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StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 07:58 AM
With Baltimore losing last night, believe it or not, the Pittsburgh Steelers are still in this thing and is only 2 games out of the 5th and 6th Wild Card Spots. I believe it CAN be done and if we win out, then we can not only land a 6th, but a possible 5th!


All we have to worry about is win out, first and foremost, some way, some how. If we do that, then we won't have to worry about Baltimore or Miami since we have the head to head tie breakers over them regardless of what they do outside of us.

We need the Jets to lose at least one and I expect that to happen since they aren't even close to being a viable contender. The Jags have a TOUGH schedule and could lose 3 of the remaining 4. I expect them to lose at least 2. Denver has Indy this week and head to Philly, 2 games they could lose right there. So with that said, let's project things that could happen in favor of us.



Jags

Dolphins: L
Colts: L (depending on what the Colts do as far as starters.)
@ Patriots: L
@ Browns: W
(8-8)


Jets

@ Buccaneers: W
Falcons: L
@ Colts : L (Depending on what the Colts do as far as starters.)
Bengals: W (Depending on what the Bengals do as far as starters. Could be fighting for a 2nd seed with SD.)
(8-8)

Dolphins

@ Jaguars: W
@ Titans: W
Texans : L
Steelers: L
(8-8)

Ravens
Lions: W
Bears: W
@ Steelers: L
@ Raiders: W
(9-7)

Broncos
@ Colts: L
Raiders: W
@ Eagles: L
Chiefs: W
(10-6)

So, that leaves:

5.Steelers (10-6) TIEBREAKER
6.Broncos (10-6)
----------------------------------------------
Ravens (9-7) ELIMINATED
Jags (8-8) ELIMINATED
Jets (8-8) ELIMINATED


Considering we win out, that puts us at 10-6. The Broncos could also be 10-6. We go head to head, and since we beat them, we own that tiebreaker, which puts us in the 5th spot and Denver in the 6th spot.

I know it's wishful thinking, but that's the best case scenario. Fortunate thing is, is that is COULD BE DONE! Of course, we need to win out and this would all be irrelevant if we indeed lose one more.

Don't Stop Believin'!!!!!

HERE WE GO STEELERS!!!!!!:tt04: Bring on the Shit Stains!!!!!

The_WARDen
12-08-2009, 08:47 AM
My daughter thinks she's getting a new swing set from Santa...so in the wishful spirit of the season...why not?

I dunno how they stop Aaron Rodgers but why not?

plenewken
12-08-2009, 08:56 AM
At this point, coming out of 4 consecutive losses, 2 of which being inexcusable, the Steelers are as capable as any of the teams you mentioned to lose at least one game out of 4.
It's not a matter of believing or not, it's a matter of looking realistically at the situation. Believing in the team doesn't win games, unfortunately.

JunScooby
12-08-2009, 08:58 AM
That is a big "what if". The steelers have always bee more than capable of doing that. I will do my part thursday to turn it into a home game.

Texasteel
12-08-2009, 09:02 AM
At this point, coming out of 4 consecutive losses, 2 of which being inexcusable, the Steelers are as capable as any of the teams you mentioned to lose at least one game out of 4.
It's not a matter of believing or not, it's a matter of looking realistically at the situation. Believing in the team doesn't win games, unfortunately.

I agree it is going to be tough as hell, but remember we won a SB when everyone said we backed into the playoffs. Just give it one game at a time bud.

Steelers>NFL
12-08-2009, 09:12 AM
I am looking for one win right now. I refuse to look ahead for what could or should happen in the future.
Even if they make the playoffs, they are not going anywhere.

canadasteel
12-08-2009, 09:19 AM
if they win 8 in a row they win number 7. (sarcasm)

plenewken
12-08-2009, 09:26 AM
I agree it is going to be tough as hell, but remember we won a SB when everyone said we backed into the playoffs. Just give it one game at a time bud.

That's exactly what I do. No wishful thinking or speculation here. From now on, there's absolutely no room for error.

SteelMember
12-08-2009, 09:34 AM
Until we are mathematically eliminated...

Nothing is over. NOTHING!

http://www.stallonezone.com/imgs/news/2007/June/062207ew_rambo_topaction.jpg

WH
12-08-2009, 09:38 AM
If there is any team in the league that can do it, it's this one. Just start showing the '05 superbowl DVD in the locker room.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 09:48 AM
I am looking for one win right now. I refuse to look ahead for what could or should happen in the future.
Even if they make the playoffs, they are not going anywhere.

The whole point of the thread was to have a rally cry and just to know that we are CERTAINLY not out of it. Of course, we have to win out. PERIOD. END OF STORY. No way around that one and that "no room for error" is even more severe that what the saying actually threats! But looking at it, and this is considering if we do wake up and possibly beat the remaining teams (The Steelers lose to the Chiefs and Raiders, but beat teams like the Chargers, Broncos and Vikings, so winning a game against Green Bay at home in December isn't as far fetched as it may seem) then we can very well get the help we need.

Wishful thinking is all we have at this point, and there's no giving up at this point. Until we are mathematically out of it, there's a punchers chance and there's no wrong doing at looking ahead right now of what could happen. We're on a 4 game losing streak and on the outside looking in. We as fans must see a way to rally behind them and get behind them at home against teams like Balty and GB coming up.

As far as not going anywhere if we DO make the playoffs, then shame on you for that comment. It's a whole new beast and the Steelers, if anybody, would be the most dangerous to any top seeded team. Bet on it. But we MUST scratch the surface for a 5th or 6th spot FIRST.

HERE WE GO.

GridironWarrior
12-08-2009, 09:50 AM
Eh I don't see them getting in at all. Everybody is passing on our D and with Rodgers coming to town we'll probably get torched.
And even if they do make the big dance they're be 1 and done. Too many injuries and inconsistency is what is dooming this team. The good news is that we get to look at younger guys like Hood, Lewis and Burnett. Let's see what these guys can do when given chances.

