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View Full Version : If you doubt Ben.....


MDSteel15
12-21-2011, 02:08 PM
Find another team! So tired of all these moronic posts of "is he elite", "can he carry this team", "who would you rather have than" blah blah blah! The guy is still young, gets beat up week in and week out and there is NO OTHER QB in the league right now other than Brady that has more Super Bowl wins or appearances than Ben Roethlisberger.... PERIOD!!! Peyton - 1 win 1 loss, Eli 1 win, Brees 1 win, Rodgers 1 win.... All these so called "ELITE" QBs can't carry the mans jock with what he has to go through every week. Look how many times those QBs get sacked or knocked down compared to Ben and then complain! If you are a Steeler fan, support the man and quit crying. Without him we still have Tommy Maddox running the offense.... :banging:

theplatypus
12-21-2011, 02:21 PM
But you're missing the fact that those quarterbacks get rid of the ball with a quickness. The ball is snapped and 1- 1,000 2 - 1,000 and boom the ball is out. Ben's ankle injury and a large portion of his sacks are due to his propensity to hang onto the football. We've got 4 losses on the season and our 8 year vet qb has at least 10 turnovers in those 4 losses.

plenewken
12-21-2011, 02:26 PM
Look how many times those QBs get sacked or knocked down compared to Ben and then complain! If you are a Steeler fan, support the man and quit crying. Without him we still have Tommy Maddox running the offense.... :banging:

Check Rodgers' number of sacks and then we'll talk.
While you're at it, check also his number of TD, INT, yardage and % of completion and compare that to Ben's numbers.
Supporting the man doesn't mean being blind. There are lots of Steelers this year who are not playing great, and our $120M Ben is unfortunately one of them.

StainlessStill
12-21-2011, 03:14 PM
and our $120M Ben is unfortunately one of them.

Where in the hell do you get 120M? He signed a 100mil dollar contract years ago and it was just this last year that he restructured his contract. These threads are making us look like Raturd fans after a loss. Truly embarrassing Steelers Fever, truly embarrassing. This place in unreadable with posts like this.

Hines0wnz
12-21-2011, 03:20 PM
There are lots of Steelers this year who are not playing great, and our $120M Ben is unfortunately one of them.

Not many of those "elite" QBs play with the injuries Ben does either. In fact, there are 2 rules in the books because of one QB in particular. Ben takes shots all game long but if you touch Brady's skirt........a new rule gets invoked the following season.

theplatypus
12-21-2011, 03:22 PM
Where in the hell do you get 120M? He signed a 100mil dollar contract years ago and it was just this last year that he restructured his contract. These threads are making us look like Raturd fans after a loss. Truly embarrassing Steelers Fever, truly embarrassing. This place in unreadable with posts like this.


100million or 120million doesn't change the fact that Ben is not consistently playing good football.

StainlessStill
12-21-2011, 03:28 PM
100million or 120million doesn't change the fact that Ben is not consistently playing good football.

What? One bad game on a shattered ankle against the toughest defense to score on in the entire NFL? The Steelers were riding a 4 game winning streak, one of the hottest streaks in the league and would of been 5 if the defense would of stopped Flacco after Ben hit Wallace for the go a-head touchdown against Baltimore. Hell, the talk around the league when we beat the Pats was that Roethlisberger was having his best season ever amidst the woeful offensive line and just this past week, held the AFC's #1 seed. How easy haters will show their ugly faces after a loss.

We go as far as Ben takes us, haters. Believe it.

plenewken
12-21-2011, 03:55 PM
We go as far as Ben takes us, haters.

Really? I clearly remember the Steelers winning the Superbowl in Detroit despite him.
You're either blind, or clueless, or both ..........

theplatypus
12-21-2011, 04:01 PM
What? One bad game on a shattered ankle against the toughest defense to score on in the entire NFL? The Steelers were riding a 4 game winning streak, one of the hottest streaks in the league and would of been 5 if the defense would of stopped Flacco after Ben hit Wallace for the go a-head touchdown against Baltimore. Hell, the talk around the league when we beat the Pats was that Roethlisberger was having his best season ever amidst the woeful offensive line and just this past week, held the AFC's #1 seed. How easy haters will show their ugly faces after a loss.

We go as far as Ben takes us, haters. Believe it.


Nice try, but it's got nothing to do with hating. And it most certainly isn't one bad game, 21 td's and 14 int's is average, and it certainly isn't great.

