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View Full Version : Is Colbert Quietly on the 'Hot Seat'?


SteelersCanada
01-18-2013, 06:22 PM
I know this might not be the popular opinion or a well-recognized one, but I think that Colbert might in fact be on the hot seat. Looking back for a second, take a look at the contrasting opinions of the team that Colbert and Tomlin have expressed. Mike said the traditional coach-type things - disappointing season, obviously not where we wanted to be, we have room to improve.

Colbert, on the other hand, was far more blunt, upfront and almost confrontational. His message that the entire team should be on their toes and they're " ... not married to any free agents" makes me think that Colbert might be feeling pressure from up top, not Tomlin.

Let's look at the draft picks from the last couple of years.

A great example of missing on draft picks would be the '08 draft. Not only did we miss on almost every single pick in that draft, we missed on the most essential ones. Now, Mendenhall is going to walk from the team and test free agency. This fact might not have been important if we had a legitimate RB on the roster to replace him with. Now, we're almost forced to use a fairly high pick on a RB in either this draft or next years.

We could also point to missing on Limas Sweed, too. We're in a very similar situation with with our receivers that we are with our 'backs. We're forced to use a high pick in again, this year or next years draft because of talent walking away and having little-to-no depth behind our starters.

That's just the '08 draft, though. Let's go ahead and look at the more recent ones. In 2009, we took Ziggy and for the most part, he has been underwhelming. He hasn't looked like a first round pick in the snaps he has received and ultimately, the starting role he walked into. Now, this could be because we were used to seeing Smith in that role or it could be, quite frankly, he isn't very good. 2010, 2011 and 2012 we seemed to hit on our first round picks. Heyward and DeCastro have both shown flashes and great potential in the time they have started, but are going to need more time to get an accurate representation of these guys.

It's not just about missing on draft picks, though. Look at the current cap situation we're in - it's a mess. Now, this could be a joint-effort between him and Khan but ultimately, the current contract situation we're in falls on the shoulders of Colbert. Being this far over the cap and admitting that "we don't have many franchise players" is a serious problem and one that needs to be addressed. I don't know whose idea it was to give Harrison that lucrative a deal when he was starting to show signs of aging, but that problem will ultimately fall on Colbert and Harrison's ridiculous cap hit is one of the many problems we're facing this offseason.

Colbert's response to questions seemed cold and of a guy who realizes that another down year with another series of missed draft picks might spell out the end of for him. With the interest in Khan over the last few years, I don't know how much longer we can keep him around. If next offseason we're in a similar mess with another series of ridiculous contracts and a series of missed draft picks, Colbert could ultimately be on his way out the door and I think he knows it. It's why in his interview he sounded more angry and frustrated than he has in the past and this could be because he realizes he has to make this offseason work or he's going to be working for another team come this time next year. With the way the Browns are hiring everyone off the street, it could be Cleveland.

StainlessStill
01-18-2013, 06:34 PM
No.

Fire Haley
01-18-2013, 06:38 PM
Is Ben on the hot seat?

"Trade him to Arizona for three #1 picks!"

SteelersCanada
01-18-2013, 06:40 PM
Somehow I knew I was going to get these.

I'm not asking for him to be fired, or for Ben to be traded (why is every thread a Ben thread now?) but there's a reason why we're in the current situation we're in with the lack of depth and/or franchise guys. We haven't hit in the draft and our cap situation is so poor we can't afford to dip into free agency. That falls on the GM, guys.

Fire Haley
01-18-2013, 06:47 PM
You're playing the blame game, I understand that


I'll give him one more draft before I give him the boot - but that's just me

harrison'samonster
01-18-2013, 06:48 PM
Tomlin usually gives the typical coach-speak answers. I know that's one reason why some ppl on this board don't like him, and I'm not saying that's all he's thinking, I'm sure he's just not saying all he's thinking.

You might be reading too much into it. If we go another 2 or 3 seasons in a downward path though, maybe there will be some changes at the top.

teegre
01-18-2013, 06:51 PM
2008:
Horrid. Everyone agrees on that. BUT, at the time, EVERYONE loved it... espeically Limas Sweed. In hindsight, it was an utter failure, but who would have known that both Spinny & Sweed would ahve mental issues... and, Tony Hilsl was a R1 prospect that dropped due to injury, and the Steelers take a calculated risk on him. Lastly, Bruce Davis was a sack machine... who simply never panned out. It happens.