Steelers>NFL
12-08-2009, 09:52 AM
Eh I don't see them getting in at all. Everybody is passing on our D and with Rodgers coming to town we'll probably get torched.
And even if they do make the big dance they're be 1 and done. Too many injuries and inconsistency is what is dooming this team. The good news is that we get to look at younger guys like Hood, Lewis and Burnett. Let's see what these guys can do when given chances.

Exactly my feelings...

WH
12-08-2009, 09:55 AM
Eh I don't see them getting in at all. Everybody is passing on our D and with Rodgers coming to town we'll probably get torched.
And even if they do make the big dance they're be 1 and done. Too many injuries and inconsistency is what is dooming this team. The good news is that we get to look at younger guys like Hood, Lewis and Burnett. Let's see what these guys can do when given chances.

By the Green Bay game Troy will be back in some form. And Troy at 85% is still better than 90% of the safeties in this league.

We've been shown in all of these losses that the Steelers are 1 play away from the W in 6 of their 6 losses. Having Troy in will get the Steelers that 1 play.

So I think they do to Rodgers what they did to his Green Bay mentor.

Drizztbob
12-08-2009, 09:55 AM
Hopefully Troy will be back and his presence will be felt. I believe we are 4-1 with him playing?? He has a knack for making big plays in big games and we will need him to do just that against Green Bay. I'm not giving up. We have a shot to win out, and with the schedules ahead for the opposing AFC teams, it's possible. So grab your towels, do your rituals, and pray that God is a Steeler fan so we can see our boys come January put on another show!!! :applaudit:

GridironWarrior
12-08-2009, 09:56 AM
By the Green Bay game Troy will be back in some form. And Troy at 85% is still better than 90% of the safeties in this league.

We've been shown in all of these losses that the Steelers are 1 play away from the W in 6 of their 6 losses. Having Troy in will get the Steelers that 1 play.

So I think they do to Rodgers what they did to his Green Bay mentor.

We don't know for sure if Troy is coming back, and even if he does it won't matter. He'll be rusty. And to be honest I think he's done for the year.

WH
12-08-2009, 10:12 AM
We don't know for sure if Troy is coming back, and even if he does it won't matter. He'll be rusty. And to be honest I think he's done for the year.
that's kind of Johnny Raincloudish.....i thought this was the pep thread?

Drizztbob
12-08-2009, 10:23 AM
that's kind of Johnny Raincloudish.....i thought this was the pep thread?

Someone peed in his Cheerios this morning...

Hayeksheroes
12-08-2009, 10:45 AM
The Steelers will make the Playoffs. The debate is over. The science is settled.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 10:47 AM
Can't tuck our tails beneath us now. A win against Cleveland all but puts us in position to at least win out. I think we can do it. Judging by the performances of the last 4 games, hope is small, but as long as we have a shot we can right the ship Thursday Night.

5 of the 6 losses came within 3 points. Given all the Special Teams mishaps and the D blowing 4th QRT leads, then a play here or a simple stop here results into 10-2 or possibly 11-1. I know, disgusting but we can win ALL these damn games coming up.

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 11:07 AM
All we have to worry about is win out, first and foremost, some way, some how. If we do that, then we won't have to worry about Baltimore or Miami since we have the head to head tie breakers over them regardless of what they do outside of us.


We do? I thought the Ravens had the edge over us, even if the Steelers beat Baltimore that still puts our division record at 3-3 (after beating the Browns of course)...

Hayeksheroes
12-08-2009, 11:20 AM
Where's the Steeler Nation bailout? Where is Reid, Pelosi and Obama? Don't they know the Steelers are too big to fail.

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 11:32 AM
This team just has too much talent to not make the playoffs. Yes we lost to some pathetic teams but have you also seen who we beat? vikings and broncos, 2 teams that will make the playoffs. So we can win out, espeially if troy comes back he is the best player in the nfl. GO STEELERS

steelreserve
12-08-2009, 11:39 AM
My daughter thinks she's getting a new swing set from Santa...so in the wishful spirit of the season...why not?

I dunno how they stop Aaron Rodgers but why not?

Why do people keep saying this? The Packers are not very good. I don't think they've beaten a single team with a winning record except Dallas (who hasn't beaten anyone with a winning record either). Green Bay's defense sucks ass. We ought to walk all over those losers.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 11:40 AM
We do? I thought the Ravens had the edge over us, even if the Steelers beat Baltimore that still puts our division record at 3-3 (after beating the Browns of course)...



Beating the Ravens would put the Ravens at 3-3 in the Division if we beat them. If we beat the Ravens and Browns, we are also 3-3. The next tie breaker would go to Conference Record. Right now they are 6-4 in the Conference, we are 4-4. We still have 3 games to play within the Conference, compared to their 2.

That Conference record, considering if the Steelers win out and beat the Ravens it would be the Steelers at 7-4 in the Conference, and Baltimore 7-5 in the Conference if they beat Oakland in Oakland. Common opponents come into play also at some point and we pretty much could cross each other out, so if we win out and we beat Baltimore we win the Conference Record at 7-4 > 7-5.

Correct me if I'm wrong.

Dino 6 Rings
12-08-2009, 11:49 AM
Nothing matter other than beating the Browns, seriously...this math and what if stuff is all nonsense if we don't beat the Browns...same as it was last week, only we FAILED to beat the Raiders

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 11:53 AM
When it comes down to it, we MUST win out or all of it becomes irrelevant. This is all in the talks of assuming we win out and nothing more. If we lose one more, then we pack up and look forward to the draft and finishing strong, but these scenarios are possible and need to be discussed until we lose.

Dino 6 Rings
12-08-2009, 11:56 AM
I want anyone with 6 or more wins in the AFC to lose and for us to keep winning, it'll all come out in the wash...first and foremost, we must stop the Browns cold and crush their throats with the heels of our boots. We must rip their hearts out early and throw them like tomatoes against the walls of our Castle.

