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60_MINUTES
01-13-2012, 09:24 PM
Okay guys I may get eat up on this Im not sure.. but I just see something in this kid and Im gonna post it. If it comes back to haunt me you guys can say I suck and missed it when the time comes. Anyway Im coming out now and saying I think this kid is gonna be a probowl number one type CB.. He has it all.. I look for him to take the same kind of jump that Troy did from year one to year two.. Even Troy P looked average his first year out,but then we all know what happened in year two..

Im not saying Allen will be the next Troy.. ( For GOD sake Troy is the best player I ever saw IMO ) but I say Allen is def a number one ProBOWl CB.. Im not 100 percent he shows to be a true number one this coming year, heck with Tomlins dumb ass he may not give him the chance to show it a full year this year but Im saying as he goes into the next few years and if given the opptunity this year that he will become a number one pro bowl type CB.. Not to mention this guy is a Rooney kind of guy.. A great person.. I at least see him as a solid number 2 townsend type guy but Im going on a limb here and saying we have our next great solid pro bowl CB.

. So what do you guys think??? Dont dodge the question with if this or if that.. call it off what you have observed so far you got 4 choices.................

1. Probowl CB sometime in the next 2 years and for years to come
2. Solid number 2 Townsend type
3. Not too bad, not to great prob a nickel back for a few years
4. wont end up being a starter at all and will fade out over the next 4 years

Goldsteel86
01-13-2012, 09:31 PM
Okay guys I may get eat up on this Im not sure.. but I just see something in this kid and Im gonna post it. If it comes back to haunt me you guys can say I suck and missed it when the time comes. Anyway Im coming out now and saying I think this kid is gonna be a probowl number one type CB.. He has it all.. I look for him to take the same kind of jump that Troy did from year one to year two.. Even Troy P looked average his first year out,but then we all know what happened in year two..

Im not saying Allen will be the next Troy.. ( For GOD sake Troy is the best player I ever saw IMO ) but I say Allen is def a number one ProBOWl CB.. Im not 100 percent he shows to be a true number one this coming year, heck with Tomlins dumb ass he may not give him the chance to show it a full year this year but Im saying as he goes into the next few years and if given the opptunity this year that he will become a number one pro bowl type CB.. Not to mention this guy is a Rooney kind of guy.. A great person.. I at least see him as a solid number 2 townsend type guy but Im going on a limb here and saying we have our next great solid pro bowl CB.

. So what do you guys think??? Dont dodge the question with if this or if that.. call it off what you have observed so far you got 4 choices.................

1. Probowl CB sometime in the next 2 years and for years to come
2. Solid number 2 Townsend type
3. Not too bad, not to great prob a nickel back for a few years
4. wont end up being a starter at all and will fade out over the next 4 years

I truly believe if he is given the chance he can be a star in that defensive backfield!!!!

60_MINUTES
01-13-2012, 09:34 PM
IF the kid is that good it sure changes what our CB problem looks like for the future.. We could go O line or NT or ILB this year and worry about CB next year..and of course I think thats what we should do.. this guy is gonna get picks as well.. he has good hands. I dont see him in someones hip pocket like IKE has been over the years.. I dont see him as a shut down never catch the ball against him CB like IKE has been in the past.. but with his hands I see him as a probowl player a number one type guy that covers very well and gives our O the ball. Basically a Townsend with better size and better speed.. Townsend was a solid number two.. he was just a little to slow and small to be a number one probowl guy.. I think Allen is just a step above townsends skill set and will have a great run with the Steelers...

60_MINUTES
01-13-2012, 09:37 PM
I truly believe if he is given the chance he can be a star in that defensive backfield!!!!




:tt03::tt03::tt03:

Alright man.. I hear ya.. lets hope we are both right about this.. I really think we need a couple lineman over the next couple years with top 3 picks. a ILB somewhere in there, A NT in there and prob another RB somewhere in there if Mendy doesnt come back healthy.. along with in two years another OLB.. so if Allen can be the man it sure helps trying to replace some stars the next couple of years

Goldsteel86
01-13-2012, 09:41 PM
:tt03::tt03::tt03:

Alright man.. I hear ya.. lets hope we are both right about this.. I really think we need a couple lineman over the next couple years with top 3 picks. a ILB somewhere in there, A NT in there and prob another RB somewhere in there if Mendy doesnt come back healthy.. along with in two years another OLB.. so if Allen can be the man it sure helps trying to replace some stars the next couple of years

Have to focus on the OL in this draft after that a stud that can rush the passer, I believe with Allen and Ike in the defensive backfield we may be solid.

60_MINUTES
01-13-2012, 09:51 PM
Have to focus on the OL in this draft after that a stud that can rush the passer, I believe with Allen and Ike in the defensive backfield we may be solid.



You have the exact same view that me and my best bud do.. Thats pretty much exactly the way I see it as well.. Im so tired of having O line problems and as much as I know we may need ILB and NT.. we need O line more.. Every year its depressing seeing essex, or john scott or a TE running on the field towards the end of the season. If we bring starks back and hes healthy then I say at least go O line first round.. if Starks is not gonna make it back I say you have to go O line with 2 out of the first 3 picks... and again your spot on with the rush OLB.. we will need him prob not this april but the next.. thats why I sure hope we are right about Allen

Goldsteel86
01-13-2012, 09:55 PM
You have the exact same view that me and my best bud do.. Thats pretty much exactly the way I see it as well.. Im so tired of having O line problems and as much as I know we may need ILB and NT.. we need O line more.. Every year its depressing seeing essex, or john scott or a TE running on the field towards the end of the season. If we bring starks back and hes healthy then I say at least go O line first round.. if Starks is not gonna make it back I say you have to go O line with 2 out of the first 3 picks... and again your spot on with the rush OLB.. we will need him prob not this april but the next.. thats why I sure hope we are right about Allen

The ILB problem will fix itself, but the Ol and lack of pass rush won't. I am not interested in the BPA, time to address some needs, IMO!!!! :noidea:

60_MINUTES
01-13-2012, 10:23 PM
The ILB problem will fix itself, but the Ol and lack of pass rush won't. I am not interested in the BPA, time to address some needs, IMO!!!! :noidea:


Right I agree with that.. I cant stand the BPA people.. they are wrong.. If you got Barrry Sanders in his second year as a RB and that year in the draft Adrian Peterson comes up at your pick then you dont take him.. However I do agree most teams need at least 2 or 3 things going into a draft.. so I do think most years you take the BPA for one of those spots.. meaning even if you need ILB a little more than anythiing and NT is your second need you still go NT first if the next Hampton is there and the only thing left at ILB is a earl holmes... a Holmes is not bad but hampton is a probowler for years to come... However this year I would go against that theory a little.. I say we got to have O line no matter what.. there has got to be a guard or T at 24 that will be worth the 24 pick. As far as ILB I dont think its on our Roster... I think we gonna have to address it with a number 2 pick sometime in the next two years..

PhantomJB93
01-13-2012, 10:44 PM
Eh, I think he can be a solid #2 but noone on this roster strikes me as a true shutdown, #1 corner. That's something I think we'll need to draft in the first round or two in the future, but doesn't need to be addressed until Ike retires or seriously regresses.

Not many Pro Bowl caliber CBs are found outside of the first round nowadays. Not that all CB talent is found there, just saying those elite, shutdown, Pro Bowl guys like you're talking about are almost always first round athletes. Cortez has the size but not so much the speed and instinctive fluidity those kinds of guys have.

tanda10506
01-13-2012, 10:44 PM
We've drafted for the line the last two years and it has worked out well, but we need to make sure Max Starks is back next year and get a FA guard. I know it's more our style to draft, but we don't have the time to wait a few years for a starter, we need it now.

pete74
01-14-2012, 05:24 AM
i just read a report were the steelers are really high on both the new corners and may let Gay walk because there confident both can start next season

stb_steeler
01-14-2012, 10:53 AM
i just read a report were the steelers are really high on both the new corners and may let Gay walk because there confident both can start next season

OH no, more Gay bashing.......See ya William!

PhantomJB93
01-14-2012, 01:22 PM
i just read a report were the steelers are really high on both the new corners and may let Gay walk because there confident both can start next season

I don't think you can just let Gay walk. Allen looked good in dime packages but Brown barely saw any playing time; I don't think you can just throw them both in the fire like that and expect great results. I know Gay just had a career year, but I don't really think he's going to be in high enough demand (especially after the Broncos game) that he's going to get some huge contract anywhere, we should be able to sign him at least to a one year deal for a reasonable price and let him start while Brown and Allen get another year with increased action to see what we can get out of them.

ricardisimo
01-14-2012, 02:37 PM
i just read a report were the steelers are really high on both the new corners and may let Gay walk because there confident both can start next season
Given the woody that Tomlin has for veterans, I just don't see this happening. It wouldn't be shocking if he left, but Gay stays, most likely.

60_MINUTES
01-14-2012, 04:36 PM
i just read a report were the steelers are really high on both the new corners and may let Gay walk because there confident both can start next season



I hope not... I have never been a big Gay fan ( lol) that dont sound good uh?? but for real I have not been high on him at all however I do think he is a decent Dime or Nick guy.. I cant imagine someone paying big money for him so why not bring him back at a low price... also while I think Allen is great... I think brown is at best a nick or dime guy.. I hope he proves me wrong and becomes a solid CB...

One last thought I posted this on another thread.. I would love to see the Steelers become one of the first teams to use their brain and counter the new NFL passing league... Stop bringing in a Safety that hits hard.. they are not needed any m ore.. and as far as that goes the NFL wont allow them to hit hard anyway... someone why not be our Steelers, but someone should pick out a decent CB that can Tackle and blitz a little and make him a S... ( Like William GAY ) he may be average CB at best a nickel player but at S he would be one of the better cover S in the league... Yes I know there are Troy P. out there and ED reeds but those kind of players that can do it all at the S positon are hard to find... it is easy hell very easy to find decent corners that can Tackle... GAY would be a good S in todays league... Townsend would have been a great one towards the end of his contract... I know yall will want to rip me for this but think about this... Even Chad Scott who we hated at times for not being a number one that we needed him to be... but Chad Scott would have made a very solid S covering TE's all day...


Please someone call the Steelers and Tell them the NFL is passing 60 times a game,, The NFL is bringing in TE that are smaller and run like 3rd WR... you would think a D coord or Head coach somewhere would counter that

:banging::banging::banging::banging::banging:

ricardisimo
01-14-2012, 05:04 PM
Please someone call the Steelers and Tell them the NFL is passing 60 times a game,, The NFL is bringing in TE that are smaller and run like 3rd WR... you would think a D coord or Head coach somewhere would counter that

:banging::banging::banging::banging::banging:
You mean something like what our DC did this year? :noidea:

60_MINUTES
01-14-2012, 05:18 PM
You mean something like what our DC did this year? :noidea:



No Im not talking going with a 5 DB nickel set.. which was a good move.. Bringing in Allen and taking a DE off the field... Im saying do it in our base set ... the two are very different.. Im sorry if you dont see what Im talking about I guess its hard to explain on a chat board.,. I do better face to face but anyway... Im saying get rid of the hard hitting run stopping S... your Clarks, ) John Lynch, Brian Dawkins, Etc... mind going blank.. anyway the run stopping hard hitting guys.. replace them with a fast nickel back or for that matter a solid big number 2 CB.. this way your base set has 4 Cover guys on the field... without going to a nickel... to acheive this... Most people I talk to get what Im saying ... Im sorry you dont... Bottom line is in a passing league you have a guy like Clark covering at 3rd wr or TE when our Base set is in... instead of having this mismatch.. why not counter it with a good CB at that spot.. the downside is teams could run ( thats why you pick a guy that can tackle as well and blitz a little) Or you could draft two Troy P who can do it all.. but again those guys are a little hard to come by.. most S are either a John Lynch or a ED Reed... not many guys that can play on the line of scrimage and shut down a number 3 WR... thats what makes Troy and some of those guys special

By the way I agree it was very smart putting him the extra guy against pats.. we stole the idea from big mouth rex ryan who did it earlier that year... Once again Im saying change the concept of D all together with your base packages.. Fullbacks are leaving.. running is leaving.. I dont like it but its the new NFL... you have to counter it

ItalianSteelersFan178443
01-14-2012, 05:18 PM
I didn't know much if anything on C. Allen during the draft, but when the Steelers drafted him I did my research and when he was at The Citadel he was a guy who loved to play tight man-to-man defense (just like I. Taylor). Although he is a little undersized he is so physical at the line and showed his speed on S.T's. I am super high on this guy and I believe he can be a solid #2 guy at best and even on his bad days he may play at #3. I am also high on C. Brown who can play man-to-man, he can play off and play the deep ball. He is a little undersized too, but had one of the highest verticals last year at the combine. I still believe that CB is big area of need though but we have a really good foundation with C. Allen, C. Brown, and W. Gay. I think Gay definitely does not get enough credit. He had a really good year at the #2 and even though he was picked on more than any other CB on the team he held his own, had some stupid plays but he is not at that level yet, I think that he is going to continue to grow into a solid CB and maybe one day become the teams #1. I think that the team will let go of K. Lewis, B. McFadden, and A. Madison as well.

60_MINUTES
01-14-2012, 05:25 PM
another way to look at it... teams on OFF are running either a 3 wr set or at least double TE... not those TE that block a double TD set with guys LB just cant seem to cover... with this look we are in a Base D... so our number one CB covers their number one our Two is on their 2 our FS takes TE, and our LB takes RB out of backfield.. this is what happens in the past... prob is who has the other TE... ( a run stopping S ) OFFense teams look for the match up of RB on LB or TE on that slow hard hitting S... So your counter that with two guys that can cover... we are actually lucky cause we got troy who is a GOD and can do it all... alot of team would be subject to being run on because of having two CB playing safety... but we are better off when it comes to that

60_MINUTES
01-14-2012, 05:28 PM
I didn't know much if anything on C. Allen during the draft, but when the Steelers drafted him I did my research and when he was at The Citadel he was a guy who loved to play tight man-to-man defense (just like I. Taylor). Although he is a little undersized he is so physical at the line and showed his speed on S.T's. I am super high on this guy and I believe he can be a solid #2 guy at best and even on his bad days he may play at #3. I am also high on C. Brown who can play man-to-man, he can play off and play the deep ball. He is a little undersized too, but had one of the highest verticals last year at the combine. I still believe that CB is big area of need though but we have a really good foundation with C. Allen, C. Brown, and W. Gay. I think Gay definitely does not get enough credit. He had a really good year at the #2 and even though he was picked on more than any other CB on the team he held his own, had some stupid plays but he is not at that level yet, I think that he is going to continue to grow into a solid CB and maybe one day become the teams #1. I think that the team will let go of K. Lewis, B. McFadden, and A. Madison as well.



I agree with you for the most part except the undersized thing... Allen is 6 foot 1 and 200 pounds .. this is one of the things I think makes him special... he can run and is not a liitle guy

steelers33
01-14-2012, 05:54 PM
Too hard to tell as of right now. After his second or maybe third year we should know what the kid has. Scouting report on him said he has the physical tools, but needs to be coached up to be more mentally focused in the game. And with Carnell Lake ( a great teacher ) as our dbacks coach I feel confident about his development.

60_MINUTES
01-15-2012, 06:18 PM
Too hard to tell as of right now. After his second or maybe third year we should know what the kid has. Scouting report on him said he has the physical tools, but needs to be coached up to be more mentally focused in the game. And with Carnell Lake ( a great teacher ) as our dbacks coach I feel confident about his development.



I agree about lake... I think he may be one of the most important good things we have done in years... I know we played a weak Sch as far as opp QB.s this year but I think Gay and Lewis playing better this year has to have something to do with Lake... He was solid during his days here for sure.. Im glad we have him back

bornaSteelersfan
01-16-2012, 12:41 AM
I said it right after the draft was over:

Re: Consensus: worst draft in AFCN
04-30-2011, 06:13 PM

"... 4) Cortez Allen - Excellent value with raw talent that hasn't yet been trained. His history says football hasn't been the top focus as far as time in his life (Due to his college). With Steelers coaching and a good work ethic, he could become THE shut down corner in a few years. He also has much softer hands than Ike.
..."

60_MINUTES
01-16-2012, 08:14 PM
I said it right after the draft was over:

Re: Consensus: worst draft in AFCN
04-30-2011, 06:13 PM

"... 4) Cortez Allen - Excellent value with raw talent that hasn't yet been trained. His history says football hasn't been the top focus as far as time in his life (Due to his college). With Steelers coaching and a good work ethic, he could become THE shut down corner in a few years. He also has much softer hands than Ike.
..."




Good sounds like you and me are two of the smartest Steeler fans in histroy