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mesaSteeler
04-04-2010, 12:59 AM
What to do with Ben and Santonio?
http://pit.scout.com/2/959352.html
By Sports Xchange

Posted Apr 3, 2010

Pittsburgh officials would like to take more serious action than the few statements they've issued on the legal predicaments of their Super Bowl heroes ...

... quarterback Ben Roethlisberger and wide receiver Santonio Holmes, but their hands are tied for now.

Until authorities in Georgia either charge Roethlisberger or announce no charges will be filed, there is little the Steelers or the NFL can do. If he is charged, Roethlisberger can be suspended by the NFL and/or the Steelers.

As for Holmes, police will re-open a case involving a woman in Orlando, Fla., who accused him of throwing a glass filled with alcohol in her face and has filed a civil lawsuit. Holmes denies the incident altogether.

The combination of these two incidents coupled with Roethlisberger fighting a civil lawsuit in Nevada where a woman accused him of sexual assault has rocked the organization. Talk shows are filled with debate on a daily basis and most of it does not shed any positive light on the Steelers or coach Mike Tomlin.

It has reached a point where the team might seriously be thinking beyond suspensions. This is the fourth legal issue for Holmes since the Steelers drafted him in 2006. His ramblings on Twitter over the past week also have embarrassed the organization.

Neither player has been working out at the team's facility. Their teammates are paying for it, having to answer questions. Defensive end Aaron Smith, as straightforward as they come, agreed to address two dozen media members who turned out this past Monday for the start of veteran offseason workouts. Nearly every question pitched at Smith dealt with Holmes and with Roethlisberger and the fact the quarterback would not be working out with his teammates.

"Honestly, most of the stuff outside of here doesn't affect us," Smith said. "Guys come here, lift their weights, they run, they do their football, they go to meetings, and they go about their business and go home to their families and children."

Steelers' president Art Rooney issued another statement this week, this time on Holmes, that said he was "disappointed."

Smith said his teammates weren't spending much time on the matter and had no opinions on whether Roethlisberger would be suspended or not.

"I don't think we've even thought about that," Smith said. "If that ever arises, when that comes, then we'll deal with that."

PLAYER/PERSONNEL NOTES

* Defensive end Aaron Smith, 34, has been working out daily at the Steelers' facility and believes he can come back strong in 2010 after rotator cuff surgery ended his season last Oct. 11.

"It's all how you perform," Smith said. "I don't think my body is wearing down. As far as me going out and performing, that will be the criteria, just like a guy in this second year trying to make the team. If you don't go out and do the job, you're too old."

Smith has started at left end for 10 mostly injury-free years. However, he tore his right rotator cuff in the second game of last season after a biceps tear prematurely ended his 2007 season. Before his latest injury, he was as dominant as ever and showing no signs of slowing down.

"When they looked at it, it was a clean tear," Smith said. "There was no degeneration, like I had broken down the fibers and wore it out. They said it was just a fluke thing. That was a good sign, and that's why I would have a good result with the surgery. It's not like it's degenerated over time, it was just one of those weird injuries. It was just luck of the draw. I should have brought a lottery ticket or something."

Without him, the Super Bowl XLIII champs slipped to 9-7 and did not reach the playoffs.

"It's not fun watching football," Smith said. "I enjoy participating in it, but I don't enjoy watching football right now."

The day is approaching when he no longer will be able to play, but he hopes that is not the case in 2010.

"Age is relative. It depends on the individual. I think some people age faster than others."

The Steelers drafted defensive end Ziggy Hood in the first round last year but he likely will play behind Smith for a second straight season, barring injury. Brett Keisel will again be their starting right defensive end.

"I thought he did well," Smith said of Hood. "He has a way to go but I have not seen a rookie perform to the level he has. As far as picking things up, learning, being a sponge."

* The Steelers will open the preseason at home against Detroit, play their second game at the New York Giants, play their third on Aug. 29 at Denver and finish with a home game against Carolina, likely on Sept. 2. Other than the game in Denver, specific dates and times will be set later.

