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View Full Version : Yeah, I think we are broke!


SCSTILLER
08-25-2009, 06:31 AM
http://www.usdebtclock.org/

WOW, just flipping WOW! I am no financial wizard, but this is going to be tough to pay off.

revefsreleets
08-25-2009, 08:13 AM
This congress and President haven't stopped spending...not by a LONG shot.

One of the things that really stands out to me is the Medicare fraud, which is approaching 40 billion. Medicare has been referred to a LOT as a government run healthcare system that's really super great and efficient, and, I guess, compared to other government programs it is all those things, but compared to reality, or even a company like McDonald's it seems like a very corrupt and inefficient system. The scary thing is it is relatively small when contrasted against a true single payer system...it's really difficult to extrapolate just how amplified that fraud number may eventually end up being (not to mention the ramifications it will have on some of the other numbers on this site) if the Nancy Pelosi's of this World have their way.

HometownGal
08-25-2009, 08:24 AM
That is some scary stuff. :horror:

Awaiting the "PANIC" smiley from the left in 1, 2, 3. . . . .

steelwalls
08-25-2009, 08:36 AM
Come on... lets just "hope" things will "change"....

MACH1
08-25-2009, 12:12 PM
Yup...And just wait till the 644 trillion in toxic debts hit.

And according to Charles Payne the totals on the clock are very, very conservative.

X-Terminator
08-25-2009, 12:19 PM
I've been round and round on this already, but the bottom line is that if spending isn't checked, this country will either be bankrupt in 10 years, or tax rates will be through the roof. And before any liberal here even says it, yes, I know Obama inherited this debt. But his massive spending bills, whether they've been implemented or have been proposed, do nothing but make the problem that much worse. I'm tired of the government running on a "credit card" mentality. Time to start tightening the belt.

MACH1
08-25-2009, 12:33 PM
I've been round and round on this already, but the bottom line is that if spending isn't checked, this country will either be bankrupt in 10 years, or tax rates will be through the roof. And before any liberal here even says it, yes, I know Obama inherited this debt. But his massive spending bills, whether they've been implemented or have been proposed, do nothing but make the problem that much worse. I'm tired of the government running on a "credit card" mentality. Time to start tightening the belt.


What? Didn't you know that spending trillions will actually lower the deficit and create or save millions of jobs. :banging:

hindes204
08-25-2009, 12:38 PM
:willy::willy::willy:

Cmon, dont you guys know that this is just a right wing scare tactic...crazy coservative nutcases just panicking over nothing................right Tony

revefsreleets
08-25-2009, 02:38 PM
"We have to spend a lot of money to keep from going bankrupt"

< Joe Biden >

That's pretty much all you need to know about "Obamanomics"

Venom
08-25-2009, 03:37 PM
Change yes we can,,,,,,ummmmm NO he cant !!

7SteelGal43
08-25-2009, 04:06 PM
I've been round and round on this already, but the bottom line is that if spending isn't checked, this country will either be bankrupt in 10 years, or tax rates will be through the roof. And before any liberal here even says it, yes, I know Obama inherited this debt. But his massive spending bills, whether they've been implemented or have been proposed, do nothing but make the problem that much worse. I'm tired of the government running on a "credit card" mentality. Time to start tightening the belt.


Amen X, and what's really funny is when Washington says "time for Americans to tighten their belt", meanwhile their spending is completely out of control. WTF ?

Preacher
08-25-2009, 04:27 PM
The REAL scary thing is,

I am starting to hear stirrings in the press about a double-dip recession. OUCH.

revefsreleets
08-25-2009, 04:34 PM
The REAL scary thing is,

I am starting to hear stirrings in the press about a double-dip recession. OUCH.

They could do us in themselves...consumer confidence is the key to digging out, and we need positive pub now! Even with an idiot in the WH, we can't afford this any longer, we MUST dig out now!

TheWarDen86
08-25-2009, 04:42 PM
Amen X, and what's really funny is when Washington says "time for Americans to tighten their belt", meanwhile their spending is completely out of control. WTF ?

They meant that? Does that mean no beer and preztels in my back yard?

HometownGal
08-25-2009, 05:37 PM
What? Didn't you know that spending trillions will actually lower the deficit and create or save millions of jobs. :banging:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_L6pDyjqqsvY/SdYOeWUi2fI/AAAAAAAAa6Y/q3IfknrRaTs/s400/obama+spending.JPG

Big D
08-25-2009, 05:46 PM
this website is about as fair and balanced as fox news

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 07:13 PM
well here's one bill we need to get from underneath....

