PDA

View Full Version : Raven and Steelers


lukas
01-10-2010, 03:32 PM
Let me preface this by saying that I have always been a huge Steelers fan my entire life. Because what I am saying can be interpreted as heresy:

It is no secret that the Ravens and Steelers are long-lost brothers. Personally, I consider the Ravens as the black sheep of the family, as I'd like to think that the Steelers organization is far classier. However, it cannot be denied that both teams ideologically espouse a stingy and physical defense, a brutal run-game, and a mentality of smashmouth football to punch the other team in the throat till they have their way with the opposing team in the second half.

I was watching the Patriots game, which just ended:

Is it just me, or are the Ravens the epitome of "Steelers football", and the Steelers themselves have digressed from their own ideology?

They had a stingy defense that shut down Randy Moss, they had incredibly big, splash plays on defense that consistently killed Patriot's momentum. Ray Rice was ripping down the middle of the Patriot's D all-game, with his YPC getting wider and wider as the defense got more gassed. By the time the Ravens had a sizeable lead, they just played smash-mouth football and ran out the clock, inadvertently beating a very, very dead horse.

I'm not trying to start a flame war, as I understand that while Ravens and Steeler's respective fanbase have mutual respect for each other, it is underlying a deep-seated hatred.

My question is: do you fellow Steelers fans approve of our slow but steady shift to a pass-first, finesse-oriented play? We won a superbowl that way, and it can't be denied that any team can trust having BB throwing the ball down the field in a two-minute comeback drive.

I just can't help but feel a twinge of nostalgia watching the Ravens play today, like watching a specter of the Steeler's past.

Thoughts?

HHUnjan
01-10-2010, 03:38 PM
I don't know about you, but i miss that fact that our run game isn't as dominate as before. I even miss our dominate defense.

However, I feel that the pass game gives the offense more versatility and BB excels at this type of play calling. We have 3 awesome WRs that can make plays. If Mendenhall can improve on his skills this offseason, i think we could be a well-balanced, more dangerous team.

zulater
01-10-2010, 03:38 PM
I feel unclean having read this.:horror: :redface:

Never forget. :sign02:

And you'll feel pure once again.:helmet:

lukas
01-10-2010, 03:39 PM
I feel unclean having read this.:horror: :sign02: :redface:

I felt unclean after writing it.

stillers4me
01-10-2010, 03:41 PM
I don't know about you, but i miss that fact that our run game isn't as dominate as before. I even miss our dominate defense.

However, I feel that the pass game gives the offense more versatility and BB excels at this type of play calling. We have 3 awesome WRs that can make plays. If Mendenhall can improve on his skills this offseason, i think we could be a well-balanced, more dangerous team.

I am thrilled we have a QB and 3 super WR but definitely feel we need more balance on the offense. Different situations call for different weapons. We have them, so why not use them?

supa_fly_steeler
01-10-2010, 03:43 PM
i will never assosciate that scumbag team as our brothers.

Vincent
01-10-2010, 03:51 PM
I felt unclean after writing it.

Over the next 24 hours hair should start growing on your palms.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 03:58 PM
to get to the playoffs, first and foremost you gotta get to the playoffs.

the browns went on a 4 game winning streak to close the season with less than 100 passing yards per game, but a runner who had about 600 yds in 3 games alone.

cinci won the division by pounding the rock with a back who averaged almost 100 ypg (2nd in the league to chris johnson).

and then look at what the ravens did today.

teh steelers are now the black sheep of the afc north. we used to own this division, but for some reason we have shifted the philosophy of what it takes to win it.

arians tried to reinvent the wheel and grossly failed.

MACH1
01-10-2010, 04:02 PM
Running game?
Who needs a running game when you can pass for 4000 yds and have two 1000 yd receivers.

stillers4me
01-10-2010, 04:03 PM
to get to the playoffs, first and foremost you gotta get to the playoffs.

the browns went on a 4 game winning streak to close the season with less than 100 passing yards per game, but a runner who had about 600 yds in 3 games alone.

cinci won the division by pounding the rock with a back who averaged almost 100 ypg (2nd in the league to chris johnson).

and then look at what the ravens did today.

teh steelers are now the black sheep of the afc north. we used to own this division, but for some reason we have shifted the philosophy of what it takes to win it.

arians tried to reinvent the wheel and grossly failed.

:thumbsup:

There's nothing wrong with an offense that can strike like lighting. But we need some thunder on the ground. That's how other teams beat us. We were outsteelered in a big way this year. I don't want to put a leash on Ben, just use him more wisely. There's nothing better than watching Ben air it out and strike for 6. We have the WR's to do it. Just burn up a little turf along the way and manage the clock a little better.

