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View Full Version : Roethlisberger works to rebuild trust


SH-Rock
01-20-2011, 03:47 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/playoffs/2010/columns/story?page=hotread19/BenRoethlisberger

PITTSBURGH -- The barkeeps along Carson Street say they haven't seen Ben Roethlisberger around in a while. They'd know if he were here. Pittsburgh, at its core, is one big little city. And people talk.

Steel mills used to drive the South Side, but sweat and grit have been replaced by Abercrombie & Fitch. It's a trendy area now, loaded with yuppies, college kids and watering holes. This used to be Roethlisberger's stomping grounds -- well, one of them -- and stories flow like Iron City beer from a tap.

There was a time, back in the boozy, pre-scandal days, when Roethlisberger could triple a bar's foot traffic within an hour. He'd show up at Jack's Rose Bar, a couple of patrons would grab their cell phones and text BIG BEN'S HERE, and the party would begin.

"He frequented our place a lot," said Chris Dawso, who owns Jack's. "We used to call him the Pied Piper.

"But he hasn't been around at all this year."

Roethlisberger, his supporters say, has grown up. He had to. The face of the Pittsburgh Steelers franchise stood in front of an angry and disappointed city this past spring, at the precipice of losing everything. In April, prosecutors had decided not to charge him with sexually assaulting a woman in Georgia, but he was facing a six-game suspension by the NFL. (It was later reduced to four.) He had two Super Bowl rings, and a locker room many suspected he had lost. Team president Art Rooney II said Roethlisberger had to work hard to earn back trust.

On the field, it's clear the 28-year-old quarterback has done that. He has hobbled around on an injured foot, toughed out a broken nose and led the Steelers to the AFC Championship Game, which will be played Sunday night at Heinz Field against the New York Jets.

Off the field, Roethlisberger has spent the past nine months lying low. He's rumored to be engaged, a claim his camp will not confirm, and no longer travels with bodyguards or entourages. He eschews the bar scene, which has been the root of just about every one of his problems.

Has he changed? On the north side of Pittsburgh, the jury's still out. Mark Baranowski is watching Roethlisberger's progress with skepticism and hope. Baranowski is known as sort of the Norma Rae of bar owners in Pittsburgh, the man who stood up to Roethlisberger a few years back when the quarterback, according to Baranowski, showed up at his Cabana Bar and acted immature and entitled, and refused to pay a $5 cover charge.

It wasn't about five bucks, Baranowski says. It was about being a Pittsburgher.

"The town was really fed up with him," Baranowski said. "They were really down on him, and there were a lot of people who just didn't want him to be our quarterback.

"But it seems like he's trying to turn it around. I haven't heard one bad story. I hope he keeps it up. He's got everything going for him. He's big and strong and tough, and people just idolize him. I mean, he could own this city."

'He's worked at it'
Eventually, they'll forget. If No. 7 leads the Steelers to their seventh Super Bowl title, the anger will subside and Roethlisberger's misdeeds will ultimately be a distant memory.

"The thing about life is that if you're a winner, people will forgive a little bit easier," said Jim Coen, the owner of Yinzers, a popular novelty store in the Strip District. "As long as you're heading in the right direction and not doing anything stupid, the city will forgive."

It was Martin Luther King Jr. Day, and the Strip was bustling with lunchtime shoppers buying black-and-gold gear. Nine months ago, when the Big Ben news hit the fan, Yinzers marked down Roethlisberger jerseys to $10. But now they're back at full price and selling at a steady clip.

Sixty-four thousand fans screamed for him Saturday night, after the Steelers' 31-24 win against Baltimore, and he lingered on the field to take it all in. Trust, in late-game situations, was never an issue with Roethlisberger. He plays on the edge, without fear, and is one of the most clutch quarterbacks in the league. Saturday night was no exception. The Steelers were down by two touchdowns to start the third quarter. Roethlisberger couldn't be rattled.

