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BIGBENFASTWILLIE
09-10-2009, 10:51 PM
Looked like shit once again.. No running room, and Ben couldnt drop back..

HOWEVER!!! They looked freakin awesome the last drive in the 4th quarter and in overtime.

Nice Job OLINE:applaudit:

Preacher
09-10-2009, 10:54 PM
Actually, they looked real good after the first quarter in the pass.

The big sack was Ben and the Receivers.

Run game is a whole different ballgame though.

But hey, If I had the choice between a bad line throughout the game, but excellent when it is on the line.... to win it. Or excellent, and breaking down when needed to lose it. I'll take the former every time.

Lock Down
09-10-2009, 10:54 PM
Props to the O-Line, i felt they did a fairly solid job pass protecting for the majority of the game, though the Titans didn't blitz often at the end of the game, the O-Line gave Ben all day too work.

Steel Head
09-10-2009, 11:01 PM
Max Starks played one hell of a game. Give him credit (that one holding call was BS)

FSUBoo
09-10-2009, 11:10 PM
It's even more BS cause there should have been 2 or 3 holdings called for us when Harrison was held. Looks like it's gonna be another long season of that crap. :pity:

steelpride12
09-10-2009, 11:12 PM
2 of the sacks were on Ben. I give the OL hell of credit for their play and a hell of a good game after the first half. Ben had ample time on that last drive and they helped them win the game. Good job OL!

Steelerfreak58
09-10-2009, 11:14 PM
Is it really the O-Line though? They called so many runs right up the gut but very little outside off the tackles. We have smaller faster backs we should be stretching the field to the sides more.

When we RUN, RUN, PASS and leave Ben in 3rd and long time after time how many times can the O-Line be held accountable? That and the fact that Ben in the first half was hardly even looking to check down. Third and fourth quarter Ben started hitting his check downs more and we started to convert.

Preacher
09-10-2009, 11:16 PM
Max Starks played one hell of a game. Give him credit (that one holding call was BS)

That was a pretty bad call. I usually never blame the refs... but there were 2 HORRIBLE calls tonight. That was one of them.

Pi Kapp Steeler
09-10-2009, 11:16 PM
Max Starks played one hell of a game. Give him credit (that one holding call was BS)

Agreed. he just belly flopped the ol' chap

BlastFurnace
09-10-2009, 11:17 PM
Max Starks played one hell of a game. Give him credit (that one holding call was BS)

Agreed. Max is better than some given him credit for.

steelreserve
09-10-2009, 11:17 PM
Hey, the line did a pretty good job if you ask me. They were a lot better in pass protection than in the running game, but for most of the game I didn't think Ben was getting chased around like a lunatic, unless it was voluntarily.

FSUBoo
09-10-2009, 11:17 PM
I think Starks will be a very good OT for us this year.

steelreserve
09-10-2009, 11:20 PM
That was a pretty bad call. I usually never blame the refs... but there were 2 HORRIBLE calls tonight. That was one of them.

Which was the other one? I would've said the late hit out of bounds on Polamalu, but then again, I would've said the pass interference on Polamalu, or that first-quarter mugging of Harrison where the guy immediately jumped on him from behind and tried to sexually assault him, but there was no call.

Steel Head
09-10-2009, 11:21 PM
Agreed. Max is better than some given him credit for.

Yeah just wanted to give him credit because everyone was bashing him in the preseason. My quick analysis:

Starks - solid game, our best lineman out there tonight

Kemo - played decent but still made some mistakes

Hartwig - poor performance, he can play better than that

Essex - really really really really really really bad game

Colon - played decent but the couple times he did get beat, Ben was absolutely clobbered

btw, Spaeth can't block worth a $hit

Preacher
09-10-2009, 11:22 PM
Which was the other one? I would've said the late hit out of bounds on Polamalu, but then again, I would've said the pass interference on Polamalu, or that first-quarter mugging of Harrison where the guy immediately jumped on him from behind and tried to sexually assault him, but there was no call.

the PI.

The late hit with Troy was in the gray area. It is a judgement call, "Could he have pulled up?" The ref thought he could. So I think it was a decent call. Personally, I think it was ticky-tack, but I can understand it. The mugging of Harrison well. I expect that anymore.

BozMan
09-10-2009, 11:28 PM
I think Starks will be a very good OT for us this year.

