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View Full Version : Cam Heyward - 17 plays, 1 sack, 1 forced grounding call


Fire Arians
10-13-2011, 11:44 AM
Damn, we better let this guy rot on the bench for another 2 years to 'learn the system'!

MasterOfPuppets
10-13-2011, 11:52 AM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:

Fire Arians
10-13-2011, 12:02 PM
I'm not saying start him now but damn, continue to rotate him even after smith is back

he basically got 2 sacks playing less than half the defensive snaps, for a 3-4 DE that is crazy

Danny136200
10-13-2011, 12:03 PM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:

A little more than Aaron Smith in the first four games...

But seriously, one of the main differences i seen in this game, than in the first four games was the Steelers Dline was the one pushing people around, not the other way around, which is what the Steelers need.

Merchant
10-13-2011, 12:23 PM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:

You expect him to get a sack every play or something?

ricardisimo
10-13-2011, 01:01 PM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:
Based on the stat line, I'd say he was helping to stop the run, which is his job - his job is not getting sacks. I'm confident he wasn't on the field for Johnson's 20-yarder to start the game, after that, it got better. Coincidence? :scratchchin:

Aaron Smith may or may not be done, but what's clear is that he's not right, not yet at least. He needs to up his dosage of 'roids.

fer522
10-13-2011, 01:44 PM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:

KICK SOME ASSSSS:noidea:

DanRooney
10-13-2011, 02:33 PM
I've been telling everyone that Heyward will transition to his position much better than Ziggy Hood did. He is the prototypical 3-4 end. I really hope the coaching staff sees this and gives him some reps.

Steelerfreak58
10-13-2011, 03:53 PM
so what did he do on the other 15 plays ? :noidea:

Ignorance or stupidity? YOU MAKE THE CALL!

Fire Arians
10-13-2011, 04:01 PM
I've been telling everyone that Heyward will transition to his position much better than Ziggy Hood did. He is the prototypical 3-4 end. I really hope the coaching staff sees this and gives him some reps.

I'm wondering how the heck he dropped all the way to 31 without any teams picking him up. he was probably one of the most, if not the most, NFL-ready defensive end in the draft. I'm not complaining though, we stole this kid :chuckle:

truesteelerfan
10-13-2011, 06:13 PM
Keep rotating all our DL in there- fresh legs equal productive plays IMO-

55BaileyFan
10-13-2011, 06:49 PM
Did anyone watch him last week? He was smashed by Duane Brown when he was on the left and Eric Winston when he was on the right. He played really well on a few plays against the Titans and the rest of the time...he wasn't outstanding and still needs to sit and learn. In all his action this year, he has that sack (which also was a forced fumble) and then a tackle here and there.

Love the guy, but he is not ready to be a starter.

DanRooney
10-13-2011, 11:22 PM
Did anyone watch him last week? He was smashed by Duane Brown when he was on the left and Eric Winston when he was on the right. He played really well on a few plays against the Titans and the rest of the time...he wasn't outstanding and still needs to sit and learn. In all his action this year, he has that sack (which also was a forced fumble) and then a tackle here and there.

Love the guy, but he is not ready to be a starter.

In all his action? You mean very little action? Are you aware of what a 3-4 end does? They aren't sack specialists.

I honestly have no idea what you were watching. I rewatched the game and didn't see him 'getting smashed.' I saw him holding is lane and occupying his blocker on almost every play he was in. He is the polar opposite of Aaron Smith this year, who is being pushed out of the play and often on his ass, leaving huge lanes.

tony hipchest
10-14-2011, 12:14 AM
cam is one hell of a draft pick, especially at the rock bottom of the 1st round-

Steelers Defensive Coordinator Dick Lebeau

On Cam Heyward:

“I think he’s making good progress. He’s always had real good pass rush ability, and he showed up in the game last Sunday with some good pass rushes. He’s learning the package pretty well. We’re very hopeful that he will develop along the lines of Ziggy and contribute significantly as the season goes on. We want him to be a part of the defense and get in the game. He’s got a great work ethic, I think the future is going to be onward and upward for him”



i am almost certain if the steelers were one of those 20 or so perinnial teams with no realistic SB aspirations, or one of those same 20 who flips their coaching staff every 3-5 years, cam would immediately be a starter.

but cam is not on one of those teams and at this point, cam is not ndomkong suh, marrio williams, or julius peppers.

steelerfans who think he should start from day one will have to recognize him for what he is (2 picks from a second rounder) and re-familiarize themselves with the steelers way.