On third-and-19, late in the game, he uncorked a 58-yard pass to rookie receiver Antonio Brown. It set up the winning touchdown and put the Steelers in their fourth conference championship game in Roethlisberger's seven years with the franchise.

"I'm very pleased," team owner Dan Rooney said as he made the rounds in the locker room late Saturday. "He's worked at it. He's doing what he has to do on the field and off."

Roethlisberger won't say it -- he has declined interview requests for stories that focus on him -- but it's clear that the whispers of his demise in Pittsburgh motivated him. He came to training camp slimmer and in possibly the best shape he's been in his career. He seemed to approach every game as a proving ground.

Roethlisberger was required to go through offseason counseling for what commissioner Roger Goodell called a "pattern of behavior" that damaged the integrity of the game. A year before the allegations of sexual assault in Milledgeville, Ga., a woman in Lake Tahoe filed a lawsuit claiming Roethlisberger sexually assaulted her at a hotel-casino in 2008.

People close to Roethlisberger call the Georgia incident an intense reality check. He knew, then, that he had to make changes. So he surrounded himself with a group of advisers, a team that included Art Rooney, Bill Cowher and former Pittsburgh running back Merril Hoge, now an NFL analyst for ESPN.

"He's human," said Roethlisberger's agent, Ryan Tollner. "He reached the point where he said to me, 'I'm OK if I never play another down of football so long as people perceive me to be a good person.'"

Maybe, Coen says, Roethlisberger underestimated Pittsburgh. It's true that the city measures success with playoff victories and Super Bowls. But it's about more than that.

People rarely leave here. Men hold doors open for women and check on their neighbors. People, Coen says, are nice to each other. They love their Steelers, worship them, and are heartsick if their quarterback isn't someone they can like. It should be noted that the most popular Steeler is Troy Polamalu, a game-changing safety who frequents a local children's hospital each week and gives his phone number to sick kids.

"The fans of Pittsburgh, they feel like the team is part of their family," Coen said. "When you walk down the street, someone looks you in the eye and says hello to you. That's the way this city is."

'He kind of had an arrogance to him'
The first time Willie Colon met Roethlisberger, they didn't really hit it off. Colon was a rookie offensive lineman in 2006, drafted to move mountains. Roethlisberger was a 24-year-old with a Super Bowl trophy, a truckload of endorsements and a bit of an attitude.

"He kind of had an arrogance to him," Colon said. "I'm a Bronx New York kid. We don't get star-struck. I wasn't impressed. I wasn't sold on the whole Big Ben thing."

But when Colon spent some time with him, he realized how much they were alike. How they were both from small colleges, both intensely competitive (they competed over who had the longest toenails) and both tied closely to their families. How their personalities were so alike that they had become good friends.

Colon was there that night in Milledgeville. He says the incident changed Roethlisberger's life.

"It's weird and maybe awkward to say this," Colon said, "but everything that happened was a blessing in disguise. He saw the kind of person he was, and he was able to change his ways.

"I think, flat out, he's a better person now."

Roethlisberger is an intensely private person, and he has been known to irk fans by refusing to sign autographs in restaurants and bars. According to several bar owners around Pittsburgh, he has, on occasion, walked into an establishment, flanked by bodyguards, and retreated to a private room without conversing with patrons.

Some of his teammates saw a similar detachment. At times, he came across as aloof or uninterested in them.

"I'd be a liar if I said he was open and forthcoming to everybody in the locker room before this," Colon said. "He wasn't. But nevertheless, he's changed his ways. He talks to everybody now. He's more open; he's more vocal. He gets it. He's becoming a great leader."

'It takes time to earn that trust back'
Just before 2 p.m. Monday, the late lunch crowd filtered out of Primanti Bros., a local dining institution. The restaurant takes cash only; the walls are painted with the faces of Pittsburgh's biggest legends.