MDSteel15
12-21-2011, 04:03 PM
Like what was said, touch any of those "Faces of the NFL" and $$$$$$ comes out your pocket! Hit Ben and no one cares but Steeler fans... Fu@& the pretty boys and those ruining the league! Ben's a throwback but with an arm! Keep it up Ben and get you THIRD ring.... :thumbsup:

MDSteel15
12-21-2011, 04:05 PM
:banging: Really? I clearly remember the Steelers winning the Superbowl in Detroit despite him.
You're either blind, or clueless, or both ..........

And they won against the Cardinals because of him!

theplatypus
12-21-2011, 04:13 PM
blind homerism at it's finest

soulkitchen
12-21-2011, 04:22 PM
Really? I clearly remember the Steelers winning the Superbowl in Detroit despite him.
You're either blind, or clueless, or both ..........

Can't really be a Steeler fan with this comment. He made the plays in sb when plays needed to be made. And don't forget, he got us there. I know, I was in a stadium seat for every one of those games and the sb. Not on a message board typing my comments while half-ass watching the game on TV.

I agree with some of the others here. You can have all the other QB's. I'll take Ben in the big games every time.

theplatypus
12-21-2011, 04:35 PM
Can't really be a Steeler fan with this comment. He made the plays in sb when plays needed to be made. And don't forget, he got us there. I know, I was in a stadium seat for every one of those games and the sb. Not on a message board typing my comments while half-ass watching the game on TV.

I agree with some of the others here. You can have all the other QB's. I'll take Ben in the big games every time.

oh you mean ARE throwing a TD to Hines and FWP breaking off a 75yd run for a td or Ben's 9-21 performance with 0td and 2 ints?

JustinM
12-21-2011, 04:49 PM
AMEN OP AMEN. It's one fcking game and people are all on his case...wtfffff?!!? He didn't play THAT bad. He connected plenty of passes, just obviously had a fcking SPRAINED ANKLE. shit.

SteelCurtainCall
12-21-2011, 04:57 PM
The reason Ben is forced to hang onto the ball, and make something happen, is because we have no running game. I'm sure Ben would love to hand the ball off 30 times a game, and it would open up the air attack to the point we'd be unstoppable. Ben has develeoped into the type of QB he is out of neccessity; IMHO.

plenewken
12-21-2011, 05:02 PM
Can't really be a Steeler fan with this comment. He made the plays in sb when plays needed to be made. And don't forget, he got us there. I know, I was in a stadium seat for every one of those games and the sb. Not on a message board typing my comments while half-ass watching the game on TV.

I agree with some of the others here. You can have all the other QB's. I'll take Ben in the big games every time.

Being a Steelers fan and recognizing that some players stink up the joint from time to time are 2 different things. Ben's not the only one, trust me. For example I won't miss Kemoatu one bit when he's gone.
Yes, Ben got us in Superbowl XL, particularly when he tackled the Colt who recovered Bettis' fumble on the goal line. I give him that. I give him lots of other great plays too but I also admit that he's very inconsistent and I am more worried than ecstatic when I watch him play now.
I wish he could go back to his style of the mid-2000s and while he's at it, if he could also shed 30 pounds, that would help.

zsheik22
12-21-2011, 05:59 PM
Can't really be a Steeler fan with this comment. He made the plays in sb when plays needed to be made. And don't forget, he got us there. I know, I was in a stadium seat for every one of those games and the sb. Not on a message board typing my comments while half-ass watching the game on TV.

I agree with some of the others here. You can have all the other QB's. I'll take Ben in the big games every time.




You'd take ben over Aaron Rodgers? Ben is pretty damn good, but Aaron Rodgers is probably the greatest passer, ever. Having Rodgers and Wallace on the same team would be absolutely unstoppable.


People doubted Ben playing on Monday, because he was hobbled and couldnt make plays he normally could make. One of his best assets couldnt be used. If you cant give your team 100% because your physically injured, you need to step aside and give the backup a shot. Everyone knows Ben is one tough customer, safe to say probably the toughest QB in the NFL.

JustinM
12-21-2011, 06:32 PM
You'd take ben over Aaron Rodgers? Ben is pretty damn good, but Aaron Rodgers is probably the greatest passer, ever. Having Rodgers and Wallace on the same team would be absolutely unstoppable.


People doubted Ben playing on Monday, because he was hobbled and couldnt make plays he normally could make. One of his best assets couldnt be used. If you cant give your team 100% because your physically injured, you need to step aside and give the backup a shot. Everyone knows Ben is one tough customer, safe to say probably the toughest QB in the NFL.

