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Bayz101
10-09-2012, 02:08 AM
Wednesday, October 9th, 2012
By Tiger Rowan
Steelers Fever Columnist

Part way through the Eagles-Steelers game, my brother turned to me, and stated, “The Steelers gave the correct wide receiver (Antonio Brown) the money.”

Indeed.

In case you missed the game, Mike Wallace quit. You can sugar-coat it all you want to and/or blame it on the rain (fallin’, fallin’), but there is no way around it: Mike Wallace had one of the most apathetic performances that I have seen in a long time.

Any and every player can have a bad game. I understand that. Cornerbacks get beaten; running backs run into walls of defenders; and quarterbacks throw three interceptions. Bad games are a part of playing sports.

But, what Mike Wallace did was completely different.

A player can try their hardest, and through no fault of their own, have a bad game… due to being slightly off and/or due to the opposition being in a zone. Sometimes, the better team just wins (or, the worse team wins, because they played the perfect game)… even though a player might be putting forth their full effort. That is the beauty of sports.

Read more of this editorial: http://www.steelersfever.com/editorials/1015.html

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Make sure you click the "Read More" link, it's a good one! Thanks Tiger! :drink:

Hawaii 5-0
10-09-2012, 03:13 AM
oh great, just what we needed...another Mike Wallace thread! :chuckle:

Bayz101
10-09-2012, 03:19 AM
oh great, just what we needed...another Mike Wallace thread! :chuckle:

:rofl:

Thank god that contract bullshit ended, I was going insane! :chuckle:

EbonySteel86
10-09-2012, 06:47 AM
Dude was being interfered with the whole game, Refs didn't call any of them.

Bayz101
10-09-2012, 07:03 AM
Dude was being interfered with the whole game, Refs didn't call any of them.

Too busy keeping an eye on Colon to see if he was holding for the hundredth time.

WVABE
10-09-2012, 07:17 AM
He has quit like Plax quit, adios dude.

maddog78
10-09-2012, 08:08 AM
"Part way through the Eagles-Steelers game, my brother turned to me, and stated, “The Steelers gave the correct wide receiver (Antonio Brown) the money.”

Indeed. "

The one who fumbled the Oakland game away, dropped a long TD in the Eagles game, and played a subpar game in general after mocking Eagles' DB's during the week? The guy with one TD in four games?

I'm starting to think they paid Brown too much, too early in his career.

maddog78
10-09-2012, 08:09 AM
And Wallace is definitely not worth the money he wants. If Santonio gets a clean bill of health next spring, I'd love to see the Steelers get him on the cheap so they can spend money on the defense.

TRH
10-09-2012, 09:53 AM
i don't know that i'd say "he quit", but he was definitely "loafing".....a problem that goes back through the entire last half of last year.
Watch some of the other BIG time receivers in the league play and then watch Wallace. There's definitely a drop-off in effort and tenacity.

No way the Steelers will up any offer they've already made at this point. I've said before that another team will likely pony up more money (just look at the way some of the dumb teams in the league lavishly, and now foolishly, threw money around this off-season.....Bills anyone?). But he won't get it here.

TRH
10-09-2012, 09:54 AM
And Wallace is definitely not worth the money he wants. If Santonio gets a clean bill of health next spring, I'd love to see the Steelers get him on the cheap so they can spend money on the defense.



They'll never bring him back here. Not only would they not do it in the first place, he's also had "prima donna" issues over there as well...
Never happen.

teegre
10-09-2012, 11:36 AM
Whoops!!! I made a double post. Sorry.

teegre
10-09-2012, 11:36 AM
"Part way through the Eagles-Steelers game, my brother turned to me, and stated, “The Steelers gave the correct wide receiver (Antonio Brown) the money.”

Indeed. "

The one who fumbled the Oakland game away, dropped a long TD in the Eagles game, and played a subpar game in general after mocking Eagles' DB's during the week? The guy with one TD in four games?

I'm starting to think they paid Brown too much, too early in his career.

