Jerry Sandusky child sex-abuse trial

[Vincent]

Originally Posted by hicksfan

nice dodge.

That wasn't a dodge Hicks. It was disrespect. 2200+ posts say that I'll cross swords with anybody, on any subject.

Mr Wallace here readily grasps the simple point I was making, and expands on it very nicely. My point is simply that history is repeating itself.

Originally Posted by Wallace108

The way most Americans view homosexuality today isn't the way it used to be viewed. There was a time in our society when homosexuality was viewed no differently than pedophilia. I'm not suggesting a link between the two. I'm just saying that both were viewed as disgusting, immoral, and just wrong by the standards of our society. Homosexuality is now viewed as "normal" by most Americans because we've become desensitized to it.

Nothing about the act itself changed. What changed is how we view it. And that change didn't happen overnight, or in 5 years. It took years and years of groups pushing for it to be normalized and for us to become desensitized to it. And now most of us accept it as normal. Fifty years ago, if any of us would have suggested that by 2012, homosexuality would largely be viewed as normal, we would have been called crazy.

Bulls eye.

Originally Posted by Wallace108

As Vincent has pointed out, there are already groups who are pushing for the normalization of pedophilia, just as there were groups pushing for the normalization of homosexuality. And if you don't think that underage children are already starting to be sexualized in our society and that to some degree we're already starting to become desensitized to it, then you haven't been paying attention. Right now, it's impossible for any of us to accept the idea of pedophilia being viewed as "normal." But it has been viewed as normal in other societies. And there was a time when no one would have thought it possible for homosexuality to be viewed as normal.

Exactly. IMHO, we're about 5-10 years out.

Originally Posted by Atlanta Dan

Vincent's initial post in the thread tossed this chum into the water.

Vincent's initial post was unambiguously "Where is the line between the homosexual rape of a child and them merely being a "couple"?" The responses hovered around consent.

If Jerry's Kids had consented, would there have been the furor?

As this society moves toward acceptance of pedophilia and the Sanduskys of the world are freer to operate, more will be drawn in. It's self-proliferating.

Its interesting that this Sandusky affair was cloistered within academia, isn't it? There are some that fear that this isn't even the tip of the iceberg. Can you imagine the furor if its breadth were known? I can see why academia would want to push that envelop a little.

[Atlanta Dan]

Originally Posted by Wallace108

I got mad respect for Vincent and agree with him more times than not. But yeah, I had no idea where this thread was going when it started. I'm still not sure. I should know better and just sit this one out. This can be a tiring debate.

When it comes to posting in threads like this I am like a recovering alcoholic who thinks he can take one drink and wakes up in the gutter after anotherr binge

I really need to remember to stick to the NFL threads

[MasterOfPuppets]

Originally Posted by Atlanta Dan

When it comes to posting in threads like this I am like a recovering alcoholic who thinks he can take one drink and wakes up in the gutter after anotherr binge

I really need to remember to stick to the NFL threads

the board is no longer run by the self righteous nazis... put the gloves on and indulge amigo ...

Originally Posted by Atlanta Dan

When it comes to posting in threads like this I am like a recovering alcoholic who thinks he can take one drink and wakes up in the gutter after anotherr binge

I really need to remember to stick to the NFL threads

I find myself getting into just as much hot water in those threads.

This thread can make for a great debate. But it won't be pretty.

[MasterOfPuppets]

Originally Posted by Wallace108

I find myself getting into just as much hot water in those threads.

This thread can make for a great debate. But it won't be pretty.

me and scmom stood up for you and buddaha ....

[ricardisimo]

I'm missing something, I guess. How could anyone have read something debatable in Vinny's original post? It didn't even make any sense.

[hicksfan]

Originally Posted by Wallace108

I already had this debate, and I really don't feel like getting into again. But against my better judgment, I want to make one point.



The way most Americans view homosexuality today isn't the way it used to be viewed. There was a time in our society when homosexuality was viewed no differently than pedophilia. I'm not suggesting a link between the two. I'm just saying that both were viewed as disgusting, immoral, and just wrong by the standards of our society. Homosexuality is now viewed as "normal" by most Americans because we've become desensitized to it.

Nothing about the act itself changed. What changed is how we view it. And that change didn't happen overnight, or in 5 years. It took years and years of groups pushing for it to be normalized and for us to become desensitized to it. And now most of us accept it as normal. Fifty years ago, if any of us would have suggested that by 2012, homosexuality would largely be viewed as normal, we would have been called crazy.

As Vincent has pointed out, there are already groups who are pushing for the normalization of pedophilia, just as there were groups pushing for the normalization of homosexuality. And if you don't think that underage children are already starting to be sexualized in our society and that to some degree we're already starting to become desensitized to it, then you haven't been paying attention. Right now, it's impossible for any of us to accept the idea of pedophilia being viewed as "normal." But it has been viewed as normal in other societies. And there was a time when no one would have thought it possible for homosexuality to be viewed as normal.

the way most americans view race and women's equality (among several other issues) today isn't the way it used to be viewed either and nothing about those acts have changed either. i don't think you have a very strong point unless you can connect homosexuality with being immoral at a base level. adding pedophilia to the mix is a red herring as well as a slippery slope fallacy, as we already understand pedophilia occurs heterosexually as well. until someone can validate the immorality at a base level, i think we chalk it up to another life lesson about judging without merit. if it's truly immoral on it's own, it should be explainable. "because that's how it's always been" is weak reconciliation for why we shouldn't learn from our mistakes. it's been proven way too man times man didn't start with all the answers, many have had to be learned along the way.

[hicksfan]

Originally Posted by Vincent

That wasn't a dodge Hicks. It was disrespect. 2200+ posts say that I'll cross swords with anybody, on any subject.

i guess it's when people ask you to validate your claims, that's when you clam up? all i'm asking for is proof that homosexuality has moral implications at a base level as you've insinuated and practically boasted. i just want to see where the rubber meets the road on the issue. otherwise, you're all hot air. 2200+ posts of it. you love your opinion, that's about it. no proof behind it, but obviously why bother with that?

[hicksfan]

anyone else want to try? these arguments so far have been paltry at best. this must be how galileo felt with the catholic church all up his ass about heliocentrism.

[Vincent]

Originally Posted by hicksfan

i guess it's when people ask you to validate your claims, that's when you clam up? all i'm asking for is proof that homosexuality has moral implications at a base level as you've insinuated and practically boasted. i just want to see where the rubber meets the road on the issue. otherwise, you're all hot air. 2200+ posts of it. you love your opinion, that's about it. no proof behind it, but obviously why bother with that?

I didn't comment on the morality of homosexuality. You inferred. In fact there were but two comments on morality in even the articles I posted...

“Morality was once revealed, inherited and shared, but now it’s thought of as something that emerges in the privacy of your own heart.”

“We were told that morality is relative and that right and wrong are simply cultural preferences.”

... homosexuality wasn't mentioned.

Perhaps there's some point you'd like to make.