Our backups should have played agains the 49ers, that's for sure. It's not worth risking Ben getting injured even further.

cubanstogie
12-21-2011, 06:42 PM
Our backups should have played agains the 49ers, that's for sure. It's not worth risking Ben getting injured even further.

hindsight is 20/20. Although I agree with Ricardisimo, Ben should have been pulled once the game was out of reach. I do think if he thought he could go then he should have. You can bet that him coming back has a positive influence on his team and shows toughness and leadership. Unlike a Jay Cultler who people question. Anyone reading too much into the loss is a glass half empty "we'll never make it" Glum kind of personality who probably will never be happy. Ben toughed it out when most QB's wouldn't have even made the 3000 mile trip. Ben clearly was not close to himself. His style of play makes the injury even harder to play with than say a Brady or Rivers type. I do think Tomlin left him in way too long. At one point it was obvious he couldn't get the job done. Get Dixon some PT in case he is needed someday.

BleedPurple
12-21-2011, 11:45 PM
What? One bad game on a shattered ankle against the toughest defense to score on in the entire NFL? The Steelers were riding a 4 game winning streak, one of the hottest streaks in the league and would of been 5 if the defense would of stopped Flacco after Ben hit Wallace for the go a-head touchdown against Baltimore. Hell, the talk around the league when we beat the Pats was that Roethlisberger was having his best season ever amidst the woeful offensive line and just this past week, held the AFC's #1 seed. How easy haters will show their ugly faces after a loss.

We go as far as Ben takes us, haters. Believe it.

It's shattered now? I thought it was a class 1 sprain. Also you held the #1 seed for ~24 hours because you played Monday night. If you had played Sunday at 1 you would have never seen it. 21/14 TD/INT is mediocre if we're being generous. It's OK, our guy is mediocre too. In fact, on one leg Ben looks an awful lot like Joe.

tanda10506
12-22-2011, 12:06 AM
Find another team! So tired of all these moronic posts of "is he elite", "can he carry this team", "who would you rather have than" blah blah blah! The guy is still young, gets beat up week in and week out and there is NO OTHER QB in the league right now other than Brady that has more Super Bowl wins or appearances than Ben Roethlisberger.... PERIOD!!! Peyton - 1 win 1 loss, Eli 1 win, Brees 1 win, Rodgers 1 win.... All these so called "ELITE" QBs can't carry the mans jock with what he has to go through every week. Look how many times those QBs get sacked or knocked down compared to Ben and then complain! If you are a Steeler fan, support the man and quit crying. Without him we still have Tommy Maddox running the offense.... :banging:

Agreed!!!:tt03::tt04:

PhantomJB93
12-22-2011, 12:30 AM
The "holding on to the ball too long" theory doesn't bother me. Yes he does it and yes it backfires sometimes, like it did Monday when he couldn't move, but he does it simply because it's a part of his game and more often than not it works to his advantage, not because he's inept as a passer and can't realize when to throw it.

No, he's not as good a strict pocket passer as Brady or Manning, but he doesn't need to be (although he is still really good in the pocket, but if it's all he could do then yes he would be just a "good" QB), his playmaking ability in the "second 3 seconds" makes him elite, it's something that not a lot of guys can do. It didn't work Monday simply because he was injured and I think a lot of people are seriously underestimating how much this particular injury inhibited his ability as a passer, you can't put anything into a throw when you can't put weight on your left foot. If Brady, Manning, Brees, or Rodgers had this same injury of the same severity, they probably would have played even worse, if at all.

Anyone starting to question him as "elite" after this particular game really needs to reconsider.

And, just because it's relevant:

1. Brady
2. Rodgers
3. Brees
4. Peyton Manning
5. Roethlisberger

------

everyone else

Bayz101
12-22-2011, 12:36 AM
If we win the SuperBowl, i'd love to hear you guy's explanations.

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 12:54 AM
It's shattered now? I thought it was a class 1 sprain. Also you held the #1 seed for ~24 hours because you played Monday night. If you had played Sunday at 1 you would have never seen it. 21/14 TD/INT is mediocre if we're being generous. It's OK, our guy is mediocre too. In fact, on one leg Ben looks an awful lot like Joe.

It's a figure of speech you purple douche. I have 0 tolerance for Ravens fans like yourself hanging around our boards to "remind" us of Ben's TD ratio or how your precious AFC NORTH Title is back into your hands. Your fanbase are nothing but schmucks. If we would hang out around your board just for the hell of it and to troll, our ass would be banned followed by nothing but wankers commenting how evil we are. Go back to your Rats-nest, Ratbird.

Bayz101
12-22-2011, 01:02 AM
It's a figure of speech you purple douche. I have 0 tolerance for Ravens fans like yourself hanging around our boards to "remind" us of Ben's TD ratio or how your precious AFC NORTH Title is back into your hands. Your fanbase are nothing but schmucks. If we would hang out around your board just for the hell of it and to troll, our ass would be banned followed by nothing but wankers commenting how evil we are. Go back to your Rats-nest, Ratbird.

