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View Full Version : Arians might be in a little trouble with Tomlin per Jay Glazer and Bouchette


BlastFurnace
12-20-2009, 11:04 PM
On PG + Site:

http://plus.sites.post-gazette.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=58&Itemid=155

"Look for Bruce Arians to be fired after the season. I was not sure about that until someone told me that Jay Glazier said Arians has been making fun of Tomlin to other coaches. Now, I do not know if that is true or not. But I do know that Tomlin and Glazier are tight, so if Glazier said that, Tomlin must believe it.

Goodbye, B.A."

Also repeated by Jay Glazer on his site:

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/s...ountdown-122009

"There is no doubt Steelers head coach Mike Tomlin has heard that offensive coordinator Bruce Arians hasn't been too kind to him with his friends. Look for Tomlin to pull the plug on his offensive coordinator in the offseason."

vindrow
12-20-2009, 11:10 PM
All I want for christmas is Arians off the Steelers...

4xSBChamps
12-20-2009, 11:20 PM
if this is true, why wait to reprimand this insubordination until after the season?

:noidea:

if not done in a timely manner, it raises questions about who steers the ship in the locker-room, and Tomlin has always led me to believe he is a 'take-charge' kinda guy

mesaSteeler
12-20-2009, 11:21 PM
Well now how interesting. The article I posted from Fox about Arians badmouthing Tomlin was roundly condemned by the Arians lovers. Seems like there might be more to it.

Well we will see if any of the media ask Tomlin or Arians about this.

Glace
12-20-2009, 11:25 PM
We'll see....

If we win our last 2 games...make it into the playoffs and do damage.....like I said...winning cures all.

X-Terminator
12-20-2009, 11:26 PM
And yet, we still don't have a source, other than Jay Glazer's word.

Sorry, but until I see a source, I'm not inclined to believe it. I'm also not surprised that Douchette would believe a rumor told to him by someone else.

HAWK
12-20-2009, 11:27 PM
If this is true...somebody needs to grow up.

klick81
12-20-2009, 11:31 PM
If he's been acting like a little bitch, fire his ass.

BlastFurnace
12-20-2009, 11:34 PM
And yet, we still don't have a source, other than Jay Glazer's word.

Sorry, but until I see a source, I'm not inclined to believe it. I'm also not surprised that Bouchette would believe a rumor told to him by someone else.

Well...we will see. It's something to watch.

fansince'76
12-20-2009, 11:36 PM
Well now how interesting. The article I posted from Fox about Arians badmouthing Tomlin was roundly condemned by the Arians lovers.

Not an "Arians lover." Just not a member of the rabid irrational lynch mob, that's all.

tony hipchest
12-20-2009, 11:37 PM
Well now how interesting. The article I posted from Fox about Arians badmouthing Tomlin was roundly condemned by the Arians lovers. Seems like there might be more to it.

Well we will see if any of the media ask Tomlin or Arians about this.arians relatives will not believe anything until the rooneys finaly fire him.

arians himself could hold a press conference claiming that tomlin sucks and they wouldnt believe it until he was finally relieved of his duties.

MasterOfPuppets
12-20-2009, 11:42 PM
to quote mike tomlin.... "where there's smoke, there's usually fire" ...:noidea:

Steelersfan4life0655
12-20-2009, 11:45 PM
I dont if its just me, but right after the game Tomlin and B.A. met on the sidelines to congrat each other and you could tell that there seems to be a little tension there. but i could be looking into it alittle too much! but who knows? we will find out if all this is true at the end of the season!

tony hipchest
12-20-2009, 11:49 PM
to quote mike tomlin.... "where there's smoke, there's usually fire" ...:noidea:

I dont if its just me, but right after the game Tomlin and B.A. met on the sidelines to congrat each other and you could tell that there seems to be a little tension there. but i could be looking into it alittle too much! but who knows? we will find out if all this is true at the end of the season!

dont be haters.

casteeler
12-20-2009, 11:55 PM
arians in trouble with tomlin.... ok but i can't recall tomlin doing anything this season to remove him from the fire. I dislike arians as much as the next guy but tomlin hasn't done s*#t but promise and not deliver. Put aside the S.B tomlin has not sold me todays game was ben and his offense all that said shut your mouth arians!