Congress provided about $188 billion for the global war on terror in the 2008, according to the Congressional Research Service

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/07/terror/main4704018.shtml

MACH1
08-25-2009, 07:49 PM
well here's one bill we need to get from underneath....



http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/07/terror/main4704018.shtml

Yeah, I guess the war is over. But somebody needs to tell the terrorist's :doh:

HometownGal
08-25-2009, 08:01 PM
this website is about as fair and balanced as fox news

And about as bu, bu, bu Bush as CNN, MSNBC and CBS.

steelwalls
08-25-2009, 08:06 PM
Amen X, and what's really funny is when Washington says "time for Americans to tighten their belt", meanwhile their spending is completely out of control. WTF ?

Who can afford a belt these days? Guess I need to tighten my burlap rope I'm using to hold up my 2nd hand shorts....

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 08:29 PM
Yeah, I guess the war is over. But somebody needs to tell the terrorist's :doh:
well i guess once were completely bankrupt, which is the sentiment of the thread, then how will we finance a military at all ? its kinda like paying your cable bill instead of your electric bill....no electric...no tv...
besides the iraqi's WANT us to leave and have expressed so on many occassions..... you shouldn't force your company on people who don't want it...especially when you can't afford the visit anyway.

MACH1
08-25-2009, 09:32 PM
well i guess once were completely bankrupt, which is the sentiment of the thread, then how will we finance a military at all ? its kinda like paying your cable bill instead of your electric bill....no electric...no tv...
besides the iraqi's WANT us to leave and have expressed so on many occassions..... you shouldn't force your company on people who don't want it...especially when you can't afford the visit anyway.

And spending trillions on pet projects is the way to go? Especially when you don't have trillions to spend.
I got it, just print some more paper up and call it good.

you shouldn't force your company on people who don't want it...especially when you can't afford the visit anyway.

Pot meet kettle. Sounds kinda familiar with obaaama care doesn't it?

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 10:06 PM
And spending trillions on pet projects is the way to go? Especially when you don't have trillions to spend.
I got it, just print some more paper up and call it good.



Pot meet kettle. Sounds kinda familiar with obaaama care doesn't it?
pot meet kettle ? please show me where i ever said it was a good or bad idea ? we don't have hundreds of billions to spend anually on playing world police either, but its never stopped it from happening. we didn't have almost 800 million to spend on a palace like embassy in iraq, but that didn't stop it from being built... we don't have the money to maintain 1000 military bases around the world, but yet we have them....:noidea:
you don't think the military has been running on that same government credit card ?

7SteelGal43
08-25-2009, 10:14 PM
well here's one bill we need to get from underneath....

Quote:
Congress provided about $188 billion for the global war on terror in the 2008, according to the Congressional Research Service

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/01/07/terror/main4704018.shtml


You're talking TRILLIONS of dollars in debt being run up, and more proposed, and you wanna cut 188 BILLION - with a B - in the global war on terror ? That's like saying "the oceans levels are too high, let me get my mellon baller and start filling my bucket"

Funding the military and providing national defense is the federal governments job, and these ain't boy scouts armed with sling shots and BB guns we're talking about.

But the TRILLIONS of dollars in spending and proposed spending is healthcare, bailing out banks and car manufacturers, down payments on a car for your neighbor and entitlement programs that are so full of fraud and abuses. That's not the federal governments job. It says "promote the general welfare" not "BE the general welfare"

7SteelGal43
08-25-2009, 10:29 PM
[QUOTE=MasterOfPuppets;644933]pot meet kettle ? please show me where i ever said it was a good or bad idea ? we don't have hundreds of billions to spend anually on playing world police either, but its never stopped it from happening. we didn't have almost 800 million to spend on a palace like embassy in iraq, but that didn't stop it from being built... we don't have the money to maintain 1000 military bases around the world, but yet we have them....:noidea:
you don't think the military has been running on that same government credit card ?[QUOTE]





MOP, THAT'S THE GOVERNMENTS JOB !!! I want to see my tax dollars going towards the strongest, best trained, best equiped military in the world - heads above the rest. If that means lots of r and d dollars for the newest state of the art weapons, planes, artillary, tanks.....SPEND IT. If that means helping to fund allies...SPEND IT. But DON'T spend more money on pet projects that were NEVER meant to be funded by the federal government using my tax dollars. Plus, it's not the military funding that is running up the debt by the trillions.

