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MasterOfPuppets
03-17-2011, 05:12 PM
oh wait ... never mind , Wasington is busy solving problems in other countries . america be patient , they'll get to our problems as soon as they fix the rest of the world ....:thumbsup:

"We need a plan for economic development, for jobs. The Tunisian people deserve that," she told reporters, saying the US would take part in a donors' conference later this year to help the North African nation.

"We need to have a very big commitment to Tunisia, [so] that we can be ready to help them economically as well as with their democratic transformation," she said.

oops ... looks like the tunisians are familiar with their work

They chanted "Hillary Clinton, you are not welcome, get out", "No colonisation after the revolution," or "No to US tutelage on Islamic soil", as they warned against any US intervention in Libya.

but hey... washington will give em taxpayers money even if we have to invade them and force them to take it.

http://english.aljazeera.net/news/middleeast/2011/03/201131712487729281.html

Atlanta Dan
03-17-2011, 07:50 PM
Looks like we are going to war with Libya based upon a UN resolution - guess we are back to overthrowing governments we do not like even if their direct threat to the U.S. is not clear - that certainly worked out well when we took down Iraq

Qadaffi is a SOB but WTF - what exactly is the U.S. dog in this fight? At least W and Cheney felt the need to lie about WMD that allegedly jeopardized the U.S. to justify invading Iraq - would like to hear what vital national interest is involved here other than being sad that the Libyan rebels (who may not uniformly be staunch supporters of Western style democracy) could not finish off the Colonel

MasterOfPuppets
03-17-2011, 10:11 PM
england , france and the arab league want to get involved. russia and china said let em work it out on their own.
is england , france ,saudi , and egypt not capable of establishing a freakin " no fly zone ???
we ( the taxpayers ) will once again foot the bill , and supply 95% of the hardware and it'll be our guys putting themselves in harms way for people who'd be just as happy shooting at us than each other.

every ass wipe in DC that supported this should have to ride shotgun on all the sorties WITHOUT parachutes.
i heard newt gingrich running his man pleaser about obama's delay in getting involved. i'm sure the military complex was behind the stage pulling his strings that made his c0ck holster move. they ain't makin money if the bombs ain't bein dropped ..they can't wait to see a few thousand of those 70 grand a piece hellfire missiles fired from those planes that cost an arm and a leg to maintain.

my guees for the delay in the US getting on board with the idea is , the politicians and military contractors were still negotiating the split on the profits and what oil companies will get the new contracts.

i read an article the other day where gadhafi was considering kicking european oil companies out of the country and giving russia , china and india , access to the oil fields .... gee i wonder why some countries want to get involved while others don't ??? :huh:

the sickening part is how these scumbags can stand at a podium and piss on your leg and tell you it's raining and keep a strait face. anyone who believes it's for humanitarian reasons is a total fool. just ask the people of darfur that survived the massacre how that humanitarian effort by the US and the UN worked out.... oh thats right,,, there was none. it's too bad they weren't blessed with oil fields . the rest of the world might have been interested.

steelax04
03-18-2011, 07:09 AM
I was just reading up on some articles about how the Obama administration has done nothing about Lybia, can't say they were caught off guard because of Egypt a few months earlier, etc, etc. I actually agree with the administration on not doing anything. We have our own issues to worry about right now. Let them figure it out on their own.

MasterOfPuppets
03-18-2011, 11:49 AM
hell no we shouldn't get "involved" , what has getting involved ever gotten us but massive debt , dead soldiers , and the tag of "most hated" country in the world. let europe and the arab league who want to "get involved" , do it them damn selves. the only reason they want us involved is to pick up the tab.
france blasted us for invading iraq. why ? because saddam was giving them a sweet deal on oil. now that gadhafi has threatened to cut em off in libya , all of the sudden they start beating their war drums and want to take action. of course it has nothing to do with oil , they just can't stand to see the suffering of the poor libyan citizens under gadhafi. but hey saddam wasn't such a bad guy.
of course the GOP can't stand the thought of passing up on a military adventure. their corporate butt buddies might miss out on billions of dollars military hardware sales if we stay on the sidelines.