Steelersfan4life0655
12-20-2009, 11:55 PM
Tony-


wasnt hating! lol just observing. i just want things to be fixed and get us back to being a year in year out good team with out giving us all high blood pressure every week. :tt04:

Rockonsteel
12-21-2009, 12:07 AM
Only problem here....I can't confirm the validity of this, but it true, makes this whole thing that much more complicated. A poster on another site said something about Arians having a clause in his contract that he can only be fired by Art II himself. If that's the case, then Tomlin's hands would be severly tied in this. It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

MACH1
12-21-2009, 12:39 AM
dont be haters.

Or fair weather fans. :rolleyes:

Preacher
12-21-2009, 12:51 AM
Not an "Arians lover." Just not a member of the rabid irrational lynch mob, that's all.


BINGO.


I am still amazed how people can't see the difference between being haters and discussing what a person disagrees with.

steelerchad
12-21-2009, 12:58 AM
arians in trouble with tomlin.... ok but i can't recall tomlin doing anything this season to remove him from the fire. I dislike arians as much as the next guy but tomlin hasn't done s*#t but promise and not deliver. Put aside the S.B tomlin has not sold me todays game was ben and his offense all that said shut your mouth arians!

Put aside the SB in his 2nd year? Yeah, OK. That makes a hell of a lot of sense.
How bout we put aside Cowher's SB? His only one by the way. I guess besides that SB he didn't do sh** either?

Here's the top 10 coaches in winning % of all-time and then the only 3 coaches the Steelers have had in the last 40 years. Anybody on this list who's not a HOF'er? Cowher will get in and join Noll soon enough.
Let's give Tomlin a chance, he's on pace for greatness after all.
Don't forget Tomlin's had 2 playoff season's so far with a 3-1 playoff record and is still in the hunt this year. I'm not happy about the current rough patch, but I think he's earned a little patience so far.

1. John Madden 103-22-7 .759
2. Vince Lombardi 96-34-6 .739
3. George Allen 116-47-5 .712
4. Banton Collier 76-34-2 .691
5. George Halas 318-148-31 .682
6. Paul Brown 213-104-9 .667 (includes All-American Football Conference Record)
7. Don Shula 328-156-6 .677
8. Joe Gibbs 154-94 .620
9. George Seifert 114-62 .648
10. Tony Dungy 102-58 .638


Chuck Noll 366- 209 .572
Bill Cowher 261- 161 .617
Mike Tomlin 29-16 .644

casteeler
12-21-2009, 01:28 AM
i am giving him a chance but he's not giving the steelers much of one.... yeah leave Gay in there. A good coach makes changes when they are obviously needed and not say were gonna unleash hell and not change a thing, the only reason we won today was the offense it sure wasn't the defense or the special teams

Preacher
12-21-2009, 01:34 AM
i am giving him a chance but he's not giving the steelers much of one.... yeah leave Gay in there. A good coach makes changes when they are obviously needed and not say were gonna unleash hell and not change a thing, the only reason we won today was the offense it sure wasn't the defense or the special teams

So as I asked someone else... who should we cut on defense and pick up to give us the immediate jump we need? Huh?

you DO realize we are playing with two backups right? While I don't agree with Tony's assessment that just putting Troy back will fix everything, it DOES make a difference.

Oh wait... wouldn't those changes actually be LeBeau's choices? Why are we having threads condemning LeBeau for his failings this year?

casteeler
12-21-2009, 01:54 AM
So as I asked someone else... who should we cut on defense and pick up to give us the immediate jump we need? Huh?

you DO realize we are playing with two backups right? While I don't agree with Tony's assessment that just putting Troy back will fix everything, it DOES make a difference.

Oh wait... wouldn't those changes actually be LeBeau's choices? Why are we having threads condemning LeBeau for his failings this year?

seems to me like Tomlin has the final say . If you see something that needs correcting maybe you should correct it and Gay should be first to be cut

Preacher
12-21-2009, 02:12 AM
seems to me like Tomlin has the final say . If you see something that needs correcting maybe you should correct it and Gay should be first to be cut

So you cut him..and replace him with whom? Who can come in NOW and replace Gay?

