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View Full Version : Attention Ben Roethlisberger doubters and haters.


zulater
01-07-2011, 01:53 PM
Make your presense known now, before the Steelers play a playoff game. No one wants to hear your ass if we lose a game come on here afterwards telling us how you knew it all along.

So tell us now or forever hold your peace.

SteelCityMom
01-07-2011, 01:56 PM
The pre pre game call out thread. :chuckle:

Personally...I love it! :thumbsup:

zulater
01-07-2011, 01:59 PM
The pre pre game call out thread. :chuckle:

Personally...I love it! :thumbsup:

:hatsoff:

:popcorn:

StainlessStill
01-07-2011, 02:10 PM
Don't sing it, bring it. LETS GO haters, this is your time.

Neil-Still-Rules-14
01-07-2011, 02:15 PM
That's what's up. Ben has looked the best this year that he has ever looked. Maybe that QB Coach he had during his suspension has something to do with it. Either way, I have a feeling Ben's best is yet to come. Go Steelers!

toughsticks87
01-07-2011, 02:15 PM
Best thread ever.

zulater
01-07-2011, 02:24 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/22828/walkers-2010-all-afc-north-team

Here, I'll heat it up in here. :wink02:

Offense

Quarterback: Joe Flacco, Baltimore Ravens

Skinny: Had Ben Roethlisberger not missed four games, he probably would have surpassed Flacco. But "Joe Cool" gets the nod in his third season after leading the Ravens to 12 wins and their third consecutive playoff appearance. His next step is to perform well in the postseason.

Generally I like James Walker, and I understand his perspective to some extent, but really? Flaccid over Ben?!!! As the guys on ESPN say, "C'mon man!!"

mizzouristeeler
01-07-2011, 02:39 PM
I think the young recievers are gonna step up big. It seems like ben is looking for them more and more.

StainlessStill
01-07-2011, 02:49 PM
I'm calling it now: The hero of this playoff series will be HEATH MILLER.

MDSteel15
01-07-2011, 02:51 PM
I'm calling it now: The hero of this playoff series will be HEATH MILLER.

LaMarr Woodley!

steelerchad
01-07-2011, 02:52 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/22828/walkers-2010-all-afc-north-team

Here, I'll heat it up in here. :wink02:

Offense

Quarterback: Joe Flacco, Baltimore Ravens

Skinny: Had Ben Roethlisberger not missed four games, he probably would have surpassed Flacco. But "Joe Cool" gets the nod in his third season after leading the Ravens to 12 wins and their third consecutive playoff appearance. His next step is to perform well in the postseason.

Generally I like James Walker, and I understand his perspective to some extent, but really? Flaccid over Ben?!!! As the guys on ESPN say, "C'mon man!!"


Flacco over Ben? Going into the playoffs, that's going out on a limb. Here's the playoff stat lines for both QB's. Big Ben may be the best big game QB of all time. Joe's stats may be the worst of any QB that's played in at least 5 playoff games.


Ben 8-2 172-278 61.5% 2,239yds 15TD 12INT
Joe 3-2 57-120 45.9% 660yds 1TD 6INT

an avg. QB rating is probably 75-80.

Joe has had one game above avg. at 89. In the other 4 games he has been pathetic with his 2nd best playoff performance at a 59.

Ben on the other hand has had 2 incredible games of 149 and 125 ratings and 8 of his 10 playoff games have been higher than 78.

stb_steeler
01-07-2011, 03:01 PM
http://espn.go.com/blog/afcnorth/post/_/id/22828/walkers-2010-all-afc-north-team

Here, I'll heat it up in here. :wink02:

Offense

Quarterback: Joe Flacco, Baltimore Ravens

Skinny: Had Ben Roethlisberger not missed four games, he probably would have surpassed Flacco. But "Joe Cool" gets the nod in his third season after leading the Ravens to 12 wins and their third consecutive playoff appearance. His next step is to perform well in the postseason.

Generally I like James Walker, and I understand his perspective to some extent, but really? Flaccid over Ben?!!! As the guys on ESPN say, "C'mon man!!"

Uh Oh zulater...you gonna give bobbyjr. a woody

PhantomJB93
01-07-2011, 03:08 PM
I'm calling it now: The hero of this playoff series will be HEATH MILLER.

You spelled Emmanuel Sanders wrong.

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 03:12 PM
Make your presense known now, before the Steelers play a playoff game. No one wants to hear your ass if we lose a game come on here afterwards telling us how you knew it all along.

So tell us now or forever hold your peace.

Sure no problem. If he plays a game like he did against Cleveland we should coast to the 7th Super Bowl victory. I think he has been super inconsistent this year. He is the leader of this offense that has looked so bad this year , redzone especially. People give him all the credit when we win so it only fair that as bad as this offense has looked should reflect on him. He struggled against Baltimore,Buffalo,Cinncy, New Orleans,Jets, New England he looked terrible until garbage time and Miami he almost fumbled the game away,he did really we got a gift from the refs. So yeah if Ben plays like he did in those games we will probably lose. The defense has done its job all year, its a joke in the games like Buffalo that we can blow that team off the field. To me poor Qb play is the reason. He has games that he either make passes to the WR's shoe laces or over there heads 4 feet. He looked great against the browns,right the lowly browns. Can he be that good against a playoff caliber team next week ? I have my doubts.:tt02::tt02:

caseyviator
01-07-2011, 03:31 PM
big ben as usual will march down the field and win the games with bombs,pinpoint passing..comparing him to flacco n the playoffs is a complete joke and really no comparison there...ben is the best with the game on the line...best big game qb out there,,,,,
good news guys when ravens play brady in 2 weeks they are goin to hutr him and he wont be playin against us!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! crystal ball says!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

steelerchad
01-07-2011, 03:37 PM
Sure no problem. If he plays a game like he did against Cleveland we should coast to the 7th Super Bowl victory. I think he has been super inconsistent this year. He is the leader of this offense that has looked so bad this year , redzone especially. People give him all the credit when we win so it only fair that as bad as this offense has looked should reflect on him. He struggled against Baltimore,Buffalo,Cinncy, New Orleans,Jets, New England he looked terrible until garbage time and Miami he almost fumbled the game away,he did really we got a gift from the refs. So yeah if Ben plays like he did in those games we will probably lose. The defense has done its job all year, its a joke in the games like Buffalo that we can blow that team off the field. To me poor Qb play is the reason. He has games that he either make passes to the WR's shoe laces or over there heads 4 feet. He looked great against the browns,right the lowly browns. Can he be that good against a playoff caliber team next week ? I have my doubts.:tt02::tt02:


I guess you're entitled to your opinion. But statistically, Ben's worst game this year was N.O. with a 67 QB rating. He's had a bunch of pretty good games and most importantly he's taken care of the ball this year. Only 5 INT's in 12 games.
He's also been very good in the playoffs in the past. 8 of his 10 playoff performances have been avg. to great. He's had 2 bad games in the playoffs. And those numbers are against playoff teams, which should be the best teams, right.
It wouldn't shock me if he had a bad game in the playoffs, but odds are he won't.

Buddha Bus
01-07-2011, 03:45 PM
It looks to me that Ben is finally hitting his stride and in sync with the receivers after the lack of preseason time, the suspension and having to knock the rust off. I think it comes more down to if the O-line can continue to protect him like they have the past few games. They have stepped up their game a bit and Ben seems to be getting rid of the ball quicker on slant patterns and passes to the RBs out of the backfield. If they continue doing those things, I think the sky's the limit with this team. They just need to find a way to beat the Cheatriots* in my opinion. Ben is going to have a huge playoff run IMHO.

plenewken
01-07-2011, 04:09 PM
Ben and the Offense haven't been particularly impressive against strong teams. Now that we'll be playing Superbowl candidates, I hope they'll show a totally different face otherwise it could be a very short post season.

Steelstoned1972
01-07-2011, 04:29 PM
I actually think ben will shine and our defense is gettin healthier and have been playing better pass defense as of late..........this year seems like a year that has doubters from the beginning but this core group has been through many wars and has come out on top, throw in some of our younger rising stars ( timmons , pouncey , wallace , sanders , brown , hood , mendy , etc ) and i think we have a killer recipe. " our number and our goal is seven , our playmaker on def . troy #43 (4+3 =7 ) and on offense is #7 "

harrison'samonster
01-07-2011, 05:01 PM
Sure no problem. If he plays a game like he did against Cleveland we should coast to the 7th Super Bowl victory. I think he has been super inconsistent this year. He is the leader of this offense that has looked so bad this year , redzone especially. People give him all the credit when we win so it only fair that as bad as this offense has looked should reflect on him. He struggled against Baltimore,Buffalo,Cinncy, New Orleans,Jets, New England he looked terrible until garbage time and Miami he almost fumbled the game away,he did really we got a gift from the refs. So yeah if Ben plays like he did in those games we will probably lose. The defense has done its job all year, its a joke in the games like Buffalo that we can blow that team off the field. To me poor Qb play is the reason. He has games that he either make passes to the WR's shoe laces or over there heads 4 feet. He looked great against the browns,right the lowly browns. Can he be that good against a playoff caliber team next week ? I have my doubts.:tt02::tt02:


Roethlisberger is and always will be great! I think the problem (B.A) never even steps onto the field.
I think a big problem with Roethlisberger and the offense IS the inconsitancy. I don't know if it's the style of offense they run or what.
I was going to back up Buffalo and say that their defense was pretty tough, but it seems they were 28th in scoring and 24th in total yards allowed. ouch.

NoFieldFive
01-07-2011, 05:56 PM
Hopefully they let Ben run the no huddle besides the 2 minute drill and if they are behind at the end. They look so much better in that mode.

