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Atlanta Dan
04-20-2011, 08:03 PM
Interesting read in SI by Cold Hard Football Facts

10 headline needs we've identified for some the league's marquee teams or those clubs that offered the most compelling statistical storylines of 2010....

Pittsburgh Steelers

Immediate need: a left guard

The Steelers have fielded plenty of fine teams over the past three years, including the Super Bowl champs in 2008 and the AFC champs in 2010.

But the offensive line has consistently been the organization's weak link and has quite literally never recovered from the loss of future Hall of Fame guard Alan Faneca, who was signed to a big-bucks deal by the Jets before the 2008 season (and played with the Cardinals last year).

We understand the reason the Steelers let Faneca go. He was getting older and he demanded huge money. Regardless, Pittsburgh has struggled to both run effectively and protect the passer in the years since he's left, often in quite frustrating fashion.

This weak link was exposed badly in the single biggest play of the 2010 season and the turning point of the Super Bowl XLV against the Packers.

The Packers had just taken a 7-0 lead in the first quarter when QB Ben Roethlisberger dropped back to pass at his own goal line. He had no chance. Left guard Chris Kemoeatu, the heir to Faneca's throne at LG, was tossed seven yards backward by DT Howard Green, who got a paw up in Big Ben's face. The QB's pass fluttered badly and was intercepted by Nick Collins, who returned for a TD.

The score was 14-0. There was plenty of football still be played. But, statistically speaking, the outcome of the game was set in stone: every team in Super Bowl history that's suffered a pick-six has lost. The Steelers proved no exception.

It was just one play. But it underscored in dramatic fashion the fact that the Steelers need help on the OL. In the biggest moment of the biggest game of the year, the OL snapped -- as weak links usually do. Pittsburgh was an elite team in every measure last year, except on the offensive line.

The Steelers ranked No. 15 on our Offensive Hog Index in 2010, No. 18 in average per rush attempt (4.09) and No. 22 at protecting the passer -- allowing a sack or INT on 10.0 percent of drop backs in 2010. And this final flaw haunted them in the biggest play of the biggest game of the 2010 season.

Pittsburgh boasts elite defense filled with playmakers, an elite if uneven quarterback, great weapons at the skill positions on offense and all the tools needed to make another Super Bowl run. They could use an elite offensive lineman, too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/kerry_byrne/04/20/nfl-draft-needs/1.html

I think CB is a bigger need - maybe I have simply become used to the Steelers OL being mediocre while expecting the defense to be consistently great:noidea:

#1LambertFan
04-21-2011, 10:45 AM
Interesting read in SI by Cold Hard Football Facts

10 headline needs we've identified for some the league's marquee teams or those clubs that offered the most compelling statistical storylines of 2010....

Pittsburgh Steelers

Immediate need: a left guard

The Steelers have fielded plenty of fine teams over the past three years, including the Super Bowl champs in 2008 and the AFC champs in 2010.

But the offensive line has consistently been the organization's weak link and has quite literally never recovered from the loss of future Hall of Fame guard Alan Faneca, who was signed to a big-bucks deal by the Jets before the 2008 season (and played with the Cardinals last year).

We understand the reason the Steelers let Faneca go. He was getting older and he demanded huge money. Regardless, Pittsburgh has struggled to both run effectively and protect the passer in the years since he's left, often in quite frustrating fashion.

This weak link was exposed badly in the single biggest play of the 2010 season and the turning point of the Super Bowl XLV against the Packers.

The Packers had just taken a 7-0 lead in the first quarter when QB Ben Roethlisberger dropped back to pass at his own goal line. He had no chance. Left guard Chris Kemoeatu, the heir to Faneca's throne at LG, was tossed seven yards backward by DT Howard Green, who got a paw up in Big Ben's face. The QB's pass fluttered badly and was intercepted by Nick Collins, who returned for a TD.

The score was 14-0. There was plenty of football still be played. But, statistically speaking, the outcome of the game was set in stone: every team in Super Bowl history that's suffered a pick-six has lost. The Steelers proved no exception.