BigRick
03-18-2011, 11:56 AM
hell no we shouldn't get "involved" , what has getting involved ever gotten us but massive debt , dead soldiers , and the tag of "most hated" country in the world. let europe and the arab league who want to "get involved" , do it them damn selves. the only reason they want us involved is to pick up the tab.
france blasted us for invading iraq. why ? because saddam was giving them a sweet deal on oil. now that gadhafi has threatened to cut em off in libya , all of the sudden they start beating their war drums and want to take action. of course it has nothing to do with oil , they just can't stand to see the suffering of the poor libyan citizens under gadhafi. but hey saddam wasn't such a bad guy.
of course the GOP can't stand the thought of passing up on a military adventure. their corporate butt buddies might miss out on billions of dollars military hardware sales if we stay on the sidelines.

I total agree. Stay out of this mess. As far as the Frenc F--K em! My Father fought all across Europe in WWII. He hated the French, said they were the rudest most ungrateful people he had ever seen. They want our help because they have never seen a war they could win.:banging::banging:

MasterOfPuppets
03-19-2011, 10:02 PM
WASHINGTON – U.S. and British ships and submarines launched the first phase of a missile assault on Libyan air defenses Saturday and a senior American defense official said it was believed substantial damage was inflicted.
In the strikes, 112 Tomahawk cruise missiles were fired at more than 20 coastal targets to clear the way for air patrols to ground Libya's air force.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_us_libya


the cost of a tomahawk missile ....about $ 570,000 A PIECE
http://www.navy.mil/navydata/fact_display.asp?cid=2200&tid=1300&ct=2

112 X 570000 =$ 63,840,000 TAX DOLLARS spent to help people who celebrated 9 / 11

i guess the CEO's at raytheon got a chub on.

MasterOfPuppets
03-19-2011, 11:19 PM
the REAL reason we are now involved ... ( and why china and russia were against involvement )

Libya: Gaddafi offers oil production to India, Russia, China to replace Western companies


Libya’s leader Muammar Gaddafi invited Chinese, Russian and Indian firms to produce its oil, state news agency Jana reported Monday, in a bid to replace Western companies that fled unrest. 'The leader of the revolution met on Sunday the ambassadors of China, Russia and India, with whom he discussed the progress of bilateral relations and an invitation to firms from these countries to exploit Libyan oil,' Jana said.

Most oil companies operating in Libya, including France's Total and China's CNPC, have partially or completely shut down production since the uprising against Gaddafi’s rule began a month ago. As the insurrection gained momentum, Gaddafi warned on March 2 that oil production in Libya had hit a historic low and threatened to throw out Western oil companies operating in the country. 'We are ready to bring Chinese and Indian companies to replace Western ones,' he said as oil companies evacuated their personnel and fled the violence.

The last oil shipment left the north African country on February 19 as large swathes of the east came under rebel control. But rebels fighting to unseat Gaddafi lost key oil towns, including Zawiyah, Ras Lanuf and Brega, in recent days to heavily-armed loyalist forces. 'Libyan oil terminals have become safe... All employees are asked to return to their jobs in all oil facilities. And we urge (foreign) firms to send their tankers to load and unload,' state television said Sunday, quoting the National Oil Corporation.

Oil giant Total said on Friday that the unrest in Libya had slashed output by 1.4 million barrels a day to under 300,000. Libya was producing 1.69 million barrels a day before the unrest, according to the International Energy Agency. Of this 1.2 million were exported, mostly to Europe. Other major customers are China and the United States.

Qatar’s Energy Minister Mohammed Saleh al-Sada said on Sunday that the world oil market was 'comfortable' despite the conflict in Libya. 'There are no problems of supply or reserves,' he told journalists, saying that producers’ cartel OPEC saw no need for a meeting on output.
http://www.energy-pedia.com/article.aspx?articleid=144557

Zk2u-pvOpcc

MACH1
03-20-2011, 01:40 AM
i guess the CEO's at raytheon got a chub on.