BP is no thumper, and that's a plus to me. He's been sportsmanlike most of the time he's been here, and he has the right to post statistics. You and I both know stats don't mean anything. What matters is what happens in January.

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 01:09 AM
BP is no thumper, and that's a plus to me. He's been sportsmanlike most of the time he's been here, and he has the right to post statistics. You and I both know stats don't mean anything. What matters is what happens in January.

Just the thought of a Ravens fan hanging around here throwing jabs and butting in on conversations rubs me the wrong way. It's fine it doesn't irk you, but as I've said, I tried to have civil conversations on their own boards and talking straight, objective football and I was banned just because I was a Steelers fan. F*ck them if they want to play like that. I don't care if he's Cinderella who shoots cupids-arrows out of his messages. I can care-less for Raturd fans until we meet again.

But, on the other hand, I love wiping the floor with their sorry, obsessed ass's. They know they love us.

Bayz101
12-22-2011, 01:17 AM
Just the thought of a Ravens fan hanging around here throwing jabs and butting in on conversations rubs me the wrong way. It's fine it doesn't irk you, but as I've said, I tried to have civil conversations on their own boards and talking straight, objective football and I was banned just because I was a Steelers fan. F*ck them if they want to play like that. I don't care if he's Cinderella who shoots cupids-arrows out of his messages. I can care-less for Raturd fans until we meet again.

But, on the other hand, I love wiping the floor with their sorry, obsessed ass's. They know they love us.

It never bothered me that they hang here, it just puzzles me that they'd want to be here. Puzzles me that they'd rather hang in their arch rivals forum then in the big purple board across the way.

3rdandlong
12-22-2011, 07:07 AM
If we question Ben's status as an elite QB, we're nit Steelers fans? Is that what you're saying? That makes a lot of sense. I've always thought Ben was overrated. People always say "well, he has 2 Super Bowls. That makes him better than Brees and Rodgers.". Ben's not the only player on the field. Why should he get most of the credit. By that logic we could say Mendenhall is elite too. Most years he's the beneficicary of an outstanding defense. Most credit should go to Kevin Colbert and the front office for drafting well, and Dick Lebeau's defense.
Sure, most seasons Ben has an abysmal offensive line, and that definitely affects his play. But he holds onto the ball too long. He reads the defense slower than elite QBs. Ben can't seem to throw the deep ball either. He's overthrown Mike Wallace more than not.
If we didn't have other important pieces on this team, Ben could not carry it. That's what an elite QB can do. Brady can carry his team. Obviously Indy is nothing without Peyton. New Orleans doesn't have a great defense, either.

MDSteel15
12-22-2011, 07:23 AM
oh you mean ARE throwing a TD to Hines and FWP breaking off a 75yd run for a td or Ben's 9-21 performance with 0td and 2 ints?

So then how did they get to the Super Bowl? Did you watch the games preceeding that? They don't get there WITHOUT Ben's play! You can't bitch and moan about his play Super Bowl without praising his play before that! So it's a double edged sword...

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 07:25 AM
If we question Ben's status as an elite QB, we're nit Steelers fans? Is that what you're saying? That makes a lot of sense. I've always thought Ben was overrated. People always say "well, he has 2 Super Bowls. That makes him better than Brees and Rodgers.". Ben's not the only player on the field. Why should he get most of the credit. By that logic we could say Mendenhall is elite too. Most years he's the beneficicary of an outstanding defense. Most credit should go to Kevin Colbert and the front office for drafting well, and Dick Lebeau's defense.
Sure, most seasons Ben has an abysmal offensive line, and that definitely affects his play. But he holds onto the ball too long. He reads the defense slower than elite QBs. Ben can't seem to throw the deep ball either. He's overthrown Mike Wallace more than not.
If we didn't have other important pieces on this team, Ben could not carry it. That's what an elite QB can do. Brady can carry his team. Obviously Indy is nothing without Peyton. New Orleans doesn't have a great defense, either.

So, what you're saying, is the Steelers have a always had a good team and Ben is just a beneficiary from that? Okay. It's football. That's true, but all winning QB's play on good teams, PERIOD. A moot point and a contradicting one for argument.

Maybe he could be like Peyton Manning though and play with multiple Hall Of Fame wide receivers, in a dome nonetheless. Even Tom Brady had Randy Moss to throw to a couple a couple years with Hall Of Fame players on the defensive side of the ball like Ty Law and Rodney Harrison. Don't forget Manning having the freak defensive ends, Dwight Freeney , Robert Mathis and safety Bob Sanders all those years on defense.