That is what must happen.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 11:58 AM
I want anyone with 6 or more wins in the AFC to lose and for us to keep winning, it'll all come out in the wash...first and foremost, we must stop the Browns cold and crush their throats with the heels of our boots. We must rip their hearts out early and throw them like tomatoes against the walls of our Castle.

That is what must happen.

I see the Jags losing atleast 2 and ALL of the 6-6 teams atleast losing one, making them 9-7 if it happens. So we just HAVE to win out and hope all of those teams drop one, which is more than realistic. We are holding onto this thing. Ironically, all of those teams are saying the same about us needing to lose one, and GB, Balty, or Miami won't be easy by any stretch of the word but we can beat those teams when it comes down to it.

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 12:00 PM
the Jets must lose to atlanta next week. The colts and bengals will be resting starters when they play them

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 12:03 PM
the Jets must lose to atlanta next week. The colts and bengals will be resting starters when they play them

Even if the Jets win out making them 10-6, and if we win out, we own the tiebreaker in the Conference. Same with the Ravens, it would be us at 7-4, Jets at 7-5 (They are 5-5 with 2 in Conference to play) and Ravens at 7-5. They'd cross each other out and we'd get the spot.

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 12:06 PM
Even if the Jets win out making them 10-6, and if we win out, we own the tiebreaker in the Conference. Same with the Ravens, it would be us at 7-4, Jets at 7-5 and Ravens at 7-5. They'd cross each other out and we'd get the spot.

oh ya just checked that out. jets are 5-5 in the afc, steelers are 4-4.
jets play indy and cincy
steelers play the browns, ravens, dolphins

so ya ur right, thats good to know

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 12:13 PM
oh ya just checked that out. jets are 5-5 in the afc, steelers are 4-4.
jets play indy and cincy
steelers play the browns, ravens, dolphins

so ya ur right, thats good to know


So, all we need is to win out and hope the Jags lose 2 (Us beating Balty and Miami would eliminate both those teams and we have the Conference over the Jets if it comes to it. So we would knock off the Jets, Ravens and Dolphins.)

A kicker would be the Broncos losing 2 as well. If they indeed lose 2 and we win out, that puts us at 10-6 and them at 10-6. We would own the breaker from head to head and we could knock them out and possibly gain #5!

We control our own destiny believe it or not if the Jags fall, and they have a TOUGH schedule.

Dino 6 Rings
12-08-2009, 12:15 PM
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 12:16 PM
Beating the Ravens would put the Ravens at 3-3 in the Division if we beat them. If we beat the Ravens and Browns, we are also 3-3. The next tie breaker would go to Conference Record. Right now they are 6-4 in the Conference, we are 4-4. We still have 3 games to play within the Conference, compared to their 2.

That Conference record, considering if the Steelers win out and beat the Ravens it would be the Steelers at 7-4 in the Conference, and Baltimore 7-5 in the Conference if they beat Oakland in Oakland. Common opponents come into play also at some point and we pretty much could cross each other out, so if we win out and we beat Baltimore we win the Conference Record at 7-4 > 7-5.

Correct me if I'm wrong.


Unless I'm mistaken the Steelers and Ravens have the same schedule, except Ravens play NE and IND and Steelers play TEN and MIA. They should have the same number of conference games. Steelers lost to the Bengals twice, Chiefs, Baltimore and Oakland, so the best they can do in the conference is 7-5.

The common games tiebreaker actually comes before the conference record tiebreaker, there are a total of 12 common games. As of now the Ravens have lost 4 of 9 common games (Vikings, Packers, Bengals twice), they still have 3 of the common games to play. The Steelers have lost 5 of 10 common games (Bears, Bengals twice, Chiefs, Raiders) and they have 2 left.

Seems to me the Ravens have the edge.

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 12:18 PM
So, all we need is to win out and hope the Jags lose 2 (Us beating Balty and Miami would eliminate both those teams and we have the Conference over the Jets if it comes to it. So we would knock off the Jets, Ravens and Dolphins.)

A kicker would be the Broncos losing 2 as well. If they indeed lose 2 and we win out, that puts us at 10-6 and them at 10-6. We could own the that tie breaker from head to head and we could knock them out!

We control our own destiny believe it or not if the Jags fall, and they have a TOUGH schedule.

ya they do, I think miami will beat them and then they only need a loss to either the colts or patriots which is 99% likely. Jets should lose to the colts bcz they play them week 16 and I doubt they rest manning before the last game

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 12:20 PM
Unless I'm mistaken the Steelers and Ravens have the same schedule, except Ravens play NE and IND and Steelers play TEN and MIA. They should have the same number of conference games. Steelers lost to the Bengals twice, Chiefs, Baltimore and Oakland, so the best they can do in the conference is 7-5.

The common games tiebreaker actually comes before the conference record tiebreaker, there are a total of 12 common games. As of now the Ravens have lost 4 of 9 common games (Vikings, Packers, Bengals twice), they still have 3 of the common games to play. The Steelers have lost 5 of 10 common games (Bears, Bengals twice, Chiefs, Raiders) and they have 2 left.

Seems to me the Ravens have the edge.

the conference record does not count games against teams in your division

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 12:23 PM
the conference record does not count games against teams in your division

Oh ok my mistake.

mwittman5
12-08-2009, 12:24 PM
Oh ok my mistake.

nfl.com has a pretty good playoff picture and it shows you the division and conference records.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 12:27 PM
the conference record does not count games against teams in your division

Ding Ding Ding, that's why there's a division head to head.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 12:29 PM
Believe ladies and gentleman, starting Thursday in Cleveland.