Thats almost cheaper than paying for a golf game. :rolleyes:

MasterOfPuppets
03-20-2011, 01:15 PM
Anti-American Extremists Among Libyan Rebels U.S. Has Vowed To Protect (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/19/extremists-among-libya-rebels_n_837894.html)


WASHINGTON -- In 2007, when American combat casualties were spiking in the bloodbath of the Iraq War, an 18-year-old laborer traveled from his home in eastern Libya through Egypt and Syria to join an al Qaeda terrorist cell in Iraq. He gave his name to al Qaeda operatives as Ashraf Ahmad Abu-Bakr al-Hasri. Occupation, he wrote: “Martyr.’’
Abu-Bakr was one of hundreds of foreign fighters who flocked into the killing zones of Iraq to wage war against the “infidels." They came from Saudi Arabia, Syria, Oman, Algeria and other Islamic states. But on a per capita basis, no country sent more young fighters into Iraq to kill Americans than Libya -- and almost all of them came from eastern Libya, the center of the anti-Gaddafi rebellion that the United States and others now have vowed to protect, according to internal al Qaeda documents uncovered by U.S. intelligence.
The informal alliance with violent Islamist extremist elements is a coming-home of sorts for the United States, which initially fought on the same side as the Libyan fighters in Afghanistan in the 1980s, battling the Soviet Union.
According to a cache of al Qaeda documents captured in 2007 by U.S. special operations commandos in Sinjar, Iraq, hundreds of foreign fighters, many of them untrained young Islamic volunteers, poured into Iraq in 2006 and 2007. The documents, called the Sinjar documents, (http://www.ctc.usma.edu/harmony/FF-Bios-Trans.pdf) were collected, translated and analyzed at the West Point Counter Terrorism Center. Almost one in five foreign fighters arriving in Iraq came from eastern Libya, from the towns of Surt, Misurata and Darnah.
On a per capita basis, that’s more than twice as many than came from any other Arabic-speaking country, amounting to what the counter terrorism center called a Libyan “surge" of young men eager to kill Americans.
During 2006 and 2007, a total of 1,468 Americans were killed in combat and 12,524 were badly wounded, according to Pentagon records.
Today, there is little doubt that eastern Libya, like other parts of the Arab world, is experiencing a genuine burst of anti-totalitarian fervor, expressed in demands for political freedom and economic reforms. But there also is a dark history to eastern Libya, which is the home of the Islamic Libyan Fighting Group, an anti-Gaddafi organization officially designated by the State Department as a terrorist organization.
The group was founded by Libyan mujahideen returning in the mid-1990s from Afghanistan, where they had gone to fight the Soviets’ Red Army. Building on a radical Islamist credo, they organized to fight the secular corruption of the Gaddafi regime. In 1996 they nearly succeeded in assassinating Gaddafi by attacking his motorcade with either a bomb or a rocket-propelled grenade which missed its target. The attack led to a severe crackdown by the regime. Many were imprisoned or disappeared, but the CIA still regards the group as one of the many franchises of al Qaeda, including al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula, which operates in Yemen, and al Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb, which is active in Algeria and elsewhere in North Africa.
Eastern Libya has been described by U.S. diplomats as a breeding ground for Islamist extremism. In diplomatic cables (http://91.214.23.156/cablegate/wire.php?id=08TRIPOLI120&search=) released by Wikileaks, the region’s young men were said to have “nothing to lose" by resorting to violence. Sermons in the local mosques are “laced with phraseology urging worshippers to support jihad," one diplomat reported.
U.S. officials declined to discuss the make-up of the anti-Gaddafi forces in eastern Libya, and U.S. intelligence agencies declined to comment publicly. To be sure, extremist elements make up only a portion of the resistance to Gaddafi and have been present in every popular uprising in the region stretching from the Iranian revolution to the Egyptian people’s overthrow of Hosni Mubarak. But others caution that in the chaotic jockeying for power that will ensue, whether or not Gaddafi is forced from power, eastern Libya’s extremist groups will emerge.
“Lingering civil conflict in Libya (certain to happen if Gaddafi clings to power) would create ample ground for radicalization and extremist recruitment," Yasser al-Shimy, an Egyptian diplomat who defected during the last days of the Mubarak regime, wrote recently. Protracted civil conflict “usually induces radicalization and chaos. In other words, Libya might turn into a giant Somalia: a failed state on Egypt's borders with radical groups taking advantage of the mayhem," al-Shimy wrote in the blog, Best Defense. (http://ricks.foreignpolicy.com/?page=1) Or as Secretary of State Hillary Clinton said Friday about the immediate future of Libya: “We don’t know what the outcome will be."

