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View Full Version : How great would Ben be with Sean Payton?


zulater
02-07-2010, 10:08 PM
Sorry, couldn't resist. :chuckle:

Guy is a great offensive mind though.

devilsdancefloor
02-07-2010, 10:15 PM
but we wouldnt run the ball enough:doh:

Psyychoward86
02-07-2010, 11:45 PM
Lol here comes the angry mob

zulater
02-07-2010, 11:47 PM
Lol here comes the angry mob

http://www.marketingpilgrim.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/angry-mob.jpg

Oh we can only hope. :chuckle:

steelerdude15
02-08-2010, 12:01 AM
:chuckle:

tony hipchest
02-08-2010, 12:08 AM
ben would more quickly reach his full potential with an offensive mind like payton.

lionslicer
02-08-2010, 02:39 AM
Brees is a way better quarterback then Ben. Ben is a better football player, better feet, better strength, but Brees is insanely acurate, he puts the ball where he wants it, if its incomplete, usually its the recievers fault. Ben has a lot of over and under throws, he isn't acurate 100% of the time, recievers bail him out alot. A great offensive minded coach isn't great unless he has good players to play the game for him.
the 1980's 49'ers wouldn't have won 4 superbowls without Cool Joe and his great recievers and tightends.

MACH1
02-08-2010, 02:53 AM
Sorry, couldn't resist. :chuckle:

Guy is a great offensive mind though.

What are you talking about? We have the best offensive mind in the league. :rolleyes:

Galax Steeler
02-08-2010, 04:42 AM
Ben is great without Payton.

HometownGal
02-08-2010, 08:47 AM
Lol here comes the angry mob

If this thread goes where I think a couple of people want to take it, it's going to be locked down.

supa_fly_steeler
02-08-2010, 08:51 AM
Whow now the stupid questions come.lol

Ben is great with Tomlin. Id rather have that combo and glad that we do.

Rockonsteel
02-08-2010, 08:51 AM
If this thread goes where I think a couple of people want to take it, it's going to be locked down.

Seriously? WOW!!

HometownGal
02-08-2010, 09:47 AM
Seriously? WOW!!

Damned straight WOW and yes, I'm serious. While I don't believe it was the OP's intention to dredge up the ongoing saga that has infested this board over the past several months, it reeks of being headed in that direction - for the gazillionth time. We've all spoken our peace and it's time to move on.

zulater
02-08-2010, 10:30 AM
What are you talking about? We have the best offensive mind in the league. :rolleyes:

Nothing against Bruce Arians, and obviously fresh off a SB victory the perception of Sean Payton is probably elevated to be greater that it actually is. But in all honesty I think Payton is a cut above as an offensive mind. I really do think he could do some special things with Ben. :thumbsup:


Not that Ben isn't already doing special things. :wave:

Rockonsteel
02-08-2010, 10:33 AM
If this thread goes where I think a couple of people want to take it, it's going to be locked down.

Damned straight WOW and yes, I'm serious. While I don't believe it was the OP's intention to dredge up the ongoing saga that has infested this board over the past several months, it reeks of being headed in that direction - for the gazillionth time. We've all spoken our peace and it's time to move on.

The anti-Arians police have spoken. I'm confused, are moderator and subject police the same thing? They seem to perform the same duties. Not much different than the Chinese governments' attempts to control the content of their internet.

I don't care what you or anybody else says, I have a hard time believing you don't know the guy personally on some level. You don't even wait until somebody says something about the guy before you threaten to lock the thread? That's ridiculous. People are merely discussing the possibilities of this offense with Payton as opposed to "the unspoken one". If that's what people want to talk about, who are you to say they can't? I don't care how many threads it encompasses. Why do you have the right to tell people they have to move on? People can only discuss topics you approve of or agree with?

I wasn't going to respond to this thread, but your threat so compelled me.


Rockon

MACH1
02-08-2010, 12:38 PM
Nothing against Bruce Arians, and obviously fresh off a SB victory the perception of Sean Payton is probably elevated to be greater that it actually is. But in all honesty I think Payton is a cut above as an offensive mind. I really do think he could do some special things with Ben. :thumbsup:


Not that Ben isn't already doing special things. :wave:

There's a reason why Sean Payton's a head coach and BA isn't. That pretty much sums it up.

