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View Full Version : The Real Story of Last Nights Game: Hint.... Its not about Big Ben


dcsteel5804
12-20-2011, 07:59 AM
The Steelers lost last night, 20 -3. So that means Big Ben must have really stunk it up out there, right? Well, that's mostly true. He through 3 interceptions and fumbled once. I don't know what it would take to teach this guy to throw the ball away. Even with a high ankle sprain and extremely limited mobility, the guy was holding the ball to long in certain situations.

But, in my humble opinion, that was not the real story of the game. We all knew that Ben was hurt and wasn't going to play very well. We knew he'd be limited in what he would be able to do. The real story to me was the defense. Coming into the game, they must not have gotten the memo that there was a good chance they'd have to play a spectacular game to help this team pull one out. Too bad, because this was definitely a winnable game

After the first interception thrown, The 49ers had the ball at around their own 30 yard line. Well to me, that's like decent kick off return starting field position. and we let them go on down and score a field goal. Probably should have been a touchdown if Alex Smith had any real skill. Basically the same sequence of events happened on the drive for both teams.

Now giving up only 6 points after two turnovers doesn't sound that bad right?? WRONG!! Because its the way they gave the 49ers yardage. They were not letting them run too well, but dang it if they weren't 10 yards of the receivers on obvious passing downs. They allowed them to convert third down throw after third down throw. Not to mention there was ABSOLUTELY NO PRESSURE ON ALEX SMITH THE ENTIRE GAME. I mean, CSI wouldn't have been able to prove he had been in a football game last night, he was untoched by an Steelers all night and didn't hit the ground but maybe twice. Compare that with how we played against the Patriots and it makes you sick. We have the talent on this team to cover New England and its receivers and tightends, but not San Frans??? Give me a break!!

To win the game, the defense would have had to play lights out, create some turnovers, create some pressure and they just didn't, and that really makes me sick in my stomach. Where was the blitz, where was the press coverage. You don't create turnovers by not pressuring a guy. But I guess we should not question the genius that is Lebeau.... Well I WILL. Why does this guy pick certain games to just shrivle his little baby nuts up into its shell and play scared. Similar to the game against freakin Tyler Palko, where we almost lost to the Chiefs because we let that bum sit back there and throw passes to open guys.

I dont know, maybe you guys saw something different, but that defensive performance sucked. I know the offense was bad, but we knew it would be bad. They scored most of their points of turnovers, we had no turnovers and never gave our offense a short field. We started inside the 20 on 90 percent of our drives, with a gimp at QB, not a formula for success. The defense needed to hand the offense points on a silver platter, and they just didnt. More thoughts to come later, but let me know what you guys think, thanks.

kirklandrules
12-20-2011, 08:27 AM
I don't think the defense played all that bad. Yes, they allowed drives to continue and didn't get off the field in short order. However, they kept the home team from the endzone until a fumble at about their own 20. I believe this game would have been totally different had the 2 first half INTs not been thrown. For the first 3 quarters, 3 turnovers and only 13 points allowed in a road game isn't all that bad. You have to go to the source, and that was the turnovers. Had the offense converted some of those drives that resulted in turnovers into points, the pressure would have been on the 49ers and Smith ... and they would have been prone to turn the ball over. A team that only scores 3 points in the NFL is going to lose, then add in 4 turnovers ... sounds like a problem with the offense to me. :noidea:

plenewken
12-20-2011, 08:42 AM
When the O of a pretender to the #1 seed in the AFC can only score 3 friggin' points and turns the ball over 4 times, it is directly responsible for the loss, period.
No need to talk about the D. They did their job, limiting the 49ers to 20pts under these circumstances.

TRH
12-20-2011, 08:49 AM
there were a few stories last night, but the biggest one for me was the fact our defense COULD NOT get to the QB. That was extremely frustrating to watch him drop back time and time and time again and not be touched. And our defense is supposed to be so great. Bah.
The truth is....that without Harrison in there....our pass rush STINKS. I was unimpressed by their QB who threw quite a few lousy balls last night. If that was an accurate QB last night, we would REALLY got creamed, much worse than we did.

defence
12-20-2011, 08:58 AM
The Steelers lost last night, 20 -3. So that means Big Ben must have really stunk it up out there, right? Well, that's mostly true. He through 3 interceptions and fumbled once. I don't know what it would take to teach this guy to throw the ball away. Even with a high ankle sprain and extremely limited mobility, the guy was holding the ball to long in certain situations.

But, in my humble opinion, that was not the real story of the game. We all knew that Ben was hurt and wasn't going to play very well. We knew he'd be limited in what he would be able to do. The real story to me was the defense. Coming into the game, they must not have gotten the memo that there was a good chance they'd have to play a spectacular game to help this team pull one out. Too bad, because this was definitely a winnable game

After the first interception thrown, The 49ers had the ball at around their own 30 yard line. Well to me, that's like decent kick off return starting field position. and we let them go on down and score a field goal. Probably should have been a touchdown if Alex Smith had any real skill. Basically the same sequence of events happened on the drive for both teams.

