Colon to RT

[StainlessStill]

Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

Stainless..... you are helping to make my point. Miller gets called for holding and it negates a Cotchery TD at Cinci. But nobody here thinks that Heath gets caught for holding.

Colon takes a holding call, which kept Ben from getting sacked and hit while throwing....but it negates a TD, so fans still harp on that 4 years later.

NFL players are going to make mistakes and get beat by the guy across from them. Its going to happen. the problem is that if it happens to an O lineman, he doesnt get a chance to make a reception or run the ball to redeem himself like RB's or TE/WR's.

You dont have to play NFL to get a feel for what they do. For those that never played organized football... Find a local beer league, flag football or whatever has some contact on the line. You will see that you can play 95% perfect game, but the 5% you get beat you stand out like a sore thumb.

I'm not going against you in what you're saying. I think Willie Colon is our best offensive lineman and is underrated underneath all that offensive line garbage. That said, I don't think anybody here doesn't think Heath ever holds. As you said, you're making your own point in pointing out that Heath held on Cotchery's touchdown.

Players make mistakes on virtually every play and so do coach's. What makes or breaks a player, especially on the offensive line, is timing of the foul and the repercussions of that. Guys like Michael Ohr has a reputation of being a stud young talent, but leads the league in false starts and his value suffers because of that. For Colon's sake, he's considered the best lineman on a bad offensive line so the scrutiny comes down harder on him givin' he's our best lineman when we all see him standing around when Ben's getting killed.

I give credit where credit is due and Heath deserves some MAD praise as an NFL football player but that doesn't necessarily mean that I've never seen the guy hold or virtually make a bad play that cost our team.

Hell, for a little while there, I was PISSED at Heath during a couple series this season. He had some big drops and was the result of a ill-advised turnover in Cincinnati that kept the Bungs in the game (also as you pointed out, the holding call, which was a lame-ass flag to begin with.) I hold that single play against Heath as I would Colon getting completely embarrassed while he watch's his QB get drilled time and time again.

They always did say an offensive lineman hates the spotlight. If nobody is talking about an offensive lineman, it's a good thing. Our unit has been talked about for years and obviously that needs continued fixing.

[60_MINUTES]

Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

No, not throwing Miller under the bus, but using him to make a point.

Fans get on a guy for having 7 penalties totalling 55yds, in a season where he played over 900 snaps. But they give their favorite WR or TE a free pass for multiple holding calls or pass interference plays, illegal blocks. I bet Hines Ward had more penalty yardage in 2009 than Willie Colon.

Fans that think Colon(or any O lineman) holds "all the time" should have to put their hand in the dirt against a guy that is faster than they are, while moving backwards and see what they can do.

Im not saying Colon sucks either.. I think he is decent to solid and could be very solid at guard.. what I am saying is I thought you picked a bad example to prove your point... The reason guys like Miller and Ward dont get the book threw at them for mistakes is because of what they have done as steelers... you should have used a guy like Starks.. or marvell smith for your comparrison.. Miller just happens to be one of the best in the league and the best Steeler TE in history... so when the guy makes mistakes people tend to forgive him a bit quicker... As far as colon.. i agree he could be solid but at this point it is what it is and the fact is thus far in Willlie carrer he is average at best when comparred to other steeler greats at his position.. lets see how he finishes up.

[Fire Arians]

colon is job insurance for our medical staff

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Originally Posted by 60_MINUTES

thus far in Willlie carrer he is average at best when comparred to other steeler greats at his position.. lets see how he finishes up.

The greats like Justin Strelczyk, Leon Searcy or Marvel Smith? He is possibly the 2nd best O lineman on the team currently and while the competition isnt the best, its something to build on .

The complainers can keep on whining about him, but at the present time the best OT combination we have is Gilbert at LT and Colon at RT, so get used to it until free agency comes and goes.

[tony hipchest]

until we gut the contracts of our defense the steelers will never be able to afford a top notch OL like the fans think ben and the offense deserve. as it is, miller, ben, and soon to be wallace will all be some of the highest paid at their position.

[60_MINUTES]

Originally Posted by El-Gonzo Jackson

The greats like Justin Strelczyk, Leon Searcy or Marvel Smith? He is possibly the 2nd best O lineman on the team currently and while the competition isnt the best, its something to build on .

The complainers can keep on whining about him, but at the present time the best OT combination we have is Gilbert at LT and Colon at RT, so get used to it until free agency comes and goes.