We are alive.:tt04:

SteelerEmpire
12-08-2009, 12:30 PM
If we can survive the Browns... TP will have another week and a half to rest his knee and will be back at Green Bay.
The re-injection of Troy into the game and what he brings when he's on the field, at this point, is our only hope....

stb_steeler
12-08-2009, 12:34 PM
Why do people keep saying this? The Packers are not very good. I don't think they've beaten a single team with a winning record except Dallas (who hasn't beaten anyone with a winning record either). Green Bay's defense sucks ass. We ought to walk all over those losers.

Believe it or not Green Bay has the #1 defense right now, according to Boomer on monday night football....

WH
12-08-2009, 12:34 PM
http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc3/hs076.snc3/14343_193319899957_504319957_2988516_4090559_n.jpg

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 12:34 PM
So both Ravens and Steelers are 3-2 in the conference tiebreaker since divisional teams don't count.

The_WARDen
12-08-2009, 12:34 PM
Why do people keep saying this? The Packers are not very good. I don't think they've beaten a single team with a winning record except Dallas (who hasn't beaten anyone with a winning record either). Green Bay's defense sucks ass. We ought to walk all over those losers.

a. Rodgers can throw the ball well. I believe that he is among the leaders (at least top 10).
b. GB has some good WRs.
c. The secondary has proven recently that they can't stop no name QBs much less a good one.
d. They have won 4 in a row...opposite of the Steelers.

a + b + c + d = Really tough game against the Pack.

The exception is that if Troy plays in that game...then he throws a variable into the equation and I feel better about it.

That's why people keep saying it.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 01:01 PM
So both Ravens and Steelers are 3-2 in the conference tiebreaker since divisional teams don't count.

*****************************EDIT: *******************************

There's certainly something wrong here and I believe indeed that the Division counts as common opponents in the Conference record.

Right now the Ravens are 6-4 in the Conference. We are 4-5. After tallying them schedule by schedule, NFL.COM is WRONG and has us 4-4 in the Conference when we are 4-5.

The Ravens ONLY have 2 more Conference opponents to play.
The Steelers have 3 Conference opponents to play.

If we beat the Ravens, and win out, that includes Baltimore as a Division win AND a Conference win, making the Ravens 7-5 in the Conference to our 7-5.

Here's a breakdown of Conference opponents:

Baltimore: (Chiefs, Browns, Browns, Chargers, Patriots, Bengals, Bengals,Broncos, Colts, Steelers.) 2 to go: Steelers and Raiders.
They are 6-4 right now, so us winning out would put them 7-5 at best.

Pittsburgh: Titans, Bengals, Bengals, Browns, Ravens, Chargers, Broncos, Raiders, Chiefs.) 3 to go: Browns, Ravens, Dolphins.
We are 4-5 right now, so if we win out, we are 7-5 at best.

So next would go to strength of victory. I'll get back to you on this one. We might need Balty to lose one more also! It's getting confusing.

The_WARDen
12-08-2009, 01:05 PM
There's certainly something wrong here and I believe indeed that the Division counts as common opponents in the Conference record.

Still, my first argument is CORRECT. Right now the Ravens are 6-4 in the Conference. We are 4-4.

The Ravens ONLY have 2 more Conference opponents to play.
The Steelers have 3 Conference opponents to play.

If we beat the Ravens, and win out, that includes Baltimore as a Division win AND a Conference win, making the Ravens 7-5 in the Conference to our 7-4.

Here's a breakdown of Conference opponents:

Baltimore: (Chiefs, Browns, Browns, Chargers, Patriots, Bengals, Bengals,Broncos, Colts, Steelers.) 2 to go: Steelers and Raiders.
They are 6-4 right now, so us winning out would put them 7-5 at best. We win.

Pittsburgh: Titans, Bengals, Bengals, Browns, Chargers, Broncos, Raiders, Chiefs.) 3 to go: Browns, Ravens, Dolphins.
We are 4-4 right now, so if we win out, we are 7-4 at best and since we would beat Balty, they would be 7-5 at best and we get in at 7-4.

The first theory was correct.

I hated these things in school (think they were called word problems or something)...after reading all these scenarios, I still hate them!

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 01:15 PM
*****************************EDIT: *******************************

There's certainly something wrong here and I believe indeed that the Division counts as common opponents in the Conference record.

Right now the Ravens are 6-4 in the Conference. We are 4-5. After tallying them schedule by schedule, NFL.COM is WRONG and has us 4-4 in the Conference when we are 4-5.

The Ravens ONLY have 2 more Conference opponents to play.
The Steelers have 3 Conference opponents to play.

If we beat the Ravens, and win out, that includes Baltimore as a Division win AND a Conference win, making the Ravens 7-5 in the Conference to our 7-5.

Here's a breakdown of Conference opponents:

Baltimore: (Chiefs, Browns, Browns, Chargers, Patriots, Bengals, Bengals,Broncos, Colts, Steelers.) 2 to go: Steelers and Raiders.
They are 6-4 right now, so us winning out would put them 7-5 at best.

Pittsburgh: Titans, Bengals, Bengals, Browns, Ravens, Chargers, Broncos, Raiders, Chiefs.) 3 to go: Browns, Ravens, Dolphins.
We are 4-5 right now, so if we win out, we are 7-5 at best.

So next would go to strength of victory. Still, it wouldn't matter because if we beat Baltimore that puts them 9-7 overall, it wouldn't come to a Conference Record to begin with. We'd eliminate them by overall record. (10-6> 9-7.)

PHEW!!!!!

AllD
12-08-2009, 02:34 PM
We were supposed to win out 2 games ago. After dropping 4 straight what kind of sports science creates a scenerio where the broken down Steelers come from nowhere to make a statement? Even in 2005 we had healthy players who were HUNGRY.

This team is playing like it can't wait to get to the end of the season and go to their vacation homes.