2009: Hood, Wallace, Lewis, and DJ Johnson. Hood had been good, and Wallace was a home run. Lewis coudl eb a home run, and Johnson played well for a R7 pick. Getting four players who contribute is a good draft. Oh, and Urbik was cut by his position coach... and ended up starting on another roster (ie not Colbert's fault).

2010: Pouncey was a grand slam. AB was a home run... found in R6. Sanders could be a good pick. Worilds is alright, as has been Dwyer. Sylvester initially showed promise... but, he was a R5 pick. That is six who have contributed: a great draft.

2011: Heyward might be good, but he has not played enough to pass judgement on. Gilbert has played well. Cortez Allen is a home run. Carter is a question mark (much like Worilds). Adn, Baron Batch is a good special teamer. That is five who have contributed.

2012: Rainey allegedly hit a woman, and Ta'amu drove drunk. Gone and likely gone. DD was injured, but I love that pick. Spence was also injured, and also a pick that I love. Adams showed promis, and Paulson the coaches like. Beachum was a steal for a R7 pick (not a Tom Brady or an AB type of steal, but a steal nonetheless). That is five who contributed... and two who might wear orange jump suits.

SUMMATION:
These past three drafts have been pretty darn good. The 2002 draft (Randel El, Foote, Keisel, Hope) laid the groundwork for the 2005 (and the 2008) SuperBowls. These past three drafts are just as good (if not better).

So... no.

teegre
01-18-2013, 06:55 PM
So... why does it feel liek he is on the hot seat?

Because, after years of not drafting players with "questionable character", the Steelers took two in one draft: Ta'amu & Rainey.

In turn, Colbert is probably embarrassed (which makes me think that he went for these two guys, and ended up being wrong).

That's my theory.

Sort of like in 1996, at the opening of training camp, when Cowher ripped a hole in Bam Morris's image, by saying that "that" type of player has no business being on this team!!! Everyoen took notice (and, Cowher was exorcising his demons, from having been such a Bam supporter... only to get egg on his face).

Fire Arians
01-18-2013, 07:18 PM
come on man

steelbelieve
01-18-2013, 07:20 PM
I know this might not be the popular opinion or a well-recognized one, but I think that Colbert might in fact be on the hot seat. Looking back for a second, take a look at the contrasting opinions of the team that Colbert and Tomlin have expressed. Mike said the traditional coach-type things - disappointing season, obviously not where we wanted to be, we have room to improve.

Colbert, on the other hand, was far more blunt, upfront and almost confrontational. His message that the entire team should be on their toes and they're " ... not married to any free agents" makes me think that Colbert might be feeling pressure from up top, not Tomlin.

Let's look at the draft picks from the last couple of years.

A great example of missing on draft picks would be the '08 draft. Not only did we miss on almost every single pick in that draft, we missed on the most essential ones. Now, Mendenhall is going to walk from the team and test free agency. This fact might not have been important if we had a legitimate RB on the roster to replace him with. Now, we're almost forced to use a fairly high pick on a RB in either this draft or next years.

We could also point to missing on Limas Sweed, too. We're in a very similar situation with with our receivers that we are with our 'backs. We're forced to use a high pick in again, this year or next years draft because of talent walking away and having little-to-no depth behind our starters.

That's just the '08 draft, though. Let's go ahead and look at the more recent ones. In 2009, we took Ziggy and for the most part, he has been underwhelming. He hasn't looked like a first round pick in the snaps he has received and ultimately, the starting role he walked into. Now, this could be because we were used to seeing Smith in that role or it could be, quite frankly, he isn't very good. 2010, 2011 and 2012 we seemed to hit on our first round picks. Heyward and DeCastro have both shown flashes and great potential in the time they have started, but are going to need more time to get an accurate representation of these guys.

It's not just about missing on draft picks, though. Look at the current cap situation we're in - it's a mess. Now, this could be a joint-effort between him and Khan but ultimately, the current contract situation we're in falls on the shoulders of Colbert. Being this far over the cap and admitting that "we don't have many franchise players" is a serious problem and one that needs to be addressed. I don't know whose idea it was to give Harrison that lucrative a deal when he was starting to show signs of aging, but that problem will ultimately fall on Colbert and Harrison's ridiculous cap hit is one of the many problems we're facing this offseason.