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 10:30 PM
You're talking TRILLIONS of dollars in debt being run up, and more proposed, and you wanna cut 188 BILLION - with a B - in the global war on terror ? That's like saying "the oceans levels are too high, let me get my mellon baller and start filling my bucket"

Funding the military and providing national defense is the federal governments job, and these ain't boy scouts armed with sling shots and BB guns we're talking about.

But the TRILLIONS of dollars in spending and proposed spending is healthcare, bailing out banks and car manufacturers, down payments on a car for your neighbor and entitlement programs that are so full of fraud and abuses. That's not the federal governments job. It says "promote the general welfare" not "BE the general welfare"take that 188 billion and multiply it by 10...20....etc... the war on terror is going about as well as the war on drugs... for every drug dealer they take down a new one will fill the void... same with terrorist.

7SteelGal43
08-25-2009, 10:39 PM
take that 188 billion and multiply it by 10...20....etc... the war on terror is going about as well as the war on drugs... for every drug dealer they take down a new one will fill the void... same with terrorist.


he bobs...he weaves...ohhh myyy, the deflection executed perfectly :applaudit:

tony hipchest
08-25-2009, 10:59 PM
he bobs...he weaves...ohhh myyy, the deflection executed perfectly :applaudit:WHOOOOOSH!!!!!

just because the point made was above your head, doesnt make it a "deflection".

please... if youre gonna use the trendy buzz word around here, atleast come correct with it.

tony hipchest
08-25-2009, 11:13 PM
:willy::willy::willy:

Cmon, dont you guys know that this is just a right wing scare tactic...crazy coservative nutcases just panicking over nothing................right Tony

awww... someone else has got a hard-on too. :jerkit:

isnt that special?

cool site (although nothing new). the quick spinning money reels remind me of a bunch of slot machines in a casino.

i laugh at all the nutjobs who have just started "panicing" in the past 10 months. you know, those who have ignored the reality of our situation that this lingering debt.

it has been hanging over our heads for years, and years, and years, but now that obama is president people are crawling out of the wood works and are all of a sudden really into politics who think they have all the answers...

anyways, old story with a nice new presentation via this website. im suprised so many republicans seem so suprised in the growing national debt. where have you guys been?

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 11:15 PM
WHOOOOOSH!!!!!

just because the point made was above your head, doesnt make it a "deflection".

please... if youre gonna use the trendy buzz word around here, atleast come correct with it. the funny part is i ask miss LITP 3 times about the palestine funding and all 3 times she responded but never answered the direct question and then has the nerve to accuse others... but then again my point was about hypocrites.....:laughing: ...

MACH1
08-25-2009, 11:21 PM
pot meet kettle ? please show me where i ever said it was a good or bad idea ? we don't have hundreds of billions to spend anually on playing world police either, but its never stopped it from happening. we didn't have almost 800 million to spend on a palace like embassy in iraq, but that didn't stop it from being built... we don't have the money to maintain 1000 military bases around the world, but yet we have them....:noidea:
you don't think the military has been running on that same government credit card ?


How bout taking that $787 billion and separate five-year, $5 billion a year investment in high-speed rail as part of obaaamas suggested fiscal year 2010 budget and give it to the military instead?

Why the hell do we need a high speed train from Philly to Pitt? Unless of course your leaving Philly, that part I can understand.

WHOOOOOSH!!!!!

just because the point made was above your head, doesnt make it a "deflection".

please... if youre gonna use the trendy buzz word around here, atleast come correct with it.

Bu...bu...bu...Bush. :chuckle:

MasterOfPuppets
08-25-2009, 11:32 PM
How bout taking that $787 billion and separate five-year, $5 billion a year investment in high-speed rail as part of obaaamas suggested fiscal year 2010 budget and give it to the military instead?

Why the hell do we need a high speed train from Philly to Pitt? Unless of course your leaving Philly, that part I can understand.



Bu...bu...bu...Bush. :chuckle:
or we could take the 100+ billion budget from the war on terror and use it for NATIONAL security on the borders and eliminate the holes that leak nonstop illegal immigrants, and maybe we wouldn't have to worry about terrorist getting in the country.