TRH
01-07-2011, 06:08 PM
no one else i'd rather have behind center at this stage of the game than Ben

zulater
01-07-2011, 06:38 PM
Sure no problem. If he plays a game like he did against Cleveland we should coast to the 7th Super Bowl victory. I think he has been super inconsistent this year. He is the leader of this offense that has looked so bad this year , redzone especially. People give him all the credit when we win so it only fair that as bad as this offense has looked should reflect on him. He struggled against Baltimore,Buffalo,Cinncy, New Orleans,Jets, New England he looked terrible until garbage time and Miami he almost fumbled the game away,he did really we got a gift from the refs. So yeah if Ben plays like he did in those games we will probably lose. The defense has done its job all year, its a joke in the games like Buffalo that we can blow that team off the field. To me poor Qb play is the reason. He has games that he either make passes to the WR's shoe laces or over there heads 4 feet. He looked great against the browns,right the lowly browns. Can he be that good against a playoff caliber team next week ? I have my doubts.:tt02::tt02:

So has Ben been the problem when the offense isn't getting the job done? Do you think he's a below average qb, or perhaps just average? How many qb's do you see operating behind our o-line doing a better job? Was Kordell better? Did Ben just tag along for the ride when we won our last two Super Bowls? :noidea:

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 06:43 PM
So has Ben been the problem when the offense isn't getting the job done? Do you think he's a below average qb, or perhaps just average? How many qb's do you see operating behind our o-line doing a better job? Was Kordell better? Did Ben just tag along for the ride when we won our last two Super Bowls? :noidea:

IF YOU CAN REMEMBER THE WHOLE WHY BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THIS YEAR ??? CAN YOU ????? 3-1 WITHOUT ROETHLISBERGER. I THINK TAMPA GAME WAS THE BEST THE OFFENSE LOOKED THIS YEAR. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION BATCH AND DIXION CAN SURVIVE BEHIND OUR LINE. THAT IS SUCH A COP OUT THAT HE IS THE ONLY QB THAT COULD, YOUR THEORY WAS PROVED TO BE BUNK THIS YEAR.
:drink:

zulater
01-07-2011, 06:46 PM
IF YOU CAN REMEMBER THE WHOLE WHY BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THIS YEAR ??? CAN YOU ????? 3-1 WITHOUT ROETHLISBERGER. I THINK TAMPA GAME WAS THE BEST THE OFFENSE LOOKED THIS YEAR. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION BATCH AND DIXION CAN SURVIVE BEHIND OUR LINE. THAT IS SUCH A COP OUT THAT HE IS THE ONLY QB THAT COULD, YOUR THEORY WAS PROVED TO BE BUNK THIS YEAR.
:drink:



http://espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=5536

Why the caps? Uh you really think Dennis dixon and Batch are on par with Ben? :toofunny:

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 06:49 PM
So has Ben been the problem when the offense isn't getting the job done? Do you think he's a below average qb, or perhaps just average? How many qb's do you see operating behind our o-line doing a better job? Was Kordell better? Did Ben just tag along for the ride when we won our last two Super Bowls? :noidea:

Like I said, people like you give him all the credit for the wins, but look past HIM when it struggles. YES i think his inconsistent is the reason. WAS it Bruce Arians fault last week when the offense lit it up ? Take off the Balck and gold sunglasses and put down the Big Ben kool aid !

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 06:50 PM
http://espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=5536

Why the caps? Uh you really think Dennis dixon and Batch are on par with Ben? :toofunny:

Not What I said and you know that... you are wrong ...face it.

By the way your the one that started this thread ...are you going to cry and whine now if people do what you ask and post a "doubt or hate" topic as you put it?

sarahpalinhater
01-07-2011, 06:54 PM
IF YOU CAN REMEMBER THE WHOLE WHY BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THIS YEAR ??? CAN YOU ????? 3-1 WITHOUT ROETHLISBERGER. I THINK TAMPA GAME WAS THE BEST THE OFFENSE LOOKED THIS YEAR. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION BATCH AND DIXION CAN SURVIVE BEHIND OUR LINE. THAT IS SUCH A COP OUT THAT HE IS THE ONLY QB THAT COULD, YOUR THEORY WAS PROVED TO BE BUNK THIS YEAR.
:drink:




Huh!! Hey Arnold,,I can remember back,,and I remember our offense AT HOME against a less then AVERAGE Atlanta defense not scoring a SINGLE TD in 4 Quarters, and was LUCKY to get that long TD Run by Mendy. I remember that if weren't for Antonio Brown's opening Kick-off in Tennessee,,,we would have lost that game. Or were you AMAZED by the COMBINED Passing yards of Batch and Dixon which was 43 Yds :applaudit: And what was it about the Baltimore game on offense you were Impressed with ? After Mendy had that one nice 7 Yd TD run,,Batch had 4 other straight chances, TWO that started inside Baltimore's 45 Yd line,,,and Batch went 0-8 passing, and we went 3 and out 4 straight times!


Please Arnold,,,,Batch, and Dixon did as YOMAN of a Job as they could,,,But to say we were close to comparable on offense with them as we are with Ben is as STUPID as a statement as they come :doh:

zulater
01-07-2011, 06:54 PM
Like I said, people like you give him all the credit for the wins, but look past HIM when it struggles. YES i think his inconsistent is the reason. WAS it Bruce Arians fault last week when the offense lit it up ? Take off the Balck and gold sunglasses and put down the Big Ben kool aid !

I guess it's the difference between knowing the difference between an elite franchise qb, and mediocre crap like Kordell, Charlie Batch, and the dreadfull Dennis dixon. If you don't see it, I can't explain it, so I wont bother trying anymore.

Just remember when the day comes that Ben helps this team win it's 7th Lombardi, he'll have done 3 times. But I guess you'll see that as nothing more than a coincidence, too bad Korkie wasn't so lucky, huh? :flap:

zulater
01-07-2011, 07:09 PM
Not What I said and you know that... you are wrong ...face it.

By the way your the one that started this thread ...are you going to cry and whine now if people do what you ask and post a "doubt or hate" topic as you put it?

No I wont whine, that's their right to be wrong. :chuckle:

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 07:33 PM
Huh!! Hey Arnold,,I can remember back,,and I remember our offense AT HOME against a less then AVERAGE Atlanta defense not scoring a SINGLE TD in 4 Quarters, and was LUCKY to get that long TD Run by Mendy. I remember that if weren't for Antonio Brown's opening Kick-off in Tennessee,,,we would have lost that game. Or were you AMAZED by the COMBINED Passing yards of Batch and Dixon which was 43 Yds :applaudit: And what was it about the Baltimore game on offense you were Impressed with ? After Mendy had that one nice 7 Yd TD run,,Batch had 4 other straight chances, TWO that started inside Baltimore's 45 Yd line,,,and Batch went 0-8 passing, and we went 3 and out 4 straight times!


Please Arnold,,,,Batch, and Dixon did as YOMAN of a Job as they could,,,But to say we were close to comparable on offense with them as we are with Ben is as STUPID as a statement as they come :doh:====

AND we still won. Ben really made the O look good in Buffalo and New Orleans he had like 15 passing yard the second half of the Cinncy game....he looked fabulous in the pats game too.....Gimme a break lady.

sarahpalinhater
01-07-2011, 07:36 PM
We won yes, but how does that mean our offense and the QB position is as comparable to Ben ? Cause CLEARLY the numbers don't agree with you.

Neil-Still-Rules-14
01-07-2011, 07:39 PM
The day before Ben's return, the passing offense was 32nd and total offense was 31st. Each now sit at 14th. That should be evidence enough for any haters. Yes they won...that's because the defense had a combined 12 turnovers in the first 4! Also they allowed 12.5 points per game. They could have gone 4-0 had Ben been in the lineup.

SteelKnight
01-07-2011, 08:23 PM
That's what's up. Ben has looked the best this year that he has ever looked. Maybe that QB Coach he had during his suspension has something to do with it. Either way, I have a feeling Ben's best is yet to come. Go Steelers!

Wait a minute...Ben is my favorite player in all of sports...but I think he has been inaccurate at times this season.

Still, if we lose, it won't be because of Ben. Ben's great.

I am always feeling nervous about our pass D so if ever i was going to say "I knew it" and be a doubter, it would be about that. I'd like to see us great like in 2008 as far as pass D. It makes me nervous. I would gladly like to be wrong.

Big
01-07-2011, 08:38 PM
If any self proclaimed Steelers fan degrades any Steelers player after any loss in the post season, they will get a visit from my little friend.

USWSteel
01-07-2011, 08:46 PM
If any self proclaimed Steelers fan degrades any Steelers player after any loss in the post season, they will get a visit from my little friend.

Thats really scary !!! :wave:

StainlessStill
01-07-2011, 10:22 PM
You spelled Emmanuel Sanders wrong.

Someone's smelling a kick return for a touchdown! Oh that would be SO sweet....:tt04:

As far as Ben looking good, I think it's close to the best year he's had thus far but the start of the year really downplayed how he could have grown from then until now. He'll have to make it up in the post-season, to which we ALL know he's so damn good at! I think his best year was easily '07.

plenewken
01-08-2011, 09:19 AM
So has Ben been the problem when the offense isn't getting the job done? Do you think he's a below average qb, or perhaps just average? How many qb's do you see operating behind our o-line doing a better job? Was Kordell better? Did Ben just tag along for the ride when we won our last two Super Bowls? :noidea:

I don't care how you rank him and I don't give a rat's @ss about Kordell either. The only thing that matters to me is can he lead the offense to score more points than the opponent in these playoffs. Based on what I've seen this season against playoff caliber teams, it remains to be seen. Not saying it won't happen but I'm not drooling over what he showed so far this year in this domain, sorry.
As for the OL, how many games does Ben need to play to realize that his style of play doesn't work with the line he has? If he needs 8 sec to find an open guy, he's not going to get them, except if he plays Carolina and Cleveland so he better read faster, hit faster, move faster or throw the ball away.
When Ben is Superbowl MVP, I'll change my opinion. I'm not holding my breath it's gonna happen.

zulater
01-08-2011, 09:34 AM
I don't care how you rank him and I don't give a rat's @ss about Kordell either. The only thing that matters to me is can he lead the offense to score more points than the opponent in these playoffs. Based on what I've seen this season against playoff caliber teams, it remains to be seen. Not saying it won't happen but I'm not drooling over what he showed so far this year in this domain, sorry


As for the OL, how many games does Ben need to play to realize that his style of play doesn't work with the line he has?

How many Steeler games do you need to see that there's no quarterback alive who's "style of play" would work tremendously with our o-line?

Did you see last year's playoffs when the Ravens consistently collapsed the pocket on Brady before he had time to get to his second read? How brilliant did he look? What about Peyton when he's forced to deliver the ball before you can count 2 Mississippi, how wonderfull is he then? Do you watch other quarterback around the league or do you just have myopic vision where you only see Ben's missteps?


If he needs 8 sec to find an open guy, he's not going to get them, except if he plays Carolina and Cleveland so he better read faster, hit faster, move faster or throw the ball away.

Yeah I'll remember that when he hits someone 25 yards down the field after he's scrambled around for 5 or 6 seconds.


When Ben is Superbowl MVP, I'll change my opinion. I'm not holding my breath it's gonna happen.

Lol, guy shoulda been SB MVP once already, if Peyton Manning or Brady have the same game in SB XLIII, no question about it they get the award that game.
Maybe you'll come to appreciate Ben 5 or 10 years after he's retired, but I doubt it.

plenewken
01-08-2011, 11:41 AM
Lol, guy shoulda been SB MVP once already, if Peyton Manning or Brady have the same game in SB XLIII, no question about it they get the award that game.
Maybe you'll come to appreciate Ben 5 or 10 years after he's retired, but I doubt it.

FYI, in SB XLIII, Warner had better numbers than Ben. All these discussions about Ben show that his style is not to the liking of everyone. I don't cream my pants when he gets sacked day in and day out.
I think he's one of the best and I'm glad we have him but he's not particularly exciting to watch. He used to be in the early years of his career but not anymore. That's my opinion.

By the way, I believe Rodgers and Vick would perform better behind our current OL.

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 11:49 AM
FYI, in SB XLIII, Warner had better numbers than Ben. All these discussions about Ben show that his style is not to the liking of everyone. I think he's one of the best and I'm glad we have him but he's not particularly exciting to watch. He used to be in the early years of his career but not anymore. That's my opinion.

By the way, I believe Rodgers and Vick would perform better behind our current OL.