The year the Saints won the Super Bowl with Brees, the Saints defense were absolute MONSTERS in the interception/turnover ratio. Greg William's defense made it happen and if it wasn't for Tracy Porter's pick 6 in Super Bowl 41, Brees doesn't own a ring. Instead, Manning did what Ben DIDN'T do. Throw the pick to lose the game.

Listen, I give credit where credit is due. But don't insult my intelligence when calling Ben overrated. It's just not true.

I've watched a ton of Steelers football since I can remember and the style Ben has brought to Pittsburgh is something the franchise has never seen since Bradshaw: productivity at the QB position.

Neil O'Donnell, Mike Tomczak, Jim Miller, Kordell Stewart, Kent Graham, Tommy Maddox. The Steelers have had some GREAT teams in the 90's and early 2000's that went to absolute excrement because of very below average performances at quarterback. The Steelers always had a run game (Barry Foster, Eric Pegram, Bam Morris, Jerome Bettis, etc) and great defense's (Greg Lloyd, Rod Woodson, Carnell Lake, Levon Kirkland, Kevin Greene, etc) yet, Cowher always lacked that QB to come in and carry the team in clutch-like situations.

And to say Ben can't throw the deep ball is ridiculously FALSE. Over the coarse of his career, Ben is one of, if not the best quarterback in the league, with the best YPA down the football field. This season and dating back to last, Ben and Wallace was the NFL's most threatful and damaging deep threat. Kind of hard to throw into triple coverage downfield now. Why do you think Antonio Brown has emerged?

Also, how do you explain 2009? Ben carried the offense into the top 10 while the defense puked all over their shoes in final minutes of football games. Ben carries this team more often than you think!

Debunked.

plenewken
12-22-2011, 07:40 AM
And to say Ben can't throw the deep ball is ridiculously FALSE. Over the coarse of his year, Ben is one of, if not the best quarterback in the league, with the best YPA down the football field.

How come the offense is ranked consistently in the 2nd half with a guy like him then? Is this worth $100M? Not to me, sorry.
I want to see points on the board, not an ineffective offense being bailed out by the Defense season after season.
It's not only Ben, but it's also Ben.

MDSteel15
12-22-2011, 07:48 AM
How come the offense is ranked consistently in the 2nd half with a guy like him then? Is this worth $100M? Not to me, sorry.
I want to see points on the board, not an ineffective offense being bailed out by the Defense season after season.
It's not only Ben, but it's also Ben.

Let's see.... THE RUNNING GAME IS PATHETIC!!! :noidea:

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 07:59 AM
How come the offense is ranked consistently in the 2nd half with a guy like him then? Is this worth $100M? Not to me, sorry.
I want to see points on the board, not an ineffective offense being bailed out by the Defense season after season.
It's not only Ben, but it's also Ben.

Listen, we've seen what Ben can do behind somewhat of a MEDIOCRE offensive line! Everyone harps on Bruce Arians as well. Now it's Ben. Fact of the matter is, this Steelers team haven't been able to put a healthy offensive line out there for years. Weekly, there's literally a new line rotation in the lineup. Hell, there's multiple lineup changes in ONE GAME.

All of that effects not only play calling, but the overall flow and timing of the offense. Mix that in with a lack of running game and there you have a quarterback carrying the entire offense with a bunch of scrubs not named Pouncey in front of you. Listen, football teams are ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS, built from the inside out. We aren't built on the inside, period. We're lucky we have Ben and the style he brings. Believe that.

MDSteel15
12-22-2011, 08:06 AM
Listen, we've seen what Ben can do behind somewhat of a MEDIOCRE offensive line! Everyone harps on Bruce Arians as well. Now it's Ben. Fact of the matter is, this Steelers team haven't been able to put a healthy offensive line out there for years. Weekly, there's literally a new line rotation in the lineup. Hell, there's multiple lineup changes in ONE GAME.

All of that effects not only play calling, but the overall flow and timing of the offense. Mix that in with a lack of running game and there you have a quarterback carrying the entire offense with a bunch of scrubs not named Pouncey in front of you. Listen, football teams are ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS, built from the inside out. We aren't built on the inside, period. We're lucky we have Ben and the style he brings. Believe that.

DING DING DIN DING!!! We have a winner! :hatsoff:

plenewken
12-22-2011, 08:15 AM
Let's see.... THE RUNNING GAME IS PATHETIC!!! :noidea:

Our coaching staff just doesn't believe in it. What did he do to make it more effective?
By the way, Ben runs too, not as well as he used to though. Probably due to the extra weight he carries now.
With the % of passing plays we call, 21TD for 14INT and 40 sacks is pathetic indeed.