Jerome Bettis graces the back wall, with a bus painted beside him. Hines Ward is there, too. Roethlisberger's giant mug is bigger than the rest of them. It's covered with graffiti scribbled in black marker.

"It takes time to earn that trust back," said a middle-aged woman named Karen who was walking nearby with her sister Monday afternoon. "He did some stupid stuff, and hopefully he can go forward from that and focus on what he is, a quarterback."

Tollner says his client has an amazing ability to compartmentalize and block out distractions, but that doesn't mean he's oblivious to what people think about him. Although various PR consultants suggested that he pour his heart out in 20-minute national TV increments this past summer, Roethlisberger decided that wouldn't be sincere.

He wanted to prove himself through his actions. He's just an average guy, Tollner says. He cuts his own grass, scoops snow out of his own driveway and shops for his own groceries. Maybe he didn't realize it at first: the importance of every interaction, his significance in the city. Roethlisberger gets it now, his agent says.

With his bar-hopping days apparently behind him, Roethlisberger retreats to his parents' home in his down time. They moved last year from their house in Ohio to a ranch just outside Pittsburgh, and Ben spends a lot of his time outdoors with his dad, Ken.

Roethlisberger was raised in a fairly strict, religious environment, people close to him say, and has turned back to those roots.

"I think his main focus was getting a better connection with the Lord and getting a better connection with his own family," Colon said.

"One part of his life right now is sitting at home, relaxing with his family. He watches TV and lets his body rest. You see the transition. I love the guy to death. Sometimes, in the past, he didn't let the outside world get to know him because he didn't trust them. He didn't feel comfortable with his world outside. But now you can tell he's open and he's willing."

'He was very gracious'
The call came in late May, at the start of Roethlisberger's season of discontent. And Scott Challis was surprised. In the couple of years since his son's death, The John Challis Courage for Life Foundation has held a charity golf event in memory of John. Celebrities are encouraged to come.

The phone rang one day in Freedom, Pa., and Roethlisberger was on the other end. At the time, he was one of the most vilified athletes in Pittsburgh. But he came to the event, played 18 holes, smiled for pictures and signed autographs.

Roethlisberger met John Challis years ago, when cancer was draining the life from the teenager's frail body. They watched a hockey game together, sat in Mario Lemieux's suite.

John, a high school baseball player who had the maturity of a 40-year-old, was considered an old soul. He connected with the quarterback many in Pittsburgh wished would grow up. They spent time together one summer during the Steelers' training camp, riding around on a golf cart. At one point in their interactions, John and Roethlisberger joked around about the quarterback's motorcycle accident. Then John turned serious.

He reminded Roethlisberger that everything can be taken away from you at any time.

"Maybe Ben remembered that," Scott Challis said. "I don't know.

"Do I think he was doing it for the PR? I don't think so. There were no TV cameras there. He wasn't proving anything to anybody. He was just trying to be respectful of my son. He was very gracious. And that made us feel good."

43Hitman
01-20-2011, 03:57 PM
good article, I thought it was well written and fair.

SteelCityMom
01-20-2011, 04:00 PM
Great read...thank you SH.

Actions speak a lot louder than words, and so far, his actions have been commendable. You can see it on the field and in pre-game too. The whole offense looks a lot closer than they did in years past and you get a sense that he's emerging as a real leader of this team.

I hope he keeps it up. I don't think he could be forgiven again, even if it's something he's not guilty of.

SeinfeldNut
01-20-2011, 04:14 PM
Great article, thanks for posting it. I hope Roethlisberger continues to work at rebuilding the trust w/ the city & the organization. He has taken the right steps so far, hope he can take these steps into the off season & just focus on getting ready for next season.