Hey son, Ben in the last Super Bowl took us 90 Yds in under 2 minutes, with a bad O-line protecting him, no Hines Ward, who was not even being paid attention to by Arizona's own admission, and Nate Washington was Mr.Invisable that game,,went all the way down the field, and threw the most PERFECT corner pass in NFL History...All Holmes did was catch it. Which is what a WR is supposed to do.


Ben had a WAY Better game than Warner did. Warner's stats were padded late in the game cause Tomlin was stupid to go to his own Tampa cover-2 zone,,which we had never used all that season until that Super Bowl, and our defensive players looked lost trying to do it. Take a look at the Manning brothers stats in the two SB games before, and right after that game..Ben's numbers were better then Eli and Peyton...but Oh Gosh...BOTH of them were named SB MVP's.


Ben is easily the leagues most DISRESPECTED QB. And he should have won that MVP Award over Santonio. Anyone disagreeing just doesn't know SQUAT about football.!!

plenewken
01-08-2011, 12:36 PM
Hey son, Ben in the last Super Bowl took us 90 Yds in under 2 minutes, with a bad O-line protecting him, no Hines Ward, who was not even being paid attention to by Arizona's own admission, and Nate Washington was Mr.Invisable that game,,went all the way down the field, and threw the most PERFECT corner pass in NFL History...All Holmes did was catch it. Which is what a WR is supposed to do.


Ben had a WAY Better game than Warner did. Warner's stats were padded late in the game cause Tomlin was stupid to go to his own Tampa cover-2 zone,,which we had never used all that season until that Super Bowl, and our defensive players looked lost trying to do it. Take a look at the Manning brothers stats in the two SB games before, and right after that game..Ben's numbers were better then Eli and Peyton...but Oh Gosh...BOTH of them were named SB MVP's.


Ben is easily the leagues most DISRESPECTED QB. And he should have won that MVP Award over Santonio. Anyone disagreeing just doesn't know SQUAT about football.!!

Son??? Hahahaha!

"Warner completed 31 of 43 passes for 377 yards and three touchdowns, with one interception. His 377 yards was the second most in Super Bowl history behind his own record of 414 yards in Super Bowl XXXIV (Warner also holds the third place record with 365 yards in Super Bowl XXXVI).[59] With the three highest totals in Super Bowl history, he passed Joe Montana for most career yards in Super Bowl history with 1,156 (Montana threw for 1,142 yards in four games). "

Warner's stats were no more padded than Ben's. He threw the ball more accurately than Ben did. As for Holmes' TD, are you kidding me? It took a Hall of Famer type of reception by Holmes to not only catch the ball (outside the line) but more importantly to keep both feet in play. This is what earned him the MVP title without any discussion.

Ben is not the most disrespected QB, he's simply evaluated by a lot of objective experts (vs biased fans) who don't see his performance as outstanding as you believe it to be.

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 12:43 PM
Son??? Hahahaha!

"Warner completed 31 of 43 passes for 377 yards and three touchdowns, with one interception. His 377 yards was the second most in Super Bowl history behind his own record of 414 yards in Super Bowl XXXIV (Warner also holds the third place record with 365 yards in Super Bowl XXXVI).[59] With the three highest totals in Super Bowl history, he passed Joe Montana for most career yards in Super Bowl history with 1,156 (Montana threw for 1,142 yards in four games). "

Warner's stats were no more padded than Ben's. He threw the ball more accurately than Ben did. As for Holmes' TD, are you kidding me? It took a Hall of Famer type of reception by Holmes to not only catch the ball (outside the line) but more importantly to keep both feet in play. This is what earned him the MVP title without any discussion.

Ben is not the most disrespected QB, he's simply evaluated by a lot of objective experts (vs biased fans) who don't see his performance as outstanding as you believe it to be.





After we were up 20-3,,,Warner, when Tomlin switched away from what we were doing earlier, threw for 212 Yds of his total. And furthermore,,,Holmes catch was nothing spectacular. The throw was perfectly tossed in the corner where ONLY Holmes could catch it. His placement of his feet were good, but that's what a WR is supposed to do. Did Santonio have to jump to get it ?, or contort his body ?...No! It was becaue of Ben's perfect pass.


Hey, do me a favor,,,why don't you show and compare the QB numbers for Ben in that game, as to both Manning's the two previous SB's ? You know, the Manning's who WERE awarded to SB MVP Award ???


Do that, and make an arguement that their performances were better then Ben's, and deserved their MVP Awards. And Ben did not. Until then...Shut the hell up...Son!!

joeyssteelcurtain
01-08-2011, 12:56 PM
What is Warner's record in the super bowl 1-2. Ben's 2-0. And dont give me the bullshit about how bad ben played in the first super bowl. He played very well in the other 3 playoff games.

joeyssteelcurtain
01-08-2011, 01:03 PM
Son??? Hahahaha!

"Warner completed 31 of 43 passes for 377 yards and three touchdowns, with one interception. His 377 yards was the second most in Super Bowl history behind his own record of 414 yards in Super Bowl XXXIV (Warner also holds the third place record with 365 yards in Super Bowl XXXVI).[59] With the three highest totals in Super Bowl history, he passed Joe Montana for most career yards in Super Bowl history with 1,156 (Montana threw for 1,142 yards in four games). "

Warner's stats were no more padded than Ben's. He threw the ball more accurately than Ben did. As for Holmes' TD, are you kidding me? It took a Hall of Famer type of reception by Holmes to not only catch the ball (outside the line) but more importantly to keep both feet in play. This is what earned him the MVP title without any discussion.

Ben is not the most disrespected QB, he's simply evaluated by a lot of objective experts (vs biased fans) who don't see his performance as outstanding as you believe it to be.

What is Warner's record in the super bowl 1-2. Ben's 2-0 and don't give me that bullshit about how bad Ben played in the first super bowl. He played very well in the other 3 playoff games

plenewken
01-08-2011, 01:05 PM
After we were up 20-3,,,Warner, when Tomlin switched away from what we were doing earlier, threw for 212 Yds of his total. And furthermore,,,Holmes catch was nothing spectacular. The throw was perfectly tossed in the corner where ONLY Holmes could catch it. His placement of his feet were good, but that's what a WR is supposed to do. Did Santonio have to jump to get it ?, or contort his body ?...No! It was becaue of Ben's perfect pass.


Hey, do me a favor,,,why don't you show and compare the QB numbers for Ben in that game, as to both Manning's the two previous SB's ? You know, the Manning's who WERE awarded to SB MVP Award ???


Do that, and make an arguement that their performances were better then Ben's, and deserved their MVP Awards. And Ben did not. Until then...Shut the hell up...Son!!

You have to resort to "shut the hell up" to try to make a point? And quit calling me son cause you're just making an @ss of yourself.
Why would I compare Ben to the Mannings in 3 different Superbowls? Doesn't make any friggin' sense.
Ben was not MVP in the Superbowls he played in because he didn't deserve it, plain and simple and there's no friggin' anti-Ben conspiracy.

plenewken
01-08-2011, 01:09 PM
He played very well in the other 3 playoff games

That's exactly what I wrote, but he was also absolutely putrid in SB XL. Just keep ignoring it if it makes you feel better, I don't care, but it's anything but BS.

cloppbeast
01-08-2011, 01:45 PM
Hey, do me a favor,,,why don't you show and compare the QB numbers for Ben in that game, as to both Manning's the two previous SB's ? You know, the Manning's who WERE awarded to SB MVP Award ???

Both Mannings earned Super Bowl MVPS because they were the most deserving of the award based on their performance in the game. Nobody deserved it more than they did.

Ben may have had an impressive game in Super Bowl XLIII, but Santonio was more deserving of the MVP. That's why Santonio won it.

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 02:20 PM
Both Mannings earned Super Bowl MVPS because they were the most deserving of the award based on their performance in the game. Nobody deserved it more than they did.

Ben may have had an impressive game in Super Bowl XLIII, but Santonio was more deserving of the MVP. That's why Santonio won it.




So you're gonna sit there and LAUGHINGLY tell me that Peyton Manning's 244 Yds, on 60 % complettion on 38 attempts was MORE Impressive then Dominic Rhodes 21 carries for 115 Yds and a TD against the then # 1 rated run defense of the Bears ?


Or what about the 2002 SB game, was Brady's 145 Yd game on BARELY 50 % completion all that ? I mean it was Ty Law's TD return that was the key play, or Antwaan Smith's rushing that was key in that game...nothing Brady did.


So much for your theory huh ? :doh: Ben was CLEARLY the best player on that field,,Not " Smoketonio Holmes "

austinfrench76
01-08-2011, 02:29 PM
Let's ride Ben to 7!!!! How coincidental, his jersey # and the 7th SB title!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SteelCityMom
01-08-2011, 02:31 PM
Let's ride Ben to 7!!!! How coincidental, his jersey # and the 7th SB title!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And in his 7th season in the Steelers 77th season. Would be freaky. :chuckle:

SteelCityMom
01-08-2011, 02:33 PM
Do that, and make an arguement that their performances were better then Ben's, and deserved their MVP Awards. And Ben did not. Until then...Shut the hell up...Son!!

Chill with the personal attacks. I don't care how people treat obvious trolls around here, but there's no need to act like an ass about other peoples opinions on this matter.

biggtee
01-08-2011, 02:38 PM
RID OR DIE with BIGBEN!!!!!!!!! THATS MY QUARTERBACK! *T.O. VOICE*
NO OTHER QB I WANT ON MY TEAM DEAD OR ALIVE I DONT GIVE A F***!!

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 02:39 PM
Chill with the personal attacks. I don't care how people treat obvious trolls around here, but there's no need to act like an ass about other peoples opinions on this matter.




I agree. But maybe you can offer an opinion ? I mean do you really feel that Holmes performance was better then Ben's ? Or that other league QB's like Manning and Brady were given MVP awards for obvious less Impressive performances in past Super Bowl games. ? I mean he can have his opinion yes. But just back it up with some kind of facts is all.

SteelCityMom
01-08-2011, 02:42 PM
I agree. But maybe you can offer an opinion ? I mean do you really feel that Holmes performance was better then Ben's ? Or that other league QB's like Manning and Brady were given MVP awards for obvious less Impressive performances in past Super Bowl games. ? I mean he can have his opinion yes. But just back it up with some kind of facts is all.

My opinion? Honestly, it was a toss up for me as to who should have been MVP. Both made some great plays, especially on the final drive. You can make a serious case for both players really. In the end, I think they went with Holmes simply because, while it was a great pass from Ben, it was an even better reception. There aren't a lot of WR's who would have made that catch the way Holmes did.

StainlessStill
01-08-2011, 02:46 PM
HEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAATH!!!!!!:tt04:

btaylor179
01-08-2011, 03:02 PM
i look at it this way.....would brady put up the numbers he does behind our line ? no........ben would be ben behind patriots line.....im not tooting bens horn by no means....i still flinch everytime he drops back to pass. are we 12 and 4 w out him? probably yes.....he beat no really good teams. the defense got him the ball against ratbirds. if the ben plays like the one when we were the 6th seed in playoffs we will be playing in texas if the ben plays that showed up in MOST of the games this year we are 1 and done! steelers won majority of there games if not all because of DEFENSE!!!!!!! we couldn't score from 1 yrd out on all 3 downs against saints...i mean com on man!