JEFF4i
12-21-2009, 02:16 AM
*sigh*

I'm fine with ripping on Arians, still not happy with the playcalling but my philosophy is just more traditional.

I'll give BA due credit, he was integral in calling a 503 passing game.

MasterOfPuppets
12-21-2009, 03:22 AM
BINGO.


I am still amazed how people can't see the difference between being haters and discussing what a person disagrees with.

cat hater ...:wtf:

Preacher
12-21-2009, 03:27 AM
cat hater ...:wtf:

:sofunny:

I can see the good in cats... well. No I cant. . . . :wink02:

ricksteelers55
12-21-2009, 03:46 AM
So you cut him..and replace him with whom? Who can come in NOW and replace Gay?

To me there's no doubt that Deshea is way better than Gay.

McFadden wasnt good enough to beat Deshea for the #2 spot but you will tell me that Gay is ? No way

1-Ike
2-Deshea
3-Gay
4-Burnett

I know the kid cant play ST but what about giving Keenan Lewis a chance ? He was a 3rd round pick and I'm sure he can be as good as the 2 5th rounders(Gay & Burnett)

mesaSteeler
12-21-2009, 07:52 AM
Only problem here....I can't confirm the validity of this, but it true, makes this whole thing that much more complicated. A poster on another site said something about Arians having a clause in his contract that he can only be fired by Art II himself. If that's the case, then Tomlin's hands would be severly tied in this. It's going to be interesting to see how this plays out.

Possible but I have not read of anything like this. I hope not. Tomlin should either have control of the team and his assistants or he should not.

However that being said I do know that Cowher fired assistants. I also seem to remember that the Rooneys did force Noll to replace assistants in the 80's. I could be wrong about the Rooneys and Noll though. It was a long time ago and I don't have time to look it up.

Tomlin and Arians will have to settle this quickly though since having dissension at the top of the chain of command is a bad thing.

madtowndrunkard
12-21-2009, 09:23 AM
Possible but I have not read of anything like this. I hope not. Tomlin should either have control of the team and his assistants or he should not.

However that being said I do know that Cowher fired assistants. I also seem to remember that the Rooneys did force Noll to replace assistants in the 80's. I could be wrong about the Rooneys and Noll though. It was a long time ago and I don't have time to look it up.

Tomlin and Arians will have to settle this quickly though since having dissension at the top of the chain of command is a bad thing.


If there were any truth to that I'm sure Mr. Rooney would grant Tomlin his wish....or at the very least let Colbert make the decision. I highly doubt there would be such a clause. Most likely Tomlin has no power to fire anyone. That would be left up to Colbert.


As to Tomlin's winning %..... he took over a SB team that is loaded with talent. The expectations of this team was to compete for a SB title. There is no way to sugar coat this season, it has been a disaster. The win vs GB was full of excitement. But it was also as ugly as they come. We completely abandoned the run. Our defense was a total failure....and a coaching gaffe that was arguably the worst decision I've ever seen.

Up next Baltimore.

fansince'76
12-21-2009, 09:25 AM
As to Tomlin's winning %..... he took over a SB team that is loaded with talent.

No, he took over a team that underachieved and went 8-8 the year before his arrival.

FacemeIke
12-21-2009, 09:32 AM
To me there's no doubt that Deshea is way better than Gay.

McFadden wasnt good enough to beat Deshea for the #2 spot but you will tell me that Gay is ? No way

1-Ike
2-Deshea
3-Gay
4-Burnett

I know the kid cant play ST but what about giving Keenan Lewis a chance ? He was a 3rd round pick and I'm sure he can be as good as the 2 5th rounders(Gay & Burnett)


Deshea's been worse then anyone in the secondary this year and will either retire or not make the roster next season.

Rockonsteel
12-21-2009, 09:34 AM
Possible but I have not read of anything like this. I hope not. Tomlin should either have control of the team and his assistants or he should not.