(FYI the "steelers way is that thing that wins championships")

kirklandrules
10-14-2011, 12:08 PM
I'm wondering how the heck he dropped all the way to 31 without any teams picking him up.

He had a serious elbow injury in the bowl game against Arkansas that required surgery in January. He continued playing the second half of that game and was still unstoppable. But the injury set his offseason schedule behind. Also, his production in his final year of college was inconsistent. He was drafted where he was projected to go ... late first round.

Curtain_of_Steel
10-14-2011, 02:48 PM
Stopped the run the other 15 plays. Exactly what he is supposed to do. Clog up the holes. Exactly what Ziggy did last year than subsequently was benched because they had no balls to cut Smith.

ggoldman
10-14-2011, 03:48 PM
Cam is progressing (especially without OTA's and minicamp like Ziggy had), but I dont expect him to start for at least 2 years, especially while Kiesel is still playing well

55BaileyFan
10-14-2011, 03:52 PM
In all his action? You mean very little action? Are you aware of what a 3-4 end does? They aren't sack specialists.

I honestly have no idea what you were watching. I rewatched the game and didn't see him 'getting smashed.' I saw him holding is lane and occupying his blocker on almost every play he was in. He is the polar opposite of Aaron Smith this year, who is being pushed out of the play and often on his ass, leaving huge lanes.

Obviously not, because there are multiple times in the Texans game that Duane Brown had him turned around and smashed him between another player...heres an idea rewatch those big runs and this time look at the left tackle and watch Eric Winston on the right side...you will see he wasn't holding as much as you think.

55BaileyFan
10-14-2011, 03:54 PM
cam is one hell of a draft pick, especially at the rock bottom of the 1st round-



i am almost certain if the steelers were one of those 20 or so perinnial teams with no realistic SB aspirations, or one of those same 20 who flips their coaching staff every 3-5 years, cam would immediately be a starter.

but cam is not on one of those teams and at this point, cam is not ndomkong suh, marrio williams, or julius peppers.

steelerfans who think he should start from day one will have to recognize him for what he is (2 picks from a second rounder) and re-familiarize themselves with the steelers way.

(FYI the "steelers way is that thing that wins championships")

100% agree...what I have been saying since he was drafted...Thankfully someone else understands what the Steelers way is and that he is not a starter...for a few more years

Ask Ziggy.

Steelerfreak58
10-14-2011, 03:56 PM
Stopped the run the other 15 plays. Exactly what he is supposed to do. Clog up the holes. Exactly what Ziggy did last year than subsequently was benched because they had no balls to cut Smith.

Pretty much this.

DanRooney
10-14-2011, 04:09 PM
Obviously not, because there are multiple times in the Texans game that Duane Brown had him turned around and smashed him between another player...heres an idea rewatch those big runs and this time look at the left tackle and watch Eric Winston on the right side...you will see he wasn't holding as much as you think.

I was obviously talking about the Titans game. But if you want to bring up the Texans game, the big runs came from everywhere. The game winning one was caused by Lamarr Woodley himself.

Goldsteel86
10-14-2011, 05:12 PM
I may be wrong but Mario Williams was started early as a rookie, so was Suh, there wasn't any of this two years to learn the system. How in the world do you learn the system from the sidelines, its called insertion into the system, trial by fire. If you look in alot of circles, Williams and Suh are now the "prototype" defensive linemen, why not allow Heyward to rotate, take his licks and learn, it seemed to have worked for Suh and Williams, oh and by the way did "Mean" Joe Green sit for two years????:noidea:

PINDEL1
10-14-2011, 07:29 PM
The Steeler way is you wait your turn and be ready at any moment. Playing rookies over qualified vets causes problems in the the locker room, team morale etc.

I am a supporter of Steeler mgmt all the way. They have proved it to me. THey are the envy of 31 NFL teams out there.