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 04:02 PM
i look at it this way.....would brady put up the numbers he does behind our line ? no........ben would be ben behind patriots line.....im not tooting bens horn by no means....i still flinch everytime he drops back to pass. are we 12 and 4 w out him? probably yes.....he beat no really good teams. the defense got him the ball against ratbirds. if the ben plays like the one when we were the 6th seed in playoffs we will be playing in texas if the ben plays that showed up in MOST of the games this year we are 1 and done! steelers won majority of there games if not all because of DEFENSE!!!!!!! we couldn't score from 1 yrd out on all 3 downs against saints...i mean com on man!






If Ben plays the way he did this year..No ? Ben was like 4th overall in QB ratings. And this with easily the leagues WORST Pass-Blocking O-Line. And him taking every " Cheap " shot that there is with NO Roger Goodell protection!! So where do you get this " If Ben plays like he did this season we are 1 and done BS ? "

cloppbeast
01-08-2011, 04:09 PM
So you're gonna sit there and LAUGHINGLY tell me that Peyton Manning's 244 Yds, on 60 % complettion on 38 attempts was MORE Impressive then Dominic Rhodes 21 carries for 115 Yds and a TD against the then # 1 rated run defense of the Bears ?


Or what about the 2002 SB game, was Brady's 145 Yd game on BARELY 50 % completion all that ? I mean it was Ty Law's TD return that was the key play, or Antwaan Smith's rushing that was key in that game...nothing Brady did.


So much for your theory huh ? :doh: Ben was CLEARLY the best player on that field,,Not " Smoketonio Holmes "

wtf is your problem dude? Stop being an ass.

You remind me of another guy that has been on this forum before. Does the name whatdoiknow ring a bell?

Neil-Still-Rules-14
01-08-2011, 04:12 PM
I also think Tyree probably should have been the MVP of SB 42.

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 04:15 PM
wtf is your problem dude? Stop being an ass.

You remind me of another guy that has been on this forum before. Does the name whatdoiknow ring a bell?




Uhm, no. And why am I being an A$$ ? Just because you can't make a valid point. Rather just attack Ben's play with ridiculous statements. ? I can admit when Ben does play bad. And he has in the past. But his being here is the main reason why we have 2 current SB titles. You think we would have gotten those with Tommy Maddox ?
Or Batch ? Or anyone else ?

cloppbeast
01-08-2011, 04:16 PM
I agree. But maybe you can offer an opinion ? I mean do you really feel that Holmes performance was better then Ben's ? Or that other league QB's like Manning and Brady were given MVP awards for obvious less Impressive performances in past Super Bowl games. ? I mean he can have his opinion yes. But just back it up with some kind of facts is all.

Holmes had 131 yards receiving and a TD. On the final drive, Holmes caught 4 of Ben's 5 completions and racked up 73 yards, 40 of which he did all on his own with yards after the catch. On top of that, he made an amazing catch to win the game.

And by the way, if I don't want to back up my opinion with some kind of facts if I don't ******* want to, I don't need to hear a bunch of shit about it.

cloppbeast
01-08-2011, 04:17 PM
Uhm, no. And why am I being an A$$ ? Just because you can't make a valid point. Rather just attack Ben's play with ridiculous statements. ? I can admit when Ben does play bad. And he has in the past. But his being here is the main reason why we have 2 current SB titles. You think we would have gotten those with Tommy Maddox ?
Or Batch ? Or anyone else ?

When did I attack Ben's play? Did I ever say we could have gotten there with Tommy Maddox or Charlie Batch?

No.

This is why you're being an ass.

My point is that Santonio Holmes deserved the MVP over Ben. How the **** is that not a valid point? I'm not the only person who thought so....after all, the MVP was awarded to Holmes. lmfao

sarahpalinhater
01-08-2011, 04:21 PM
When did I attack Ben's play? Did I ever say we could have gotten there with Tommy Maddox or Charlie Batch?

No.

This is why you're being an ass.

My point is that Santonio Holmes deserved the MVP over Ben. How the **** is that not a valid point? I'm not the only person who thought so....after all, the MVP was awarded to Holmes. lmfao




Maybe I am wrong, sorry then. I was refering to the Moron who suggested that if Ben plays in the playoffs, like he did MOST of this season, then we are 1 and done. That guy was the Moron I was refering to :applaudit:

bobby jr
01-08-2011, 04:30 PM
Make your presense known now, before the Steelers play a playoff game. No one wants to hear your ass if we lose a game come on here afterwards telling us how you knew it all along.

So tell us now or forever hold your peace.


I'm not a "hater" but I am a doubter. Ben is a good QB, he is above average. but he is not in the class of Brady or P. Manning. The difference in ability between Brady and Ben is part of the reason why the Steelers are usually dominated when they meet the Patriots. He doesn't have Manning's ability to read a defense and quick release, and he doesn't have Brady's pinpoint accuracy in passing.

Also I have my doubts about whether Ben is any better in the clutch, in the big games, than other QB's. People cite the last Super Bowl but that AZ team had given up like 35 points a game in their last five regular season games. They were considered one of the worst Super Bowl teams of all time. And he needed a last minute TD to beat this team. The prior biggest game he had was against Seattle in his first Super Bowl, and it is fair to say say he had a bad game.

This is not a weak field in the playoffs this year. Unlike the road the Steelers had in 2008 which included 8-8 San Diego and 9-7 AZ. To win the Super Bowl,the Steelers will likely have to meet the Ravens, the Patriots, and the Falcons or the Saints. Or possibly the Colts. Even the last seed the Jets are good /

Looking at his past history and the level of competition this year in the AFC playoffs, I don't see Ben getting to the Super Bowl this year, or winning another ring. I've watched NFL football for many years and that's the way I see it.

Kanata-Steeler
01-08-2011, 04:51 PM
Thats really scary !!! :wave:

...not this again ... ???!!!
;)

figg
01-08-2011, 05:16 PM
That whole drive was Ben! His pump fakes and scramble's got Holmes open. Dont forget that Holmes dropped a td pass the play before he caught the game winner. BTW the game would would've been over had Hartings not held in the endzone.

Kanata-Steeler
01-08-2011, 05:39 PM
...had Harrison(aka Steelers Defense, and other mind-boggling Defensive plays,...) NOT opened up those offensive drives in the first place ???
it does take 2 to tango, but who is on top and who gets to enjoy are 2 very different perpectives. In the end, THEY both joined, without which, then NO Rings man.

Until this offense can actually "PLAY" like this Defense, more consistently, then I rest my case. 'cause I just believe in what I see.

zulater
01-08-2011, 11:50 PM
That whole drive was Ben! His pump fakes and scramble's got Holmes open. Dont forget that Holmes dropped a td pass the play before he caught the game winner. BTW the game would would've been over had Hartings not held in the endzone.

This! :thumbsup:

lionslicer
01-08-2011, 11:52 PM
That whole drive was Ben! His pump fakes and scramble's got Holmes open. Dont forget that Holmes dropped a td pass the play before he caught the game winner. BTW the game would would've been over had Hartings not held in the endzone.

Hartings wasn't even on the team then, don't blame a hold on a good center who retired lol.
It was Hartwig.

zulater
01-08-2011, 11:53 PM
I'm not a "hater" but I am a doubter. Ben is a good QB, he is above average. but he is not in the class of Brady or P. Manning. The difference in ability between Brady and Ben is part of the reason why the Steelers are usually dominated when they meet the Patriots. He doesn't have Manning's ability to read a defense and quick release, and he doesn't have Brady's pinpoint accuracy in passing.

Also I have my doubts about whether Ben is any better in the clutch, in the big games, than other QB's. People cite the last Super Bowl but that AZ team had given up like 35 points a game in their last five regular season games. They were considered one of the worst Super Bowl teams of all time. And he needed a last minute TD to beat this team. The prior biggest game he had was against Seattle in his first Super Bowl, and it is fair to say say he had a bad game.

This is not a weak field in the playoffs this year. Unlike the road the Steelers had in 2008 which included 8-8 San Diego and 9-7 AZ. To win the Super Bowl,the Steelers will likely have to meet the Ravens, the Patriots, and the Falcons or the Saints. Or possibly the Colts. Even the last seed the Jets are good /

Looking at his past history and the level of competition this year in the AFC playoffs, I don't see Ben getting to the Super Bowl this year, or winning another ring. I've watched NFL football for many years and that's the way I see it.



Bobby, if you want to talk weak playoff field to the SB title, think Ravens path in 2000. The Raiders team they beat after Fatso Siragusa took out the Raiders only player worth a damn on a cheap shot ( Gannon) was laughably weak, as was that pathetic Giant team they beat in the SB.

zulater
01-08-2011, 11:55 PM
FYI, in SB XLIII, Warner had better numbers than Ben. All these discussions about Ben show that his style is not to the liking of everyone. I don't cream my pants when he gets sacked day in and day out.
I think he's one of the best and I'm glad we have him but he's not particularly exciting to watch. He used to be in the early years of his career but not anymore. That's my opinion.

By the way, I believe Rodgers and Vick would perform better behind our current OL.

I think youy're wrong, particualry with Vick.

And if Ben isn;'t exciting enough for you to watch, well honestly do you not understand the game of football or just not like it?

:noidea:

steelers33
01-09-2011, 12:17 AM
Bobby Jr you are such an idiot that I have to reply to you idiotic arguement. If you knew ANYTHING about playoff football you would know records don't really matter and it's all about who gets hot. Just look at today a 7-9 team got hot and beat an 11-5 team. The Cardinals during the Steelers Super Bowl year got extremely hot and dangerous at the end of the season translating to the playoffs. They beat quality teams because they had great momentum. And the Chargers had enough momentum to win a playoff game before they came to Steel City. And look at the Steelers winning the Super Bowl as a 6 seed, they may not of had a great regular season record but they got hot at the right time and took it all the way. Playoff football is so about momentum that for someone who has been watching football for a while should know. Or you are a pathetic loser troll. Ben has proven time and time again proven he is an extremely clutch 2 minute quarterback. He proves it time and time again in the regular season and the post season. Like in the regular season when he had the game winning drive to beat the Packers last year and numerous other occasion. And in playoff football, when he led a 15-1 team to the AFC ship game as a rook and winning it all as a 2nd year, having oustanding games verse the Colts and the Broncos witha few plays in the Super bowl. And for someone to have a game winning drive with under 2:30 left to go is clutch. Arizona had momentum and were playing physical just like they've had all post season, but Ben put that all aside with the drive that would go down in Super Bowl history glory. And also Ben is great in is own right. While Peyton is a football genius, and Brady a rare accurate passer, nobody in the NFL can create plays at quarterback that Ben makes with his mobility and his ability to throw on the run. Bobby your arguments just get ripped in half time and time again, I would like to see your response to this you pathetic loser.