As I mentioned: every player can have a bad game.

The difference is that AB had a fumble while TRYING to get more yards. Effort. Whereas, Wallace stood still & watched two defenders jump at a ball in the end-zone. No effort.

As far as the Eagles game: true, AB had an average game... but, it was still the best game if any of the receivers. His dropped TD was off of his fingertips... a difficult catch, and one he should have made... but, he was TRYING to catch it... as opposed to standing still & watching the ball hit the defender in the hands.

Lastly, it's not just TDs. BB looks for AB on third down... and AB converts a ton of those. He is the drive-lengthener.

maddog78
10-09-2012, 01:02 PM
As I mentioned: every player can have a bad game.

The difference is that AB had a fumble while TRYING to get more yards. Effort. Whereas, Wallace stood still & watched two defenders jump at a ball in the end-zone. No effort.

As far as the Eagles game: true, AB had an average game... but, it was still the best game if any of the receivers. His dropped TD was off of his fingertips... a difficult catch, and one he should have made... but, he was TRYING to catch it... as opposed to standing still & watching the ball hit the defender in the hands.

Lastly, it's not just TDs. BB looks for AB on third down... and AB converts a ton of those. He is the drive-lengthener.

Don't get me wrong, I like me some Brown, and I don't want to see the team pay Wallace what he wants for many of the reasons stated.

I'm just a tad worried that the money may be getting to AB's head a bit.

Darkstorm05
10-09-2012, 01:06 PM
Lastly, it's not just TDs. BB looks for AB on third down... and AB converts a ton of those. He is the drive-lengthener.

This. Last I checked, AB had way more yards and about twice the number of 1st downs. Even on his down games, he usually does ok. He's providing better value.

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-09-2012, 01:08 PM
Maybe showing up for training camp in person is better than getting "mental reps" while holding out???

Bayz101
10-09-2012, 01:10 PM
I'm upset with Wallace as far as his effort goes. He just doesn't seem to have his heart in it, and when he gets frustrated, his effort plunges. But, as I've heard many, many times. He DOES draw an extra defender on a consistent basis, and that DOES benefit the other receivers. I won't sit here and tell you he's worth 11 million dollars though, because he ISN'T if he doesn't work on his effort a little bit.

If Ben doesn't hit him on the hands, he seems to give up even trying to make the catch, especially in the End Zone. Their was an instance in which Ben threw one into the End Zone and Wallace didn't even attempt to make the grab.

Sure, he probably wouldn't have got it, but at least GIVE A SHIT.

Darkstorm05
10-09-2012, 01:11 PM
Maybe showing up for training camp in person is better than getting "mental reps" while holding out???

New playbooks are for chumps when you're famous for running in a straight line as fast as you can. 11 mil a year, right there.

Darkstorm05
10-09-2012, 01:13 PM
I'm upset with Wallace as far as his effort goes. He just doesn't seem to have his heart in it, and when he gets frustrated, his effort plunges.

But, as I've heard many, many times. He DOES draw an extra defender on a consistent basis, and that DOES benefit the other receivers.

This is true to an extent...and I also see people saying he's being held...but he just doesn't look fast like he used to. Early last year wouldn't he have just taken off and left those holders behind? Doesn't seem the same this year. I don't think we've seen a play yet where he took off and was 5 yards beyond the safeties. Have they learned to play him...or is he going slower?

teegre
10-09-2012, 02:08 PM
Don't get me wrong, I like me some Brown, and I don't want to see the team pay Wallace what he wants for many of the reasons stated.

I'm just a tad worried that the money may be getting to AB's head a bit.

I see your point, and understand what you're saying, but I am not worried.

While he doesn't have TDs, AB makes the small plays that matter (3rd down conversions, YAC, et cetera). Likewise, unlike some players who "play down" after a contract (Chris Johnson), AB is actually trying (100% effort, on every play).