HometownGal
02-08-2010, 12:39 PM
The anti-Arians police have spoken. I'm confused, are moderator and subject police the same thing? They seem to perform the same duties. Not much different than the Chinese governments' attempts to control the content of their internet.

I don't care what you or anybody else says, I have a hard time believing you don't know the guy personally on some level. You don't even wait until somebody says something about the guy before you threaten to lock the thread? That's ridiculous. People are merely discussing the possibilities of this offense with Payton as opposed to "the unspoken one". If that's what people want to talk about, who are you to say they can't? I don't care how many threads it encompasses. Why do you have the right to tell people they have to move on? People can only discuss topics you approve of or agree with?

I wasn't going to respond to this thread, but your threat so compelled me.


Rockon

Get the hell down off your high and mighty horse, wake up and smell the coffee. Refer to Post #8 and subsequently Post #17 and you'll see where my posts originate from.

I have no problem with the OP's choice of a topic but we are simply NOT going to keep riding on the BA merry-go-round which clogged up the Steelers forums for almost 2 months. It you don't like it - TOUGH.

MACH1
02-08-2010, 12:42 PM
Get the hell down off your high and mighty horse, wake up and smell the coffee. Refer to Post #8 and subsequently Post #17 and you'll see where my posts originate from.

I have no problem with the OP's choice of a topic but we are simply NOT going to keep riding on the BA merry-go-round which clogged up the Steelers forums for almost 2 months. It you don't like it - TOUGH.

:shake01:

supa_fly_steeler
02-08-2010, 12:46 PM
Get the hell down off your high and mighty horse, wake up and smell the coffee. Refer to Post #8 and subsequently Post #17 and you'll see where my posts originate from.

I have no problem with the OP's choice of a topic but we are simply NOT going to keep riding on the BA merry-go-round which clogged up the Steelers forums for almost 2 months. It you don't like it - TOUGH.

Go Girl Power lol

HometownGal
02-08-2010, 12:46 PM
:shake01:

You can shake your head all you want, but YOU are the one who subtly referenced BA in Post #8 and again referenced him in Post #15.

We simply are NOT going to go there again, as it caused so much dissention on this board. I'll tell you the same thing I told Rockon - if you don't like it - TOUGH.

steelreserve
02-08-2010, 12:49 PM
Well, if we're not talking about Arians, there's still ONE thing I know for sure ... with Sean Payton as OC, Parker would still suck.


P.S. - Trade Roethlisberger and fire Tomlin. Let's put in Dixon and run some wildcat shit.

Prok
02-08-2010, 12:56 PM
Ben is great without Payton.

Yeah, this. ^^

I'm an admitted BA hater but had he called 3 straight runs like Sean did before halftime last night he'd have been killed. lol

Looks to me like the Saints run alot of similar formations to the Steelers.

Hey, maybe we ain't that bad off. :drink:

MaidenIndiana
02-08-2010, 12:57 PM
Well, if we're not talking about Arians, there's still ONE thing I know for sure ... with Sean Payton as OC, Parker would still suck.


P.S. - Trade Roethlisberger and fire Tomlin. Let's put in Dixon and run some wildcat shit.

Me thinks its time you give the water bong a rest:doh:

LVSteelersfan
02-08-2010, 12:59 PM
The question is could Sean Payton make Ben get rid of the ball quicker or throw it away to save yards? I doubt it as Ben is Ben. The whole hypothetical thing is comical any way as it is never going to happen. Brees is more accurate than Ben but goes down like a sack of potatoes if someone grabs his jersey. Ben would have busted loose from that sack in the SB and thrown it down the field 40 yards. If the Steelers had the Colts Oline, would Ben be so much better than he is with his exisiting line? Probably but there is no way to prove it. You can do hypotheticals all day long.

X-Terminator
02-08-2010, 01:06 PM
:shake01:

Seriously dude, why continue to dredge up the same circular argument day after day after day? Nobody's mind is going to be changed, and thus it's pointless to keep going on and on about it. It's time to accept that the guy is still the OC, and move on.

fansince'76
02-08-2010, 01:15 PM
Brees is a way better quarterback then Ben. Ben is a better football player, better feet, better strength, but Brees is insanely acurate, he puts the ball where he wants it, if its incomplete, usually its the recievers fault. Ben has a lot of over and under throws, he isn't acurate 100% of the time, recievers bail him out alot. A great offensive minded coach isn't great unless he has good players to play the game for him.