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/19/extremists-among-libya-rebels_n_837894.html

MasterOfPuppets
03-20-2011, 09:13 PM
heard a talking head on tv today say it will cost about 300 million per week to enforce a no fly zone ....:jerkit:

thank god they made budget cuts to those stupid programs like education . otherwise how would we be able to pay for this ... no sense in education anyway... its not like its going to help you get a job , since there won't be any jobs left to get...:popcorn:

Wallace108
03-20-2011, 11:14 PM
But on a per capita basis, no country sent more young fighters into Iraq to kill Americans than Libya -- and almost all of them came from eastern Libya, the center of the anti-Gaddafi rebellion that the United States and others now have vowed to protect, according to internal al Qaeda documents unc

MoP, it would seem that even Gadhafi suggests this.

Calling Barack Obama as "our son", Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi sent a message to the US President defending his decision to attack the rebels fighting to overthrow him. ...
Defending his decision to attack rebel cities, Gaddafi told Obama, "Al Qaeda is an armed organisation, passing through Algeria, Mauritania and Mali. What would you do if you found them controlling American cities with the power of weapons? What would you do, so I can follow your example."
http://www.timesnow.tv/Gaddafi-defends-attack-on-rebels/articleshow/4368205.cms

Wallace108
03-20-2011, 11:33 PM
So, how long until our European allies decide this wasn't such a good idea and leave us holding the bag? :noidea:
------

CAIRO — The Arab League secretary general, Amr Moussa, deplored the broad scope of the U.S.-European bombing campaign in Libya and said Sunday that he would call a league meeting to reconsider Arab approval of the Western military intervention.

Moussa said the Arab League’s approval of a no-fly zone on March 12 was based on a desire to prevent Moammar Gaddafi’s air force from attacking civilians and was not designed to endorse the intense bombing and missile attacks — including on Tripoli, the capital, and on Libyan ground forces — whose images have filled Arab television screens for two days.

Moussa’s declaration suggested that some of the 22 Arab League members were taken aback by what they have seen and wanted to modify their approval lest they be perceived as accepting outright Western military intervention in Libya. Although the eccentric Gaddafi is widely looked down upon in the Arab world, the leaders and people of the Middle East traditionally have risen up in emotional protest at the first sign of Western intervention.

A shift away from the Arab League endorsement, even partial, would constitute a major setback to the U.S.-European campaign. Western leaders brandished the Arab League decision as a justification for their decision to move militarily and as a weapon in the debate to obtain a U.N. Security Council resolution two days before the bombing began.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/arab-league-condemns-broad-bombing-campaign-in-libya/2011/03/20/AB1pSg1_story.html?hpid=z3

MasterOfPuppets
03-21-2011, 11:10 AM
[QUOTE=Wallace108;925360]So, how long until our European allies decide this wasn't such a good idea and leave us holding the bag? :noidea:
i don't know about the rest of europe , but as soon as a french plane gets shot down , they'll surrender . :popcorn:

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_YJ5At1CvB2g/TIwEgslUXyI/AAAAAAAAAlY/WO2pLN0N5ys/s400/french+surrender.jpg

http://www.uwm.edu/People/picmack/surrender.jpg

MasterOfPuppets
03-21-2011, 11:37 AM
this is funny... here's 2 headlines on yahoo news today....

