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Old 12-20-2012, 06:18 PM   #31
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Originally Posted by tanda10506 View Post
This is a truly clueless comment actually. Why don't you fill us in then on what Tomlin specifically does? And yes we are an extremely talented team. Let's see: J. Harrison, T. Polamlu, R. Clark, I. Taylor, L. Woodley, M. Pouncey, M. Wallace, A. Brown, H. Miller, L. Timmons, good #3-#5 WR's, decent O line depth, and a QB that will likely be in the HOF, yeah this is a pretty damn talented team. Damn, have you even looked at our depth chart? And that's this year. When we "unleashed hell" in 2009 Hampton and Farrior were still playing good.

Teegre, good call, for some reason I wasn't thinking that Cowher almost passed on Ben. That would have been a total blunder. Good point, but still, once he got a real QB we went 15-1 and lost to a team that was cheating, then followed it up next year with a SB. Cowher wasn't perfect, no coach is or ever will be, I just think Tomlin is a lot further from it then Cowher or a lot of other coach's. I'm not just trying to bag on Tomlin and I'm not saying that Tomlin isn't CAPABLE of getting the team back to where they want to be, I'm just saying we need a hell of a lot more from him then we're getting now. With all the fumbles, penalties, losses to crap teams, inconsistency and lack of heart, I don't see how anybody could think we're getting good coaching right now. That's not to say the players aren't part of the problem, it's a team sport, but those things that I just pointed out are discipline issues and that has a lot to do with the coach.
As you mentioned, Tomlin has a talented group of players... quite a few of whom, he has added to the roster: Wallace, AB, Pouncey, Timmons, Woodley, DD, Lewis, making Harrison a starter... et cetera.

His additions is something that some people ignore.

I will give you this: this year, these players are not there.

I say "this year", because I equate 2009 to 2006: a post-SuperBowl-victory lull.

I know that it is a tired excuse, but honestly, some of this year's lull may have to do with injuries: Harrison is just now reaching his stride; Woodley has disappeared; Troy is done; the constantly rotating O-line; and, obviously, Big Ben being out & his subsequent struggles once he returns (too early).

Another thing that Tomlin has done is manage superstars. People say that he was given a talent rife with talent, and he absolutely was. But, people also have said similar things about Phil Jackson. "Phil only won when he had the players to do so." To which, I say two things:

1) Obviously.
Belichick wasn't anything before Brady. Talent trumps all.

2) Managing the egos of highly skilled players/super stars is equally as difficult as turning dregs into winners. As the adage goes: reaching success is not nearly as hard as maintaining success.

Lastly, as far as this year goes, I remember Lawrence Taylor saying something about winning in the regular season versus the post-season. He talked about how he went through the motions (albeit, great motions) during the regular season; the regular season almost bored him. All that he wanted to do was get into the post season, where "wins actually counted."

Maybe this team has had too much success... and become complacent about the regular season.

I remember in 1998, Dermontii Dawson was angry at the younger teammates, because those kiddos ASSUMED that the Steelers would "just make the play-offs." Many of them had spent their first six season making the play-offs, and Dirt knew differently. This season reminds me eerily of that one... down to losing to Tampa Bay & Kordell throwing his helmet in disgust (which is similar to losing to San Diego two weeks ago).
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Old 12-20-2012, 06:57 PM   #32
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Awesome post, TEEGRE.
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Old 12-20-2012, 07:21 PM   #33

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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

This team has no heart or leadership. they are missing some kind of spark or a dressing room guy to motivate them. As for the coaching. Tomlin will be here next year. But he has not done a good job in preparing his guys to play week in week out. Unfortunately; when things don't go well; it always falls on the head coach. We can go on from Brown not taking a safety in the end zone against the Chargers to last week I believe it was Brown again running out of bounds to stop the clock for the Cowboys towards the end of the game. Little things. But all these little things have really added up to a season like this.In this league; there is such a fine line between being a crap team and being competitive all the time. Tomlins got his work cut out for him this off season. Next year really should define what Tomlin is all about. Lebau will probably retire. Many veterans may be leaving. Cuts need to be made. Drafting must get better. We will see how he builds his team!
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Old 12-20-2012, 07:25 PM   #34
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Originally Posted by Riddle_Of_Steel View Post
Awesome post, TEEGRE.
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Old 12-21-2012, 07:46 PM   #35
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

That's definitely a possibility Teegre with so many of our players being at the tail end of their careers, but you have to win to get there. Tomlin has to take the ship by the wheel and get them to not just go through the motions. The great coach's don't have a problem managing a lot of super stars who may have inflated egos.