Now giving up only 6 points after two turnovers doesn't sound that bad right?? WRONG!! Because its the way they gave the 49ers yardage. They were not letting them run too well, but dang it if they weren't 10 yards of the receivers on obvious passing downs. They allowed them to convert third down throw after third down throw. Not to mention there was ABSOLUTELY NO PRESSURE ON ALEX SMITH THE ENTIRE GAME. I mean, CSI wouldn't have been able to prove he had been in a football game last night, he was untoched by an Steelers all night and didn't hit the ground but maybe twice. Compare that with how we played against the Patriots and it makes you sick. We have the talent on this team to cover New England and its receivers and tightends, but not San Frans??? Give me a break!!

To win the game, the defense would have had to play lights out, create some turnovers, create some pressure and they just didn't, and that really makes me sick in my stomach. Where was the blitz, where was the press coverage. You don't create turnovers by not pressuring a guy. But I guess we should not question the genius that is Lebeau.... Well I WILL. Why does this guy pick certain games to just shrivle his little baby nuts up into its shell and play scared. Similar to the game against freakin Tyler Palko, where we almost lost to the Chiefs because we let that bum sit back there and throw passes to open guys.

I dont know, maybe you guys saw something different, but that defensive performance sucked. I know the offense was bad, but we knew it would be bad. They scored most of their points of turnovers, we had no turnovers and never gave our offense a short field. We started inside the 20 on 90 percent of our drives, with a gimp at QB, not a formula for success. The defense needed to hand the offense points on a silver platter, and they just didnt. More thoughts to come later, but let me know what you guys think, thanks.

I agree100 % of everything u said here bud!!! I know the offence (ben in particular) played poorly; but u are bang on!! Opening drive 17 plays!! Cmon; 17 frikin plays and it should have been 7 not 3 had there qb not miss a wide open receiver in the endzone!! Isn't san fran ranked 30 something in the nfl in total offence?? I'm not a numbers guy; but i will say our d is way overrated and everyone can talk about there number 1 against the pass!! They are not very good this year!!

fortmemphis
12-20-2011, 09:00 AM
The Steelers lost last night, 20 -3. So that means Big Ben must have really stunk it up out there, right? Well, that's mostly true. He through 3 interceptions and fumbled once. I don't know what it would take to teach this guy to throw the ball away. Even with a high ankle sprain and extremely limited mobility, the guy was holding the ball to long in certain situations.

But, in my humble opinion, that was not the real story of the game. We all knew that Ben was hurt and wasn't going to play very well. We knew he'd be limited in what he would be able to do. The real story to me was the defense. Coming into the game, they must not have gotten the memo that there was a good chance they'd have to play a spectacular game to help this team pull one out. Too bad, because this was definitely a winnable game

After the first interception thrown, The 49ers had the ball at around their own 30 yard line. Well to me, that's like decent kick off return starting field position. and we let them go on down and score a field goal. Probably should have been a touchdown if Alex Smith had any real skill. Basically the same sequence of events happened on the drive for both teams.

Now giving up only 6 points after two turnovers doesn't sound that bad right?? WRONG!! Because its the way they gave the 49ers yardage. They were not letting them run too well, but dang it if they weren't 10 yards of the receivers on obvious passing downs. They allowed them to convert third down throw after third down throw. Not to mention there was ABSOLUTELY NO PRESSURE ON ALEX SMITH THE ENTIRE GAME. I mean, CSI wouldn't have been able to prove he had been in a football game last night, he was untoched by an Steelers all night and didn't hit the ground but maybe twice. Compare that with how we played against the Patriots and it makes you sick. We have the talent on this team to cover New England and its receivers and tightends, but not San Frans??? Give me a break!!

To win the game, the defense would have had to play lights out, create some turnovers, create some pressure and they just didn't, and that really makes me sick in my stomach. Where was the blitz, where was the press coverage. You don't create turnovers by not pressuring a guy. But I guess we should not question the genius that is Lebeau.... Well I WILL. Why does this guy pick certain games to just shrivle his little baby nuts up into its shell and play scared. Similar to the game against freakin Tyler Palko, where we almost lost to the Chiefs because we let that bum sit back there and throw passes to open guys.

I dont know, maybe you guys saw something different, but that defensive performance sucked. I know the offense was bad, but we knew it would be bad. They scored most of their points of turnovers, we had no turnovers and never gave our offense a short field. We started inside the 20 on 90 percent of our drives, with a gimp at QB, not a formula for success. The defense needed to hand the offense points on a silver platter, and they just didnt. More thoughts to come later, but let me know what you guys think, thanks.

I was thinking the same. SF didnt do anything spectacular. They were scared that we would kill Alex Smith, so they made a running game out of the short dink and dunk passes. And we fell right into it. We played 8-9 yards off the receiver at the line. Well the play was over right there. No way our CBs could close fast enough to stop it and Smith was getting rid of the ball in less than 2 secs.

We came up to the line and harrassed the NE receivers but we couldnt do the same against a mediocre QB in Alex Smith. We made Smith look like a pro bowl QB at times.

But all that being said, turning the ball over 4 times and having all the turnovers lead to points simply destroys any chance we had to win the game. The defense got some 3 and outs and forced some punts, but then the offense came in. They would move the ball down to the 25-30yd line and proceed to shoot themselves in the foot.

SF definitely has a good defense. And last night, they wanted that game so badly--so so badly. But realize, SF just lost to Arizona--Arizona!!! Arizona is okay but it is disturbing that Arizona could beat SF and all we could produce was a 51 yard FG that barely made it thru the uprights.