MACH1
08-25-2009, 11:49 PM
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_i1xPnZCtbMA/SYcygE_a85I/AAAAAAAAAXo/CWaZxDga79c/s400/obama+pork.jpg

Couldn't help myself.

tony hipchest
08-26-2009, 12:03 AM
or we could take the 100+ billion budget from the war on terror and use it for NATIONAL security on the borders and eliminate the holes that leak nonstop illegal immigrants, and maybe we wouldn't have to worry about terrorist getting in the country.stab your tongue with a fork!

i have personally witnessed "bush's billions" still in progress building a wall between el paso and juarez, which is pretty much nothing more than a multi billion dollar canvas for graffiti artists. (support the "arts"!) :cheer:

of course while we build a 13 foot tall wall, the illegals are spending a few hunnerd bucks on building 14 foot tall ladders.

:hunch:

as long as halliburton (or whoever) has the contracts to build the walls, i guess all is well.

we are safe.

7SteelGal43
08-26-2009, 12:47 AM
or we could take the 100+ billion budget from the war on terror and use it for NATIONAL security on the borders and eliminate the holes that leak nonstop illegal immigrants, and maybe we wouldn't have to worry about terrorist getting in the country.

Or, maybe we could just take the billions we're already spending on illegals and put THAT money towards keeping them OUT instead of keeping them HERE. Talk about a government program that pays for itself !!!

7SteelGal43
08-26-2009, 02:12 AM
WHOOOOOSH!!!!!

just because the point made was above your head, doesnt make it a "deflection".

please... if youre gonna use the trendy buzz word around here, atleast come correct with it.

You're right tony, it wasn't so much a deflection as it was "he missed the point". Good call :thumbsup: Gosh, I just hate it when I come incorrect with a trendy buzz word ?

I"ve read some of his other posts though, there is hope for him. YOU GO MOP !!

revefsreleets
08-26-2009, 08:37 AM
Rail will cost 125 billion...ALWAYS take the highest number projected when it comes to the government.

Reducing military spending a little by implementing a more responsible appropriations procedure is fair...but isolationism will fail, ESPECIALLY now. The War of Terror is not a smashing success, and has flaws, but the alternative is far worse. It's very naive to think that we can just hunker down inside our 4 walls and let the World rip itself to pieces.

Finally, White House budget officials project the national deficit to reach 17.5 TRILLION by 2019, or 77% of GDP. That's unsustainable debt...and before ANY lefties come in with the tired old "Bu-bu-Bush" garbage, I think his 400-500 billion is somewhere in the 4-6% of GDP range.

5% of GDP versus 77% of GDP.

These deficits ARE Obama.

SteelCityMan786
08-26-2009, 09:44 AM
I've been round and round on this already, but the bottom line is that if spending isn't checked, this country will either be bankrupt in 10 years, or tax rates will be through the roof. And before any liberal here even says it, yes, I know Obama inherited this debt. But his massive spending bills, whether they've been implemented or have been proposed, do nothing but make the problem that much worse. I'm tired of the government running on a "credit card" mentality. Time to start tightening the belt.

He has jacked the debt faster then Bush did in 1 year.

7SteelGal43
08-26-2009, 10:38 AM
He has jacked the debt faster then Bush did in 8 months.

fixed it for ya :chuckle:

The_WARDen
08-26-2009, 10:44 AM
Just substitute Iraq for US when it comes to budget deficit talk and it'll make you feel more at ease.

MACH1
08-26-2009, 10:47 AM
Rail will cost 125 billion...ALWAYS take the highest number projected when it comes to the government

These deficits ARE Obama.

Yep...Thats right, plus 5 Billion a year for five years.

Then theres this little golden nugget.

Biden rolls out $1.3 billion for Amtrak



WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Vice President Joe Biden continued the administration's rollout of the recently passed economic stimulus package Friday, highlighting $1.3 billion in federal funding for Amtrak.
Vice President Joe Biden called Amtrak "an absolute national treasure and necessity."

The money for the rail service, which carried almost 29 million passengers in the previous fiscal year, will go primarily to infrastructure repair and improvement.

The $787 billion stimulus plan includes a total of $8 billion for improvements in rail service, a crucial investment to help ease traffic in the congested northeast corridor running from Boston, Massachusetts to Washington, Biden argued.

It is "a necessity for a great nation to have a great [rail] passenger system," Biden said. "I'm tired of apologizing for help for Amtrak. ... It's an absolute national treasure and necessity."

The $1.3 billion will roughly double the size of Amtrak's capital investment program over the next two years, according to the vice president's office.

The largest single project funded by the stimulus money is the $105 million replacement of a movable bridge over Connecticut's Niantic River. The replacement of the 102-year-old drawbridge has been delayed for more than 20 years because of a lack of capital, Biden noted.