And yes....do something about the daggum secondary. duh.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 04:06 PM
Running game?
Who needs a running game when you can pass for 4000 yds and have two 1000 yd receivers.dont be a hater mach. its all part of the master plan.

we will trick the rest of the division to abandon the run and smashmouth philosophy.

and once they all switch to a pass first, arial, offense we will rule the division once again! :muhaha:

MACH1
01-10-2010, 04:08 PM
:toofunny::toofunny::banging:

cakmakli
01-10-2010, 04:21 PM
Maybe Bruce would be kind enough to go down there and "help" them out.

Bluedust
01-10-2010, 04:26 PM
Let me preface this by saying that I have always been a huge Steelers fan my entire life. Because what I am saying can be interpreted as heresy:

It is no secret that the Ravens and Steelers are long-lost brothers. Personally, I consider the Ravens as the black sheep of the family, as I'd like to think that the Steelers organization is far classier. However, it cannot be denied that both teams ideologically espouse a stingy and physical defense, a brutal run-game, and a mentality of smashmouth football to punch the other team in the throat till they have their way with the opposing team in the second half.

I was watching the Patriots game, which just ended:

Is it just me, or are the Ravens the epitome of "Steelers football", and the Steelers themselves have digressed from their own ideology?

They had a stingy defense that shut down Randy Moss, they had incredibly big, splash plays on defense that consistently killed Patriot's momentum. Ray Rice was ripping down the middle of the Patriot's D all-game, with his YPC getting wider and wider as the defense got more gassed. By the time the Ravens had a sizeable lead, they just played smash-mouth football and ran out the clock, inadvertently beating a very, very dead horse.

I'm not trying to start a flame war, as I understand that while Ravens and Steeler's respective fanbase have mutual respect for each other, it is underlying a deep-seated hatred.

My question is: do you fellow Steelers fans approve of our slow but steady shift to a pass-first, finesse-oriented play? We won a superbowl that way, and it can't be denied that any team can trust having BB throwing the ball down the field in a two-minute comeback drive.

I just can't help but feel a twinge of nostalgia watching the Ravens play today, like watching a specter of the Steeler's past.

Thoughts?

Flacco is on training wheels, just like Ben was in 2005. I'd imagine they'll be throwing much more once they give Flacco more responsibilities, if that ever happens. Depends on if he takes off like Ben and does a good job with it.

That said, we'd all love that dominant run game, but you can't just wrinkle your nose and make it happen, gotta work with what you have, with Mendy finally coming along this year I'm sure we'll see a more balanced attack, hopefully.

lukas
01-10-2010, 04:34 PM
Hopefully Mendenhall is the advent of the Bus 2.0. I miss 36's happy "my feet are on fire" dance after a big gain up the middle. It's as iconic as Hines' grin.

smokin3000gt
01-10-2010, 05:01 PM
Over the next 24 hours hair should start growing on your palms.

mine are already hairy..



buh-dunt-chshhhh

T.Richardson
01-10-2010, 05:03 PM
to get to the playoffs, first and foremost you gotta get to the playoffs.

the browns went on a 4 game winning streak to close the season with less than 100 passing yards per game, but a runner who had about 600 yds in 3 games alone.

cinci won the division by pounding the rock with a back who averaged almost 100 ypg (2nd in the league to chris johnson).

and then look at what the ravens did today.

teh steelers are now the black sheep of the afc north. we used to own this division, but for some reason we have shifted the philosophy of what it takes to win it.

arians tried to reinvent the wheel and grossly failed.

and how many superbowls did that produce?

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 05:06 PM
and how many superbowls did that produce?

this year for the steelers- 0

this decade for the division- 2

what else you got, bruce jr.?

T.Richardson
01-10-2010, 05:08 PM
this year for the steelers- 0

this decade for the division- 2

what else you got, bruce jr.?

1

lasts year superbowl, the defense was pretty bad, the run game was prettty bad. Ben and the "pass happy" offense won on the last drive of the game.

MACH1
01-10-2010, 05:12 PM
1

lasts year superbowl, the defense was pretty bad, the run game was prettty bad. Ben and the "pass happy" offense won on the last drive of the game.

:huh: Last year didn't we have the #1 defense. They musta sucked. :doh:

T.Richardson
01-10-2010, 05:17 PM
:huh: Last year didn't we have the #1 defense. They musta sucked. :doh:

374 passing yards, and 400+ total yards in the Superbowl isnt dominate.

MACH1
01-10-2010, 05:22 PM
374 passing yards, and 400+ total yards in the Superbowl isnt dominate.

And the highly potent 30th ranked redzone offense is? :noidea:

I'd be fine with arians if he figured out the redzone stuff, learned clock management at the end of a game and stopped with egg-headed calls at the worst time of a game. Thats not to much to ask is it.