* The Steelers signed veteran backup quarterback Charlie Batch two a two-year contract after he became a free agent. Batch, 35, has been with the Steelers the past eight seasons, mostly as their No. 2 quarterback. However, Dennis Dixon likely will take over that job in 2010 and, as long as Ben Roethlisberger is on the team, Batch could serve as No. 3. Dixon moved up to No. 2 and stayed there after Batch broke his wrist during a Nov. 22 game in Kansas City.

* Art Rooney Jr. and former Steelers greats such as Rocky Bleier, Mel Blount and L.C. Greenwood will celebrate their 1979 Super Bowl team the night of the NFL draft, April 22.

* Director of football operations Kevin Colbert is in the final year of his contract. Many reports have had him joining former Steelers coach Bill Cowher if he coaches for another team in the future: "My reaction is I'm perfectly happy working with the Pittsburgh Steelers and the future will take care of itself," Colbert said.

* QUOTE TO NOTE: "He's kind of a fun guy. He enjoys having fun, joking around and going about his business. He's just a jovial kind of person when he's around here." -- DE Aaron Smith on QB Ben Roethlisberger

STRATEGY AND PERSONNEL

A total of 13 draft-eligible players visited the Steelers this week, from Monday through Thursday: Penn State linebacker Navarro Bowman, Purdue defensive lineman Michael Neal, Wake Forest offensive lineman Chris DeGeare, Kansas safety Darrell Stuckey, Tennessee guard Jacques McClendon, Indiana tackle Rodger Saffold, cornerbacks Nolan Carroll of Maryland, Kareem Jackson of Alabama and Kyle Wilson of Boise State, Alabama-Birmingham wide receiver Joe Webb, Marshall linebacker Albert McClellan, Wake Forest defensive back Brandon Ghee and South Carolina linebacker Eric Norwood.

steelerdave1969
04-04-2010, 04:07 AM
While the Steelers are in for some major decisions in the future with Ben and Santonio, I cant help but remember what happened to Plaxico Burress his last couple years with the Steelers. He was not happy and missed meetings and got in bad favor with the organization. I kept thinking that the Steelers would have a litte talk with him and then resign him, but they showed me that I know very little about the business I guess. They let him go and it was the right mover on their part. Now it comes to Santonio Holmes. . . The guy has helped us win Super Bowls and made an Awesome catch that sealed the last one. I can almost see the Headlines Reading Now on the Post-Gazette paper the day after they let him go... Super Bowl Hero Will Be Missed.
:coffee:

Rick5895
04-04-2010, 05:57 AM
I believe they will let the Ben saga play out, but IMO this will be his last chance with the team. As for Santo, there have been too many disruptions wit him the past few years. I love him as a football player, but with his contract coming up I don't think he will be resigned. Perhaps the time is near or on us to trade him , maybe get a 2nd or 3rd, and move on. It also might help Ben straighten out aswell.

Matty™
04-04-2010, 06:12 AM
I believe they will let the Ben saga play out, but IMO this will be his last chance with the team. As for Santo, there have been too many disruptions wit him the past few years. I love him as a football player, but with his contract coming up I don't think he will be resigned. Perhaps the time is near or on us to trade him , maybe get a 2nd or 3rd, and move on. It also might help Ben straighten out aswell.

no question i will be his last his chance and these allegations have just made his being here all the more harder. Granted he's innocent but the way the media have played it the Steelers back board will want him on his A game or by the end of the seaosn he'll be out on his arse :(

zulater
04-04-2010, 06:20 AM
Either keep both or get rid of both, depending upon how future events unfold of course. You keep Ben and get rid of Santonio and the team is likely to divide, possibly upon racial lines. By establishing such a clear double standard, regardless of reason, you wouldn't be doing Ben any favors, if it's your intent that he reestablish himself amongst his teammates. Which is absolutley essential for him to do if he is to remain a viable leader on the team. Put it this way, if Ben ever does get his current prediciment behind him he's going to need to do some major fence mending in the locker room. Enforcing such a blatant double standard would hurt that cause greatly imo.