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 03:09 PM
TO BREAK A TIE WITHIN A DIVISION

If, at the end of the regular season, two or more clubs in the same division finish with identical won-lost-tied percentages, the following steps will be taken until a champion is determined.
Two Clubs

1. Head-to-head (best won-lost-tied percentage in games between the clubs).
2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the division.
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games.
4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
5. Strength of victory.
6. Strength of schedule.
7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed.
8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed.
9. Best net points in common games.
10. Best net points in all games.
11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
12. Coin toss




1) Obviously if the Ravens beat the Steelers at Heinz field they win the first tiebreaker, and the Steelers are pretty much out of luck.

Assume that the Steelers beat the Ravens.

Situation 1: The Steelers go 10-6, meaning they beat the Dolphins in head to head. The only two things that can keep the Steelers out are Jacksonville losing only 1 more game or the Jets winning out :toofunny:

Situation 2: The Steelers lose a different game and go 9-7 and Ravens win all of their other games. Everything else goes right and somehow, the Steelers are competing with the Ravens for the 6th wild card spot (I focus on the Ravens because they have the easiest remaining schedule). Let's assume the Dolphins and Jets lose 2, and that either Jacksonville or Denver loses 3.

2) Since the division games tiebreaker comes before the conference tiebreaker, it doesn't matter whether or not the conference tiebreaker includes divisional games. Since Ravens and Steelers were both swept by the Bengals and beat each other once, this is a tie.

3) If we give the Ravens the Lions game, they would be 5-5 in common games with 2 to go (Bears, Raiders), and if we give the Steelers the Browns game, the Steelers would be 6-5 with one to go (the Packers). So, if the Steelers 7th loss is against the Packers, the Ravens win (having won the rest of their games and gone 7-5 in common games to the Steeler's 6-6). If the Steelers 7th loss is against the Dolphins, they are tied at 7-5 and we go to number 4.

4) The Ravens would now be 7-5 in the conference (or 4-2 if you're not going to count divisional games). The Steelers would be 6-6 (or 3-3). Ravens win.


Basically, the Steelers need to win out. Otherwise, the chances are quite remote. After losses to the Bears, the Chiefs, and to the Raiders at home, I'm not feeling very confident.

GridironWarrior
12-08-2009, 03:38 PM
We were supposed to romp the Raiders and Chiefs as well and how did that turn out? Face it gang, our team isn't going to the playoffs. Let's just enjoy the next 4 weeks and not matter what happens its only a game. Life goes on. Christmas is here, enjoy it with friends and family.

GridironWarrior
12-08-2009, 04:42 PM
Again, if you go by that logic, we shouldn't win any more games at all, so just go ahead and put us at 6-10 right now. And if we're that bad ... well, it'd be kind of hard to "enjoy" that last four games.

Me? I'm still hoping that the team who started out 6-2 shows up. They're still in there somewhere.

If they go 6-10 I'll still enjoy watching them cause afterall it's only a game and there is only 4 more weeks of seeing the Steelers. Plus we'll get to see what the younger guys can do which will get me excited for the future of this team.

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 04:49 PM
TO BREAK A TIE WITHIN A DIVISION

If, at the end of the regular season, two or more clubs in the same division finish with identical won-lost-tied percentages, the following steps will be taken until a champion is determined.
Two Clubs

1. Head-to-head (best won-lost-tied percentage in games between the clubs).
2. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the division.
3. Best won-lost-tied percentage in common games.
4. Best won-lost-tied percentage in games played within the conference.
5. Strength of victory.
6. Strength of schedule.
7. Best combined ranking among conference teams in points scored and points allowed.
8. Best combined ranking among all teams in points scored and points allowed.
9. Best net points in common games.
10. Best net points in all games.
11. Best net touchdowns in all games.
12. Coin toss




1) Obviously if the Ravens beat the Steelers at Heinz field they win the first tiebreaker, and the Steelers are pretty much out of luck.

Assume that the Steelers beat the Ravens.

Situation 1: The Steelers go 10-6, meaning they beat the Dolphins in head to head. The only two things that can keep the Steelers out are Jacksonville losing only 1 more game or the Jets winning out :toofunny:

Situation 2: The Steelers lose a different game and go 9-7 and Ravens win all of their other games. Everything else goes right and somehow, the Steelers are competing with the Ravens for the 6th wild card spot (I focus on the Ravens because they have the easiest remaining schedule). Let's assume the Dolphins and Jets lose 2, and that either Jacksonville or Denver loses 3.

2) Since the division games tiebreaker comes before the conference tiebreaker, it doesn't matter whether or not the conference tiebreaker includes divisional games. Since Ravens and Steelers were both swept by the Bengals and beat each other once, this is a tie.

3) If we give the Ravens the Lions game, they would be 5-5 in common games with 2 to go (Bears, Raiders), and if we give the Steelers the Browns game, the Steelers would be 6-5 with one to go (the Packers). So, if the Steelers 7th loss is against the Packers, the Ravens win (having won the rest of their games and gone 7-5 in common games to the Steeler's 6-6). If the Steelers 7th loss is against the Dolphins, they are tied at 7-5 and we go to number 4.

4) The Ravens would now be 7-5 in the conference (or 4-2 if you're not going to count divisional games). The Steelers would be 6-6 (or 3-3). Ravens win.


Basically, the Steelers need to win out. Otherwise, the chances are quite remote. After losses to the Bears, the Chiefs, and to the Raiders at home, I'm not feeling very confident.

That's WAY to complicated and it shouldn't and wouldn't need to come to that if we take care of our own business first in foremost. All the tiebreakers and all that junk don't matter if we beat them and win out because A.) We win out making us 10-6 that includes Balty B.) That puts Balty at 9-7 and C.) Us winning out also includes Miami , and that means they go 9-7 at best. We would eliminate both of them from contention.

We need to win out, and the Jags need to lose 2 for the best case scenario.

The 5th and 6th spots would be open and it's not far fetched for us to land it. Can the players do it? Absolutely. Can they fold? YES! We'll see.