Honestly, would a mobile Charlie Batch, after a couple series to get his legs up under him, been better for us last night? I just dont know. Ben threw some bad balls and missed some receivers. All turnovers can be attributed to Ben. That decision is on Tomlin. It is his job to put the person who best gives the team a chance to win on the field. Last night, I dont know if he did that.

TRH
12-20-2011, 09:02 AM
I think its time to face the facts and stop hiding. Our "blitzing" just plain isn't that good anymore. The only times we get pass pressure at all anymore is when:
1. Harrison plays
2. when Gay safety blitzes
3. And when Woodley plays dominant. But the problem is Woodley plays in "flashes" of greatness, not all the time. He's about a 60%-er.

magnus0211
12-20-2011, 09:10 AM
You can blame the offense all you want, and yes they were a large part of last night's performance. However, the real reason is the same as always. We got out coached on both sides of the ball! It's the coachs' job to put the team in the best position to succeed and they just don't do that. Obviously, Roethlisberger was going to have limited mobility so our offensive game plan should have been a quick short passing game (which we proved we could do successfully earlier in the year... anyone remember how good we looked against the Titans?) But we have an OC that's as stubborn as they come, and will continue to run what we do (a vertical passing game) regardless of the opponent or circumstance. Just let our hobbled QB run on that bad ankle to prolong a play while our receivers fun 20 yd routes on a 3rd and 2. Genius! It doesn't help that our qb is just as stubborn if not more so. Defensively, we were going to have to play more aggressive to cause some turnovers without Harrison and a less than 100% Woodley bringing pressure. As stated above, if we could play bump and run against the Pats (with a far superior qb in Brady), why is it we decided to go against it against a West Coast offense? Hard to jump routes when playing 10 yds off receivers with no pressure on a qb . Just as we did against the Pats, I would have preferred to play more out of our nickel packages with more DBs or safetys to avoid having our LBs like Farrior or Timmons in coverage. We could have supplied that needed pressure blitzing our those MLBs and let our secondary do their job. Oh, also really glad we saved that timeout before the half.... how many times have we seen that before? Just another example of a poorly coached game.

Curtain_of_Steel
12-20-2011, 09:27 AM
Ben played bad no doubt.

I agree Magnus, thats what I hav ebeen saying, every 3 and short we played twice the yardage they needed at least, off the line. Are they retarded? This isn't the first time we did this, we do this a lot, than scratch our heads why they got the 1st down.

To say we got out coached is an understatement, but that also shows you how bad our coaches are. Perhaps they should stop worrying about tossing harrison under the bus in the media and worry about the game at hand. Outc oached 3 times by whiney little girls names Harbaugh. Tomlin should have to wear a dress home and to practice all week. But he ir probably drafting his next news release on Harrison and how the Steelers may not let him play this week.

dcsteel5804
12-20-2011, 09:33 AM
All excellent points by you guys, and one of the things brought up with the pass rush minus Harrison and Woodley. Didn't we spend 2 first round picks on DE's? I know, I know, everyone always says a DE in a 3-4 is supposed to occupy blockers so the LB's can make plays, but for cryin out loud, and one of these guys get some freakin pressure. Where's Ziggy? Where's Kiesel, Heyward, or Mclendon? I mean, I don't expect much from hamton, we all no he's no a pass rusher, but where are these other guys. For first round picks, I want a guy who can do both. If we're gonna play coverage all day, we need to generate a rush with 4 guys, you know, kind of like to SF did. The defense just did not cut it last night. The coaching strategy on both sides sucked. I dont know what else to say.... Oh yeah, Ben did suck too.

Rick5895
12-20-2011, 09:42 AM
UMMMM!!!!!! The defense did not lose this game, in what world does a D allow less than 300 yards, limit the opposition to a "mere" 20 points off of 4 turnovers and have to take the blame for a loss when the O manages to score only 3 stinkin points. The 49ers didn't do anything special, but what they did they executed very well, didn't really take any drive stopping penalties and played within themselves.
Once again, we have an offensive game plan that throws the ball more,than twice the rush attempts with a hobbled QB, a game plan that refuses to continue with quick passes and forces our QB ( I am sure some of it is Ben's fault too) to throw deep crossing routes and search for the "home run" ball. On our opening drive Ben throws a pic in the red zone,later Brown drops a quick slant that looked like it would have been a TD, this happened before we were down 6-0, it should have been 14 - 3 at the half for us, not a 6-0 deficit.
Did we play our best game on D, NO, but they aren't to blame for the loss!!

PatsFan09
12-20-2011, 10:36 AM
Wow, you guys are kind of harsh. Your defense only gave up 20 points. That's not bad, especially without Harrison on the field. The Steelers have won every game their offense put up more than 20 points & lost 4 out of 7 when they didn't.

Solution, score 21 points or better each week & win! Big Ben couldn't put any weight on his plant foot, so obviously he was not going to have a great day. He probably shouldn't have played. If he keeps the injury from healing he could be an immobile QB who can't put any weight on his plant foot throughout the playoffs. That is a pretty big disadvantage for one of the most dangerous guys on the run to ever play the game!

So, do you settle for a wildcard spot and take a 100% healthy Ben on the road to the SB, or... Do you go for the #1 seed, which you can ONLY secure IF Baltimore loses again, (their last 2 games aren't too tough, although KC didn't look too tough either)... AND.... the Pat's lose one of their final 2 games vs. Buffalo or Miami. Even though both teams are at 5-9, they ARE capable of beating the Pat's. Buffalo did it already this season & Miami is just better than their record shows. In their last 7 they've gone 5-2. It helps some that both are home games for the Pat's

Going for it puts Ben in position to get himself more hurt than he is now. He can't really scramble at all, so he is a sitting duck. Yes, he's PLENTY tough, but any one big hit can do damage. Also, how will his sprain heal if he keeps playing on it?