Leading Republican critics of Amtrak argue that the money is a poor use of taxpayer dollars and that the often-struggling rail service should instead be stripped of public money in an effort to force changes that would make it more profitable.

Amtrak is "poorly run and poorly managed," Sen. Tom Coburn, R-Oklahoma, told CNN's Brianna Keilar on Tuesday.

"That doesn't mean we shouldn't have a train service, but we [shouldn't] give additional money and reward incompetency and inefficiency. If that's what the stimulus is about, we're in a whole lot worse trouble."

Amtrak's financial struggles are more a result of inadequate public support than managerial incompetence, responded Ross Capon, head of the National Association of Railroad Passengers.

"By and large, this organization has survived an incredible amount of low funding [for] years," Capon said. There is very little rail service in states like Oklahoma, "so it might not be surprising that one of Amtrak's fiercest critics comes from a state that, relatively speaking, would not notice it if Amtrak disappeared tomorrow."

Biden frequently commuted on Amtrak between Washington and his home near Wilmington, Delaware, during his more than three decades in the Senate.

In his remarks Friday, Biden argued that every modern passenger rail service in the world depends on subsidies. He also claimed that U.S. highways and airports are actually subsidized more than the railway system.

"So let's get something straight here. Amtrak has not been at the trough. Amtrak has been left out," he said.

During the 2008 presidential campaign, President Obama pledged to support a national network of faster passenger trains. He has proposed an additional five-year, $5 billion investment in high-speed rail as part of the administration's suggested fiscal year 2010 budget.

Amtrak, according to its Web site, was established by Congress in 1970 "to take over the passenger rail services previously required to be operated by private freight railroad companies in the United States." It functions today as a quasi-public entity that, while able to set its own rates and fares, is subject to strict
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/13/biden.amtrak/index.html

Another pet project to waste the spendulas money on.
I also live in on of 'those' states that would never notice if amtrac disappeared forever.

revefsreleets
08-26-2009, 10:56 AM
It's already subsidized to the hilt...another prime example of politics over common sense.

revefsreleets
08-27-2009, 03:11 PM
So much for all this "transparency"...

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090826/ap_on_go_co/us_stimulus_border_crossings

By EILEEN SULLIVAN and MATT APUZZO, Associated Press Writers Eileen Sullivan And Matt Apuzzo, Associated Press Writers – Wed Aug 26, 2:45 pm ET

WASHINGTON – A sleepy Montana checkpoint along the Canadian border that sees about three travelers a day will get $15 million under President Barack Obama's economic stimulus plan. A government priority list ranked the project as marginal, but two powerful Democratic senators persuaded the administration to make it happen.

Despite Obama's promises that the stimulus plan would be transparent and free of politics, the government is handing out $720 million for border upgrades under a process that is both secretive and susceptible to political influence. This allowed low-priority projects such as the checkpoint in Whitetail, Mont., to skip ahead of more pressing concerns, according to documents revealed to The Associated Press.

A House oversight committee has added the checkpoint projects to its investigation into how the stimulus money is being spent. The top Republican on that committee, California's Rep. Darrell Issa, sent a letter to Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano on Wednesday, questioning why some projects leapfrogged others.

It wasn't supposed to be that way. In 2004, Congress ordered Homeland Security to create a list, updated annually, of the most important repairs at checkpoints nationwide. But the Obama administration continued a Bush administration practice of considering other, more subjective factors when deciding which projects get money.

The results:

• A border station in Napolitano's home state of Arizona is getting $199 million, five times more than any other border station. The busy Nogales checkpoint has required repairs for years but was not rated among the neediest projects on the master list reviewed by the AP. Napolitano credited her lobbying as Arizona governor for getting the project near the front of the line for funding under the Bush administration. All it needed was money, which the stimulus provided.

• A checkpoint in Laredo, Texas, which serves more than 55,000 travelers and 4,200 trucks a day, is rated among the government's highest priorities but was passed over for stimulus money.

• The Westhope, N.D., checkpoint, which serves about 73 people a day and is among the lowest-priority projects, is set to get nearly $15 million for renovations.

The Whitetail project, which involves building a border station the size and cost of a Hollywood mansion, benefited from two key allies, Montana Sens. Max Baucus and Jon Tester. Both pressed Napolitano to finance projects in their state. Tester's office boasted of that effort in an April news release, crediting Baucus and his seat at the head of the "powerful Senate Finance Committee."