Colbert's response to questions seemed cold and of a guy who realizes that another down year with another series of missed draft picks might spell out the end of for him. With the interest in Khan over the last few years, I don't know how much longer we can keep him around. If next offseason we're in a similar mess with another series of ridiculous contracts and a series of missed draft picks, Colbert could ultimately be on his way out the door and I think he knows it. It's why in his interview he sounded more angry and frustrated than he has in the past and this could be because he realizes he has to make this offseason work or he's going to be working for another team come this time next year. With the way the Browns are hiring everyone off the street, it could be Cleveland.

you realize that Colbert just finished up the first year of a five year contract he signed last spring.

Riddle_Of_Steel
01-18-2013, 08:27 PM
come on man

I am designing an algorithm-- it will determine the level of backlash received from fellow posters in comparison to the level of controversiality of the post.

The deeper into the bowels of the organization we level criticism, the more resistance is encountered from fellow members.

You should know, CANADA, that certain people in the Steelers' org are untouchable in the fans' eyes.

Teegre, did a very good job of listing out all the draft picks since 2008. But really, out of all the 4 or 5 guys per draft that "panned out"-- how many of them are domiant, game-changing players like we expect as fans of this team?

It took Timmons until this year to figure out what the hell he is supposed to be doing.

Woodley is turning into Lamar the Hutt.

Hood has been descent, but not awe-inspiring at all. Can't tell yet about Heyward.

We are about to let Mendenhall walk away over a petty personality conflict.

Sweed was garbage. Bruce Davis was garbage.

We have a number of starters that came from those drafts, and they got us to an 8-8 season. Pouncey, Wallace, and Brown are about the only guys that are still playing at a high level, or that did not fall off a cliff after one successful season.

KC is a far better GM than 99% of them out there-- but he is not perfect. His tone of late would strongly suggest the psychology behind what CANADA is suggesting.

I don't think his job is in danger this year-- but I am sure the Rooneys have made it clear they are not happy with what most of our recent drafts have produced on teh field.

Are you really happy with all of the personnel we have right now? The Ravens were also hit with the injury bug this year and lost 3 former DPOY over the coursse of the season at times (Reed, Lewis, and Suggs), but they are still in the playoffs and looking for their next title because their roster had better depth behind te estarters than the Steelers. The blame for that has to fall on KC and the personnel department, at least partially.

SteelersCanada
01-18-2013, 10:43 PM
Thank you, Riddle, for understanding my post.

I'm not asking him to be fired or let go this offseason, and I'm not playing the blame game. I was recognizing that there has been some issues in this organization in regards to the draft, free agency, lucrative contracts, etc. and some of that has to fall on the shoulders of the GM. His own words were "we don't have very many franchise players on this roster" and we're 15 million over the cap? I'm sorry, but that's a serious problem that needs to be addressed. Harrison having a cap hit over 10 million dollars is another serious problem. Not having depth at very many - if any - defensive positions on this roster is another serious problem and some of those, if not all, fall on the shoulders of Colbert.

Again, I'm not calling for his head or asking him to be fired this offseason. I'm asking for some level-headed thinking about the issues that are on this team and where they might be coming from instead of just blaming Tomlin and Ben.

Thank you Teegre for the logical response and you're right - we have drafted well in the later rounds. The problem is, we're not hitting with the first two - three on a consistent basis and that has to change. We've managed to draft special teams players with great consistency, but have failed to draft starters and that, again, falls on scouting but ultimately Colbert.

OX1947
01-18-2013, 11:38 PM
Is this an Onion article posed as a thread post?

Hawaii 5-0
01-18-2013, 11:51 PM
It took Timmons until this year to figure out what the hell he is supposed to be doing.

Woodley is turning into Lamar the Hutt.



:chuckle:

SteelersCanada
01-19-2013, 12:06 AM
Is this an Onion article posed as a thread post?

Enlighten me, who do you pin the bad contracts, poor drafting and bad cap situation we're in right now on? I'd love to hear how Tomlin is to blame for any of this because it's already been posted multiple times in many other threads that Tomlin isn't in charge of drafting. He isn't in charge of contracts which resulted in this ridiculous cap situation we're in.

So I'll ask again, who do you pin it on?

wwhickok
01-19-2013, 09:38 AM
Hinestly I think everyone is on the hotseat. And its not the typical "I'm going to fire you if" hot seat. Its the "no one is irreplaceable" hot seat. The owners expect a certain level of competition and success. When they dont get that or when they feel there is a legit threat of falling out of that line of success theyre going to put on the pressure and motivate people to gain more focus and more care in their decision making. If they respond with a losing season...theyll find themselves on the typical hotseat.

steelfury02
01-19-2013, 09:43 AM
IMO, I agree with some the O player picks not panning out as we have looked for them to contribute much, much sooner than the D players we have drafted, and that's part of the Steelers system on defense - some of the young guys to step on defense have looked great - ie, Lewis and Allen. I'm "meh" on Hood but he isn't terrible. McClendon and Heyward need more trial by fire.

