiley here).

The Patriot
07-21-2009, 05:28 PM
Actually, there isn't sure bet on the schedule...but then again, there rarely is in the NFL.

I said you'd win 10-11 games and make the playoffs, lose in the divisional round. Now, if Brady just ain't the same, and a few early losses take their toll, I expect things could go south fast, as there are several players of questionable character on that team who could implode and become locker room poison. A lot of fans in the league would be awfully sad if that were to happen to SUCH a classy team (insert sarcasm smiley here).

Yeah, and, you know, everybody on the team could simultaneously spontaneously combust. I mean, you have to allow for every possibility.

The Patriot
07-21-2009, 05:31 PM
Ravens, Titans, Dolphins, Colts, Falcons, Panthers and Bye.
:popcorn:

Bye is tough year.

revefsreleets
07-22-2009, 09:43 AM
Yeah, and, you know, everybody on the team could simultaneously spontaneously combust. I mean, you have to allow for every possibility.

I'm sorry man, but the Patriots just aren't that great. They have a real schedule for a change, they are (presumably, although I'd put nothing past Beliprick) done cheating, which levels the playing field, Brady will most likely be tentative and less effective, the system that he thrives in has been exposed, and the league has evolved. Fan bravado and arrogance won't change a 10-6 or 11-5 season and elimination in the middle rounds of the playoffs.

fansince'76
07-22-2009, 12:52 PM
....Brady will most likely be tentative and less effective, the system that he thrives in has been exposed....

Thus the new rule change that was enacted, bearing his name no less, which will prohibit anyone from even breathing on him without drawing a 15-yarder. Not to mention the other rule change which will allow WRs like Welker to run over the middle without having to fear being made to pay for it, as Clark did last November.

Level playing field my ass. Every one of those rule changes that pussifies the game even more benefits them and penalizes physical defensive teams. :coffee:

revefsreleets
07-22-2009, 01:14 PM
Belichick: 41-55 prior to taping/stealing signals.

And that's a fact, Jack...

The Patriot
07-22-2009, 02:31 PM
Belichick: 41-55 prior to taping/stealing signals.

And that's a fact, Jack...

Belichick 27-5 after spygate, best in league.

The Patriot
07-22-2009, 02:35 PM
Thus the new rule change that was enacted, bearing his name no less, which will prohibit anyone from even breathing on him without drawing a 15-yarder. Not to mention the other rule change which will allow WRs like Welker to run over the middle without having to fear being made to pay for it, as Clark did last November.

Level playing field my ass. Every one of those rule changes that pussifies the game even more benefits them and penalizes physical defensive teams. :coffee:

Hey, you had a couple automatic first downs in that super bowl. Roughing the holder, was it?

revefsreleets
07-22-2009, 04:44 PM
Belichick 27-5 after spygate, best in league.


That says a lot, doesn't it? A coach that was 41-55 before he started cheating manages to go 27-5 AFTER he was "caught" by a sympathetic and friendly NFL commissioner.

Something is rotten in Foxboro...

The Patriot
07-22-2009, 06:09 PM
That says a lot, doesn't it? A coach that was 41-55 before he started cheating manages to go 27-5 AFTER he was "caught" by a sympathetic and friendly NFL commissioner.

Something is rotten in Foxboro...

Someone is bitter in Akron.

Someone won't yield to reason.

Someone's mind is performing spectacular mental gymnastics to belittle a formidable opponent's accomplishments, rather than just acknowledge them.

NJarhead
07-22-2009, 06:46 PM
It was a fumble. :whistle:

silver & black
07-22-2009, 08:59 PM
Ahh well. At least it's a little different this year now that Dungy retired. Pretty much every list like this for the past several years would go:

1. Belichick
2. Dungy
3. Bill Parcells when he's not retired, Mike Shanahan when he is
4. Whichever flavor-of-the-month NFC team made the Super Bowl last year, only to fall flat this season
5. Whichever flavor-of-the-month team came back from 5-11 to make the playoffs last year, only to fall flat this season


Shanahan my ass. He hasn't done shit since golden boy Elway retired. Extremely overrrated.

silver & black
07-22-2009, 09:03 PM
It was a fumble. :whistle:

You bet your ass it was! :thumbsup:

revefsreleets
07-23-2009, 11:22 AM
Someone is bitter in Akron.

Someone won't yield to reason.

Someone's mind is performing spectacular mental gymnastics to belittle a formidable opponent's accomplishments, rather than just acknowledge them.

"Mental gymnastics"?

I look at the facts. I see a shitty coach start cheating and have success. I see a mediocre team with a back-up college QB winning multiple super bowls. this is Occam's Razor, the simplest solution is correct: The Patriots had an unfair advantage that propelled them to undeserved success.