It was just one play. But it underscored in dramatic fashion the fact that the Steelers need help on the OL. In the biggest moment of the biggest game of the year, the OL snapped -- as weak links usually do. Pittsburgh was an elite team in every measure last year, except on the offensive line.

The Steelers ranked No. 15 on our Offensive Hog Index in 2010, No. 18 in average per rush attempt (4.09) and No. 22 at protecting the passer -- allowing a sack or INT on 10.0 percent of drop backs in 2010. And this final flaw haunted them in the biggest play of the biggest game of the 2010 season.

Pittsburgh boasts elite defense filled with playmakers, an elite if uneven quarterback, great weapons at the skill positions on offense and all the tools needed to make another Super Bowl run. They could use an elite offensive lineman, too.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/kerry_byrne/04/20/nfl-draft-needs/1.html

I think CB is a bigger need - maybe I have simply become used to the Steelers OL being mediocre while expecting the defense to be consistently great:noidea:

How about both? We do have more than 1 pick, and we can get both a great linemen and a great cornerback. Personally I want a big mean corner first, but this years first round has some good line prospects and I believe most of the good corners will go in the top 20.

stiller39
04-21-2011, 12:47 PM
Steelers will take the best player available next thursday in the areas of need. I agree we need help at CB, OL, and DL. I think we will take a big man on Thursday. Just not sure what side of the ball he will play.

zulater
04-21-2011, 12:57 PM
Steelers will take the best player available next thursday in the areas of need. I agree we need help at CB, OL, and DL. I think we will take a big man on Thursday. Just not sure what side of the ball he will play.

BPA is fine by me, as long as it's not a qb, rb, wr, te, olb or Center. :wink02:

wootawnee
04-22-2011, 09:57 AM
This article sucks.....The DL made a play......Kemo is a road grader and is gonna be the guard for 8 more years at least.....Who comes up with this crap.......Thats like saying Randy White sucks cuase he got blocked by Mike Webster in the Super Bowl..
Meanwhile Randy WHite Is a hof er.........

I wont stand for this terrible crap......Kemo is one of the best guards in the league......

:yap:

Riddle_Of_Steel
04-22-2011, 12:02 PM
Kemo struggled this year, but I'd say it is too quick to pull the trigger and grab a guard in the early rounds, whn we have more pressing needs at DL, CB.

Kemo has given us one descent year (2007), two good years (2008 & 2009), and one shoddy one (this last season). It is understood he is not an elite guard or in the top echelon of the league, so he is going to have an off-year every now and then.

But he wasn't the main problem with the left side, it was the journeyman LT we had for most of the season. Jonathan Scott was the weak link on this team in 2010/2011 (and Gay & McFadden), by far. All one had to do was watch the other team stack up the right side of their defense every play to put their best edge rushers on that side each game to know.

pete74
04-23-2011, 05:55 AM
an OLB in the 1st or 2nd wouldnt surprise me.

steelerchad
04-23-2011, 07:24 AM
This article sucks.....The DL made a play......Kemo is a road grader and is gonna be the guard for 8 more years at least.....Who comes up with this crap.......Thats like saying Randy White sucks cuase he got blocked by Mike Webster in the Super Bowl..
Meanwhile Randy WHite Is a hof er.........

I wont stand for this terrible crap......Kemo is one of the best guards in the league......

:yap:

I'm a fan of Kemo after he took less money to stay with the team. But, I thought he had a poor season last year. And not because of the Super Bowl. I was at the game and have yet to watch the DVR of it because I'm just not ready to do so. I was still under the impression that the guy who made the tip was Legursky's guy.
The other thing about Kemo is he let his temper cost and almost cost his team a couple of times in big situations. That's a mental mistake and can't happen.

zulater
04-23-2011, 01:16 PM
I'm a fan of Kemo after he took less money to stay with the team. But, I thought he had a poor season last year. And not because of the Super Bowl. I was at the game and have yet to watch the DVR of it because I'm just not ready to do so. I was still under the impression that the guy who made the tip was Legursky's guy.
The other thing about Kemo is he let his temper cost and almost cost his team a couple of times in big situations. That's a mental mistake and can't happen.