Our Rd1 RB from 08 is coach fodder and possibly gone or at best on his last chance for redemption (and you all know how I feel sorta bad because of what I think Arians did to his psyche). A Rd 2 WR (Sweed) was one of the biggest busts of the last 15 seasons. Rainey is gone. Wallace was a flash in the pan with his attitude. In many ways, we are retooling yet again at WR and RB and now we need someone at TE. Not looking good on an already frustrating offense. It pretty much will be like starting over again with Haley in a lot of ways. I am excited about the young O-linemen - bright spot and I Have hope

Hot seat? IMO - no. Same performance or lack of from younger guys next season, along with bad record or limping into playoffs and 1 and done? Yea - I think so.

FrancoLambert
01-19-2013, 10:31 AM
Must take issue with a couple of player evaluations previously posted.

"Marcus Gilbert has played well." Really? When and for how long? :noidea:
"Kelvin Beachum was a seventh round steal." Really? A steal? Based on what?

steelfury02
01-19-2013, 11:08 AM
Must take issue with a couple of player evaluations previously posted.

"Marcus Gilbert has played well." Really? When and for how long? :noidea:
"Kelvin Beachum was a seventh round steal." Really? A steal? Based on what?

IMO - for being a 7th rounder - he could have played worse - but, that doesn't make him a steal - it makes him a bit of a serviceable surprise and gives us depth where we might not have otherwise had

casteeler
01-19-2013, 11:33 AM
This thread seems to be a reaction the Colbert not closing the door orn the idea of drafting a QB early when it's clear most on the forum would like a SS and six LBs:chuckle:

casteeler
01-19-2013, 11:36 AM
Must take issue with a couple of player evaluations previously posted.

"Marcus Gilbert has played well." Really? When and for how long? :noidea:
"Kelvin Beachum was a seventh round steal." Really? A steal? Based on what?

Beech played a hell of a lot better the DD in the few games,so yes a steal at #7

OX1947
01-19-2013, 12:09 PM
Enlighten me, who do you pin the bad contracts, poor drafting and bad cap situation we're in right now on? I'd love to hear how Tomlin is to blame for any of this because it's already been posted multiple times in many other threads that Tomlin isn't in charge of drafting. He isn't in charge of contracts which resulted in this ridiculous cap situation we're in.

So I'll ask again, who do you pin it on?

Bad contracts? Poor drafting? Bad cap situation? Did you mistake the Steelers for the Jets or the Redskins? In Colbert's tenure he hasn't had one bust in the 1st round. 2 of those guys are on pace to go to the Hall of Fame. Countless pro bowlers from free agent pick ups(Parker, Harrison) or low draft picks. Signed one the most important players of this last era of Super Bowl winners, James Farrior. They have been to 5 AFC title games, 3 Super Bowls and 2 Super Bowl titles as GM/PP in his 13 years.

When a team loses to shitty teams, it is ALWAYS the coaches fault. He is not preparing the team well enough. When your QB keeps bitching about stuff, it's the HEAD COACH who can not control his player. You have seen plenty of times up in New England when a player gets wise, Hoody sends them packing to the Raiders or Siberia and he fleeces that team for an extra 1st rounder.

Well, the interview Colbert made the other day had just as much to do with warning shots at Tomlin then anyone else. It meant, it aint going to be a bunch of quitters like Mike Wallace and Mendenhall holding you down anymore. SO, if the results stay the same when he lets those clowns go and finds replacement who DO give a shit, then its on you Mr Standard. The Standard is the Standard in terms of running an organization, a player is not the standard when you are losing to the (bleep) Oakland Raiders who have been a USFL team for the last decade.