WH
01-10-2010, 05:36 PM
And the highly potent 30th ranked redzone offense is? :noidea:

I'd be fine with arians if he figured out the redzone stuff, learned clock management at the end of a game and stopped with egg-headed calls at the worst time of a game. Thats not to much to ask is it.

If only Dick Lebeau would use that genius mind for defense he has to adapt his defense to not having Troy Polamalu so they could stop giving up double digit leads.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 05:36 PM
1

lasts year superbowl, the defense was pretty bad, the run game was prettty bad. Ben and the "pass happy" offense won on the last drive of the game.


1? what are you talking about? this thread is about the division.

funny how last years defense was never a problem on this board until arians head was on the chopping block.

anyways the way of the afc north led the ravens to a sb in 00 and the steelers in 05.

it also led the steelers to afc champ games in 01, 04, 05, and the ravens in 00, and 08. the slow to learn bungles and browns (who have been playiff failures using the arians philosophy in 02 and 05) are just now catching on.

those are the indisputable facts.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 05:42 PM
I have no problem with running the ball more. None whatsoever. The Ravens' game plan was very simple, but it was executed to perfection.

But I also do NOT want to have a $102 million QB, who also happens to be one of the best in the league at his position, doing nothing but handing the ball off 40 times a game, every game. Too many people in The Nation want to do that, and I just do not understand why. Throwing the football isn't all that scary, really!

MACH1
01-10-2010, 05:43 PM
If only Dick Lebeau would use that genius mind for defense he has to adapt his defense to not having Troy Polamalu so they could stop giving up double digit leads.

Clock management would keep the D off the the field longer. Especially in the 4th qtr.

As one hater said before, the 4 minute offense would be nice.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 05:46 PM
Too many people in The Nation want to do that, and I just do not understand why. Throwing the football isn't all that scary, really!

false. typical strawman argument.

nobody wants to revert back to the days of kent graham and jim miller. NOBODY!

WH
01-10-2010, 05:46 PM
Clock management would keep the D off the the field longer. Especially in the 4th qtr.

As one hater said before, the 4 minute offense would be nice.

With this D you wanted them to be on the field ASAP so the other team would score fast enough for the offense to have time for a 2 minute drill to seal up the game in the final seconds.

WH
01-10-2010, 05:48 PM
Too many people in The Nation want to do that, and I just do not understand why. Throwing the football isn't all that scary, really!
This team doesn't have the offensive line to be throwing the ball 30-40 times a game effectively every single game.

WH
01-10-2010, 05:52 PM
Ben and the "pass happy" offense won on the last drive of the game. But it was Ben and the pass happy offense that nearly f'd it all up when they called pass plays on 2 of 3 plays from the Steelers' own 1 yard line with the shittiest o-line to ever be in a superbowl. Which not only resulted in a safety because of the holding penalty, but failed to take that extra 40-80 seconds off the clock.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 05:55 PM
false. typical strawman argument.

nobody wants to revert back to the days of kent graham and jim miller. NOBODY!

I wholeheartedly disagree, and I'll just leave it at that.

This team doesn't have the offensive line to be throwing the ball 30-40 times a game effectively.

They don't have the OL to be running 30-40 times per game effectively either. That, of course, points to a problem that seems to be overlooked by those who constantly bash Arians...the OL being average at best. There's a reason why the Ravens were able to execute their game plan so well - they have a MUCH better OL than the Steelers do. If the OL improves and we run the ball better next season, we will definitely see more balance. Otherwise, expect more passes than runs again, because that will be the team's strength, like it or not.

zulater
01-10-2010, 05:57 PM
But it was Ben and the pass happy offense that nearly f'd it all up when they called pass plays on 2 of 3 plays from the Steelers' own 1 yard line with the shittiest o-line to ever be in a superbowl. Which not only resulted in a safety because of the holding penalty, but failed to take that extra 40-80 seconds off the clock.

Why are we tearing each other apart over a game we won last season? A Super Bowl win no less! :toofunny:

WH
01-10-2010, 05:59 PM
They don't have the OL to be running 30-40 times per game effectively either. That, of course, points to a problem that seems to be overlooked by those who constantly bash Arians...the OL being average at best. There's a reason why the Ravens were able to execute theri game plan so well - they have a MUCH better OL than the Steelers do. If the OL improves and we run the ball better next season, we will definitely see more balance. Otherwise, expect more passes than runs again, because that will be the team's strength, like it or not.

But if they run the ball more that means the opposing defense has to play both the run and the pass on each down....making it easier on the oline because it keeps the other team guessing so they can't bring as many blitzers..