VegasStlrFan
01-09-2011, 12:40 AM
Ben has more athletic talent than Brady, Manning, or the other top QBs, unfortunately his work ethic, study habits, decision making and/or football smarts are not at their level. Ben is lucky he plays on a team that is competitive with or without him. When he's on he's lights out, unfortunately he has plenty of mediocre performances.

Here's a question; if all the playoff teams lost their starting QB, who would be the least affected? Hands down it's the Steelers.

zulater
01-09-2011, 06:27 AM
Ben has more athletic talent than Brady, Manning, or the other top QBs, unfortunately his work ethic, study habits, decision making and/or football smarts are not at their level. Ben is lucky he plays on a team that is competitive with or without him. When he's on he's lights out, unfortunately he has plenty of mediocre performances.

Here's a question; if all the playoff teams lost their starting QB, who would be the least affected? Hands down it's the Steelers.

Really? Because you say so?

Gee I remember like a 30 year drought between Super Bowl wins. Miracously that drought ended in 2004, I guess some find that coincidental with the arrival of Ben, but I doubt many among the Steelers do.

plenewken
01-09-2011, 07:08 AM
Really? Because you say so?

Gee I remember like a 30 year drought between Super Bowl wins. Miracously that drought ended in 2004, I guess some find that coincidental with the arrival of Ben, but I doubt many among the Steelers do.

Sorry but his question wasn't about Ben being the best Steelers QB since the 80s. His question was: "if all the playoff teams lost their starting QB, who would be the least affected?."
Can you answer this one?

plenewken
01-09-2011, 08:11 AM
I think youy're wrong, particualry with Vick.

And if Ben isn;'t exciting enough for you to watch, well honestly do you not understand the game of football or just not like it?

:noidea:

Nothing to do with not knowing or not liking football. I like football but I prefer hockey as a game, but that's a different issue.
Pretty much every football analyst considers Vick to be the most spectacular and exciting QB in the NFL today and I agree with that.
I didn't say Ben is not exciting enough for me to watch. I watch all Steelers games and some of them twice. Ben rarely triggers "wow!" from me. Same when Elway and Favre played. These 3 pretty much have the same style and it's not the style of QB I enjoy watching, but I watch.

steelcityboyz
01-09-2011, 08:52 AM
Ben needs to keep it up with the quick reads and throws, and he and the offense should be just fine.

zulater
01-09-2011, 09:04 AM
Sorry but his question wasn't about Ben being the best Steelers QB since the 80s. His question was: "if all the playoff teams lost their starting QB, who would be the least affected?."
Can you answer this one?

Jets, Sanchez was missing open receivers all night. They won despite him.

After that the Packers, they almost beat the Patriots in Gillete without Rogers.



And here's a question for you and him, name one remaining playof team you'd expect the Steelers to beat without Ben?

My answer. None, other than Seattle.

plenewken
01-09-2011, 09:25 AM
Jets, Sanchez was missing open receivers all night. They won despite him.

And here's a question for you and him, name one remaining playof team you'd expect the Steelers to beat without Ben?

My answer. None.

I agree that the Jets, being a run first offense, would be one of the least affected if Sanchez couldn't play. If it wasn't for a killing roughing the kicker penalty, the Jets would be playing golf today. Sanchez played pretty poorly for 58mn and kinda woke up at crunch time. Sounds familiar?

To answer your question, I'd say Atlanta, Baltimore, KC and Seattle could be beat without Ben.
I don't think we can beat the Pats , Eagles, Green Bay or Chicago without him.

zulater
01-09-2011, 09:34 AM
I agree that the Jets, being a run first offense, would be one of the least affected if Sanchez couldn't play. If it wasn't for a killing roughing the kicker penalty, the Jets would be playing golf today. Sanchez played pretty poorly for 58mn and kinda woke up at crunch time. Sounds familiar?

Well I would say the numbers bear out that Ben is significantly better than Sanchez, and Ben while better in crunch time, doesn't reserve all of his magic for late in games.


Have you forgot the 2005 AFC playoffs where Ben more or less took the bull by the horns right out of the gate. And for his career Ben has almost 50 games where he logged a qb rating of 100 or higher, you can't do that by just playing the last couple minutes well.

To answer your question, I'd say Atlanta, Baltimore, KC and Seattle could be beat without Ben.

I didn't say could, I said and underlined expect. Would you expect to beat any of those teams, well other than Seattle, without Ben?



I don't think we can beat the Pats , Eagles, Green Bay or Chicago without him.

So does that mean you think the Steelers possibly could beat those teams with Ben? If so, what are we arguing about? :noidea:

plenewken
01-09-2011, 10:16 AM
So does that mean you think the Steelers possibly could beat those teams with Ben? If so, what are we arguing about? :noidea:

Of course the Steelers could beat these teams with Ben, but Ben and the offense need to put points on the board, something they haven't done consistently this season. I'd say 21pts minimum. That's my #1 concern.

zulater
01-09-2011, 11:43 AM
Of course the Steelers could beat these teams with Ben, but Ben and the offense need to put points on the board, something they haven't done consistently this season. I'd say 21pts minimum. That's my #1 concern.



Granted, but I guess where we part paths is as to who we believe to be resonsible for our lack of offensive productivity in the form of points scored.

In my opinion the fault lies with the line, who when not missing critical blocks, are way too often caught taking drive killing penalties. Besides Pouncey, we don't have one other offensive lineman that could be considered above average. Jonathan Peterson might be the worst left tackle in a 32 team league. Same with the two headed right guard monster of Trai Foster/ Ramon Essex. Think about it, two offensive line starters that could be argued to be worst starters in the league, that's forty cent of your line that's crap right there. Now fill that out with the maddeningly inconsistent Chris Kemoeatu, and Flozell (flag in waiting) Adams.

Thankfully they've seemed to stabilize their play a bit later in the season. Plus Arians and Ben seem to be utilizing more quick hitting slants, now that he's finally getting in sync with his talented young receivers, which makes the lines job a bit easiar.

But bottom line, Ben hasn't had the benift of an above average offensive line since 2005. That's the last season Hartings and Marvel Smith both played at full strength. Anyway notice the Steelers only gave up 32 sacks for that season, so do you really think Ben's regressed in his reads and recogniction from when he was a second year player, or does it occur to you that maybe the problem lies in the fact that the Steelers just haven't done a good enough job assembling an offensive line since then?

VegasStlrFan
01-09-2011, 11:54 AM
The intent of the question was, if everyone lost their starter who would be the least affected or who would be the team to beat. IMO, winning for the Colts, Saints, Falcons, Packers, & Pats revolves around the QB, the Steelers, Jets, and Bears can win with average QB play.

zulater
01-09-2011, 11:56 AM
The intent of the question was, if everyone lost their starter who would be the least affected or who would be the team to beat. IMO, winning for the Colts, Saints, Falcons, Packers, & Pats revolves around the QB, the Steelers, Jets, and Bears can win with average QB play.

I disagree that the Steelers can win with average qb play in the playoffs.

VegasStlrFan
01-09-2011, 12:41 PM
I disagree that the Steelers can win with average qb play in the playoffs.

Debatable, I don't totally disagree really depends who they are playing. It's not the point I was trying to make, take the QB out of the picture and i believe we have the best team. That's why when Ben is on nobody can touch them, and when he is average they still win way more than they lose. When Brady and Manning play average they don't have a team around them that can pickup the slack.

figg
01-09-2011, 02:55 PM
Hartings wasn't even on the team then, don't blame a hold on a good center who retired lol.
It was Hartwig.

lol my bad. Point still stands though. Dont forget that drive started 1st and 20.

JackHammer
01-09-2011, 05:17 PM
IF YOU CAN REMEMBER THE WHOLE WHY BACK TO THE BEGINNING OF THIS YEAR ??? CAN YOU ????? 3-1 WITHOUT ROETHLISBERGER. I THINK TAMPA GAME WAS THE BEST THE OFFENSE LOOKED THIS YEAR. SO TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION BATCH AND DIXION CAN SURVIVE BEHIND OUR LINE. THAT IS SUCH A COP OUT THAT HE IS THE ONLY QB THAT COULD, YOUR THEORY WAS PROVED TO BE BUNK THIS YEAR.
:drink:


====

AND we still won. Ben really made the O look good in Buffalo and New Orleans he had like 15 passing yard the second half of the Cinncy game....he looked fabulous in the pats game too.....Gimme a break lady.

So is it about winning, or is it about our offense being better without Ben? Well if it's about winning..... We went 3-1 without him and 9-3 with him. 9-3 = 3:1 so the win pct is exactly the same when he's playing. On top of that Ben is getting his wins in the toughest times of the season, going 7-2 from November until the end of the season.

If it's about the offense being better without Ben, well, palinhater sh*tted all over that horrible argument. On top of all of that, in those first 4 games the run pass ratio was 60/40 in favor of run, as opposed to being 53/47 in favor of pass since Ben came back. We ran more than we passed in each of the first four games because we knew we couldn't put it on the arm of the QB. The loss to Baltimore was our ONLY loss of year when we ran the ball more than we passed in a game. That tells me that QB play was the difference in that loss and, sure enough, Batch threw for 141 and a pick.

For perspective: We're 8-1 when we run more than we pass. That one loss came with Batch playing. We're 2-3 when we pass more than we run. All five of those games were with Ben playing. We're 2-0 when the run pass is 50/50. Ben played in both of those games.

Ben is not the problem. The only real problem with our O is that we're a losing team when our OC tries to force the passing game instead of using a balanced attack. The only way you can blame that on Roethlisberger is for him being on the active roster b/c BA wouldn't, and hasn't tried to force the passing attack unless Ben was playing. That being said, sometimes you need to put it on the passing attack. A good example is vs. Baltimore. You can't beat them with just a rushing attack. Hell, you'd be fortunate to even have a rushing attack against them so you surely can't rely on it. You need the QB to step up vs. them. This year, Ben stepped up against them and won. Batch didn't, and lost.

cloppbeast
01-09-2011, 06:02 PM
So is it about winning, or is it about our offense being better without Ben? Well if it's about winning..... We went 3-1 without him and 9-3 with him. 9-3 = 3:1 so the win pct is exactly the same when he's playing. On top of that Ben is getting his wins in the toughest times of the season, going 7-2 from November until the end of the season.

If it's about the offense being better without Ben, well, palinhater sh*tted all over that horrible argument. On top of all of that, in those first 4 games the run pass ratio was 60/40 in favor of run, as opposed to being 53/47 in favor of pass since Ben came back. We ran more than we passed in each of the first four games because we knew we couldn't put it on the arm of the QB. The loss to Baltimore was our ONLY loss of year when we ran the ball more than we passed in a game. That tells me that QB play was the difference in that loss and, sure enough, Batch threw for 141 and a pick.

For perspective: We're 8-1 when we run more than we pass. That one loss came with Batch playing. We're 2-3 when we pass more than we run. All five of those games were with Ben playing. We're 2-0 when the run pass is 50/50. Ben played in both of those games.

