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-   -   No asterisk necessary (http://forums.steelersfever.com/showthread.php?t=20147)

Borski 09-28-2007 08:21 PM

No asterisk necessary
 
http://cbs.sportsline.com/nba/story/10378095/rss

No asterisk necessary: Arenas wants to buy Bonds' 756th ball
Sep. 28, 2007
CBSSports.com wire reports



WASHINGTON -- If Gilbert Arenas has his way, the baseball Barry Bonds hit for his record-breaking 756th career homer will never be branded with an asterisk.

Arenas' solution? He wants to buy the ball.

Fashion designer Marc Ecko bought the ball in an online auction, then set up a Web site so people could vote to determine its fate. Ecko announced the winning choice this week: branding the ball with an asterisk before it's sent to the Hall of Fame.

"I don't think he should mess up history like that," Arenas said Friday.

"It's history. It's still history. I mean, the guy's a man before he's some big slugger," he added. "I mean, how you just going to take what this man's done for his career and ... say, 'Hey, you were accused of this. You allegedly did this. I want to take this away from you.'? I mean, what if we took away your Ecko company? I mean, why graffiti the ball?"

Later Friday, Arenas posted an entry on his blog making the same point.

"I'll buy the ball from you Ecko for $800,000. If Barry Bonds is found guilty, I'll give it back to you. I'm not going to let you go around like some little superhero," the blog says. "I'll put it in my hall of fame. The Gilbert Hall of Fame for Athletes no matter what you did."

AP NEWS
The Associated Press News Service

Copyright 2006-2007, The Associated Press, All Rights Reserved

__________________________________________________ ______

I might be one of the few people on Bonds side, I like that this guy has the guts to stick of for what he believes in, I think its a disgrace that this guy wants to put an asterisk on the ball.

revefsreleets 09-28-2007 08:32 PM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
This is getting out of hand. It's one thing for some delusional fans to give Mr. Pumpkinhead the benefit of the "doubt", but this is getting out of hand. Hammerin' Hank is the undisputed HR champ and always will be. He did it without batting gloves and knee surgery and HGH and robotic elbow pads and weight rooms and whatever other trash Bonds used. Bonds wasn't always, but is now and will be forever after a joke. If Gilbert wants to buy the ball, let him waste his money. At least Ecko got a bunch of pub for his gear out of it. Arenas will just look like a jackass.

revefsreleets 09-29-2007 07:28 PM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
This picture says it all.

http://i5.ebayimg.com/02/i/000/b0/3f/9df0_1.JPG

Stlrs4Life 09-30-2007 10:53 AM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
Screw Barry Bonds, I voted to send it into space.

silver & black 09-30-2007 11:46 AM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
I have to disagree with you guys. Any athlete will take whatever advantage science and technology will give them. Do you really think that Hank wouldn't have used the elbow pads if they were available in his time? Do you really think Ruth, the poster boy for partyers in his time, would think twice about using roids if they were available?

I don't really know the answers to those questions. I do know this... if Bonds' homerun ball deserves an asterisk branded on it... the Steelers' and the Raiders' Lombardi's do too. Both teams had guys on the juice...and you know it. It doesn't matter weather or not there was a policy against it back then... cheating is cheating... right?

revefsreleets 10-01-2007 09:15 AM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
But by that logic, EVERY super bowl is tainted, because the majority of players were using them. That levels the playing field. If Hank had used any or all of the cheats that Barry has (and I'm not sure he would have), then he might have hit 1000 HR's, because not only would he have enhanced hs already formidable p[ower, he would have also had his career artificially extended. My point is this:


Bonds-steroids=600-650 HR's tops.
Aaron-steroids=755 HR's

Conversely

Bonds+steroids=762 HR's
Aaron+steroids=850HR's? 900?

Steelerstrength 10-01-2007 05:03 PM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
In my humble opinion, at this point in time, you cannot take the record away from Barry. Absolutely nothing has been proven and, as of this date, accusations are not proof. When and if they do prove anything, my opinion will change.

And, as a World Champion Natural athlete, that means polygraph & urinalysis for all performance enhancing drugs including caffiene, steroids, growth etc., I have to disagree that "Any athlete will take whatever advantage science and technology will give them."