Galax Steeler
04-04-2010, 06:26 AM
I still believe if there is no charges against them then they should stil be able still play for the Steelers and there should not be no suspensions.

Rick5895
04-04-2010, 06:41 AM
Either keep both or get rid of both, depending upon how future events unfold of course. You keep Ben and get rid of Santonio and the team is likely to divide, possibly upon racial lines. By establishing such a clear double standard, regardless of reason, you wouldn't be doing Ben any favors, if it's your intent that he reestablish himself amongst his teammates. Which is absolutley essential for him to do if he is to remain a viable leader on the team. Put it this way, if Ben ever does get his current prediciment behind him he's going to need to do some major fence mending in the locker room. Enforcing such a blatant double standard would hurt that cause greatly imo.
You make a very valid argument , I believe Santo's days are numbered because of his contract, that is why I advocate a trade now, it is much easier to replace a WR than a franchise QB. I think because of Bens position and IF no charges are laid he will get another chance with the team. But, if he can't get things straightened out and that includes the locker room, then he will be gone as well. IMO

solardave
04-04-2010, 07:17 AM
You make a very valid argument , I believe Santo's days are numbered because of his contract, that is why I advocate a trade now, it is much easier to replace a WR than a franchise QB. I think because of Bens position and IF no charges are laid he will get another chance with the team. But, if he can't get things straightened out and that includes the locker room, then he will be gone as well. IMO

This will boil down to what is best for the Team in terms of win/loss. Homes' contract is up this year. If Sweed gets it together (if he even gets a chance and I think now he might) then I think Santonio is as good as gone.
Ben will be given more rope because (as was pointed out) a franchise QB is harder to find but there is a limit and I think they've both pushed the envelope.

History has shown us the FO doesn't tolerate this kind of behavior but is the policy changing? I hope not. As much talent as these two have they are not above the rules.

WH
04-04-2010, 07:45 AM
Cut'em both. Here's to Dixon to Wallace 2010.

/sarcasm

AllD
04-04-2010, 09:19 AM
The thing with Holmes is he is golden in the playoffs like Reggie Jackson. He comes on strong in the second half of the season and then makes big plays when it counts.

Holmes and BB should have a heart-to-heart sit down with management and let it be known they have their issues under control. Holmes should rediscover the humility he had immediately after the SB. He may have to settle for an incentive laden contract to resign.

BB is on a short leash and playing or being cut is the least of his problems right now.

solardave
04-04-2010, 09:38 AM
The thing with Holmes is he is golden in the playoffs like Reggie Jackson. He comes on strong in the second half of the season and then makes big plays when it counts.

Holmes and BB should have a heart-to-heart sit down with management and let it be known they have their issues under control. Holmes should rediscover the humility he had immediately after the SB. He may have to settle for an incentive laden contract to resign.

BB is on a short leash and playing or being cut is the least of his problems right now.

You make sense but how does management really know if this is the last of the "Issues"?
I'll bet they've been called on the carpet the first time. The answer just may be Incentive laden contracts with conduct up front. Hey, we know they can play football. Now we nned to be sure they can play by the rules. If not you take away their means.

fansince'76
04-04-2010, 09:44 AM
Cut'em both. Here's to Dixon to Wallace 2010.

/sarcasm

Championship! :applaudit: :tt02: :tt04: :tt: :tt: :tt04: :tt02: :applaudit:

:chuckle:

MACH1
04-04-2010, 10:38 AM
It's amazing the Steelers can field a full team with such lofty standards they are held to.
We all know everyone of them has angels wings. :rolleyes:

silver & black
04-04-2010, 11:08 AM
I know what to do................... straight up trade for JaMarcus Russell and DHB... problem solved.:wink02:

SteelerJay
04-04-2010, 11:09 AM
Pittsburgh must be holier than the Vatican judging from the reactions of the Ed Bouchette's and some of the posters on this board. Holmes' altercation is really not a big deal at all. He and a woman have a passionate disagreement and suddenly that reflects on the Rooneys - man give me a break! Not everyone's background is mid-America, Andy Griffith Mayberry-ish. You might say Holmes has had other issues - like caught smoking pot. How many of you and your kids have smoked pot? Have you turned yourself in? Get over it...I thought this is America the Free.

wootawnee
04-04-2010, 12:00 PM
I believe they will let the Ben saga play out, but IMO this will be his last chance with the team. As for Santo, there have been too many disruptions wit him the past few years. I love him as a football player, but with his contract coming up I don't think he will be resigned. Perhaps the time is near or on us to trade him , maybe get a 2nd or 3rd, and move on. It also might help Ben straighten out aswell.