Steelers have some young talent waiting. It is time to clean the Cowher Era officially and let the young guys play. And Tomlin will need to devise a plan to keep his hard headed idiot QB from getting hurt. If Ben isnt playing, you aint winning. It doesn't matter if Ben's game is holding the (bleep) for 15 secs, the older he gets with the pounding he has already taken for 10 years, isnt gonna work anymore. ADJUST, if he cant adjust, time to find a damn QB. The standard is winning Super Bowl's, if that QB will not adjust his game or isnt good enough to adjust to stay on the field to WIN SUPER BOWL's, then what the hell are you doing out there? It's common sense.

teegre
01-19-2013, 03:26 PM
I am designing an algorithm-- it will determine the level of backlash received from fellow posters in comparison to the level of controversiality of the post.

The deeper into the bowels of the organization we level criticism, the more resistance is encountered from fellow members.

You should know, CANADA, that certain people in the Steelers' org are untouchable in the fans' eyes.

Teegre, did a very good job of listing out all the draft picks since 2008. But really, out of all the 4 or 5 guys per draft that "panned out"-- how many of them are domiant, game-changing players like we expect as fans of this team?

It took Timmons until this year to figure out what the hell he is supposed to be doing.

Woodley is turning into Lamar the Hutt.

Hood has been descent, but not awe-inspiring at all. Can't tell yet about Heyward.

We are about to let Mendenhall walk away over a petty personality conflict.

Sweed was garbage. Bruce Davis was garbage.

We have a number of starters that came from those drafts, and they got us to an 8-8 season. Pouncey, Wallace, and Brown are about the only guys that are still playing at a high level, or that did not fall off a cliff after one successful season.

KC is a far better GM than 99% of them out there-- but he is not perfect. His tone of late would strongly suggest the psychology behind what CANADA is suggesting.

I don't think his job is in danger this year-- but I am sure the Rooneys have made it clear they are not happy with what most of our recent drafts have produced on teh field.

Are you really happy with all of the personnel we have right now? The Ravens were also hit with the injury bug this year and lost 3 former DPOY over the coursse of the season at times (Reed, Lewis, and Suggs), but they are still in the playoffs and looking for their next title because their roster had better depth behind te estarters than the Steelers. The blame for that has to fall on KC and the personnel department, at least partially.

You mention that this group of talent got the Steelers to 8-8. May retort is that until the best player on the team got hurt (BB), they were 6-3 & being talked about as serious SuperBowl contenders.

Yes, the Ravens have good depth, but it is debatable whether it's any better than the Steelers. Losing Terrell Suggs is the same as losing James Harrison. Losing Ed Reed is the same as losing Troy. Losing Lardarius = losing Ike & Keenan & Cortez. Et cetera. The difference was that the Steelers lost a top-five QB.

Speaking of top-tier players, AB, Keenan Lewis, & Cortez Allen are great picks. Wallace, while a "flash in the pan", was still a great pick. That is four good starters out on the "islands"... which most teams do not have.

The first rounders have been better than people want to give them credit. Hood is debatable; but, Pouncey is every bit as good a pick as Troy was. It's too soon to know about Heyward & DD: DD has been injured, and Heyward has been stuck behind Keisel (much like Keisel was stuck behind von Oelhoffen for four years).

Sure, Colbert hit back-to-back home runs with BB & Troy... but, aside from Ike, very little came out of those drafts. I still contest (as many experts have also averred) that the 2002 draft was the key draft for setting up the future SuperBowl runs.

Yes, playmakers are essential, but I argue that regardless of round selected, the Steelers have added a good amount of playmakers: AB, Wallace, Pouncey, Lewis, Allen... and possibly Spence, DD, & Heyward. I'd even argue that Adams & Gilbert can turn into this generation's Marvel Smith & Max Starks.

I am HIGHLY optimistic about the next few years with this team.

Hawaii 5-0
01-19-2013, 03:33 PM
Steelers’ Colbert would take character ‘risk’ again

By Mark Kaboly
Published: Friday, January 18, 2013

In a year when fourth-round pick Alameda Ta‘amu was arrested for leading police on a drunken driving chase through the South Side and fifth-round pick Chris Rainey was cut after police charged him with slapping his girlfriend, Steelers general manager Kevin Colbert said the organization won‘t shy away from players with character issues in the NFL Draft.

Colbert told TribLive Radio on Friday it would be unrealistic to enter the draft process eliminating players who are labeled as having character issues.

“Does that mean that you are not going to look at guys who have risk?” Colbert said. “No, I think that is unrealistic because a lot of the guys in the draft pool do have character challenges. It is up to us to assess that and determine if we want to take the risk. If we do, we have to be ready not only if the player does well but the consequences if it doesn‘t work.”

