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stillers4me
04-13-2010, 05:06 PM
Just wondering.

What with everybody with a pulpit taking their turns at kicking Ben while he's down, I was wondering if there really was anything Ben could even do to earn the respect of the fanbase and even other NFL fans ever again. It seems that today, he could pull an entire family and their dog out of a burning house and it wouldn't be enough.

Do you see Ben getting past this........will 2 minute, comeback drives be enough? Will anybody really accept sincere community involvement and stellar play on the field as proof that he's really trying to be a better person? Will he ever really be forgiven?

Prok
04-13-2010, 05:08 PM
You'd think damn near our entire fanbase is without sin the way stones are being thrown at Ben these days.

Gotta say it's getting really old with me too.

Gnutella
04-13-2010, 05:11 PM
Will anybody really accept sincere community involvement and stellar play on the field as proof that he's really trying to be a better person? Will he ever really be forgiven?

All you need to do is look at the way some of our fans reacted to what Terry Bradshaw said to find that answer.

SteelGhost
04-13-2010, 05:13 PM
Just wondering.

What with everybody with a pulpit taking their turns at kicking Ben while he's down, I was wondering if there really was anything Ben could even do to earn the respect of the fanbase and even other NFL fans ever again. It seems that today, he could pull an entire family and their dog out of as burning house and it wouldn't be enough.

Do you see Ben getting past this........will 2 minute, comeback drives be enough? Will anybody really accept sincere community involvement and stellar play on the field as proof that he's really trying to be a better person? Will he ever really be forgiven?

I think he will be as long as he proves he's learned his lesson :thumbsup: ... besides he's innocent AFAIK :noidea:

Prok
04-13-2010, 05:18 PM
All you need to do is look at the way some of our fans reacted to what Terry Bradshaw said to find that answer.

I know Steelers fans who were waiting for chance to hate Ben. They got their wish now. Unfortunately some of our fanbase thinks we're above human nature and sin.

Gnutella
04-13-2010, 05:22 PM
I know Steelers fans who were waiting for chance to hate Ben. They got their wish now. Unfortunately some of our fanbase thinks we're above human nature and sin.

We do seem to have a slice of our fan base that claims to be fans while secretly loathing all the high-profile players.

Shoes
04-13-2010, 05:48 PM
Sure he can! That's my hope for him personally and as a Steeler.

steelerdude15
04-13-2010, 05:49 PM
Yeah I'm pretty sure he will, look at Kobe Bryant, no one ever says anything about that.

supa_fly_steeler
04-13-2010, 05:51 PM
if he somehow lands aubrey o day.

i will accept his written by someone else apology

fansince'76
04-13-2010, 05:51 PM
All you need to do is look at the way some of our fans reacted to what Terry Bradshaw said to find that answer.

And the ironic thing is the Nation deserved Bradshaw's ire.

SteelersBry79
04-13-2010, 05:53 PM
If he can lead the team to another Super Bowl this year, then he'll be fully redeemed IMO.

stillers4me
04-13-2010, 05:55 PM
If he can lead the team to another Super Bowl this year, then he'll be fully redeemed IMO.

And that will just give everybody else more reason to hate on him and claim we cheated and call him a rapist and say he should be in jail.

Screw'em.

tube517
04-13-2010, 05:58 PM
I'll still root for him. He needs to accept his punishment or non punishment and move on. He's going to have to have some guts and take his lumps like a man. He does it on the football field so he should have no problem taking criticism by fans, media, teammates, coaches, the Rooneys, opposing players, etc. He has to weather this firestorm first and lay low for a while.

tony hipchest
04-13-2010, 05:58 PM
anyone hear the galleries in augusta this weekend cheering for tiger?

the nba p;layoffs is upon us and pretty soon our airwaves will be flooded with kobe bryant puppet commercials for nike again.

all ben has to do is win.

SteelersBry79
04-13-2010, 06:07 PM
And that will just give everybody else more reason to hate on him and claim we cheated and call him a rapist and say he should be in jail.

Screw'em.