Kemo's guy was most certainly the man who's pressure created the pick 6 in the Super Bowl.

zulater
04-23-2011, 01:22 PM
an OLB in the 1st or 2nd wouldnt surprise me.

It wouldn't me either, but I'd be dissapointed all the same. I understand the concpet of BPA, I also understand the Steelers need a steady stream of good young OLB's to keep LeBeau's defense viable. But the need is so much more urgent at ILB, OT, DE, NT, OG, and CB that I would hope they would concentrate their efforts their with there with the first couple choices. In all honesty if there's not a true value pick at one of those positions of dire need I would strongly consider trading down before I would back log myself at one of the positions that there's no immediate need to address.

55BaileyFan
04-23-2011, 03:56 PM
I think it is so funny that we are talking about a whole at LG when the right side has been the worst part of our line for the last few years.

The right side averaged more sacks allowed and penalties per game than the left side the last two years. Flozell was a huge upgrade from Willie Colon who at best in an average lineman but that didn't cure the problems.

Kemoeatu's biggest issue is his pass blocking but for most of the season with Pouncey (who is an amazing pass blocker) that weakness was somewhat dealt with. The Steelers should really invest in a right guard, maybe not in the first round...depending who is left at 31 bu there should be tons of talent in the second round.

The Steelers always take the best available so it is not a shocker that they might not take a G in the first round but this draft is full of guys able to play the RG position. With a solid right guard and a good cornerback we will be Super Bowl XLVI bound.

55BaileyFan
04-23-2011, 03:59 PM
I'm a fan of Kemo after he took less money to stay with the team. But, I thought he had a poor season last year. And not because of the Super Bowl. I was at the game and have yet to watch the DVR of it because I'm just not ready to do so. I was still under the impression that the guy who made the tip was Legursky's guy.
The other thing about Kemo is he let his temper cost and almost cost his team a couple of times in big situations. That's a mental mistake and can't happen.

It was Legursky's man and Kemo did really screw up with his temper but Keyaron Fox made another huge screw up in this game with the personal foul of the KR, it is funny that he also had stupid penalty in Super Bowl XLIII.

zulater
04-23-2011, 07:07 PM
It was Legursky's man and Kemo did really screw up with his temper but Keyaron Fox made another huge screw up in this game with the personal foul of the KR, it is funny that he also had stupid penalty in Super Bowl XLIII.

What play are you talking about, or better yet what game were you watching? It was most definetely Kemo who got beat on the pressure that caused the pick 6 in SB XLV.

55BaileyFan
04-23-2011, 08:01 PM
What play are you talking about, or better yet what game were you watching? It was most definetely Kemo who got beat on the pressure that caused the pick 6 in SB XLV.

A) That is not the play I was talking about the play in question was later in the game.

B) Ben had released the ball before the defensive lineman got to him and the contact was made after the throw and not during the throw. Ben himself acknowledged that he UNDER THREW Wallace and told the NFL Network that there was no excuse for EVER under throwing Mike Wallace.

Why does every Steeler fan defend Ben for everything? He can't do anything wrong to people. He throws two interceptions and we blame it on his line? Did anybody else notice that the pick was thrown into double coverage? Or that Nick Collins read it perfectly because Ben never took his eyes off Wallace.

I like Ben and I don't think we get this far without him but still. In multiple interviews he said that the picks were his fault and when his line was brought up he said it was not their fault. He also said that he should have paid attention more especially on the second pick.