WH
01-10-2010, 05:59 PM
Why are we tearing each other apart over a game we won last season? A Super Bowl win no less! :toofunny:

Because that's what Steelers fans do.

zulater
01-10-2010, 06:01 PM
I got news for you all. None of the Steelers 6 Super Bowl wins were without warts. But like the man with the super model wife who burns dinner slightly, it's not something you dwell on. Unless of course you're insane, gay or just a real a-hole.:wink02:

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 06:01 PM
But if they run the ball more that means the opposing defense has to play both the run and the pass on each down....making it easier on the oline because it keeps the other team guessing so they can't bring as many blitzers..

And if they aren't running the ball effectively enough, the opposing defense will just crowd the line and bring pressure all day because they know you can't run. Kinda like...the Ravens today. Imagine that!

So it isn't quite as simple as it seems.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 06:04 PM
I wholeheartedly disagree, and I'll just leave it at that.

.and i will disagree with your opinion. :drink:

WH
01-10-2010, 06:05 PM
And if they aren't running the ball effectively enough, the opposing defense will just crowd the line and bring pressure all day because they know you can't run. Kinda like...the Ravens today. Imagine that!

So it isn't quite as simple as it seems.

But the Steelers have a proven passing game that they absolutely have to respect.

WH
01-10-2010, 06:07 PM
I got news for you all. None of the Steelers 6 Super Bowl wins were without warts. But like the man with the super model wife who burns dinner slightly, it's not something you dwell on. Unless of course you're insane, gay or just a real a-hole.:wink02:

Raises hand for option #3, real a-hole.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 06:17 PM
But the Steelers have a proven passing game that they absolutely have to respect.

Yes, and who is responsible for that? And please, don't give me the talent thing - someone has to call the plays, and we know Ben does not call them all. If the OC is responsible for all of their failures, then they should also get credit for their successes.

Anyway, the Ravens showed Marsha and Co. absolutely no respect today, and they're supposed to have one of the most feared passing attacks in the league. Their OL is about as good (or bad) as the Steelers' OL, and that ultimately is what did them in. They could not run the ball and could not protect Marsha, and as a result, they are one and done. They'd had that problem all season. The OL is where it starts - if you want more balance on offense, then those guys need to do a better job, period.

ytsan2q
01-10-2010, 06:22 PM
If the Ravens would have had to depend on their QB in the game they would have lost. The Patriots have no running game. That's what did them as well as the Eagles in. We won the Super Bowl last year without a running game. As late as we have been picking in the draft recently, it's going to be hard to find good run blocking O-linemen.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 06:50 PM
Yes, and who is responsible for that? And please, don't give me the talent thing - someone has to call the plays, and we know Ben does not call them all. If the OC is responsible for all of their failures, then they should also get credit for their successes..so now all of a sudden it is about the coaching and not the talent that executes?

:willy:

xbroughneck
01-10-2010, 07:14 PM
And if they aren't running the ball effectively enough, the opposing defense will just crowd the line and bring pressure all day because they know you can't run. Kinda like...the Ravens today. Imagine that!

So it isn't quite as simple as it seems.

See, that's where you and I disagree. The PATRIOTS are not built to run the football, and their OFFENSIVE PLAYBOOK is not designed to have a consistent, steady running attack against a team like the Ravens. They've got this "we've got Brady and Moss so we don't really care about the run" attitude that I hate. It's an attitude that Bruce Arians has nurtured as well.

If you run once..get 1 yard... then run twice...get two yards....then throw the ball the next eight plays because they stopped you on the first two...that is NOT running to win. That's trying to run and giving up on it because it's hard. That's what a team like the Patriots would do, and it's what the STeelers and Arians would tend to do. Give a half ass attempt at establishing a running game, then chuck it because it may not have worked inititally.

xbroughneck
01-10-2010, 07:16 PM
If the Ravens would have had to depend on their QB in the game they would have lost. The Patriots have no running game. That's what did them as well as the Eagles in. We won the Super Bowl last year without a running game. As late as we have been picking in the draft recently, it's going to be hard to find good run blocking O-linemen.

You get better at run blocking through repetition as well. You don't have to have four first round Olinemen to effectively run the ball. You have to coach and prepare the players to execute, then have them do it on the field.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 07:21 PM
so now all of a sudden it is about the coaching and not the talent that executes?