Starks did surprisingly well in pass protection. Hopefully he can keep it up.

devilsdancefloor
09-10-2009, 11:44 PM
i think our tackles played well tonight , but the interior flopped on several occasions. I know it just one game but Kemo seems lost at times:noidea:

Steelboy84
09-10-2009, 11:45 PM
They play better when Ben is in the gun. Running game and Ben under center, that's another story.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-10-2009, 11:54 PM
That was a pretty bad call. I usually never blame the refs... but there were 2 HORRIBLE calls tonight. That was one of them.

Actually, that was a justified call. I knew it the instant that it happened.

When an offensive lineman takes a guy down because his hands are "outside the frame" of the defender......it should be a penalty that is called every time.

The rusher dipped under Starks and got behind him, so Starks used his left hand to hook him and right hand on the back of the shoulder pads to take him down. It reminded me of Locklear taking down Haggans in SBXL or Roos taking down Harrison tonight.

Starks missed a few tonight, but moved his feet well for a lot of the game. I would still grade the guy as playing a C+ game, nothing more.

Preacher
09-11-2009, 12:00 AM
Actually, that was a justified call. I knew it the instant that it happened.

When an offensive lineman takes a guy down because his hands are "outside the frame" of the defender......it should be a penalty that is called every time.

The rusher dipped under Starks and got behind him, so Starks used his left hand to hook him and right hand on the back of the shoulder pads to take him down. It reminded me of Locklear taking down Haggans in SBXL or Roos taking down Harrison tonight.

Starks missed a few tonight, but moved his feet well for a lot of the game. I would still grade the guy as playing a C+ game, nothing more.

I don't know. I am going to watch the game again and focus on the line and plays. Watching it the first time, I mainly just watch to enjoy. I did see the FB whiff a couple times and Hartwig whiff too. It'll be an interesting playback.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 12:17 AM
I don't know. I am going to watch the game again and focus on the line and plays. Watching it the first time, I mainly just watch to enjoy. I did see the FB whiff a couple times and Hartwig whiff too. It'll be an interesting playback.

Sure, check it out. I rewound the PVR and watched it. I know Collinsworth was saying it wasnt a hold, but he also said that Hoke took off his helmet and he didnt. Collinsworth has less insight and accuracy than Lisa Gurerro did.

As for the Starks play......as an O lineman, if you take a guy down and your hands are not "inside the frame" (basically a box on the front of the defenders jersey from the shoulders to the numbers), it should be a penalty. Starks committed that one by textbook not moving the feet and punching.

As a whole, the O line pass blocked well, but didnt run block well outside of the 1st quarter..........which is OK, because the Steelers are a passing team now. That is their identity.

Kvnfaber
09-11-2009, 12:38 AM
Sure, check it out. I rewound the PVR and watched it. I know Collinsworth was saying it wasnt a hold, but he also said that Hoke took off his helmet and he didnt. Collinsworth has less insight and accuracy than Lisa Gurerro did.


Collinsworth is an idiot. I hated listening to him.

BKAnthem
09-11-2009, 04:46 AM
No movement on the line during running plays...they don't get paid to just pass block...

Preacher
09-11-2009, 05:23 AM
Sure, check it out. I rewound the PVR and watched it. I know Collinsworth was saying it wasnt a hold, but he also said that Hoke took off his helmet and he didnt. Collinsworth has less insight and accuracy than Lisa Gurerro did.

As for the Starks play......as an O lineman, if you take a guy down and your hands are not "inside the frame" (basically a box on the front of the defenders jersey from the shoulders to the numbers), it should be a penalty. Starks committed that one by textbook not moving the feet and punching.

As a whole, the O line pass blocked well, but didnt run block well outside of the 1st quarter..........which is OK, because the Steelers are a passing team now. That is their identity.

I have broken down the first quarter so far. Starks has actually looked pretty dang good in the first quarter. The only time he didn't was when they sent three his way, and he looked around like a keystone cop.

Colon looked really good in the first quarter too. Essex had one major flubup. Let the guy push right through him. Hartwig had a couple actually. Though one didn't hurt anything.

I can't get over how big a flop Frank the Tank was this game. It was painful to watch.. .even more so on replay so far.

But yeah, I agree with you. Our identity is now a passing team. That is fine. As long as we can set up the run with it. I Still want balance, and it doesn't look like we are going to get balance.

Venom
09-11-2009, 05:48 AM
The O line was bad in the first half . They have to do something . Cant afford getting Ben killed in the backfield. If the line could give Ben 2 more seconds back there , he will be scary !!!

Steel Head
09-11-2009, 09:28 AM
Colon looked really good in the first quarter too.