(Side Note: On big hits.... How about that hit by Elvis on Brady? WOOOW ! I couldn't believe he popped back up like he did AND continued to play great the rest of the game. All the crap people like to say about him being a p*ssy & a whiner etc. You have to give him some props for him popping right up and not just going right back to the game. That was the cleanest hit I've seen on a QB in , well, maybe ever. I'm glad no flag was thrown. Nothing was done wrong, but refs whip them things out almost every time a QB gets hit, clean or not.)

The 3rd option which just popped into my head is putting in Batch. You could probably still win against tomato cans like 2-12 Rams & the 4-10 Browns. Then that way you are still in position for the #1 seed IF Baltimore loses one of their final games, which could possibly happen, especially against the Bengals.

Either way, we could see a rematch between the Pat's & Steelers in the AFCCG. Only question now is where??? I can't imagine it would turn out as lopsided as the 1st one, or at least I hope not. That was one of the worst Pat's game of the Brady era. They scored 17, but it somehow felt like a shutout

Until then.....................

Rotorhead
12-20-2011, 11:00 AM
Actually this loss should be 100% on the coaches and Vets. This was the most pathetic game plan i have ever seen. How does this QB that gets sacked 9+ times in 2 games barely get touched this game? Answer: terrible def gameplan. How the hell do we not max protect our QB who is hobbled? Answer: terrible off gameplan. How the hell does a team of vets come out this flat when they know whats on the line. We were handed the #1 seed on a silver platter and the coaches couldnt motivate these guy to play better than that turd they laid out there. Absolutely zero fire in anyone except Clark.

lipps83
12-20-2011, 11:28 AM
I think its time to face the facts and stop hiding. Our "blitzing" just plain isn't that good anymore. The only times we get pass pressure at all anymore is when:
1. Harrison plays
2. when Gay safety blitzes
3. And when Woodley plays dominant. But the problem is Woodley plays in "flashes" of greatness, not all the time. He's about a 60%-er.

Now that you mention it, I agree.

Everyone harps on the offense even when they play decent (which is rare these days) and the defense always gets a pass, no matter how poorly they played.

I, for one, AM tired of our db's playing far off the receivers. I understand they are trying to keep everything in front of them to avoid the big play. I would rather sacrifice the possibility of a big play happening instead of always giving them the shorter stuff which allows horrible teams, like the Chiefs and Palko, to march down the field until we decide to 'tighten up' near the end zone.

And where has the pressure been all season long? It seems we can expect a good blitz only once or twice a half. We give the opposing QB all day long to find an open guy instead of forcing them to make a decision and hopefully a bad one.

Turnovers are down because there is no pressure. The QB doesn't have to worry about it.

Fire Arians
12-20-2011, 11:31 AM
If you turn the ball over 4 times you ain't gonna beat anybody

BKAnthem
12-20-2011, 11:57 AM
Still don't understand why Ben was playing when you have a proven veteran backup QB on your Bench

ClosetSteelerFan
12-20-2011, 12:03 PM
The San Francisco 49er quarterback should be no stranger to sports fans; but as I watched last night's game, I couldn't think of what college team he played for, so I checked the internet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alex_Smith

He's a Urban Meyer product, and in 2005, Alex lead his undefeated Utah team to a 35-7 Fiesta Bowl victory over the University of Pittsburgh. After that Urban became the head coach at the University of Florida, and Alex Smith was the 1st overall pick in the NFL Draft (ahead of a guy named Aaron Rogers).
His pro career was plagued with injuries and many different coaching philosophies..... yet Alex survived, and has finally blossomed in the NFL. Is he as good as Big Ben? I don't think so; but his offensive coordinator uses all of the tools he has at his disposal, and San Francisco has a plethora of that.
So stop the complaining,and Tuesday morning quarterbacking.... with a healthy Ben, we're a different team. Don't blame the defense.... they hung in there until late in the game.

Closet Steelers Fan

FanSince72
12-20-2011, 12:25 PM
UMMMM!!!!!! The defense did not lose this game, in what world does a D allow less than 300 yards, limit the opposition to a "mere" 20 points off of 4 turnovers and have to take the blame for a loss when the O manages to score only 3 stinkin points. The 49ers didn't do anything special, but what they did they executed very well, didn't really take any drive stopping penalties and played within themselves.
Once again, we have an offensive game plan that throws the ball more,than twice the rush attempts with a hobbled QB, a game plan that refuses to continue with quick passes and forces our QB ( I am sure some of it is Ben's fault too) to throw deep crossing routes and search for the "home run" ball. On our opening drive Ben throws a pic in the red zone,later Brown drops a quick slant that looked like it would have been a TD, this happened before we were down 6-0, it should have been 14 - 3 at the half for us, not a 6-0 deficit.
Did we play our best game on D, NO, but they aren't to blame for the loss!!


I agree!

The only thing I'd add is that Ben was way more hurt than I had been led to believe and that he probably should not have played at all or should at least have been pulled in the second half.