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 08:25 AM
Our coaching staff just doesn't believe in it. What did he do to make it more effective?
By the way, Ben runs too, not as well as he used to though. Probably due to the extra weight he carries now.
With the % of passing plays we call, 21TD for 14INT and 40 sacks is pathetic indeed.

I can't count how many times you've flubbed your inaccurate statements. What you say is simply just not fact.

Ben runs? I've seen Ben run maybe a handful of times. Majority of them went for first downs or touchdowns.

The TD/INT ratio looks worse than it really is on paper. Bens stats looked excellent before 3 interception performances. Anyone's would.

Also, what extra added weight? Ben was like, 270 pounds in his second season and moved fine. He's actually in great shape, probably the best shape he's ever been in due to his physical presence, doing P90X and staying in great shape. How else could he withstand such a beating?

You've said you wanted points. Well, Maybe we should call Touchdown Tommy Maddox back since it worked out so well last time. He's even a bigger statue than anyone at his position. God help his soul behind this offensive line. God help his soul.

3rdandlong
12-22-2011, 08:53 AM
So, what you're saying, is the Steelers have a always had a good team and Ben is just a beneficiary from that? Okay. It's football. That's true, but all winning QB's play on good teams, PERIOD. A moot point and a contradicting one for argument.

Maybe he could be like Peyton Manning though and play with multiple Hall Of Fame wide receivers, in a dome nonetheless. Even Tom Brady had Randy Moss to throw to a couple a couple years with Hall Of Fame players on the defensive side of the ball like Ty Law and Rodney Harrison. Don't forget Manning having the freak defensive ends, Dwight Freeney , Robert Mathis and safety Bob Sanders all those years on defense.

The year the Saints won the Super Bowl with Brees, the Saints defense were absolute MONSTERS in the interception/turnover ratio. Greg William's defense made it happen and if it wasn't for Tracy Porter's pick 6 in Super Bowl 41, Brees doesn't own a ring. Instead, Manning did what Ben DIDN'T do. Throw the pick to lose the game.

Listen, I give credit where credit is due. But don't insult my intelligence when calling Ben overrated. It's just not true.

I've watched a ton of Steelers football since I can remember and the style Ben has brought to Pittsburgh is something the franchise has never seen since Bradshaw: productivity at the QB position.

Neil O'Donnell, Mike Tomczak, Jim Miller, Kordell Stewart, Kent Graham, Tommy Maddox. The Steelers have had some GREAT teams in the 90's and early 2000's that went to absolute excrement because of very below average performances at quarterback. The Steelers always had a run game (Barry Foster, Eric Pegram, Bam Morris, Jerome Bettis, etc) and great defense's (Greg Lloyd, Rod Woodson, Carnell Lake, Levon Kirkland, Kevin Greene, etc) yet, Cowher always lacked that QB to come in and carry the team in clutch-like situations.

And to say Ben can't throw the deep ball is ridiculously FALSE. Over the coarse of his career, Ben is one of, if not the best quarterback in the league, with the best YPA down the football field. This season and dating back to last, Ben and Wallace was the NFL's most threatful and damaging deep threat. Kind of hard to throw into triple coverage downfield now. Why do you think Antonio Brown has emerged?

Also, how do you explain 2009? Ben carried the offense into the top 10 while the defense puked all over their shoes in final minutes of football games. Ben carries this team more often than you think!

Debunked.

I never said Ben wasn't good. I just don't think he's the calibre that a lot of people in this forum think he is.

This year Ben has consistently missed the deep ball to Wallace. It's obvious to me. I see it constantly.

Ben has had some really good seasons where I would have considered him elite, particularly his fourth. But lately he just doesn't inspire the same confidence that obvious elite QBs do.

You bring up how in 2009 the defense choked a lot. Yeah, and we missed the playoffs. We were 9-7. Defense wasn't bad that year, but they definitely weren't elite. Just proves my point that Ben shouldn't get as much credit as he does for the Steelers being a winning team.

zsheik22
12-22-2011, 08:53 AM
You telling me Bradshaw was better than Marino? LOL. You cant rate QB's by SB's because QB's dont play defense. They are on the sidelines. You can rate Hockey players and basketball players by cups and trophies, but not QB's. Sorry.


You can rate their performances in the SB's, and sorry folks... Ben was very average minus a few plays. He is still damn good, though.

MDSteel15
12-22-2011, 09:08 AM
You telling me Bradshaw was better than Marino? LOL. You cant rate QB's by SB's because QB's dont play defense. They are on the sidelines. You can rate Hockey players and basketball players by cups and trophies, but not QB's. Sorry.


You can rate their performances in the SB's, and sorry folks... Ben was very average minus a few plays. He is still damn good, though.