Colon played solid but was beat 2-3 times bad where Ben was totally annihilated. One was late in the game when Kearse came untouched.....wtf was that

Another real bad one i thought happened in the 1st quarter (maybe 2nd though)

I guess you missed that in your "analysis" again?

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 10:37 AM
Colon played solid but was beat 2-3 times bad where Ben was totally annihilated. One was late in the game when Kearse came untouched.....wtf was that
Another real bad one i thought happened in the 1st quarter (maybe 2nd though)

I guess you missed that in your "analysis" again?

If YOU actually were able to rewatch that play, you would see that the Titans overloaded the right side of our O line on that sack by Kearse. One player was gonna get a free.

Colon had 2 guys to block............would you rather have him block Kearse and let the closer rusher go, so he could get to Ben faster????

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 10:40 AM
Essex had one major flubup. Let the guy push right through him. . Was that the play where Mendenhall ran into Ben for the handoff??

Steel Head
09-11-2009, 11:37 AM
If YOU actually were able to rewatch that play, you would see that the Titans overloaded the right side of our O line on that sack by Kearse. One player was gonna get a free.

Colon had 2 guys to block............would you rather have him block Kearse and let the closer rusher go, so he could get to Ben faster????

Yeah, I didn't quite understand the design of that play

Regardless, Kearse will never drop into coverage on that play someone's got to block him

Sharkissle29
09-11-2009, 11:42 AM
I gotta say, their pass blocking was......IMPRESSIVE.

work on the run blocking and we will be great. keep in mind tennessee is a great defense...

MJ5150
09-11-2009, 11:44 AM
I'm not so sure it is all about our O-line being terrible. Tennessee has a really good defensive line with depth.

-Mike

revefsreleets
09-11-2009, 11:47 AM
Yeah, I didn't quite understand the design of that play

Regardless, Kearse will never drop into coverage on that play someone's got to block him

Let's face it, Welcher, there's a TON you don't understand.

Indo
09-11-2009, 12:04 PM
I'm going to say something that I NEVER thought I would---


I actually AGREE with Collinsworthless that the O-line did a Near Perfect job at pass blocking in the 2nd half...


the run blocking was a different story---

MJ5150
09-11-2009, 12:41 PM
.....I actually AGREE with Collinsworthless that the O-line did a Near Perfect job at pass blocking in the 2nd half...


the run blocking was a different story---

So next week, Willie and Mendenhall go for 100+ each. Ben get's sacked six times, knocked down a ton more while passing for 118 yards.

-Mike

austinfrench76
09-11-2009, 12:42 PM
They looked like the worst line in football for 1 quarter and then honestly, one of the best the rest of the game!!! Great job O-Line!

OX1947
09-11-2009, 12:43 PM
The Offensive line's protection towards the end was awesome. The titans wore out and Ben had 5 seconds to throw the ball. Very happy withe Offensive line in pass protection.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 12:47 PM
Regardless, Kearse will never drop into coverage on that play someone's got to block him

I agree that Kearse will be rushing, but there was nobody to block him. If a team overloads one side, then somebody is gonna come free..........and offensively you leave the guy the farthest away from the QB unblocked.

You need to quit harping that somebody needs to block him on that play, and instead insist that Ben needs to recognize Kearse is coming and Ben needs to throw the ball quickly or evade Kearse.

Its not like it was a rush on Ben's blind side. The QB has to be accountable for a guy rushing in his face. Colon did his job on that play, as did Essex and the rest of the line.

HometownGal
09-11-2009, 12:48 PM
Overall, I thought the OL placed decently - moreso on the pass blocking. Colon needs to up his game, Kemo has to use that big bod to his advantage more and Hartwig was manhandled much of the first half. When it came time to walk the walk, though - they stood up and got 'r done. :drink:

Steel Head
09-11-2009, 12:50 PM
I agree that Kearse will be rushing, but there was nobody to block him. If a team overloads one side, then somebody is gonna come free..........and offensively you leave the guy the farthest away from the QB unblocked.

You need to quit harping that somebody needs to block him on that play, and instead insist that Ben needs to recognize Kearse is coming and Ben needs to throw the ball quickly or evade Kearse.

Its not like it was a rush on Ben's blind side. The QB has to be accountable for a guy rushing in his face. Colon did his job on that play, as did Essex and the rest of the line.

Yeah, I'm guessing it was supposed to be a quick screen pass to the left side and Ben didn't throw it because it wasn't there

Just a failed play but I hate seeing Ben get hit that hard

xbroughneck
09-11-2009, 01:35 PM
Actually, they looked real good after the first quarter in the pass.