:willy:

Nope. I say BOTH are equally responsible for the success or failure of the offense. Arians and the offense does a good job between the 20s...not so good inside the 20. Both playcalling (empty sets, lack of a running game) and execution (dropped passes, sacks, turnovers) are responsible for those problems, just as playcalling and execution is responsible for the successes. I mean, you don't put up the numbers the O did this season if your OC and players are completely inept. However, most only want to blame one aspect when it fails (coaching) while giving him no credit for the successes, and absolving the players of all blame when they fail while giving them all the credit when they don't; I am not one of those people.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 07:32 PM
See, that's where you and I disagree. The PATRIOTS are not built to run the football, and their OFFENSIVE PLAYBOOK is not designed to have a consistent, steady running attack against a team like the Ravens. They've got this "we've got Brady and Moss so we don't really care about the run" attitude that I hate. It's an attitude that Bruce Arians has nurtured as well.

If you run once..get 1 yard... then run twice...get two yards....then throw the ball the next eight plays because they stopped you on the first two...that is NOT running to win. That's trying to run and giving up on it because it's hard. That's what a team like the Patriots would do, and it's what the STeelers and Arians would tend to do. Give a half ass attempt at establishing a running game, then chuck it because it may not have worked inititally.

But the Pats* have been successful with that mentality. You cannot argue against that. As I said, their problem is their OL, both in not being able to run block and not being able to protect Marsha.

Dude, I'm all for running the football, but if it's getting you nowhere, why keep doing it? This is the attitude I'm talking about with the "let's run it 40 times a game regardless of whether or not it works." If Arians did that with the running game and as a result wasn't able to score, he would get railroaded for that too. Plus, how many times have you heard Steelers fans bitching about "going conservative" and playing prevent offense in the 2nd half, especially when Cowher was HC? Now we have an OC and an offense capable of being aggressive and keeping the pressure on, and now THAT apparently is bad. Which is it?

MACH1
01-10-2010, 07:38 PM
No matter who's coaching, they're always going to get bitched about. That's just the way it is, can't please all of the people all of the time.

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 08:06 PM
Nope. I say BOTH are equally responsible for the success or failure of the offense. Arians and the offense does a good job between the 20s...not so good inside the 20. Both playcalling (empty sets, lack of a running game) and execution (dropped passes, sacks, turnovers) are responsible for those problems, just as playcalling and execution is responsible for the successes. I mean, you don't put up the numbers the O did this season if your OC and players are completely inept. However, most only want to blame one aspect when it fails (coaching) while giving him no credit for the successes, and absolving the players of all blame when they fail while giving them all the credit when they don't; I am not one of those people.and i am not one of those people who has hatred in my heart for an offensive coordinator of a football team. the offensive situation of the steelers is the easiest to rectalfy. all it takes is arians to simply quit being so freaking stubborn and pull his head out of his ass. the defense and ST will take some work.

But the Pats* have been successful with that mentality. You cannot argue against that. As I said, their problem is their OL, both in not being able to run block and not being able to protect Marsha.

Dude, I'm all for running the football, but if it's getting you nowhere, why keep doing it? This is the attitude I'm talking about with the "let's run it 40 times a game regardless of whether or not it works." If Arians did that with the running game and as a result wasn't able to score, he would get railroaded for that too. Plus, how many times have you heard Steelers fans bitching about "going conservative" and playing prevent offense in the 2nd half, especially when Cowher was HC? Now we have an OC and an offense capable of being aggressive and keeping the pressure on, and now THAT apparently is bad. Which is it?actually XT, the patriots really havent won shit with that mentality. they found more success with a. smith and c. dillon being a bell-cow back.

anyways, can you show one example where ANYONE has suggested to run 40 times even if it is not working? this is the same strawman argument that keeps getting throw out there and it is totally bunk and doesnt hold an ounce of water.

mendenhall was one of the best backs in YPC this season. can you think of any reason we abandoned the run when he was peeling off runs of 6.9 ypc vs the vikings.

its not like the bengals, bears, browns, chiefs, or raiders were shutting down our run? please offer up the slightest logical explanation of why we would shelf it?

i have looked, and cannot find any. i defended arians, for 3 years on this board. but his jackassery in the browns game is indefensible.

if he dont get it right, he is gone for sure after next year and will never get a coordinators job in the nfl again.

Bubbabanjo
01-10-2010, 08:13 PM
Ravens are body snatchers............they have the tuff D and pounding ground game and boring QB. Hope they choke on razor blades but.....................I am jealous right now. We just dont look like ourselves.

But that SB trophy sure looks good. Shore up the D backfield and get us a slammin RB and we will be right back in buisness. Need a good Joey Porter or Lethon Flowers to stick it in their eye too. Woodley is warmin up there.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 08:41 PM
and i am not one of those people who has hatred in my heart for an offensive coordinator of a football team. the offensive situation of the steelers is the easiest to rectalfy. all it takes is arians to simply quit being so freaking stubborn and pull his head out of his ass. the defense and ST will take some work.