:tt04:

WH
12-08-2009, 04:50 PM
If they go 6-10 I'll still enjoy watching them cause afterall it's only a game and there is only 4 more weeks of seeing the Steelers. Plus we'll get to see what the younger guys can do which will get me excited for the future of this team.

What if the young guys suck=

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 05:07 PM
What if the young guys suck=

I think this "benching players" and "lineup changes" aren't going to be the whole entire wash of the whole team. It's more of a coaching ploy IMO. Tomlin will probably bench 1 or 2 starters and they would eventually get in the game any how in situations of need be. It won't be a complete wash out by no means.

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 05:08 PM
That's WAY to complicated and it shouldn't and wouldn't need to come to that if we take care of our own business first in foremost. All the tiebreakers and all that junk don't matter if we beat them and win out because A.) We win out making us 10-6 that includes Balty B.) That puts Balty at 9-7 and C.) Us winning out also includes Miami , and that means they go 9-7 at best. We would eliminate both of them from contention.

We need to win out, and the Jags need to lose 2 for the best case scenario.

The 5th and 6th spots would be open and it's not far fetched for us to land it. Can the players do it? Absolutely. Can they fold? YES! We'll see.

:tt04:


What do you mean way too complicated? That's the tiebreaker scenario at 9-7. I agree that it shouldn't come to that, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it won't come to that. As I said at the end, the Steelers need to win out, otherwise the chance of a playoff appearance is miniscule. The rest of it was just to demonstrate that if it comes down to a tiebreaker, the Steelers are not in good position. If they do win out, they still need either Jacksonville or Denver to lose 2 (we can just neglect the Jets).

StainlessStill
12-08-2009, 05:14 PM
What do you mean way too complicated? That's the tiebreaker scenario at 9-7. I agree that it shouldn't come to that, but I wouldn't go so far as to say that it won't come to that. As I said at the end, the Steelers need to win out, otherwise the chance of a playoff appearance is miniscule. The rest of it was just to demonstrate that if it comes down to a tiebreaker, the Steelers are not in good position. If they do win out, they still need either Jacksonville or Denver to lose 2 (we can just neglect the Jets).

Even though at 9-7 we would have a weensy eency chance, but 9-7 would pretty much be a nail in the coffin and we would need ALL teams to implode pretty harshly if it comes to it.

Right now, it's win out and the magic number is the Jags to lose two and judging by their schedule, they can and probably will. Don't worry about tiebreakers with the Ravens, or Dolphins, or Jets because considering if we DO win out, then we eliminate all of them and it will come down to us and Jacksonville, or possibly us and Denver for a 5th spot believe it or not.

10 gets us in.

SteelBaller
12-08-2009, 05:20 PM
Even though at 9-7 we would have a weensy eency chance, but 9-7 would pretty much be a nail in the coffin and we would need ALL teams to implode pretty harshly if it comes to it.

Right now, it's win out and the magic number is the Jags to lose two and judging by their schedule, they can and probably will. Don't worry about tiebreakers with the Ravens, or Dolphins, or Jets because considering if we DO win out, then we eliminate all of them and it will come down to us and Jacksonville, or possibly us and Denver for a 5th spot believe it or not.

10 gets us in.


Yeah I agree, I guess I'm just not that confident in the Steelers getting to 10. I've heard some people talk about the possibility of getting in with 9 wins, so I wanted to take a look at our chances. Those losses to KC and Oakland were devastating.

GridironWarrior
12-08-2009, 05:20 PM
Well if the young guys suck oh well, Iím still thankful to be able to even watch Football and root for a team that goes to the playoffs most of the time. Itís a game, my life doesnít change whether they make the dance or not. But it wonít stop me from enjoy watching the Steelers play.

Steel-Bryan
12-08-2009, 07:37 PM
IF pittsburgh doesent make the playoffs, i will be rooting for GB. We WILL MAKE IT THOUGH !

markymarc
12-08-2009, 08:38 PM
I still believe and hopefully the Steelers will realize that it's now or never. Just win out and let the chips fall where they may :tt02:

LVSteelersfan
12-08-2009, 08:40 PM
I don't give up until the last game is over or we are eliminated. NEVER. I will still watch the playoffs if they don't get in, though only halfheartedly. BUT, I will not believe they are eliminated until I actually see it. If Ben would just quit throwing picks in the end zone, it would help tremendously. Ben, get your head out please.

Bluedust
12-08-2009, 09:13 PM
Meh. Green Bay gets a lot of good fantasy football stats against crappy opponents. Any team worth half a shit has scored 30+ points on them.

And despite how it's become oh-so-fashionable to say our defense can't stop anyone ever, it's FAR better than any defense the Packers have faced so far this year. You want to jump on the "we have no defense and we're on a losing streak" bandwagon, then why not go ahead and concede all four games to make us 6-10, because with that logic, obviously we have no shot at beating anyone.

Me? I'm the least worried about the Packers out of any of our final four opponents, including Cleveland. This one has 31-10 romp written all over it.

Steel, I understand the sentiment.. but the Packers are for real, and Rodgers is a great QB. Gradkowski torched us, and Rodger's is the #5 QB in the league stat-wise.

Rodgers this season is:
65.5 Completion 25 TD 7 Int 103.3 QB Rating

Do you believe the Vikings have a good defense? They're 9th in Pass Defense and Rodgers played them twice, his lowest QB Rating was 108.5 against them.

This isn't even mentioning that the Packers have the #1 Total Defense at the moment.

Mags87
12-08-2009, 09:29 PM
ok so the teams left to fight for the wilcard spot are Den, Jax, Pit, Bal, Mia, and NYJ. lets see here: Denver looked absolutely pathetic against us, San Diego and Baltimore. i dunno about jaxonville cause i havent been following them. We let some (very) bad teams beat us in the very last part of the game. Baltimore needed OT at home playing us w/o Ben or Troy to win. Miami got throttled by Buffalo a few weeks back, and the Jets dont seem to have a late season QB with Sanchez. even the way we're playing, we have just as great of a shot as anyone else. you guys are only looking at part of the picture here. all you see is how we've been performing, not our competition.
Will GB be tough? of course. it will be at home though, with our strongest players back (hopefully) and they did lose to tampa earlier this year. we'll be going after the ravens for revenge after a thursday game.
if you look at just us right now, we're in trouble. but, our situation isnt that bad all things considered.