So, before you want to insult someone about a play or watching a game...get on youtube and watch it over and over again before you post and make sure that you are looking at every aspect. The lineman may have got to him but Ben still had the chance to get the ball out.

bornaSteelersfan
04-23-2011, 09:57 PM
A) B) Ben had released the ball before the defensive lineman got to him and the contact was made after the throw and not during the throw. Ben himself acknowledged that he UNDER THREW Wallace and told the NFL Network that there was no excuse for EVER under throwing Mike Wallace.
...
So, before you want to insult someone about a play or watching a game...get on youtube and watch it over and over again before you post and make sure that you are looking at every aspect. The lineman may have got to him but Ben still had the chance to get the ball out.

I have watched that play about 100 times now. Kemo got man-handled by Howard Green and Green got his hand in Ben's face hitting his shoulder before the ball was released. That being said, a split second before, Ben did a pump-fake in that same direction. If Ben throws instead of a pump fake, that's a touchdown for the Steelers. Bad play by both Ben and Kemo.

55BaileyFan
04-23-2011, 11:03 PM
I have watched that play about 100 times now. Kemo got man-handled by Howard Green and Green got his hand in Ben's face hitting his shoulder before the ball was released. That being said, a split second before, Ben did a pump-fake in that same direction. If Ben throws instead of a pump fake, that's a touchdown for the Steelers. Bad play by both Ben and Kemo.

For real? Ben himself during an NFL Network interview said the hit had nothing to do with the throw. He also said in the interview that he under threw Wallace and that should never happen, EVER.

I am not doubting that Kemo got beat off the line, but it had nothing to do with the interception. Nick Collins read the play perfectly and cut the pass off at the perfect time. The ball was still off target, it was to the outside like it needed to be but it was about ten years too short.

Either way the game is over. Kemo got beat. The ball was off. The end.

zulater
04-24-2011, 12:08 AM
A) That is not the play I was talking about the play in question was later in the game.

B) Ben had released the ball before the defensive lineman got to him and the contact was made after the throw and not during the throw. Ben himself acknowledged that he UNDER THREW Wallace and told the NFL Network that there was no excuse for EVER under throwing Mike Wallace.

Why does every Steeler fan defend Ben for everything? He can't do anything wrong to people. He throws two interceptions and we blame it on his line? Did anybody else notice that the pick was thrown into double coverage? Or that Nick Collins read it perfectly because Ben never took his eyes off Wallace.

I like Ben and I don't think we get this far without him but still. In multiple interviews he said that the picks were his fault and when his line was brought up he said it was not their fault. He also said that he should have paid attention more especially on the second pick.

So, before you want to insult someone about a play or watching a game...get on youtube and watch it over and over again before you post and make sure that you are looking at every aspect. The lineman may have got to him but Ben still had the chance to get the ball out.

What a load of bullshit and misdirection. Is it really worth addressing such nonsense? . :doh:

zulater
04-24-2011, 12:13 AM
I have watched that play about 100 times now. Kemo got man-handled by Howard Green and Green got his hand in Ben's face hitting his shoulder before the ball was released. That being said, a split second before, Ben did a pump-fake in that same direction. If Ben throws instead of a pump fake, that's a touchdown for the Steelers. Bad play by both Ben and Kemo.

That's quite fair.


Not to you Borna but to someone else. No one here is trying to place false blame or absolve anyone for anything. At this point what does it really matter? The play and game are long over, and pointing out aspects of why a play failed are simply that, and nothing deeper or sinister need be inferred.

Steeldude
04-24-2011, 02:12 AM
This article sucks.....The DL made a play......Kemo is a road grader and is gonna be the guard for 8 more years at least.....Who comes up with this crap.......Thats like saying Randy White sucks cuase he got blocked by Mike Webster in the Super Bowl..
Meanwhile Randy WHite Is a hof er.........

I wont stand for this terrible crap......Kemo is one of the best guards in the league......

:yap:

what...lol? kemo is not one of the best guards in the NFL. he commits too many mental errors to be considered one the best in the NFL. kemo is a big, dumb ox. an ox who gets pushed around too much for his so-called size and strength.

bornaSteelersfan
04-24-2011, 04:45 AM
For real? Ben himself during an NFL Network interview said the hit had nothing to do with the throw. He also said in the interview that he under threw Wallace and that should never happen, EVER.