Colbert disagreed with the perception that the organization‘s decision to release Rainey but keep Ta‘amu was based on talent alone.

“The only thing I can point to is our draft preparations,” Colbert said. “We do homework on players, and we will reject significant players. I am talking about first-round talents that (we) decide we don‘t want to assume the risk if they do have a character issue. But when we do assume the risk, sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn‘t. Obviously, we had two cases this year that didn‘t work for us, and that falls on me because I am the guy who said we can assume this risk.”

The Steelers took tackle Mike Adams off their draft board last year after he tested positive for marijuana during the NFL Scouting Combine. However, after Adams made a trip to Pittsburgh to talk to Colbert and coach Mike Tomlin, the Steelers put Adams back on their board, and they ended up drafting him in the second round.

http://triblive.com/sports/steelers/3322006-74/colbert-risk-character#ixzz2IS47y21P

Steeldude
01-19-2013, 03:36 PM
2008:
Horrid. Everyone agrees on that. BUT, at the time, EVERYONE loved it... espeically Limas Sweed. In hindsight, it was an utter failure, but who would have known that both Spinny & Sweed would ahve mental issues... and, Tony Hilsl was a R1 prospect that dropped due to injury, and the Steelers take a calculated risk on him. Lastly, Bruce Davis was a sack machine... who simply never panned out. It happens.

2009: Hood, Wallace, Lewis, and DJ Johnson. Hood had been good, and Wallace was a home run. Lewis coudl eb a home run, and Johnson played well for a R7 pick. Getting four players who contribute is a good draft. Oh, and Urbik was cut by his position coach... and ended up starting on another roster (ie not Colbert's fault).

2010: Pouncey was a grand slam. AB was a home run... found in R6. Sanders could be a good pick. Worilds is alright, as has been Dwyer. Sylvester initially showed promise... but, he was a R5 pick. That is six who have contributed: a great draft.

2011: Heyward might be good, but he has not played enough to pass judgement on. Gilbert has played well. Cortez Allen is a home run. Carter is a question mark (much like Worilds). Adn, Baron Batch is a good special teamer. That is five who have contributed.

2012: Rainey allegedly hit a woman, and Ta'amu drove drunk. Gone and likely gone. DD was injured, but I love that pick. Spence was also injured, and also a pick that I love. Adams showed promis, and Paulson the coaches like. Beachum was a steal for a R7 pick (not a Tom Brady or an AB type of steal, but a steal nonetheless). That is five who contributed... and two who might wear orange jump suits.

SUMMATION:
These past three drafts have been pretty darn good. The 2002 draft (Randel El, Foote, Keisel, Hope) laid the groundwork for the 2005 (and the 2008) SuperBowls. These past three drafts are just as good (if not better).

So... no.

Everyone didn't love the 2008. I despised it from the start. Bruce Davis was a longshot to make the team. Mendenhall was a soft back who played one season in a spread option. The Steelers didn't need to waste a pick on a RB in the 1st. Sweed was a good value pick that failed. Tony Hills should have never been drafted by any team. Horrible injuries coupled with lack of strength is not a good sign for success as a NFL offensive lineman.

I was fine with the Hood pick, but I was wary of Wallace due to his poor attitude and inability to catch with his hands.

harrison'samonster
01-19-2013, 03:39 PM
“The only thing I can point to is our draft preparations,” Colbert said. “We do homework on players, and we will reject significant players. I am talking about first-round talents that (we) decide we don‘t want to assume the risk if they do have a character issue. But when we do assume the risk, sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn‘t. Obviously, we had two cases this year that didn‘t work for us, and that falls on me because I am the guy who said we can assume this risk.”



I'm confident that they do a good job looking into these players. Obviously you can't just look past any player who might have character issues, they're all human and none are saints.

Bottom line though is the player needs to take responsibility for themselves, and not the coaching staff or FO.

teegre
01-19-2013, 04:23 PM
Thank you, Riddle, for understanding my post.

I'm not asking him to be fired or let go this offseason, and I'm not playing the blame game. I was recognizing that there has been some issues in this organization in regards to the draft, free agency, lucrative contracts, etc. and some of that has to fall on the shoulders of the GM. His own words were "we don't have very many franchise players on this roster" and we're 15 million over the cap? I'm sorry, but that's a serious problem that needs to be addressed. Harrison having a cap hit over 10 million dollars is another serious problem. Not having depth at very many - if any - defensive positions on this roster is another serious problem and some of those, if not all, fall on the shoulders of Colbert.