And, the cockiness is simply the modern NFL. Michael Irvin was as cocky as the come, and he bugged me to no end... but I'd have loved to have him as a Steeler. (Make sense?)

[Note: I am not saying AB is nearly the level of Irvin... yet.]

teegre
10-09-2012, 02:12 PM
I'm upset with Wallace as far as his effort goes. He just doesn't seem to have his heart in it, and when he gets frustrated, his effort plunges. But, as I've heard many, many times. He DOES draw an extra defender on a consistent basis, and that DOES benefit the other receivers. I won't sit here and tell you he's worth 11 million dollars though, because he ISN'T if he doesn't work on his effort a little bit.

If Ben doesn't hit him on the hands, he seems to give up even trying to make the catch, especially in the End Zone. Their was an instance in which Ben threw one into the End Zone and Wallace didn't even attempt to make the grab.

Sure, he probably wouldn't have got it, but at least GIVE A SHIT.

Exactly: give a darn about the play... don't give up... put forth some effort... et cetera...

Also, as far as being held, it reminds me of the Pats-Colts games, where the Pats CBs woudl badger the Colts WRs... because it got in their heads. It seems like Wallac eis having the same thing happen to him: he is letting the "legal" holding (small tugs on his jersey) divert him.

Lastly, Wallace catches the ball with his body (not his arms). If he would extend, a lot of those "overthrown" balls would be caught. Similarly, if he extended his arms, he would have far more receptions. As it is, when one does not extend one's arms, it reduces the angle of the ball, and in turn, those 10 yard distances between Wallace & the CB into a 5 yard difference (and, 5 yard distances become batted balls).

Fire Arians
10-09-2012, 02:25 PM
I'm upset with Wallace as far as his effort goes. He just doesn't seem to have his heart in it, and when he gets frustrated, his effort plunges. But, as I've heard many, many times. He DOES draw an extra defender on a consistent basis, and that DOES benefit the other receivers. I won't sit here and tell you he's worth 11 million dollars though, because he ISN'T if he doesn't work on his effort a little bit.

If Ben doesn't hit him on the hands, he seems to give up even trying to make the catch, especially in the End Zone. Their was an instance in which Ben threw one into the End Zone and Wallace didn't even attempt to make the grab.

Sure, he probably wouldn't have got it, but at least GIVE A SHIT.

should let him walk and re-sign mendenhall. if this game was anything, i'd rather pay someone who is putting in 100% and making a difference. and that wasn't wallace. don't get me wrong, wallace is ultra talented but it upsets me to no end to see this guy basically quit on plays

and for those doubting mendenhall, you won't for long. mendenhall is light years beyond our other RB's in the talent department, in the right offensive system he will be huge (aka not the arians offense)

El-Gonzo Jackson
10-09-2012, 02:59 PM
and for those doubting mendenhall, you won't for long. mendenhall is light years beyond our other RB's in the talent department, in the right offensive system he will be huge (aka not the arians offense)

Are you trying to say that a lead block by Will Johnson, a screen pass with Gilbert out in front of Mendenhall is a better offense than handing him the ball with no lead blocker??......................OK, you may have a point. :doh:

steeltheone
10-09-2012, 03:03 PM
Now, I know that is was only one game, and Wallace’s first three games were spectacular...

Just what did Wallace do in the first 3 games that was spectacular?

steeltheone
10-09-2012, 03:05 PM
Don't get me wrong, I like me some Brown, and I don't want to see the team pay Wallace what he wants for many of the reasons stated.

I'm just a tad worried that the money may be getting to AB's head a bit. I'm just a tad worried he is not as good as the money he gets !

teegre
10-09-2012, 04:00 PM
Now, I know that is was only one game, and Wallace’s first three games were spectacular...

Just what did Wallace do in the first 3 games that was spectacular?

17 receptions, 234 yards, 3 TDs (which still 12th in the league, depsite having a bye week).

Fire Arians
10-09-2012, 04:15 PM
17 receptions, 234 yards, 3 TDs (which still 12th in the league, depsite having a bye week).

could be more if he doesnt quit on plays. his talent is undeniable, but his attitude / work ethic bothers me.