However that being said I do know that Cowher fired assistants. I also seem to remember that the Rooneys did force Noll to replace assistants in the 80's. I could be wrong about the Rooneys and Noll though. It was a long time ago and I don't have time to look it up.

Tomlin and Arians will have to settle this quickly though since having dissension at the top of the chain of command is a bad thing.

Yeah, like I said, I don't have any other confirmation, other than this poster. Apparently, he's pretty well informed about Steelers business. He said Dick Hoak had a similar clause that he could only be fired by Dan. He also said Cowher is the one that worked the deal for Arians to be elevated to OC if Whis and Grimm left. Included, in that clause, was the fact that he could only be fired by Art II. Not, sure exactly how much of that is true, but if it is, it does makes things a bit more interesting.



This is the post.........The dude Chemsteel, is the guy that's providing the info. Like I said, I can't confirm or dispute the validity of any of this, but this dude is pretty money when he does post "inside" info.


JimInPGH wrote:

Actually, this is also a chance for Tomlin to save face. If Tomlin had to fire Arians it would be an admission that Tomlin was wrong to hire him in the first place, and Tomlin's ego can't let him admit that. So Arian's "retirement" would save face all around.


Chemsteel wrote:

Coach Tomlin did not have a say in his offensive coordinator. Arians had a clause in his contract that if Coach Ken Whisenhut departed then he (Arians) would get the position of OC for the term of his contract.

JimInPGH wrote:

OK, you have good knowledge of the Steeler organization, so if you say it I'll accept it as true. I then have two questions:

(1) Who in the Steeler organization was behind giving Arians that clause?

(2) Does Tomlin now have the ability to fire Arians if he wants to?


Chemsteel wrote:

Bruce Arians and Coach Cowher were good friends in Kansas City. Arians went on to the Saints as TE Coach then on to the Colts as QB coach. He did a great job with Peyton Manning and many coaches in the NFL credit Coach Arians with making Manning the great QB he is now.

Coach Cowher hired Arians as the QB coach when Arians was fired in Cleveland. Coach Cowher had all control at that time after his struggles with Tom Donahue. The clause was approved by Mr. Rooney. The announcement that Bruce Arians was the new offensive coordinator by Coach Tomlin in January of 2007 was perfuntory.

Only Art Rooney II can fire Arians at this point but that may be moot since Bruce Arians is a "Stand Up" guy and will do what is right for the Steelers and the Rooney Family.

Besides, if Coach Cowher comes back into the NFL in 2010, Arians would welcome a continued relationship with Bill Cowher.

Lambertfan
12-21-2009, 09:36 AM
Steelersfan4life0655 you were right at least the way I saw it...Like hugging a relative you did not like but had to in front of dad!!!:tt04::tt04::tt04::drink::tt::tt02:

FacemeIke
12-21-2009, 09:38 AM
I did see Tomlin get on Arians a bit on the sidelines after a playcall yesterday. I can't remember which play though. But, if Arians really is doing that he needs to be out of here. Of all the people Arians has the least room to talk about someone not doing their job. He's lucky the defense bailed him out so often last season or else he wouldnt even have a job right now.

Lambertfan
12-21-2009, 09:39 AM
We are down Smith and Troy and Kerskie was out for a while so there goes rotating player and keeping them fresh and it showed nothing to do with bad D coaching...

madtowndrunkard
12-21-2009, 09:45 AM
No, he took over a team that underachieved and went 8-8 the year before his arrival.


Lets be honest..... Why was that team 8-8? think it had anything to do with Ben bouncing his head off a windshield just months prior to that season starting? Remember Ben's horrible play during the first half of that season? Recall the last 8 games of that season? We started out 2-6 and finished 6-2.

So if you wanted to be honest....you'd acknowledge the fact that Tomlin did in fact take over a SB caliber team.....and we still have one Talent wise.

fansince'76
12-21-2009, 09:46 AM
Lets be honest..... Why was that team 8-8? think it had anything to do with Ben bouncing his head off a windshield just months prior to that season starting? Remember Ben's horrible play during the first half of that season? Recall the last 8 games of that season? We started out 2-6 and finished 6-2.