And how was Marino's ONLY SB appearance? Not to good... :hatsoff:
Oh, and Bradshaw, unlike Marino, called all his plays!

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 09:13 AM
You can rate their performances in the SB's, and sorry folks... Ben was very average minus a few plays. He is still damn good, though.

And those few plays were MONUMENTAL in our wins. That 3rd and 28 in XL. The diving touchdown. The play where he hit Hines Ward after a broken play for a first down to seal the game. XLIII speaks for itself. To my understanding, the defense collapsed with 2:00 left to go in the game. We all know what happened next. No need to continue in this thread. Have at it.

theplatypus
12-22-2011, 09:29 AM
And those few plays were MONUMENTAL in our wins. That 3rd and 28 in XL. The diving touchdown. The play where he hit Hines Ward after a broken play for a first down to seal the game. XLIII speaks for itself. To my understanding, the defense collapsed with 2:00 left to go in the game. We all know what happened next. No need to continue in this thread. Have at it.


And for every clutch game he's had at least one piss poor performance, like the other two super bowls. Pump fakes from your own end zone is pure quarterbacking brilliance. When is the last time Ben had a superstar elite qb performance? Leave out all the bs rhetoric about Arians or this or that.

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 09:38 AM
And for every clutch game he's had at least one piss poor performance, like the other two super bowls. Pump fakes from your own end zone is pure quarterbacking brilliance. When is the last time Ben had a superstar elite qb performance? Leave out all the bs rhetoric about Arians or this or that.

Ben threw for 5 TD's on his OTHER f*cked up ankle against Tennessee earlier on in the year. He also out dueled Tom Brady and put on one helluva performance against the un-beatable Patriots. Oh yes, he also brought his team down 10 against the Ratbirds and that dominating & intimidating defense to take the lead before his defense shit the bed on him.

Dude, what you're saying can be said about any QB in this league. Tom Brady had a dreadful performance in SB XLII and the unflappable Manning cost his team the Super Bowl in XLI. I've said this before but I don't expect any hater to acknowledge that the best QB's have their good and bad days. Hell, Drew Brees was laughed at before rejuvenation with the Saints.

For every CLUTCH performance there's always a piss poor performance? Haha, typical spoiled rotten comment from a Steelers fan. Be lucky your teams QB performs in the clutch AT ALL, and one of the best at it.

ETL
12-22-2011, 09:40 AM
Here we go Roethlisbergers, here we go....

BleedPurple
12-22-2011, 09:51 AM
It never bothered me that they hang here, it just puzzles me that they'd want to be here. Puzzles me that they'd rather hang in their arch rivals forum then in the big purple board across the way.

I post in both boards--for most people it isn't a big deal. Other people need to throw leaves into the air and piss on every tree for miles around :chuckle:

ETL
12-22-2011, 09:52 AM
Ben cost us this game. No way looking around it. The first interception was bad judgment and the second one - he could have dumped off to Mendenhall but instead got greedy and tried to hit Miller for a longer gain. I saw that he learned quickly and on the next series he dumped off to Mendenhall a little too early.

Ben needs to learn that he DID NOT NEED TO WIN that game for us. Our D is good enough and with him hobbled, he should have managed the game by not throwing interceptions. In this type of game, punt are better than ints.

However DO NOT CONFUSE this criticism of Ben as a statement that i hate him or wish he wasn't the Steelers QB. I am so so grateful that we have a great QB. i appreciate what he has done for us and i hope this last game just serves as a good learning experience for Ben.

He had a bad game just like Heath did last time and others before them. He's human but as long as he wears black and gold, i will root for him and hope he succeeds.

theplatypus
12-22-2011, 09:53 AM
Ben threw for 5 TD's on his OTHER f*cked up ankle against Tennessee earlier on in the year. He also out dueled Tom Brady and put on one helluva performance against the un-beatable Patriots. Oh yes, he also brought his team down 10 against the Ratbirds and that dominating & intimidating defense to take the lead before his defense shit the bed on him.

Dude, what you're saying can be said about any QB in this league. Tom Brady had a dreadful performance in SB XLII and the unflappable Manning cost his team the Super Bowl in XLI. I've said this before but I don't expect any hater to acknowledge that the best QB's have their good and bad days. Hell, Drew Brees was laughed at before rejuvenation with the Saints.




One hell of a performance against the pats? You seem to be forgetting the home run ball he threw to the wide open middle linebacker. And let's not forget the Pats pass defense has more holes than a slice of swiss cheese. Brady consistently puts up more td's and fewer ints than BR year in and year out. Against Baltimore? YOu seem to be forgetting his at a minimum 10 point swing int to Suggs in that game as well. It isn't hating it's simply acknowledging that BR isn't the superstar hall of fame qb people like you want him to be.