SteelersFever
10-09-2012, 04:32 PM
could be more if he doesnt quit on plays. his talent is undeniable, but his attitude / work ethic bothers me.

Wallace may have more touchdowns than Wallace, but Brown has more yards. Not to mention most of those touchdowns came in our two losses, if i'm not mistaken. Not really a statistic to make any case on this early in the season, but it's interesting when compared to Wallace's notable habit of giving up. At least it sure looks like he doesn't give a shit at times.

OX1947
10-09-2012, 05:29 PM
You can save all the breath you need about Wallace because it doesn't take a lot to explain him. He is a bitch. Period. Nothing is going to change it. There are Wallace's all across this world. Those who care about themselves, the money they will eventually spend and then be broke 2 years out the league, and then suing the NFL for negligence. We have seen it many times. We have Brown and Sanders. Those two seem to make catches when it trult matters. Same with Heath and now with Mendy back, just use Wallace when you can and thats it. Let him walk after the season and steelers will find another stud reciever in the 3rd or 4th round.

Hawaii 5-0
10-09-2012, 05:50 PM
Whoops!!! I made a double post. Sorry.

sure, you probably did it on purpose to drive up your post count... :pw: :toofunny:

tony hipchest
10-09-2012, 06:22 PM
nobody has mentioned that mike wallace may suck just as bad as the texan's andre johnson, or that he may just not be as good as miami's brian hartline. :hunch:

mikegrimey
10-09-2012, 06:28 PM
Wallace may have more touchdowns than Wallace, but Brown has more yards. Not to mention most of those touchdowns came in our two losses, if i'm not mistaken. Not really a statistic to make any case on this early in the season, but it's interesting when compared to Wallace's notable habit of giving up. At least it sure looks like he doesn't give a shit at times.

Wallace had one touchdown in each of our first three games. Antonio Browns has only one, in our third game, which came in a loss too (although why that's relevant I don't know, they were competetive games, there were no blow outs, the opposing D shutting down and padded stats from those games.) Wallace has a lot lot lot lot more TDs than any other WR (or player) on our team since he got here. It's not the only important factor, but it is a telling stat.

austinfrench76
10-09-2012, 06:38 PM
I am a Wallace fan but he did quit in that last game. Not sure why, but he sure did.

steeltheone
10-09-2012, 06:57 PM
17 receptions, 234 yards, 3 TDs (which still 12th in the league, depsite having a bye week). Thats ok, not Spectacular...All the stats came from the Raiders game ( both starting corners out ) So against NFL starters, he is 11 rec...128 yards and 2 tds....Thats just not big time receiver stats!

steeltheone
10-09-2012, 06:59 PM
Wallace had one touchdown in each of our first three games. Antonio Browns has only one, in our third game, which came in a loss too (although why that's relevant I don't know, they were competetive games, there were no blow outs, the opposing D shutting down and padded stats from those games.) Wallace has a lot lot lot lot more TDs than any other WR (or player) on our team since he got here. It's not the only important factor, but it is a telling stat.
Check yourself...all Wallaces yards came against the Raiders backups..

teegre
10-09-2012, 10:40 PM
could be more if he doesnt quit on plays. his talent is undeniable, but his attitude / work ethic bothers me.

Exactly. Those are good numbers, but to be Fitzgerald-esque, all Wallace needs to do is show some effort.

The difference between Hines Ward and most other WRs, is that Ward simply tried harder. Put Ward's attitude into Wallace's body, and you have Larry Fitzgerald.

Well, maybe not Fitzgerald... but, someone really, really good.

teegre
10-09-2012, 10:47 PM
Thats ok, not Spectacular...All the stats came from the Raiders game ( both starting corners out ) So against NFL starters, he is 11 rec...128 yards and 2 tds....Thats just not big time receiver stats!