So if you wanted to be honest....you'd acknowledge the fact that Tomlin did in fact take over a SB caliber team.....and we still have one Talent wise.

He took over a team that finished 8-8 in 2006. Fact. And do we not have injuries now?

madtowndrunkard
12-21-2009, 09:48 AM
Arians should be fired based on the performance of our offense.....nothing to do with him clowning Tomlin if that did in fact happen.

FacemeIke
12-21-2009, 09:49 AM
The irrational posts calling for Tomlin's head are why people roll their eyes at the rational posts calling for Arians to be replaced.

madtowndrunkard
12-21-2009, 10:00 AM
He took over a team that finished 8-8 in 2006. Fact. And do we not have injuries now?


What ever dude. Ben is healthy now and in the prime of his career. A far cry from what unfolded in 06 when Ben was absolutely horrible those first 8 games after nearly killing himself on a motorcycle. There were clear and obvious reasons for that 8-8 season and it had little to do with coaching and more to do with bad QB play. Holmes was a rookie, Cedrick Wilson was suppose to be our #2 WR. Porter and Haggans had a combined total of 13 sacks. Not to mention Cowher was able to rally the team and finish the season 6-2. The complete opposite of what is happening this year w/ the team basically quitting on the coaching staff.

Point of this was Tomlin's winning %. If you think his high winning % has nothing to do with the talent this team has then go ahead and tell your self that. I'd love to see what Tomlin and his staff would do with a bad QB and average OLB's. This team has more talent then almost ever team in the league....you could probably argue we have the most talent as a whole - period.

fansince'76
12-21-2009, 10:03 AM
Yeah, that last drive really showed a lot of "quit." Whatever, dude.

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-21-2009, 10:03 AM
The irrational posts calling for Tomlin's head are why people roll their eyes at the rational posts calling for Arians to be replaced.

Not true. People call for Tomlin's head because we lose a game or try an onside kick, but they ignore his record and how the players respond to him. That seems irrational to me.

People call for Arians head because he doesnt run the wildcat or doesnt have a 250lb back are irrational. People calling for him to be replaced that have more thought out reasons are grouped into the "hater" category incorrectly.

KeiselPower99
12-21-2009, 10:20 AM
Im not an Arians fan and if in fact the Glazer story is true then he needs shit canned. ASAP. Yesterdays play calling was ok just because we did such a great job throwing the ball. Tomlin knows what he has in this offense BUT we need a more balance. Ive always said throw it in the first half run it in the second half. It may be a lil bit of Cowher ball but it works.

steel9guy
12-21-2009, 10:23 AM
Im not an Arians fan and if in fact the Glazer story is true then he needs shit canned. ASAP. Yesterdays play calling was ok just because we did such a great job throwing the ball. Tomlin knows what he has in this offense BUT we need a more balance. Ive always said throw it in the first half run it in the second half. It may be a lil bit of Cowher ball but it works.

Yes I agree. I wish we would RUN IT MORE and lock up games when we have leads.

HometownGal
12-21-2009, 04:59 PM
Not true. People call for Tomlin's head because we lose a game or try an onside kick, but they ignore his record and how the players respond to him. That seems irrational to me.



Last I knew, Arians has the same "record" with the Steelers as Tomlin, yet he is the anti-Christ, even when the Steelers put up a lot of points and the Steelers D/ST's squander away our leads . . . and our W's. :banging: Had the D been able to protect the leads Arians offense gave them in the 4 losses that can be directly attributed to their ineffectiveness, the Steelers would be an 11-3 team right now and sitting atop the AFCN, yet the D is rarely ever called out. Go figure.

People calling for him to be replaced that have more thought out reasons are grouped into the "hater" category incorrectly.

That's simply not true and you know it. When I call someone a hater, it is because just about every thread that has nothing to do with Arians is turned into an Arians bashing thread by a select group of people around here. Also - your reference to "thought out reasons" are simply opinions and you know the cliche on opinions.