And more reason to be proud to be a Steelers fan and rub it in everyone else's faces! :tt03:

stillers4me
04-13-2010, 06:08 PM
anyone hear the galleries in augusta this weekend cheering for tiger?

the nba p;layoffs is upon us and pretty soon our airwaves will be flooded with kobe bryant puppet commercials for nike again.

all ben has to do is win.

I hope you're right, Tone. But it just seems like everybody sets the bar higher for the Steelers and nothing is ever good enough.

fansince'76
04-13-2010, 06:08 PM
And that will just give everybody else more reason to hate on him and claim we cheated and call him a rapist and say he should be in jail.

Screw'em.

:iagree:

Gnutella
04-13-2010, 06:09 PM
And the ironic thing is the Nation deserved Bradshaw's ire.

No doubt.

I mentioned in the Bradshaw thread that he was at least man enough to apologize for being a jerk even if it did take some time, and also to forgive those fans who treated him poorly. This stands in stark contrast to some of the petty comments directed at him in that thread by people who still don't like him. Terry Bradshaw is more of a man than any of them are.

The Duke
04-13-2010, 06:27 PM
I hope he thrives under all this hate

he's never been well liked or respected anyway

Go get #7 ben!

Gnutella
04-13-2010, 06:31 PM
I'll say this: if Ben Roethlisberger keeps his shit together and wins another championship, NFL Films will have a hell of a documentary on their hands.

stillers4me
04-13-2010, 06:33 PM
We've had one helluva year, Steelers fans.

Preacher
04-13-2010, 06:34 PM
Look.

There's Ben the person, and Ben the football player.

When it comes to Ben the person, his actions affect Ben the football player.

However, I am cheering for laundry on the field. So will I be ecstatic if Ben hits 20 TD's in the first three games he plays? Absolutely.

Will it change how I feel about his stupidity in the offseason? Nope.

What would it take for me to change how I feel about his offseason antics? Well, let's try getting through an offseason without nearly killing himself, or being accused of some type of sexual predatory action. That means making wiser decisions. That's all.

Basically, grow up.

Redemption? That's not my department.

Preacher
04-13-2010, 06:35 PM
I'll say this: if Ben Roethlisberger keeps his shit together and wins another championship, NFL Films will have a hell of a documentary on their hands.

:rofl::rofl:

SteelersBry79
04-13-2010, 06:36 PM
We've had one helluva year, Steelers fans.

And the scary part is it's only April! :doh:

+NuBbS+
04-13-2010, 06:36 PM
anyone hear the galleries in augusta this weekend cheering for tiger?

the nba p;layoffs is upon us and pretty soon our airwaves will be flooded with kobe bryant puppet commercials for nike again.

all ben has to do is win.


great example. once ben starts winning again and if he keeps his nose outta trouble, then he'll be fine. he needs to be more grateful b/c he knows that he can lose this forever. i hope everything goes well for him and i back him 100% no matter what.

BlastFurnace
04-13-2010, 06:36 PM
Look.

There's Ben the person, and Ben the football player.

When it comes to Ben the person, his actions affect Ben the football player.

However, I am cheering for laundry on the field. So will I be ecstatic if Ben hits 20 TD's in the first three games he plays? Absolutely.

Will it change how I feel about his stupidity in the offseason? Nope.

What would it take for me to change how I feel about his offseason antics? Well, let's try getting through an offseason without nearly killing himself, or being accused of some type of sexual predatory action. That means making wiser decisions. That's all.

Basically, grow up.

Redemption? That's not my department.

:applaudit::applaudit::applaudit:

stillers4me
04-13-2010, 06:38 PM
And the scary part is it's only April! :doh:

Most of us thought that things couldn't get worse after losing to the Browns.

MACH1
04-13-2010, 06:41 PM
anyone hear the galleries in augusta this weekend cheering for tiger?

the nba p;layoffs is upon us and pretty soon our airwaves will be flooded with kobe bryant puppet commercials for nike again.

all ben has to do is win.

And keep his nose clean. If winning is part of that, great. But I think just staying out of trouble for the few years would go along way.