Gates hopes to expand US-Russian cooperation


ST. PETERSBURG, Russia – U.S. Defense Secretary Robert Gates arrived in Russia Monday to take a final, personal try at easing Moscow's worries over a missile defense shield in Europe and to expand a military relationship that has grown dramatically since his Cold War days at the helm of the CIA.

West in "medieval crusade" on Gaddafi, Putin says

"The resolution is defective and flawed," said Russia's Putin, whose country did not use its power to veto the resolution at the United Nations. "It allows everything. It resembles medieval calls for crusades," Putin added.

Sixburgher
03-21-2011, 11:50 AM
So, how long until our European allies decide this wasn't such a good idea and leave us holding the bag? :noidea:

Isn't the U.S. ultimately holding the bag at the end of all this pretty much a foregone conclusion anyway? Not to mention the blame for any and all deaths as a result of it?

Atlanta Dan
03-21-2011, 02:45 PM
Isn't the U.S. ultimately holding the bag at the end of all this pretty much a foregone conclusion anyway? Not to mention the blame for any and all deaths as a result of it?

http://imgsrv.gocomics.com/dim/?fh=ceb91d126ece756d4f863d4dada19835

Wallace108
03-22-2011, 01:38 AM
Costs of Libya Operation Already Piling Up

With U.N. coalition forces bombarding Libyan leader Muammar el-Qaddafi from the sea and air, the United States’ part in the operation could ultimately hit several billion dollars -- and require the Pentagon to request emergency funding from Congress to pay for it.

The first day of Operation Odyssey Dawn had a price tag that was well over $100 million for the U.S. in missiles alone. And the U.S. military, which remains in the lead now in its third day, has pumped millions more into air- and sea-launched strikes targeting air-defense sites and ground-force positions along Libya’s coastline.
http://www.nationaljournal.com/nationalsecurity/costs-of-libya-operation-already-piling-up-20110321?page=1

MasterOfPuppets
03-23-2011, 11:26 AM
i just thought of another possible reason why england and france were so eager for military action .....

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c2/Eurofighter_Typhoon_AUT.jpg/800px-Eurofighter_Typhoon_AUT.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/9b/Dassault_Rafale_B_03.jpg/800px-Dassault_Rafale_B_03.jpg


the eurofighter typhoon and the rafale.
the UK and France have been searching hard for buyers. obviously battle tested equipment sells better than unproven equipment.

SteelersinCA
03-23-2011, 03:58 PM
Maybe if their plane didn't look so homo....

Wallace108
03-24-2011, 12:02 AM
Far be it from me to bash the Obama administration, but am I the only one who finds it odd that a few days after attacking a sovereign country, the president takes his family on vacation, and the vice president is doing photo ops at the Yankees spring training camp? :doh:

TAMPA, Fla. - Vice President Joe Biden has visited the New York Yankees' spring training camp.

Biden spent around 30 minutes on the third-base side of George Steinbrenner Field on Wednesday while the Yankees were taking part in early defensive drills. He was with Sen. Bill Nelson, D-Fla., and both wore Yankees hats.

The vice president talked with team officials, including manager Joe Girardi and spring training instructor David Wells, along with a number of players.
http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/42237450/ns/sports-baseball/

http://nbcsportsmedia1.msnbc.com/j/ap/blue%20jays%20yankees%20spring%20baseball--256560428_v2.320w.jpg

Since there's little focus on the economy, shouldn't they be giving their attention to any number of the wars we're involved in? :noidea:

SteelersinCA
03-24-2011, 12:36 AM
No you aren't

MACH1
03-24-2011, 01:03 AM
Didn't you know obaaaama isn't calling this a war? :doh:

Wallace108
03-25-2011, 11:30 PM
Libyan rebel commander admits his fighters have al-Qaeda links

Abdel-Hakim al-Hasidi, the Libyan rebel leader, has said jihadists who fought against allied troops in Iraq are on the front lines of the battle against Muammar Gaddafi's regime.