But on the subject of Ben in general, last night was a demonstration of just how much his mobility factors into our offense overall. On at least a dozen plays, there were situations where a healthy Ben could have either extended the play by scrambling or gained yardage by running. On at least a dozen MORE plays, there were instances where he wanted to move to avoid defenders or to simply enlarge the pocket and he couldn't do that. Then on at least another dozen pass attempts, he was not able to plant onto his left foot to step into a throw and was instead "flipping" the ball and his accuracy was severely affected by that.

To me, when Ben is healthy it's like listening to music in surround sound whereas last night it was like listening through a 2-inch speaker in a clock radio.
His mobility is essential to this team's offensive success and his lack of mobility made our offense about as dynamic as something drawn on a blackboard.

The "play through pain" thing may make for great stories and plays to the ego of the sport and the fans but it also has its limits and last night was a perfect example of that. If we are to have ANY success in the post-season, Ben needs to be healthy and I think that he should sit until he is. Right now, I doubt we're looking at anything better than a five-seed and if sitting him for two weeks gets us a six-seed -- then what's the difference?

If we continue to play him and even if by some miracle Baltimore hits a slump and we end up with a bye, it won't be enough because he won't be near 100% and we need him at , or very close to, 100% if we're to have any chance going deep into the post-season or to the SB.

lipps83
12-20-2011, 12:31 PM
Still don't understand why Ben was playing when you have a proven veteran backup QB on your Bench

Because Batch is horrible and fragile? I was surprised he didn't get knocked out for the year last week when he played after Ben went out.

He only has a job on this team because he is a local guy.

They are afraid of him throwing the ball.

Opt2loc
12-20-2011, 12:42 PM
Because Batch is horrible and fragile? I was surprised he didn't get knocked out for the year last week when he played after Ben went out.

He only has a job on this team because he is a local guy.

They are afraid of him throwing the ball.

As soon as ben threw the first pick he should have been benched. The only thing he was bound to accomplish last night was making his injury worse. Not very bright.

FanSince72
12-20-2011, 01:01 PM
As soon as ben threw the first pick he should have been benched. The only thing he was bound to accomplish last night was making his injury worse. Not very bright.

I hate to say it, but you're absolutely right.

I don't believe that SF is is so good that Batch or Dixon couldn't have handled them.
But playing Ben made them look a whole lot better and probably made Ben's leg a whole lot worse.

Opt2loc
12-20-2011, 01:14 PM
I hate to say it, but you're absolutely right.

I don't believe that SF is is so good that Batch or Dixon couldn't have handled them.
But playing Ben made them look a whole lot better and probably made Ben's leg a whole lot worse.


The main thing that would bother me if I were a Steeler fan is that he set himself up to be out for the season. Then what are you going to do? I realize how nice it would be to win the division, get home field and all that but the fact that he was left in for the whole game as bad as it was going for him. It was so obvoius watching him hobble around that he was in no shape to be productive. You already had a playoff berth locked up. Luckily it looks like he didn't injure himself any worse.

MDSteel15
12-20-2011, 01:18 PM
As soon as ben threw the first pick he should have been benched. The only thing he was bound to accomplish last night was making his injury worse. Not very bright.

I only aggree that Ben shouldn't have been out there. BUT the first pick, well lets see, if the idiot TE Johnson sticks his hands out and catches the ball we are at least 1st and Goal! 10% Bens fault for who he threw to...

The Second INT, isn't it said if the balls in your handds it should be caught? Heath was stretched out to the limit but he did have his hands there... so I'll go 50/50 on that!

Third one, I missed due to a bathroom break so I can't comment! But the coaching staff nas to have BALLS and sit Ben if he flipping hurt! Every other player does.... :banging:

FanSince72
12-20-2011, 01:22 PM
I only aggree that Ben shouldn't have been out there. BUT the first pick, well lets see, if the idiot TE Johnson sticks his hands out and catches the ball we are at least 1st and Goal! 10% Bens fault for who he threw to...

The Second INT, isn't it said if the balls in your handds it should be caught? Heath was stretched out to the limit but he did have his hands there... so I'll go 50/50 on that!

Third one, I missed due to a bathroom break so I can't comment! But the coaching staff nas to have BALLS and sit Ben if he flipping hurt! Every other player does.... :banging:

I was fine with that pick (picks happen) but after the first half, I think it was pretty obvious that Ben was not "Ben" and I would have pulled him for the second half.

lipps83
12-20-2011, 01:28 PM
I hate to say it, but you're absolutely right.

I don't believe that SF is is so good that Batch or Dixon couldn't have handled them.
But playing Ben made them look a whole lot better and probably made Ben's leg a whole lot worse.

I think you are overestimating the ability of this team without Ben and underestimating the 49'ers overall.

They had to give it a go with Ben. They had virtually no choice given the circumstances.

No matter how much you want to spin it, the Harbaugh's are some pretty damn good coaches.

Opt2loc
12-20-2011, 01:33 PM
I think you are overestimating the ability of this team without Ben and underestimating the 49'ers overall.

They had to give it a go with Ben. They had virtually no choice given the circumstances.

No matter how much you want to spin it, the Harbaugh's are some pretty damn good coaches.


Give it a go, sure. Not the whole game.

PeRK82
12-20-2011, 01:39 PM
As soon as ben threw the first pick he should have been benched. The only thing he was bound to accomplish last night was making his injury worse. Not very bright.