Customs officials would not discuss that claim. Asked to explain Whitetail's windfall, they provided a one-page fact sheet that contains no information about Whitetail's needs and is almost identical to the fact sheet for every other Montana project.

It's hardly a recent phenomenon for politicians to use their influence to steer money to their home states. Yet Obama said the stimulus would be different. He banned "earmarks," which lawmakers routinely slip into bills to pay for pet projects, and he told agencies to "develop transparent, merit-based selection criteria" for spending.

Customs and Border Protection, the Homeland Security agency overseeing border projects, allowed the AP to review the list but will not make it public or explain its justifications for deviating from it.

Releasing that information would allow the public to see whether less important projects are getting money. The Transportation Department, for instance, recently was criticized by its internal watchdog for not following its standards when handing out money for 50 airport construction projects. Now the full $1.1 billion airport construction program is under scrutiny.

Without the lists, the public and members of Congress don't know when the administration bumps a project ahead of others ranked more important.

Customs officials said they wouldn't release the master list because it was just a starting point and subject to misunderstanding. They acknowledged there's no way for the public to know whether they are cherry-picking projects.

"There's a certain level of trust here," said Robert Jacksta, a deputy customs commissioner.

Some discrepancies between the stimulus plan and the priority list can be attributed to Congress, which set aside separate pools of money for large and small border stations. That guaranteed that a few small, probably lower-rated projects would be chosen ahead of bigger, higher-priority projects. But it doesn't explain all the discrepancies, because even within the two pools, Homeland Security sometimes reached way down on the list when selecting projects.

Many of the nation's 163 border checkpoints, known as land ports, are more than 40 years old and in need of upgrade and repairs. After the Sept. 11, 2001, terrorist attacks, those needs became more pressing and complex as officials beefed up border security. There is far more work to be done than money to complete it.

To prioritize, officials score each project on traffic volume, security vulnerability, construction needs and other factors. The resulting list represents "an objective and fair method for prioritizing projects," officials wrote in a 2005 summary.

That's the process the Obama administration described in a news release announcing $720 million in stimulus money for borders. But it didn't say that officials can choose projects out of order for many reasons.

Trent Frazier, who oversees the border projects, said the list Congress required is more like a meal plan. The administration can decide when to eat each dish, as long as everything eventually gets eaten.

Explaining why one project might get pushed ahead, Frazier said, "You just really liked pizza and you wanted to accelerate it."

In the case of the stimulus, officials said the Nogales, Ariz., project was construction-ready, a requirement of the recovery law. Officials also consider the economy, which means if the government expects local businesses to close and border traffic to decrease, it can delay paying for that project.

In one instance, officials said they reached deep into the list to provide $39 million for repairs in Van Buren, Maine, because flooding made the facility a safety hazard. In another, they are spending $30 million in Blaine, Wash., a lower-rated project that is unusual because it includes covering the costs of a state road project. With the 2010 Olympics coming to nearby Vancouver, Canada, officials worried the border would be strained without the project.

Officials said they could similarly justify every decision they've made. They would not provide those justifications to the AP. Frazier said the department would answer questions on a case-by-case basis, working through Congress to explain decisions to the public.

But even some in Congress say they aren't getting answers. Rep. Henry Cuellar, D-Texas, said he has yet to hear a good explanation about why highly ranked projects such as Laredo were snubbed.

More than $116 billion in freight passed through Laredo last year, according to the Transportation Department. It is one of the busiest border stations in the country. Unemployment in the metropolitan area is 9.4 percent.

"For the sake of fairness, if you have a list, there's some sort of expectation that you're going to follow that list," Cuellar said.

Tester, who said he pressed the Obama administration to get money for Montana projects, said border crossings in his state had been unfairly ignored.

"The northern border tends to be forgotten, and it shouldn't be," Tester told the Great Falls Tribune after announcing $77 million for Montana posts in the stimulus.

Whitetail, Mont., an unincorporated town with a population of 71, saw only about $63,000 in freight cross its border last year. County unemployment is an enviable 4 percent.

"I think, absolutely, it's going to create jobs and build the infrastructure," Tester said.

MACH1
08-27-2009, 03:24 PM
Need to keep those pesky Canadians out. :doh:

With whats going on, on the southern border you'd think that would be priority one.

Preacher
08-27-2009, 05:02 PM
Wait Wait Wait....

:shout: Panic thread Panic Thread...