TRH
01-20-2011, 04:16 PM
i've been very impressed with the way he's handled himself, its gotta be tough

fer522
01-20-2011, 05:24 PM
and to think that a lot of people wanted get rid of him :doh:

Curtain_of_Steel
01-20-2011, 05:37 PM
Yea the same people probably wanted Vick...Or McChoke McNabb

Good article, but enough of the harping on a person who was not ever guilty of anything a side from getting to much fame to quick. Perhaps he was an asshole, who cares, show me the SB trophys and work your ass off to get me another one. Dont kill anyone or anything, don't smoke or inject anything, just go win. Perhaps be more selective with your women, lol

If the jury is still out and everyone isn't behind him for what he has done on and off the field(although off is unwarranted). than don't show up to the game, because guess what? Big Ben is not going anyplace. No matter how much you boo, which no one does, no matter what you say which no one is really blasting him a side from message boards here and there.

stb_steeler
01-20-2011, 05:47 PM
Ive noticed Ben rallying the team on the sidlines alot more now. :tt02:

FanSince72
01-20-2011, 06:11 PM
Whether he's actually guilty or not from a legal perspective isn't really the point.
SOMETHING happened in Georgia and it probably wasn't pretty.

But I think that everyone is entitled to do something extremely stupid or go through a moment in their life when they are perhaps not showing their best side and not have it held against them forever.

But that doesn't mean that whatever they did should just be forgotten. If they can move on from that point and by their future actions demonstrate that whatever stupid thing they did or behavior they demonstrated was an anomaly or that they've learned from the experience and understand the importance of it, then I have absolutely no problem allowing that person the opportunity to straighten things out and get pointed back in the right direction and eventually I think the slate can be wiped clean.

Everybody deserves a second chance.

But if those second (or third or more) chances are taken for granted or if the sincerity of the person being given that chance proves to be little more than an act and they once again continue to do the same stupid things and not caring about the people they're hurting and ignore the help they're being offered, then they deserve whatever happens to them.

Nobody's perfect and everyone makes mistakes. But the trick is to learn from those mistakes and recognize that no one lives in a vacuum and that the things that a person does rarely only affects just themselves and usually affects many people.

There's no shame in admitting that you don't have all the answers or that maybe the universe doesn't revolve around you and that maybe you need some help sorting things out.

It seems that Ben has realized that and I hope that he can continue to move forward in a positive way and that as time goes by, people can see their way clear to allow him to be less than perfect --- just like the rest of us.

StainlessStill
01-20-2011, 06:17 PM
Love Ben. The writer is RIGHT. He's so beloved, leader of a WORSHIPED team here in Pittsburgh. He can own the city. I hope he keeps it up and is sincere about his own actions right now. Well put in how a city is heartsick if they can't look up to the quarterback of their beloved football team.

4xSBChamps
01-20-2011, 06:18 PM
Whether he's actually guilty or not from a legal perspective isn't really the point.
SOMETHING happened in Georgia and it probably wasn't pretty.

But I think that everyone is entitled to do something extremely stupid or go through a moment in their life when they are perhaps not showing their best side and not have it held against them forever.

But that doesn't mean that whatever they did should just be forgotten. If they can move on from that point and by their future actions demonstrate that whatever stupid thing they did or behavior they demonstrated was an anomaly or that they've learned from the experience and understand the importance of it, then I have absolutely no problem allowing that person the opportunity to straighten things out and get pointed back in the right direction and eventually I think the slate can be wiped clean.

Everybody deserves a second chance.

But if those second (or third or more) chances are taken for granted or if the sincerity of the person being given that chance proves to be little more than an act and they once again continue to do the same stupid things and not caring about the people they're hurting and ignore the help they're being offered, then they deserve whatever happens to them.

Nobody's perfect and everyone makes mistakes. But the trick is to learn from those mistakes and recognize that no one lives in a vacuum and that the things that a person does rarely only affects just themselves and usually affects many people.

There's no shame in admitting that you don't have all the answers or that maybe the universe doesn't revolve around you and that maybe you need some help sorting things out.

