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mesaSteeler
11-18-2009, 06:58 AM
http://blog.triblive.com/view-from-the-press-box/2009/11/17/reed-not-to-blame-for-kick-coverage-woes/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+triblive%2Fblog%2FViewFromThe PressBox+%28View+from+the+Press+Box+Blog%29
View From The Press Box


Reed not to blame for kick coverage woes
November 17th, 2009

The biggest surprise of the season for the Steelers -- and it is hardly a pleasant one -- is the alarming breakdowns they have experienced on their kickoff coverage team.

The unit that ranked first in the NFL last season (19.1 yards per return) has become a weak link on the Steelers.

And the regression the Steelers have experienced in that area of the game could lead to a significant shake-up of the unit -- one that may have started today when the Steelers signed Donovan Woods from the practice squad and released Arnold Harrison.

Of all the criticism that has been leveled at the kickoff coverage team, the one that is so much hot air is Jeff Reed’s culpability on the back end of the three touchdown returns the Steelers have allowed in the last four games.

Granted, Reed has unwittingly provided some recent comic relief. And he made “SportsCenter” last Sunday for the wrong reason by running past Bernard Scott as he if were crossing a street and Bengals’ return man was an oncoming car.

But to call out Reed for not bringing down Scott or Minnesota’s Percy Harvin on the latter’s kickoff return for a touchdown last month is simply misdirected fan anger.

“I am not going to get down to evaluating Jeff Reed as a tackler,” said Steelers coach Mike Tomlin, who has been satisfied with Reed’s kickoffs. “When it comes down to that we’ve failed as a coverage unit as far as I’m concerned.”

Amen.

If a kicker is needed to stop a returner from taking one to the house, then it is gravy, a bonus, if he actually brings him down or slows him down enough for someone to make the tackle.

As Tomlin said, “I don’t lose any sleep over the quality of Jeff Reed’s tackles.”

Tomlin paused and then added, “Or tackle attempts.”

SCSTILLER
11-18-2009, 07:47 AM
Thank You for posting this Mesa, I just forwarded it off to my friends who I was watching the game with. After the KO return they both were yelling "Thank You Reed" and "Reed, You Suck!" This was not Skippy's fault. He got the ball down to the five in the corner (even though on a bounce or two if I remember right) and our ST's had him pinned. Whether it be a block in the back, lack of lane discipline, or just poor tackling the returner should have never gotten to Reed. Than my buddy was complaining that Reed never kick's the ball into the endzone, no crap, he never does. He doesn't have the strongest leg in the league, but one of the more accurate ones. I will take him any day when the game is on the line, but every kicker will have misses like the first two losses.

Sorry if I was all over the place with my thoughts, my ADD and Redbull kicked in the exact same time, haha.

HometownGal
11-18-2009, 07:52 AM
:applaudit::thumbsup::hatsoff:

A-freakin'-MEN.

Glace
11-18-2009, 02:06 PM
#1...A kicker should not HAVE to be a part of the equation when tackling on ST's
#2...Not many kickers in the history of the NFL were head hunters. Just do a youtube search of kickers tackling and enjoy the comedy. Some of them make Reed look like Lambert.

Jmat
11-18-2009, 04:37 PM
So because Jeff Reed is the last guy with a chance to tackle the returner and is out there in the middle of the field for everyone to see going against a guy running full speed and making quick moves who just blew past the 10 players who's sole job is to tackle the kick returner people still want to crucify him for his attempted tackles.

There's a reason why the ten guys who get paid to make tackles on ST's aren't asked to kick.They can't. But does anyone bitch about that?

I remember James Harrison attempting to long snap last year with terrible results. Where were the complainers at then?

I can understand being pissed at Reed for a few minutes in the heat of the moment or for a little while after the game but once people settle down and get control of their emotions their common sense should take over.

frankvctr
11-18-2009, 04:55 PM
Big Ben best play was a tackle of a Colt player when Bettis fumbled near the goal line. Without that play, steelers would not win the Superbowl in 2005. Big Ben wasn't paid for making a tackle, but he did to win the crucial game for Steelers.

Jeff Reed has to make a decent attempt.

X-Terminator
11-18-2009, 05:31 PM
It's not going to matter, Mike, because Steelers fans always need a scapegoat when something goes wrong. It doesn't matter if it's the responsibility of the other 10 guys to make sure the KR never gets to Reed...no. It's all his fault, dammit, and he should be CUT IMMEDIATELY!!!!!