BleedPurple
12-22-2011, 09:54 AM
It's a figure of speech you purple douche. I have 0 tolerance for Ravens fans like yourself hanging around our boards to "remind" us of Ben's TD ratio or how your precious AFC NORTH Title is back into your hands. Your fanbase are nothing but schmucks. If we would hang out around your board just for the hell of it and to troll, our ass would be banned followed by nothing but wankers commenting how evil we are. Go back to your Rats-nest, Ratbird.

1. Shattered is not a figure of speech. It is exaggeration and dramatization. Ben would be proud.

2. I don't care what you think, keep it up with the personal attacks, it just shows how wrong you are.

3. I'm not trolling. Ben is one step above Flacco as a QB, and without his mobility he looked a lot like Flacco on Sunday--that's the truth.

Whodis
12-22-2011, 10:07 AM
Find another team! So tired of all these moronic posts of "is he elite", "can he carry this team", "who would you rather have than" blah blah blah! The guy is still young, gets beat up week in and week out and there is NO OTHER QB in the league right now other than Brady that has more Super Bowl wins or appearances than Ben Roethlisberger.... PERIOD!!! Peyton - 1 win 1 loss, Eli 1 win, Brees 1 win, Rodgers 1 win.... All these so called "ELITE" QBs can't carry the mans jock with what he has to go through every week. Look how many times those QBs get sacked or knocked down compared to Ben and then complain! If you are a Steeler fan, support the man and quit crying. Without him we still have Tommy Maddox running the offense.... :banging:

I personally agree with all of the above except for "find another team".

This forum is great and just because some one doesn't agree with me (i.e. my constant bitching about Arians) doesn't make them shitty fans. Hell, my father hated Cowher! I love the opinions and I wouldn't want to see the board turn into a bunch of sheep.

MDSteel15
12-22-2011, 10:20 AM
I personally agree with all of the above except for "find another team".

This forum is great and just because some one doesn't agree with me (i.e. my constant bitching about Arians) doesn't make them shitty fans. Hell, my father hated Cowher! I love the opinions and I wouldn't want to see the board turn into a bunch of sheep.

I love this board also but the same threads over and over and over.... Come on man! :chuckle:

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 10:25 AM
One hell of a performance against the pats? You seem to be forgetting the home run ball he threw to the wide open middle linebacker. And let's not forget the Pats pass defense has more holes than a slice of swiss cheese. Brady consistently puts up more td's and fewer ints than BR year in and year out. Against Baltimore? YOu seem to be forgetting his at a minimum 10 point swing int to Suggs in that game as well. It isn't hating it's simply acknowledging that BR isn't the superstar hall of fame qb people like you want him to be.

Doesn't change the fact he out-dueled Brady (Roethlisberger 36/50, 365 YDS, 2 TD, 1 INT; Brady 24/35, 198 YDS, 2 TD)and brought his team back 10 and gave us the lead in the final moments of the Baltimore game. Nice counteract to redact Ben's performance just because New England's defense now is "swiss-cheese" a swiss cheese defense that still creates more turnovers than our top 3 defense in the league!

Listen, I don't make Ben out to be a superstar, Hall of Fame QB no different than people like you who don't appreciate what he gives our team. I simply appreciate our QB for what he has done. I read more into the lines than just stats or anything else for that matter. He's one helluva ball-player that gives defense fits. Period, end of story.

StainlessStill
12-22-2011, 10:31 AM
1. Shattered is not a figure of speech. It is exaggeration and dramatization. Ben would be proud.

2. I don't care what you think, keep it up with the personal attacks, it just shows how wrong you are.

3. I'm not trolling. Ben is one step above Flacco as a QB, and without his mobility he looked a lot like Flacco on Sunday--that's the truth.

1. Regardless of the figure of speech or, "exaggeration" of saying it's a "shattered ankle" it might as well be since a high ankle sprain is said to be worse than an actual break for the firs time. I bet Flacco is proud that his God awful mustache finally match's his Bert-unibrow.

2. I'm actually happy and breathed a breath of fresh air (another one of those figures of speech's) that you don't care what I think because I never cared for a Raturds opinion other than gameday VS gameday. Still trying to figure out where I'm "wrong" at.

3. According to your purple-peeps on your message board, you're trolling so in my eyes, yes, you're trolling with smartmouth comments like the one's you've been posting and also replying to me in that kind of attitude. Just goes to show how I Loathe everything not Black and Gold, especially Raturd, Brownie and Bungle fans! You're all the same.