I am not doubting that Kemo got beat off the line, but it had nothing to do with the interception. Nick Collins read the play perfectly and cut the pass off at the perfect time. The ball was still off target, it was to the outside like it needed to be but it was about ten years too short.

Either way the game is over. Kemo got beat. The ball was off. The end.

Ben showed a true measure of class by saying that. He took all the blame on himself and showed a huge growth in his maturity by being as humble as he was after that loss. I am certainly not placing any blame, but we definitely need some help on the O-line.

I personally believe a FB wouldn't hurt either. Someone to stay back and move in for a block from time to time or give a better lead block for a RB. Pulling a lineman and a TE doesn't always work that well.

DanRooney
04-24-2011, 07:17 AM
This article sucks.....The DL made a play......Kemo is a road grader and is gonna be the guard for 8 more years at least.....Who comes up with this crap.......Thats like saying Randy White sucks cuase he got blocked by Mike Webster in the Super Bowl..
Meanwhile Randy WHite Is a hof er.........

I wont stand for this terrible crap......Kemo is one of the best guards in the league......

:yap:

Kemo is a fat, stubborn turd who is horrid in pass protection. You saying he's on of the best guards in the league makes me vomit. He can pull pretty good in run support but that's it. Other than that, he's just a big fat guy who takes up space. I can name about 26 guards who are better than him in the NFL.

DanRooney
04-24-2011, 07:20 AM
For real? Ben himself during an NFL Network interview said the hit had nothing to do with the throw. He also said in the interview that he under threw Wallace and that should never happen, EVER.

I am not doubting that Kemo got beat off the line, but it had nothing to do with the interception. Nick Collins read the play perfectly and cut the pass off at the perfect time. The ball was still off target, it was to the outside like it needed to be but it was about ten years too short.

Either way the game is over. Kemo got beat. The ball was off. The end.

Mike Tomlin asked Ben "what happened?" shortly after the interception. Ben responded "my arm got hit." He even makes the motion with his hand when he's on the sideline.

Ben is known for covering from his offensive line's mistakes. That was certainly the case. Saying there's "no excuse for underthrowing Wallace" is a bunch of bullshit. He's the fastest or 2nd fastest receiver in the league. Of course there's an excuse for underthrowing him and he does it often.

55BaileyFan
04-24-2011, 09:21 AM
Mike Tomlin asked Ben "what happened?" shortly after the interception. Ben responded "my arm got hit." He even makes the motion with his hand when he's on the sideline.

Ben is known for covering from his offensive line's mistakes. That was certainly the case. Saying there's "no excuse for underthrowing Wallace" is a bunch of bullshit. He's the fastest or 2nd fastest receiver in the league. Of course there's an excuse for underthrowing him and he does it often.

In your opinion there is an excuse for underthrowing him. Ben has said multiple times that there is no excuse and the ball should be there. So, am I gonna take your word that there is an excuse or the QB who says that there isn't?

I'm going with the QB on this one.

Why is everyone so down on Kemo anyway? Until Pouncey he has been one of our better lineman. He has his issues on pass blocking but Pouncey has really helped with that. Max Starks has gotten a lot better as well but the right side of the line has always been an issue with our team.

We start with what lineman we need to draft and somehow get to a Kemo bashing fest with everyone who has watched the Super Bowl a million times. The thing with opinions is everyone has one.

Let me try to end this again, and get back to the subject at hand. Kemo screwed up. Ben threw a crappy ball. We lost. The end.

Back to the draft...I am a huge fan of Mike Pouncey (how awesome would that be?) but I feel that we could grab Nate Solder or Danny Watkins. I think Danny will be there in the second round but Nate might go before we draft.

Does anyone think that we will not take a lineman though? There are no real standout CB that will be there in the late second round. What do you all think?

55BaileyFan
04-24-2011, 09:51 AM
Kemo is a fat, stubborn turd who is horrid in pass protection. You saying he's on of the best guards in the league makes me vomit. He can pull pretty good in run support but that's it. Other than that, he's just a big fat guy who takes up space. I can name about 26 guards who are better than him in the NFL.

I would love to hear the 26 guards.

mikegrimey
04-24-2011, 05:06 PM
I was way highher on Kemo last offseason than I am this offseason. Like others have mentioned, he can be a beast when pulling but getting beat in pass protection and losing his temper and drawing stupid penalties outshadowed his positives this year.

I don't think LG is the biggest priority on the o-line though. Kemo is far more stable than the revolving door we have at RG (Foster was actually okay, but his legursky and essex aren't permanent solutions) and then we need some help at tackle. We don't have enough luxury of depth at either slot to dismiss Kemo right now, in my personal view.

55BaileyFan
04-24-2011, 06:38 PM
I was way highher on Kemo last offseason than I am this offseason. Like others have mentioned, he can be a beast when pulling but getting beat in pass protection and losing his temper and drawing stupid penalties outshadowed his positives this year.

I don't think LG is the biggest priority on the o-line though. Kemo is far more stable than the revolving door we have at RG (Foster was actually okay, but his legursky and essex aren't permanent solutions) and then we need some help at tackle. We don't have enough luxury of depth at either slot to dismiss Kemo right now, in my personal view.

I agree, I think at some point later we could upgrade from Kemo but I think right now that right side needs attention, we really need a corner and some young guns on the defensive line so when our big boys retire we have someone to step in. That is how Keisel got his job and I think we can build towards that as well.

DanRooney
04-25-2011, 10:22 AM
I would love to hear the 26 guards.

1. Steve Hutchinson
2. Jahri Evans
3. Shawn Andrews
4. Logan Mankins
5. Leonard Davis
6. Davin Joseph
7. Ben Grubbs
8. Arron Sears
9. Eric Steinbach
10. Brian Waters
11. Chris Snee
12. Carl Nicks
13. Kris Dielman
14. Justin Blalock
15. Justin Smiley
16. Chris Kuper
17. Stephen Neal

Got about 17 and this is just off the top of my head.

thumper
04-25-2011, 03:43 PM
First on all, LG is _not_ our biggest concern. Kemo is a fat, talent-limited OG, who
really can suck ass in pass protection; that much is true. But he is hardly our biggest
weakness and it's unlikely he will be losing his starting job any time soon. I would say
you can count on him being there through his current contract, period. Our LT spot
is below average, even with Starks playing. He has super slow feet. LT is the most
vital spot on the OL. LG is so so. Center is solid for a decade. RG.....who the F is our
starting RG right now? RT is fairly solid with Hotel for another year. Then we got a bunch
of loose parts with Essex, Foster, et al.

As far as Kemo being fat, who on our OL isn't fat except for Pouncy? Pgh puts an
emphasis on our OL being really BIG at the expense of it being athletic. I am not
sure I agree with that philosophy, to be honest. We end up with bunch of blobs
with giant guts, who huff and puff too much as the game goes on. I don't know
whose decision it was to go with fat guys. You don't expect any OLmen to be thin,
obviously. But guts that huge, like Colon, etc? I can't imagine that is the best way
to go.

55BaileyFan
04-26-2011, 08:01 PM
1. Steve Hutchinson
2. Jahri Evans
3. Shawn Andrews
4. Logan Mankins
5. Leonard Davis
6. Davin Joseph
7. Ben Grubbs
8. Arron Sears
9. Eric Steinbach
10. Brian Waters
11. Chris Snee
12. Carl Nicks
13. Kris Dielman
14. Justin Blalock
15. Justin Smiley
16. Chris Kuper
17. Stephen Neal

Got about 17 and this is just off the top of my head.

Kuper, Nicks, Neal, Sears, Davis ARE huge stretches. Smiley is even keel, not any better. Blalock is arguable. I only see about ten people who are head over heels better than Kemo.

I have not seen Chris ranked worse than 20th from any reputable source. You can keep your opinion about him he isn't going anywhere.