Let's break this down a little more. I think their competitive advantage pretty much ended last year. Whatever signals they stole, playbooks they pilfered, radio frequencies they monitored wore out in 2008. You look at their team, and what do you see? Another average QB succeeding in a super QB friendly system. Look at the schedule. Every quality team but one they played, they lost to, with the exception of the Cardinals (but that was a wake up call for Arizona as well). Sure they won 11 games, but look who they beat. KC, Jets, 49ers, Broncs, Rams, Bills (Twice) Dolphins (Phins were decent last year and they split with the Pats), Seahawks, Raiders, and Cards. Most of those teams were below .500.

The teams they couldn't beat? Colts, Chargers, Steelers, Dolphins and Bills...4 of those were playoff teams. So it pretty much bears out what I'm saying...they beat the shit bottom feeders, and lost to playoff quality teams. They don't have the luxury of playing the easiest schedule in the league this year.

Sorry, Charlie, but there is no way I'm going to acknowledge dishonesty, cheating and mediocrity.

Ishkabibble
07-23-2009, 02:13 PM
Uh, it's called a tuck RULE for a reason. Gotta gripe? Take in to Park Avenue in NYC.
Wonder how much the namesake of the Rooney Rule had to do with ESPN's embarrassing reluctance to report on the Roethlisbeger situation? Tony Zendejas (an NFL nothing compared to Roethlisberger) was alleged to have drugged & raped a woman last September. No criminal charges filed; a civil suit only, but ESPN sure as hell reported on that.
So ABC/Disney/ESPN reports on the one guy, who no one cares about, but not on the other guy? Then they absurdly state the reason they're not reporting Roethlisberger is because "no criminal chages have been filed"....only to have the Zendajas double-standard thrown back in their face. Compromised much?

The Patriot
07-23-2009, 04:18 PM
"Mental gymnastics"?

I look at the facts. I see a shitty coach start cheating and have success. I see a mediocre team with a back-up college QB winning multiple super bowls. this is Occam's Razor, the simplest solution is correct: The Patriots had an unfair advantage that propelled them to undeserved success.

Let's break this down a little more. I think their competitive advantage pretty much ended last year. Whatever signals they stole, playbooks they pilfered, radio frequencies they monitored wore out in 2008. You look at their team, and what do you see? Another average QB succeeding in a super QB friendly system. Look at the schedule. Every quality team but one they played, they lost to, with the exception of the Cardinals (but that was a wake up call for Arizona as well). Sure they won 11 games, but look who they beat. KC, Jets, 49ers, Broncs, Rams, Bills (Twice) Dolphins (Phins were decent last year and they split with the Pats), Seahawks, Raiders, and Cards. Most of those teams were below .500.

The teams they couldn't beat? Colts, Chargers, Steelers, Dolphins and Bills...4 of those were playoff teams. So it pretty much bears out what I'm saying...they beat the shit bottom feeders, and lost to playoff quality teams. They don't have the luxury of playing the easiest schedule in the league this year.

Sorry, Charlie, but there is no way I'm going to acknowledge dishonesty, cheating and mediocrity.

:sofunny::blah:
You're talking about a year where we lost our franchise player in the first game, yet we still went 11-5. That's all you can dish out: "You had an easy schedule".Dude, your team barely beat the 9-7 arizona cardinals, but that doesn't make your super bowl any lesser than any else. We all play NFL teams, so quit whining about who plays who.

The idea that a lousy coach could become a great coach by conning the entire sport with a simple camcorder is laughable. You have absolutely nothing on Seahawks fans. Their complaints are tame compared to this incessant lunacy.

fansince'76
07-23-2009, 04:22 PM
Wonder how much the namesake of the Rooney Rule had to do with ESPN's embarrassing reluctance to report on the Roethlisbeger situation? Tony Zendejas (an NFL nothing compared to Roethlisberger) was alleged to have drugged & raped a woman last September. No criminal charges filed; a civil suit only, but ESPN sure as hell reported on that.

So ABC/Disney/ESPN reports on the one guy, who no one cares about, but not on the other guy? Then they absurdly state the reason they're not reporting Roethlisberger is because "no criminal chages have been filed"....only to have the Zendajas double-standard thrown back in their face. Compromised much?

WTF does that have to do with anything? Bitter much? :coffee:

revefsreleets
07-23-2009, 04:35 PM
:sofunny::blah:
You're talking about a year where we lost our franchise player in the first game, yet we still went 11-5. That's all you can dish out: "You had an easy schedule".Dude, your team barely beat the 9-7 arizona cardinals, but that doesn't make your super bowl any lesser than any else. We all play NFL teams, so quit whining about who plays who.

The idea that a lousy coach could become a great coach by conning the entire sport with a simple camcorder is laughable. You have absolutely nothing on Seahawks fans. Their complaints are tame compared to this incessant lunacy.

I think it started with a camcorder...but the rabbit hole went much deeper than that before it was all over (radio frequencies, stolen playbooks, etc...). There were so many allegations it made the head spin...and it was so bad that the commissioner had no choice but to bury it all because there was no way to actually deal with all the ramifications that such deep rooted cheating and corruption wrought.