It seems that Ben has realized that and I hope that he can continue to move forward in a positive way and that as time goes by, people can see their way clear to allow him to be less than perfect --- just like the rest of us.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y272/Glensgages/TV%20shows/SpockdetectinglagrequantitiesofWIN.jpg

SH-Rock
01-20-2011, 08:51 PM
If the Steelers do win the Superbowl, Ben's real season starts in the off season and his personal Super Bowl would be reaching the end of it without any mishaps.

43Hitman
01-20-2011, 08:55 PM
Whether he's actually guilty or not from a legal perspective isn't really the point.
SOMETHING happened in Georgia and it probably wasn't pretty.

But I think that everyone is entitled to do something extremely stupid or go through a moment in their life when they are perhaps not showing their best side and not have it held against them forever.

But that doesn't mean that whatever they did should just be forgotten. If they can move on from that point and by their future actions demonstrate that whatever stupid thing they did or behavior they demonstrated was an anomaly or that they've learned from the experience and understand the importance of it, then I have absolutely no problem allowing that person the opportunity to straighten things out and get pointed back in the right direction and eventually I think the slate can be wiped clean.

Everybody deserves a second chance.

But if those second (or third or more) chances are taken for granted or if the sincerity of the person being given that chance proves to be little more than an act and they once again continue to do the same stupid things and not caring about the people they're hurting and ignore the help they're being offered, then they deserve whatever happens to them.

Nobody's perfect and everyone makes mistakes. But the trick is to learn from those mistakes and recognize that no one lives in a vacuum and that the things that a person does rarely only affects just themselves and usually affects many people.

There's no shame in admitting that you don't have all the answers or that maybe the universe doesn't revolve around you and that maybe you need some help sorting things out.

It seems that Ben has realized that and I hope that he can continue to move forward in a positive way and that as time goes by, people can see their way clear to allow him to be less than perfect --- just like the rest of us.

Aben

Riddle_Of_Steel
01-20-2011, 09:45 PM
But I think that everyone is entitled to do something extremely stupid or go through a moment in their life when they are perhaps not showing their best side and not have it held against them forever.



Great quote, '72.

I can sympathize with Ben because I think his problems were not so much his attitude, so much as attitude+hormones+ALCOHOL, and I had my own dark chapter in my life with alcohol.

Folks like to say things like "alcohol makes the true you come out" and whatnot, but that is NOT true. I'll dump a little bit of myself out here.....for those that are interested. Sorry if this is kinda boring....

------------------------------------------------

I started drinking and "partying" (a loose term that translates to "willing to try putting anything in my body") back in high school, when my parents split up. I did not realize it back then, but I was an angry, angry teenager, which is contrary to my normally easy-going and compassionate nature. I DID NOT handle my parents' divorce well at all, nor did I handle being one of the only minorities in a small rural town in northeastern PA.

After raping and pillaging two colleges/universities, I joined the Navy, where I replaced my other previous habits with drinking. And being a sailor, drink I did.... Friday night would roll around, and if I did not have a plan for who, where, when, and how we were getting drunk that night, I felt like I was doing something wrong....like I forgot to pay rent or something.

I spent my entire 7 years in the military as a 4.0 sailor, made Junior Sailor of the Quarter twice, served on the ship's boarding team and a whole host of other high-profile duties, but my hours away from the ship became somewhat of a black mark, my drinking got so bad. It got to the point where it was a running joke every Monday that everyone was happy I showed up for quarters unharmed and/or the ship did not have to send the Master-at-Arms to pick me up from County jail or the brig (became a ritual for a little while).

Eventually, my drinking cost me my military career. I was discharged early from a Marine Corps/Navy command (but fortunately, I still got discharged under Honorable conditions as my service was otherwise superb), and things looked pretty bleak, with no higher education to work with.

However, to make a long story short, sometimes, when good people get caught up in that kind of behavior, they either need someone else to intervene, or some major calamity has to hit for the person to realize they are destroying themselves (a.k.a. "rock bottom"). My early discharge was mine-- it took them a year and a half of legal proceedings to finally discharge me, a year and a half of pure, condensed, STRESS.