Maybe YOU aren't, but there is a healthy amount of hatred for him on this board from a whole hell of a lot of people. There is a site called firebrucearians.com, for crying out loud. Who makes a site like that for someone they like??

actually XT, the patriots really havent won shit with that mentality. they found more success with a. smith and c. dillon being a bell-cow back.

anyways, can you show one example where ANYONE has suggested to run 40 times even if it is not working? this is the same strawman argument that keeps getting throw out there and it is totally bunk and doesnt hold an ounce of water.

mendenhall was one of the best backs in YPC this season. can you think of any reason we abandoned the run when he was peeling off runs of 6.9 ypc vs the vikings.

its not like the bengals, bears, browns, chiefs, or raiders were shutting down our run? please offer up the slightest logical explanation of why we would shelf it?

i have looked, and cannot find any. i defended arians, for 3 years on this board. but his jackassery in the browns game is indefensible.

if he dont get it right, he is gone for sure after next year and will never get a coordinators job in the nfl again.

I don't know...16-0 isn't anything to sneeze at, cheating aside. :noidea:

I also do not excuse the Cleveland game in any way, shape or form. It was a horrible game plan from the get-go. But I'm also not one who is always willing to throw the baby out with the bath water, not when there are plenty of positives to take away from this season offensively.

Anyway, it's the attitude from many forum members as well as people on the street with their "SMASHMOUTH FOOTBALL" battle cries that make me believe what I do. They'd rather Ben be a turnstile while handing the ball off 40 times a game while maybe getting 10-12 chances to show everyone how much of a weapon he truly is. In other words, they're scared of passing the football, even though most of the remaining teams in the playoffs are pass-first offenses and that there is a pretty good chance that there will be 2 pass-first offenses meeting in the Super Bowl. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

ricksteelers55
01-10-2010, 08:56 PM
We have to stop using that lame...We won the SB by being a pass-happy team and bla bla bla.We won the SB because our D was incredible period.That is what allowed Ben to do his magic at the end of each game.

Be serious,do you guys really think we wouldnt have won the SB with a running game like the one they have in Baltimore? We would be unstoppable.

The Packers have back to back 4000+ yds passing years as well as 2 x 1000+ yds receiving and a 1200+ rushing yds RB and look what they've done over 2 years...NOTHING

So I guess it's not much the offense but more the D.

Stop throwing the ball 45+ times and use the clock more efficiently to help the D having a breather.Pound the ball,stop being a finesse team and play Steelers football.

I guarantee that if we do that we will win football games.One of the best way to protect your 100 million dollar QB from being sacked 50+ times a year is to run the football effectively by establishing the run

So please stop saying we are 8th overall in league in yardages and all that crap.You can have 20 000 yds in a year if your last game of the year is week 17 it doesnt matter.

X-Terminator
01-10-2010, 09:17 PM
And here's yet ANOTHER poster who'd rather go back to the "3 yards and a cloud of dust, run it 40 times" offense.

You have a $100 million QB and a crapload of talent at WR and TE. Let them do their thing!

tony hipchest
01-10-2010, 09:56 PM
They'd rather Ben be a turnstile while handing the ball off 40 times a game while maybe getting 10-12 chances to show everyone how much of a weapon he truly is. In other words, they're scared of passing the football, even though most of the remaining teams in the playoffs are pass-first offenses and that there is a pretty good chance that there will be 2 pass-first offenses meeting in the Super Bowl. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

:jawdrop: God forbid! that offense only got us a 15-1 season and a sb victory the following year.

and while it is a pass oriented league, the majority of the playoff teams are still tops in rushing the ball too. if you notice, all 4 winners from this weekends games, rushed more than passed.

rush rankings-

jets- 1
baltimore - 5
saints- 6
dallas- 7
vikings- 13

cardinals-28
chargers-31
colts-32

brady, rogers and palmer are considered elite fantasy qb's yet all 3 of them were sent packing.

there are 4 other teams we havent seen yet in the playoffs-

saints and colts can easilly be bounced in the 1st round. the vikings too, unless brett favre isnt the interception machine.

there is an ancient formula for winning championships in the nfl. why do people think arians has invented a new one?

if there are 2 "pass 1st offenses" who meet in the superbowl, the one who rushes the most will win the game.

stb_steeler
01-10-2010, 10:48 PM
Thats a good point Tony... Ive noticed that to. The teams that ran the ball more won this week. But on the other hand those teams also could throw the ball when needed on the exception of Flacco, he didnt have many but, I believe you need balance=execution=good play calling. And if all else fails call the Bus back, times seemed alot easier when he was here. :wink02:

ricksteelers55
01-11-2010, 12:25 AM
And here's yet ANOTHER poster who'd rather go back to the "3 yards and a cloud of dust, run it 40 times" offense.

You have a $100 million QB and a crapload of talent at WR and TE. Let them do their thing!