The big sack was Ben and the Receivers.

Run game is a whole different ballgame though.

But hey, If I had the choice between a bad line throughout the game, but excellent when it is on the line.... to win it. Or excellent, and breaking down when needed to lose it. I'll take the former every time.

Unfortunately this is the perfect reply.

One day this is going to bite the Steelers. Maybe against the Colts, Chargers or Patriots (teams I think the Steelers will have to beat to get back to the dance). But for now, we can't do anything about it.

I think the O-Line looked above average in the passing department and I think Ben handled blitzes MUCH better than he did last year. Considering we went up against one of the top defenses in the league, I think the O-Line did ok last night.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 01:36 PM
Just a failed play but I hate seeing Ben get hit that hard I hate that too. But there was a lot to critique last night and enjoy the win.

Some things I saw that were not impressive on the O line were:

-Starks again using a poor kick slide and letting the rusher get the edge on him.
-Hartwig leaving his feet on a run block and missing the DT
-Essex swimming his man to get to the 2nd level, but Ben turns the wrong way to handoff and cant let Kemo execute the trap block.
-Colon getting out of his stance too late and letting Kearse get a quick rush on Ben
-Starks looking at a rusher on either side of him and blocking NOBODY. :doh:
-Frank Summers looking indecisive on who to block when leading Moore.

A lot to work with in film room and on the field. Definately room for improvement. 1-0 Baby!!

Steel Head
09-11-2009, 01:38 PM
-Frank Summers looking indecisive on who to block when leading Moore.


They are ripping into Summers hard on the radio

steelreserve
09-11-2009, 01:40 PM
They are ripping into Summers hard on the radio

He'll learn. Or if not, we're still no worse off than we were with Davis, so we just wait it out again until it's time to try somebody else.

mmalone
09-11-2009, 02:20 PM
They are ripping into Summers hard on the radio

4 plays in the NFL.... Give him a break..

Parker had the Ball 13 times.. Hes been here 8 years. He had 19 yards...

Lets give Summers the Ball once on a 3rd and 1 and see what happens.

Geeeez:banging:

Steel Head
09-11-2009, 02:33 PM
4 plays in the NFL.... Give him a break..

Parker had the Ball 13 times.. Hes been here 8 years. He had 19 yards...

Lets give Summers the Ball once on a 3rd and 1 and see what happens.

Geeeez:banging:

talking about Summers as a lead blocker

apparently he whiffed on some blocks on the 3rd and shorts

smileyforall
09-11-2009, 02:39 PM
Not to take anything away from your guys' o-line last night, but our new D coordinator for some reason stopped blitzing the second quarter. In Overtime I think I remember seeing him send only a 3 man rush:doh:

mmalone
09-11-2009, 02:43 PM
talking about Summers as a lead blocker

apparently he whiffed on some blocks on the 3rd and shorts

i watched the misses.. oh well, he needs to play in the NFL...

on one miss miller missed his guy and summers didnt know which guy to take....

so he missed too ..... parker got tackled for -2

i cant harp on a guy who played 4 plays in the NFL as a rookie.

did anyone look good on offense... on the run plays??

smileyforall
09-11-2009, 02:46 PM
i watched the misses.. oh well, he needs to play in the NFL...

on one miss miller missed his guy and summers didnt know which guy to take....

so he missed too ..... parker got tackled for -2

i cant harp on a guy who played 4 plays in the NFL as a rookie.

did anyone look good on offense... on the run plays??

Moore caught a couple, thats about it...

mmalone
09-11-2009, 02:53 PM
when a team has to play the steelers they watch the film... right?

well the film has been out since last september. blitz and bull rush the line and you stop everything the steelers will run....

we have not yet countered the leagues strategy against us.... until we do. it will continue to look ugly...

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 05:13 PM
we have not yet countered the leagues strategy against us.... until we do. it will continue to look ugly...

Yeah, I guess the rest of the league has our number. :chuckle: Oh yeah.......#6 TIME SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS!!!!!

Steel_Bus_24
09-11-2009, 05:27 PM
Yeah, I guess the rest of the league has our number. :chuckle: Oh yeah.......#6 TIME SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS!!!!!

you know I cherish that SB win as much as the next Steeler fan but Im a little tired of it being thrown around every time theres a legitimate problem with the Steelers


Ben can't keep playing this way, his career is going to get cut short. We need balance to our O.