1. Even without the Raidahs game, for those two other games, he is averaging: 5 receptions, 64 yards, and a TD.
...which are respectable numbers.

That expands to a season total of: 88 receptions, 1,024 yards, and 16 TDs.
...which is very respectable.

2. Wait... you have me arguing for Wallace. Did Wallace have a good first three games or not...???
...uh... that is not the point.

The point is: Wallace quit... regardless of whether his first three games were spectacular, average, or horrible.

maddog78
10-10-2012, 12:32 AM
Exactly. Those are good numbers, but to be Fitzgerald-esque, all Wallace needs to do is show some effort.

The difference between Hines Ward and most other WRs, is that Ward simply tried harder. Put Ward's attitude into Wallace's body, and you have Larry Fitzgerald.

Well, maybe not Fitzgerald... but, someone really, really good.

Maybe Ward wouldn't be Ward if he had Wallace's body. Ward was built like a safety, Wallace is built like a speed burning deep threat.

teegre
10-10-2012, 12:54 AM
Maybe Ward wouldn't be Ward if he had Wallace's body. Ward was built like a safety, Wallace is built like a speed burning deep threat.

Ergo, a correction in my statement:

Ward's drive, combined with Wallace's speed, equals a really awesome, unstoppable, TD-catching, deep-threat WR... who blocks. :wink02:

mikegrimey
10-10-2012, 03:24 AM
Check yourself...all Wallaces yards came against the Raiders backups..

I said nothing about his "yards", and that's an incorrect statement anyway.

pete74
10-10-2012, 05:26 AM
wow are you guys nuts. your actually trying to say Wallace didnt earn his yards because he got them against a backup corner? are you freaking kidding me? he had one bad game, get over it.

Bayz101
10-10-2012, 05:38 AM
I'm personally not mad about his performance. He gives up a lot, especially when things aren't going his way. This dates back to the entire second half of last year, and I noticed him completely give up on multiple plays yesterday. Wallace's performance isn't an issue in my eyes. He may have less yards than Brown, but he also has three touchdowns. It's his heart and determination that worry me.

It's not just me, either. Several people have noted that he gives up, not to mention he catches everything with his chest and rarely extends his arms to make grabs out in front of him. But, again, it's not his stats that worry me. Not at all. It's his effort.

Steeldude
10-10-2012, 07:33 AM
And Wallace is definitely not worth the money he wants. If Santonio gets a clean bill of health next spring, I'd love to see the Steelers get him on the cheap so they can spend money on the defense.

Please no. Holmes is overrated.

maddog78
10-10-2012, 08:23 AM
Please no. Holmes is overrated.

Go back and watch the 2008 playoffs. He came up big in every single game. He's a big game player. We could have used him in 2010.

Darkstorm05
10-10-2012, 08:50 AM
Go back and watch the 2008 playoffs. He came up big in every single game. He's a big game player. We could have used him in 2010.

2010 when he put up 746 yards and like 6 TDs? Wallace did way better. Brown has been better, too. If Holmes were with us now he'd be 3rd behind both of them.

steelfury02
10-10-2012, 09:20 AM
If you've watched him being interviewed by other teammates over time, it is obvious he got full of himself fairly quickly and is in fact in it for himself most of the time.

It is a job, and like in any career, you have to look out for your own best interest. He will get the star recognition and his name will carry him for at least a few seasons if in fact he does leave the Steelers in whatever scenario. Brown took note of Hines' career and the longevity of it looked a lot nicer than Holmes' flash in the pan.

IMHO, Holmes will be paid all or most of the remainder of his contract with the Jets - and then you'll see him bounce around like T.O. for a little while and that'll be it at his current rate

Wallace might not have the same noted off the field problems, I could see him possibly ending up like Boldin in Baltimore. He could go to another contender for a medium-low price.

teegre
10-10-2012, 09:37 AM
I'm personally not mad about his performance. He gives up a lot, especially when things aren't going his way. This dates back to the entire second half of last year, and I noticed him completely give up on multiple plays yesterday. Wallace's performance isn't an issue in my eyes. He may have less yards than Brown, but he also has three touchdowns. It's his heart and determination that worry me.