And stop being such an a-hole.:rolleyes:

Kaeg
04-13-2010, 06:43 PM
He just has to show that he means it by staying out of trouble. Winning should be irrelevant, but I understand it certainly is relevant. It's easy to forget things when the person in question is winning. I say stay out of trouble and you'll keep my respect as a person. Stay winning and you'll keep my respect as a player.

SteelersGirlTN7
04-13-2010, 06:43 PM
So far, Ben has only proved that he is guilty of bad judgment. Until proven otherwise, I will still stand behind him. He is young and single and unfortunately he is going to be a target. Nobody really knows what happened behind that door but him and the girl but he DEFINITELY needs to stop putting himself in these positions. I believe in his apology and I hope he is sincere, and this is a wake up call for him. Actions will speak louder than words. Can't wait for the season to start!

SteelersBry79
04-13-2010, 06:45 PM
Most of us thought that things couldn't get worse after losing to the Browns.

The Browns....really? They don't even count. Losing to the Rats, now that's pretty bad.

Gnutella
04-13-2010, 08:01 PM
So far, Ben has only proved that he is guilty of bad judgment. Until proven otherwise, I will still stand behind him. He is young and single and unfortunately he is going to be a target. Nobody really knows what happened behind that door but him and the girl but he DEFINITELY needs to stop putting himself in these positions. I believe in his apology and I hope he is sincere, and this is a wake up call for him. Actions will speak louder than words. Can't wait for the season to start!

He's almost 30 now. Furthermore, Eli Manning found himself a suitable wife three years ago, while Philip Rivers married his high-school sweetheart, has four kids, and drives a minivan in the off-season. Meanwhile, Ben Roethlisberger has been getting college coeds drunk and banging them in public restrooms. If other late-twentysomething QBs can be respectable people, then why can't he?

All I can say about Roethlisberger is, better late than never.

stlrtruck
04-14-2010, 07:53 AM
I believe Ben can be redeemed. It's a matter of him wanting to be. And of course the only real way to do that in Pittsburgh is to win another Super Bowl.

zulater
04-14-2010, 08:42 AM
The real irony is that if Ben is innocent of commiting a crime ( which I believe to be the case) he would have been better off charged- tried and acquitted than for things to break the way they did. At least that way he would have had a chance to face his accuser and she would have been subject to cross examination as to her charges and possible motives. As it stands now even though she didn't have the courage to follow through with charges it's as if she's some combination of Snow White and Joan of Arc according to the national press and all her allegations must be taken as gospel despite the vaugness and inconsistentcies that are within them .

memphissteelergirl
04-14-2010, 09:08 AM
I'll still root for him. He needs to accept his punishment or non punishment and move on. He's going to have to have some guts and take his lumps like a man. He does it on the football field so he should have no problem taking criticism by fans, media, teammates, coaches, the Rooneys, opposing players, etc. He has to weather this firestorm first and lay low for a while.

Agree completely. How well he handles himself from now on (i.e., the manner in which he accepts whatever discliplinary action the Steelers/NFL brings down, and how he conducts himself on and off the field) will go a way in winning back the fans' trust. But, here again, he's got to make a conscious effort to do this. It's crucial that he thinks carefully about every action he takes, even to the smallest detail such as saying "thank you" to the clerk at the convenience store who sells him a pack of gum.

I'll say this: if Ben Roethlisberger keeps his shit together and wins another championship, NFL Films will have a hell of a documentary on their hands.

:chuckle: No doubt about THAT! :drink:

memphissteelergirl
04-14-2010, 09:15 AM
Eli Manning found himself a suitable wife three years ago


Hehe....that sounds like a line out of a Victorian period drama. :chuckle:

What can I say? I watch a lot of "Masterpiece Theatre." :wink02:

siss
04-14-2010, 09:44 AM
I still that most of Bens problems could be solved by finding a good women...I will volunteer my services!

sharkweek
04-14-2010, 06:16 PM
Ray Lewis gets tons of praise and admiration. If he can do it, Ben can too.

stillers4me
04-14-2010, 06:33 PM
Ray Lewis gets tons of praise and admiration. If he can do it, Ben can too.