Last chance?.......What if he didn't do shit......The he said she said stuff gets old........

Alot of this shit is just propaganda media shit that just sells ratings and isn't true......

Don't beleive everything these dudes talk about cause they are getting paid to talk

and all that shit sells if it is true or not........When I say sells, I mean it makes them a

ton of money one way or the other, so they do not care if it is true or not.......

Rick5895
04-04-2010, 01:41 PM
Last chance?.......What if he didn't do shit......The he said she said stuff gets old........

Alot of this shit is just propaganda media shit that just sells ratings and isn't true......

Don't beleive everything these dudes talk about cause they are getting paid to talk

and all that shit sells if it is true or not........When I say sells, I mean it makes them a

ton of money one way or the other, so they do not care if it is true or not.......

I have made mention of this in earlier posts. I am sure Ben is innocent, however, he needs to stop putting himself in these situations. The more allegations happen, the less likely the authorities are going to disregard them. Sooner or later an allegation will stick and charges will be filed, maybe not with this case but maybe down the road. Ben needs to realize his notoriety and act accordingly. Holmes is a different story, he is constantly in the news and being probed for different legal infractions. With one year on his contract, to me , it seems better to trade him and get something than to let his contract play out and not resign him. Santo may just be the second coming of Plaxico.
One thing we all have to stop doing is looking at our team with blinders on, I sure as heck want Santo and Ben to stay, but there comes a time when you have to part company,(Santo) to get the other (Ben) to wake the hell up.

Merchant
04-04-2010, 04:08 PM
God I am so sick of this Ben/Santonio crap.. Neither of them did anything.. It's amazing how much these incidents got blown out of proportion..

Damn you offseason!! Damn you!!

AllD
04-04-2010, 04:30 PM
The Steelers are a media and revenue earnings machine for the NFL. They are probably the most popular team in total market areas since everybody has moved around so much. They are one of the premiere teams in the NFL with an honorable history beginning in 1969.

If the team starts carrying players with so much controversey and the team image suffers making it less marketable, then everybody risks the chance of losing revenue and flexibility.

Did you notice that not too many Steeler games other than SB XIII have been shown lately? Prior to BB's first incident, the NFL Network showed some kind of highlight from a Steeler game regularly. Now it could be embarrasing to show what many argue is the best play in Super Bowl history. If the worse were to happen, you have BB throwing a winning catch to Holmes. That alone would reduce the image of the greatest game in the greatest sport in America. That is how important it is to conduct yourself accordingly.

IamTheSteelGod
04-05-2010, 05:36 AM
I reckon Big Ben will get cleared of all charges, keep his head down from now on and play a decent season. Holmes will go when his contract is up, Wallace will stick and be a big player for us in years to come.

SteelersMongol
04-05-2010, 08:58 AM
V should bi tch slap em both. Bi tch slap Santo back 2 Africa & bi tch slap Ben back 2 Swiss cheese farm 4 causing us all these crap. :wink02:

spyboots
04-05-2010, 11:01 AM
Something I find amusing is that fans of many of the other teams say he's scum and should be cut, but you know they'd love for THIER team to then sign him.

stillers4me
04-05-2010, 11:37 AM
Something I find amusing is that fans of many of the other teams say he's scum and should be cut, but you know they'd love for THIER team to then sign him.

Ding ding ding! Another winner!

Most of them only wish they had a 2 time winning superbowl QB to worry about losing and would give anything to see Ben land on their team.