Goldsteel86
10-14-2011, 07:48 PM
The Steeler way is you wait your turn and be ready at any moment. Playing rookies over qualified vets causes problems in the the locker room, team morale etc.

I am a supporter of Steeler mgmt all the way. They have proved it to me. THey are the envy of 31 NFL teams out there.

That must have been what they did with Pouncey last year, I sure hope we get to see him pretty soon, must be waiting for something to happen to Legursky. I mean the mgmt did it with Woodson and Polamalu to name a few, tell me where it has ever been said talent waits behind veterans? Thank goodness the Steelers finally had someone retire so Wallace could play!!!!

tony hipchest
10-14-2011, 10:35 PM
I may be wrong but Mario Williams was started early as a rookie, so was Suh, there wasn't any of this two years to learn the system. How in the world do you learn the system from the sidelines, its called insertion into the system, trial by fire. If you look in alot of circles, Williams and Suh are now the "prototype" defensive linemen, why not allow Heyward to rotate, take his licks and learn, it seemed to have worked for Suh and Williams, oh and by the way did "Mean" Joe Green sit for two years????:noidea:thank God youre not a manager for a team.

if you dont understand the difference between a team coming off a superbowl run, and a team sucking so bad they get the #1 pick and are pretty much starting the dregs of the league just to win 2 games in a season, then i dont know what to tell you.

mario williams was a #1 pick for a complete peice of shit of a team that had david carr at qb, not a 2X sb winner who had made it to 3 sb's.

joe greene played on a team that went 1-13. of course he was gonna start and "learn on the fly". the steelers had nothing to lose.

you do know the lions went 0-16 just a few years ago, right?

jeebus, how many #1 overall picks do they have starting for their team? 14?
of course suh was going to start. he was a proven, nfl player who earned the right to bew drafted #1 overall. if heyward did the same, and was better than cam newton, im sure he would be starting for the panthers.

but heres the kicker- he didnt and he wasnt.

How in the world do you learn the system from the sidelines, its called insertion into the system, trial by fire

i sure hope this isnt a serious question. can you even guess how players even learn the system by studying the playbook or watching game film? if they cant learn from the sidelines, they dont belong in this league. just ask ZIGGY HOOD.

from all indications, heyward is a great study and getting snaps accordingly.

again, the steelers arent running a freaking high school science experiment here, they are on a mission to win the superbowl.

they arent gonna sacrifice the season so a damn rookie can be thrown into the firs just to see if he really "gets it". :dang:

i wish more fans would realize and understand that the rooneys are actually running a business with a proven track record and not rolling the dice or playing the lottery in hopes that a single player is gonna "strike it big".

too many people are enamoured with the hype of the draft and "potential and upside"

they quickly forget that young players like polamalu and ben (who were "thrown into the fire") were HUGE liabilities in their 1st AFCC game, despite a 15-1 season.

MACH1
10-14-2011, 11:00 PM
Homer

tony hipchest
10-14-2011, 11:49 PM
:laughing:

ricardisimo
10-15-2011, 12:08 AM
I may be wrong but Mario Williams was started early as a rookie, so was Suh, there wasn't any of this two years to learn the system. How in the world do you learn the system from the sidelines, its called insertion into the system, trial by fire. If you look in alot of circles, Williams and Suh are now the "prototype" defensive linemen, why not allow Heyward to rotate, take his licks and learn, it seemed to have worked for Suh and Williams, oh and by the way did "Mean" Joe Green sit for two years????:noidea:
How many championships have either of those guys won?

DanRooney
10-15-2011, 01:53 AM
How many championships have either of those guys won?

I guess you're right. We should have not started Pouncey last year :thumbsup:

Ben either in his rookie year. Tommy Maddox would have done a lot better had he not gotten injured.

You guys treat players like they're of the same mold. Sitting Ziggy a majority of his rookie year was understandable. He was basically a 4-3 DT that had to learn how to play a3-4 end. Heyward is not learning the position from scratch. He deserves reps especially with our d-line looking suspect as hell in 3 out of 5 games this year. Everyone here is so general. Like mindless zombies advocating everything the Steelers coaching staff does. "Veteran=GOOD, young players=BAD!!! 6 championships!"