And it looks like you'd rather pass the ball and see your 100 mil. QB see his career shortened because he's been hit too many times because other teams could find out your gameplan quickly.Well good for you, but I dont. I love the passing tools that we have in this team,I really do,but we have to stop lying to ourselves we might be able to win the SB once in a while like last year,but in the long run I just dont think it is the best decision for our QB and our team succes.

We have the tools in offense and that is right,but make no mistakes in a couple of years we wont be able to keep them all.I'd rather build a solid D with a less-talented Offense than having a superb set of 4 great WR and a good TE but a D that is average at best.

and BTW for those saying that steelers fans dont know nothing about football or stuff like that,if they didnt know anything about football they wouldnt be asking the coaching staff to run the football,they would be pleased to see the team throw that much,because that is what bandwagonners love,Pass-happy teams !!

ricksteelers55
01-11-2010, 12:28 AM
:jawdrop: God forbid! that offense only got us a 15-1 season and a sb victory the following year.

and while it is a pass oriented league, the majority of the playoff teams are still tops in rushing the ball too. if you notice, all 4 winners from this weekends games, rushed more than passed.

rush rankings-

jets- 1
baltimore - 5
saints- 6
dallas- 7
vikings- 13

cardinals-28
chargers-31
colts-32

brady, rogers and palmer are considered elite fantasy qb's yet all 3 of them were sent packing.

there are 4 other teams we havent seen yet in the playoffs-

saints and colts can easilly be bounced in the 1st round. the vikings too, unless brett favre isnt the interception machine.

there is an ancient formula for winning championships in the nfl. why do people think arians has invented a new one?

if there are 2 "pass 1st offenses" who meet in the superbowl, the one who rushes the most will win the game.

couldnt say better

X-Terminator
01-11-2010, 07:42 AM
And it looks like you'd rather pass the ball and see your 100 mil. QB see his career shortened because he's been hit too many times because other teams could find out your gameplan quickly.Well good for you, but I dont. I love the passing tools that we have in this team,I really do,but we have to stop lying to ourselves we might be able to win the SB once in a while like last year,but in the long run I just dont think it is the best decision for our QB and our team succes.

We have the tools in offense and that is right,but make no mistakes in a couple of years we wont be able to keep them all.I'd rather build a solid D with a less-talented Offense than having a superb set of 4 great WR and a good TE but a D that is average at best.

and BTW for those saying that steelers fans dont know nothing about football or stuff like that,if they didnt know anything about football they wouldnt be asking the coaching staff to run the football,they would be pleased to see the team throw that much,because that is what bandwagonners love,Pass-happy teams !!

NO, I DON'T want to see my $100 million QB have his career shortened. I DON'T want to see him throw 40-50 passes every game. What I DO want to see is him still be allowed to be the weapon that he is and NOT be used simply to hand the ball off all the time! Why in the WORLD would you want to see that kind of weapon holstered? We can still have Ben throw 25-35 passes, AND still have 25-35 rushes per game, with circumstances dictating we pass more or run more. I DO NOT want to see 15 passes and 40 runs every game. That is a gross misuse of the weapons we have, but that's what so many people want.

X-Terminator
01-11-2010, 07:46 AM
:jawdrop: God forbid! that offense only got us a 15-1 season and a sb victory the following year.

and while it is a pass oriented league, the majority of the playoff teams are still tops in rushing the ball too. if you notice, all 4 winners from this weekends games, rushed more than passed.

rush rankings-

jets- 1
baltimore - 5
saints- 6
dallas- 7
vikings- 13

cardinals-28
chargers-31
colts-32

brady, rogers and palmer are considered elite fantasy qb's yet all 3 of them were sent packing.

there are 4 other teams we havent seen yet in the playoffs-

saints and colts can easilly be bounced in the 1st round. the vikings too, unless brett favre isnt the interception machine.

there is an ancient formula for winning championships in the nfl. why do people think arians has invented a new one?

if there are 2 "pass 1st offenses" who meet in the superbowl, the one who rushes the most will win the game.

But you notice, in the playoffs in 2005, what did the Steelers do? Come out throwing. Gee, imagine that? Passing the ball to try and score! What a novel concept!

Yes, I want to see more of a commitment to the run and a BETTER rushing attack just like everybody else. But NOT at the expense of wasting all that talent in the passing game. The Rams offense from 1998-2000 is what I'd LOVE to have here, and that offense was in the top 5 in both rushing and passing. What a lot of The Nation wants is a run-heavy offense, and like I said above, that would be a major misuse of all the talent we have on offense.

Prok
01-11-2010, 09:24 AM
i will never assosciate that scumbag team as our brothers.