Yeah, only 2 SBs in the last 4 years. Ben is truly dog shit. Maybe we can trade up and get a real QB in the upcoming draft.

Indo
02-08-2010, 01:25 PM
Ben would be as good with Sean Payton as Brees would be with Tomlin...
Both are great coaches. Both are great players. Great coaches know how to bring out the Greatness in their players.

(but to suggest that Arians is somehow "holding Ben back" is ludicrous, IMO)

El-Gonzo Jackson
02-08-2010, 01:26 PM
Think instead of how much better Ben would be with the #6 rushing offense in the NFL and a line that consisted of linemen like :

Jahari Evans
Jon Stinchcomb
Jonathon Goodwin
Carl Nicks

BTW.......have I ever mentioned that the Steelers could have drafted Carl Nicks instead of Tony Hills?? :noidea:

steelreserve
02-08-2010, 01:49 PM
Me thinks its time you give the water bong a rest:doh:

It's OK, it was a complete joke.


Back on topic, I don't really know whether Payton as OC (or HC) would benefit Ben that much. Ben seems like the kind of QB who is just going to do pretty well no matter who the coach is or what scheme they use. He falls more into the category of a general "playmaker" than a specialized precision-passing QB.

I think measuring Ben against Brees or Manning is comparing apples to oranges. Sure, if all three are playing in a wide-open offense with a perfect offensive line, Ben will probably max out a little below either of them. But if you put all three on an average NFL team that isn't a custom-built quarterback's dream, I firmly believe Manning and Brees would drop off A LOT and Ben wouldn't. I also like the fact that having Ben gives us more than one way to win a game, and that's something that he's probably better at than any QB in the league.

So ... all in all, I don't see this being a huge move as far as Ben is concerned, but for the other players, and as far as things like situational playcalling and the overall effectiveness of the offense, maybe.

X-Terminator
02-08-2010, 01:56 PM
Think instead of how much better Ben would be with the #6 rushing offense in the NFL and a line that consisted of linemen like :

Jahari Evans
Jon Stinchcomb
Jonathon Goodwin
Carl Nicks

BTW.......have I ever mentioned that the Steelers could have drafted Carl Nicks instead of Tony Hills?? :noidea:

We saw a little bit of that in 2007, actually, when the Steelers were leading the league in rushing most of the season and ended up finishing in the top 5 (don't remember their actual ranking). Ben had his best statistical season, until this past season, with 32 TD and only 11 INT. He would easily duplicate that with a better rushing attack - in fact, I think he'd put up Brees-type numbers.

Prok
02-08-2010, 02:09 PM
It's OK, it was a complete joke.


Back on topic, I don't really know whether Payton as OC (or HC) would benefit Ben that much. Ben seems like the kind of QB who is just going to do pretty well no matter who the coach is or what scheme they use. He falls more into the category of a general "playmaker" than a specialized precision-passing QB.

I think measuring Ben against Brees or Manning is comparing apples to oranges. Sure, if all three are playing in a wide-open offense with a perfect offensive line, Ben will probably max out a little below either of them. But if you put all three on an average NFL team that isn't a custom-built quarterback's dream, I firmly believe Manning and Brees would drop off A LOT and Ben wouldn't. I also like the fact that having Ben gives us more than one way to win a game, and that's something that he's probably better at than any QB in the league.

So ... all in all, I don't see this being a huge move as far as Ben is concerned, but for the other players, and as far as things like situational playcalling and the overall effectiveness of the offense, maybe.

Good post.

But when I watched that game last night I swear I saw ALOT of the formations and personel packages from the Saints that our Steelers also run. Am I the only one seeing that ??

X-Terminator
02-08-2010, 02:44 PM
Good post.

But when I watched that game last night I swear I saw ALOT of the formations and personel packages from the Saints that our Steelers also run. Am I the only one seeing that ??

You're not seeing things; the formations they run are very similar. The Saints are just better at utilizing and executing them than the Steelers are.

markymarc
02-09-2010, 09:18 PM
You're not seeing things; the formations they run are very similar. The Saints are just better at utilizing and executing them than the Steelers are.

Very good and correct post! Plus it doesn't hurt that they have a better OL.