I'm really not sold that he can. Pittsburgh is a brutal place to be a quarterback. I can't imagine anything he can do, even winning another superbowl that will satisfy people. I'm not saying I personally feel that way, it's just the way I see the community as a whole.

AllD
04-14-2010, 06:47 PM
He can redeem himself by winning another Super Bowl, quickly. Otherwise, he could be done in Pittsburgh. You don't hear about this kind of nonsense from Peyton Manning and I am no fan of his. Manning gets all of the commercials because he has a much cleaner image just like pre-scandal Tiger Woods.

stillers4me
04-14-2010, 07:03 PM
He can redeem himself by winning another Super Bowl, quickly. Otherwise, he could be done in Pittsburgh. You don't hear about this kind of nonsense from Peyton Manning and I am no fan of his. Manning gets all of the commercials because he has a much cleaner image just like pre-scandal Tiger Woods.

Peyton Manning......a pig.

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/colts/2003-11-04-manning-defamation-suit_x.htm

Manning's image could take hit in suit
By Mel Antonen, USA TODAY
Indianapolis Colts quarterback Peyton Manning, who has one of the NFL's most sparkling marketing images, will have to continue defending himself against a defamation lawsuit, the record of which includes a graphic description of an act he is accused of committing against a female assistant trainer while he was at the University of Tennessee.

Peyton Manning says the act in question was harmless, but former Tenn. trainer Jamie Naughright has filed a defamation suit against him.
By Steve Nesius, AP

Manning asked for the suit to be dismissed, but Polk County (Fla.) Circuit Judge Harvey A. Kornstein denied the motion, writing in a ruling filed Monday that there is evidence suggesting Manning knew the 2000 book written by him and his father, Archie, included false statements about the trainer and an incident in February 1996 involving her and Peyton Manning. (Related items: Trainer has backers in lawsuit | Excerpt from Manning: A Father, His Sons and a Football Legacy)

The trainer, Jamie Ann Naughright, disputes the contention in Manning's book that he dropped his pants and showed his backside to another athlete in the training room "thinking the trainer wasn't where she would see." In Manning: A Father, His Sons and a Football Legacy, he wrote the act was "crude, maybe, but harmless" and that Naughright should be able to "shrug it off."

According to Naughright's deposition, Manning, while being examined by Naughright, placed his "naked butt and rectum" on her face.

In the book, Peyton Manning also wrote of Naughright, "I thought she had a vulgar mouth."

Naughright, who left Tennessee in 1997 as part of a settlement with the university related to the 1996 incident, alleges that characterization led to her losing her subsequent job at Florida Southern College, a United Methodist liberal arts school in Lakeland, Fla.

Archie Manning, ghost writer John Underwood and HarperCollins Publishers Inc. also have been named as defendants. The elder Manning is a former NFL quarterback.

The defendants' New York-based lawyer, Slade Metcalf, declined to comment on Monday's ruling or whether they will appeal. Naughright's lawyer, Robert Puterbaugh of Lakeland, also declined to comment.

The case has been set for trial March 29 in Bartow, the Polk County seat.

Naughright's lawsuit, filed in May 2002, seeks monetary damages. ( the university paid the girl $300,000 while he was in college so she wouldn't file charges and she won this case....another $300,000 )

steelerjim58
04-14-2010, 07:18 PM
If Ben did indeed force himself on this girl or the one in Tahoe, then I would lose all respect for him and would be the first to say he should go to jail. But all I can conclude right now is that he may have had sex with her. If I had to make a guess I would bet that a fairly large number of players have done the exact same thing.

mesaSteeler
04-14-2010, 07:40 PM
Suspension, Fine? Roethlisberger Couldn't Care Less
http://nfl.fanhouse.com/2010/04/14/suspension-fine-roethlisberger-couldnt-care-less/
4/14/2010 1:20 PM ET By Terence Moore

Ben RoethlisbergerA suspension for Ben Roethlisberger, either by the NFL or by his Pittsburgh Steelers, will happen, because it has to happen. But it won't matter.

It never does.

In fact, the next knucklehead in sports will surface by the end of the month, or probably by the end of the week, and likely sooner than that.