Some of you guys would be appalled at the notion that our non-veterans had anything to do with us being dominant in last week's game.

kirklandrules
10-15-2011, 05:22 AM
I guess you're right. We should have not started Pouncey last year :thumbsup:

Ben either in his rookie year. Tommy Maddox would have done a lot better had he not gotten injured.

At the time, I thought Ben was the best QB in his draft (best player actually). He was ranked as the top QB when the college season ended, but during the off season all the hype in Eli with his daddy getting in the mix and Rivers ... well the Steelers had a great steal at the 11 spot. Ben got his chance because of the Maddox injury. Pouncey had a horrible Hartwig in front of him. I imagine that if Keisel goes down this weekend, Heyward will be in.

Heyward is not learning the position from scratch. He deserves reps especially with our d-line looking suspect as hell in 3 out of 5 games this year.

Hmmm, Heyward does get reps during games. Aren't you just pissed he not the starter?

Everyone here is so general. Like mindless zombies advocating everything the Steelers coaching staff does. "Veteran=GOOD, young players=BAD!!! 6 championships!"

It's mindless to think replacing proven veterans with rookies is the answer to the team's problems. And I wouldn't say the posters here are "advocating everything the Steelers coaching staff does", but are in line with the greater philosophy of this team: build a solid core, then remain consistent. Yeah, I'll take the Steelers way and their 6 championships (not to mention the franchise with the most wins since 1970) ... because it's proven to work.

Some of you guys would be appalled at the notion that our non-veterans had anything to do with us being dominant in last week's game.

Non-veterans and rookies are key to this team's success, but that doesn't mean you just start all your non-veterans. There's no franchise in the NFL that has long term success by dumping their core players year in and year out.

You would have us all believe that John Mitchell and Dick Lebeau sit in their basements looking at pictures of Smith and Keisel and :jerkit: And that Bruce Arians is in his basement every night :jerkit: over Hines Ward and not replacing him with Brown. In fact, Mitchell made a comment during training camp that Heyward was going to have to unlearn some things and learn how DEs play for the Steelers. Mitchell isn't looking for raw talent, he's looking for someone who can execute the duties of a Steelers DE. That isn't going to happen overnight. Even Heyward, after the Colts game, said: "I did some positive things out there, but I still need to execute better".

I liked Heyward in college and loved seeing the Steelers pick him in the draft. I also get pumped seeing the other young guys on this team make plays. But I don't believe the Steelers would keep their winning ways if they just replaced their veterans with those young guns.

DanRooney
10-15-2011, 06:15 AM
Heyward's snaps were fine by me last week. He got a lot of them in the 2nd half but most of that was due to the score and Smith beig out. I actually don't want him to be the starter yet. Mainly because Keisel is playing fine and Ziggy Hood has already shown that Smith should be riding the bench. If Heyward is worked into as many snaps as last week for the rest of the season, I'd be fine with that. I believe the moment Smith comes back, he'll be sent to rot.

I'm not a veteran hater until I see them digress to the point where I believe inserting a younger player will benefit the team more (after all, you'll never hear me say start Ryan f'n Mundy over Troy or Jason Worilds over Harrison). But before the season, I was a big proponent of Lewis/Brown starting over McFadden/Gay (1/2 of that is happening already) and Brown starting over Ward (pretty much transitioning now). Sylvester is the next who I believe should be worked in the rotation. I'm not sure how long Tomlin expects Farrior and Foote to play for the team. It would be nice to see him at least getting snaps there.