Elbow pads, weight room, hydration drinks are all tools that any sane athlete should take advantage of. And, they are not "...trash..." at all. Don't let your biased opinion blind you from things that help to protect an athlete from serious injury. (Why have helmets?)

That being said, I think Hank was a better Home Run hitter, and obviously a more likeable person. Barry is and was a better all around player. I've read a few books on Barry, and the opinions of his colleagues are not pretty.

As a side note, when I was about 6 years old, I witnessed Hank hitting a Home Run, into the bullpen, vs my Dodgers. My brother & I Booed him, only to be scolded by a lady in front of us. I responded, "He's not on my team." I remember that moment!

revefsreleets 10-01-2007 05:59 PM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Steelerstrength (Post 302870)
In my humble opinion, at this point in time, you cannot take the record away from Barry. Absolutely nothing has been proven and, as of this date, accusations are not proof. When and if they do prove anything, my opinion will change.

And, as a World Champion Natural athlete, that means polygraph & urinalysis for all performance enhancing drugs including caffiene, steroids, growth etc., I have to disagree that "Any athlete will take whatever advantage science and technology will give them."

Elbow pads, weight room, hydration drinks are all tools that any sane athlete should take advantage of. And, they are not "...trash..." at all. Don't let your biased opinion blind you from things that help to protect an athlete from serious injury. (Why have helmets?)

That being said, I think Hank was a better Home Run hitter, and obviously a more likeable person. Barry is and was a better all around player. I've read a few books on Barry, and the opinions of his colleagues are not pretty.

As a side note, when I was about 6 years old, I witnessed Hank hitting a Home Run, into the bullpen, vs my Dodgers. My brother & I Booed him, only to be scolded by a lady in front of us. I responded, "He's not on my team." I remember that moment!

A) "Nothing has been proved". Actually, yes it has. Empirical data is observed data, and the growth (his head growth alone is enough) that Barry Bonds has experienced is beyond what being a simple gym rat could ever provide. I would welcome any kind of logical scientific explanation for what has been well documented OTHER then steroids or other unnatural growth substances, banned or otherwise.

B) As for my comment about "trash", I'm, of course, not referring to the above board methods that modern athletes employ, such as hydrating drinks, lifting, etc. Bonds employs many means to enhance his game, some less savory then others. For more information on his "simple elbow pad", read here. The author believes it alone was responsible for a significant amount of his HR's. http://www.editorandpublisher.com/ea..._id=1003621797

C) Is Bonds the better all around player? Yup. But, again, Mr. Pumpkinhead tainted his whole career by screwing up the last 7-8 years, and his legacy will be rightfully based upon how he ended, not how he started.

Preacher 10-01-2007 11:15 PM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by revefsreleets (Post 302903)
A) "Nothing has been proved". Actually, yes it has. Empirical data is observed data, and the growth (his head growth alone is enough) that Barry Bonds has experienced is beyond what being a simple gym rat could ever provide. I would welcome any kind of logical scientific explanation for what has been well documented OTHER then steroids or other unnatural growth substances, banned or otherwise.

B) As for my comment about "trash", I'm, of course, not referring to the above board methods that modern athletes employ, such as hydrating drinks, lifting, etc. Bonds employs many means to enhance his game, some less savory then others. For more information on his "simple elbow pad", read here. The author believes it alone was responsible for a significant amount of his HR's. http://www.editorandpublisher.com/ea..._id=1003621797

C) Is Bonds the better all around player? Yup. But, again, Mr. Pumpkinhead tainted his whole career by screwing up the last 7-8 years, and his legacy will be rightfully based upon how he ended, not how he started.

By rules of the game... proved means that steroids were found in the bloodstream (urine stream, whatever). It hasn't been proved... he keeps the record, without an asterick.

Second he gets caught... the record should be pulled.

revefsreleets 10-02-2007 08:31 AM

Re: No asterisk necessary
 
That's interesting. By that criteria, he'll forever be innocent. But this is a lot like OJ. Everyone knows he's guilty, he is guilty, but some people, um, want to believe otherwise. So be it. The rcord can stay on the books, but everyone knows it's tainted.


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