Roethlisberger is just a symptom of a historical problem. Suspensions. Fines. Tongue lashings. Water boarding. Try as you might, you can't scare more than a few athletes into doing the right thing -- especially those with real or perceived clout -- because they think they already know it all.

They think they know that what happened to those other knuckleheads can't possibly happen to them. They think that, even if they are caught, they won't have anywhere near the same punishment as those other knuckleheads.

Mostly, they think that they won't get caught.

Just in the NFL in recent years, you've had everything from Pacman Jones and his 10 (ahem) interviews by the police within months, to the late Chris Henry's four arrests, to a drunk Donte Stallworth killing a guy with his Bentley, to Michael Vick and his dogs, to Plaxico Burress and his gun.

Elsewhere in sports, you've had Gilbert Arenas and his guns, along with Tiger Woods and his women, and you can keep going for eternity.

Woods had it right, when he described the reason for his reckless extra-marital transactions as having "a sense of entitlement." He was speaking for Eldrick Tont Woods and for all of those other knuckleheads -- past, present and future.

The solution?

There isn't one.

Never has been, and never will be.

Roethlisberger is the epitome of arrogance wrapped in stupidity, with no end in sight. In the NFL, for instance, you'll always have clueless teams such as the New York Jets, who have added Santonio Holmes, Braylon Edwards and Antonio Cromartie in the past year, taking Al Davis' "Just win, baby" to the extreme. So what if you are a knucklehead for this team? If you wait a while, you can become somebody else's knucklehead with a raise.

You also have Nike, which rarely has met a high-profile athlete that it wanted to drop. For instance: While the endorsement world kept collapsing around Woods -- from AT&T to Gatorade to Accenture -- the swoosh people remained. Then, after PLB Sports, which makes something called Big Ben's Beef Jerky, announced this week that it had terminated its contract with Roethlisberger, the swoosh people quickly said that Roethlisberger will remain one of their knuckleheads.

Surprise, surprise.

And this part's not a surprise, either: Roethlisberger is the epitome of arrogance wrapped in stupidity, with no end in sight. For one, he is at least a three-time loser regarding his decision-making away from the huddle. There was his nearly fatal motorcycle accident four years ago when he was told by his coach to stay off the thing, and now you've had two sexual assault charges against him within the last several months.

As for the latest charge, a district attorney in Milledgeville, Ga., decided not to prosecute the case. Even so, he gave enough details about what he said happened in a nightclub restroom -- featuring the 6-foot-5 and 241-pound Roethlisberger and a "highly intoxicated" 20-year-old woman who was much smaller than the quarterback -- to make you wonder if Roethlisberger has a vacancy between his ears.

It gets worse. When Roethlisberger walked into his news conference on Monday after he got his considerable break from that prosecutor, he resembled a burned-out love child from the 1960s -- crazy hair, unshaven face, spacey look.

Or I should say an uncaring look.

The look of entitlement.
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Within keeping Roethlisberger's shaky reputation with the media, he spent 73 seconds reading from a prepared text, and then he vanished. During the regular season, when all NFL quarterbacks are required to make themselves available for interviews at least once a week, Roethlisberger stays away from the Steelers' locker room like clockwork on his scheduled day of Wednesday until 11:42 a.m.

The locker room closes to the media at 11:45 a.m.

The point is, Roethlisberger hasn't created much goodwill through the years, even among his teammates. Wide receiver Hines Ward has ripped him a couple of times -- once, when Roethlisberger said he needed taller receivers despite winning two Super Bowls with the ones he had, and once, for not playing with a head injury that Ward thought wasn't as bad as Roethlisberger said it was.

He doesn't get it. He never did.

And, yes, Roethlisberger cleaned himself up -- after a mighty shove from somebody -- for Tuesday's meeting with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, but Roethlisberger's message already had been sent the day before by his silly ways in that news conference.

Fine. Suspension.

Whatever, dude.

That's the mantra for all of these knuckleheads.