Hate to say it but Steelers were still in it until the field goal flag and then they ended up scoring. That sealed the deal.
Every team's Defense has an off day, RAVENS did Sunday night. It is what it is.

But i wont talk crap or anything because i know how much i hate it when my team loses.

As long as the RAVENS get the 2nd or 1st seed and the STEELERS still make it into the playoffs and win to be able to meet the RAVENS i will be happy. As much as i hate the steelers, i wouldnt have it any other way in the play off scenario, as long as its at the BANK this time.

I personally think you guys need to rest Ben for the Playoffs or atleast for the RAMS game, just my opinion. As long as you guys are the 5th seed and RAVENS are 2nd, if the RAVENS some how are the 1st seed then i hope the Steelers are the 6th seed. So it will be an almost guarantee for a RAVEN/STEELERS Division play off. I dont see the Steelers losing to DENVER or TEXANS in the play offs.

tanda10506
12-20-2011, 01:41 PM
The receivers are at fault for the int's also. The defense was giving Alex Smith a cushion like the one they used to always give Brady. Even bad qb's at the NFL level can complete 3-10 yard open passes all day. The niners wouldn't have got 20 if the offense would have done their job on a few drives and took some time off the clock. This defense does play good enough to win games, but they just aren't exceptional like the prior years. No turnovers, no qb pressure, inconsistant defensive schemes like giving a no name QB a 10 yard cushion, all those things will make it hard to win in the playoffs unless the offense really shows up.

Bayz101
12-20-2011, 01:51 PM
The defense wasn't perfect, but they did a good job. They held a talented offense to just 6 points for thirty minutes, and our offense couldn't capitalize on that. At some point you can work, and work and work. But if your not getting paid, your not going to work as hard, am I right?

austinfrench76
12-20-2011, 01:51 PM
The defense WAS that bad and no one stepped up for their QB! NO ONE! Dropped balls and passes going through hands. That all leads to bad things that get compounded when you turn the ball over 4 times. The D couldn't get off the field all night. Bad game, chalk it up to that and move on. Rest the wounded and get ready for a 5 seed.

Bayz101
12-20-2011, 01:54 PM
If you turn the ball over 4 times you ain't gonna beat anybody

One of those was a Hail Mary and the other was after the game had already been decided.

dcsteel5804
12-20-2011, 01:56 PM
Look, I understand that Ben played bad. I understand that he probably should have been benched. I understand he turned it over 4 times. In all, it was too much for the defense to overcome. My point is that WE ALL KNEW BEN WAS GONNA BE BAD. Everyone in the stadium knew that if we were gonna win, the defense would have to do something special, and the bottom line is that they didn't. They allowed SF to convert on nearly 60% of third downs. How can you overlook that?! They got no sacks!! Baltimore got 9! How can you over look that?! They got no turnovers. They allowed San Fran to convert 3rd and longs. They played 10 yards off the receivers all night.

I believe we could have come closer to winning if our D would have shown up big but again, they didnt. They weren't bad or horrible, they just weren't exceptional, and they had to be.

SteelCurtainCall
12-20-2011, 03:15 PM
This is my first post, but I've been a Steeler fan since the late 60's. I've lived and died with them, and always will. We rose to prominence in the 70's with a combonation of killer defense, and finally getting some great O players. Since then , we have been enjoying what is usually a great D, year after year. We've seen some O situations kind of come and go, but the D has, for the most part; done it's job well.

I can't understand how we can't solve our O line problems, and get the blocking schemes down to kick our running game back into gear. I know Ben is a unique QB to block for, and it's not easy to do so, but the designed running play blocking is awful too. We had total control of the 2nd Ravens game, and couldn't even come up with a first down to close them out? That's not the Steelers I've followed all these years.

Yes Ben makes mistakes, and they chap my butt when they come out of nowhere, but my biggest concern is that our D is just not what we've all grown accustom to. That 92 yard Raven drive hit me square between the eyes. Like mentioned in this thread already; the D played 10 yards off the receivers, and still Holt got behind Gay for the winning score. The only way the birds could win was with a TD, and the Steelers gave it up. That was the lowest point for me this year with our D. I also have seen here were some say Ben is holding us back,ect. Remember, it was the D that let Fitzgerald loose for what looked to be the winning SB score, until Ben drove them right at 90 yards down the field to win with the toss to Holmes.

Ben is an elite QB in my opinion, but we're just facing some challenges in several different areas. The team is getting older(some of the key players), and they are getting injured more often than before. I've seen some bad lapses at safety this year, and Troy has always come thru before; we're just used to stellar play every year, and we may be coming to a crossroads here. I'm like you all; I bleed black and gold, and I'm going to continue to believe. I look forward to interacting with you all.
John Sr. :tt:

StainlessStill
12-20-2011, 03:32 PM
We did blitz. We did try to run our famous A gap, Cross-X'ing stunts. Thing is, the 49'ers picked it all up and had a flawless, west-coast attack on us while we played on our toes the entire night. The 9'ers had balance and it showed big time. Totally threw us off our game, especially on third downs (and it was STILL a tight ball game for the majority.)

They picked up our blitzing schemes and counter-acted it with a short, quick underneath game that worked endlessly against our soft-zones and 12 yard cushions. It's very hard to create pressure and dial up blitzes when the QB is getting rid of the ball as soon as our blitzers reach the line of scrimmage. Credit San Fran, they out played, out witted and certainly out coached us. We just got our ASS kicked!

stb_steeler
12-20-2011, 03:46 PM
You could see the patience in the 9ers play......Steelers looked like they had to hurry up and go for the long ball all night.