I met a great woman, though, and while she would never tell me I was doing something wrong (she was paranoid about being a ball-n-chain), I saw the toll my actions were taking on her, as well as my mother (who is disabled and has always been in tow for my life's journey from PA to CA), and it was too much for me to bear.

Since that time, I used my Montgomery GI Bill to put myself through some schooling, gained certifications, quit drinking, and am now a happily married man to the same woman who put up with all my drinking and misdemeanoring those nasty years. I have a nice job as a Cisco network engineer at a large company, and am preparing to buy my first house soon (hopefully). My mom actually trusts my judgement now, and depends on me to take care of her, which I do with the utmost caring and affection.

Again, folks that say that alcohol makes the "true you" come out or whatever, are WRONG. I still drink and party to this day, but in a way that does not interfere with me GETTING THE JOB DONE and BEING A DESCENT HUMAN BEING.

Looking back on those troubled years, I am not sure why or how it happened, or what mechanism of my personality caused all that to come out. I drink and still "party" now, but for some reason I don't have all those problems anymore, and do so at a "social level" without waking up in the concrete 10' x 10' drunk tank anymore.... My behavior those years could not have been more contrary to my person-- while I am a passionate and wild guy who likes to have fun, I was never criminal or outright destructive, violent, or mean, quite the opposite.

Alcohol used to cause a Jeckyl/Hyde kind of transformation, and I saw the same things happening to Big Ben 9and some of the other guys on the team-- Matt Spaeth pissing into a plant potter on the street outside the bar, Jeff Reed and kicking towel dispensers off the wall-- all sounds familiar, like the actions of single, 22 year old military members).

He probably woke up many mornings, as did I, thinking back on the nights previous, and wondering how things got so efffed up, and feeling embarassed by remembering his own drunken, boorish behavior.

That segment at the end of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, when Hunter was talking about all those mornings waking up to "splintered, horrible memories of wild, jibber-jabbering nights", only truly makes sense to those that have been to that brink before.....

I am happy to see Ben is recognizing his earlier self as an alternate ego that must be stamped out of existence. Sounds like he found himself a descent woman, and now has something else to live for.

Props to you, Ben--- I know how it feels.

SH-Rock
01-20-2011, 09:50 PM
Very cool story. I'm glad you didn't give up on yourself. True warrior.

43Hitman
01-20-2011, 09:58 PM
Great quote, '72.

I can sympathize with Ben because I think his problems were not so much his attitude, so much as attitude+hormones+ALCOHOL, and I had my own dark chapter in my life with alcohol.

Folks like to say things like "alcohol makes the true you come out" and whatnot, but that is NOT true. I'll dump a little bit of myself out here.....for those that are interested. Sorry if this is kinda boring....

------------------------------------------------

I started drinking and "partying" (a loose term that translates to "willing to try putting anything in my body") back in high school, when my parents split up. I did not realize it back then, but I was an angry, angry teenager, which is contrary to my normally easy-going and compassionate nature. I DID NOT handle my parents' divorce well at all, nor did I handle being one of the only minorities in a small rural town in northeastern PA.

After raping and pillaging two colleges/universities, I joined the Navy, where I replaced my other previous habits with drinking. And being a sailor, drink I did.... Friday night would roll around, and if I did not have a plan for who, where, when, and how we were getting drunk that night, I felt like I was doing something wrong....like I forgot to pay rent or something.

I spent my entire 7 years in the military as a 4.0 sailor, made Junior Sailor of the Quarter twice, served on the ship's boarding team and a whole host of other high-profile duties, but my hours away from the ship became somewhat of a black mark, my drinking got so bad. It got to the point where it was a running joke every Monday that everyone was happy I showed up for quarters unharmed and/or the ship did not have to send the Master-at-Arms to pick me up from County jail or the brig (became a ritual for a little while).