Sharkissle29
12-21-2009, 05:11 PM
What ever dude. Ben is healthy now and in the prime of his career. A far cry from what unfolded in 06 when Ben was absolutely horrible those first 8 games after nearly killing himself on a motorcycle. There were clear and obvious reasons for that 8-8 season and it had little to do with coaching and more to do with bad QB play. Holmes was a rookie, Cedrick Wilson was suppose to be our #2 WR. Porter and Haggans had a combined total of 13 sacks. Not to mention Cowher was able to rally the team and finish the season 6-2. The complete opposite of what is happening this year w/ the team basically quitting on the coaching staff.

Point of this was Tomlin's winning %. If you think his high winning % has nothing to do with the talent this team has then go ahead and tell your self that. I'd love to see what Tomlin and his staff would do with a bad QB and average OLB's. This team has more talent then almost ever team in the league....you could probably argue we have the most talent as a whole - period.

I tend to disagree with basically everything you post.

if you remember 06, cowher basically checked out before the season started.....there was definitely poor coaching on our end (not saying cowher is a bad coach, he just seemed content)

NJarhead
12-21-2009, 05:15 PM
Not an "Arians lover." Just not a member of the rabid irrational lynch mob, that's all.

Count me in on that list too. I'm more the rational type and I only have venom for our opposition.

Aussie_steeler
12-21-2009, 05:19 PM
I have a problem with the performance of some players over the last 6 weeks. Obviously some dont have:

* the talent to compete effective in their allocated roles
* the capacity to perform at a high level anymore
* the desire to work hard to remain competitive on the squad

Tomlin, Arians and Le Beau have zero chance at improving points 1 & 2. They could impact a players desire but in the age of Free agency we dont know the real motives of some ( staying fit for one last contract)

Tomlin, Arians and Le Beau are in trouble if this team keeps getting older and slower in the personnel department. If they have to rely on players like Tyrone Carter, Deshea Townsend, William Gay and Travis Kirschke to play major roles then they are going to struggle again.

A Interception here, at TD catch there, a kick return tackle maybe and we are not having these discussions.
IMO it is a personnel issue and the steelers have been caught out this for lacking in depth in key positions,

El-Gonzo Jackson
12-21-2009, 06:09 PM
Last I knew, Arians has the same "record" with the Steelers as Tomlin, yet he is the anti-Christ, even when the Steelers put up a lot of points and the Steelers D/ST's squander away our leads . . . and our W's. :banging: Had the D been able to protect the leads Arians offense gave them in the 4 losses that can be directly attributed to their ineffectiveness, the Steelers would be an 11-3 team right now and sitting atop the AFCN, yet the D is rarely ever called out. Go figure.



That's simply not true and you know it. When I call someone a hater, it is because just about every thread that has nothing to do with Arians is turned into an Arians bashing thread by a select group of people around here. Also - your reference to "thought out reasons" are simply opinions and you know the cliche on opinions.

Yes, their records are the same over the past 3 years, but if you have heard interviews from people that played for or coached above him... the likes of John Lynch, Darren Sharper, Brad Childress, Tony Dungy about Tomlin you would be impressed.

I havent heard Tom Moore, Butch Davis, Bill Cowher or anybody that isnt working directly with Arians say anything glowing about the guy. The current Steeler regime is supportive as they should be, but the guy isnt on the same level as Tomlin.

I'm not a blanket hater of the guy. I never liked his offensive philosophy when he was given the OC job and the knee jerk reactions many fans on this board have to calls or situations that Arians manages......are not a suprise to me at all. I think Arians is a good coach, the same way that I think June Jones and Steve Spurrier are good coaches........I just dont like to see that kind of football in cold weather in December/ January.

WH
12-21-2009, 06:12 PM
If Tomlin is pissed that Arians is saying he looks like Omar Epps to other coaches......sorry coach, but it's true.

revefsreleets
12-22-2009, 04:36 PM
If Arians is not performing to Steelers standards BY STEELERS standards, than Rooney will shitcan him. The guys not stupid. And I'm sure Tomlin has his ear. If the HC walks into the FO and says "I can't work with this guy anymore", that guy is gone...

And I'm fine with that. The coaches need to be in complete cahoots for this all to work. At that point it has NOTHING to do with what Arians is or is not doing right or wrong, it's simply a matter of chemistry...