I agree with this 100 percent... thats what the whole debate is about man... IMO and many others we have to address this.. we need to make sure he is not the 2nd best OT on the team.. we need to make sure he is the 3rd best OT and the Best guard on the Team.. Now if no one falls to us and we can t grab a guy in FA because of lack of money then I guess we have to keep Colon there... however IMO going into the season with a guy that has not played in two years because of major injuries.. along with the fact that when he did play he was average... to good at best... Its just not very smart at all... by the way we tried that last year and looked how it ended up ( after the injuries we had the worst line in football until Starks came back and made us at least decent for a while )

Bottom line we have to draft OL sometime in the first 2 picks...round one or Two doesnt matter to me...either that or maybe the rumor of bringing in gaither or whatever his name is might not be a bad idea...

All I know is if the Steelers are dumb enough to go into the season with Colon coming off two years of injuries and John Scott as his back up.. then we are way more retarded then I ever dreamed we could be... Lets assume our FO will do what they need to do this off season

[60_MINUTES]

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

until we gut the contracts of our defense the steelers will never be able to afford a top notch OL like the fans think ben and the offense deserve. as it is, miller, ben, and soon to be wallace will all be some of the highest paid at their position.

Actually I think the steelers can afford to pay and do pay well to the OL.. they just pay the wrong people... Why in the world they cant see it is beyond me...

We are giving John Scott ( worst OT in football IMO I would rather have Essex at Vet Min ) but anyway we are giving him 2.2 mil.. Chris K was getting around 4... shit those two guys alone could be cut... I would expect for 6 mil a year we could get one of the better Guards or tackles in football. and look at the money Colon makes... Flozall Adams ( who I might add played at least 3 times better then Colon ever did out at RT ) he wanted 4 mil to stay...shit Colon makes more then that...

again dont get me wrong I think Colon is decent and would be great a guard.. but I dont care how people look at it he has not even come close to earning the 6 mil he will get this year.

Bottom line is that since the steelers built heinz field Dan rooney and the boys have lived up to their end of the deal.. they said they had to have the new stadium to pay and compete and they have paid good money... We also have won our asses off... Its been great being a steeler fan... that being said we always pay our guys good money but in doing that we seem to pay the guys on our team that dont deserve good money as well... How we can be so smart with players but yet also be so dumb with others is beyond me... Kendell Simmons over paid.. Dewayne Washington was way over paid.. Chad Scott got a mil more then Dewayne... Chris K has robbed us blind. Colon again is a decent guy but not near worth 6 mil a year. Arnez battle was getting 2.7 mil a year. John Scott ( 2.2 mil ) good lord I still cant believe that.

If David Johnson makes anything over a dollar then its the worst contract in history

the list goes on and on... I know other teams have those list as well but it just seems the Steelers sign some of the average guys for money no other team would dare pay them.

Two guys stick out to me more then anyone in the past 10 years.. when both signed I hit the floor... One was Dewayne Washington... everyone in the world new the guy sucked.. how he cont to start over Townsend and then get paid the big money ( back then it was big money for a CB 4 mil a year ) I never understood.it.. finally townsend got his chance and played 10 times better then Dewayne...

the other for me is Chris Kemo... man I and many others have been saying for years now how bad this guy is... not only did he keep his starting job but the guy got paid top money ( shit Pro bowl money ) now all of a sudden they finally see how bad he sucks and then finally cut him... How in the world did he get paid to begin with... he as never been nothing any better then the 5th round pick we wasted on him ( I think it was 5th )

[El-Gonzo Jackson]

Originally Posted by 60_MINUTES

All I know is if the Steelers are dumb enough to go into the season with Colon coming off two years of injuries and John Scott as his back up.. then we are way more retarded then I ever dreamed we could be... Lets assume our FO will do what they need to do this off season

Now this is over-reaction. Jon Scott actually played well at RT last season....which stands to reason because that is what he is. A RT that the Steelers had to play at LT at the start of the season.

Colon had a triceps tear last year. not really career threatening. The issue is that the Steelers should have addressed the O line at least 5 years ago (I mean other than Tony Hills) and at the current moment its possible that Gilbert, Pouncey, Colon, Scott, Foster could be the best 5 they can put on the field.

I expect rookies to be drafted, but not necessarily start on opening day. I can see O line in round 2 and round 4 selected.

[tony hipchest]

i still think steelers went knee jerk and screwed the pooch cutting urbick.

sure he may have been bench fodder, but look how long essex and kemo stuck around.

[ricardisimo]

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

i still think steelers went knee jerk and screwed the pooch cutting urbick.

sure he may have been bench fodder, but look how long essex and kemo stuck around.

We cut Urbik so we could keep Dorian Brooks. That hurts.