Eventually, my drinking cost me my military career. I was discharged early from a Marine Corps/Navy command (but fortunately, I still got discharged under Honorable conditions as my service was otherwise superb), and things looked pretty bleak, with no higher education to work with.

However, to make a long story short, sometimes, when good people get caught up in that kind of behavior, they either need someone else to intervene, or some major calamity has to hit for the person to realize they are destroying themselves (a.k.a. "rock bottom"). My early discharge was mine-- it took them a year and a half of legal proceedings to finally discharge me, a year and a half of pure, condensed, STRESS.

I met a great woman, though, and while she would never tell me I was doing something wrong (she was paranoid about being a ball-n-chain), I saw the toll my actions were taking on her, as well as my mother (who is disabled and has always been in tow for my life's journey from PA to CA), and it was too much for me to bear.

Since that time, I used my Montgomery GI Bill to put myself through some schooling, gained certifications, quit drinking, and am now a happily married man to the same woman who put up with all my drinking and misdemeanoring those nasty years. I have a nice job as a Cisco network engineer at a large company, and am preparing to buy my first house soon (hopefully). My mom actually trusts my judgement now, and depends on me to take care of her, which I do with the utmost caring and affection.

Again, folks that say that alcohol makes the "true you" come out or whatever, are WRONG. I still drink and party to this day, but in a way that does not interfere with me GETTING THE JOB DONE and BEING A DESCENT HUMAN BEING.

Looking back on those troubled years, I am not sure why or how it happened, or what mechanism of my personality caused all that to come out. I drink and still "party" now, but for some reason I don't have all those problems anymore, and do so at a "social level" without waking up in the concrete 10' x 10' drunk tank anymore.... My behavior those years could not have been more contrary to my person-- while I am a passionate and wild guy who likes to have fun, I was never criminal or outright destructive, violent, or mean, quite the opposite.

Alcohol used to cause a Jeckyl/Hyde kind of transformation, and I saw the same things happening to Big Ben 9and some of the other guys on the team-- Matt Spaeth pissing into a plant potter on the street outside the bar, Jeff Reed and kicking towel dispensers off the wall-- all sounds familiar, like the actions of single, 22 year old military members).

He probably woke up many mornings, as did I, thinking back on the nights previous, and wondering how things got so efffed up, and feeling embarassed by remembering his own drunken, boorish behavior.

That segment at the end of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, when Hunter was talking about all those mornings waking up to "splintered, horrible memories of wild, jibber-jabbering nights", only truly makes sense to those that have been to that brink before.....

I am happy to see Ben is recognizing his earlier self as an alternate ego that must be stamped out of existence. Sounds like he found himself a descent woman, and now has something else to live for.

Props to you, Ben--- I know how it feels.

:applaudit::hatsoff::applaudit::hatsoff:

****ing awesome man and THANKS for your service to our country!

FanSince72
01-20-2011, 09:58 PM
Great quote, '72.

I can sympathize with Ben because I think his problems were not so much his attitude, so much as attitude+hormones+ALCOHOL, and I had my own dark chapter in my life with alcohol.

Folks like to say things like "alcohol makes the true you come out" and whatnot, but that is NOT true. I'll dump a little bit of myself out here.....for those that are interested. Sorry if this is kinda boring....

------------------------------------------------

I started drinking and "partying" (a loose term that translates to "willing to try putting anything in my body") back in high school, when my parents split up. I did not realize it back then, but I was an angry, angry teenager, which is contrary to my normally easy-going and compassionate nature. I DID NOT handle my parents' divorce well at all, nor did I handle being one of the only minorities in a small rural town in northeastern PA.

After raping and pillaging two colleges/universities, I joined the Navy, where I replaced my other previous habits with drinking. And being a sailor, drink I did.... Friday night would roll around, and if I did not have a plan for who, where, when, and how we were getting drunk that night, I felt like I was doing something wrong....like I forgot to pay rent or something.