TRH
12-20-2011, 03:49 PM
We did blitz. We did try to run our famous A gap, Cross-X'ing stunts. Thing is, the 49'ers picked it all up and had a flawless, west-coast attack on us while we played on our toes the entire night. The 9'ers had balance and it showed big time. Totally threw us off our game, especially on third downs (and it was STILL a tight ball game for the majority.)

They picked up our blitzing schemes and counter-acted it with a short, quick underneath game that worked endlessly against our soft-zones and 12 yard cushions. It's very hard to create pressure and dial up blitzes when the QB is getting rid of the ball as soon as our blitzers reach the line of scrimmage. Credit San Fran, they out played, out witted and certainly out coached us. We just got our ASS kicked!

Exactly.
Another thing we don't do and i don't understand is quick snap counts like Brady does.
Everybody screams for the 'no-huddle' but we don't make it count. Even when we do it....Ben just stands back there and the play count winds down 4, 3, 2 1, SNAP....why the hell do we even do the no-huddle then? you might as well not even do it.
Do a no-huddle, then do a quick snap. But nooooooooooooooooooo....
We just stand there and let them all get settled and have their best look at our offense lining up.
It completely makes ZERO sense.

plenewken
12-20-2011, 04:24 PM
Exactly.
Another thing we don't do and i don't understand is quick snap counts like Brady does.
Everybody screams for the 'no-huddle' but we don't make it count. Even when we do it....Ben just stands back there and the play count winds down 4, 3, 2 1, SNAP....why the hell do we even do the no-huddle then? you might as well not even do it.
Do a no-huddle, then do a quick snap. But nooooooooooooooooooo....
We just stand there and let them all get settled and have their best look at our offense lining up.
It completely makes ZERO sense.

Very true. I don't get this no-huddle with normal count crap either.

FanSince72
12-20-2011, 04:30 PM
Exactly.
Another thing we don't do and i don't understand is quick snap counts like Brady does.
Everybody screams for the 'no-huddle' but we don't make it count. Even when we do it....Ben just stands back there and the play count winds down 4, 3, 2 1, SNAP....why the hell do we even do the no-huddle then? you might as well not even do it.
Do a no-huddle, then do a quick snap. But nooooooooooooooooooo....
We just stand there and let them all get settled and have their best look at our offense lining up.
It completely makes ZERO sense.


Oh man! You just read my mind!

I was thinking that while I was watching the game.
I thought that SF doesn't have to anticipate a snap count, all they have to do is watch the play clock and start moving at 2 or 1.

But I think a lot of that has to do with "who" Ben is.

He's not a chess player and doesn't seem too interested in things like deceptions and clever use of snap counts and other such things.
Like his overall build, Ben is all about physicality and simply being better than someone else and that's his mindset.

I don't think he really cares about cleverness when brute force or skill or sheer willpower can work and that's how he sees it.
If that's true, then we're stuck with it because that's something he's learned and it's what got him here and it's too late to change him now.

Kanata-Steeler
12-20-2011, 04:41 PM
The Steelers lost last night, 20 -3. So that means Big Ben must have really stunk it up out there, right? Well, that's ABSOLUTELY true. He through 3 interceptions and fumbled once.

WRONG, it amounted to 4 TURNOVERS, count them bud, 4 TUROVERS, by BEN.

I don't know what it would take to teach this guy to throw the ball away. Even with a high ankle sprain and extremely limited mobility, the guy was holding the ball to long in certain situations.
ummmm DUYHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

But, in my humble opinion, that was not the real story of the game. We all knew that Ben was hurt and wasn't going to play very well. We knew he'd be limited in what he would be able to do. The real story to me was the defense. Coming into the game, they must not have gotten the memo that there was a good chance they'd have to play a spectacular game to help this team pull one out. Too bad, because this was definitely a winnable game

After the first interception thrown, The 49ers had the ball at around their own 30 yard line. Well to me, that's like decent kick off return starting field position. and we let them go on down and score a field goal. Probably should have been a touchdown if Alex Smith had any real skill. Basically the same sequence of events happened on the drive for both teams.

Now giving up only 6 points after two turnovers doesn't sound that bad right?? WRONG!! Because its the way they gave the 49ers yardage. They were not letting them run too well, but dang it if they weren't 10 yards of the receivers on obvious passing downs. They allowed them to convert third down throw after third down throw. Not to mention there was ABSOLUTELY NO PRESSURE ON ALEX SMITH THE ENTIRE GAME. I mean, CSI wouldn't have been able to prove he had been in a football game last night, he was untoched by an Steelers all night and didn't hit the ground but maybe twice. Compare that with how we played against the Patriots and it makes you sick. We have the talent on this team to cover New England and its receivers and tightends, but not San Frans??? Give me a break!!

To win the game, the defense would have had to play lights out, create some turnovers, create some pressure and they just didn't, and that really makes me sick in my stomach. Where was the blitz, where was the press coverage. You don't create turnovers by not pressuring a guy. But I guess we should not question the genius that is Lebeau.... Well I WILL. Why does this guy pick certain games to just shrivle his little baby nuts up into its shell and play scared. Similar to the game against freakin Tyler Palko, where we almost lost to the Chiefs because we let that bum sit back there and throw passes to open guys.