It's just an investigation.

:chuckle:

hindes204
08-27-2009, 05:23 PM
well i guess once were completely bankrupt, which is the sentiment of the thread, then how will we finance a military at all ? its kinda like paying your cable bill instead of your electric bill....no electric...no tv...
besides the iraqi's WANT us to leave and have expressed so on many occassions..... you shouldn't force your company on people who don't want it...especially when you can't afford the visit anyway.


hmmm...thats weird, when I was there, the Iraqi locals did nuthin but shake our hands and thank us for what we were doing. Same thing with the Iraqi military we worked side by side with

revefsreleets
08-27-2009, 05:29 PM
I think the military would be the LAST thing to cut...China and Russia heavily covert our natural resources. We need to do everything we can to keep those wolves as far from our doors as possible.

If we destroy ourselves from the inside out there is no second guessing or "what if" games to be played...but if we fall from the outside in while we were playing a shell game trying to rob Peter to pay Paul, that's ALL on us...

Military has to stay strong...in fact, if things get REALLY bad, that may be our last stronghold and source of stability.

MasterOfPuppets
08-27-2009, 06:45 PM
hmmm...thats weird, when I was there, the Iraqi locals did nuthin but shake our hands and thank us for what we were doing. Same thing with the Iraqi military we worked side by side with


Iraq May Hold Vote On U.S. Withdrawal
As American Focus Turns to North, Troops Could Be Forced to Leave Early

BAGHDAD, Aug. 17 -- U.S. troops could be forced by Iraqi voters to withdraw a year ahead of schedule under a referendum the Iraqi government backed Monday, creating a potential complication for American commanders concerned about rising violence in the country's north.
Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki's move appeared to disregard the wishes of the U.S. government, which has quietly lobbied against the plebiscite. American officials fear it could lead to the annulment of an agreement allowing U.S. troops to stay until the end of 2011, and instead force them out by the start of that year.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/08/17/AR2009081700949.html

not only do they want us out...they wanted us out 3 years ago...

Most Iraqis Favor Immediate U.S. Pullout, Polls Show
Wednesday, September 27, 2006

BAGHDAD, Sept. 26 -- A strong majority of Iraqis want U.S.-led military forces to immediately withdraw from the country, saying their swift departure would make Iraq more secure and decrease sectarian violence, according to new polls by the State Department and independent researchers.

In Baghdad, for example, nearly three-quarters of residents polled said they would feel safer if U.S. and other foreign forces left Iraq, with 65 percent of those asked favoring an immediate pullout, according to State Department polling results obtained by The Washington Post.

Another new poll, scheduled to be released on Wednesday by the Program on International Policy Attitudes at the University of Maryland, found that 71 percent of Iraqis questioned want the Iraqi government to ask foreign forces to depart within a year. By large margins, though, Iraqis believed that the U.S. government would refuse the request, with 77 percent of those polled saying the United States intends keep permanent military bases in the country.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/26/AR2006092601721.html

HometownGal
08-27-2009, 10:34 PM
U.S. troops could be forced by Iraqi voters to withdraw a year ahead of schedule

:shout: :shout: :shout:

I think I'm going to trust the statement of hindes and other servicemen I know who were/are actually THERE over the incessant babbling of a media source.

hindes204
08-27-2009, 11:00 PM
:drink::shout: :shout: :shout:

I think I'm going to trust the statement of hindes and other servicemen I know who were/are actually THERE over the incessant babbling of a media source.

thank you...i was gonna say that but i figured why bother

tony hipchest
08-27-2009, 11:24 PM
Need to keep those pesky Canadians out. :doh:

With whats going on, on the southern border you'd think that would be priority one.being that the US/canada boarder is the largest open boarder in the world there is no way a terrorist would ever think of crossing there. :doh:

anyone go through a southern boarder patrol lately? theres 3 just travelling west between here and tucson. you would not believe the amount of hit tech camera looking thingies and wires and generators that are "watching" you as you approach. in reality, they are cameras, radiation detectors, x-ray, thingamabobbers, and all that other surveillance crap.

many people in my town travel to el paso or las cruces for radiation therapy for cancer treatment (i know this firsthand with a family member). the doctors have to issue a card much like a work excuse for when you come back through one of the boarder patrols, or else you get detained and searched for dirty bombs for setting off the detectors as you try to pass.

if a dirty bomb is going to be smuggled into this country, it certainly isnt going to be via the southwestern US highway system.

i would like to think the same preventative measures are being taken up north.

as for nogales, we are pretty much playing a game of "whack-a-mole" with the mexican cartels. beefing up security there = staying ahead of the game (even though we are far behind).

you crack down on the tijuanna and juarez cross points and the next logical one is nogales. phoenix is already the major distribution hub (and led the US in kidnappings last year thanks to all the drug dealing criminal activity).

all the right wingers and "fear and loathing" crowd who bitch about these preventative measures being taken are the epitome of hypocrites. after all, its just a continuation of "another failed bush policy", right?