I spent my entire 7 years in the military as a 4.0 sailor, made Junior Sailor of the Quarter twice, served on the ship's boarding team and a whole host of other high-profile duties, but my hours away from the ship became somewhat of a black mark, my drinking got so bad. It got to the point where it was a running joke every Monday that everyone was happy I showed up for quarters unharmed and/or the ship did not have to send the Master-at-Arms to pick me up from County jail or the brig (became a ritual for a little while).

Eventually, my drinking cost me my military career. I was discharged early from a Marine Corps/Navy command (but fortunately, I still got discharged under Honorable conditions as my service was otherwise superb), and things looked pretty bleak, with no higher education to work with.

However, to make a long story short, sometimes, when good people get caught up in that kind of behavior, they either need someone else to intervene, or some major calamity has to hit for the person to realize they are destroying themselves (a.k.a. "rock bottom"). My early discharge was mine-- it took them a year and a half of legal proceedings to finally discharge me, a year and a half of pure, condensed, STRESS.

I met a great woman, though, and while she would never tell me I was doing something wrong (she was paranoid about being a ball-n-chain), I saw the toll my actions were taking on her, as well as my mother (who is disabled and has always been in tow for my life's journey from PA to CA), and it was too much for me to bear.

Since that time, I used my Montgomery GI Bill to put myself through some schooling, gained certifications, quit drinking, and am now a happily married man to the same woman who put up with all my drinking and misdemeanoring those nasty years. I have a nice job as a Cisco network engineer at a large company, and am preparing to buy my first house soon (hopefully). My mom actually trusts my judgement now, and depends on me to take care of her, which I do with the utmost caring and affection.

Again, folks that say that alcohol makes the "true you" come out or whatever, are WRONG. I still drink and party to this day, but in a way that does not interfere with me GETTING THE JOB DONE and BEING A DESCENT HUMAN BEING.

Looking back on those troubled years, I am not sure why or how it happened, or what mechanism of my personality caused all that to come out. I drink and still "party" now, but for some reason I don't have all those problems anymore, and do so at a "social level" without waking up in the concrete 10' x 10' drunk tank anymore.... My behavior those years could not have been more contrary to my person-- while I am a passionate and wild guy who likes to have fun, I was never criminal or outright destructive, violent, or mean, quite the opposite.

Alcohol used to cause a Jeckyl/Hyde kind of transformation, and I saw the same things happening to Big Ben 9and some of the other guys on the team-- Matt Spaeth pissing into a plant potter on the street outside the bar, Jeff Reed and kicking towel dispensers off the wall-- all sounds familiar, like the actions of single, 22 year old military members).

He probably woke up many mornings, as did I, thinking back on the nights previous, and wondering how things got so efffed up, and feeling embarassed by remembering his own drunken, boorish behavior.

That segment at the end of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas, when Hunter was talking about all those mornings waking up to "splintered, horrible memories of wild, jibber-jabbering nights", only truly makes sense to those that have been to that brink before.....

I am happy to see Ben is recognizing his earlier self as an alternate ego that must be stamped out of existence. Sounds like he found himself a descent woman, and now has something else to live for.

Props to you, Ben--- I know how it feels.


Thanks for sharing that.

I staggered down that same road myself and I was damned lucky to find the exit ramp.

The bottom line is that when you look in the mirror, you have like who's looking back at you and if you can honestly say that you do, then you're well on your way to living a good life.


Good luck to you, man!

Tulsa
01-20-2011, 10:03 PM
2 great reads. Thanks Riddle for the second one.

Riddle_Of_Steel
01-20-2011, 11:43 PM
That was kinda tough to write--- made me sweat while I was thinking about some of that stuff I was glad to put behind me....

I am probably not the only person that has ever nearly lost his life to the devil drink. I am just glad I woke up when I did or I realize that things could get a LOT worse.