GodfatherofSoul
04-05-2010, 11:42 AM
Charlie Sheen had a great line about women. Paraphrasing:

"I don't pay prostitutes for sex, I pay them to leave."

smokin3000gt
04-05-2010, 11:49 AM
The part that worries me is that this is 2 strikes against Ben even though none of them have had any merit so far. One more false allegation could spell big trouble for our buddy. I'm sure there are a few people out there who would love to see us lose our QB so easily.

fansince'76
04-05-2010, 11:59 AM
I want Vick and Plaxico!!!! :tt03: :tt03: :tt03:

:chuckle:

stillers4me
04-05-2010, 12:34 PM
I want Vick and Plaxico!!!! :tt03: :tt03: :tt03:

:chuckle:

T.O. would be a great addition to Hines and Wallace. :popcorn:

43Hitman
04-05-2010, 01:41 PM
Start watching at 1:43
This is what we do with Ben and Santonio
UVKsd8z6scw











:chuckle:

Vincent
04-05-2010, 01:55 PM
I want Vick and Plaxico!!!! :tt03: :tt03: :tt03:

:chuckle:

While Plax's er, intellect is closely rivaled by those of Irish Setter puppies, he can catch a ball under pressure, and, beyond the reach of a lot of DBs. Wouldn't mind having him back.

Tone throws things at wimmins. :mad::banging: Plax shoots himself in the leg. :eyecrazy: :wtf:

pancake
04-05-2010, 02:23 PM
I know what to do................... straight up trade for JaMarcus Russell and DHB... problem solved.:wink02:

Like Al Davis is going to trade away his 2 favorite players... :toofunny:

Dino 6 Rings
04-05-2010, 04:43 PM
How about you lock them in a film room together and make sure they are paying attention to the new defenses they may be facing this season.

silver & black
04-05-2010, 04:48 PM
Something I find amusing is that fans of many of the other teams say he's scum and should be cut, but you know they'd love for THIER team to then sign him.

You're right... I'll take him in a heartbeat!

silver & black
04-05-2010, 04:50 PM
Like Al Davis is going to trade away his 2 favorite players... :toofunny:

Yeah... there is that little issue to get past.:doh:

Prok
04-05-2010, 08:59 PM
I vote for just letting em' both continue making big plays in big games and win us championships.

:drink:

Sharkissle29
04-05-2010, 10:50 PM
I vote for just letting em' both continue making big plays in big games and win us championships.

:drink:

at the end of the day, who cares about the character of a football team....as long as you win championships

Prok
04-06-2010, 05:52 AM
at the end of the day, who cares about the character of a football team....as long as you win championships

These 2 guys are humans just like the rest of us. I see no reason why each player can't get their shit together and clean up their rep. I'd rather they clean up their rep with us and help us win than go somewhere else and help another team.

It's important to remember that everyone makes mistakes. Getting rid of either player would not benefit us one bit. Sticking by them through tough times and helping them get their shit together would speak volumes about the character of the org.

Trading or releasing either would be basically telling them our org is better than them and we don't believe they can reform. I'd be prouder of Art II and Steelers org if they stuck by these 2 and helped improve them as people and players.

LVSteelersfan
04-06-2010, 06:30 PM
Holmes has a history of bad things against him. Ben has a couple of unproved allegations that have yet to be settled. Hardly the same thing IMO. Holmes will want a bigger contract than the Steelers can afford to pay, so I think he will play out this year and be gone. We should be able to get a compensatory pick out of him so not trading him will not be a total loss. I would be very surprised if the Steelers re-sign Holmes with a big contract this year. They just need to draft WR this year and see if Sweed will pan out for the eventual replacement of Holmes and then Hines.

pete74
04-06-2010, 06:39 PM
These 2 guys are humans just like the rest of us. I see no reason why each player can't get their shit together and clean up their rep. I'd rather they clean up their rep with us and help us win than go somewhere else and help another team.

It's important to remember that everyone makes mistakes. Getting rid of either player would not benefit us one bit. Sticking by them through tough times and helping them get their shit together would speak volumes about the character of the org.