I dont know, maybe you guys saw something different, but that defensive performance sucked. I know the offense was bad, but we knew it would be bad. They scored most of their points of turnovers, we had no turnovers and never gave our offense a short field. We started inside the 20 on 90 percent of our drives, with a gimp at QB, not a formula for success. The defense needed to hand the offense points on a silver platter, and they just didnt. More thoughts to come later, but let me know what you guys think, thanks.

Sir, you are either an trolling instigator, or just out of your mind. !!!
Ben himsself said "...I was the best player for the 49'ers..."
nuff said.
....
I love Ben, but why do you ppl, consistently try to imagine anything remotely different about last NITE ! ?
It's boggling to say the least.
Ben should NOT have even played, we played him and it was an UTTER-Catastrophic gamble.
you wanna blame the DEFENSE. ???!!!

NO TEAM really SURVIVES 4 TURNOVERS by an offense (and yes they were ALL on BEN).
Don't blame the DEFENSE. Blame our idiotic Coach and senile Rooney for gambling with their severely INJURED Franchise investment.
-case closed already.
You guys need glasses when you watch these games .
omfg !

Get OVER it !
Lets get goin' on the next games, which we NEED to win straight out.
The only"Real story" here, is that this thread is UNREAL and suitable for IGNORING !
end of story.
:tt04:

OX1947
12-20-2011, 04:46 PM
Ben will need to learn to throw the ball away. For his health and the health of his team. Ben can win staying in the pocket, he isnt tebow. This is where Tomlin needs to stop with the eliquent quotes and sit his guy down and coach him. Enough is enough.

dcsteel5804
12-20-2011, 06:10 PM
Sir, you are either an trolling instigator, or just out of your mind. !!!
Ben himsself said "...I was the best player for the 49'ers..."
nuff said.
....
I love Ben, but why do you ppl, consistently try to imagine anything remotely different about last NITE ! ?
It's boggling to say the least.
Ben should NOT have even played, we played him and it was an UTTER-Catastrophic gamble.
you wanna blame the DEFENSE. ???!!!

NO TEAM really SURVIVES 4 TURNOVERS by an offense (and yes they were ALL on BEN).
Don't blame the DEFENSE. Blame our idiotic Coach and senile Rooney for gambling with their severely INJURED Franchise investment.
-case closed already.
You guys need glasses when you watch these games .
omfg !

Get OVER it !
Lets get goin' on the next games, which we NEED to win straight out.
The only"Real story" here, is that this thread is UNREAL and suitable for IGNORING !
end of story.
:tt04:

Your entitled to you opinion and I'm entitled to mine. I know Ben played a bad game, and I addressed that. I was just pointing out that our defense played below what I would have expected, knowing that we were hurting at QB.

People have said they were throwing the ball quickly, well sure, thats easy when the DB's are constantly 10 yards off the receivers. Did you ever think that thats why the bitlz didn't get there instead of the other way around? Have you ever heard of a coverage sack? You have to cover to get those. SanDiego had about 3 of em. I'm you watched that game.

I'm open to other opinions and its quite clear that you're not. Well, unfortunately for you, this is a message board, so I can state any opinion I want, and if you don't like it or agree with it, GET OVER IT (quoting you!)

SteelCurtainCall
12-20-2011, 08:33 PM
I don't sense a feeling of urgency with the Steelers this year. It's almost like they except the mediocre too easily. A team has to have a non stop hunger to be the best, to stay on top. I agree that Tomlin needs to sit the guys down, and say what needs to be said to light a fire under them. We have talented bunch at a number of key positions, and we need to play like every game is a playoff game. You see how quickly belicheck(sp?) gets rid of players that don't perform consistently. I agree with those who say that Ben shouldn't have been in there; if we can't place a BU QB on the roster that can put points on the board when he's called on; then he shouldn't be on the team. And if he is on the team; then he should be played in this type of situation. We won 3 out of 4 games when been was out last year at the beginning of the season.
John Sr.

FanSince72
12-21-2011, 09:37 AM
I think you are overestimating the ability of this team without Ben and underestimating the 49'ers overall.

They had to give it a go with Ben. They had virtually no choice given the circumstances.

No matter how much you want to spin it, the Harbaugh's are some pretty damn good coaches.

I don't think so.

Our D held SF to 6 points for most of the game. The two TD's were the result of a defense that was frustrated by the fact that no matter how hard they worked, they were back out on the field in short order to do it all over again. I don't care how good or how dedicated they may be, if the offense isn't helping it's hard to hold another team to 6 points forever.

It was pretty obvious that Ben was nowhere near as "normal" as many had said like Ed Bouchette who wrote that Ben showed, " little noticeable effects of his injury from 11 days previous" ( I think Mr. Bouchette should either get glasses for his eyes or put down the glass in his hand) and after a few series I think it was obvious that Ben had no game.

Harbaugh is indeed a good coach, but we were in that game until very late when our D simply ran out of steam. And with the whole world able to see that Ben was little more than a shell of his normal self, it didn't take a whole lot of coaching genius to figure out how to play him.

At least with Batch or Dixon, we'd have had two healthy bodies and even though neither is Ben, they at least would have had SOME mobility and a solid throwing motion. I mean, what's the better choice? A three-legged thoroughbred or a four-legged plow horse?