Ben is not the problem. The only real problem with our O is that we're a losing team when our OC tries to force the passing game instead of using a balanced attack. The only way you can blame that on Roethlisberger is for him being on the active roster b/c BA wouldn't, and hasn't tried to force the passing attack unless Ben was playing. That being said, sometimes you need to put it on the passing attack. A good example is vs. Baltimore. You can't beat them with just a rushing attack. Hell, you'd be fortunate to even have a rushing attack against them so you surely can't rely on it. You need the QB to step up vs. them. This year, Ben stepped up against them and won. Batch didn't, and lost.

Ok, so he's better than Batch :coffee:. Nobody said that he wasn't.

figg
01-09-2011, 11:44 PM
Nothing to do with not knowing or not liking football. I like football but I prefer hockey as a game, but that's a different issue.
Pretty much every football analyst considers Vick to be the most spectacular and exciting QB in the NFL today and I agree with that.I didn't say Ben is not exciting enough for me to watch. I watch all Steelers games and some of them twice. Ben rarely triggers "wow!" from me. Same when Elway and Favre played. These 3 pretty much have the same style and it's not the style of QB I enjoy watching, but I watch.

Let me know the next time he wins a big game :toofunny:

zulater
01-10-2011, 05:58 AM
Qb's like Vick just don't get it done in the postseason.

pete74
01-10-2011, 06:04 AM
The intent of the question was, if everyone lost their starter who would be the least affected or who would be the team to beat. IMO, winning for the Colts, Saints, Falcons, Packers, & Pats revolves around the QB, the Steelers, Jets, and Bears can win with average QB play.

the steelers proved before Ben arrived that they can not win with an average QB. they won 4 super bowls with Bradshaw and 2 with Ben. thats it. they couldnt win a single super bowl all those years in between with an average QB even though they had a great defense some of the time. without a franchise QB your odds of winning the superbowl are extremly slim

plenewken
01-10-2011, 06:06 AM
Let me know the next time he wins a big game :toofunny:

I'm talking about spectacular and exciting to watch. If you like end of court tennis players who win in 5 sets in more than 4 hours, fine; I don't.

By the way, Akers blew it yesterday, not Vick.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 06:15 AM
Qb's like Vick just don't get it done in the postseason.

QBs like Manning and Brees didn't "get it done" either. What's your point?

theplatypus
01-10-2011, 06:30 AM
the steelers proved before Ben arrived that they can not win with an average QB. they won 4 super bowls with Bradshaw and 2 with Ben. thats it. they couldnt win a single super bowl all those years in between with an average QB even though they had a great defense some of the time. without a franchise QB your odds of winning the superbowl are extremly slim

This is true to an extent. When Cowher was running the team we typically spent our upper tier draft picks at core positions (o-line etc) and frequently lacked high profile players at the skill positions(qb,wr etc).

scsteeler
01-10-2011, 06:35 AM
I think this Upcoming play off Game is where Hines Ward Steps up really big. Along with Heath Miller, Hines will be a key factor on offense and well the Defense will be Awesome as always.

zulater
01-10-2011, 06:44 AM
QBs like Manning and Brees didn't "get it done" either. What's your point?

Well for one, they didn't throw an interception to end the game like Vick did.And for two, they already got theirs.

btw blaming the loss entirely on the kicker is weak. The game's dynamics change if makes either of those kicks and subsequently the Packers play with more urgency on offense, and look to put more points on the board if neccessary.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 06:58 AM
the steelers proved before Ben arrived that they can not win with an average QB. they won 4 super bowls with Bradshaw and 2 with Ben. thats it. they couldnt win a single super bowl all those years in between with an average QB even though they had a great defense some of the time. without a franchise QB your odds of winning the superbowl are extremly slim

The Steelers couldn't win with an average QB but Baltimore with Dilfer and Tampa Bay with Brad Johnson could. They were no better than O'Donnell, IMO.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 07:57 AM
Well for one, they didn't throw an interception to end the game like Vick did.And for two, they already got theirs.

btw blaming the loss entirely on the kicker is weak. The game's dynamics change if makes either of those kicks and subsequently the Packers play with more urgency on offense, and look to put more points on the board if neccessary.

I'm not putting the loss entirely on Akers but the fact is that he missed 6pts and In a close game, it can be the difference between W and L. We lost to the Ravens in Oct for the same exact reason. Akers certainly carries more responsibility for the loss than Vick.

Manning and Brees have 1 ring, same as Johnson and Dilfer. There's a world of difference between them so the QB can't be the only reason teams win or lose important games. If you remember, Tampa Bay had 3 defensive INTs returned for TD, that's how Johnson got his ring.

zulater
01-10-2011, 10:20 AM
I'm not putting the loss entirely on Akers but the fact is that he missed 6pts and In a close game, it can be the difference between W and L. We lost to the Ravens in Oct for the same exact reason. Akers certainly carries more responsibility for the loss than Vick.

Manning and Brees have 1 ring, same as Johnson and Dilfer. There's a world of difference between them so the QB can't be the only reason teams win or lose important games. If you remember, Tampa Bay had 3 defensive INTs returned for TD, that's how Johnson got his ring.

So you'd trade Ben for Vick straight up if it was in your power?

plenewken
01-10-2011, 12:03 PM
So you'd trade Ben for Vick straight up if it was in your power?

You like straw man rethoric?

stand undefeated
01-10-2011, 12:30 PM
It all comes down to this.

We know what our defense is going to do come Saturday. Do we know how well Ben will do? No, we don't.

Hate to say it, but he's most certainly the game breaker. If the offense can put together a couple long scoring (TD) drives and put up over 20 points on these bozo's... the Steelers will advance.

zulater
01-10-2011, 12:36 PM
You like straw man rethoric?

NO, it's a simple question, judging from your responces on this thread I'd wager it would be Vick, but maybe you don't have the courage of your conviction enough to say so openly?

zulater
01-10-2011, 12:39 PM
It all comes down to this.

We know what our defense is going to do come Saturday. Do we know how well Ben will do? No, we don't.

Hate to say it, but he's most certainly the game breaker. If the offense can put together a couple long scoring (TD) drives and put up over 20 points on these bozo's... the Steelers will advance.

I don't know what the defense will do? Every game is different, we have ot account for Heap this game, while still managing to keep track of their wide receivers.

I'd guess defensively we will keep the Ravens under 20, but you never know.:noidea:

zulater
01-10-2011, 12:45 PM
FYI, in SB XLIII, Warner had better numbers than Ben. All these discussions about Ben show that his style is not to the liking of everyone. I don't cream my pants when he gets sacked day in and day out.
I think he's one of the best and I'm glad we have him but he's not particularly exciting to watch. He used to be in the early years of his career but not anymore. That's my opinion.

By the way, I believe Rodgers and Vick would perform better behind our current OL.

I guess you already answered the question Plenewken. :coffee:

jizzballz
01-10-2011, 12:50 PM
I guess you already answered the question Plenewken. :coffee:

dude that is his opinion, eagles wr's didn't help the vick last night with all the drop balls, and aaron rodgers is like sex on pitch when he throws the ball, but i really like the play of tramon williams.

stand undefeated
01-10-2011, 12:54 PM
I don't know what the defense will do? Every game is different, we have ot account for Heap this game, while still managing to keep track of their wide receivers.

I'd guess defensively we will keep the Ravens under 20, but you never know.:noidea:


I know what you're saying but if it came down to this as far as the Steelers losing:

A: Offense not producing
B: Defense not playing their game
C: Special teams allowing a game changing score

You're going to choose A or C 99% of the time.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 12:55 PM
NO, it's a simple question, judging from your responces on this thread I'd wager it would be Vick, but maybe you don't have the courage of your conviction enough to say so openly?

Enjoying Vick's style doesn't mean I'd throw out the baby with the bath water. If you read my posts, you'll see that I'm not ecstatic about Ben but I recognize that he's an excellent and proven QB, the best we've had since Bradshaw by far and one of the top 5 in the League. If we win another SB this year, he could end up #2.
Ben's not the main reason for our offensive woes, not at all. The OL and OC are far higher on my Pareto chart.
Take it easy.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 01:02 PM
I guess you already answered the question Plenewken. :coffee:

I said Vick and Rodgers would do better behind our current offensive line because they read defenses faster and they're more mobile, but our OL problems can be solved and when they are, Ben and the whole offense will be much more effective, provided that Arians doesn't f*ck up.

Danny136200
01-10-2011, 02:17 PM
====

AND we still won. Ben really made the O look good in Buffalo and New Orleans he had like 15 passing yard the second half of the Cinncy game....he looked fabulous in the pats game too.....Gimme a break lady.

Your kidding right? Are you seriously saying that Ben is an average qb?
Look at the weapons around him.
Hines ward? As much as I love this guy, he is shot, he can't get any separation.
Mike Wallace? Probably his only real weapon, really good getting deep, and getting begets with his route running.
Heath miller? Another big time target, but he has fallen off this year, I believe he only has one td
Emmanuel sanders? I love this guy, he is going to be good. But don't kid yourselves, he is a rookie. He has and will make mental mistakes from time to time.
The offensive line? Ben has been playing 2- Mississippi football all season long.
But I do like what I have seen from this group the past couple of games.
The running game of course has been inconsistent all year long.
One week we run all over the jets. The next we mendenhall and company can barely run on the panthers and the browns.
There are also other things that make this offense sputter, like dumb penalties, drops, etc.
Now with all that being said, ben does have his faults. Sometimes he and opine cannot properly read blitzes, he does not hit the hot receiver and can hold on to the ball waaaaaaaaaaay too long ( this one always aggrevates me) and sometimes he tries to force the balk into tight coverages leading to dumb picks.
But he still is a one of the best qbs in the NFL, he makes alot of plays that no other qb can, he is very accurate, and most of all, he is arguably the best qb in the clutch today.
To say that Ben is and average qb is a pretty ridiculous statement from you. As you can see there are many other problems with our offense right now.

zulater
01-10-2011, 02:20 PM
I said Vick and Rodgers would do better behind our current offensive line because they read defenses faster and they're more mobile, but our OL problems can be solved and when they are, Ben and the whole offense will be much more effective, provided that Arians doesn't f*ck up.

Vick read's defenses faster than BEN and Rodgers is more mobil?

Wow. Learn something new everyday I guess. :doh:

zulater
01-10-2011, 02:23 PM
Mike Vick peaked against the Redskins, after that he was more or less an ordinary quarterback. The league got the book on vick, he's back to being a middle of the pack guy who wont ever beat elite teams when it matters.

plenewken
01-10-2011, 03:29 PM
Mike Vick peaked against the Redskins, after that he was more or less an ordinary quarterback. The league got the book on vick, he's back to being a middle of the pack guy who wont ever beat elite teams when it matters.

C'mon!

Vick played extremely well against the Giants too with 3 TDs, 130yds rushing and 1rushing TD. This was week 14.

He finished the season with a QB rating >100. He also had close to 800yds rushing and 9 rushing TDs, putting him #35 of all rushers in the NFL.

Let me know when you've compared his numbers to Ben's and I mean all of them. TDs, Passing Yds, Rushing Yds, Sacks, INTs, Fumbles, etc ............

Oh and didn't know #4 at the end of the season was middle of the pack ....... By the way, Ben was #5.

zulater
01-10-2011, 04:03 PM
C'mon!