It's not just me, either. Several people have noted that he gives up, not to mention he catches everything with his chest and rarely extends his arms to make grabs out in front of him. But, again, it's not his stats that worry me. Not at all. It's his effort.

Exactly.

Wallace's TDs or yards or receptions are not what people are concerned about; it's Wallace's lack of effort. Very DeSean Jackson-esque... both of whom are amazing talents, but have shown that they will "give up."

Another name: Eric Green... laying on the ground... in the 1994 AFCCG... at the 3 yard line... as opposed to getting up (or even rolling) into the end-zone.

And, spot on. Wallace catches the ball completely wrong. He'd be twice as good, if he extended his arms. When he allows the ball to fall into his chest, it not only makes a drop more likely, it negates his height, which allows DBs to bat away passes easier.

I saw a sports science (or something on ESPN) about Megatron, and how he caught the ball at the pinnacle of his leap. Add in his ridiculous arm span, and he had a 14 inch advantage over any DB in the league. Conversely, again, Wallace catches the ball at chest level, which allows DBs easier access for knocking the ball away... especially on jump balls (a battle that never seems to go his way).

Furthermore, considering the angle of a ball arriving at his chest versus the angle when arriving at his extended arms, it negates some of his speed. He "has" to be 3-5 yards ahead if a CB (which he usually is), because he catches the ball so low; if he caught the ball with his arms extended, he'd be nearly unstoppable (i.e. even when "covered", he'd be able to make the reception)... like 16 TDs type of unstoppable.

The attitude could be just one game. We can hope that he was just in a funky mood. Hope... hope... hope...

The arm thing has been there from day one. If he could correct that... again, wow!!! ...he'd be a truly great player. Alas, I'm sure that the coaches have worked on it; ergo, it's probably just who he is/how he's going to always catch the ball.

tony hipchest
10-10-2012, 10:04 AM
unfair comparison to megatron who is almos 6'5" and 230 lbs. he can probably dunk on an 11 foot rim.

wallace 6'0" 200 lbs and built more like hines ward.

Steelerfreak58
10-10-2012, 10:17 AM
Not surprising really.

TRH
10-10-2012, 10:25 AM
the thing that surprised me most about Wallace has been his transformation.

When he arrived as a youngster - he seemed so humble, very thankful to be in the NFL, wanting to work hard
Now that he's been in the league a couple years - cocky, aloof, dogs it on occasion now, "all about me" attitude

I blame this on a couple things. One, his agent and ones that surround him obviously have been detrimental to his character, image, and possible business end of it. Two, some people buy into their own hype. Mike has obviously listened to the accolades, embraced them, and now has a big head.

Steelerfreak58
10-10-2012, 10:39 AM
the thing that surprised me most about Wallace has been his transformation.

When he arrived as a youngster - he seemed so humble, very thankful to be in the NFL, wanting to work hard
Now that he's been in the league a couple years - cocky, aloof, dogs it on occasion now, "all about me" attitude

I blame this on a couple things. One, his agent and ones that surround him obviously have been detrimental to his character, image, and possible business end of it. Two, some people buy into their own hype. Mike has obviously listened to the accolades, embraced them, and now has a big head.

I blame him and him alone. He is the one on the field, he is the one who sat out all of TC, he is the one taking plays off. Why pass the buck? He gets paid a lot of money to play a GAME.

teegre
10-10-2012, 11:54 AM
unfair comparison to megatron who is almos 6'5" and 230 lbs. he can probably dunk on an 11 foot rim.

wallace 6'0" 200 lbs and built more like hines ward.

The point is still the same:
arms extended > trapping the ball in one's chest

The sports science segment (or whatever it was on ESPN) just happened to use Megatron as their example. The crux was that leaping plus extended arms equals less chance for a DB to bat the ball away (regardless of who the WR is).