As you pointed out and I pointed out in earlier posts, injuries are a big problem. The "next man up" philosophy is the best thing for a person sitting on the bench, but it doesn't really transfer to the field. There is a reason some players start and some players don't, that's all there is too it. You can't win with everybody injured. Also, Tomlin has drafted some good players on offense, but most of them are under performing currently. Wallace and Sanders have a lot of drops and fumbles, Brown fumbles often, Timmons just started showing his worth earlier this year, etc. I do agree though that he has drafted "talent" on offense, it's just that most of the talent he drafted is under performing and he's their HC. Furthermore, Woodley is the only top draft pick on defense that has performed well right away. Worilds, Carter, Brown, Allen, and McClendon are no where near up to the task of replacing Harrison, Hampton and Ike.

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree on Tomlin, but it's all good.
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Old 12-23-2012, 01:07 AM   #36
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Pittsburgh Steelers Mike Tomlin: In The Hot Seat If No Playoffs?

Dec 21st, 2012 by Craig Gottschalk

The Pittsburgh Steelers are at a crossroads this weekend. And, I’m not just talking about whether or not they will make the playoffs. I think the Steelers are at a point in time where they will begin to reassess the direction Mike Tomlin is taking them in as a head coach regardless of this week’s outcome.

The Tomlin era has lasted for almost six seasons. Enough players have come and gone, that the football world is beginning to see the fruits (or lack thereof) of his labor.

Tomlin has been a part of six draft classes, seen players retire, and has had to let players go. The sole discretion is not his, but what he does with the talent that is presented to him is completely his responsibility. I’m sure most, if not all of you, have said to yourself three sentences ago, ‘Come on really? You’re going to bust a guy who’s won two AFC Championships and a Super Bowl in five and a half seasons?’

Yes I am.

Many have said over the past few seasons that Tomlin has experienced success off the successes from the Cowher era – riding the coat tails as it were. With many players gone from the roster the last time Cowher yelled and let the spit fly on the sidelines, Tomlin has laid his own foundation of what he thinks it takes to have a championship football team. Because let’s be honest, when it comes to the Pittsburgh Steelers, saying ‘a winning team’ is not enough. Wins are not enough.

Championships are enough. And really, it’s one thing to be 11-5 and come ‘this close’ to winning it all vs. the 2011 and 2012 Steelers. Losing tough games is one thing, it’s how this team is losing that is really starting to worry me. But is it worrying Colbert and the Rooney’s too?

The 2012 Steelers should be a twelve win team. Should be. But they aren’t. Why? They have the talent. And, they have the potential to stand toe to toe with any top team in this league like the Texans or Falcons. But yet they fold to teams that are currently 5-9, 5-9, 4-10. Why? Preparation, lack of discipline, and lack of fire. When playing this sub .500 teams, or any team that isn’t very good for that matter, this team fails to make the essential plays it needs to make in order to win the game – whether it’s to take the lead or seal up the lead. Mistakes, miscues, and mishaps have plagued this teams for several seasons. Maybe it’s a lack of leadership in the locker room with veterans like Hines Ward and James Farrior and others gone. There is certainly a lack of fire in this team and it’s up to the coach to find it, inspire it, and get the players to use it.

Bill Cowher used to stand on the sidelines and look Greg Lloyd right in the eye while hitting his shoulder pads and say, “I need you to rush the quarterback. I need you to rush the quarterback. I need you to do that. Now go.” When was the last time you saw Tomlin stare James Harrison in the eye and say those things to him? Was there ever a time? Aside from his pacing up and down the sidelines with an occasional yelling of ‘Let’s go!’ Tomlin is never in his players faces. He’s said to be a player’s coach, but is that because he never yells at them in public?

Circumstances within a season can certainly affect certain outcomes. But, if people use the ‘injury bug’ as an excuse for Tomlin, then you are all disavowing his own mantra of ‘The Standard is the Standard’ and ‘Starters in Waiting.’ And if he can’t be held accountable for his own set standards, then how will he ever? As I mentioned, this team should be a twelve win team – even with the injuries they’ve had. I actually believe Tomlin to an extent when he says ‘The standard is the standard.’ But just because you lay out expectations of how players should perform doesn’t mean it ends there. And the way the Steelers play and fail to execute at times and have huge miscues at times, it sure seems like that’s where Tomlin draws the line in the field of how far he will go as a coach.

Is Tomlin in the ‘hot seat’ if the Steelers fail to make the playoffs? Probably not. At least not in the way that guys like Norv Turner are. Speaking of our friends out west – do you really think that the Chargers are a 5-9 team? Phillip Rivers may not be elite, but he’s no chump either. And, neither are many other players on that roster. The AFC West is so bad (aside from the Denver Mannings) that the Chargers can’t get themselves up to being a 9-7 team or better. Why? Well, Alex Spanos and A.J. Smith may finally get things right by letting go the biggest thing holding back that team – Norv.

I have to admit that I drank the Tomlin kool aid back in 2007/2008. I like him. I think he’s a very smart man and coach. I think his intentions and philosophies are somewhat in the right place of how to coach a team. But, after taking on this blog and committing myself to watching game tape each week to better understand this team,

it’s hard not to look at this coach and not come down on him for the current state of this football team.

Will Tomlin be on the ‘hot seat?’ Nah. But I bet you many in Steeler Nation are going to become a little more uneasy going into 2013.

2015 NFL Sig Mock Draft:

2 trades: our 1(22) to Dallas for 1(27) and 3(91), then our 2(56) and 3(87) to NY Giants for 2(40)

1(27) Kevin Johnson CB Wake Forest
2(40) Eli Harold OLB Virginia
3(91) Eric Rowe CB/FS Utah
4(121) Gabe Wright DT/DE Auburn
5(160) Sean Hickey OG/OT Syracuse
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6(212) Kyle Emanuel DE/OLB N Dakota St
7(239) Cameron Clear TE/OT Texas A&M
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Old 12-23-2012, 09:07 AM   #37
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Originally Posted by Whodis View Post
Riddle brings up good points~

I know it's been said here, but this team lacks discipline. Fundamentals seem to be forgotten and wether its tackling or holding on to a ball.

These teams real problems are not personnel or scheme, the real issues are attitude and application.
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Old 12-23-2012, 05:05 PM   #38
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Originally Posted by tanda10506 View Post
I was referring to this year and last year. Yes last year we looked good on paper, but they didn't pass the eye test and didn't show up when it mattered most, as MANY on here have already stated before. Then we got kicked out of the playoffs by an 8-8 team with a college level QB. This year we've lost to the Browns, Titans, Raiders, and Chargers, and those are just the scrub teams. That's what I'm talking about. Look at how many of Cowher's players were in there prime in 2008 and still playing at a high level in 2010, now compare them to Cortez Allen, Curtis Brown, Ziggy Hood, Steve McClendon, Jason Worilds, Chris Carter, etc. That is what I'm talking about.

Also, when I said that I hadn't seen anything in these last two years from Tomlin, I meant just that, from Tomlin. This team has played at a high level under him in earlier years, but they're not not, they're not being replaced by starting quality players. Also, since we don't have any players stepping up like Porter did when it was needed, then it's time that Tomlin does it. Cowher inspired this team, it's not like that now.
Realistically, this team is only slightly worse than last years. But i am expecting the team to go that way heading into next season. No signs of it getting better for sure.
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Old 12-24-2012, 04:16 AM   #39
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Again, I‘m behind Roethlisberger on this. He‘s the franchise player, and that‘s the lay of the land anymore.

To address that fully — and let‘s not pretend it won‘t come up anew — Tomlin must first accept that the star holds all the cards. He‘s got no choice. If it comes down to a him-or-me from Roethlisberger‘s perspective, the $102 million quarterback has to win that duel 102 times out of 102. And, yeah, even if that means finding a new coordinator.
Elite QB and a mediocre head coach. Damn right Ben holds the cards.
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Old 12-24-2012, 04:39 AM   #40
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Default Re: Mike Tomlin up to the tall tasks ahead

Originally Posted by TheVet View Post
Elite QB and a mediocre head coach. Damn right Ben holds the cards.
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