Again, I'm not calling for his head or asking him to be fired this offseason. I'm asking for some level-headed thinking about the issues that are on this team and where they might be coming from instead of just blaming Tomlin and Ben.

Thank you Teegre for the logical response and you're right - we have drafted well in the later rounds. The problem is, we're not hitting with the first two - three on a consistent basis and that has to change. We've managed to draft special teams players with great consistency, but have failed to draft starters and that, again, falls on scouting but ultimately Colbert.

STARTERS
As I was saying to Riddle, Allen, AB, Wallace, Adams, Gilbert, Lewis are all good starters. Spence and DD have been injured. I am optimistic about this team's future.

COLBERT'S DISDAIN
As I was mentioning, I think it is more to do with the last two picks: Ta'amu & Rainey than anything else. In fact, I was just reading (Hawaii posted the same article) about Colbert "defending" his taking of Ta'a'mu & Rainey, saying that sometimes you "have to take a risk."

CONTRACTS
I mentioned this in another thread: sometime,s when you have good players, this happens. Can you imagine the outcry if Colbert had NOT given big contracts to Harrison, Troy and/or BB??? Every few years, bought decision have to be made... as in: Good-bye Keisel (Heyward is 1/16 the cost).

teegre
01-19-2013, 04:24 PM
Everyone didn't love the 2008. I despised it from the start. Bruce Davis was a longshot to make the team. Mendenhall was a soft back who played one season in a spread option. The Steelers didn't need to waste a pick on a RB in the 1st. Sweed was a good value pick that failed. Tony Hills should have never been drafted by any team. Horrible injuries coupled with lack of strength is not a good sign for success as a NFL offensive lineman.

I was fine with the Hood pick, but I was wary of Wallace due to his poor attitude and inability to catch with his hands.

True. I wanted Ray Rice, and was happy with Sweed. The consensus was that it was a great draft (people specifically liked the Sweed pick).

teegre
01-19-2013, 04:27 PM
Must take issue with a couple of player evaluations previously posted.

"Marcus Gilbert has played well." Really? When and for how long? :noidea:
"Kelvin Beachum was a seventh round steal." Really? A steal? Based on what?

As a rookie, Gilbert played well as the starting RT. He will only be in his third year, and i think he will eb the modern version of Max Starks: dependable.

Beachum... yea, "steal" was probably not quite the right word... but, I am sure you got my drift. He was able to play very well, and for a R7 pick, that is more than one can ask for. He FAR exceeded expectations. Make sense?

austinfrench76
01-19-2013, 04:59 PM
I agree that he is not on the hot seat. I don't think people really get on a "hot seat" with the Rooney's (except for Arians apparently). Colbert is an Executive and they seem very happy with him.

rich4eagle
01-19-2013, 05:37 PM
I know this might not be the popular opinion or a well-recognized one, but I think that Colbert might in fact be on the hot seat. Looking back for a second, take a look at the contrasting opinions of the team that Colbert and Tomlin have expressed. Mike said the traditional coach-type things - disappointing season, obviously not where we wanted to be, we have room to improve.

Colbert, on the other hand, was far more blunt, upfront and almost confrontational. His message that the entire team should be on their toes and they're " ... not married to any free agents" makes me think that Colbert might be feeling pressure from up top, not Tomlin.

Let's look at the draft picks from the last couple of years.

A great example of missing on draft picks would be the '08 draft. Not only did we miss on almost every single pick in that draft, we missed on the most essential ones. Now, Mendenhall is going to walk from the team and test free agency. This fact might not have been important if we had a legitimate RB on the roster to replace him with. Now, we're almost forced to use a fairly high pick on a RB in either this draft or next years.

We could also point to missing on Limas Sweed, too. We're in a very similar situation with with our receivers that we are with our 'backs. We're forced to use a high pick in again, this year or next years draft because of talent walking away and having little-to-no depth behind our starters.

That's just the '08 draft, though. Let's go ahead and look at the more recent ones. In 2009, we took Ziggy and for the most part, he has been underwhelming. He hasn't looked like a first round pick in the snaps he has received and ultimately, the starting role he walked into. Now, this could be because we were used to seeing Smith in that role or it could be, quite frankly, he isn't very good. 2010, 2011 and 2012 we seemed to hit on our first round picks. Heyward and DeCastro have both shown flashes and great potential in the time they have started, but are going to need more time to get an accurate representation of these guys.