I want to be good for another decade not just the 1-2 more years Ben has before he loses the ability to evade 2-4 guys on constant 3rd and longs because Our Running game did squat on 1st/2nd

mmalone
09-11-2009, 05:33 PM
Yeah, I guess the rest of the league has our number. :chuckle: Oh yeah.......#6 TIME SUPER BOWL CHAMPIONS!!!!!

They have our run game pegged . they kill us.

BUT --- the defenses dont know what to do with Bens scrambleCat - thats why we win. WR's and Ben and the No-Huddle and were the best. 100 million of the best players in the league, 363 yards of srambleCat yesterday, we won.

your right.. we won the SB....

but we cant run. and we dont know what to do to fix it. its goning into two years now..
so i blame arians and the O coaches, they have yet to counter and fix this problem.



.
.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 05:39 PM
you know I cherish that SB win as much as the next Steeler fan but Im a little tired of it being thrown around every time theres a legitimate problem with the Steelers


Ben can't keep playing this way, his career is going to get cut short. We need balance to our O.

I want to be good for another decade not just the 1-2 more years Ben has before he loses the ability to evade 2-4 guys on constant 3rd and longs because Our Running game did squat on 1st/2nd
Yeah, and I get tired of every time the Steelers dont play a "perfect game", that pessimist fans throw out that "the entire NFL knows how to stop us".

At least 25 other NFL teams wish they had our problems and could still beat the Titans. For somebody to say that the key to stopping the Steelers is simply "blitz and bull rush the O line" is short sighted and incorrect.

Titans D Coordinator Chuck Cecil said it best :

“When you bring people, he’s got answers, so are you willing to live with the answers?” Cecil said of the Steelers' quarterback http://espn.go.com/blog/afcsouth

Ben, BA and the offense have to collectively have answers for a blitz. That is how they won 12 games last season.

El-Gonzo Jackson
09-11-2009, 05:43 PM
They have our run game pegged . they kill us.

BUT --- the defenses dont know what to do with Bens scrambleCat - thats why we win. WR's and Ben and the No-Huddle and were the best. 100 million of the best players in the league, 363 yards of srambleCat yesterday, we won.

your right.. we won the SB....

but we cant run. and we dont know what to do to fix it. its goning into two years now..
so i blame arians and the O coaches, they have yet to counter and fix this problem.
.
.

Arians never had great running games when he coached in Cleveland or here. I dont expect to see him have great running games. Do I wish we had them?? YES.

I prefer to enjoy the victories and trust that Mike Tomlin will continue to strive to have a team that can run the football like the Tampa Bay teams he was a part of. It really isnt as bad as many make it out to be, but there will never be a focus to run the football like Cowher, John Fox or Tom Coughlin teams do.

mmalone
09-11-2009, 05:50 PM
Arians never had great running games when he coached in Cleveland or here. I dont expect to see him have great running games. Do I wish we had them?? YES.

I prefer to enjoy the victories and trust that Mike Tomlin will continue to strive to have a team that can run the football like the Tampa Bay teams he was a part of. It really isnt as bad as many make it out to be, but there will never be a focus to run the football like Cowher, John Fox or Tom Coughlin teams do.

Maybe with Ben running the Backyard style offense..... then..

Maybe we need a Redman type runner that plays a backyard hard hitting style run game. Redman may not be the answer but someone that hits very hard and moves people.

i am still waiting to see Summers get the ball once... In college he was tearing things up... you have to start sometime... he moved college players 4 at a time.
i just hope we are not ruining his confidence...

Preacher
09-11-2009, 09:36 PM
Maybe with Ben running the Backyard style offense..... then..

Maybe we need a Redman type runner that plays a backyard hard hitting style run game. Redman may not be the answer but someone that hits very hard and moves people.

i am still waiting to see Summers get the ball once... In college he was tearing things up... you have to start sometime... he moved college players 4 at a time.
i just hope we are not ruining his confidence...

the dude has to show something first before I want him trying something else. As I said in another post, if he cant' find the first free guy in the direction he is running and hit him solidly, how in the world is he going to find the hole and AVOID them?

This was his first NFL game, and you want to throw him out of the frying pan and into the fire?

No. Give him time to develop. Let him get used to the game as a FB. THEN, give him the ball.

steelwalls
09-11-2009, 09:42 PM
I'm with the camp that says the O-line looked great (in general) on passing plays. Lets remember this D is no slouch either. I seen problems of course on running plays, but even there I seen numerous times our lead blockers whiffed and gave up the tackle or caused misdirection leading to someone else getting in.

Props O-line though.