Bluedust
12-08-2009, 10:00 PM
ok so the teams left to fight for the wilcard spot are Den, Jax, Pit, Bal, Mia, and NYJ. lets see here: Denver looked absolutely pathetic against us, San Diego and Baltimore. i dunno about jaxonville cause i havent been following them. We let some (very) bad teams beat us in the very last part of the game. Baltimore needed OT at home playing us w/o Ben or Troy to win. Miami got throttled by Buffalo a few weeks back, and the Jets dont seem to have a late season QB with Sanchez. even the way we're playing, we have just as great of a shot as anyone else. you guys are only looking at part of the picture here. all you see is how we've been performing, not our competition.
Will GB be tough? of course. it will be at home though, with our strongest players back (hopefully) and they did lose to tampa earlier this year. we'll be going after the ravens for revenge after a thursday game.
if you look at just us right now, we're in trouble. but, our situation isnt that bad all things considered.

Okay.. *sigh* I know this is all for naught, but gonna try and bring some logic into this post.

Denver: Wishful thinking, helps you sleep better at night by putting them down.
Miami: Just beat New England after they were totally embarrassed by the Saints, can't list too many times the Pats have lost back to back games like that.
Jax: This team is nuts this season, can't honestly say yes or no on them getting in, but they've picked it up in the 2nd half.
Baltimore: Would love nothing more than to kick us out of playoff contention like we did to the Bengals in 2006.
Jets: Awful team, garbage.

You act like we haven't just lost 4 in a row, take the blinders off and function as a normal human, of course we have a shot, but it's an insanely narrow chance.

That said, I was cheering when the Ravens lost last night, and I'll be cheering the Steelers on against the Browns, but you're just lying to yourself to make things feel better by saying we have a good shot.

edit: But hey, we have Sweed instead of Hines on Thursday, and he's instilled confidence in us all, right?

Mags87
12-08-2009, 10:13 PM
Okay.. *sigh* I know this is all for naught, but gonna try and bring some logic into this post.

Denver: Wishful thinking, helps you sleep better at night by putting them down.
Miami: Just beat New England after they were totally embarrassed by the Saints, can't list too many times the Pats have lost back to back games like that.
Jax: This team is nuts this season, can't honestly say yes or no on them getting in, but they've picked it up in the 2nd half.
Baltimore: Would love nothing more than to kick us out of playoff contention like we did to the Bengals in 2006.
Jets: Awful team, garbage.

You act like we haven't just lost 4 in a row, take the blinders off and function as a normal human, of course we have a shot, but it's an insanely narrow chance.

That said, I was cheering when the Ravens lost last night, and I'll be cheering the Steelers on against the Browns, but you're just lying to yourself to make things feel better by saying we have a good shot.

i know that we've lost 4 straignt. im just trying to point out that we arent the only team with troubles right now. im almost 100% sure that denver has a WC spot, but no to say they have been w/o struggles. Again, baltimore needed OT to beat us at home with a 2nd year 3rd string QB getting his first start. saying theyd love to knock us out of the playoffs is tru, but we'd like to do the same to them. they might even be without Ed Reed. we can win that one. Green Bay is definately solid, but we do get to play then at Hienz at least. we'll also be playing for our playoff lives (some for their jobs). this is prolly the toughest game left. we dont play the jets or the jags so we gotta count on them losing by themselves.
we need to take baby steps, and the first one is winning a game. that opportunity comes in the form of a trip to Cleveland. win that, and we're on our way. i could lay down and die like you seemed to, but i dont want to do that. getting to the playoffs this way would be amazing. if it doesnt happen, we'll come back next year. but until it doesnt happen, im still thinking playoffs. call me blind, behind black and gold glasses, delusional,or whatever you want. that isnt gonna change what i want to happen. the team needs all the support it can get and you are saying give up. thats just not for me.

Steely McSmash
12-09-2009, 12:02 AM
TO BREAK A TIE WITHIN A DIVISION

If, at the end of the regular season, two or more clubs in the same division finish with identical won-lost-tied percentages, the following steps will be taken until a champion is determined.
Two Clubs
.......
sses to the Bears, the Chiefs, and to the Raiders at home, I'm not feeling very confident.

That is to break the tie for division champ -- does not apply to wildcard as I understand it.

Steely McSmash
12-09-2009, 12:06 AM
I kind of wonder if GB isn't looking good defensively because they play a 3-4 in a predominantly 4-3 division. Steelers tend to do better vs 3-4 than 4-3 but I suspect GB might have an advantage as one of the few NFC 3-4 teams.

SteelBaller
12-09-2009, 12:20 AM
That is to break the tie for division champ -- does not apply to wildcard as I understand it.


:dang: I guess you don't understand it. Can't you even look it up before questioning me?

http://www.nfl.com/standings/tiebreakingprocedures

TO BREAK A TIE FOR THE WILD-CARD TEAM

If it is necessary to break ties to determine the two Wild-Card clubs from each conference, the following steps will be taken.

1. If the tied clubs are from the same division, apply division tie breaker.
2. If the tied clubs are from different divisions, apply the following steps.

WH
12-09-2009, 06:05 AM
:dang: I guess you don't understand it. Can't you even look it up before questioning me?

http://www.nfl.com/standings/tiebreakingprocedures

TO BREAK A TIE FOR THE WILD-CARD TEAM

If it is necessary to break ties to determine the two Wild-Card clubs from each conference, the following steps will be taken.