:shout:- BU...BU...BU...BUSH!!!!

(its so much better when i do it.... :chuckle: )

MACH1
08-28-2009, 12:04 AM
being that the US/canada boarder is the largest open boarder in the world there is no way a terrorist would ever think of crossing there. :doh:

anyone go through a southern boarder patrol lately? theres 3 just travelling west between here and tucson. you would not believe the amount of hit tech camera looking thingies and wires and generators that are "watching" you as you approach. in reality, they are cameras, radiation detectors, x-ray, thingamabobbers, and all that other surveillance crap.


In the time it took you to type that about 6000 Mexicans crossed.

Try stopping along the road to take a piss when your crossing INEEL territory. The old highway cross's the facilities land. I made that mistake once on a hunting trip, before I could zip up there was a blackhawk hoovering behind me. :jawdrop: I found out they have the listening things and vibration sensors all over the place out there besides the cameras and probly a few things we don't know about.
Quietest damn chopper I ever seen though. About all I could hear is a little hum and the swoosh of the blades. They gave me the big pointy finger to get a move on, then followed for a few miles. Talk about nervous.

tony hipchest
08-28-2009, 12:45 AM
In the time it took you to type that about 6000 Mexicans crossed.

Try stopping along the road to take a piss when your crossing INEEL territory. The old highway cross's the facilities land. I made that mistake once on a hunting trip, before I could zip up there was a blackhawk hoovering behind me. :jawdrop: I found out they have the listening things and vibration sensors all over the place out there besides the cameras and probly a few things we don't know about.
Quietest damn chopper I ever seen though. About all I could hear is a little hum and the swoosh of the blades. They gave me the big pointy finger to get a move on, then followed for a few miles. Talk about nervous.:laughing:

i was suprised to hear we no longer use the boarder ballons (not sure how true it is but i havent seen one lately).

i remember seeing the first one about 10 years ago between lordsburg and deming (we're talking about bumfuk egypt here) and wondering what the hell that UFO was about 50 miles to the south of the highway. i got to see another one up close, grounded at its "base" when i arrived in yuma.

the damn things were huge. like a giant metlife blimp that was 3 stories tall and about the length of a football field.

if i had to guess, i would say things like the predator drones have rendered them obsolete. (im thinking it is no coincidence the training squadron for the predators has been re-located to my base).

MasterOfPuppets
08-28-2009, 01:29 AM
:shout: :shout: :shout:

I think I'm going to trust the statement of hindes and other servicemen I know who were/are actually THERE over the incessant babbling of a media source.

but yet you guys just eat up and post away those articles from those same media sources when its something negative about obama... :thumbsup:

Preacher
08-28-2009, 02:27 AM
but yet you guys just eat up and post away those articles from those same media sources when its something negative about obama... :thumbsup:

Simple logic. When a Steelers player says something good about another STeelers player, we all expect. When they come out and rip on another Steelers player, then it is probably true, since it takes a lot to make something like that happen.

Obama has screwed with the media enough that they have turned on him. This is the same media that virtually handed him the election by refusing to chase down any stories on him... but sending reporters to sit in Palin's church service "just in case"

revefsreleets
08-28-2009, 08:06 AM
A) One of those articles about the Iraqi's wanting us out was 3 years old
B) I'd be curious to see what they think now that the violence has ratcheted back up...
C) Mistrust has shifted from the US onto the Iraq military

The Iraqi people want to stand on their own, but they simply aren't ready...they used the US military as a scapegoat, but the fact is, they still need us and will continue to need us for awhile longer, in spite of Obama's best efforts to hasten us out of there.

MACH1
08-28-2009, 08:19 AM
but yet you guys just eat up and post away those articles from those same media sources when its something negative about obama... :thumbsup:

Because there's nothing positive that he has done.

HometownGal
08-28-2009, 08:29 AM
Because there's nothing positive that he has done.

:applaudit: :thumbsup:

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