In an interview with the Italian newspaper Il Sole 24 Ore, Mr al-Hasidi admitted that he had recruited "around 25" men from the Derna area in eastern Libya to fight against coalition troops in Iraq. Some of them, he said, are "today are on the front lines in Adjabiya".

Mr al-Hasidi insisted his fighters "are patriots and good Muslims, not terrorists," but added that the "members of al-Qaeda are also good Muslims and are fighting against the invader".

His revelations came even as Idriss Deby Itno, Chad's president, said al-Qaeda had managed to pillage military arsenals in the Libyan rebel zone and acquired arms, "including surface-to-air missiles, which were then smuggled into their sanctuaries".

Mr al-Hasidi admitted he had earlier fought against "the foreign invasion" in Afghanistan, before being "captured in 2002 in Peshwar, in Pakistan". He was later handed over to the US, and then held in Libya before being released in 2008.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8407047/Libyan-rebel-commander-admits-his-fighters-have-al-Qaeda-links.html

And we're talking about supplying weapons to the rebels. :doh:


The United States and its allies are considering whether to supply weapons to the Libyan opposition as coalition airstrikes fail to dislodge government forces from around key contested towns, according to U.S. and European officials.

France actively supports training and arming the rebels, and the Obama administration believes the United Nations resolution that authorized international intervention in Libya has the “flexibility” to allow such assistance, “if we thought that were the right way to go,” Obama spokesman Jay Carney said. It was a “possibility,” he said.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/us-allies-ponder-arming-libyan-rebels/2011/03/25/AFJP9mYB_story.html

Wallace108
03-26-2011, 06:18 PM
It just keeps getting better and better :dang:

'Al-Qaeda snatched missiles' in Libya

AL-QAEDA'S offshoot in North Africa has snatched surface-to-air missiles from an arsenal in Libya during the civil strife there, Chad's President says.

Idriss Deby Itno did not say how many surface-to-air missiles were stolen, but told the African weekly Jeune Afrique that he was "100 per cent sure" of his assertion.

"The Islamists of al-Qaeda took advantage of the pillaging of arsenals in the rebel zone to acquire arms, including surface-to-air missiles, which were then smuggled into their sanctuaries in Tenere," a desert region of the Sahara that stretches from northeast Niger to western Chad, Deby said in the interview.

"This is very serious. AQIM is becoming a genuine army, the best equipped in the region," he said.

His claim was echoed by officials in other countries in the region who said that they were worried that al-Qaeda in the Islamic Maghreb (AQIM) might have acquired "heavy weapons", thanks to the insurrection.
"We have sure information. We are very worried for the sub-region," a Malian security source who did not want to be named said.

AQIM originated as an armed Islamist resistance movement to the secular Algerian government.

It now operates mainly in Algeria, Mauritania, Mali and Niger, where it has attacked military targets and taken civilian hostages, particularly Europeans, some of whom it has killed.

"We have the same information," about heavy weapons, including SAM 7 missiles, a military source from Niger said.

"It is very worrying. This overarming is a real danger for the whole zone," he added

"AQIM gets the weapons in two ways; people go and look for the arms in Libya to deliver them to AQIM in the Sahel, or AQIM elements go there themselves."

Elsewhere in the interview, Chad's president backed the assertion by his neighbour and erstwhile enemy Libyan leader Muammar Gaddafi that the protests in Libya have been driven in part by al-Qaeda.

"There is a partial truth in what he says," Deby said.

"Up to what point? I don't know. But I am certain that AQIM took an active part in the uprising."

After years of tension between the two nations, which were at war during part of the 1980s, Deby has more recently maintained good relations with Gaddafi.

The Chadian leader described the international military intervention in Libya, launched a week ago by the United States, France and Britain, as a "hasty decision".

"It could have heavy consequences for the stability of the region and the spread of terrorism in Europe, the Mediterranean and the rest of Africa," he cautioned.

Read more: http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/al-qaeda-snatched-missiles-in-libya/story-e6frfku0-1226028543204#ixzz1Hkaqvsoy