Goldsteel86
10-15-2011, 02:06 PM
thank God youre not a manager for a team.

if you dont understand the difference between a team coming off a superbowl run, and a team sucking so bad they get the #1 pick and are pretty much starting the dregs of the league just to win 2 games in a season, then i dont know what to tell you.

mario williams was a #1 pick for a complete peice of shit of a team that had david carr at qb, not a 2X sb winner who had made it to 3 sb's.

joe greene played on a team that went 1-13. of course he was gonna start and "learn on the fly". the steelers had nothing to lose.

you do know the lions went 0-16 just a few years ago, right?

jeebus, how many #1 overall picks do they have starting for their team? 14?
of course suh was going to start. he was a proven, nfl player who earned the right to bew drafted #1 overall. if heyward did the same, and was better than cam newton, im sure he would be starting for the panthers.

but heres the kicker- he didnt and he wasnt.



i sure hope this isnt a serious question. can you even guess how players even learn the system by studying the playbook or watching game film? if they cant learn from the sidelines, they dont belong in this league. just ask ZIGGY HOOD.

from all indications, heyward is a great study and getting snaps accordingly.

again, the steelers arent running a freaking high school science experiment here, they are on a mission to win the superbowl.

they arent gonna sacrifice the season so a damn rookie can be thrown into the firs just to see if he really "gets it". :dang:

i wish more fans would realize and understand that the rooneys are actually running a business with a proven track record and not rolling the dice or playing the lottery in hopes that a single player is gonna "strike it big".

too many people are enamoured with the hype of the draft and "potential and upside"

they quickly forget that young players like polamalu and ben (who were "thrown into the fire") were HUGE liabilities in their 1st AFCC game, despite a 15-1 season.

Ohhh I do understand, now you are saying that a team won't through a rookie into the fire for sake of the season??? What about Ben in 2004? Potential upside once again, what about Ben and his learning curve? I would safely say that when Ben beat the Eagles and the Patriots you weren't complaining. Huge liabilities, Ben made bad decisions as a rookie against the Pats and he admitted that, I am not saying start Heyward, but I am saying to play him for game experience, just like the same experience that worked with Green, Holmes, Greewood, White and Furness. Just like with Ben and Troy, experience wins Super Bowls not expecting someone on Gameday to step in and fill a gap.

ricardisimo
10-15-2011, 04:42 PM
I guess you're right. We should have not started Pouncey last year :thumbsup:

Ben either in his rookie year. Tommy Maddox would have done a lot better had he not gotten injured.

You guys treat players like they're of the same mold. Sitting Ziggy a majority of his rookie year was understandable. He was basically a 4-3 DT that had to learn how to play a3-4 end. Heyward is not learning the position from scratch. He deserves reps especially with our d-line looking suspect as hell in 3 out of 5 games this year. Everyone here is so general. Like mindless zombies advocating everything the Steelers coaching staff does. "Veteran=GOOD, young players=BAD!!! 6 championships!"

Some of you guys would be appalled at the notion that our non-veterans had anything to do with us being dominant in last week's game.
Those two guys prove the system works. Pouncey impressed everyone - including these stupid coaches of ours - to the degree that he was made the starter. Maddox did get hurt, the number two guy - Ben - took over, and he played just well enough (on one of the better teams in our history, it's worth noting) to win out.

These players are indeed all different, and I'd say our coaches do a decent job of judging those differences, and if they err it is on the side of caution, which is how you treat multi-million dollar investments. As far as all of us licking the coaches' boots, you clearly haven't been paying much attention. Massive schisms and draconian purges took place on two message boards in large part because of the strong opinions many (maybe even most) of us have about several past and present coaches.

Goldsteel86
10-15-2011, 07:03 PM
Those two guys prove the system works. Pouncey impressed everyone - including these stupid coached of ours - to the degree that he was made the starter. Maddox did get hurt, the number two guy - Ben - took over, and he played just well enough (on one of the better teams in our history, it's worth noting) to win out.

These players are indeed all different, and I'd say our coaches do a decent job of judging those differences, and if they err it is on the side of caution, which is how you treat multi-million dollar investments. As far as all of us licking the coaches' boots, you clearly haven't been paying much attention. Massive schisms and draconian purges took place on two message boards in large part because of the strong opinions many (maybe even most) of us have about several past and present coaches.

There is only one coach in question, never seen or heard anything about Wisenhunt or Mularkey, you must be referring to ARIANS!!!!!!

ricardisimo
10-15-2011, 07:31 PM
There is only one coach in question, never seen or heard anything about Wisenhunt or Mularkey, you must be referring to ARIANS!!!!!!
No, many of us were calling for Bob Ligashesky's head a couple of years ago, and we had our team spirit, patriotism and sexuality called into question as a result. Then he got canned and suddenly everyone was allowed to talk about how truly worthless he was.