Anyway, I can see you're getting angry, which is predictable, but it's just facts, ma'am. The allegations of cheating surfaced circa 2001, which correspond exactly with this formerly awful coach suddenly winning.

I'm sorry, buddy, but the Pats just ain't all that. When the tires come off the bus, as they inevitably and invariably will (most likely next season, but perhaps as soon as 2009) you'll jump ship to another winning team like most Pats fans did in the first place and this will all be a moot point...in the meantime, is it really worth getting all fired up over?

Now that i think about it, is THAT why you post here? Scouting your next favorite team out?

One more thing. Look at these overall records:

41-55 pre-taping/cheating
112-35 after taping

He went from winning 42% of his games to winning 76% of his games because of....um....playing fair?

Please.

NJarhead
07-23-2009, 05:15 PM
Uh, it's called a tuck RULE for a reason. Gotta gripe? Take in to Park Avenue in NYC.
Wonder how much the namesake of the Rooney Rule had to do with ESPN's embarrassing reluctance to report on the Roethlisbeger situation? Tony Zendejas (an NFL nothing compared to Roethlisberger) was alleged to have drugged & raped a woman last September. No criminal charges filed; a civil suit only, but ESPN sure as hell reported on that.
So ABC/Disney/ESPN reports on the one guy, who no one cares about, but not on the other guy? Then they absurdly state the reason they're not reporting Roethlisberger is because "no criminal chages have been filed"....only to have the Zendajas double-standard thrown back in their face. Compromised much?

Get over yourself little fella. You have a beef with ESPN? Fine with me. Go tell THEM about it.

NJarhead
07-23-2009, 05:21 PM
Uh, it's called a tuck RULE for a reason. Gotta gripe? Take in to Park Avenue in NYC.
Wonder how much the namesake of the Rooney Rule had to do with ESPN's embarrassing reluctance to report on the Roethlisbeger situation? Tony Zendejas (an NFL nothing compared to Roethlisberger) was alleged to have drugged & raped a woman last September. No criminal charges filed; a civil suit only, but ESPN sure as hell reported on that.
So ABC/Disney/ESPN reports on the one guy, who no one cares about, but not on the other guy? Then they absurdly state the reason they're not reporting Roethlisberger is because "no criminal chages have been filed"....only to have the Zendajas double-standard thrown back in their face. Compromised much?

WTF does that have to do with anything? Bitter much? :coffee:

Definitely issues there 76.

....and...

IT WAS A FUMBLE!!!!!! :chuckle:

The Patriot
07-23-2009, 06:11 PM
I think it started with a camcorder...but the rabbit hole went much deeper than that before it was all over (radio frequencies, stolen playbooks, etc...). There were so many allegations it made the head spin...and it was so bad that the commissioner had no choice but to bury it all because there was no way to actually deal with all the ramifications that such deep rooted cheating and corruption wrought.

Anyway, I can see you're getting angry, which is predictable, but it's just facts, ma'am. The allegations of cheating surfaced circa 2001, which correspond exactly with this formerly awful coach suddenly winning.

I'm sorry, buddy, but the Pats just ain't all that. When the tires come off the bus, as they inevitably and invariably will (most likely next season, but perhaps as soon as 2009) you'll jump ship to another winning team like most Pats fans did in the first place and this will all be a moot point...in the meantime, is it really worth getting all fired up over?

Now that i think about it, is THAT why you post here? Scouting your next favorite team out?

One more thing. Look at these overall records:

41-55 pre-taping/cheating
112-35 after taping

He went from winning 42% of his games to winning 76% of his games because of....um....playing fair?

Please.

You wish you could make me angry. You'll have to do better than some weak patronization and the bandwagon insults.

Anybody can accuse anybody of anything. Accusations which never materialize are usually baseless. You just undermined your own argument.

Oh, and by the way...

Bush caused 9/11!!!
Al Gore won the election!!!!
The CIA took out JFK!!!
Roosevelt lured the Japanese to strike Pearl Harbor!!!
The government inserts memory chips in your ear!!!
:toofunny:
Oh, and ofcourse: Obama is a communist Arab!!!!!!!!!!!!

The Patriot
07-23-2009, 06:15 PM
IT WAS A FUMBLE!!!!!! :chuckle:

Yes, but Warner's was clearly an incomplete pass. No doubt the NFL had the referees favor the Steelers for some diabolical reason.

NJarhead
07-23-2009, 06:38 PM
Yes, but Warner's was clearly an incomplete pass. No doubt the NFL had the referees favor the Steelers for some diabolical reason.

Favoring you guys was beginning to get a little obvious. And besides, Brady was out for the year so they had to pick someone else.

revefsreleets
07-24-2009, 09:58 AM
41-55 before
112-35 after

And there's only one element of difference between the two.

It's too bad you've lost the ability to point a critical eye at your own team...but that has nothing to do with me...