Vick played extremely well against the Giants too with 3 TDs, 130yds rushing and 1rushing TD. This was week 14.

He finished the season with a QB rating >100. He also had close to 800yds rushing and 9 rushing TDs, putting him #35 of all rushers in the NFL.

Let me know when you've compared his numbers to Ben's and I mean all of them. TDs, Passing Yds, Rushing Yds, Sacks, INTs, Fumbles, etc ............

Oh and didn't know #4 at the end of the season was middle of the pack ....... By the way, Ben was #5.

Vick hadn't played in a couple seasons, and never in Andy Reid's offense, teams didn't havbe the book on him. His passer rating the last 6 weeks of the regular season was a modest 89.5, after teams figured him out.

And you knock Ben for racking up stats against bad teams, well tell me who exactly did Vick beat that was worth a damn?

He lost to the Vikings for Christ's sake, you knock Ben for beating bad teams, well your hero got skunked by the lousy Vikings with a first round bye at stake.

I doubt there's a G.M. in the N.F.L. who would take Vick over Ben.

davidtrout
01-10-2011, 04:13 PM
I doubt there's a G.M. in the N.F.L. who would take Vick over Ben.

His own team is still trying to decide if they want to take him over Kevin Kolb or not.

You're right, teams had to figure out how to handle Vick again because it had been so long since he had played. That's not to say he didn't have a great season. He did, but once the Giants reminded everyone how to contain him, which they did for 7 out of 8 qtrs this year, his numbers took a serious plummet.

btaylor179
01-10-2011, 04:22 PM
yea sara palin hater this is the moron again and yes i lov ben being our qb and no he did notta to win the ring against the seahawks.......nothing! he is a good qb im glad steelers got him im just not that excited about him.hope i don't get banned but thats my opinion.

VegasStlrFan
01-11-2011, 12:35 AM
the steelers proved before Ben arrived that they can not win with an average QB. they won 4 super bowls with Bradshaw and 2 with Ben. thats it. they couldnt win a single super bowl all those years in between with an average QB even though they had a great defense some of the time. without a franchise QB your odds of winning the superbowl are extremly slim

Not true, Ben has been blessed with the best string of defenses in Pittsburgh since the 70's (its actually been better stats wise). In the 23 years preceeding Ben, they were in the top 5 overall 8 times and #1 overall twice. In Ben's 7 years they have been top 5 6 times and #1 overall 3 times. Only 1 year (06) the Steelers were not in the top 5.

w/ Ben
Defensive Stats Regular Season yds/game
'04 = #1 Rush, #4 Pass, #1 Total
'05 = #3 Rush, #4 Total
'06 = #3 Rush,
'07 = #3 Rush, #3 Pass, #1 Total
'08 = #1 Rush, #2 Pass, #1 Total
'09 = #3 Rush, #5 Total
'10= #1 Rush, #2 Total

w/o
'82= #1 Rush
'83 = #5 Pass, #3 Total
'84 = #4 Rush, #5 Total
'85 = #2 Pass
'87 = #4 Rush
'90 = #1 Pass, #1 Total
'93 = #3 Rush, #3 Total
'94 = #3 Pass, #2 Total
'95 = #2 Rush, #3 Total
'96 = #3 Rush, #5 Pass, #2 Total
'97 = #1 Rush
'99 = #4 Pass
'01 = #1 Rush, #4 Rush, #1 Total
'02 = #1 Rush

plenewken
01-11-2011, 07:49 AM
And you knock Ben for racking up stats against bad teams, well tell me who exactly did Vick beat that was worth a damn?



This kind of argument can fire back at you, you know.

Tell me who exactly Ben and the Steelers beat that was "worth a damn", besides Baltimore? They lost to all the other strong teams they played.

I never knocked Ben for racking up stats against bad teams because besides Cleveland and Oakland, Ben and the offense haven't racked up much to begin with. The Steelers don't have a high scoring offense, everyone knows it.

I said I find Vick more exciting to watch than Ben and you rip me for it. He's not my hero by the way, I don't have nor need heros. I also said that Vick's mobility (and Rodgers') would perform better behind a weak OL like ours and you rip me for it. Guess what?

This year, Ben ranks #13 in number of rushes (33), #9 in number of rushing yds (176) and #8 in number of rushing TDs (2). Vick is #1 in all 3 categories and Rodgers is #4, #3 and #4 respectively. Vick has 35 sacks, Ben 32, and Rodgers 31 but as you know, Ben has played 12 games vs. 16 for the 2 others

If you enjoy to watch Ben getting slaughtered in the pocket just say it. That's fine with me. Me, I prefer to watch more mobile QBs eluding tackles. That's my right, no?

As far as replacing Ben by Vick or Rodgers, I don't know where this comes from. That's what I call straw man rethoric.

Let's agree to disagree on the whole subject and move on.

TRH
01-11-2011, 07:52 AM
Mike Vick peaked against the Redskins, after that he was more or less an ordinary quarterback. The league got the book on vick, he's back to being a middle of the pack guy who wont ever beat elite teams when it matters.

exactly. well said.
NO WAY in the world i'd want Vick around here. No way.

zulater
01-11-2011, 10:15 AM
This kind of argument can fire back at you, you know.

Tell me who exactly Ben and the Steelers beat that was "worth a damn", besides Baltimore? They lost to all the other strong teams they played.

I never knocked Ben for racking up stats against bad teams because besides Cleveland and Oakland, Ben and the offense haven't racked up much to begin with. The Steelers don't have a high scoring offense, everyone knows it.

I said I find Vick more exciting to watch than Ben and you rip me for it. He's not my hero by the way, I don't have nor need heros. I also said that Vick's mobility (and Rodgers') would perform better behind a weak OL like ours and you rip me for it. Guess what?

This year, Ben ranks #13 in number of rushes (33), #9 in number of rushing yds (176) and #8 in number of rushing TDs (2). Vick is #1 in all 3 categories and Rodgers is #4, #3 and #4 respectively. Vick has 35 sacks, Ben 32, and Rodgers 31 but as you know, Ben has played 12 games vs. 16 for the 2 others

If you enjoy to watch Ben getting slaughtered in the pocket just say it. That's fine with me. Me, I prefer to watch more mobile QBs eluding tackles. That's my right, no?

As far as replacing Ben by Vick or Rodgers, I don't know where this comes from. That's what I call straw man rethoric.

Let's agree to disagree on the whole subject and move on.

So you tell me is there a worse NFL starter than Jonathan Scott or Ramons Foster? That's 2/5 aka 40% of your offensive line that's arguably the worst at their position in the league. Is Kemoeatu any better than middle of the pack? Flozell Adams, think at this point he starts on more than 8 or 10 teams? So you know that Rodgers would be sacked with the same frequency behind our line as his? Vick? Guy looked pretty confused to me as often as not the last 6 or 7 weeks of the season. Save a let down late by the Giants he was pretty damn ordinary for the majority of the last half of the season.



Yeah right. :doh:

welder4pit
01-11-2011, 10:49 AM
Make your presense known now, before the Steelers play a playoff game. No one wants to hear your ass if we lose a game come on here afterwards telling us how you knew it all along.

So tell us now or forever hold your peace. IF he gets through this game with a win i will never say anything bad about his playing ability again. IF he wins with this offensive line in the playoffs it will be impressive. And i might add its very impressive how he has handled himself after the turmoil this spring. He has showed ALOT of character.

:drink:

davidtrout
01-11-2011, 01:24 PM
Originally Posted by plenewken
This year, Ben ranks #13 in number of rushes (33), #9 in number of rushing yds (176) and #8 in number of rushing TDs (2). Vick is #1 in all 3 categories and Rodgers is #4, #3 and #4 respectively. Vick has 35 sacks, Ben 32, and Rodgers 31 but as you know, Ben has played 12 games vs. 16 for the 2 others

Vick also missed four games, 3 due to injury 1 he sat in the meaningless game against Dal. He also only had 7 attempts in the first Wash game before getting hurt, so essentially only played 11 games. Rodgers missed the game in NE, so he played in 15 games. Not sure what any of that proves but at least it's accurate.

BigBen5543
01-11-2011, 01:50 PM
I said Vick and Rodgers would do better behind our current offensive line because they read defenses faster and they're more mobile, but our OL problems can be solved and when they are, Ben and the whole offense will be much more effective, provided that Arians doesn't f*ck up.

Vick has no clue how to read a defense. The week prior to the final regular season game andy reid had vick simply watch video all week of the 3-4 defense to try to prepare him. The fact that vick takes off and runs all the time does not mean he is reading the defense.

Vick didn't do a thing against a good defense. Those numbers against the giants are overblown because the gmen had a big lead and played prevent.

Vick does provide excitement, but he will never be the qb that can get a team over the top.

Edman
01-11-2011, 02:09 PM
I doubt Ben can get it done in this game. There. I said it. He's the big difference between a win and a loss.

Back in the game the Steelers won at Baltimore, Ben didn't exactly light the Ravens up. The Offense was struggling all game until Troy and the D did the strip sack setting up the Steelers O with great field position.

It wasn't like in 2008 where Ben drove the Steelers 92 yards for the win.

I'm saying this because the Steelers seemingly do better when I doubt them, so I'm doubting them in this game.

zulater
01-15-2011, 08:35 PM
I doubt Ben can get it done in this game. There. I said it. He's the big difference between a win and a loss.

Back in the game the Steelers won at Baltimore, Ben didn't exactly light the Ravens up. The Offense was struggling all game until Troy and the D did the strip sack setting up the Steelers O with great field position.

It wasn't like in 2008 where Ben drove the Steelers 92 yards for the win.

I'm saying this because the Steelers seemingly do better when I doubt them, so I'm doubting them in this game.


:chuckle:

SuperSteelers
01-15-2011, 10:08 PM
I doubt Ben can get it done in this game. There. I said it. He's the big difference between a win and a loss.

Back in the game the Steelers won at Baltimore, Ben didn't exactly light the Ravens up. The Offense was struggling all game until Troy and the D did the strip sack setting up the Steelers O with great field position.

It wasn't like in 2008 where Ben drove the Steelers 92 yards for the win.

I'm saying this because the Steelers seemingly do better when I doubt them, so I'm doubting them in this game.

Nice man...

So many fans, so little faith.

:tt02:

zulater
02-09-2011, 12:27 PM
Make your presense known now, before the Steelers play a playoff game. No one wants to hear your ass if we lose a game come on here afterwards telling us how you knew it all along.

So tell us now or forever hold your peace.

I see the idiots have come out of the woodwork now that we've lost the Super bowl. So tell me, where were you when this thread was posted?

Very weak, very weak indeed.