Goldsteel86
10-15-2011, 07:34 PM
No, many of us were calling for Bob Ligashesky's head a couple of years ago, and we had our team spirit, patriotism and sexuality called into question as a result. Then he got canned and suddenly everyone was allowed to talk about how truly worthless he was.

I know exactly what you:banging::banging::banging: are talking about, I apologize and I stand corrected. I shouldn't have assumed you were talking about ARIANS. I wish you were though!!!!!

ricardisimo
10-15-2011, 07:43 PM
I know exactly what you:banging::banging::banging: are talking about, I apologize and I stand corrected. I shouldn't have assumed you were talking about ARIANS. I wish you were though!!!!!
Oh, we are... we most definitely are talking about him as well.

thebus36idf
10-15-2011, 07:43 PM
I may be wrong but Mario Williams was started early as a rookie, so was Suh, there wasn't any of this two years to learn the system. How in the world do you learn the system from the sidelines, its called insertion into the system, trial by fire. If you look in alot of circles, Williams and Suh are now the "prototype" defensive linemen, why not allow Heyward to rotate, take his licks and learn, it seemed to have worked for Suh and Williams, oh and by the way did "Mean" Joe Green sit for two years????:noidea:

Mario williams played as a rookie and did fairly well and don't forget I think he left college a year early. His second and third year he was palying better than most veterans. Suh well he's just an animal and is just now in his second year and played in his first, and I believe he led all def tackles in sacks. I however hesitate to mess with a philosophy that works and is time tested. :tt02:

thebus36idf
10-15-2011, 07:46 PM
The Steeler way is you wait your turn and be ready at any moment. Playing rookies over qualified vets causes problems in the the locker room, team morale etc.

I am a supporter of Steeler mgmt all the way. They have proved it to me. THey are the envy of 31 NFL teams out there.

Nicely put and the envy of me included!

DanRooney
10-15-2011, 09:12 PM
Those two guys prove the system works. Pouncey impressed everyone - including these stupid coached of ours - to the degree that he was made the starter. Maddox did get hurt, the number two guy - Ben - took over, and he played just well enough (on one of the better teams in our history, it's worth noting) to win out.

These players are indeed all different, and I'd say our coaches do a decent job of judging those differences, and if they err it is on the side of caution, which is how you treat multi-million dollar investments. As far as all of us licking the coaches' boots, you clearly haven't been paying much attention. Massive schisms and draconian purges took place on two message boards in large part because of the strong opinions many (maybe even most) of us have about several past and present coaches.

Well coaches not named Arians : P

Rick5895
10-16-2011, 07:04 AM
Heyward's snaps were fine by me last week. He got a lot of them in the 2nd half but most of that was due to the score and Smith beig out. I actually don't want him to be the starter yet. Mainly because Keisel is playing fine and Ziggy Hood has already shown that Smith should be riding the bench. If Heyward is worked into as many snaps as last week for the rest of the season, I'd be fine with that. I believe the moment Smith comes back, he'll be sent to rot.

I'm not a veteran hater until I see them digress to the point where I believe inserting a younger player will benefit the team more (after all, you'll never hear me say start Ryan f'n Mundy over Troy or Jason Worilds over Harrison). But before the season, I was a big proponent of Lewis/Brown starting over McFadden/Gay (1/2 of that is happening already) and Brown starting over Ward (pretty much transitioning now). Sylvester is the next who I believe should be worked in the rotation. I'm not sure how long Tomlin expects Farrior and Foote to play for the team. It would be nice to see him at least getting snaps there.

I agree with you on Heyward, however, I think he may be closer to being an "everyday" player than we may think and he's providing us with a very nice luxury on D.
I want to see Sylvester in there aswell but I wonder whether or not he's picking up the intricacies of this defense. Brown just isn't ready yet to take Ward's spot and we saw what happened when Hines was more prevalent in the passing attack (not as the 1st read but he does sit down in the zone well), our highest point output of the season.

I have a feeling we will see a much different defense next season, with Bmac, Smith and Maybe farrior and Clark no longer starting if in fact they are even here.