It's not just about missing on draft picks, though. Look at the current cap situation we're in - it's a mess. Now, this could be a joint-effort between him and Khan but ultimately, the current contract situation we're in falls on the shoulders of Colbert. Being this far over the cap and admitting that "we don't have many franchise players" is a serious problem and one that needs to be addressed. I don't know whose idea it was to give Harrison that lucrative a deal when he was starting to show signs of aging, but that problem will ultimately fall on Colbert and Harrison's ridiculous cap hit is one of the many problems we're facing this offseason.

Colbert's response to questions seemed cold and of a guy who realizes that another down year with another series of missed draft picks might spell out the end of for him. With the interest in Khan over the last few years, I don't know how much longer we can keep him around. If next offseason we're in a similar mess with another series of ridiculous contracts and a series of missed draft picks, Colbert could ultimately be on his way out the door and I think he knows it. It's why in his interview he sounded more angry and frustrated than he has in the past and this could be because he realizes he has to make this offseason work or he's going to be working for another team come this time next year. With the way the Browns are hiring everyone off the street, it could be Cleveland.

that would be stupid Colbert is the strenght of the franchise but I seen dumb rule often in myopic regimes:tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03::tt03:

madtowndrunkard
01-19-2013, 09:01 PM
I think it says Mike Tomlin is on the hot seat for next season.

TheVet
01-19-2013, 10:58 PM
I think it says Mike Tomlin is on the hot seat for next season.

No, I'm fairly certain that the standard is the standard there, even if it's a bit substandard at this point. The Rooneys are patient, and Tomlin is still young. And the man does have accomplishments.

Although Tomlin hasn't yet demonstrated much capacity for learning from his mistakes, that could begin to change if/when he matures as a head coach. It's far too soon to pull the plug on such a dedicated, hard-working man, especially a SB winner - even given the legitimate disappointment with his inconsistent performance and lack of growth.

Lady Steel
01-20-2013, 02:13 PM
I don't think Colbert is in the hot seat. There are going to be changes, dontcha know!


xMQ0Ryy01yE

rich4eagle
01-21-2013, 03:15 PM
I went through a litany of posts. My thoughts remain the same as they have for two years maybe three under Tomlin.

Colbert going would be a huge loss to the franchise.

He gets players who can play and win!

Now strategies on game day and coaching the players are the responsibility of Tomlin and his staff.

My guess is Dick Lebeau has been told to play softer coverage way too much the last few years. Rarely, have the Steelers gone for the jugular on third down instead played soft zones and gave up firsts

Rarely have the Steelers gone in Q4 in a close game and gone for the kill
Rarely has the Steeler Offense done anything but sit on the ball when ahead

I cannot remember the last time the Steelers smashed an opponent in a close game in Q3 and Q4

This past season the Offense was horrible, horrible

None of the above is Colbert's fault the players are there

The strategies SUCK

Right now I am in the camp the Steelers won in the past despite Tomlin's bad game day coaching
Right now I am in the camp the Steelers play to too soft on offense always and too soft on defense in the end game

So, doing this stuff for half a century, right now, my gun is firmly pointed at Tomlin, and then Haley, we got the players but you cannot win a race holding the reins on the horses and telling them prevent themselves from winning

That last phrase to me seems to the Steelers biggest problem,,,,,,,,,,,,fixing that is solely the responsiblity of Tomlin, Haley and LeBeau

BTW, one of the dumbest things I have ever witnessed is the running back by committee of four which guarantees NONE of them gets a game feel and good procduction. Two carries every two Q's guarantees lousy running game performance. Redman is the lone back with upside. Dwyer does not make decisive runs, Mendenhall is a fumble and brain fart waiting to happen. Redman when given the chance to get his legs on see the hole hits and pushes te pile............. We need a complement to Redman the rest good bye. We have great WR's used to get four yards passes whhoopie??????????? The D has enough solid players to go back to what Steelers do, destroy and desrupt and offense instead of sitting back and hoping and offense screws up. Time for Tomlin to step up and manage a game to win instead of to survive:tt04:

3rdandlong
01-21-2013, 08:27 PM
The past couple drafts have not been Colbert's best, but I would never think of firing the man. He have one of the best front offices in the league. It's really hard to contend for a Super Bowl every year if you don't have Tom Brady. We've been Super Bowl contenders for nearly every season the last 10 years. It's hard to argue with it. We may be in a slight rebuilding phase but Colbert is almost an untouchable in my mind