:coffee:

Velvet Elvis
02-09-2011, 01:27 PM
Sure no problem. If he plays a game like he did against Cleveland we should coast to the 7th Super Bowl victory. I think he has been super inconsistent this year. He is the leader of this offense that has looked so bad this year , redzone especially. People give him all the credit when we win so it only fair that as bad as this offense has looked should reflect on him. He struggled against Baltimore,Buffalo,Cinncy, New Orleans,Jets, New England he looked terrible until garbage time and Miami he almost fumbled the game away,he did really we got a gift from the refs. So yeah if Ben plays like he did in those games we will probably lose. The defense has done its job all year, its a joke in the games like Buffalo that we can blow that team off the field. To me poor Qb play is the reason. He has games that he either make passes to the WR's shoe laces or over there heads 4 feet. He looked great against the browns,right the lowly browns. Can he be that good against a playoff caliber team next week ? I have my doubts.:tt02::tt02:

Well this guy was right on the money Zulater, Ive looked through this entire thread and he was right Ben's poor play in the playoffs costs the Steelers the Super Bowl. He had key turnovers in all 3 playoff games. He passes were off target all year and the playoffs I think he was even worse. He looked nothing like "clutch" on the final drive in the SB "lost" is more like it. The D carried the team in every game all year. If the Steelers D didnt play the way it did this year the Steelers would have been 6-10 at best. The offense stunk. Ben needs to be more accurate and learn to read a defense better, he has regressed for the 2nd year in a row. Its going to be along time before he ever plays in another SB again.

Sixburgher
02-09-2011, 01:34 PM
Way to "out" yourself.

Curtain_of_Steel
02-09-2011, 01:41 PM
Ben sucks, LOL

Wow, imagine what some of you guys do to your kids when they stick it up on the field and turf, lol As you would think you have more invested in them than Ben, lol.


I'll still take Ben over any other QB in the league. I hope to enjoy him in a Steeler uniform for another 10 years. hopefully he can take the hits that come with it, lol.

TEAM lost the game, Coaches didn't prepare for the pass attack.

Through all the crap in that game, we still had a shot at winning. That is what this team is about. That is just how much better we are than the Packers.

tube517
02-09-2011, 03:49 PM
So, you're saying Dennis Dixon is the future?? :doh:



Well this guy was right on the money Zulater, Ive looked through this entire thread and he was right Ben's poor play in the playoffs costs the Steelers the Super Bowl. He had key turnovers in all 3 playoff games. He passes were off target all year and the playoffs I think he was even worse. He looked nothing like "clutch" on the final drive in the SB "lost" is more like it. The D carried the team in every game all year. If the Steelers D didnt play the way it did this year the Steelers would have been 6-10 at best. The offense stunk. Ben needs to be more accurate and learn to read a defense better, he has regressed for the 2nd year in a row. Its going to be along time before he ever plays in another SB again.

Ricco Suavez
02-09-2011, 04:14 PM
]

Same guy who says good QB's carry a team and Ben gets carried by the Defense. Yet when I pointed out "media Darling" Rivers had a pretty good defense and he still could not carry his team to the playoffs much less a SuperBowl

Riddle_Of_Steel
02-09-2011, 04:30 PM
Some of y'all are gonna wear out the panic button, for crying out loud. Ben is fine, Ward is fine.

Looking back, we had a tough year, the whole fines/penalties/illegal hits fiasco, Ben's suspension (and then getting his nose and foot busted), injuries on the Oline, 75% of our WR corps shows GREAT TALENT, but are rookies or only second year guys still.

I still say Tomlin should be up for Coach of the Year Honors, not Darth Hoodie. Steelers will be back in 2011....errr, 2012.

MaineSteelerFan
02-09-2011, 04:51 PM
What I would like to know for those of you out there that are haters is who would you replace him with? I mean what qb in the NFL could survive behind that o-line, I mean would you take a traditional pocket passing QB like Manning or Brady? If you would, do you really think those guys would survive behind that line?

I mean, yes we lost the SB, but at least we got there lol.

saveus1011
02-09-2011, 04:53 PM
I'm not saying I knew it all along. In fact I vocally defended Ben to EVERYONE because truth is I loved the guy.

That pretty much died Sunday. :(

I know I'm still harping on it, but it just hurts.

zulater
02-09-2011, 06:09 PM
Well this guy was right on the money Zulater, Ive looked through this entire thread and he was right Ben's poor play in the playoffs costs the Steelers the Super Bowl. He had key turnovers in all 3 playoff games. He passes were off target all year and the playoffs I think he was even worse. He looked nothing like "clutch" on the final drive in the SB "lost" is more like it. The D carried the team in every game all year. If the Steelers D didnt play the way it did this year the Steelers would have been 6-10 at best. The offense stunk. Ben needs to be more accurate and learn to read a defense better, he has regressed for the 2nd year in a row. Its going to be along time before he ever plays in another SB again.

:rofl:


One thing I do know, if you had any say in the Steelers day to day operation, the Steelers would never have a winning season again. Period.

zulater
02-09-2011, 06:12 PM
I'm not saying I knew it all along. In fact I vocally defended Ben to EVERYONE because truth is I loved the guy.

That pretty much died Sunday. :(

I know I'm still harping on it, but it just hurts.

What are you twelve?

Are you through with Troy too? He was directly responsible for as many negative plays as Ben, and unlike Ben who threw two touchdown passes, Troy did very little to help the Steelers cause this past Sunday.

btw I still love Troy, just making a point.

vasteeler
02-09-2011, 06:26 PM
I'm not saying I knew it all along. In fact I vocally defended Ben to EVERYONE because truth is I loved the guy.

That pretty much died Sunday. :(

I know I'm still harping on it, but it just hurts.

really?!?!?!?.......i pity you :doh:

harrison'samonster
02-09-2011, 06:42 PM
GB just came out and beat us team to team. It wasn't any one players fault. Ben will be with the Steelers for a long time, unless he has any more off-field issues.

I've got to admit, I can't stand it when he holds on to the ball for to long, but I usually end up feeling stupid when he makes a big play.

Velvet Elvis
02-09-2011, 08:00 PM
:rofl:


One thing I do know, if you had any say in the Steelers day to day operation, the Steelers would never have a winning season again. Period.

Maybe you should get a job with the Steelers FO , with all your great advice I'm sure the Steelers would never lose another game ! You seem to be right about everything with your condescending tone you spew out in almost every one of your posts where you try and belittle everyone that you dont agree with.

Troy came through all year and has played hurt all playoffs, not the drama queen shit Ben whines about. I wish Troy had a broken nose any day over a Achilles injury. Defend Ben all you want fact is he was outplayed by Sanchez and Rodgers and the Defense shouldnt have to cover for his mistakes in every game. He was 90 % of the reason the Steelers lost the Super Bowl.

SteelCityMom
02-09-2011, 08:06 PM
Maybe you should get a job with the Steelers FO , with all your great advice I'm sure the Steelers would never lose another game ! You seem to be right about everything with your condescending tone you spew out in almost every one of your posts where you try and belittle everyone that you dont agree with.

Troy came through all year and has played hurt all playoffs, not the drama queen shit Ben whines about. I wish Troy had a broken nose any day over a Achilles injury. Defend Ben all you want fact is he was outplayed by Sanchez and Rodgers and the Defense shouldnt have to cover for his mistakes in every game. He was 90 % of the reason the Steelers lost the Super Bowl.

When did Ben whine about his injuries? The media reported on them, but they reported on Troy's as well.

Both players shouldered a ton (if not all) the blame in their post game interviews...and neither one brought up injuries as the reason why. :noidea:

zulater
02-09-2011, 08:26 PM
Maybe you should get a job with the Steelers FO , with all your great advice I'm sure the Steelers would never lose another game ! You seem to be right about everything with your condescending tone you spew out in almost every one of your posts where you try and belittle everyone that you dont agree with.

Troy came through all year and has played hurt all playoffs, not the drama queen shit Ben whines about. I wish Troy had a broken nose any day over a Achilles injury. Defend Ben all you want fact is he was outplayed by Sanchez and Rodgers and the Defense shouldnt have to cover for his mistakes in every game. He was 90 % of the reason the Steelers lost the Super Bowl.

I'm only condescending with no nothing assholes such as yourself,.

Seriously, you're so biased in your views, spewing nothing but hate and ignorance, you're really not entitled to a reasonable argument or debate.

:coffee:

SH-Rock
02-09-2011, 08:26 PM
Maybe you should get a job with the Steelers FO , with all your great advice I'm sure the Steelers would never lose another game ! You seem to be right about everything with your condescending tone you spew out in almost every one of your posts where you try and belittle everyone that you dont agree with.

Troy came through all year and has played hurt all playoffs, not the drama queen shit Ben whines about. I wish Troy had a broken nose any day over a Achilles injury. Defend Ben all you want fact is he was outplayed by Sanchez and Rodgers and the Defense shouldnt have to cover for his mistakes in every game. He was 90 % of the reason the Steelers lost the Super Bowl.

When did Ben whine?

Velvet Elvis
02-09-2011, 08:50 PM
I'm only condescending with no nothing assholes such as yourself,.

Seriously, you're so biased in your views, spewing nothing but hate and ignorance, you're really not entitled to a reasonable argument or debate.

:coffee:

You should look in the mirror, does name calling on the internet make you feel like a tough guy ? You seem to have alot of pent up aggression ? Maybe try getting laid ? I know it will cost you a few bucks but it will be worth it.

zulater
02-09-2011, 09:00 PM
You should look in the mirror, does name calling on the internet make you feel like a tough guy ? You seem to have alot of pent up aggression ? Maybe try getting laid ? I know it will cost you a few bucks but it will be worth it.

No I don't feel tough, and I get laid plenty by my wife of 20 years, who's still smoking hot, thanks all the same.

Look you're so far beyond reason that no one can take you seriously. You want to say you'll never forgive Ben for his personal transgressions, fine, that's your right. You want to say you think he's overrated, fine, there's an argument to be made there. But you're just so far over the top, that's it's readily obvious that you're either a troll, or a person who 's opinion of Ben's play is so jaded by your personal dislike of him that it's not even worth bothering trying to discuss it with you.

You're virtually an island unto yourself here guy. ( or gal) So either we're all idiots, or you are.

By virtue of the Steelers going to 3 Super Bowls in Ben's 7 year career, I think the answer is you're the dope.:doh:

:hatsoff:

Velvet Elvis
02-09-2011, 09:06 PM
No I don't feel tough, and I get laid plenty by my wife of 20 years, who's still smoking hot, thanks all the same.

Look you're so far beyond reason that no one can take you seriously. You want to say you'll never forgive Ben for his personal transgressions, fine, that's your right. You want to say you think he's overrated, fine, there's an argument to be made there. But you're just so far over the top, that's it's readily obvious that you're either a troll, or a person who 's opinion of Ben's play is so jaded by your personal dislike of him that it's not even worth bothering trying to discuss it with you.

You're virtually an island unto yourself here guy. ( or gal) So either we're all idiots, or you are.

By virtue of the Steelers going to 3 Super Bowls in Ben's 7 year career, I think the answer is you're the dope.:doh:

:hatsoff:

What did I say that was "so over the top " , you moron ? What makes you think I have a personal dislike of Ben ? I think he hasnt lived up to his potential or contract this year or last. I could give a shit how "hot " you think your wife is either. So **** off .

tony hipchest
02-09-2011, 09:14 PM
well this thread has certainly served its purpose and basically worn out its welcome especially when the last page is nothing but talk of morons, getting laid, peoples wives, and varying other personal attacks.

im more than happy to lock it down. :smile: