"FIRE THE TRAINING STAFF!!!"

[steelfury02]

Originally Posted by Riddle_Of_Steel

No, because the Steelers and their list of injuries to critical players over the last 3 seasons paints a clear and repetitive pattern.

If it was just this year this was happening, your arguments would have some merit. The Packers had a bad year in 2010 with injuries, but have not since then. The Eagles have less injuries to critical players right now and they are a shambles.



No, it's not a stretch at all. Other teams have ben NEARLY as decimated with injuries, but not for 3 or 4 seasons in a row. If it happens, once, you can chalk it up to coincidence, or lazy players or whatever. When it becomes a systemic and repetitive problem, a pattern has been established.

The team, coaches, and staff get paid to win championships. If the same obstacle keeps coming up year after year to derail that endeavor, you can place balme where you want to-- but the fact remains, something is wrong with their conditioning that is causing them to keep getting injured. THAT is some simple, straightforward deductive reasoning.




Nope-- you posted a bunch of quotes from the training staff, blaming it on the players' laziness. Hmmm...what would be their incentive to blame the problem on the players, rather than their training program?




* Too many breaks and days off for veterans.
* Too soft a training camp (Tomlin's camps are well-known for this)
* Allowing the players to freelance during the offseason as far as their training programs (or lack thereof)
* Not doing the right types of excercises and stretches
* Skipping pre-game warmups

Just for starters.....

Steelers Nation demands a tribunal! lol. It is maddening - and while I don't have the inside source to understand what actually takes place - I just know that if the injuries keep piling up this season, and into next - I don't think it is a simple as an article stating all the possibilities. There needs to be an investigation if it continues and some consultation from outside sources.

[Riddle_Of_Steel]

Originally Posted by Fire Arians

i thought it was just me, but we possibly have the worst injury list 2 years in a row

According to Hipchest, there is no problem-- the Steelers players are just lazy and don't want to listen to their trainers. The conditioning program is top-notch and has no issues.

We know this because the training staff told us so.

[tony hipchest]

Originally Posted by Riddle_Of_Steel

According to Hipchest, there is no problem-- the Steelers players are just lazy and don't want to listen to their trainers. The conditioning program is top-notch and has no issues.

We know this because the training staff told us so.

just because you are flat out wrong with your hypothesis and conjecture is no reason to build a strawman and flat out lie.

i never quoted the training staff and i never said the players are lazy.

learn to read.

i did say the steelers play a more physical brand of football than the majority of teams, something that is lost upon all the make believers who KNOW our training staff is substandard.

i also know that football professionals who have put together and supervised training staffs and entire front offices such as gil brandt and pat kirwan said as soon as they saw the new CBA w/ reduced practices and hitting that it was a team like the steelers who would be affected and most hurt by it.

i side with the pros, not the keyboard jockeys and speculators.

[Hawaii 5-0]

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

i side with the pros, not the keyboard jockeys and speculators.

come on, what do the pros know compared to us internet geniuses?

[Riddle_Of_Steel]

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

just because you are flat out wrong with your hypothesis and conjecture is no reason to build a strawman and flat out lie.

i never quoted the training staff and i never said the players are lazy.

learn to read.

Thank you for your concerns-- I can read just fine.

The article you posted, whether it by written by you, the training staff, or Jim Wexell, is nothing more than a long-winded excuse blaming the poor conditioning on the players by citing ONE, SINGLE player as an example (Keenan Lewis in this case-- who has not missed a single game due to injury yet, if I am not mistaken).

It goes on with this excuse-making for another three paragraphs using another anecdotal example dredged up from NFL history to support the claim it is the players' fault they are not physically ready to perform at a high level without breaking all the time.

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

i did say the steelers play a more physical brand of football than the majority of teams, something that is lost upon all the make believers who KNOW our training staff is substandard.

You're right-- the Steelers are the only NFL team that hits hard and plays "physical".

That 49ers defense? They're soft. Ndumakong Suh? He is just a little kitten.

it sure looked to me just a couple weeks ago that even the lowly Chiefs play a pretty physical breed of football. I hear the Giants do a pretty good impression of playing physical as well.

The Saints played such physical defense they were literally trying to take people's heads off in games, but I don't see half their team walking around on crutches in street clothes.

You seem to think you are so much smarter than I, and you have all the facts on your side-- please present me with conclusive statistical/factual proof the Steelers play more "physical" football than the other 31 clubs in the NFL.

How exactly do you quantify that? How does that affect the number of injuries to our players, as opposed to the opposing teams? You seem to be content to hinge your entire argument on a very vague concept and then cancelling out the sound logic I used to come to my conclusions.

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

i also know that football professionals who have put together and supervised training staffs and entire front offices such as gil brandt and pat kirwan said as soon as they saw the new CBA w/ reduced practices and hitting that it was a team like the steelers who would be affected and most hurt by it.

i side with the pros, not the keyboard jockeys and speculators.

So, in other words, you are throwing your hands up in the air-- BECAUSE YOU YOURSELF DON'T KNOW A FUCKING THING, and simply deferring it to "the experts", whom we routinely bash around here on per thread basis for their inaccurate predictions, and cluelessness about the Steelers.

Maybe the Steelers DO play "more physical football" than other ball clubs. Then the logical conclusion to come to based on all the injuries, is that they need a training staff that is better suited to designing a program for specifically, the Steelers and their style of play.

Blaming it on the players, their style of play, etc. is still just making excuses. If season after season keeps swirling down the toilet bowl because we can't keep guys healthy, I doubt that telling Mr. Rooney: "Heck, we can't help it-- we play more physical football than everybody else!" is going to cut it. Results are all that matters.

Maybe the players are lazy and that is why their conditioning program is not working. Either way, that is still the rsponsibility of the front office to fix-- the caoch neds to motiviate his guys better, whatever. The point is-- something behind the scenes in the org's front office/staff still has to happen to fix the problem.

[tony hipchest]

Originally Posted by Riddle_Of_Steel

You seem to think you are so much smarter than I, and you have all the facts on your side-- please present me with conclusive statistical/factual proof the Steelers play more "physical" football than the other 31 clubs in the NFL.

there you go, lying again. i said the majority of teams. they pass the eyeball test. EVERYBODY knows the steelers are one of the most physical, hardest hitting teams. you must not know or believe this being that you cited the "Cheifs".

How


So, in other words, you are throwing your hands up in the air-- BECAUSE YOU YOURSELF DON'T KNOW A FUCKING THING, and simply deferring it to "the experts", whom we routinely bash around here on per thread basis for their inaccurate predictions, and cluelessness about the Steelers.

idiots around here routinely bash the players, coaches, training staff, etc. i dont give a shit who "we routinely bash.

experts and paid professionals, front office execs typically know more about the inner workings of things than keyboard jockey fans. throwing your hands up, i expect you will deny this as well.



Blaming it on the players, their style of play, etc. is still just making excuses.

blaming it on the training staff is just making excuses as well.

there you go. the rooneys know more than you. their training staff is fine. injuries happen. its a hard hitting game.

fans need to quit whining about it.

[Riddle_Of_Steel]

there you go, lying again. i said the majority of teams. they pass the eyeball test. EVERYBODY knows the steelers are one of the most physical, hardest hitting teams. you must not know or believe this being that you cited the "Cheifs".

Alright, wiseguy-- I'll play along.

You say the Steelers play more physical football than a MAJORITY of the teams. So that means that at least one team plays more physical football than the Steelers, right?

So tell me, specifically, which teams are more physical? And then, are any of those teams suffering the same yearly rash of injuries If not, your theory is shot to shit.

idiots around here routinely bash the players, coaches, training staff, etc. i dont give a shit who "we routinely bash.

I am pretty sure I have heard you bitch about the "experts at ESPN" on more than one occaision around here. I am pretty sure I recall you saying Warren Sapp was an idiot because he picked us to finish 3rd in the AFC North this year.

Even if you aren't one of the ones who routinely questions these experts, you are still just deferring your opinion to someone you perceive as "knowing better than any of us". You aren't presenting any opinion of your own in this regard. You are thowing your arms up in the air and letting someone else argue for you,just like I already said.

experts and paid professionals, front office execs typically know more about the inner workings of things than keyboard jockey fans. throwing your hands up, i expect you will deny this as well.

So can you or one of your experts explain then why our team seems to be the only one that loses half of its roster on a yearly basis, since we've already established that you cannot blame it purely on "physical play"?

As I already stated, even if the Steelers are playing a more physical breed of football than the other 31 clubs (you haven't established this yet, in any way, shape, or form), based on the current yearly list of injuries--something must change. Insanity is doing the same thing over and over, yet expecting different results. Clearly, whatever they are doing right now-- does not work.

blaming it on the training staff is just making excuses as well.

Only on your planet...

If the brake job I just paid someone to do on my car does not work afterwards-- you blame the mechanic that worked on your car. If the heart transplant they just did for you does not work-- you blame the surgeon that messed you up.

If your training staff is not properly preparing the players for the game, and everybody is getting injured every season like they are-- you blame the folks who were specifically tasked with, and paid to condition your players and prepare them physically.

Logic 101.

[Riddle_Of_Steel]

Here's another brain-teaser for you:

You claim there is nothing wrong with the Steeler's training and conditioning program-- all these injuries are just a product of their physical play. They are sooooo much more physical than the other 31 teams.....

Did they only start playing this physical breed of football in the last few seasons since Tomlin came onboard? They weren't playing physical ball under Cowher? How interesting....I don't recall so many walking wounded in any of the last few seasons the Chin was with us.

[tony hipchest]

• Linebackers coach Keith Butler also has some goals for productive but frequently injured linebacker LaMarr Woodley: Do more conditioning work. Woodley (high ankle sprain) hasn’t practiced this week and isn’t expected to play in Baltimore. “The thing I will tell him is he needs to get his hamstrings in shape,” Butler said. “He worked harder than he ever has to get in shape, but he needs to work on his hamstrings.” Woodley missed one game and most of two others with injuries this season.

go figure. a coach putting the honus on a player to do MORE conditioning work on his frail hamstrings.

woodley is probably too busy practicing his stupid post sack flying leg kick.

I am pretty sure I have heard you bitch about the "experts at ESPN" on more than one occaision around here.

you are "pretty sure"???

more like- you are pretty wrong.

i wont even dignifiy these desperate and deflective lies.

i have a brain teaser for you, once you get a clue.

in the meantime i will sit back and LMAO at all the people who think the trainers and conditioning staff should put in OT and take time out from their lives to go over to casey hamptins house every night and cook and spoon feed him his dinner.



also i will let you ponder why james harrison is probably the most physical hitter in the nfl (im sure you will contend hundreds are more physical and hit harder) PLUS one of the most conditioned & hardest workers, yet still sustains injuries.

- FIRE THE TRAINING STAFF!!!!

[steelfury02]

Originally Posted by tony hipchest

• Linebackers coach Keith Butler also has some goals for productive but frequently injured linebacker LaMarr Woodley: Do more conditioning work. Woodley (high ankle sprain) hasn’t practiced this week and isn’t expected to play in Baltimore. “The thing I will tell him is he needs to get his hamstrings in shape,” Butler said. “He worked harder than he ever has to get in shape, but he needs to work on his hamstrings.” Woodley missed one game and most of two others with injuries this season.

go figure. a coach putting the honus on a player to do MORE conditioning work on his frail hamstrings.

woodley is probably too busy practicing his stupid post sack flying leg kick.



you are "pretty sure"???

more like- you are pretty wrong.

i wont even dignifiy these desperate and deflective lies.

i have a brain teaser for you, once you get a clue.

in the meantime i will sit back and LMAO at all the people who think the trainers and conditioning staff should put in OT and take time out from their lives to go over to casey hamptins house every night and cook and spoon feed him his dinner.



also i will let you ponder why james harrison is probably the most physical hitter in the nfl (im sure you will contend hundreds are more physical and hit harder) PLUS one of the most conditioned & hardest workers, yet still sustains injuries.

- FIRE THE TRAINING STAFF!!!!

I'm done speculating about who is responsible for the injury plague. What is the solution then? If we go into next couple of seasons with the same shit happening - it just isn't about being the most physical team anymore -it will develop into questioning their attitude about putting in the time to optimize their health