Trading or releasing either would be basically telling them our org is better than them and we don't believe they can reform. I'd be prouder of Art II and Steelers org if they stuck by these 2 and helped improve them as people and players.

im not saying to cut either even though i do belive holmes will be gone but we are humans and we are responsible for our actions. if either one were police officers they would already be fired or at the very least be suspended. with that said i think both should be kept on a very short leash and any trouble or even accusations in the future were they put themselves in a bad situation should be there last as a steeler

stlrtruck
04-07-2010, 10:44 AM
I vote for just letting em' both continue making big plays in big games and win us championships.

:drink:

I was just thinking let Holmes run a 9 or 7 route, scramble Ben to the left and heave that rock down field for 6 points. :tt04:

BehindSteelCurtain
04-07-2010, 06:13 PM
Holmes=overrated

Very rarely catches the ball away from his body. He isnt a #1 receiver.

pete74
04-07-2010, 06:31 PM
Holmes=overrated

Very rarely catches the ball away from his body. He isnt a #1 receiver.

??? holmes is definatly a #1 WR and he has proved that

BehindSteelCurtain
04-07-2010, 06:47 PM
??? holmes is definatly a #1 WR and he has proved that

because he made 1 big catch?

Preacher
04-07-2010, 06:48 PM
I'm very, VERY interested to see how fast we would have condemned Santonio or Ben if they had been on the Browns, Bengals, or Baltimore.

I am also as interested to see how much we would have said about how they should be cut, and how the Steelers would have cut them in an instant had they been a Steeler.

STEEL-MAN
04-08-2010, 02:46 PM
WHAT TO DO?????????????????? I for one am tiring of these posts.......:mad: he hasn't been charged, I mean come on these boys are big easy targets, they have more fame then ever dreamed which is more curse than blessing. Granite, football players are treated different from high school up, it is because they are seen. WE are to blame but it doesn't make them or us bad people. These boys are good people, just young and dumb.


As a young man, I drove my friends motorcycle through a stop sign with my girl friend on the back. I did it to be cool knowing the small town cop would chase me, the cop was sitting right there. I went with her like 15 miles, he was out of site, right into a road block full of cops. They still couldn't catch me, until my girl friend jumped off then I gave. I was charged with about every thing they could think of the worse was indangerment. Most of the charges were dropped but it still made the papers and My boss, friends and family never looked at me the same way. I suffered with guilt for being so dumb "I was just a kid" it took me a long time to realize we all make dumb mistakes!

BlastFurnace
04-08-2010, 03:12 PM
If we keep Santonio this year, I bet it will be his last with us.

Santonio strikes me as a guy who is going to want to win the lottery with his next contract....much more about the money than Hines ever was. I predict he won't be around in 2011.

fansince'76
04-08-2010, 03:15 PM
because he made 1 big catch?

Why's he overrated? Because he isn't 6'5"? Besides, I've NEVER heard his name mentioned in any discussion of top flight WRs.

BehindSteelCurtain
04-08-2010, 03:17 PM
Why's he overrated? Because he isn't 6'5"? Besides, I've NEVER heard his name mentioned in any discussion of top flight WRs.

Overrated by Steelers fans'.

LamarrWoodleysFade
04-08-2010, 03:31 PM
I'm very, VERY interested to see how fast we would have condemned Santonio or Ben if they had been on the Browns, Bengals, or Baltimore.

I am also as interested to see how much we would have said about how they should be cut, and how the Steelers would have cut them in an instant had they been a Steeler.

Lol dude, I've been saying this to myself for the longest time. It's like these guys can do no wrong in some fans' eyes...

pete74
04-08-2010, 04:05 PM
I'm very, VERY interested to see how fast we would have condemned Santonio or Ben if they had been on the Browns, Bengals, or Baltimore.

I am also as interested to see how much we would have said about how they should be cut, and how the Steelers would have cut them in an instant had they been a Steeler.

man do i agree with you. i wanted to say this so many times on here but tried to hold back for the most part.

pete74
04-08-2010, 04:07 PM
because he made 1 big catch?

1 big catch? do you watch the steelers on sundays? i asure you he made more then 1 big catch. you watch, after this season he will go to another team and be paid as one of the top 5 or 6 highest paid wr's