Here here. :tt:

While we may have been identical during the Cowher years we are far from the same offensively these days. Our Steelers have a crap load of better WR's and much better QB. No more smashmouth for us ! :tt02:

steelcity1974
01-11-2010, 11:03 AM
Personally, I think we drafted Mendenhall for the very reason of getting back to smash mouth football. Willie was never going to be that kind of back...and Bettis was one in a million. Mendenhall is exactly what we need to get back to Steeler football. But at the same time, I don't want a Tommy Maddox, or Kordell Stewart, or even Neil O'Donnel kind of passing game to supplement him. I like what we are doing in the passing game. Now that Mendenhall has proven he can be a feature back, I think we will only see more of him in 2010 and beyond. We need to get more balanced, but with all of the passing weapons, I don't mind using them when we need to. I think we have maxed out our pass attempts for a while, and will see more running...maybe no more than 47 or 48%, but I'm ok with that.

steelerjim58
01-11-2010, 11:14 AM
For me, while of course winning is the most important thing, I hated the Cowher way of maybe only throwing 5-10 times in the second half of games. I want an offense that puts teams away. That kind of game allows teams to stay in the game to where one big play puts them right back in it. I agree that balance is important, but not to where I want 55-45 pass to run or vice versa. But I want an offense that has the ability to run when the pass isn't working or pass when the run isn't going. If they pass 40 times one game and run 40 the next that's fine.

steelcity1974
01-11-2010, 11:17 AM
But I want an offense that has the ability to run when the pass isn't working or pass when the run isn't going. If they pass 40 times one game and run 40 the next that's fine.

Agree...the capability to adjust based on how the game is going needs to be there. We need to be multi-dimentional.

Ravnet
01-11-2010, 11:28 AM
If the Ravens would have had to depend on their QB in the game they would have lost. The Patriots have no running game. That's what did them as well as the Eagles in. We won the Super Bowl last year without a running game. As late as we have been picking in the draft recently, it's going to be hard to find good run blocking O-linemen.

Ben went to the AFCCG in his first year just like Joe did, and now he's progressing in his second year (hopefully) to the Super Bowl just like Ben did in his sophomore season.

By that logic, we're going to have to rely on Joe as much as the Steelers relied on Ben in 2005, which wasn't much, as we have a stronger running game with Rice/McGahee/McClain than the Steelers did with the Bus, and just as good of a defense as the Steelers did in their Super Bowl year.

So unless you think the Steelers totally relied on Ben in 2005, then there is no reason why the Ravens will have to place the burden on Flacco's shoulders unless the running game implodes, or the secondary completely falls apart. The latter is a definite problem, though.

Indianapolis? San Diego? These teams aren't just not good at stopping the run, they're bad at it.

Steely McSmash
01-11-2010, 12:00 PM
Agree...the capability to adjust based on how the game is going needs to be there. We need to be multi-dimentional.

Exactly!... finally made it to the last page of all this and find that somebody has just made the point I was about to type....

You need to be a pick your poison team.

Want to load up the box, we burn your DB's. Want to sit back in nickel, then we'll run it all day.

If you can build a team this way you can beat anyone with a typcial Steeler defense.

I'm a big fan of mixing it at the start and if you find that they can't stop the run, then you don't stop running! Your QB throws 15 times and the game is over in 2 hrs 45 min with a big fat win. This was typical of Cowher teams except that when they finally met someone that could stop the run, we tried to impose our will rather than simply switch the correct poison (or effective mix of poison as it were)

In the past we were more competent in the run, now we've swung the other way. I think the corrections are in process already.

anyone see this:

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10010/1027112-66.stm

They also might add a fullback. Before Canadian Football League fullback Rolly Lumballa signed with the Miami Dolphins this week, he entertained an offer from the Steelers. They have Frank Summers, who could become that fullback, coming off injured reserve.

X-Terminator
01-11-2010, 12:36 PM
Agree...the capability to adjust based on how the game is going needs to be there. We need to be multi-dimentional.

Agreed 100%. Nothing better than being able to do whatever you want, WHEN you want. Some just want to do nothing but run, run, run, run, run, and nothing else. You do that when you come across a team that is weak against the run, while mixing in passes whenever they try to stack the box. And when you come up against a strong run defense like the Ravens traditionally have had, you throw more to back them out of crowding the line, which opens up the run lanes. That is what I've always wanted to see from the offense - good situational football.

WH
01-11-2010, 03:30 PM
So unless you think the Steelers totally relied on Ben in 2005, then there is no reason why the Ravens will have to place the burden on Flacco's shoulders unless the running game implodes, or the secondary completely falls apart. The latter is a definite problem, though.

.
against the Colts and Bronco's I'd say yes, Ben was heavily relied upon.