:coffee:

Psyychoward86
11-18-2009, 05:46 PM
Big Ben best play was a tackle of a Colt player when Bettis fumbled near the goal line. Without that play, steelers would not win the Superbowl in 2005. Big Ben wasn't paid for making a tackle, but he did to win the crucial game for Steelers.

Jeff Reed has to make a decent attempt.


Although i can point the finger directly at Reed, i gotta agree with this. The crap he pulled against the Vikings and the Bengals was inexcusable (as in his effort to tackle the ballcarrier). But really, we just need the other 10 guys to do their job

rich4eagle
11-18-2009, 06:26 PM
http://blog.triblive.com/view-from-the-press-box/2009/11/17/reed-not-to-blame-for-kick-coverage-woes/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+triblive%2Fblog%2FViewFromThe PressBox+%28View+from+the+Press+Box+Blog%29
View From The Press Box


Reed not to blame for kick coverage woes
November 17th, 2009

The biggest surprise of the season for the Steelers -- and it is hardly a pleasant one -- is the alarming breakdowns they have experienced on their kickoff coverage team.

The unit that ranked first in the NFL last season (19.1 yards per return) has become a weak link on the Steelers.

And the regression the Steelers have experienced in that area of the game could lead to a significant shake-up of the unit -- one that may have started today when the Steelers signed Donovan Woods from the practice squad and released Arnold Harrison.

Of all the criticism that has been leveled at the kickoff coverage team, the one that is so much hot air is Jeff Reed’s culpability on the back end of the three touchdown returns the Steelers have allowed in the last four games.

Granted, Reed has unwittingly provided some recent comic relief. And he made “SportsCenter” last Sunday for the wrong reason by running past Bernard Scott as he if were crossing a street and Bengals’ return man was an oncoming car.

But to call out Reed for not bringing down Scott or Minnesota’s Percy Harvin on the latter’s kickoff return for a touchdown last month is simply misdirected fan anger.

“I am not going to get down to evaluating Jeff Reed as a tackler,” said Steelers coach Mike Tomlin, who has been satisfied with Reed’s kickoffs. “When it comes down to that we’ve failed as a coverage unit as far as I’m concerned.”

Amen.

If a kicker is needed to stop a returner from taking one to the house, then it is gravy, a bonus, if he actually brings him down or slows him down enough for someone to make the tackle.

As Tomlin said, “I don’t lose any sleep over the quality of Jeff Reed’s tackles.”

Tomlin paused and then added, “Or tackle attempts.”

Tomlin might get it and astute Steeler fans might get it.............but I been chastized for saying it is unacceptable and it is unacceptable.............if you can do no more than wave at the retuner as he zooms by on a TD.............you are NOT qualified to be on a kick off team

I reiterate, get some one else to perform kick offs.............is that too hard?????????????:tt::tt03::tt04::tt02:

Steelboy84
11-18-2009, 08:45 PM
I can understand both sides of what people are saying. But Jeff Reed is our kicker. I seriously doubt he practices tackling because that's not what he's paid to do. He's paid to put the ball between the uprights.

SteelCityMom
11-18-2009, 08:58 PM
I can understand both sides of what people are saying. But Jeff Reed is our kicker. I seriously doubt he practices tackling because that's not what he's paid to do. He's paid to put the ball between the uprights.


I agree with this too, and have defended Reed in the past when everyone was bashing him for missing the FG's in the Bears game.

However, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth when someone who wants to be one of the highest paid kickers in the league and was made captain of the ST's unit is unwilling to even attempt to put his body out there to keep the other team from scoring. I agree that the other 10 guys need to do their job as well, but they all get paid to play as part of a team. Heck, even last year Berger made a pretty nice tackle when he was the last guy to stop a punt return for a TD...I don't think it's that unreasonable to ask that Reed at least attempt to do the same.

Also, I take this article with a grain of salt because there's no way Tomlin is going to publicly bash any of his players. We'll find out at the end of the season or next season what Tomlin and the FO think when Reed either does or doesn't get the extension offer he's looking for. I'm sure things like this will stick out in their minds though.

SteelCityMom
11-18-2009, 09:01 PM
#1...A kicker should not HAVE to be a part of the equation when tackling on ST's
#2...Not many kickers in the history of the NFL were head hunters. Just do a youtube search of kickers tackling and enjoy the comedy. Some of them make Reed look like Lambert.

And we're quite lucky that we have a punter who actually CAN make tackles like Lambert used to!

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_FhCgLeuO0I&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_FhCgLeuO0I&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Nadroj 20
11-18-2009, 09:05 PM
And we're quite lucky that we have a punter who actually CAN make tackles like Lambert used to!

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/_FhCgLeuO0I&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/_FhCgLeuO0I&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

I've never seen that before that was awesome!

Preacher
11-18-2009, 09:42 PM
do I expect Reed to tackle? No. (Resisting the urge to combine "the Water Boy" and "visualize a towel dispenser" comment)

However, I do expect him to learn how to take a bit better angles in order to slow down the runner and either 1. Force him out of bounds or 2. slow him down so other players can make the tackle.

However, you can never blame a kick return or punt return on the kicker or punter's failed tackles. They usually are very lucky to make those tackles. Reed's has just been highlighted over the last few weeks.

devilsdancefloor
11-18-2009, 10:33 PM
Im not gonna defend reeds non tackles, but i dont think he is out there to do the tackling in the first place, but i also wonder if part of his problem is his ankle inst he playing thru ankle problems..... anyway can we stop the blaming and flaming of reed?

Rich4eagle if we get a person for kick offs WHO are gonna cut for 1 and 2 yes it is harder than it sounds ask any ravens fan..........

Steelboy84
11-18-2009, 10:48 PM
I agree with this too, and have defended Reed in the past when everyone was bashing him for missing the FG's in the Bears game.

However, it leaves a bad taste in my mouth when someone who wants to be one of the highest paid kickers in the league and was made captain of the ST's unit is unwilling to even attempt to put his body out there to keep the other team from scoring. I agree that the other 10 guys need to do their job as well, but they all get paid to play as part of a team. Heck, even last year Berger made a pretty nice tackle when he was the last guy to stop a punt return for a TD...I don't think it's that unreasonable to ask that Reed at least attempt to do the same.

Also, I take this article with a grain of salt because there's no way Tomlin is going to publicly bash any of his players. We'll find out at the end of the season or next season what Tomlin and the FO think when Reed either does or doesn't get the extension offer he's looking for. I'm sure things like this will stick out in their minds though.

:thumbsup: :hug:

Texasteel
11-19-2009, 03:44 AM
Big Ben best play was a tackle of a Colt player when Bettis fumbled near the goal line. Without that play, steelers would not win the Superbowl in 2005. Big Ben wasn't paid for making a tackle, but he did to win the crucial game for Steelers.

Jeff Reed has to make a decent attempt.

Ben was just freakin lucky to make that tackle. He happened to guess right which way the runner would brake, and got his big body tangled up in the guys legs. I thought it was more a case of bad running than a great tackle. I would wager that 8 times out of 10 he would not have made that tackle. Its just that this time he did thank God.

You feel you need someone to blame for the run back? There were 10 other players that were on the field that work on tackling, and looked just as bad.

stlrz fan
11-19-2009, 08:47 AM
The only thing that worries me is where's his heart, It seems like not too long ago he'd be right in the thick of it trying to prevent a run back. I think when his contract is worked out he will be throwing himself into these stops. I agree that he shouldn' t be in that position but unfortunately he has become our last line of defense with st ine state that they are. Until some changes start working this won't be the last time that Reed needs to be a tackler.

Justin Otstott
11-19-2009, 10:51 AM
Big Ben best play was a tackle of a Colt player when Bettis fumbled near the goal line. Without that play, steelers would not win the Superbowl in 2005. Big Ben wasn't paid for making a tackle, but he did to win the crucial game for Steelers.

Jeff Reed has to make a decent attempt.

Thank You!!! If I am the last guy to make a tackle I am making sure I throw a shot in there. It's either try or 6 points for the other team. We are the Steelers not some other trash ass team! I hate Reed for his comment now, if you ask me I think the guy is scared to tackle.

HometownGal
11-19-2009, 11:44 AM
Also, I take this article with a grain of salt because there's no way Tomlin is going to publicly bash any of his players. We'll find out at the end of the season or next season what Tomlin and the FO think when Reed either does or doesn't get the extension offer he's looking for. I'm sure things like this will stick out in their minds though.

He may not publicly "bash his players" but he would get the message across loud and clear if he had a problem with their play, as he did with Mendenhall. You should know by now that Tomlin pulls no punches when he is dissatisfied with his players' efforts. This is why I encouraged fans to watch the video of Tomlin's press conference which I posted up a few days back - his agitation at the reporter who asked about Reed's tackling efforts is quite obvious by his facial expression and the Tomlinspeak that followed.

I do think the Steelers will find a way to keep Reed, as most times, he's money in the bank especially at HF. I think he screwed himself out of the price tag he wanted with his off the field antics but I do believe he and the Steelers will reach an agreement in the offseason. :hope:

Bng_Hevn
11-19-2009, 12:24 PM
I can understand both sides of what people are saying. But Jeff Reed is our kicker. I seriously doubt he practices tackling because that's not what he's paid to do. He's paid to put the ball between the uprights.

When in the military and on the war front, even the cook is a rifleman when it comes down to living or dying.

In football, EVERYONE on the field is a tackler when called upon.

I don't think it's that he didn't make the tackles anyway, it's the total lack of effort.Hell, he didn't even make it LOOK like he was trying to make the tackle.

IMO, he needs to try. If you give him a total pass because "he is the kicker", what happens when that TD return is with 0 time on the clock and will end up being the game winner for the other team? Put that scenario in the SB and THEN tell me how you feel about kickers' responsibility.

Not making the tackle? I'm fine with that.
Not attempting to make the tackle? Inexcuseable.

Nadroj 20
11-19-2009, 12:43 PM
When in the military and on the war front, even the cook is a rifleman when it comes down to living or dying.

In football, EVERYONE on the field is a tackler when called upon.

I don't think it's that he didn't make the tackles anyway, it's the total lack of effort.Hell, he didn't even make it LOOK like he was trying to make the tackle.

IMO, he needs to try. If you give him a total pass because "he is the kicker", what happens when that TD return is with 0 time on the clock and will end up being the game winner for the other team? Put that scenario in the SB and THEN tell me how you feel about kickers' responsibility.

Not making the tackle? I'm fine with that.
Not attempting to make the tackle? Inexcuseable.


This pretty much sums up my thoughts on it as well, its not the fact he didnt make the tackle, its just a little more effort would be nice.

However what would be even NICER would be him never having to show effort because the returner should be taken down long before he has that chance

willie_district
11-19-2009, 01:07 PM
It may not be Reed's job to tackle, but he is a football player. Playing football includes doing what is needed to make a play when opportunities present. It's not Ben's job to block, yet on some running plays, such as end-arounds, Ben makes a block when needed. If Reed is the only player between a kick returner and a touchdown, then he needs to make a tackle (attempt).

steeltheone
11-19-2009, 01:52 PM
If he could ever kick it thru the end zone this would not be an issue.

LVSteelersfan
11-19-2009, 02:38 PM
If he could ever kick it thru the end zone this would not be an issue.

AMEN to that one. That is really the only problem I have with Reed except for his off field antics. That kick that made it all the way to the 15 yard line last week was absolutely pathetic. And don't even try to tell me he was kicking it away from their return man. They got extremely good field position on that kick. I watch guys like the Patriots kicker hit the end zone with ease and am extremely jealous they have him. I guarantee you that kicker could hit a critical FG at Heinz Field as well as pin us back on kickoffs. There are two sides to a kicker's game. Reed handles the FG side fairly well (except at Chicago) most of the time. But his kickoffs make me cringe every time I watch him. Kind of like Berger punts last year.

As far as tackling, I think he could have taken a better angle on Percy Harvin. That one last week I just don't know what to think about. It was in the middle of the field and most KRs can juke a kicker every time in the middle of the field. But it did look like he just ran away from the contact. Regardless, I don't think Reed had a chance on that one and it wasn't his fault because that kick was not as bad as the other ones that we had run back on us. We should have pinned them back on that one. How did we go from the number one ST last year to this mess?

rich4eagle
11-19-2009, 03:12 PM
I am glad this subject is gaining more traction. If you are useless on covering kicks...........time is of the essence to find a new kick off guy.............simple elegeant and accurate

I played a lot .....and indeed I would find a new guy to kick off

HometownGal
11-19-2009, 03:16 PM
I am glad this subject is gaining more traction. If you are useless on covering kicks...........time is of the essene to find a new kick off guy.............simple elegeant and accurate

Obviously, Coach Tomlin doesn't agree with you or the others witch hunting Reed in this and the gazillion other threads on this topic.

So - because Reed isn't the best tackler as a PK (:laughing:), we're supposed to throw him under the bus and out of Pittsburgh even though he is one of the most reliable PK's the Steelers have ever had? :jawdrop: :shake02:

X-Terminator
11-19-2009, 05:58 PM
Obviously, Coach Tomlin doesn't agree with you or the others witch hunting Reed in this and the gazillion other threads on this topic.

So - because Reed isn't the best tackler as a PK (:laughing:), we're supposed to throw him under the bus and out of Pittsburgh even though he is one of the most reliable PK's the Steelers have ever had? :jawdrop: :shake02:

Yes, because as i said, Steelers fans need a scapegoat. They also seem to think that reliable kickers grow on trees. Ask a Ravens fan how well things have gone without Matt Stover this season.

It's entirely possible that they will get what they want, and Reed will be let go in the offseason. But the first time I hear any of them bitch whenever the new kicker misses critical FGs, I'm just going to sit back and laugh and say...hey, you asked for it! But at least they'd get a few more kicks into the EZ to make up for it! :coffee:

Nadroj 20
11-19-2009, 07:13 PM
Yes, because as i said, Steelers fans need a scapegoat. They also seem to think that reliable kickers grow on trees. Ask a Ravens fan how well things have gone without Matt Stover this season.

It's entirely possible that they will get what they want, and Reed will be let go in the offseason. But the first time I hear any of them bitch whenever the new kicker misses critical FGs, I'm just going to sit back and laugh and say...hey, you asked for it! But at least they'd get a few more kicks into the EZ to make up for it! :coffee:

I'm one that just questions his effort (along with all ST players) and also beleive you shouldnt leave reed out of the disscussion when talking about the poor play of the ST because he is a member of that unit, and in NO WAY am i saying he should get all of the blame because that is stupid, ALL 11 players as a unit should be blamed and i dont like any of their effort as of right now....... and just to make this clear I love reed as a PK and i want to get him back next year because his positives outweigh his (questionable by opinion) negatives BY FAR.

WeegiesWarriors
11-20-2009, 10:27 AM
My take is that you have a guy riddled with off the field issues not doing whatever it takes on the field to make ammends for it. I'm appreciative that he isn't at least tanking his FGs, but it is apparent to anybody who isn't enthalled with Jeff Reed to see that he is playing not to get hurt. He's damn sure going to be paid and an injury isn't going to enter the negotiation table. If he got an extension tomorrow I would bet the house the next KO that got to him you'd see at least an attempt at a tackle.

That shit don't fly in Steeler Nation. He doesn't have to make the tackle but come on... the attempt against the Vikes I've seen more aggression in a women's powder puff game before. Despite what his intentions are... the perception is he's playing not to get hurt because of his contract situation.

steelballs
11-20-2009, 11:01 AM
I was embarassed as a Steeler fan watching his non-attempt at a tackle.
I don't care if he's a kicker, snapper, holder whatever....he's a Steeler and Steelers don't wuss out when it comes to contact. At least fall down in front of the returner, grab his hair, grab anything and hold on, but to simply wuss out....unacceptable.

I agree that your kicker having to make a tackle magnifies many other larger problems in your ST play, but damn make an effort....I guarantee that Sepulveda would have taken his ass out and enjoyed it.

With Reed on the outside looking in (towards being re-signed) you'd think he'd be doing anything he could to help his cause....not go on record as "I'm paid to kick, not tackle"

Bng_Hevn
11-20-2009, 12:18 PM
My take is that you have a guy riddled with off the field issues not doing whatever it takes on the field to make ammends for it. I'm appreciative that he isn't at least tanking his FGs, but it is apparent to anybody who isn't enthalled with Jeff Reed to see that he is playing not to get hurt. He's damn sure going to be paid and an injury isn't going to enter the negotiation table. If he got an extension tomorrow I would bet the house the next KO that got to him you'd see at least an attempt at a tackle.

That shit don't fly in Steeler Nation. He doesn't have to make the tackle but come on... the attempt against the Vikes I've seen more aggression in a women's powder puff game before. Despite what his intentions are... the perception is he's playing not to get hurt because of his contract situation.

If that's the case, then I can't really blame him. Players do that all the time, why not the kickers. In this "what have you done for me lately" league, if Reed gets hurt, especially if he screws up his leg(s), what compensation does he get? If he got hurt to the point where he couldn't kick, that effectively ends his career.

On the other hand, if he ends his career on a KO then the team, if it signed him to a new contract, would have to eat it.