1. If the tied clubs are from the same division, apply division tie breaker.
2. If the tied clubs are from different divisions, apply the following steps.

but he has more posts then you clearly that person knows more!!!!!:rofl:

The_WARDen
12-09-2009, 06:58 AM
Meh. Green Bay gets a lot of good fantasy football stats against crappy opponents. Any team worth half a shit has scored 30+ points on them.

And despite how it's become oh-so-fashionable to say our defense can't stop anyone ever, it's FAR better than any defense the Packers have faced so far this year. You want to jump on the "we have no defense and we're on a losing streak" bandwagon, then why not go ahead and concede all four games to make us 6-10, because with that logic, obviously we have no shot at beating anyone.

Me? I'm the least worried about the Packers out of any of our final four opponents, including Cleveland. This one has 31-10 romp written all over it.

until proven otherwise, they don't have a legit shot ....this team is playing like crap and until they stop playing like crap, why would anyone assume that they're just gonna flick a switch and it's gonna be 2008 again.

Green Bay is one of the hotter teams right now, so until proven otherwise I respect them and think it's gonna be a tough game for the Steelers.

Going by PPG (which I consider more important than YPG), GB has faced 2 better defenses than the Steelers - Cincy & Baltimore.

Psyychoward86
12-09-2009, 11:30 AM
Jags are ahead of a lot of wildcard teams in this race, but i think they are fakes (same can be said of us, which cant be blamed but back to my point.) They've lost or stooped down to mediocre competition all season long. They could easily lose 3 of the last 4 against Miami, Indy, and New England. Hell, if the Browns are pumped to play spoiler, maybe they'll lose all 4 lol. But im hoping for too much.


Anywho, here's a fun fact: Jaguars are dead last in the league in sacks with 12 on the season so far.


that could hurt them :stirthepot:

Steely McSmash
12-09-2009, 11:35 AM
but he has more posts then you clearly that person knows more!!!!!:rofl:

who said anything about that?

I read thisthe following steps will be taken until a champion is determined. and I assumed it was a mistake. I stand corrected. No need to get uppity.

MassSteeler
12-09-2009, 12:00 PM
If the Steelers win out, they'll get in. That's the way I look at it. We don't have to worry about what Denver does, because they appear to be a lock for one of the Wildcard spots. Baltimore, Miami, & New York all have at least 1 more loss left in them, and Jacksonville appears to have at least 2 left. If the Steelers handle their business, they should be fine.

WH
12-09-2009, 01:23 PM
who said anything about that?

I read this and I assumed it was a mistake. I stand corrected. No need to get uppity.

twas a joke kind sir :wave:

mwittman5
12-09-2009, 01:39 PM
If the Steelers win out, they'll get in. That's the way I look at it. We don't have to worry about what Denver does, because they appear to be a lock for one of the Wildcard spots. Baltimore, Miami, & New York all have at least 1 more loss left in them, and Jacksonville appears to have at least 2 left. If the Steelers handle their business, they should be fine.

the jets may actually ave it easy. They may play the falcons without matt ryan and the colts and bengals may be resting starters. I think they'll lose to the falcons tho and heck even the Bucs can surprise them, they beat the packers

SteelMember
12-09-2009, 01:54 PM
can no lose no more games. must wine!

ricardisimo
12-09-2009, 04:58 PM
For those of you who are enjoying working differential calculus and numbers theory into this thread, take a crack at this one:

Only KC and Cleveland have been eliminated from playoff contention (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/standings/playoffrace/seeds) through week 13. Please try explaining to me the scenario that would have to unfold for Buffalo and/or Oakland to get in.

I've got my abacus out right now, and I'm playing with it... but I promise I'll be paying attention all the same. :wink02:

StainlessStill
12-09-2009, 05:11 PM
For those of you who are enjoying working differential calculus and numbers theory into this thread, take a crack at this one:

Only KC and Cleveland have been eliminated from playoff contention (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/standings/playoffrace/seeds) through week 13. Please try explaining to me the scenario that would have to unfold for Buffalo and/or Oakland to get in.

I've got my abacus out right now, and I'm playing with it... but I promise I'll be paying attention all the same. :wink02:

Oh man, haha. My guess is that EVERY TEAM IN THE NFL, including the NFC would have to lose out, and that includes teams playing each other tieing as well.:applaudit:

MassSteeler
12-10-2009, 10:20 AM
the jets may actually ave it easy. They may play the falcons without matt ryan and the colts and bengals may be resting starters. I think they'll lose to the falcons tho and heck even the Bucs can surprise them, they beat the packers

Possibly, but the Jets are one of the most erratic teams in the NFL. I think 3 of those teams you mentioned can beat them with their backups in, and even the Bucs may be able to pull an upset. I see the Jets finishing 8-8 at best.

One thing to take into account is how the AFC East plays out as a whole. If the Dolphins overtake New England to win the division, NE becomes a part of the wildcard picture. I'm not exactly sure where they stand in terms of tie-breakers though.

markymarc
12-10-2009, 10:20 AM
Please try explaining to me the scenario that would have to unfold for Buffalo and/or Oakland to get in.

That is scary to think Buffalo and Oakland still have a playoff shot!

The_WARDen
12-10-2009, 10:31 AM
For those of you who are enjoying working differential calculus and numbers theory into this thread, take a crack at this one:

Only KC and Cleveland have been eliminated from playoff contention (http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/standings/playoffrace/seeds) through week 13. Please try explaining to me the scenario that would have to unfold for Buffalo and/or Oakland to get in.

I've got my abacus out right now, and I'm playing with it... but I promise I'll be paying attention all the same. :wink02:

not sure but think it involves the mayan calendar or something.

ricardisimo
12-10-2009, 02:50 PM
not sure but think it involves the mayan calendar or something.

Ah! Yes, and a lot of bloodshed and human sacrifice... the "Al Davis Way", as they called it back in Mayan times. That makes sense. Thanks!