Vincent
04-14-2010, 07:47 PM
http://forums.steelersfever.com/showpost.php?p=799382&postcount=38

stillers4me
04-14-2010, 07:48 PM
http://forums.steelersfever.com/showpost.php?p=799382&postcount=38

I'm running out of cookies. :cookie:

SteelersGirlTN7
04-14-2010, 08:22 PM
He's almost 30 now. Furthermore, Eli Manning found himself a suitable wife three years ago, while Philip Rivers married his high-school sweetheart, has four kids, and drives a minivan in the off-season. Meanwhile, Ben Roethlisberger has been getting college coeds drunk and banging them in public restrooms. If other late-twentysomething QBs can be respectable people, then why can't he?

All I can say about Roethlisberger is, better late than never.

LOL Well, at 33, I guess I take offense to the idea that you need to be married in order to be a better or more respectable person. I still go out and party with my friends on occasion. I just know not to put myself in questionable situations. I'm also not a $100 millionaire with a target on my back either. People have every right to celebrate and have a good time and enjoy life. Ben just needs to make smarter decisions in doing so.

By no means do I think Ben deserves a pass - he at the very least violated the personal conduct policy. Ben needs a wake up call, whether he comes by it honestly or it is forced and his actions as time goes by will show if he is sincere with his words.

mesaSteeler
04-14-2010, 08:34 PM
Can Ben be saved? That's the key question the Rooney's are dealing with.

Ben's on his third strike and if he does something like this again then he'll be gone. I honestly think he has an alcohol problem.

Consider what happens if Ben pulls this crap again and if he's unrepentant and still feels entitled then the odds are good he will. After all if Ben's that desperate to get laid couldn't he have taken her to a hotel room? At the very least it would have been more comfortable than some dirty bathroom.

That's why this incident is so troubling. To me Ben's actions seems more about power and a feeling of entitlement rather the pleasure of having sex. Rape is not about sex it's about power. What ever his actions were that night they were not an act of love, affection or respect.

So if Ben gets arrested for another incident like this then the Rooney's will cut him and Goodell will suspend him and we will have lost him.

The Rooney way with troubled players is to try and help them as they did with Earnie Holmes. (see http://forums.steelersfever.com/showthread.php?p=794982#post794982).

However if a player won't change their ways then the Rooney's will cut, trade or let them walk. What we don't know and will never find out is what Ben has told Tomlin and Art Rooney.

Is Ben truly repentant and willing to change or not?

If the Art decides that Ben won't change then I expect Ben will be traded. At least we'd get something for him and I would be fine with it. However if Art wants to give Ben another chance along with a fine, suspension and counseling then I'm down with that as well.

The Rooney's' are a justifiably proud and respected family and Ben's actions have dragged the Steelers and by extension the Rooney name into the sewer. I personally think Ben's action's that night were despicable and I'm pretty sure the Rooney's do to. Another incident like this by Ben would be intolerable.

I'm glad I don't have to make the decision but either way I will still be a Steeler fan and Rooney's have my full support.

steelerdude15
04-14-2010, 08:50 PM
I love how every writer thinks he's guilty.... people make me sick.

steelerjim58
04-14-2010, 08:52 PM
"- he at the very least violated the personal conduct policy. "

I'm curious, how many of you think that what Ben did should be a punishable offense by the league or team? I for one have a serious problem with an employer having that much control over what an employee does on their own time.

zulater
04-15-2010, 01:33 AM
"- he at the very least violated the personal conduct policy. "

I'm curious, how many of you think that what Ben did should be a punishable offense by the league or team? I for one have a serious problem with an employer having that much control over what an employee does on their own time.

How exactly? When did banging strange chicks in awkward places become a matter of the league personal conduct policy? I'd like to see where this goes after this if they suspend Ben. Maybe they should go after Cromartie for getting like 6 or 7 different gals pregnant?

BigBen'sSwagger
04-15-2010, 01:53 AM
The one thing I get from all this is that Ben has a HUGE image problem, and since that seems to be the case I would say if he wants to change any public perception of him that would be a great place to start, but that also would be up to him.

Along with that winning cures everything. Yes there will be those who will never cut him slack they were out before any of this took place and they are on their high horses now.

For what it is worth I think the Santonio trade was way to reactionary and I hate that it went down like that. We cut off our noses to spite our face.